Is Phil Foden the best player in the Premier League right now? – Football Weekly

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Hello, and welcome to the Guardian Football Weekly.

Phil Foden wins the Derby late on for Manchester City.

It felt like it was always coming, even if Manchester United at least had a plan and stuck to it after Marcus Rashford went full Yaboa early on almost justifying his players tribune piece with one kick so City keep pace with Liverpool who left it really late Paul Tierney's inch perfect cross for Darwin Nunes had Mark Clattenberg going on the referee's last whistle will unpick it all in the race for fourth place Villa batter Luton for an hour Luton batter Villa for 25 minutes and Villa win it at the end while unleash the buckets Timo Werner's first goal for Spurs helps them come back from behind again.

Alphonse Areola's taking Barry's snub personally, pulling out a match-winning performance at Everton, who continue to refuse to take their chances.

While there are good wins for Fulham, Newcastle, and Bournemouth, and a point that isn't that great for Brentford or Chelsea, we've got a late comeback against Neil Warnock in Scotland.

Another defeat for Leicester, seems in Wimbledon.

Your questions, and that's today's Guardian Football Weekly.

On the panel today, Jonathan Wilson, welcome.

Morning, how are you doing?

Very well, thank you.

Hello, Barry Glendenning.

Hi, Max.

And hello, Troy Townsend.

Hi, Max.

Let's start the Etty had then.

Manchester City 3, Manchester United 1.

I mean, City clearly deserved it, but United were not terrible, I don't think, of playing on the break.

But let's start with Phil Foden, who scored the second and third best goals of this game.

Pep called him the best player in the Premier League at the moment.

Troy, agree, disagree, neither agree nor disagree.

I mean, Pep did he did sound a bit like one of those really drunk people at a wedding who just loves everyone in his post-match.

It was that really like, ah, I just love it all.

But he might have a point.

Foden is absolutely imperious at the moment.

Yeah, he's playing exceptionally well, isn't he?

And

picking up the mantle and running with it, to be honest.

And his goals were great, but his all-round contribution was even better.

He's just a young man who's enjoying his football and he's enjoying the trust of his manager as well, isn't he?

That's probably the big thing is that Pep has now given him the run of games that he has obviously deserved.

And he's proving to Pep that he deserves to be in that starting 11 and he's proven it with his goals, his assists, his all-round contributions.

And he took the ball by the horns yesterday and, you know, after hitting that great strike, it's massively important that City scored early enough to give them the time to get the other goals.

It was, you know, it's been a little bit,

I had the privilege of watching them on Tuesday night, if you want to call it a privilege.

And Haaland and De Bruyne were just unplayable.

They were machines.

You know, having two machines on one team is not really good, is it?

And then you have Voden to who had a little break on Tuesday night to back it all up.

So it was a great start, it was a great performance.

Chris is, does anyone else just smile watching Phil Foden the season?

Genuinely excited to see him at the Euros.

Where should Southgate play him?

Assuming Saka

plays wide on the right.

Wilson, I saw Barney sort of tweeting, look, this England team looks quite good.

You play Bellingham behind,

yeah, behind Saka Kane, and then play Foden out on the left.

Does that seem the most sensible?

Yeah, definitely.

I mean, I guess

the people who feel that Southgate is too defensive and possibly in the last 20 minutes of games of England are chasing a goal.

Maybe you pull Bellingham back to play effectively alongside Rice, and then Foden can play centrally and you play Grealish or somebody else on the left.

But I would have thought the starting setup would be that front four.

I can't remember.

It's been a long time since England had three creative players as good and as informal at the moment.

I mean, it's another three months, obviously, three and a bit months of Euros as Sacker, Bellingham, and Foden.

I mean, Bellingham, obviously, his career started to unravel yesterday.

But it was good while it lasted.

And maybe there'll still be something left come the summer.

Just for that Foden equaliser, which was such a brilliant strike.

Imagine I'd wanted a free kick in the build-up where Marcus Rashford was cynically scythed down, Barry, by Kyle Walker.

That's not a foul.

I mean, Rashford has to, but we'll get on to his good bit in a minute, but he's got to not fall over there.

Yeah, but it is a foul,

to be fair.

Walker tugged his arm.

That's a foul.

Do you think so?

Do you think so?

Well, it is.

I mean, it's not a matter of debate.

It's a foul.

I don't think it was a foul.

Yeah, I don't think it was a foul.

There's a difference between the foul.

Sorry, how can you not think it was a foul?

He grabbed his arm.

There's a difference between laying your arm on and pulling with the hand.

Like Rashford's at the very least.

No, he literally grabbed his arm with his hand.

Oh, Barry, come on.

I don't think so.

I mean, if it was given, it would be what ex-pros call a soft foul, but it is a foul nonetheless.

I still think Rashford's got to

at least try and shrug him off.

Yeah, he should.

But it's a foul.

No, no.

Not a hope in hell.

No, okay.

But it is.

I mean, it's either a foul or it isn't.

There's no greater than that.

I agree that Rashford should stay on his feet, but Walker had his number at that point, and I think he knew the jig was up as far as his duel against Walker was going, and he went down.

But he could have stayed in his feet, but that does not take away from the fact that it was a foul.

If that's a foul, Barry, then we don't play football because there's so many of those that happen in the game.

We'll be forever stopping it and reviewing it and VAR doing its magical thing.

I just don't see how.

But yeah, I mean, you're adding caveats all over, Chris.

It's still a foul.

I get what you're saying and I agree with you, but it's still a foul.

I mean, I don't think it is.

But I mean, the way you're so categoric, Barry, means that I...

But I'm not sure how you can argue it isn't.

I mean,

this isn't a debate I want to get into.

And I've got to say,

we appear to be in it.

But you did ask me the question.

We're really in this debate.

I mean, I know you don't want to get into it.

I can't help feeling that that's literally what we're right in at the moment.

Okay, well,

putting that to one side,

let's talk about Rashford's because that strike

barrier is just...

I think that goal has everything I like.

Getting it launched, a big man, okay, Bruno holding it up, someone holding it up, and then the ball going in off the bar.

I can't think of anything better.

Yeah, it was a Roy of the Rovers strike.

I mean, I have a note here, two Roy of the Rovers goals from Rashford and Folden.

