Property Cousins

Welcome to the Judge John Hodgman Podcast.

I'm Bailiff Jesse Thorne.

This week, Property Cousins, Matthew brings the case against his cousin, Casey.

Matthew says Casey is too caught up in buying rundown buildings without a proper plan.

He thinks Casey should step back from the attempted acquisitions and strategize better.

But Casey says he does have a plan, and he says these buildings are vital.

Who's right, who's wrong, only one can decide.

Please rise as Judge John Hodgman enters the courtroom and presents an obscure cultural reference.

They don't look like Presbyterians to me.

Bailiff Jesse Thorne, please swear the litigants in.

Matthew and Casey, please rise and raise your right hands.

Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you, God, or whatever?

I do.

I do.

Do you swear to abide by Judge John Hodgman's ruling, despite the fact that he's due for major renovations?

I do.

I do.

Judge Hodgman, you may proceed.

I am due for major renovations.

I got cat scratch fever.

Oh, no.

Guy scratched by a cat.

Scratch that.

You know what the name of the cat was?

This is all off mic, by the way.

You know what the name of the cat was, you guys?

Kyle.

Ugh.

Oh, it would be a Kyle.

Weird.

Ugh.

Blame Kyle.

Kyle is a Derek.

You know what?

Leave it in.

Before we started officially recording, I was explaining that my friend's cat, Kyle, scratched my hand during a friendly game of cards.

I wasn't playing cards with the cat, I was playing cards with humans, trying to pet a cat and show it affection, and fairly reasonably within cat logic, just wailed on me, on my hand.

And now I think I got cat scratch fever.

But we'll leave that aside.

Matthew and Casey, I almost called you both Kyle.

Kyle and Kyle, you may be seated for an immediate summary judgment.

One of your favors, can either of you name the piece of culture that I reference as enter the courtroom.

I'll repeat it for you because it was so swift.

They don't look like Presbyterians to me.

Matthew, what's your guess?

My guess is

Children of the Corn.

Children of the Corn.

Now, Matthew, of the two of you, you're the one who has admitted to listening to Judge John Hodgman in the past.

That's true.

So take a moment to explain to Casey what's happening here.

At the beginning of every show, there is a obscure cultural reference.

And if you guess what it's from, you will win immediately.

Is that correct, Judge?

That's the basics.

As well, you might tell Casey that the obscure cultural reference usually has some connection to the case at hand.

That's also true.

Okay.

Makes my guess.

So my question to you, Matthew, is what are you doing?

What does Children of the Corn have to do with anything?

Honestly, it just popped into my head, Judge.

I love it.

Is there a church in Children of the Corn?

Maybe there's a church in Children of the Corn.

All right.

I wasn't going to write it down, but now I am.

C-O-T-C, Children of the Corn.

Also, my favorite Children Children of the Corn subreddit.

All right, Casey, you get the idea of what this game is all about, right?

I am.

And Rugs is honestly more suited to this than I, but I think.

Rugs, of course, is the nickname for Matthew.

Is that Rugs with one G or two?

Two Gs.

Two Gs.

Rugs.

All right.

I'm going to call you Rugs from now on.

Jesse Thorne, make a note.

So noted.

Matthew is Rugs with two Gs.

All right, you heard Ruggs' guess.

You got a guess?

Here's the quote again.

They don't look like Presbyterians to me.

Here's a hint.

We am, is, are, and be, them who as are known as the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

Does that bring it home for you?

Ghostbusters one.

Ghostbusters one, also known as commonly as Ghostbusters.

I'm writing that down.

And why?

Oh, because of church?

Well, there's the marshmallow man, stay puff marshmallow man steps on a church.

That's true.

And also, this case is about you, Casey, acquiring old properties that used to be churches or banks, just like those Ghostbusters acquired an old

fire station

in Tribeca, New York, which is there now with a Ghostbusters sign right out in front of it.

You can go see it.

You ever see that?

Casey, you ever come to New York City to see the Ghostbusters HQ?

I've never been, but I would love to.

Yeah.

Check it out sometime.

I have a friend who had an apartment across the street from it.

It was the most exciting thing in the history of the world.

Just look out her window and see the Ghostbusters house.

That would be cool.

Oh, my goodness.

And see all the people coming by to check it out.

I'm sure.

Yeah, well, that's a good guess.

I'm putting that down.

I wrote it down.

I actually did write it down this time, but I'm going to tell you.

And Matthew, did you want to revise your guess?

Because I did give you an extra hint.

And you know that you're wrong.

I am wrong.

Judge Hodgman, a lot of people go past that Ghostbuster's house, but only a few people travel down that dusty road that connects with the church where the electric mayhem live.

Are you guessing the obscure cultural reference and getting it right right now?

