Episode 182: Aaron Alexander – Movement Coach, Creator of the Align Method, Author and Podcast Host

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Hi guys, it's Tony Robbins.

You're listening to Habits and Hustle.

Fresh it.

Today on the podcast, we have Aaron Alexander.

Aaron is a movement coach.

He is the founder and creator of the Align Method, the author of the Align Method book, and of course, the Align Method podcast.

He really is about true mind-body connection.

And as a result, he helps people align their body, their mind, their environment, their posture, movement to achieving incredible results.

On this episode, we talk about becoming physically and mentally healthier.

Along the way, he tells his his own family story of a father addicted to crack cocaine.

We talk all about posture.

We talk about

how to infuse better movement into your daily life and like practical ways and solutions to do this, the impact of your environment for your postural patterns and physiology.

It was really an interesting conversation.

And he's an interesting guy, just altogether.

So I really think that you're going to enjoy this podcast and get a lot of very valuable ways to integrate these practical things to help optimize your mind, your body, and your spirit.

Enjoy.

I'm very curious about you.

I mean, are you kind of like the, you're the align guy.

Your book obviously was, well, it's called The Align Method.

You created the Align Method.

Are you just like

a guru in mind-body connection and mobility?

Like, who are you?

Give me like the origin story of who you are and what your,

what your thing is.

That's so funny.

Um, I mean, I don't, I think guru is like actually, that's like a, that's, that's like a bad word.

I would just like making it.

I wouldn't use guru personally, but

I think the actual meaning of guru is teacher.

Um, okay.

So, you know, I would say we're all gurus in our own right.

Okay, Tony Robbins.

Isn't that what

you know, know, you are your own guru, or whatever that movie was documented.

Yeah,

I think, I mean, I think there's, I think there's, there's a lot of truth to that.

Like, like, we have the answers to many things, to life's, you know, predicaments within ourselves.

And we are in a circumstance where we are bombarded with so much information from all angles.

Totally checked.

And that tends to drown out the internal, deeper

knowing that we all do have.

So, in that sense as like kind of

i don't know maybe maybe soft or like metaphysical or you know a bit a bit like

i don't like to fall into like the the new age type category as new agey as that sounds like i think there that is a lot of a lot of truth to that like we all really are our own gurus in a sense and we do have a deeper knowing and i think there's many processes and paths to get us all closer to that relationship with ourselves.

And a part of that would just be a very simple, pragmatic process of cutting out

static from our lives, you know, and that's like Bruce Lee.

I think that like everybody's a big fan of Bruce Lee, myself included.

One of the things he's said various different iterations of is, you know, life or martial arts or anything relevant is about subtraction, it's not about addition.

And so

some of the potential statics that we may

be encumbered by in our modern lives, a lot of beautiful things in our lives as well, might be nutritional related static, you know, having different things that might make us feel a little stirred up, make us feel a little aggressive, make us feel a little anxious, make us feel a little tired.

We're continually yearning for something to pep us back up because we just feel kind of like our energy is like pooled.

Movement or lack of movement, the lighting in our environments or a lack of light, you know, if we're not getting adequate exposure to full spectrum light,

relationships, a sensation of purpose, like feeling like, what the hell am I doing here?

What is the point of anything?

Like, why do I care to exercise in the first place?

I think it's a reasonable question to ask.

Because if your goal of exercising is just coming from a place of like lack of self-acceptance, and I will accept myself when my ass doesn't jiggle in this way, or when I have six-pack abs, which is just a story of that indicating health,

that's problematic.

So in short, I guess if your question is like,

well, the shorter version, if you're asking like, who am I?

I think I'm just very interested in these questions.

And I really enjoy looking at the body from a broader lens than just like merely exercise.

And I'm really interested in like the psychosomatic relationships.

Like that mind-body relationship is the thing that I, it like, it, you know, winds me up.

I'm very interested in that conversation.

So, then, what would you say?

Because you created the, you have your whole brand is the align method, right?

So, what would you, how would you define if someone says, Aaron, in elevator pitch me, what is the align method?

What is it?

Align method is a manual on how to make it so that fitness is who you are as opposed to a thing that you do.

If I had to put into like a sentence, can you hear the rain in the background?

Yeah, I can.

I'm going to shut my window, but the rain is awesome.

wow

that sounds actually

yeah it's very soothing oh

yeah so fitness is who you are it's not a thing you should do as you're having a conversation with somebody are you gonna comment on something no i'm listening to you i think that's a great way of summing it up actually because

uh what would you how did you kind of

what was your evolution for it though like what did you start doing how did you become the person that is

i mean for all great for all intents purposes here, like an expert in

this kind of,

what would you call it?

Would you call it mobility overall, overall movement, overall?

Like holistic, holistic physical health.

Holistic physical health.

Okay, what was your evolution?

How did you start?

Insecure bodybuilding, all of the supplements,

all of like just the very

just basic muscle and fitness workouts and just a lot of time staring in the mirror making muscles kind of like like manifest myself into being like a mini Arnold Schwarzenegger as a young person

really like what you like just working out at the gym day in day out taking all the time

really everything I put on like 60 pounds in a matter of like I don't remember what it was very short amount of time like six months or less than a year or something like that a part of that was puberty so it wasn't like I mean I was essentially on steroids but they were like, you know, endogenous.

But it was that compounded with just like complete, utter obsession around getting as big as I possibly could because I felt like a deep lack of acceptance in myself.

And within that, that was, I would, if there was ever like a time of like taking a picture or something, there was a picture in this day and age, which was, I'm not super old, I'm 35, but it was before like cell phone cameras and stuff.

I know what you mean.

You know, but so there was less pictures at that time frame.

But when there was a picture,

I would immediately leave the room.

I would run out and I would go do a bunch of push-ups.

I'd go find a doorway to do pull-ups on or something, and I would like try to get this like pump in my muscles, get good circulation, you know, get a good, good, get a good hue.

Yeah, I totally know what you mean.

Yeah.

And then I'd come back in for the photo.

So that was just like, just like, that was kind of like...

where my mind was at.

And then that

turned into a lot of muscular imbalance.

I was very focused on like the glamour muscles, the beach muscles.

If I didn't see it, probably didn't matter that much.

I'd like touch up on those muscles every now and again, but it just wasn't that relevant.

And then a lot of pain, a lot of injuries, like chronic lingering type pain, like

many people are accustomed to, particularly like back pain.

And that turned into,

I was going to go to school for physical therapy.

I went to school for rolfing, structural integration instead.

So manual therapy.

I was doing personal training working with clients at the time, moved to Hawaii, was doing like beach boot camps and, you know, got into jiu-jitsu and surfing and

various different forms of manual therapy or like massage therapy.

And so it was more like getting into like yin side now of like, okay, how do we start to

reassemble the system as opposed to just like just like making everything bigger just for bigger sake.

And, you know, that's, I'm still like in that process.

Like I'm like still sorting it out.

Well, it's interesting because looking at you, like even on your Instagram or just in general, you're like

extraordinarily fit looking.

I mean, I can't imagine you, like, if you said that, that's how you used to be, like, I would think that you were like at like a 10 pack right now.

So how did, like, are you, how did you, or are you still

How did you kind of like pivot from being that bodybuilder?

I need to like work out for vanity purpose.

Um, what, what, like, what triggered you to kind of get more into this other holistic side, but yet still look the same?

I mean, you still, you look, look amazing.

Not to like, I'm not hitting on you, I'm just telling you, you just do, right?

Appreciate that.

You look great too.

Well, thank you, but not like you,

are you just like a thank you?

Are you just like a genetic freak that way?

Like, your baseline is so good, or what are you like, what's the secret?