Apparently,

there was an XG of 0.03 on the screen, but he couldn't have hit it sweeter in off the bar.

And

it was one in the eye of the haters with a Z

that prompted him to write this Players' Tribune piece last week, or someone else to write it on his behalf.

And it was the only thing of note he did in the game.

I mean, I thought Manchester United's approach to this game was like, and it's a measure of how far they've fallen, I suppose.

They approach it like a League One or two side who've been drawn against City away in the third or fourth round of the cup.

And they went a goal up.

They could have gone, you know, at times until Forden equalised.

They looked quite dangerous on the break.

They probably should have gone 2-0 up.

Rashford missed

missed controlled the ball when he was put through by Fernandez.

He probably should have scored there.

And he had that air shot.

So

apart from an absolutely stunning goal,

it sounds churlish to say his contribution was poor.

And if United had gone 2-0 up, City,

you know, they might have panicked.

But doesn't that suggest, Wilson, that the way Manchester United set up, however it was, was the right thing to do, right?

They are not going...

There is such a gulf between the squads that they aren't going to compete with City.

And actually, they sort of did everything that they should have done apart from

you know lindelof not letting foden cut inside and amrabat not forgetting how to play be a footballer which has sort of been quite consistent since he arrived at united i'm not sure he ever was a footballer to be honest apart from a little spell during the world cup but

i don't think united played particularly well yesterday but the issue is not that game is it yeah

if that game had sort of come in a sort of normal well it wouldn't because the game would have been you know the tenor of the game would have been different.

But that game alone is not why they're six points behind Tottenham in sixth, having spent a lot more money and Tenhag been there longer than Postagoglu or Emery, you know,

what, five points further ahead.

The way they played, that sort of

the diamond in midfield with the split strikers is how Salcio ended in a lot of games against City.

And Salcio's record against City was pretty good.

And if you look at City and look at where their vulnerabilities are, and they've conceded more goals to what Opta defined as rapid counters this season than any other Premier League team apart from Bristol Palace.

So pace getting in behind their defensive line is the way you get at them.

And they did get at them in that first half.

The goal, the rash of a chance when he miscontrolled it, there were opportunities there in the break.

But I think you equally saw that they weren't used to playing that system.

They were slow, they were hesitant when

the sort of slickness you expect from a top side now wasn't there because they're just not familiar with it.

That, to an extent, is understandable because they expect Hoyland to be there, and Hoyland's injured, so they've had to change.

The fact that they've, you know, Johnny Evans was starting, shows up what injuries he've had at the back.

So, there's reasons to have sympathy in that one game, but it's not really about that one game, it's about the fact that whatever gains they've made last season, finishing third, seem to be being fritted away this season.

And even when they are winning this season, it's not particularly convincing.

They're winning by single goals.

That when they've played that front three of Rashford, Hoyland, and Garnacho, they've won every Premier League game they've played, but they haven't done them convincingly.

They've letting a lot of goals while doing so.

So, structurally, they're still massively unconvincing.

So, the long-term picture, you know, Tenaga was saying, look at the big picture.

The big picture is pretty bad.

The small picture of yesterday's game is it's okay.

It's if that happens when you play a really good size.

Hard if the small picture is bad and the big picture is bad.

What a manager is meant to tell you to look at, isn't it?

Don't look at anything.

The medium-sized picture of the games before they lost to Fulham, that was okay.

Right.

You just got to get that.

You've got to crop it, exactly.

Anytime we're going to tell you.

Troy, that Haaland miss was something, wasn't it?

I mean, he could have just run into it and it would have got in.

I think he was looking for the perfect finish in regards to a volley into the roof of the net and he's got the volley all wrong.

He's had a few of those since he's come back.

He's had a few moments where he's

not looked as sharp.

And

again, I have to go back to Tuesday night because I watched him Tuesday night and he was as sharp as I've seen him for a very long time.

And obviously, when you've got Kevin De Bruyne feeding you balls all day long, you're almost obliged to put them in the back of the net.

And then I looked at him on

yesterday.

He was well marshalled yesterday.

So let's give Manny Night a little bit of credit.

Varane Evans, I thought Casemero was good in the first half.

So he was well marshalled and he found his openings to get space like reduced quite a lot.

But then you can't keep him quiet.

And he looked an angry man at the miss because his expectation is very high.

And you would imagine that he would say, that's meat and drink to me.

You know, could he have put his head on it more just to secure the goal more than anything else?

But he's persistent and he keeps going.

And regardless of the amount of touches that he has, I know there was a big debate again about the amount of touches that he had.

I don't know why we're still having those debates because he gets on the end of things that and then he creates stuff that

many other forwards are not doing at the moment, although one that I will want to speak about later.

If you don't mind, can I go back to Ten Hark?

Because

I don't know how he analyzes this game.

You know, he spoke a lot about we could have won, we should have won, we may have got a draw, it was a great performance, we defended brilliantly, and they did, but they ran out of gas.

And they ran out of gas, ran out of ideas.

And then balls were going, apart from that, Garnacho, when Edison came out and made that tackle on Garnacho, I can't really remember them like

getting even near Man City's box.

So it's interesting to see how he's currently, maybe he's just making it just for, you know, the journalists, but everyone's watching the game.

And whilst they did have a couple of counters, and Barry's right about two opportunities for Rashford,

I just can't see how this performance brings a lot of joy to Man United fans and

the watching eye because while it was disciplined, whilst the approach was very much what the manager wanted and they go and get this

spectacular goal,

I just can't see where Manchester United are offering much.

I'd say a lot of Manchester United fans and possibly Ten Hague as well were expecting to get absolute hiding yesterday.

So to escape with

3-1 defeat in which you scored a wonderful goal and missed a couple of opportunities,

that might feel like a good result.

Barry, can I ask you about that

since you are the head of the laws today?

Garnacho and Edison, quite a few people making the point that Edison gets the ball, but his follow-through is

he takes the man.

And quite a few defenders have been penalised for that kind of thing.

So, I don't know if there is a difference.

I, at no point, thought that it should be a penalty.

I thought on first look it should be a penalty, and then

second or third look, thought, oh no, he's got the ball, but yeah, he did sort of clean him out with the follow-through.

It wouldn't have been a massive surprise if it had been given, and I'm not sure it would have been overturned.

Wilson, you had your hand raised about a previous point.