Oh,

let the record show.

If you watch on video, Jesse just calmly took a sip of victory out of his mug.

Wow.

That is absolutely right, Jesse Thorne.

And you explained it better than I ever could.

The line is: they don't look like Presbyterians to me, as delivered by Fozzie the bear, as he and Kermit stumble across an old church in the countryside running from Doc Hopper, the villain of the piece.

And it is rocking and rolling with the unmistakable

middle.

How would you describe the rock and roll of Dr.

Teeth and the Electric Mayhem, Jesse Thorne?

Rollicking.

Rollicking.

The rollicking semi-psychedelia of Dr.

Teeth, Floyd, Zoot, Janice, and Animal playing a song in their decommissioned church that they have bought and are turning into a coffee house.

This really was an incredible movie of the 70s.

Also, one of the most meta, the first introduction young John Hodgman ever had to the concept of meta, because that's the scene where they read the screenplay to the movie to bring everybody up to speed as to what's happened so far.

You ever seen the Muppet movie, Casey or Ruggs?

Yeah,

I think we saw it together.

Well, you missed out.

Jesse wins.

Immediate summary judgment in Jesse Thorne's favor, of course, but now we have to hear the case between Rugs and Casey.

I got to get that in my head.

Rugs, Rugs, Rugs.

That's your name now.

Rugs, forever, forever after.

Rugs brings the case against Casey.

We mentioned this case back a few episodes ago on our cricket-themed themed episode.

It was our Swift Justice, and Ruggs wrote in that he wanted me to ban his friend Casey from buying more banks and churches.

And it was just such a incredibly provocative request that

my order was that

I would enjoin Casey from buying more banks and churches until such time as he could explain himself here on this podcast.

So welcome.

Welcome.

Welcome from central Ohio, I believe you both are.

Is that correct, Ruggs?

Yes, thank you.

Thank you for having us.

So, Matthew, what is your relationship to Casey?

Casey's my cousin.

His mom is my mom's sister.

First cousin, then.

First cousins.

And in what way does this give you any standing whatsoever to have even a comment on Casey's property buying habits?

Well, because,

you know, it would inevitably involve me helping him out with these things.

How so?

Because I would have to go down there.

These properties involve a lot of work.

They're basically crumbling.

And he has big dreams for them.

But, you know, he's starting basically from scratch.

And I just, you know, I tend to get roped into Casey's little projects and missions, as he calls them.

Because of the cousin code?

Cousin code means you have to help somebody rebuild a church or whatever.

Exactly.

I mean, that's the plot of the bear, Jesse.

I believe that's the plot of the prestige television show, The Bear, John.

The bear.

Okay, cousin Casey, do you.

Have you seen this show, The Bear?

The bear.

Everybody's talking about the bear.

The bear.

Casey, do you currently own any buildings?

I'm happy to announce, yes, I've picked up one of my three necessary portfolio properties.

Hang on.

Here we go.

You have identified three necessary portfolio properties.

Good, that is correct.

All right.

So you're not just doing this willy-nilly.

Oh, no.

You're picking, picking, you have three properties in mind that you want as part of your portfolio, and you have purchased one of them.

Yes.

Tell me about the property that you purchased.

I believe I have some photos here.

This is the, this is the, the property in Dayton, Ohio, I believe.

Yeah.

All right.

Tell me about it.

The warehouse is awesome.

It's an old steelworkers building built by the men and women that made the backbone that made our country strong.

And when I feel when they built this building, they they built it to stand for generations.

And I'm happy to be one of those generations that will own it for a time.

I understand warehouses are awesome, but why do you need a warehouse or a want?

I don't care about need.

He's trying to throw a party.

He's David Byrne, and it's 1983.

We do have the 1970s madmen style conference room that will be great for themed parties.

I'm going to say, I just want to say that there are photos of this, of the exterior and the interior of this warehouse available for your perusal on the Judge Sean Hodgman Instagram page, as well as the showpage at maximumfun.org.

And I see the conference room that you are referring to.

It has red wall-to-wall carpet.

It's got an incredible drop popcorn ceiling with fluorescent lighting, but also some incandescent lighting and a drop mid-century modern fixture that I've never seen before.

It's got terrific old office chairs.

I mean, if you wanted to do, if you wanted to cosplay Mad Men, I'm thinking because of the

sheer emptiness and desperation in this picture, I would say a little bit more severance from Apple TV.

But yeah, this is a pretty incredible room.

Okay, go on.

So just a little history behind this.

I've spent, I've lived the last 10 years in a bus with my patient, kind, generous, understanding, significant other.

And this is not a metaphor for anything.

This is, you're actually talking about a bus.

Yes, yes, an actual bus.

An actual bus.

Are you a schoolie?