I've, so, I've, I mean, I, I, I, like anybody, have, have, have been,

you know working on it for a while like I've I've I've been working out quote unquote in some capacity very intently since I was 14 like I just never stopped and then it turned into my career like I started personal training when I was 16 I got a job at LA Fitness got my my NSCA personal training certification

you know and and you know that that was kind of like the beginning of that so it's always been just a part of i've had the accountability of showing up for like adults adults.

So I was 16, showing up to like train adults.

There's like 30, you know, 40, whatever year old people with like real jobs, real lives, partners, you know, like they're like, they're like real people.

And I'm just like this, this little insecure kid that's kind of jacked, you know, trying to try to precociously just like garner as much information to be able to regurgitate to these people as possible.

And

so it's, I think it, I think it's just been like a process of continual slow

work.

And now

I'm very grateful that

my body and anybody's body, we do have a certain level of like muscle memory, which is kind of a bit of a soft, flimsy term.

But

my endocrine system, my neurochemicals, like all the systems, they're kind of exposed.

They understand training.

they understand cold, they understand heat, they understand hypertrophy, they understand fasting, and you know, you can kind of work those systems into the body through exposure.

And I've just been like continually exposing myself, I haven't stopped like exposing myself.

I think of like each day as like an experiment.

Are you not?

So,

are you basically saying you've always been kind of what I'm gathering is you haven't ever stopped being active in some capacity, so it's it is muscle memory.

What are you doing now, though, to stay this healthy and fit and to move?

Are you not a gym person?

Do you not work out

at a traditional gym?

Oh, you do?

You still do that?

Yeah, but the gym I go to is largely, I train outside quite a bit.

So it's here in Austin.

It's a place called Squatch.

And

I really like it because I can get like sunlight.

So sun, that's like one of the primary factors for, again, like neurochemical health, hormonal health, testosterone,

you know, libido, like all that, just generally, you know, skin tone looking, feeling attractive.

There's various different research around that.

So I'm a big advocate for spending time in the sun.

I'm a big advocate for, like right now, as we're having this conversation, you've already noticed,

I've changed positions, you know, 15 times.

Yeah, you're moving a lot.

It's like you're, you're, you're, by the way, you're sitting on the floor as we do this podcast.

Yeah, I'm sitting on the floor, which isn't, I don't think is, is very strange.

It's like, welcome to the whole world.

That's true.

Most of the world slash before

just complete transition to like becoming a chair-based culture,

you know, spending time on the ground is just very, very normal.

Like, spending time on the ground actually is the normal thing.

You know, so as I'm on the ground,

and normal is a dumb word.

It's a subjective word.

But as far as like normal, my definition of normal would be like most conducive for

cellular health you know and like musculoskeletal well-being i said skeletal like a british person so if that if we were just we were just to

put normal as something that's like okay like what just what makes your cells function best we'll just call that normal just for lack of you know for just to find a definition and so That's very normal.

Like our body,

there's actually a book called Muscles and Meridians by Philip Beach that's been quite impactful for me.

And in that book, he refers to spending time on the ground, which again, most all healthy cultures around the world do that.

Cultures that have minimal incidence of ostearthritis in the hips and the knees have minimal issues around like, you know, incontinence, like pelvic floor issues.

you know, just like

spine pathologies, things of the sort.

Like just going through those ranges of motion, it heals the joints.

It brings new fluids to the joints.

And it's just, it's good for them circulates lymphatic fluid better for for digestion because your your legs are closer to your your viscera your heart your organs you don't have all this blood pooling up in your lower compartments think like cankles when you're in a plane it's gross doesn't look good doesn't feel good makes you makes you feel drained standing in a museum for too long you're just like

so sitting on the floor is there a position that we should be sitting in or just our legs crossed or what's the the ideal position to be sitting on the floor there's no best position so this i mean I have a whole chapter in the align method book about just spending time on the ground.

I mean, it feels so stupid to talk about.

It feels like dumb because it's like childish.

But it actually is not.

Because I think that people,

it's the most basic things in life I feel and find that we just.

we don't kind of, we don't think about, right?

And we just, we just don't, we forget.

And now what's our normal, quote unquote, is sitting in a chair like I am.

But you're saying that there's so many more extra there's so many benefits to actually being on the ground which is why and what I want to get to like I want you to talk about like you have been

what are the like what are the benefits of of sitting on the ground versus being in a chair like where I'm sitting right now in a chair you're saying it's not great for my back my hips it helps with it like

you know like if I just sat on the floor let's just put it this way if I sat on the floor versus sitting in a chair what would the benefits be what would I kind of get from that or not just me but everybody?

So a bunch.

So, so, all right, so a few things.

One, there's been various different research around this, studying different cultures that happen to spend more time around.

So, like northern Africa, southeastern Asia, eastern Mediterranean, these places.

There's also other things, you know, at least northern Africa

and eastern Mediterranean, they tend to drink like, you know, eat pretty good, eat a lot of olive oil, which is also good for the joints.

But very low incidence of ostearthritis in the hips and the knees.

And a part of their culture is they're just taking their hips and their knees through a full range of motion.

It's very simple.

You know, that would be one thing that's pretty interesting.

Another thing is, like I already mentioned, digestion.

So if you're eating and you're in order for you to be able to digest food, you're going to pull like why you get sleepy when you're eating food is you're pulling a bunch of blood from your periphery and it's going into your viscera and your organs and your stomach to break that stuff down and then recirculate and and carry those nutrients to the rest of the body.

So

when your legs are closer to your heart, like think if you ever injured your ankle, if you ever sprain an ankle, everybody's sprained an ankle at some point in their lives, your physical therapist, first thing they're going to say, you know, compression and elevation.

Right.

It used to be rice, rest, ice, compression, elevation.

Then Merkin, the doctor fellow that created that in like the late 70s, he recently recalled that, I think in like the early 2000s.

So it's like, oh, like my bad, ice is actually a bummer.

You know, you don't want to slow down the inflammatory response and

stop that action.

You want to actually support it.

You just want to keep it circulating.

So actually warmth, elevation, movement, stay out of pain, but elevation and compression.

It's essentially what you're doing when you're sitting in any of those childish positions when you're on the ground.

So if you're laying on your back, that's obviously it's just going to be more advantageous for for better circulation the way that you circulate lymphatic fluid is through muscular contraction if you are just sitting on a sofa just kind of pulling your fluids it's not bad it's not like a moralistic thing it's just disadvantageous for the circulation of the vital fluids throughout your body so if you are sitting on the ground like any kid would do or person in you know culture that does this, you'll just naturally kind of move your body around.

Like that's a healthy body, a body that just kind of wiggles a little bit.

And, you know, that's, there's a, there's a fancy term for those wiggles called neat.

It's, it's,

what is it called?

Non-exercise activity thermogenesis is the unnecessary

definition of the, of the acronym.

And so what that is, is non-exercise.

So it's not like, like the idea of exercise, I think, is cute.

Like you think you're gonna like work yourself out into some new form.

It's like what about, like, that's one hour, three or four days a week.

Like, what are you even talking about?

That is, it's like so minuscule.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yes.

So it's like the rest of the day, like, that's the align method.

Like, all I care about is like, what are you doing with the rest of it?

Like, you have so many coaches and magazines and muscle and fitness and everything to do the perfect Tybo workout or plyometrics or knees over toes or like whatever you do.

The rest of the day is all I'm really interested in as far as like working with, well, I like both, honestly, because I do enjoy like nerding out about training.

But the rest of the daytime, that NEAT, that non-exercise activity, thermogenesis time, you'd be burning upwards of 2,000 extra in quotations, calories just from living a little bit more of like a wiggly lifestyle.