So there's this new stat that I found that I'm now obsessed by, which is non-penalty goals minus XG.

So the goals you have scored, excluding penalties, less the goals you're expected to score.

So obviously, the higher that number, the more efficient you are in front of goal.

Obviously, it's not a perfect measure, but it's a useful rule of thumb

as to how efficient a striker is being.

Going into the weekend, of 551 players in the Premier League, I presume 551 players have had a shot.

I think they must be the people on the list.

Holland was ranked 543rd.

He's a top scorer, but he was the, what's that, the eighth, or is that the ninth least productive player, which is extraordinary.

Um, the other stat I just find bizarre is he hasn't scored a header since the Manchester Derby in October.

You know, he's what, six foot four or whatever, six foot three.

You know,

you think of him as being a good header of the ball.

And you sort of think when he's four yards out and he could just nod it in with his head.

Is that why he doesn't go for it with his head?

He stopped trusting his head.

And then the other point,

I completely Troy's right.

We shouldn't be surprised surprised by how few touches he has now.

But that does make a difference to how City play.

Remember when Guadiola arrived, he said

when City wins the ball back, he likes to have 15 passes to get set to counter a potential counter should they lose the ball.

If you play like that to Hawland, you're losing one of his great strengths, which is popping balls in behind the opposition's defensive line, him running on.

And the bulk of the goals at Luton came like that.

I think the fact that they're trying to play slightly quicker through midfield to use them in that way means they're not as well set up to counter the counter, and that's why they are conceding so many goals to two rapid counter-attacks.

So, there's this oddity about them now, where I think, in some ways, a bit more exciting than they have been in previous seasons.

They're a little bit more reliant on individuals like Orland, like Foden, like De Bruyne, but maybe they are slightly more vulnerable as well.

And then, last week, you barry mentioned the stat that they've been on this great run, run, they've won, what, 15 of the last 16, isn't it now?

But they haven't played a team that's yesterday was the first time they'd played a team in the top eight of the Premier League since the first weekend of December when they lost to Villa.

So it's very, very hard.

They basically spent three months playing nobody.

I mean, that's a bit harsh, Jonathan, that, isn't it, eh?

Playing teams that,

you know, in a normal run of things, you expect where the par result is them winning.

And obviously, then with Liverpool and Arsenal coming up, and then Villa after that, within the next four weeks, we're going in this bit of the season.

There's a big, you know, they're obviously in great form.

You can't say not in great form when they won 15 and drawn one of the last 16 games.

But there is a bit of a question mark there.

Yeah, that's interesting.

Troy, can I ask you about the Marcus Rashford piece in the Players' Tribune?

He got criticised a lot for it.

We spoke to Andy Mitten, me and Barry, on the radio yesterday from United We Stand, who speaks to a lot of Manchester United fans, right, who are just, you know, not happy with how Rashford is playing this season and sort of feel that his attention is elsewhere or he's yeah but Rashford said this he said look I'm not trying to have a go at the media I understand the game you know what I mean they're not really writing about me it's like they're writing about this character Marcus Rashford it can't be about me as a 26 year old lad on a night out or a lad getting a parking ticket it's got to be about how much my car costs guessing my weekly salary my jewelry or even my tattoos it's got to be about my body language and questioning my morals and speculating about my family and my football future there's a tone to it that you don't get with all footballers.

Let's just leave it at that.

Now, I might be wrong in thinking that he's insinuating that there is a racial element to the reporting of Marcus Rashford.

And we have spoken about this before, and, you know, it is definitely true that, you know, Raheem Sterling got it exactly right.

He pointed out newspapers reflected on, I think it was Toysin Adarabayo getting, you know, what wages he was getting and Phil Foden when they'd had equal salary.

Yeah.

And so you have to be really careful and you have to understand that obviously lots of people are writing about the same thing and some could have that undertone.

But I sense most of the criticism of Marcus Rashford is because he's just not playing very well at the moment is that fair i think it's fair um when you look at it when you're not so close to the situation and obviously manchester united fans being so close you know they deserve the right to have comment on any player

um but i also think that what marcus did over covid

you might take this right or take it wrong i thought it unsettled a lot of people who then totally agree wanted to have a judgment on him

that was nothing to do with the way that he played at the time.

You know, it was more this judgment that this young guy has come up, he's stood up,

he's challenged the government, he's created, you know.

I mean, what Marcus did over that period of time was unbelievable.

But I think the judgment then becomes a lot harsher.

I think the expectation also changes because if he can run away and do that, well, then he's got to still be doing the stuff that he does on the football pitch.

And that's right.

This season,

I always look at body language.

Body language is a massive thing for me.

And you're either at the, you know, you're obviously bouncing or you're not.

And he doesn't look like he's enjoying the environment of Manchester United.

That's what it looks to me.

I mean, the ferociousness of that strike yesterday had

all amounts of anger in it.

You know, we all saw it.

And you saw the celebration as well.

It had all amounts of anger in it.

Getting to the point of your question,

and you've even answered it in your own way, Max, there, because you spoke about Raheem Sterling and what was happening to Raheem Sterling had nothing to do with his footballing ability.

You also can't say that, oh, it's based on the color of your skin, but actually, you can say that because the comparison against other people at the height of their game at the time, did it matter that he was shopping in a particular store?

Did it matter that he was eating somewhere?

The narrative around,

as you said, Toshin and phil foden which has existed which which raheem highlighted why do we need to know that toshin hadn't made an appearance to that he wanted to buy his family a home it's the first thing on many many footballers minds his story was based around negativity foden's story it's not about the two players by the way but foden's story was based around positivity and what he was trying to do And if you really delve into this and pick into the narrative sometimes, unfortunately, for whatever reason, players like Sterling and players like Marcus Rashford get a lot of negative press, and you wonder why they're poking.

Now, I'll probably get slaughtered for this when this goes out later on through some of the press pack, but it's unless you've lived that, you won't really truly understand it.

And just remember, just remember, Max.

Sorry, just last point, just remember, it went on and on and on.

Sterling's tattoo.

Yeah.

You know, whenever England players are spouting tattoos of very similar nature, you know, so I don't get the hounding, although in Marx's situation, I think what people were looking for that chink of his armory after he did so well, obviously, during the COVID period, which had nothing to do with his footballing ability.