Is it a school bus that you've put it out to live in?

No, it's, it's, it's more like a, it's not like a prevost or or anything, but it's, it's more similar to like a tour bus.

I wish it was a prevost, but it's not.

It's a tour master.

I don't even know what that word is.

Prevost?

What?

They're the super nice like million-dollar buses.

This is not that.

How do you spell that?

That's the kind of bus that your friend loans you the money to buy and then doesn't ask you to repay the loan because you're on the Supreme Court.

Okay.

Got it.

And if you know, if you are touring, especially to central Ohio, if you have to come back here for your sixth time and you are not on a prevost, I will volunteer my bus to shepherd you around, not to sway your favor in this ruling, but just as a kind generosity.

Oh, pre-vost.

Look, I don't want to buzz market this high-end motorhome company, but I do have to say that the first,

the link that comes up is titled Prevost, The Ultimate Experience.

Okay, we're talking about a very, very fancy, full-size Torbus slash RV living experience.

Got it.

You're saying you've already had the ultimate experience and now you're just chasing the dragon.

Why do I not have photos of this?

Can I order you guys to send in some photos of Casey's bus?

There are a couple of photographs, one of which is deeply intriguing to me.

Oh, forgive me.

You're absolutely right.

I see two photos down below.

We'll get to them in a moment.

I mean, the whole topic of you living in a bus is a thing, but let's just stipulate for the moment.

You live in a bus and you would like to collect three specific properties, one of which is the warehouse, which you have gotten.

You acquired it because it has a cool conference room and it has a history to it.

And I think that's where I started interrupting you.

You were going to tell me about the history of this building, this warehouse.

The motivation behind a warehouse in general is living in this bus,

we had an incident when we were gold mining outside of Yosemite where we cracked the bus.

Stop.

Just give me a minute to catch up.

Trying to ask you about this warehouse.

I haven't even gotten to the other two properties.

All of a sudden, we're claim jumping over here.

Yeah, I just processed you live in a bus.

You had an incident.

Let me write down some topics to return to.

Bus.

I'm going to put, I don't know what that thing is on that picture, but we got to talk about that.

Antenna?

Is that an antenna?

It's a mast.

Okay, bus mast.

We'll get to that.

And then also gold mining, did you say, or panning for gold?

Mining.

Of course.

Okay, you had an incident while you can't pan with dynamite, Judge Hodgman.

You had an incident while gold mining with the bus.

What happened to the bus?

To get closer to the claim, we try to go over some bridges that really aren't designed for this type of weight.

And we broke the bus.

Nearly cracked it in half.

How did you not break the bridge?

How did the bridge break the bus?

The bridge actually held quite well, surprisingly.

Okay, but explain to me how going over an old bridge breaks a bus nearly in half.

Oh, because a lot of the bus hangs behind the rear axle.

So, and the bridge was small and narrow enough that we couldn't make that turn coming off of it.

Oh, okay.

All right.

I got you.

And that's the moment when you realize, hey, maybe bus lizing isn't for me.

I've been living in a bus for almost a decade, but now that I'm turning this bridge on my way to a gold mine and I broke it in half, maybe I need to get three properties, including a warehouse, correct?

Yeah, no, at that point, I was not a warehouse fan.

I was still a bus fan, but my bus needed to be fixed.

It had a crack down the center.

And for that reason, it's got a full slide that couldn't come out.

My bed's attached to that slide, so I can't even sleep in my bed with a cracked bus.

I got to write down slide now.

Judge Hodgman, full slide.

Full slide.

Thank you.

When you say a full slide, is this some specialized bus terminology, like a pop-out or something like that?

Are you talking about like a playground slide that comes out of your bus so you can slide down it?

What drew me to this bus, there's a wall that comes out from behind the driver to in front of the bathroom.

So it's a 45-foot bus and about 40 feet of this bus will kind of pop out and make a double wide, I suppose.

Okay.

So it's not like a playground slide or a water slide.

You're talking about a section of the bus that pops out to...

Yes, I understand.

I've witnessed these things in the past.

Got it.

So that's what the slide is in this case.

Correct.

Hey, Rugs, are you still there?

I'm still here.

You may want to go take a break.

If you can just shake your head and look with disdain, that's typically what I'm in my head case.

Okay, I'm going to ask you a question about the bridge on the way to the gold mine real quick.

Yeah.

How do you get to the point where you're turning the bus?

And the bridge is too narrow.

Why don't you just stop and straighten it out?

I was uncomfortable with the bridge from the beginning um but my good friend uh jr who was managing this gold mine at the time said oh this this bridge was around during world war ii so it can hold tanks but i don't think there were many tanks in yosemite national park but i don't know he convinced me it was a good idea

jr the manager of the gold mine lured you he did across a bridge that was going to break your bus i'm going to say right now i still don't understand how your bus almost broke I can't picture it.