And if you were to take yourself into, you know, so you'd say to go like northern Tanzania, where there's been a ton of research with like gut biome stuff, also with

movement, researchers from southern california from from your part of the world my old my old part

uh they went out there in the last few years and um they attached these sensory systems bio something motor whatever to the tribal folks hips hips and knees to track the range of motion they're going through the day and what they found was that these hunter-gatherer, ancestral, like the romanticized people that the whole world is like, oh, whatever they're doing is the right thing.

They are in resting positions about as much as industrialized cultures.

So, on average, it was, it was like the exact number was 9.82 hours per day, if I remember correctly.

And so, that's like, okay,

they're not just like running all day or like climbing trees all day, you know, or doing like capueta dancing and like playing drums.

Like, they're resting a lot.

Like,

they're trying to preserve energy so they're resting about as much as we are

like we you know representing like you know industrialized western culture whatever so the the difference is how are they resting

The way they're resting is they're in kneeling positions, they're in squatting positions, they're in

various different floor sitting positions that I pretty much outlined in the book slash everywhere.

And

they're they're actively

engaging in their resting positions.

It's not just outsourcing all of their mechanical efficiency to, you know, a device, in this case, the device being the chair.

When you outsource what your body would naturally do, then you begin to atrophy.

When you atrophy, you start to become trapped.

If you atrophy too much, then you're in a tight spot.

Right.

That's right.

That's right.

Does that mean, by the way, the wigglies, is it because, are you wiggling because you're uncomfortable on the floor?

And so therefore you're trying to get a job you're adjusting yourself constantly to find a comfortable position?

Because like right now,

if you're in an uncomfortable chair, you can wiggle a lot.

You know, I'm wiggling a ton right now.

That's great.

That's how a kid would sit in a chair

until they were advised that they're sick and they need medication.

That's how a healthy kid would sit in a chair.

They'd rock back on the chair.

They'd go on the left side.

They'd go on the right side.

They're working their whole proprioceptive system.

That's neurology, like that's education.

So, does that mean I'm uh I'm getting the same benefits in this chair as you are on the floor because I'm like, Yeah, I'm moving around.

There's also a chair, chairs are just a thing, it doesn't matter, it's just who are you in the chair.

Who are you?

Where am I in the chair?

Right, but can you sit on a cushion on the chair on the floor?

Yes, do you?

Oh, yeah, I'm on a cushion.

My whole setup, okay.

Let me look at your setup.

I'm just curious.

All right, so I want to.

So, I got this cute little, little cushion situation about that wine.

Okay.

My hips are semi-flexible.

I would say they're more than semi.

They would poop very flexible.

But so that's, I'm just saying that that cushion is kind of small for a lot of a lot of folks.

For most people, I'd say make your cushion like at least, I don't know, a foot high, 10 inches high, or something like that.

The big thing, if you want to have biomechanical efficiency within your sacrum, just your spine, your hips, you want to make sure your hips are up above the height of your knees.

If your hips are up above the height of your knees, that will put your lower back, particularly the L5S1 vertebra, they are in a bit of a shape of a wedge with the wide angle of the wedge facing out towards your belly button.

And so

what that suggests is that you want to kind of have

the hips ever so slightly kind of like tilting forward.

And that's kind of like a ready position.

So if you roll your hips backward and you sit down on the ground without like having your hips up above the height of your knees, then you're going to be in that sad puppy dog kind of like

rolled forward position.

There's nothing wrong with it, but it's just putting a little undue stress on the discs in your spine and such.

So you can really relax into the architecture of your spine when you set your hips up above the height of your knees.

That in and of itself, whether you're on a chair or on the floor or whatever, if you just take away that tip, you know, those of you

still engaged in this conversation

or monologue, if you just take away that one tip, this whole thing was worth it.

You can stop listening.

Just do that and it will make a massive difference in your life.

Wow, that's amazing.

So then how about sleeping?

Do you sleep on the floor or do you sleep on a mattress?

That'd be so cool if I could.

I'm such a baby.

Like

I spent a lot of time, I lived in Colorado for a while, I lived in Venton, Oregon for a while, and I've like identified as like a like a mountain climber person, but it's so hard for me to sleep if I'm not on like a comfortable, like, it has to be like a really comfortable, expensive mat from REI, like a thick one,

or just like a good mattress.

But ideally,

yeah, ideally, you would have enough adaptability in your joints and your connective tissue to be able to sleep on something that's fairly firm.

You know, and if, and if you, you don't,

it's kind of an indication that there is some room for growth there.

But for me, my suggestion is

sleep is kind of like the most important thing you can do over a lot of things.

So if you're getting whatever your metaphoric eight hours of sleep is, it doesn't need to be eight hours, but like whatever

your eight hours, like where you feel like you've got your eight hours,

that's like the foundation to rest most other practices on top of.

So for me, I'm like, I just want you to sleep, like make sure you sleep.

And then from there, let's draw back and say, maybe every once in a while, experiment and sleep on, you know, go camping outside someplace, you know, and within that, you're going to naturally be actually taking your body through a bit of like a myofascial release session in a way.

So when you're on a feather, soft, whatever bed, there's not a lot of pressure on your connective tissue, on on your joints, on your muscles.

When you're on something like a hard ground, you're getting more pressure.

So, if you went and got a massage with like a big Russian lady or something, and she was putting elbows into different parts of your body, if you have a healthy body, you know, alga can drop a ton of weight into all sorts of weird spots in your body, and you're like, Yeah, I can just breathe through this.

Like, this actually feels good.

If you're in a dis-eased body, you know, like a body that's eased, yes, yes.

Then alga is going to be, is going to be like bringing the pain.

So the healthier the body, the more dynamic and flexible it is to its environment.

If a body is more kind of stuck, then the idea of like laying down on the ground would be like, would be really hard because, you know, their tissue is sensitive.

And it's sensitive because it's like, it's...

You know, pain is a, I borrowed this from a podcast guest I've had in the past called Perry Nicholson.

But he said, pain is a request for change.

It's just so cool.

Oh, I like that.

Pain's a big, very robust topic.

I've done like tens of episodes exclusively just asking the question, what is pain to like the smartest people on the planet around the conversation of pain.

Right.

And nobody really knows what pain is.

But I really like that, that one.

If there's pain, it's like there's, it's, we don't define exactly what it is, but there's some suggestion from the body saying, like, can can we change right right

and and you and you feel that most pain comes from the fact that like you were saying there's 24 hours in a day even if you work out a lot you still have let's say you have even if you work out once an hour a day you still have 23 hours uh to like be fit and like to live when you say and and your definition of fitness is is very different.

So number, what is your approach to fitness?

Like what in a day in the life, like what would you do?

Give me what you do, what time you wake up, all the different habits that you've incorporated, how you've went from this like muscle building meathead type of thing to this like, you know, evolute, you know, this, this new Aaron who's now you, not guru, but expert in holistic movement.

Well, I think that I'm, I don't, honestly, I don't think I'm the best example.

Like, I think that I've, one thing that I am is I've been consistent for, you know, the last 20 years.

So I can pat myself on the back about that.

I have kind of augmented my perception somehow

towards enjoying some bout of discomfort pretty much every day.

So whether it's like doing a cold plunge or sitting in a sauna for, you know, an extended period or like fasting or exercising and getting into the part where like the training starts to be like, oh, it's uncomfortable.

It's like, oh, this is fine.

It's just a thing.

It's not something to run away from.

It's just a thing.

You know, I have like a, I have like a these sadhu nailboard thing sitting behind me here.

A what?

It's called a sadhu nailboard.

I can grab it.

So this is a sadhu nailboard, and it's just covered in a bunch of sharp nails.

And so that's an example of something that it's like,

you know, I like.

You sit on it or you stand on it?