If that has happened to you, right?

And if you have, if some people have had a go at you and it is not about your football, then even if criticism that you get is justified a year or two later,

it's not as if you just compartmentalize that and go, well, that shit happened to me, so I've forgotten about it.

It stays with you, right?

Absolutely.

And look,

Marcus is not squeaky clean, as proved, but he's actually been no different to a couple of other players that were involved in those games, in that game yesterday, from Manchester City, from United.

But his seems to tweak the imagination very, very quickly.

And look, he's still 26.

I'd like to see him smiling a lot more on the field of play.

There may be some background stuff that none of us know about.

And then the kind of critiquing of him impacts on him a little bit more.

And, like you say, you don't just park it.

You can't just leave it.

We've seen players on the field of play who looked like that, you know, they're experiencing something else.

And we'd normally say that being on the field of play was their sanctuary.

They would, you know, it's the way of going and showing everyone that they're still a footballer whilst they have issues in the background.

They're human beings.

It's as simple as that.

They're human beings.

But I do think there is this, we need to get another story on Marcus kind of

attitude that must have an impact on him.

And I always say this, Max, it's the last thing I'll say now.

It's not just Marcus, it's the people that surround him as well, his family.

You know, most importantly,

he's spoken about the strengths of his mother.

His brothers are involved in his whole kind of image.

And it does have an impact.

And at some times, I would really like the press to have a think about that but we all know it's not going to happen.

Okay that'll do for part one part two we'll begin at the City Ground.

Hi Pod fans of America, Max here.

Barry's here too.

Hello.

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Welcome to part two of the Guardian Football Weekly.

So Notting Forest Nil, Liverpool won.

I mean, this is all really Barry about injury time, isn't it?

Sells make this great save.

Forrest got the other end.

Gibbs White has his chance.

Then it's a corner.

Then Canate's down.

There's a head injury.

Paul Tierney stops the game and he restarts the ball at Kelleher's feet.

And the rest is history.

And Stephen Reed is sent off.

And Mark Clattenberg talks to the media.

Yeah,

that's about the size of it.

The one thing you've left out there, I'm going to get further pillaried for this.

I thought Joe Gomez fouled on Bama Daily

in the build-up, in the penalty area, before the ball.

Oh, he tugged his shirt.

Now, that was more of a shirt pull than Carl Walker or Marcus Rashford.

Well,

it was a foul, and no penalty was given.

Then the ball goes out to Callum Hudson Adoy.

You've explained what happened.

It shouldn't have happened.

It was a bad mistake by Paul Tierney, the referee.

There will be people who say, ah, well, you know, the ball was in play for a further two minutes before Liverpool scored the goal, and it was Callum Hudson Adoy who trying to play the ball out of defence gave it away allowed McAllister to stand it up Darwin Nunes who who headed home and that's all fair comment but I think it was a terrible error by Paul Tierney and

I think Forrest should have had a penalty that wasn't given they should at the very least have been given the ball back who knows what might have happened Callum Hudson Adoy probably wouldn't have found himself in that position where he's trying to dribble out of defence which he shouldn't have done he should have just hoofed it as Forrest had been doing throughout the game.

But Liverpool ended up winning, mentality monsters, and I totally understand why Forrest's players and backroom staff were so annoyed at the end of the game, because they'd given it everything they had chances to score, which, you know, good chances to score, which they squandered.

And then to lose right at the death must be absolutely heartbreaking.

Mr.

Lancaster writes, Clattenberg,

Chairman, you will go on my first whistle.

Yes, Evangelos Marinakis

also got involved.

Dan says, look, let's be honest, after the Tiny mistake, if the Forest players harass, surround, and berate him, they probably get the ball and a point.

I'm not condoning the behaviour, but you can see why players do it.

There's a bit of media ex-pro hypocrisy about at the moment, too.

I mean, they would sort of complain to it, Wilson, but he does have a point, doesn't he?

If they'd really just stood there and stood there and stood there,

Tinney might have gone, actually.

I mean, I don't understand why someone's not in his ear saying, oh, mate, actually, that's their drop ball, if it's that obvious.

Yeah, I don't know.

I mean,

look, it's clearly a mistake.

Whether it's a penalty or not,

clearly there is a pull of a shirt.

The only issue is, and I just haven't seen a replay that goes back far enough, and Barry might have done.

I don't know.

Is it some mutual grappling to start with?

So there was the penalty that City would give in the Chelsea when Cookarea was judged to have pulled Holland's shirt.

Then you roll it back five seconds more, and it turns out that Holland's pulled Cucarea's shirt first.

so it may be one of those situations I don't know as I say it it wasn't uh certainly wasn't that late but um but the replay I've seen I couldn't tell you about that but clearly yeah the ball shouldn't have been given to

to to Liverpool

but

I just think

and this is this is not specifically a forest thing it's a it's a general cultural thing across the game

it is slightly worse than if Tierney had given a goal kick not a corner yeah if he just missed

a flick off somebody's machine or whatever, it is slightly worse because it's not just sort of missing an incident,

it's sort of misremembering what had happened, misremembering when he'd blown the whistle initially.

But at the same time, you've got to deal with it.

If Forrest gets relegated this season, it's not because of that decision, it's because they've missed loads of chances, and more specifically, because they've been absolutely awful at the back.

So it's, I don't know, it just sort of refereeing errors just give everybody an excuse.

Forrest committed hundreds of errors in that game.

Tierney, I'm sure Tierney committed more than that one error, but to blame everything on that one thing, I get why they're angry, of course, because right at the end of the game, they were piling pressure on.

It did relieve the pressure of Gillette to pull the ball back.

It is clearly a mistake.

But I just the obsession with referring errors as if that's the only thing that diverts the course of a game.

You don't lose the ball 30 yards from your own goal is a good way of not losing games as well.

I mean, in the in Burnley's game yesterday, Vince and Company afterwards just listed off this litany of decisions that have gone against Burnley in various games throughout the season, and some of them were quite egregious decisions.

Burnley are going to go down, it's not because of referees.

Imagine there was a referee in conspiracy against Burnley.

What a futile thing that would have been.

Imagine if there were so many mistakes by referees that Burnley would actually be qualifying for the Champions League if it wasn't the case.

Something extraordinary.

At Troy, listen, I

get both sides of the argument here.