I don't get it.

And I maybe never will.

And I don't want to talk about it anymore.

So I'm banning myself from talking about it.

Suffice to say, bus almost broke, slide was damaged.

Warehouse, go on.

So the bus needed to be repaired.

So I brought it to the home of all buses, beautiful, sunny Elkhard, Indiana.

I brought it to the factory where many of these buses are made.

They call that the Tor Bus's graveyard, Jesse.

Got it.

Elkhart, Indiana.

And

I found

they were able to bring my bus into the factory and eyeball it and look at the damage that was done.

And they decided that they could fix it.

It could be remended.

Sure.

So while they remend it, we were still obviously living on the bus.

But the cool part, this is when I started to enjoy living in a warehouse, is they would work from like 6 a.m.

to 3 p.m.

and then they're done.

Lights out.

But when the lights are out, then I can sneak out of my bus, turn all the lights on, and I have like a big list of all these things I've always wanted to do to my bus, but I've never had the facilities for it.

And then I'm in this multi-million dollar warehouse where they build buses.

And I have access to a paint booth and I have access to a metal shop and a fabrication shop.

So from 3 a.m.

Wait a minute.

Is this part of the deal?

When you bring in a cracked bus to the dealer, you're allowed to use their tools.

Like the borrowers or something?

He's like a bus borrower, Jesse.

Sneaks out.

These These folks at this particular place were accommodating to me.

They were really.

They knew that you were sneaking out in the middle of the night and using their stuff.

Yes.

Yeah, they did.

What did you want to add to your bus that you were sneaking out at

from 3 p.m.

to 3 a.m.

in Elkhart, Indiana?

What did you want to add to it?

I needed a manner in which I could establish a cellular tower for when we're in the gold mine.

So in case you have a collapse,

we can call for a rescue.

I don't need any further explanation.

That's great.

Is that what the masp is for?

Yes.

I put it together.

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Yeah, I'm talking about entree bowls, but you know what?

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So you're in Elkhart, Indiana, going through the warehouse in the middle of the night, installing.

a 65-foot mast.

And that's when you discovered the beauty of a warehouse because it has things you want for your bus in it, right?

Is that why you started thinking warehouse and dreaming of warehouse dreams?

Correct.

And we weren't just living in the bus of the warehouse because they had to take the slide out in order to fix it.

And our bed is attached to there.

So fortunately, they were kind enough.

When the slide had come out, we had to move out of the bus.

The manager of the warehouse had recently been let go and his office opened up.

So we ended up kind of living in his office working on the bus.

And I just grew to enjoy warehouse life.

Warehouse living.

Hashtag warehouse life.

Rugs, let me just, I got to take a break from Casey for a second.

You ever feel like you need to take a break from Casey Ruggs?

Yes, often.

You guys have known each other since childhood, I presume.

Has he always been this way?

He has.

He's always been a bit of a mad scientist type guy.

He's always into a project.

Uh-huh.

And I think he, he's not always looking for a project that he can finish.

He wants to be doing the project.

Matthew or Ruggs, I should say, excuse me.

I apologize.

I have a note here.

It says from Jennifer.

When Casey was was asked how he spends his time, his answers were both vague and informative.

Saying he works on projects and doing different quote unquote missions.

What are your missions, Casey?

Well, you're on the missions typically find me, so I can't tell you what my next mission is.

Absolutely.

Good note, Jennifer.

Vague.

Casey, I'm going to ask you again.

Be informative.

Give me an example of one of your missions.

I suppose one of the missions that I gave as an example to Jennifer was like the reverse heist.

Go on.

We're all huge gamers.

And we have one of our particularly loud, boisterous friends was in desperate need of a PlayStation 5 and no way to get one.

So we formulated a way in which to magically...

Get him one, I suppose.

And that was the reverse heist.

That was the question.

You were going to sneak one into his life, into his house.

That's the reverse heist part.

Jennifer also said that when trying to schedule her pre-interview, she had to work around your schedule, Casey, because you were attending ice cream college.

I know that it's correct.

Jennifer would not lie to me.

This is the part where you elaborate.

What is ice cream college?

Well, it is pretty much what it sounds like.

It's a college in which you.

No, it's not.

No, it's not.

It's three words that pose a question, not an answer, please.

It's a college in which you can learn to make and manufacture and distribute ice cream.

Got it.

Okay.

Who runs this college?

State of Ohio?

University of Madison, Wisconsin, with my major professor being Scott Rankin, brilliant dairy scientist, I suppose.

Now,

Casey, I'm not mad at you.

I'm just mad at the world.