No, you stand your feet on it.

Oh, it's one of those.

Yes, yes, yes.

Yeah, it's cool.

I'm not like bragging about this.

I think this is very minor, whatever.

This doesn't matter.

But I'm just saying, like, this is an example of like, it induces this sensation that we call pain.

For the most part, pain is a thing to like, like, oh, like, stop it.

That is a perception.

Pain is just an ex, it's just a sensation, like, it's just like chemicals, and it's just, it just is, right?

And so, some bout of that is something that I typically,

you know, I'll try to like find something like that each day.

I organize my relationships around that.

So, most of my relationships and friends this morning met up as friends and we boxed, so we sparred.

Um, so that was like community connection, all of that stuff, um, challenge, a lot of hand-eye coordination.

um there's just a lot it's just a you know a lot packed into that that was at like a date that was like that was meeting up with a buddy and doing that so organizing relationships around things that that catalyze you to be some version of yourself that would be more preferable is i think that's advisable uh so that's that's something that and and and now i've kind of organized my life around that and my career and my brand so now there's a certain expectation of that of me which is cool.

You know, so now if people meet up with me, they're like, okay, let's like swim across, you know, some river thing or do cold plunge or there's like this certain level of expectation.

I'm like, fucking amazing.

Great.

Like, that's so cool.

Like, yeah, like, let's, let's do hard things together.

Like, we always feel better afterwards.

It's also bonding.

It's a bonding thing.

Like, what you're doing.

Of course.

You don't bond over soft stuff.

You don't bond over coffee.

100%.

No, you don't.

You don't bond over coffee, even dinner.

Like, you know, like my husband's like a big believer in that.

You need to do, you have to experience.

You have to have life experience with people in order to build a true relationship and connection that's long-lasting, right?

Like, how many people have you had coffee with?

I can,

I have so many coffee, lunch, dinner meetings, and like, you forget about the person the next day.

It's like when you like do an activity, like you're talking about, is how you really build real bond and real like connection.

You're you're putting your body into a like a pseudo-psychedelic state.

You're getting flooded with opiates.

So, when you're doing something hard, like your skin is an endocrine organ, your muscles are also endocrine organs.

When you're contracting and pumping and exposing them to sun or cold temperatures or hot temperatures, the pores are opening, expanding, contracting.

Like, that's not like your skin is continuous with the same embryological layer as your brain it's called the ectoderm they merge it's the same dermal layer so when you're having contact and and that's why like my suggestion with meeting people is like oh like

Let me flip you upside down for 10 minutes and decompress your spine and do this like weird, ridiculous thing called acro yoga.

That's what now I get it.

Now I know why you said that to me.

All those years ago.

Like, hey, let's meet up and do some acro yoga as opposed to, hey, let's meet up and have a coffee.

Yeah, I find, I find, I find myself, and that's probably my own like neurosis.

That neuroses, where I kind of like, I don't really

love,

and this is my work.

Like, for me, sitting in stillness is that's like really like the path towards greatest growth for me, I think.

I've really, I've like established the wiggly aspect of life and the doing hard things, like the doing hard things things I find easy.

Sitting, like, I have a darkness, a seven-day darkness retreat that I'm scheduled to do in November 15th or something

and so that would be something where it's an example of like oh okay

that's doing hard things for me that's like that's doing hard things that's hard art wait what is that I've never heard of this tell me what this darkness retreat is are you sitting in like darkness for seven days literally like pitch black darkness yeah yeah it's a thing uh I wrote about it in my book there there's it's I didn't see that in the book and maybe I missed that page I think it's in it might have been in the vision chapter or it's probably in the visual chapter.

I would imagine the visual chapter.

So there's a whole chapter about how your you know your eyes affect your physiology and such.

Can we talk about that?

Let's let's stay on that.

That's very interesting.

The eyes affecting your physiology and the darkness.

So tell me about this darkness retreat first.

Well, yeah, so it's

originally, I think people started doing this in Germany.

It has a German name that I'm the name, the German name has escaping me right now.

It's a cool name though.

I remember I liked to say it back in the day that I remembered what the term was.

And it might come to me at some point in this conversation.

And yeah, you go, and you are essentially locked up.

Well, not locked.

You could leave if you want to, in

a room.

There's a bathroom, like a little tub at the place that I'm going to.

They bring you food, I think, twice a day or something.

And they pass it underneath a little thing, and you remove all contact to human beings and light.

It varies the times, like five to ten days typically is common.

I'm doing seven days coming up.

And you pay for this frame.

People pay for it.

They're offering it to me, but yeah, it's a paid thing.

It's called prison.

It's like being in solitary confinement.

Well, I mean, those are the, I mean, that's the thing is, is I think that without the color black, you know, white's not very brilliant.

You know, so without juxtaposition of things that are really uncomfortable, then we're in like

a place that a lot of people are.

I'm in some level of this, like just like a comfortably numb experience, just avoiding discomfort to the point that eventually you suffocate on your own comfort.

And by you, I mean me and like, you know, people that are maybe

addicted to pharmaceutical drugs to

support with anxiety or depression or things of the sort, you know, people that want to hurt themselves, cut themselves, end their lives.

You know, I think that's like a sense, it's like a cry for like, I just want to feel,

you know?

I think that is actually, so you basically are saying you like, you put yourself in these like

treacherous,

hard

places.

So then you come back really appreciating and being grateful for what you then have, right?

So you need the juxtaposition, you need that

more, or you need that

um

like you said the juxtaposition so let me get this straight so do you go by yourself to this dark retreat do you go with a friend are you sitting in a dark room are you in a bed do you have like so entertainment it was gonna be myself but then recently you probably know you might know both the girls the one is uh krista from the almost 30 podcast she's she's gonna go as well

and the other friend called well in another room there's the place that i'm going is in oregon there's they have three different rooms.

I don't remember what it's called right now, but people can look up Darkness Retreat, Oregon, and you'll find it.

You might even see a blurb about me on there in a minute.

Okay.

And then

another gal called Hannah, Hannah Eden, who we just actually did this really other, like hard motorcycle trip through the Pacific Northwest together.

We did a group of us, and it was like

the whole time.

Yes.

Yeah, she just fitnessed up.

Yeah.

And she's got like pink hair or red hair or green hair.

She used to have pink hair.

But so those, so the motorcycle trip, all that,

both of those are examples of

preparing the body

from, again, like an endocrine perspective, from a, you know, you could say from like a

developing, from like a cold riding motorcycle in the rain, developing brown adipose tissue, developing, you know, like your whole body adjusts to the structure and shape of your environment.

And so for me, I think it's sensible to

what's the what's the quote from Roosevelt or whatever he says, like the time to repair the roof is when the sun is shining.

So

I'm a little bit of like a prepper in a way.

So I want to develop

the robusticity of my cells throughout my bones, muscles, endocrine organs, et cetera, while life is easy.

And then a silly example is yesterday, I I rode my bike to the gym and then it got like suddenly got like cold and raining.

And so now I'm like semi-stranded at the gym.

And I'm like, okay, I'm at the gym.

So I get in the sauna and I like get all sweaty.

And then I ride my bike home in like the cold rain in my underpants.

They're like boxer briefs.

They kind of look like shorts.

I had a fanny pack on too.

So it was kind of like covering up my situation.

But that was an example where it's like, I'm like, I'm like, this is so totally fine.

So this is an example of like life actually happening.

Very simple, very like basic, low-level, soft, the softest version of life.

Oh my God, I'm biking home for 15 minutes in cold-ish rain, like, not even that cold.

But still,

there's a lot of you know, human organisms out there that that would be devastating.

Totally true.

That is so true.