You know,

it should never be about the referee,

really

but it was it's uh

you know we've we've had even referees debating it haven't we and it's an interpretation of the law and or did he forget i agree with with jonathan surely surely with all the technology we have someone could have said to him you're going for a drop ball but to the wrong side it should be out on on this side whatever but i don't like the pitting of the referee mistake against the player mistake

there's a group that does that quite a lot And it's actually what you're trying to do then is you're trying to turn the focus away from the referee and then lambast the player, but we're being warned not to lambast the referee.

So

I don't like that approach.

But ultimately, look, the reason why it's so important is because

Paul Tierney, for whatever reason, made the wrong decision at the wrong time.

with minutes to go and then Nottenham Forest.

We've also got to think about the mentality.

Their heads have gone do you think they've gone i don't know if their heads have gone no but there's this thing where when i say their heads have gone i think that they they're they're so aggrieved at the decision they're so aggrieved at the ball dropping they've switched off uh you know they've defended very well against liverpool all game and they've created these these magnificent chances which i agree they should have scored from there's a language had two three

And then they've switched off and for some reason the ball gets in and around their box.

I admit it.

They should have smashed it down the field and protected their point.

But we cannot downplay what McAllister's role is in creating that goal for Nuniez, who we also, I don't think this guy gets enough credit because of all the mischances that people focus on.

Surely he was 501 in that list or whatever.

Yeah, he was, yeah, he is below Hawley.

He's below Holland.

I get it.

So he's in that bottom eight.

Calvert Lewin's the other big name in there.

That's no surprise, by the way.

That is no surprise.

But, you know, his finish at Brentford the other week, Michael Owen took umbrage to it as far as he's concerned.

He should never have finished in that way.

And I just think that he's one of those players that no matter what he does, he'll always get criticised.

But, you know, he's stepping up.

And, you know, Sal has been injured and away.

And he's stepping up and he's stepping up in such a...

and such big moments that we should be, well, I think he should be appreciated a lot more.

But yeah, just the referee thing was the thing that I really wanted to highlight.

No, no, no, good point.

I like the idea of saying, don't lambast him lambast him or look we all want to we all wake up on a Monday morning and we just fancy to do doing some lambasting and you know we've got to pick someone um look four wins in 11 days for Liverpool Wilson is brilliant I do you want to join what Barry would suggest is my meek falling over in front of some Liverpool criticism last week or just congratulate them for

basically they've done incredibly well even if there's some late winners and a bit of luck etc these last sort of two weeks has been fantastic yeah they've had a really good two weeks uh the injuries they've had it's been difficult for them but i i just say i think loads of people just sort of didn't understand what we were saying on monday what i was saying was it's not that they've

they clearly have played teenagers i'm not denying they've played teenagers but it's different to chelsea's it's much more constructive than chelsea's because they also had experienced players there to lead them on Whereas Chelsea have no experience.

And although it's not the fact that their young players are slightly more experienced or that their young players are slightly older than Liverpool's young players.

It's just that Liverpool as a club has just run much better.

So you have an array of ages so the older players can

lead the younger players, which Chelsea just don't have.

You're not a teenager denier.

You would totally accept that teenagers exist.

Yeah, I'm not sure they should, but they seem to.

And yeah,

I thought your capitulation was craven and disappointing.

Noted.

Well, I'd like to apologise to you now, Cravenly.

Apologise to you for Cravenly apologising to them.

Accepted.

Okay, to Kennenworth Road, Luton 2, Villa 3.

Odd game this, Troy.

You were there.

Villa could have been five up after an hour.

Luton staged another stirring comeback and then let it slip at the end.

Right, the same script that you've written in moments like this.

It's very important to focus.

We're talking about forwards quite a lot today.

And

obviously, like I said, having seen Harlan's performance on the Tuesday night, Watkins' performance was just as good in a totally different context.

But it was great to see him up close and personal because I know everyone talks about Harry Kane and, you know, Kane's going to lead us to this, that, and the other, and we don't need to have a second striker.

At the moment, what Ollie Watkins is doing is he's saying, actually, could I be the first choice?

And we know that's not going to happen.

But his

what I was really pleased with with him,

not at the time, obviously, but when you reflect is his hold-up play was great.

His desire to run into gaps and spaces to create the options was unbelievable his two finishes you know the first one i don't know how luke looton don't pick him up from the corner but he gets his head on it and then the second one his awareness that four luton players had actually switched off from this free kick that they were debating and telling Louise just to put it there and I'll do the rest.

It's exactly what he did.

Left foot touch, right foot finish.

He was a threat throughout the whole game.

Luton, again,

I don't know how many times I'm going to say this.

You know, chalk and cheese, they were very disappointing in the first half, but I think the goals had a massive impact at difficult times.

And I think they could almost were replaying the Man City game back in their head.

But then half an hour, 25 minutes, they absolutely switched on and battered Villa.

And Villa did well to survive that in regards to keeping it at 2-2

and, you know, battling down the hatches a little bit as Luton drove and drove at them.

But this thing about Luton is that they switch off in the final minutes against the top sides, and it's been proven all season.

And whilst the cross into the box by Diarby was a decent cross, it's defender first,

forward second.

And it wasn't even a forward, it was Dina, Luca Dina.

But as you watch the ball go in the box, you think he's not got this.

He's not covered it, Cabore.

And he's had a quick look at dina but by the time he's had his look dina is now advancing and you know heads it down and again heads it into the box and the whole place goes dead silent because they didn't deserve it but it's a replication of many games against the top sides and look they're still doing well they're still like they remove a chance if they can they've got a couple of games coming up now three in a week i think after after the next round which is very important um it was interesting that all five goals were, well, four of the five goals were scored from set pieces, so it shows again their strength and then obviously where they're probably at their weakest.

But honestly, it was a really, really good game of football.

And like I said, Ollie Watkins at the moment is playing at the height of his powers at the moment.

I mean, Luton have done so well at Kendall Road against Lords of the Big Teams and come away with nothing.

Well, come away with one point, didn't they?

They drew with Liverpool.

Yeah, because Liverpool liverpool equalize later on but yeah one point in those five gets the top five then they've lost against sheffield united and burnley at home and that's like oh you're not white barry totally different approach because again what sheffield united want and this is what luton have to learn what united wanted to do in a game that they thought wow they're so good here was get a goal up and Luton allowed them to do that.