Jesse Thorne and I were in Madison, Wisconsin, doing a wonderful show at the Majestic Theater last fall.

No one told me, Jesse, did anyone tell you that the University of Wisconsin is an ice cream college?

John, I didn't get the memo.

Nobody copied me on that memo.

I mean, we played a matinee.

We got out of the show early.

We could have bopped over to audit a class at Ice Cream College.

We had all night for lecture halls.

Ruggs, I'm going to let you pick this up for a second because we haven't heard from you.

And I'm afraid to ask Casey any more questions.

You seem to exist on Earth.

Can you tell me a little bit about this warehouse that Casey has acquired and the other two properties that he's got in his sites?

Sure.

Okay.

So over the last couple years at least, Casey's been going on auction sites and hunting down old abandoned churches and banks because he wants, really, he wants to live in a castle.

That's his idea.

Okay, let the record show Casey is nodding and putting his thumb up.

So like this whole, his bus broke, he's in the the warehouse.

He came to like it.

That's not necessarily his motivation or what we've heard.

He's always talked about having a lair or a headquarters.

And he's been searching these auction sites for these broken down buildings.

Usually they're in distressed areas of cities.

Right.

They used to be, you know, industrial sites.

The industry's gone.

Yeah.

No, I saw a link to the Google Map view of this warehouse that Casey bought, and it's a pretty haunted-looking situation.

Yes.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It's pretty, pretty grim, pretty grim,

post-apocalyptic-looking stretch of Dayton, Ohio here.

Yes, exactly.

And that's how they all look.

He's shown us multiple properties,

churches, banks.

Basically, anything that could be turned into a nightclub for vampires.

If a blood fountain can be installed, it's perfect for Casey.

Anything you might, anything you might find on Zillow Goes Wild dark edition.

I do need to look for things that are a little more distressed, but with good bones.

If it has good bones, the rest is child's play.

You know, a little speckle here, a little mud here, boom, boom, boom.

You got a beautiful place.

Yeah, but Ruggs is saying you need Rugs to put in the spackle and the mud.

Mud, I don't think is advisable as a construction material.

But

are you capable of fixing up these places without Ruggs' help?

Oh, yeah, yeah, I am.

But, you know, just despite all of Ruggs' machinations towards this, in the end, he will end up being there helping out.

And that's why he's trying to stymie this at the beginning, because he, you know, he knows.

How is it going to happen that he's just going to show up?

It just always works out that way.

It just always works out that way.

You don't put any subtle pressure on him.

You don't make any requests.

He's like, it's like a strange attraction.

He can't help but show up and help you.

Rugs, do you have an answer to that?

Yeah, it's not a strange attraction at all.

He's asking everybody to help.

Right.

When Casey finds out somebody's, you know, a carpenter, hey, now I know a carpenter, even if you met him once.

So he'll be calling them, hey, come down here.

I'm getting a warehouse.

Come do work on this.

You know.

And they have the right to say yes or no.

Sure, sure.

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

And do they ever say no?

Yes, they always say no.

So why can't you say no?

Well, Because he's my cousin and I have to deal with it.

I think he should just take a step back.

Now that he's got this warehouse, which he bought spur of the moment, and he told me himself it doesn't serve his needs.

He can't put his bus in there.

It doesn't fit.

A lot of the equipment and the electrical needs just aren't there.

So it's really a fun project for him, and that's fine, but do that project instead of getting yourself mired in all these other money pits.

Well, Ruggs raises a good point here, Casey.

You want to live in a castle.

And I understand that, but you're buying a warehouse and you are eyeing a church and a bank.

Why don't you just wait for the correct property?

A castle?

Well, I think the fundamental problem is our country isn't old enough for good castles.

We have very few good castles.

Yeah.

Right.

They don't build them like they used to, John.

It's just a bunch of, just a bunch of mud and chicken wire these days.

So given that there aren't a lot of castles for sale here in the United States in and America, and you're speaking, I guess, a little bit more metaphorically,

describe

what your castle would look like, your ideal castle.

Obviously, you need to drive your bus into it because that's the way all that's like medieval European castles.

You always had a bus depot and a castle.

That was normal.

The ideal castle obviously would have a moat.

And that moat would have to say on the playground, doi.

Yeah.

Go on.

I'm embarrassed to bring that up because it's so obvious.

And that moat should

rather than detract or hold people off, I'd want the moat to invite people.

So like rather than like alligators and stuff, I'd put like dolphins in it that you could swim with as part of, you know, calisthenics or just for enjoyment.

That would be for, that would be for aerobic health, John.

Stone needs to be built of stone, needs to have amazing parapets and towers.

And that's really it.

I mean, I've got simple needs.

names.

So when I was like, so when you say castle, we're speaking metaphorically here.