But it's so, it's so what I prefer, I prefer more like peaks of

like positive and quotations experience where it's like, wow, like fuck yeah, like this is great.

This feels good.

Yes.

The way, the only way to do that is to make yourself more adaptable to variety of life.

And if you do that through things like cold exposure, heat exposure, or, you know, some hermetic stressor in the form of exercise or maybe public speaking, You know, go join a,

whatever they call that.

What's the club?

The public speaking club?

Toastmaster?

No.

Toastmasters, yeah.

I did Toastmasters for a little bit.

You did?

So

anything, anything that just reorienting.

Okay, so this is

two things from the podcast that are relevant.

One, make sure your hips are above the height of your knees when you're sitting.

Try to get on the ground with more regularity.

Fall risk is the number one leading reason that elderly need assisted living.

Fall risk.

I arrived on the ground in some way and I don't have the capacity to get my body off of the ground anymore.

That is insane.

Like, that's unacceptable.

That is exclusively a product of divorcing yourself from getting up and down off of the ground while you can.

Off the table, if we just start doing this now collectively as a society.

Insane that that's it's that simple.

Wow.

So that's one thing.

Then the other thing would be reorienting one's relationship with discomfort to being something that's actually not just like being okay with it but actually seeking it out and actually inviting it because you know that it's inevitable you will be uncomfortable in your life you a million percent like there's no way around it you're gonna get caught It's gonna happen.

So right now, while you're chilling is the best time to invest and saying, how could I elect to make myself uncomfortable right now?

Maybe I'll go for a little run.

Maybe I'll go, you know, just fill it, whatever thing you want, whatever makes you kind of go like, oh, like, okay, ah, we made it.

Exactly true.

Get in the habit of doing that.

And that is the greatest insurance policy for your happiness and contentment in the future.

And then, well, I mean, another great insurance policy would just be like focusing on relationships and like do good by people.

When you come into interaction with someone, start developing

the

mantra for yourself of like making everyone a little bit better than they were.

Not like forcing them to be better, but like if you have an interaction with someone, what can you do to make sure that they walk away from that interaction, like feeling a little better than they did when they started?

Like, don't allow interactions to end.

I mean, sometimes you just got to, whatever, you got to move on or whatever.

It's like not your business to like try to save everybody.

But the best you can with every interaction, the person serving you coffee, it's Starbucks or wherever, you know, your, your kids, your partner, your business people, like at the end of that conversation, like, did we both walk away like, ah, all right, feel, I feel good.

Yeah, like, and you're, and you're intended, you're, you're, you're, you're, you have a very, you're, you have an intention around that.

So when you have any kind of interaction, you personally, Aaron, that's what's going through your head is like, how, like, you want to leave that, you want to leave that conversation, that interaction,

giving that person

a feeling that, like, it's like a positive feeling.

Like, you think about that.

Yeah, like, give gifts.

So, the gift could be physical gifts.

The gift could be write somebody a letter.

The gift could be sending a text to somebody in the morning.

The gift could be just like you were.

There's so many people that I see just in like in the streets, you know, of Austin, Texas, or wherever the heck I'm at, that there's just just like a sensation of like,

um,

I don't know, oftentimes people are like sad, sometimes people are happy, sometimes a lot of things, but there's oftentimes you can kind of see this person just like not feeling, maybe they feel lonely, maybe they feel disconnected, maybe they feel purposeless, maybe they're literally like thinking about ending their life.

Like, how many people do you walk statistically?

You walk past a lot of people each week that literally are like

ideating, how do I turn the lights off on this thing?

So in that scenario, it's just like, man, like, what an opportunity to, as you're just walking down the street, as you're getting coffee, as you're doing, whatever you're doing, just to like make eye contact with somebody and be like, ah, like, just show them, like, there's people out here that care.

You know, like, like, I care.

I don't know you, but like, I care.

And what that is, it's incredibly selfish because upon you bridging that connection to someone else, it's, it's healing you.

It's opening your heart.

It's opening you at a mental, emotional, cellular level.

You release the contraction and the defense.

It comes into a place.

And then when you release that contraction, so this is kind of like metaphoric, but also very literal.

If you're in a defensive state,

so you think somebody wants your money, or you think somebody wants to take advantage of you or whatever, someone's going to attack you, like what do you do?

your shoulders contract, you might meet a rotation of the shoulders, the traps and sternocleidomastoid and masteth that might contract.

Your blood will flush out to your periphery, out of your organs, your pupils might dilate, your mouth might get dry.

So it's this,

it's this, it's this resistance

contracted, like ready to fight or freeze or run or whatever.

There are many humans, myself included in this, that are chronically in that state more than would be ideal for their health and their longevity.

And

stress, like bar none,

is the most consistent factor in any form of dis-ease.

Like name a thing, stress is in there.

Yeah, totally agree with that too.

So

you're saying then the making eye contact is the key to this, right?

Like

with the going out every day and whatever interaction you have, even with strangers, you want to make it, you want to have like eye contact.

Eye contact would be a fine bridge because it might be like, whoa, like, wow, I'm like actually looking at somebody in their eyes.

Don't be crazy about it because there can be too much.

Like, this is what you get in like the kind of like the new age spiritual world.

Like, it's almost like this spiritual ego of like, I can stare you into your eyes for 35 seconds.

And I'm like, they're like, kind of like barely even there, but they're like deep eye-gazing contact, bro.

I'm like, no, no, no, like, too much.

Like, that's like, you're being intrusive.

you know but just a just it's it's like how you sit in the chair it's it's or how you sit you know how you sit anywhere it's not about the chair it's it's about what's behind the eye contact so actively engaging in a process of like just compassion like i have compassion for your experience and if you have compassion you practice having compassion for someone else's experience you are

simultaneously practicing having compassion for yourself

so many people are so hard on themselves i'm in this category, and it's it's uh it's not being enough.

Like a big part of why I

am, you know, I don't know, muscular is still lingering, lingering aspects of like feeling not enough.

Like, if I lose the muscles, I think about that regularly.

If I, if I wasn't, if I didn't fall into a category of being what modern culture you know happens to consider largely as being like uh

um

I don't know, like, like attractive, you know,

or I didn't have, like, I wasn't fit.

I didn't have that edge in a way.

It would be a lot of work for me.

It would be a lot of like deep emotional, like heart work.

And so I kind of have that as a buffer to kind of lean on a little bit, but I realize that it's also can be

almost like a barrier to like more, more authentic growth.

And so I think within that, it's like the practice of compassion for other people.

It really inevitably spills into yourself.

And the more you do that, the more

or more one does that, the more one begins to bridge that relationship and get out of the isolation of I'm alone in this.

When I'm alone in this, then I hoard.

And then I protect, I build my walls up, and then I build the walls up so big that no one can get in.

You know, and this comes into relationships.

You know, it's like, and this is the.

Are you married?

What is your situation?

I have a girlfriend, but these are all things that are part of my process with it.

Like, so, because

you just gave me a great, good segue into asking you how you,

what was that turning point when you went from being the, because I don't think you answered me, the gym guy, the meathead guy, to this new, not new age person, but who you are now.

Like, like, if you were doing it because of insecurity and for whatever other reason it was in your past what kind of made is what just what made you have that growth uh to to kind of follow this path

probably challenge i think i think probably like like my

something i write about my book so it's not like a secret i think i've talked about it a bunch my dad was like really um

super like end of the line addicted to to drugs growing up for me um and and he ended up going to jail and it was like a whole thing.

It was around when I was a teenager time frame.

And now he's doing amazing.

He's like one of the sweetest humans you ever possibly could meet.

And he helps people with like rehab and all sorts of stuff.

Like he's on, it's unbelievable that he's totally clean now.

Very clean.

Yeah.