And then it was battening down the hatches, you know, so all of a sudden now they're playing against six, seven defenders and they can't break them down.

It was a a massive game, you're right, it was a massive game.

And that's why I say that the Bournemouth game, the Nottingham Forest game, and the Crystal Palace game are very, very important because

they won't meet sides like the top sides, and they've got to take a good chunk of those nine points if they are realistically in with a chance of staying up.

Quiz time.

Ollie Watkins, only the fourth player to score 16 goals in a Premier League season for Villa.

After which three players?

Dwight York?

In this season.

Not this this season, Villa Players.

Oh, Villa Players.

Dwight York?

Correct.

Sorry, I said Dwight York before Jonathan said Dwight York.

They just did Dwight York.

And he's just got the credit for my answer.

One point to Wilson.

There you go.

One point one girl.

Correct.

Two for Wilson.

Alan McInally?

No.

No, Premier League.

It's Premier League.

No, not Premier League.

One of your favourites, actually, Baz.

Oh,

Savan Milosevich?

John Carew?

Pre-Premier League.

No.

Is John Carew one of your favourites?

No.

I don't know.

Oh, Benteke?

Christian Benteke.

Ah.

Come on.

Well done.

Tuwan to Wilson.

To the Tottenham Spurs Stadium.

You were there, Wilson.

Felt like a game that Spurs probably deserved to win, but also got away with it at the same time, which is quite a recurring theme.

That's exactly it.

I got a bit of criticism for being too negative in the match report.

People go, oh, well, they had 80% possession and they won 3-1.

How can you not say it was a battling?

To which the answer is, I was there and I saw saw what I saw, which is that

when Timo Verna scored, and let's be honest, none of us were expecting that, they were 1-0 down with 13 minutes to go.

And

yeah, they were creating some chances, but it wasn't sort of relentless pressure.

I mean, I was really surprised by that 80%, 20% statistic.

It didn't feel like that.

And it felt like Palace had played it just right.

I mean, it was very sort of Hodgson-style approach, different shape, but

sitting deep, get into half-time at 0-0.

Ezza

was really good on the break, got the free kick, then scored the free kick.

He went off after 65 minutes, just coming back from a samurai injury.

And Palace then lost their outlet.

To see Tim O'Verner score, it's like being at the wedding in Cana when Jesus turned the water into wine.

I thought that was slightly harsh, listing various miracles to have occurred throughout history in your intro and then likening Tim O'Verner's

finish at the back post to the wedding feast of Cana, the loaves and the fishes.

All I would say is it was 30 minutes to go, I had to do a hasty rewrite and googling what the world's most famous miracles seemed like the best way to go.

Would I do it again?

Possibly?

I don't know.

St.

Polycarp, not

he was number two weirdly on the site I found.

Look, we haven't we don't we don't talk enough about St.

Polycarp and it's one of the most pointless miracles.

So he's been he's been burned alive in Smyrna in 155,

and the flames don't burn him.

So they just stab him with swords and then cremate the body anyway.

So it's like it's a miracle that deferred his death by about half an hour.

Seems utterly futile, but there was a brother Polycarp in my national school.

Nobody ever tried to set him on fire.

No, I'm pleased about that.

Yeah, was he flammable?

Did it say, you know,

do not put close to a naked flame?

Steve says, does North London have enough buckets to hold all the goals Werner is about to go on and score?

I suppose the interesting thing, Troy, is watching, because he had that chance, and he always cleaned through, watching him clean through to watching Kuhnman's son clean through in the same game.

And obviously different output, but just the way that time slows down for one of them and sort of speeds up for the other one, right?

Listen, scoring goals is a confidence thing, as we know.

And, you know, maybe if he had scored the first one, the one that he had scored and then had this chance afterwards, he might have taken it in a totally different way.

But he really did like when he was in there was no confidence that he was going to finish and then he took the big roundabout route to try and get past um johnson and it just went the wrong way around the roundabout as well didn't he

he but look we have to still give him credit and jonathan yu was there and i know johnson had an impact in the time that he came on But again, the credit to

the slight movement to create his own space to score the goal after Johnson had done so well.

You know, you have to give players credit at that moment.

And that's him going, do you know what?

I want the easiest chance to tap this ball in as possible.

So he created his own space.

He scores, you know, and I don't know.

He's not my kind of finisher.

But like you said, the minute we saw Song go through, I think Spurs fans were already cheering because you kind of know that that's his style of finish and he's going to, you know,

put it away.

But listen, I'm pleased for Werner.

I thought we had a good game, Jonathan, from what I saw.

I thought he had a good game.

Yeah, he was my man of the match.

I made him man of the match, and that was only partly out of guilt for having lived a piss out of him in the match.

But no,

everything apart from the.

I mean, I was at the game, was it his day before Spurs the game away at Old Trafford?

And I thought he was really good that day as well, while missing some chances wildly.

So, everything apart from finishing, he's great.

If he does work out a finish, as he did in that one season at Leipzig, then you know, he's a he's a really, really, really dangerous forward.

To Goodison, Everton won West Ham three.

Simon says, Lucas Fabianski was amazing yesterday, wasn't he, Barry?

Yes, according to WhoScored.com, Alphonse Ariella's performance against Everton was the highest rated by a goalkeeper in the Premier League this season.

He got a 9.74.

I mean, it wasn't just him, you know, it wasn't just Everton battering West Ham, right?

Like,

it could have gone either way this game, but he was key, Bass.

He was.

He pulled off some sensational saves.

When he wasn't there to save, Thomas Suchek had an excellent clearance off the line, which I did notice on match of the day too.

They did a, in their too good, too bad section, they did a clearances off the line bit and left out Suchek's, which I thought was the best of the lot.

And then,

I suppose it's Everton's story of Everton's life, really.

Goals, they find goals hard to come by then in a game where they create loads of chances.

The opposition goalkeeper puts in a wonderful performance.

They missed a penalty.

Beto, who was in in place of Dominic Calvert-Luhn.

Dominic Calvert-Luhn hasn't scored for 21 games.

Betto eventually scored his second Premier League goal of the season.

I think he's third or fourth in all competitions.

And that's Everton's problem, really.

They can't score goals.

And

Thomas Suchek had one of the goals of the weekend to put West Ham ahead.