You're like, no, no, literally.

It has to have a moat and parapets, and I don't care about anything else.

You don't even care if you can drive your bus in it.

Well, it probably has a central courtyard where you could.

Yeah, it'd be nice to have the bus.

And then, of course,

you know, we need falcons that we can put on the parapets.

Yeah, there is a photo of you handling a falcon.

Is that you handling a falcon?

That is.

That is.

And that

seems to be on the grounds of an actual castle.

There's definitely parapets.

Where is this photo taken?

Yeah, and that's what got this whole dream started.

I spent some time in Scotland learning falconry with my amazing significant other.

Sure.

We lived in a castle while learning Falconry, and we said, this is the life for us.

Like, we should do this full time.

Yeah.

And you're definitely the kind of person who just lets his dreams go unfulfilled.

You're definitely the kind of person who's like, I have a funny idea.

Yeah, I'll never do that.

And then you just go, you live in a bus with a mast.

Why don't you just move to Scotland and live in a castle with falcons?

I mean, that's not a bad idea, though.

I'm getting two thumbs up and fireworks over there from rugs.

Why is that out of your reach when

buying a, I mean, obviously, buying a castle in Scotland is perhaps a little bit more expensive than buying a decrepit warehouse in Dayton, Ohio.

I acknowledge this.

But that's a worthy dream, is it not?

No, that is.

That is.

I think the only problem is it'd be tough to get on my, I could get my bus there on a container ship, but the roads are very narrow and very winding.

It would be tough navigating and traversing the highlands.

Your bus is broke in half, sir.

No, it's patched now.

It's a full bus.

You can't try.

Everyone knows

once your bus is broken in half, it's always broken in half.

Now, this church that you almost bought, you put a bid on, you got outbid.

And we have some photos of the church that are also available every place you find the photos.

We've talked about it before.

You know where to go, instagram.com slash John Hodgman on the showpage of John at maximumfund.org.

and this is a big church was this also in ohio this church as a matter of fact it is yeah and and uh and there's a photo of you standing in front of a stained glass window and standing wearing gloves a boiler suit and a respirator mask at the pulpit of i what i think this used to be it looks like it might have been a catholic church when it was

consecrated Why are you wearing that respirator mask?

Or is that not even you?

That is me.

At the time, I was testing for asbestos.

I was gathering samples in the church for asbestos.

Sure, don't leave that to the professionals.

Do it yourself.

It's a pretty fair-sized church, too.

I mean, I'm judging by how big I guess these windows are, but it's not a tiny, it's not a tiny building.

This isn't the electric mayhem's church.

15,000 square feet, I believe, if you include the basement.

Could you drive your bus in it?

Not in its current condition, but that's probably the first modification I was going to make is some type of bus entrance.

But you can't make it because someone bought it out from under you.

This one, yes.

How did that feel?

It was heartbreaking.

Fortunately,

when I was investigating this bus, I made great friends with the neighbors.

They called the cops on me.

Listen, listen to this guy expertly laying out the bait for me.

I made great friends with the neighbors.

They called the cops on me, pregnant paws, waiting for me to jump on that cheese,

get my mouse neck snapped under the trap of whatever new story you're going to try to tell me.

I'm trying to mess with stories.

I don't care.

I don't care about your friends, the neighbors, why they call the cops on you.

I mean, I really do care.

I really want to ask, but I'm going to try to keep this on track.

I'm not going to break my bus turning on your bridge, sir.

So, after I lost this in the auction, I'd pretty much given up on it.

One of the cop neighbor contacted me and is like, hey, I saw a post in a forum that says, oh my God, what have I done?

I bought a huge church.

I can't believe how easy it was to bid on this thing.

I'm overwhelmed.

It's an elephant.

What should I do?

He sent me a screenshot of this, and

I then started a little investigative journalism to find out who this person was.

I've since located the person, reached out to them, and we're going to meet.

And maybe they are overwhelmed.

Maybe this is too much for them.

Maybe they're like,

what kind of idiot buys a 15,000 square foot church with no plan?

And I can be that idiot.

Maybe they could just transfer it to me.

My wife and I once bought a zoo.

What did you say when you bought the zoo?

Did you say anything to yourself out loud?

Yeah, I thought to myself,

oh, we bought a zoo.

There are a lot of churches for sale, Casey.

You don't need to have the neighbors call the cops on you and then befriend them to get a crazeless listing from a guy who regrets buying a church.

There are a lot of churches for sale.

There are a lot of guys who regret buying churches for sale.

There's an abundance of them.

Why did you buy a warehouse when you could have bought a church?

Or I guess my question really is:

why do you have a portfolio of three properties when you really only need one castle?

The warehouse, yeah, I was obviously saddened by the loss of the church.