Like he's like one in a million, like very rare to be at the edge of

where he was.

You know, he was as close to

being

not in his body anymore as you could be, I think.

And he managed to, like, jail actually was really like one of the best, the best thing that could have happened to him.

How long was he in jail for?

A couple years.

It wasn't too bad.

But it was great for him because I think with him, it like stripped him of all of his defense mechanisms.

You know, so he was a stockbroker.

He was, you know, he was doing fine financially.

He was like the president of the Nature Conservancy.

He was respected.

My mom's Miss America pageant.

She's like third runner-up, Miss Pennsylvania, super hot, beautiful, singer, songwriter.

Like very like

all the, all the boxes check.

Within that, when the person's, all the person's boxes are checked, it's almost a disadvantage into like deeper growth in a way.

Because you can lean on your material world.

You're like, no, no, no.

Like everyone confirms, like, I'm the shit.

Fuck off.

Like, I'm like,

no, get out of here.

Like, I'm the best.

You're fired.

You're done.

So true.

It's easy to kind of stay up on that white castle, right?

Because you have all these, you're, you're gorgeous and you're rich and you're this.

It doesn't make you force you to look inward.

So he was like a, like a finance dude.

And then, because he was, he was addicted to, was it like crack cocaine or something like severe crack, right?

Crack was his thing, yeah.

How did that even happen?

Probably cocaine originally.

his his story is

that he's told me is that there was like he has like a savior complex he's always been big into jesus and and and like dying on the cross saving you know other people from their sins i grew up very like deeply steeped in that world and so i kind of for me i i grew up uh in a in a way that i i remember I don't know how you how you grew up, but I remember in the way that I grew up very

steeped in in Christianity.

I'm not mad at Christianity.

I think Christ, consciousness, Jesus, all that stuff.

I'm Jewish.

That's how I grew out Jewish.

And so something that was interesting that I would be curious if this relates to you or anyone listening.

I kind of grew up

in a way respecting people that were in pain.

And like if they were in pain, but they were like still doing good for other people, but they had this deep pain.

To me, that like epitomized like a saint.

Like that was a good life,

which I think is so interesting that that was like growing up.

I was like, yeah, of course.

And my mom and, you know, my more of my mom would iterate these kind of stories of like, my uncle or my this or that.

And she would tell these stories of like how he was really sick or how he was really had all this like chronic whatever, terrible stuff

that he was dealing with.

But he was always good to the children at the school or something like that.

He always did this thing.

I didn't really get the story of someone that just felt like liberated and was healthy and confident and strong and playful and dynamic.

And like, yeah, like they lived a good life.

It was, it was kind of this interesting, like Jesus type thing.

Like they were hanging from the cross.

I just thought that was very interesting.

And the reason I say that is my dad had a bit of that like savior type complex to him.

And the way we call that like a God comp?

No, that's not.

Is that kind of like a God complex?

I think God complex would be more of a narrative.

More like creating and destroying.

His is more like if you're if you're in a bad way, like I, it, it fulfills my ego and my identity to save you.

Because probably if I save you, it denotes that I don't need saving because I'm the savior.

Right.

But anyway, so there's like some gal that was like smoking crack or something like that.

And she was like telling him about it.

And the story goes that he like

finally was like, watch, I'll like show you I can smoke crack and

be okay with it and like kind of like enter enter the chaos with you and like I'll pull you out from it.

And then the story goes that that was kind of, he was like, whoa, this is really good.

And then kind of kept going down that direction.

I don't know if that's a level of accuracy to that, but that was kind of what I've heard.

But again, now he's doing like tremendous, and I'm so grateful for all of that.

Original question,

yeah, he does like insurance stuff, but he's still in like financial, financial world.

And you have a relationship with him, yeah.

I talked to him like two days ago.

And your mom, Nat, what is she up to now?

Like, is she

she's doing she she was she's like now back in like singing, like making her art is her thing that she's really like the most excited about.

But they split up uh when when he went to jail,

Yes, and your mom raised you I would imagine then or no he this happened I was like a semi-adult at this time so that's it this is

he had that experience when I was like 17 or oh wow you're bridging on like 18 or something like that.

And so I was like I moved to Hawaii

Shortly after that.

So I was it was kind of I had a bit of like a transition into like

leaving that that scenario.

Thankfully.

Thankfully.

I mean so that'd be a lot tougher.

So what, so then I was going to say, were you always kind of

because the way you described yourself was like this more like this gym, you know, guy, meeting.

Yeah, Jim, right.

But you, you seem very like deep now and very

evolved and kind of like not like woo-woo, but a little woo-woo.

Like, was that ever part of your

vibe back then or not really?

I was always interested.

Like I started experimenting with like psychedelics and stuff when I was when I was like pretty young, like 14, 15 years old or so.

I don't like condone or not condone, you know, whatever, you know, to each of them, but but I um in that time and I was using a lot of like like cannabis and very interested in just like altering my mind as a young person, probably some form of like escapism, I'd imagine, like in in in retrospect.

And so that was and also rite of passage.

I was seeking rite of passage and probably like escape from whatever kind of like

mundane slash disjointed reality that I was experiencing.

Right.

And

so that, I think inevitably, through experiences like that,

it starts to

catalyze the beginning of perceiving the world as like, okay, what else?

Essentially, like, yes, this is, this is the the world in front of me, but like, you know, like, what else?

There's other layers to this.

If you don't think there's other layers to what's going on here, like, you're just not paying close enough attention.

Like, there's other, there's other things going on here, you know, and so whether that's, I mean, you can look at it very scientifically.

You can look at it as like the percentage of the acoustic spectrum that we're able to hear is like minuscule compared to the actual spectrum that exists.

Same thing with visual spectrum.

Probably same thing with like, well, well, not probably, definitely with like olfactory.

Like, our senses are

very dumb in a lot of ways, like our basic, you know, the ones that we are accustomed to.

And so, there's so much more information out there just from a very like strictly scientific five senses type perspective.

So, you know,

like,

what is that information?

Right, you got curious.

You got curious.

I got curious, yeah.

Yeah, that makes sense.

And that's kind of led you down this path.

And also, before we continue,

the dark thing you're telling me about,

what are you doing in the room for the 24 hours?

Are they putting you in a dark room?

They're giving you two meals through the door.

What else are you doing?

Can you see your feet?

Can you exercise?

Like, what are you supposed to be doing in there for 24 hours?

Sorry, for seven days.

I'm sorry, for seven days.

I guess it'll probably start off

with a lot of sleep.

It'll probably transform into like chronic masturbation and it'll probably get bored of that and it'll probably enter into like deep introspective work.

So that's basically the point.

Just to like literally give you like some solitude.

It's actually it could be a vacation for a parent also.

I mean, maybe I should go.

I don't know.

But that's basically what.

And how much do they charge people for this?

I have to know.

I can look it up.

I don't know.

I don't know.

Look it up.

Yeah.

I think people, it's an interesting thing.

I don't think it's, it's, it's, I've heard a lot of people,

like Aubrey Marcus, he's, I, I,

um,

inspired him to do his first, I think maybe first and only, darkness retreat.

And then he went on to do like a documentary about it and all of that stuff.

And I inspired him to do that in a podcast that we had recorded like years ago.

And I was telling him about darkness retreats because I was writing about it in my book.

And then he went and did it,

and he claims that to be, and I say Aubrey because he's like kind of like a psychonaut type figure in the world where he's he's tried all the plant medicines and all the different things yeah and he suggested that the darkness was like bar none the most potent experience that he's ever had as far as

you know I don't know spiritual stuff you know psycho psychonaut stuff like and you've never done it yet you've never done it yet no no I've been interested in it for a while and you're not with so does everybody have to be by themselves in isolation you can't go with another person there right you probably could you probably could maybe go with another person i'm sure that's not how it's set up typically it's typically you you you alone on your own but

could be very interesting finding a relationship for for for for two people but i would i would still if i was going there with a partner i would probably still i would rent out the place that i'm going in oregon

and i'm a little bit bummed I don't know the name of the place, but if people are interested, literally just look up like Oregon Darkness Retreat.