And then

Edson Alvarez wrapped things up for them deep in injury time, one of many, many late goals on Saturday.

Yeah, Everton are now without win in 10 games.

I think they've drawn four out of their last 10 Premier League games, lost six, and looks like they'll get away with it because there'll be three teams worse than them.

Buzz, you talk more highly of Suchek's clearance off the line than you do of his absolutely amazing strike.

Oh, it's just stunning goal.

Are we saying that's a half volley, by the way?

Oh, yes, it is for me.

It is for me.

I thought just

as I said to you yesterday, Baz,

him spinning around in the rain.

I just don't think any of us will just know joy like that.

Like, there is someone who is unburdened by anything.

He's not thinking about anything.

He's just that is pure happiness distilled into one rangy check.

Deserves the music behind it, doesn't it?

Yeah, it was a pleasure to see.

Producer Joel writes, you'd have bettoed your house on him scoring that penalty.

I mean, mean, not really, actually, you want to say you wouldn't beto your house on him scoring that penalty for it to really work.

I also thought good, I saw Calvin Phillips at the end and thought, oh, I've not noticed him.

That's good.

He's had 25 minutes where nothing absolutely disastrous has happened.

So hopefully, onwards and upwards for him.

And that'll do for part two.

Part three, we'll round up the rest of the Premier League.

Hi, Pod fans of America.

Max here.

Barry's here, too.

Hello.

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A proper football journalist, mate.

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Welcome to part three of the Guardian Football Weekly, as Barry just pointed out in the break.

We don't have a lot of time for these games because we spent far too much time disagreeing with Barry about Kyle Walker's brushing Marcus Russell's.

I would like to apologise for that.

I was really ordered into a debate.

I've seen one.

But I'd like to apologise for bringing it up again at the top of part three.

It just wasn't a failure, was it?

It wasn't a failure.

Oh, God.

Brett for two, two, Chelsea two.

Should we talk about Johan Wisse's overhead kick, Troy?

I love that it was his third go.

No one can have attempted three overhead kicks in a match before, can they?

I thought he was going to give this to Barry because the way that he downplays these great strikes over the weekend, like he won't have much to say about this.

But look, if you don't succeed first, second time, make sure you try it again and make sure you hit it with everything that you've got.

It's just one of a catalogue of really good goals this weekend.

And, you know, to his credit, again, when the ball looped up perfectly.

So let's just talk about the goal.

The ball looped up perfectly and it deserved what it got.

And Viza just

gave it everything, didn't he?

A great height to hit it.

Power on it as well meant that even if there was someone standing on the line, they probably wouldn't have kept it out anyway.

So, look, for me, it was a

it was a game of two sides that are not playing very well, but managed to eke out a draw with a great goal in it, make it kind of exciting.

Brentford will be disappointed that Chelsea have got one late on, but

there was a catalogue of mistakes as well.

And it was just one of those, I don't know, it's supposed to be a West London derby, isn't it?

It didn't feel like a derby, but the goal obviously elevated the game to a really high level of status.

Lots of catalogues for you, Troy.

I mean, we feel like catalogues are going out of bathing, aren't they?

You're still getting deliveries.

I still remember Freeman's.

Don't worry about that.

Argos.

I still remember

Little Woods and Freeman.

Amstrad Action.

Here we go.

What Hi-Fi?

Troy's got them all in a ring binder, hasn't he?

What's Hi-Fi?

I don't know.

I mean, I've

yeah, no, you're right.

You're right.

You're right.

Is that a catalogue or a magazine?

I think it's slightly different things.

It's a magazine, I think.

Yeah, Ivan Tony didn't score.

He did present a Brit Award later that evening.

So swings and roundabouts, I guess.

I don't know what he was presenting.

And I certainly don't know who won any of of them.

David Raya, I seem to get six Brits.

That's what I read.

Anyway, I don't have any strong thoughts about this game apart from that, Barry.

I suppose the main takeout was that the Chelsea fans really turned on, and these are the travelling Chelsea fans, the hardcore, really turned on Maurizio Pocciino.

And when it was put to him that they'd done that after the game, he said he didn't care.

Doesn't sound great.

He may not care, but he should probably pretend he does.

Just for it, if only in the interests of an easy life.

Didn't the Brentford fans also turn on the side at half-time when they were one down?

I think Thomas Frank said something about it as well.

So it was a game, really, where both sets of fans turned on their own players and team halfway through and then at the end of the game as well.

Yeah, actually, Thomas Frank was slightly weird after this game.

I was sort of really...

really going over the top about how well his players played.

I think he sort of said wow about four times in a row.

Well, I really, really went for it.

Newcastle three Wolves 0.

It was very wet, Wilson.

Good win for Newcastle.

Let's talk about Anthony Gordon because when we're looking at England's front three, probably,

you know, he's not going to knock Sakura or Foden out of a team, but he could get a looking in this March international break and probably should.

I think he's been their best player this season, hasn't he?

Yeah, I think that's probably fair.

I think he definitely should get a look.

I I mean, Ezra had the call-up for the Malta and North Macedonia games, so he

is in the picture.

I think the thing with Gordon as well, now that the squad's back down to 23, there's a slight issue with centre-forwards.

So Kane and Watkins will obviously go.

But you sort of think, well, you probably do with three because there are times when you might want two of them on the pitch.

So one of them got injured.

So Gordon can at least fill in there.

You know, has played at centre-forwards for England at youth level for Newcastle this season.

But yeah, I think, you know, I hate this idea of, oh, he deserves a call-up, but he deserves a call-up, and there's an obvious slot for him.

And therefore, I think it makes sense to give him a try.

And actually, you call someone up to see how they go, even 20 minutes in a random friendly, and then decide if their international quality is slightly ridiculous.

No, but it's the training as well, isn't it?

I think from Southgate's point of view, it's how they look in training, and I think that's much more significant than the actual friendlies for March.

He was also a player of the tournament, wasn't he, at the under-21s?

I know it's a different

thing, but he has proven he can do it in a tournament environment.

And he's a pen in the arse, which I think is kind of being a pen in the arse is a good thing when you're trying to win tournaments.

You need a couple of them.

Okay.

Same for pods, but I'm not saying anything more than that.

There was a goal-line clearance from Totty that I thought was better than Suchik's, Barry, but I don't want to have a row with you.