And, you know, they say the way to get over one building is to get under another.

So I walked through this warehouse.

I was like, this is cool.

And the guy's like, you want it?

And I was like, yeah, sure.

And he's like, well, how about this?

And I was like, oh, let's do that.

And we shook hands.

And,

you know, I knew there might be an injunction coming in the near future against me buying any more buildings.

So now that you've bought this warehouse, are you done?

No, no, no, no.

I mean, I still need the church and the bank.

Why do you need all three?

That was the question that I started with.

Well, because they're very specific properties for very specific purposes.

And yes, one is for storage.

One is for worship.

Sorry, Jesse, we both got there at the same time.

I apologize.

We broke our bus on the bridge.

Why do you need a bank of church and a warehouse?

The warehouse and is it like SimCity that if you get all three, then you unlock the ability to build a space center or something?

I think another overreaching life goal is to have my life here more closely mimic my life in one of my favorite video games, GTA 6.

And I do have those things in the game.

So if I could get them in the real world, that would also be cool.

But

that's not the overarching reason behind it.

I had no idea that Grand Theft Auto VI was busy town themed.

I'm going to stop you there, Casey.

Is it fair to say, because what I'm asking you is, why do you need all three properties?

Oh, sure.

And you keep answering me by saying, well,

I need all three properties.

And you don't really explain why.

Vague and not very informative.

Is it fair to say that you want all three properties simply because you just want a bank, a church, and a warehouse?

Is that enough?

Is there any reason beyond just just wanting those three things?

No, Your Honor.

I want five properties.

I need.

Here we go.

Here we go, Rugs.

Yeah, yeah.

Does this come as news to you, or is it just news to us?

No, it's not news to me.

If you had to name his five properties, Rugs, what would you name?

We know that three of the answers are bank, church, warehouse.

What are the other two?

The other is an actual castle.

Uh-huh.

And then an otter facility.

He does.

No, no, it's not an otter facility.

You're just, you're just riffing.

No, I swear.

He's wearing an otter shirt right now.

Goodbye.

Goodbye.

I'm done.

I got to finish this one out.

Judge Hodgman's having a meltdown over there.

The people on YouTube can see this.

The people on the Judge Jen Hodgman YouTube channel can see this.

But the people who are listening don't know that Casey just opened his outer shirt, Superman style, to reveal that he's wearing an otter t-shirt.

Casey, do you have purposes in mind for these buildings?

Well, the YMCA I was looking at had an Olympic-sized swimming pool.

We're going to turn that into an actual otter sanctuary in Iowa because they need them in Iowa.

Why do they need otters in Iowa?

They are otter deficient.

What is a bank for?

Oh, well, we've talked about the reverse heist.

We're all big gamers, my whole crew, friends and family.

And anytime we get an opportunity to get everyone to play games um like we've done escape rooms and stuff we think escape rooms are are fun but like i hear you i get it if you have a bank then you can create a business where people break into the bank yes yes a heist room can you imagine your honor i can imagine it i can see it

i'm writing you a check for $1 million.

Oh, this is going to be huge.

This is going to be huge.

I'm not actually.

This is not a promise to invest in your business, but if this were Shark Tank, I would be 100% in.

All right, Casey, stop talking for a minute.

Rugs?

Yes.

Until Casey purchased this warehouse,

all of this talk was hypothetical, correct?

Yeah, but I know him.

So I think he was actually trying to make it happen.

And it has.

It did happen.

Yes, it has.

Yeah.

Now that you know that he's capable of closing the deal on a decrepit warehouse, what are you afraid is going to happen next?

I think that he just will get so mired under all of this stuff instead of going in, you know, one or two directions, he's going in every direction.

Right.

And I'm concerned about his general happiness.

I mean, I've seen him, you know, in the last few years and he's a generally happy person, but seems pretty happy.

Yeah, he's got this this need.

You know, he's got this, he's searching for something and he's doing it in such a fast pace that

I'm worried about him just in general, his mental health, really, because you end up, he, if he ends up buying these three decrepit buildings, you know, nothing's going to happen with them and he's going to get nowhere.

So I think he should just step back, focus on one of these projects, go in that direction, see what happens, and then, you know, reassess and maybe go in another direction later.

He has to pick something or else he's not going to go anywhere.

Casey, how does that resonate?

When you hear your cousin saying this about you, how do you feel?

Oh, I think that's true.

I do typically bite off more than I can chew.

There's another complaint here, which is that, Casey, you feel that Matthew isn't funny enough.

What is this all about?

Oh, no, I feel he's extraordinarily funny.

Whereas I might be out there doing too many things,

I feel Ruggs doesn't use his talent enough.

He's very naturally funny.

He just has has that comedic talent.