You could probably literally even use i don't know if i have a discount code per se but i bet you if you like mention me or like say a line or something they'll probably give you some discount or something so if it's something that's of interest there's a very prominent one in oregon and um

you know i know a lot of people that have gone through the experience and it's pretty unanimous it's like that was the most potent thing i've ever done Wow, it's it's fascinating.

Okay, we haven't even finished what your date, your daily routine is.

What other things, okay, so I don't even know where we okay.

So

what time are you up?

Does it matter?

I know you love, you think that sun exposure is one of the most important things to do daily, right?

For your, to maximize your

yeah, I mean, I would, I, I, I think that I know that.

I would, I would say that I know that.

I don't know that I know anything.

I think I know anything, but I think that I know that.

I think that's a known one, though.

Like having some type of sun exposure.

You know, the question is how much sun exposure, right?

Like it's about, it's like a, it's a very, it's very.

It depends on ethnicity.

It depends on where you're at in in the world.

That's why that's why that's why this stuff around the like sun is very confusing.

It's the same thing with nutrition, same thing with like anything.

We are all very biochemically individual, we come from different parts of the world, our skin pigment's very different, and also our skin pigment is very adaptive.

You know, so if you're a person that has

not exposed themselves to a lot of sun, then your skin cells aren't going to be prepared for sun.

So, a little bit will go a long way.

If you're a person like me, who like,

I, I like, I, I really prioritize being in the sun.

I, I don't feel well if I don't get enough sun.

Um I'm the same way, which is why I'm surprised you moved away from California.

Just for that awesome

Austin's sunny as all get out.

I didn't realize that.

Oh man, I went literally just, I just like laid out on my little like porch stoop here for like 20 minutes and I was pouring in sweat.

And it was literally like a sauna.

Like I was like, wow, that was impressive.

Like that was a detox.

That was awesome.

Winter, it's less you know but for most of the year yeah it's like you know it's like 105 degrees and sunny sunny is all gonna does that mean that you don't believe in sunscreen

uh i mean i think that it exists i think that it's real but i don't yeah it does exist definitely yeah

i can prove it to you by showing you a bottle but uh no i think i think it's just it's the same thing it's not the chair's not the problem the sunscreen's not the problem it's it's uh when are you using when are you using it and what are you using so if you're using zinc oxide if you're using you know something that's like organic

materials or products where you're like, oh yeah, like I know what that, I get it.

Coconut oil, zinc oxide.

Like you're like, uh-huh, like I would, I would ingest that.

Right.

Like, don't, don't be fooled.

Like,

chemicals going into your bloodstream is, that's eating.

You're essentially eating.

Just because it didn't go down your gullet, it's still all entering the bloodstream.

Especially your skin's a very thick.

It's a derm, like your skin is like one of the most open.

I mean, everything can go through your skin oh yeah and you know when it's the most open is when you're hot baking in the sun yeah so if you put yourself if you put some like noxious uh hormone disrupting chemicals on your skin it'd be one thing if you just got out of a cold plunge and you rubbed some toxic paste on your arm right but if you go you rub this stuff disrupts your hormonal function has all sorts of issues with like local riverways riverways and like you know, ocean, you know, just like the other creatures that are that are existing.

And then you go and open your pores full blast and bake that shit into you.

Super not a good idea.

Yeah, super not a good idea.

That's a great way to put it.

It's so scientific based.

Super not a great idea.

Okay, so some we know.

Give us some other things that are on your list of like think if we have to if we could do five things to really kind of up our optimal

I don't know if it's like like what would be the word like living

or life or daily health habits what would it be fun what one movement one just because I'm like

I'm like a language Nazi, I can be kind of uncomfortable to be around with it.

I would personally, one, just pay attention to language.

You seem quite good with language, actually.

Not like just that you're eloquent, but it seems like you don't tend to speak in ways that are

disruptive to, I don't know,

feeling well.

But something that's a bit of a bind, I think, in the modern

digital age of

productivity and efficiency and like, you know, essentially like the

the, the, the runoff from the Tim Ferris-type optimal performance world.

Right.

Nothing against Tim.

But the idea of optimal, I think, is a bit in like efficiency and things like that.

I think is a bit of like machine language.

And like, you optimize a computer, you optimize, you know,

like, like devices.

Like,

the idea of

yeah, the idea

you being optimized.

Like, I just think that a lot of that, we can kind of tie ourselves into knots and come into this place of like a lack of just, again, compassion and acceptance and like love

for

where I'm at in like right now.

And this story that I got to get optimized.

I got to get optimized.

It's like, there is no optimized.

Like, there's no, like, you, like, it's, it's, you're, it's just a carrot.

You keep pushing forward.

Wherever you arrive, you're going to be like, oh, I get more optimized.

Yeah, I know what you mean.

You mean, like, in this world we're living with, everything is biohacking ourselves to a place where

you're not a machine.

You're not a computer.

You're like a living, breathing, mental, emotional.

But with you saying that, right, you know, the reality is you're still doing all of these things to, I hate to say the word optimize, to optimize how you feel, right?

You're doing the cold, because all these hard things that you call, you're doing these harder things to feel

the counter, the juxtaposition is to feel really good and optimized on the other side.

So you're doing the plunge, you're doing the sauna, you're doing the sunlight, you're doing the exercise, right?

You're sitting on the floor to optimize how your pelvic floor will work and then not being, you know, what's that word?

I always get that.

So you're

incontinent.

Incontinence.

Yeah.

Or so you're, you know, so you're, you know, your

sick bones or whatever.

These are all things to help

overall be the most healthy in body, in mind you can be, right?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So I don't, I'm not, I'm not especially mad at optimize.

It's more just the general idea of like, I totally agree.

I know what you're saying.

I think there's also value, like the way that you think now

and the operating systems that you're running.

probably aren't going to change based on your material

manifestation.

Like what, what happens in the world, the operating system of the way that you think is probably just going to keep on running until you actually come into a place of like, what's going on in the OS here?

And so that idea of like always needing to be more, always needing to be more efficient, always needing to be more optimized, always need to be more like blah, blah, blah.

So the way it's kind of...

You're taking the word optimize and like using it.

It's kind of like for you, it sounds like to be the most efficient, highest purring you know vehicle or yeah sure but okay so let's just say in your how you feel like in an environment like what would you say what would be your ideal environment you continue to do like give me a still I want to know the day in the life what time do you wake up do you eat plant-based are you eating animal protein are you

so the so that the day in the life of what I think would be most ideal

what do you do

a human and and this is what I tend to try to follow the best I can

would be getting up with the sun,

getting your eyes exposed to the sun as soon as you possibly can,

acknowledging that the sun is it's it's actually a material object, photons like penetrating your eyes.

And within that, that's one of the best things you can do to generally just tune your neurochemistry for the day.

Set your circadian rhythm, make it so that you're actually sleepy, you know, 16 odd hours later after that.

Just helps you make you feel good.

And then from there, get like some movement, wiggle your body around, go for a walk, you know, something of a sort, drink a bunch of water, probably spit some of the first like swig of water out because you got a bunch of stuff in your mouth you don't really want to swallow right away.

You brush your teeth before you drink a bunch of water.

You do like coconut pulling if you want.

Coconuts, antimicrobial, antibacterial, so that could be a nice thing as well.