We haven't got time.

Fulham 3, Brighton, 0.

Rodrigo Mooniz, Barry.

He's got a bit of Mitrovich energy about him.

I don't know if

energy is the right word, but like he's

technically great.

He's strong.

He's a nuisance.

He's really important, I think.

And I'm really impressed with him.

Five and five, I think.

Yeah, speaking of pains in the arses, you immediately go on to Alexander Mitrovic.

Yeah,

I still can't make head nor tail of Fulham.

They were really good in this game.

He was excellent.

I think

I'm not even sure where he came from or when he arrived.

I'm probably not the person to come.

He just appeared.

He was one of those miracles, Barry.

He was the next miracle.

The appearance of Rodrigo Munes in West London.

That was it.

Ping!

Like Dungeon Master.

I'm probably not the person to come for Rodrigo Munes chat, but it was another great performance out of nowhere from, well, not out of nowhere from Fulham.

But Brighton were terrible.

I'm worried about Evan Ferguson's lack of goals.

He hasn't scored in 17 appearances.

He's no longer really first choice for Brighton.

And considering how much he was being

talked up last season and earlier this season, that's a slight worry for me as a Republic of Ireland fan.

And yeah, even when that Adam Atrora is scoring against you, you've got problems, haven't you?

He set one up in their last game, I think, and

scored in this one, which is a rare bout of productivity from all the Dama.

Yeah, Pete says he Adama Troy has an assist and scored in the last two games.

When will the world return to normal and he go back to having no end product?

Or is this the sign of an impending apocalypse?

To Turf Moore, you touched on it earlier, Barry.

Bernie Nil Bournemouth, two.

Bernie have five points at home all season.

I thought they were okay in this game, Troy.

And

I think Vince and Company has a bit of a point that Bournemouth had two yellow cards that could have been reds.

They were sort of, you know, very orangey yellows, Clyverton,

Tavern.

Yeah,

and the disallowed goal, I thought was a foul, but

because Adam Smith made the most of it.

As Adam Smith normally does, knowing him so well.

How well do you know Adam Smith?

He grew up with Andross in the Tottenham Academy.

Ah, is that right?

I mean, he was diving all over the place.

Is that what you're saying?

He does like the ground a lot, yeah.

Sort of in that sort of Luke Ayling style, you know, that amazing video of Luke Luke Ayling getting cheap free kicks for leads over and over again, that kind of thing.

Sorry, carry on.

Over and over and over again, yeah, that was Adam.

Now, listen,

I'm sorry, I'm going to ignore the yellow card situation and just your opening there of Burnley.

I suppose we're okay.

Burnley cannot afford to be okay anymore.

And if they are going to have any chance of survival, and they're not down yet, but they have to win home games like that.

And, you know, the record at home is terrible.

So, where do they create the environment of of of um you know expectation of wins if it's not at home to bournemouth who have been struggling lately themselves i don't think they've won they had one in 2024 as yet then you kind of resign yourself that you know where are they going to pick up points and there's been a lot of chopping and changing there's been a lot of debate about the goalkeeper There's been some nice football being played, but I didn't see the fans creating any energy as well that would make it a very difficult place to go to um so they're not even creating a buzz and a fear around going to turf moor which there used to be and look i think vincent will keep his job because he's probably the best person to try and bring them back up again but i think they would look on this

if they go down i must say that but i think they'll look on this season probably a little bit wasted um

you know because they've not really give it a really really good fight and i think that would disappoint them and i think think it would disappoint the fans as well i think the last person to have a fear of going to turret moor was troy when it looked like andross might sign for burley and christen

but it probably speaks volumes this was probably their best performance of the season they still lost 2-0 you know i think there's a wider worry here that burney was so good in the championship last season i mean i think one of the best teams i've ever seen in the championship

and then on the back of that their premium league performance is so limp if that is in you know chef united scrapped their way up fine.

They were the second best championship last season, completely deserved to go up.

But nobody thought they'd be good this season.

Then they sold their three best posts before the season began.

So Sheffield United were always going to be in trouble.

But if what's happened to Burnley is indicative of a gulf between the championship and the Premier League, then that is a big, big problem.

And

it's not that implausible that the three sides who went up will come down, the three sides who came down will go up.

And that's also a worry.

Yeah, well, look, Leicester had lost three in a row,

and now just three clear of Ipswich five clear of leads Southampton also came down they had a very late win at Birmingham for the first time in six years Celtic and Rangers both lost Scottish Premiership games on the same weekend which is pretty extraordinary got I think Celtic must have been buzzing when Rangers lost on Saturday so then to lose again not great

Stuart says can the panel think of any team that's managed to lead a game that didn't involve extra time for longer than Neil Warnock's Aberdeen did on Saturday and still managed to lose away at St Miran they scored in in the first minute.

St.

Miran equalized in the 96th and won it in the 97th minute.

Gianna Infantino was there because ifab were having a meeting in Loch Lomond

and

a few things came out of it that we might have time to discuss during the week.

Ian says, no questions.

Just looking forward to your hour-long special on Ronan Curtis's 94th minute winner for AFC Wimbledon against franchise and the bedlam that followed.

Yeah, they beat MK Dons 1-0.

Charlie Baker made a good point on the radio.

Why don't MK just lose the Dons, right?

Just lose that.

Just be Milton Keynes United or something.

Because, you know, they are a football team.

There will be young kids who weren't even born who support their local team that is Milton Keynes.

Why not just do that?

That seems like a, I mean, unless I'm,

I can't think of a reason why you wouldn't to sort of end the

rage.

Max, something very important here.

In the celebration, one of the ball boys was picked up and we never saw him again.

So we asked the fans to make sure that in all the kind of diving on top of each other, I never saw that ball boy again because someone made some guy's front room and that he enjoyed the fact that he was just sitting in someone's front room.

Where am I?

The commentary was amazing on that as well.

It was absolutely amazing.

Oh, the local radio commentary was really, really good, wasn't it?

Anyway, look, that'll do for today.

Thank you very much, Jonathan Wilson.

Cheers.

Thank you.

Thank you, Troy.

Pleasure.

I just established bow, did you think that was a foul?

Football Weekly is produced by Joel Grove.

Our executive producer is Max Suns.

This is The Guardian.