Plus, just having the the fats in the, in your, the, the biome in your mouth

is good for the bacteria in there, the healthy bacteria in your mouth do you do that every day

no but when I do it it's always seems like a good idea yeah I do it maybe like once every like two weeks or something like I'm gonna start doing this I have it sitting right in my cabinet I just I just just don't yeah I just do like water sunlight walk coffee typically but I but every time I I decide to put coconut oil in my mouth and then go for a walk outside and kind of like swish around while I'm going for a walk, I'm always like, this is awesome.

Like my mouth feels really fucking good.

Really?

Because I did did that.

And then you spit out the coconut, the coconut oil in your business.

Spit it out in a bush.

No, no, you almost walk.

That's a good idea.

I'm going to try that tomorrow.

So you just basically walk around with the coconut oil in your mouth and swig it around.

Yeah, you're supposed to do it for like, I don't know, whatever they say.

Do it for some amount of time, three minutes, five minutes.

And what does it do?

It pulls out all the different.

So coconut oil,

I don't know exactly what it does, to be honest.

I know

I've had podcast episodes.

I had Dr.

Stephen Lynn on my podcast recently.

He's like a biological dentist, I think is the term for him.

And one of the things that he was suggesting is healthy fats such as coconut oil are really good for feeding the good, in quotations, bacteria in your oral biome, so your mouth.

And so that's a good thing.

It's kind of like maybe like prebiotic fiber in a way.

It's like eating,

oh, what's the stuff?

What's the fibrous...

Shoot, what's the thing?

My friend has a whole company around it.

Hickema.

Hicama.

I love jicama.

It's my my favorite thing ever.

Yeah, hiccama is good stuff.

But anyway, so it's like good for the good bacteria and it's and it's it's bad for the bad in quotations bacteria.

So it's like cleansing and also is feeding healthy bacteria.

So that would be something that I think is interesting.

Again, that wasn't a very scientific description of it.

It's just something I think is nice.

I like it.

I don't like it.

I mean, that was actually the most, I understood that the most than anything else you said this whole other podcast.

It was the most ancient

succinct.

I'll stay there.

Thank you.

Thank you.

I'll stay there.

And then,

you know,

I think that, so I tend to, if you're asking specifically about me, I tend to batch things that I would put into like a category of like obligatory like work type scenarios, such as recording podcasts.

Not like obligatory, but it's like, it's like, oh, it's a scheduled thing.

I try to

keep before like 11.30 open for me and then keep like after 4 open for me.

So that block of like four to five hours is the time that I permit

shit to be scheduled.

And then before then, it's just, it's like time to do what feels good.

Typically for me, it's like I'll go train.

I'll like do some writing or something, just whatever.

And then the evening, try to keep that open as well.

So again, I'll typically like train or something, some version of that,

and do dinner with somebody I care about,

you know, read, hang out.

You know, but the big thing as far as

like, I think that optimizing cellular health, I think is just go the freak outside as often as you can.

Turn your phone off as regularly as you're willing to.

Put your phone in airplane mode

as regularly as you're willing to.

Allow your eyes to go through a full range of motion.

Acknowledge that your eyes, your ocular tissue, your eyeballs, and all the correlating muscles around them are neurological tissue.

So it's continuous with your central nervous system.

Your central nervous system, your spine, your spinal cord, your brain, your eyes.

When you're adjusting the perception of nearsightedness or taking the panoramic view or looking up or scanning the horizon left, right, looking down, all of that, think of it as like you're pulling like a joystick of your autonomic nervous system.

So when you're going into panoramic view, it's sending a cue into your physiology that it's like, okay, Jen's, she's chilling out.

Okay, we're just chilling.

When you're focusing your vision in on a cell phone, for example, or computer, or a predator, you know, or a prey, you go into like high-functioning, you know, executive function, sympathetic, get shit done mode.

When you're done getting shit done, and you either didn't get eaten by the predator, or you ate the prey, you go, ah,

you let out a long exhale.

Once you establish it, you feel safe, then you can, oh, you take in the whole world.

You're not like a shark

isolating myopic vision from place to place.

You're, oh, you're just taking it all out.

You're just chilling out, man.

So same thing, acknowledging.

So

make sure you're getting enough sunlight to your eyeballs.

Sunglasses are best suited for nighttime.

Again, another backwards thing in modern culture.

Like the idea of wearing sunglasses, if you're like avoiding a glare or something, or you're driving over a mountain pass or something, like you can't see, like, of course, like put your thing down, get sunglasses, do whatever you need to do to see.

But the idea of blocking light while the sun is out and then and then bringing the light in from alternating current flickering blue lights inside your house once the sun goes down

is another bummer.

Like that's really problematic.

So you're saying to wear glasses at night, basically.

I'm saying tone the lights down.

So

get salt lamps,

you know, just get like more reds and oranges and things that make you feel kind of sexy so like if you were to have a a like intimate partner if you were to have like an intimate partner over to your house okay you know and you're making like a nice dinner like if you really wanted to do it right you'd probably light candles you know you'd probably like play some soothing music you wouldn't just have like a like like a big nasty fluorescent light

like she would feel like she's under attack or he would feel like they're under attack and it's and that alternating current of the light as well.

It's not a direct current like you're getting from the sun.

It's literally flickering.

It's flickering real fast to the point that it looks like a stable light.

It's not.

It's very agitating.

And so I would avoid that

if you're trying to sleep.

I would avoid agitation.

So emphasizing long exhalations.

Relax the eyes.

Use long wave light, which is the reds and the oranges and things of the sort that you get from like a fire.

Those are all very viable.

I love this.

Okay, so we're like, I'm going to have to wrap this up because it's long, but I want you to come back, if you don't mind, and we can

do another one.

Like, you're a very fascinating human, I find.

And

I want to do the acro now that I know you.

Yeah, I can do it.

I'm done.

Let's do it when you're in L.A., Nick.

Oh, you're going to be here in a couple of weeks, you said, right?

I will be there in three weeks or so.

All right.

You're an interesting little cat there,

Alexander.

I mean, really, you really are.

Has anyone ever told you that before?

I can't be the first.

I think I strike different people differently, but yeah.

I mean, but you have a nice way about you, though.

You know what I mean?

You're very pleasant, you know.

That's good.

Yeah, you are.

You're very pleasant, actually.

No, it's true.

And we knew a lot of mutual people.

And so I'm glad that I finally got to meet you this way.

But

I know the book has been out a while.

We've been trying, like I said, trying to do this, but it's called the Align Method.

And it's actually really,

I enjoyed it a lot.

I didn't even get to a lot of the other questions about flexibility and about sleep and about walking.

So we do have to do this again.

More to come.

Absolutely.

How do people find you?

Just on IG or are you on anything else?

No, whatever.

I mean, mean, most people probably just end up going to Instagram.

So everything's under Align Podcast, including the podcast called Motherfucker.

And then we have a free community if people want to have like kind of like a more intrinsic experience with the Align Method stuff.

And that's found at alignpodcast.com slash community.

So there's about a couple thousand people.

And there, I'm in there every day answering questions.

We do like lives and stuff, and we share a lot of instructional content.

This conversation was very much geared towards,

I don't know, metaphysical, you know, what the hell are we doing here type conversation, but that's very like didactic.

Here's how you make your joints work better.

Yeah.

And so, yeah, just type a line podcast into the internet, and that, you know, you know, all the things will come up or align method.

That's that's the book.

It's funny because I thought this would be much more about like, is it how do your joints work better?

And this took a whole different really direction, which is interesting to me.

So that's fun.

I appreciate that.

That's my preference.

Absolutely.

It's great.

And,

well, thank you for being on the podcast.

Yeah, of course.

Thank you.

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