We used to be in a comedy troop together and he would walk on stage and just bring it all down.

Like me, I have to work on these things really hard to get an eke of funniness.

So I would ask that Ruggs use his skills more.

Like I'll dial mine back, but he needs to dial his forward a little bit.

Otherwise, I think there's a

statute I referenced in the Ohio Revised Code for useless or unused or abandoned properties.

I would like to impart those skills to me because I could use them.

Ruggs, you seem to be suggesting that somehow Casey is unhappy, but Casey seems to be a very happy dude.

Is that, and Casey just gave me a happy thumbs up and a smile.

I guess maybe it's more he's

unsatisfied.

Throughout his life, he's accumulated stuff, accumulated friends, ideas.

He likes adventures for adventure's sake.

Right.

He likes things for the story of it, not necessarily for the follow-through.

What a recipe for a miserable life.

You're right, Ruggs.

Jesse, I didn't even think about it this way.

Unlike Ruggs and you and me, who are perfectly satisfied with our lives in every way and have been for years and absolutely want nothing further than what we've got, which is honestly, I got, I'm very happy with what I've got, but this guy still wants stuff.

This guy still has ambitions.

He doesn't need a warehouse.

He needs to be put in a home.

Well, I also think that I, you know, we want answers too because when we ask casey as you said all these answers are vague and it jumps from one thing to the other casey did you buy this warehouse because you knew that you were going to come on this podcast no

no no and in fact yeah the injunction thing he didn't know that he filed this injunction or the request he did not know about it up until um right jennifer

because what i'm trying to balance here is this idea that you maintain that he has all these fantasies and he never he's got them he's all over the place and he's lacks direction and he's got multiple different dreams and he can't chase down even one.

And

yet

he has, he bought the warehouse.

And if you had said to me, if, you know, Casey only bought the warehouse because Judge John Hodgman had provisionally ruled against him.

He wanted to prove that he could do this one thing, then I would be like, well, I can't, I can't motivate Casey throughout his life.

But if he actually did it, then there's some evidence here that he is capable of achieving his dreams, no matter how unusual, atypical, and potentially asbestos-filled they might be.

See what I mean?

Yeah, that's a good point.

So, my next question is, is he hurting anyone?

No, I don't think he's hurting anyone.

Is it worrying to you?

Yeah, it worries me.

Yeah.

Why?

Well, I guess it's just we have different perspectives on life.

And it confuses me of why he would be doing this.

He has all this equipment, but he's not using it.

And then he's buying buildings that aren't going to help him use that stuff.

So it's just confusing, I think.

Your question is why,

and it's a reasonable question, but it's only taken me the span of not yet an entire episode of a podcast to realize you're never going to get an answer, are you?

No, I'm not.

No.

Matthew, I understand that if I were to rule in your favor, You want me to order Casey to hold off on new property acquisition for a year or two?

Yes.

Before expanding.

Is that correct?

Yeah, I think that's fair.

And Casey, you want me to transfer Matthew's comedy?

You want me to transfer Ruggs' comedy skills to you?

Not all of them, Your Honor.

Just his comedic timing and delivery.

He can keep the rest.

And if I, if I were unable to do that due to the factor of impossibility,

what would you have me rule instead?

That he use it, that he use it, you know, give him a one-year opportunity just to use it to benefit others around him because you know comedy is best when it's shared um and then maybe if at the end of the year he hasn't used it maybe i could have it then rugged do you want to do you want a career in comedy or do you want to or even an amateur career in comedy no not particularly i mean it's it's fun to do stuff like that but i mean i use my timing and delivery in life just having fun with people but no i didn't have any overarching ambitions like that you don't feel a need to physically manifest your comedy by buying a YMCA and turning it into an otter sanctuary, for example.

That's right.

Yes, Your Honor.

Let me ask you a question.

If I were to order in Ruggs' favor and order you to take a step back for a year or two, can you see yourself doing that?

It depends on the opportunity.

I don't feel like I could pass an opportunity if it were to find me.

How much gold did you get out of that gold mine, by the way?

You know, less than an ounce, although I still have some dirt that needs to be classified.

You still have some dirt that needs to be classified yeah

i'm going to take a break now and go to dirt classification college i'll be back in a moment with my verdict please rise as judge john hodgman exits the courtroom

casey how are you feeling about your chances right now uh i mean relatively slim being that my counterclaim is more ephemeral than than real although i i still feel that if it if it's ruled you know it there's there's those things that if you believe you can achieve type of thing if i believe i have

it's clear what your perspective on the world is, Casey.

The belief, if you believe you can achieve, is a parent in spades.

Ruggs, how are you feeling about your chances?

I don't think my chances are great because it's a tough ruling.

And I think the judge can see that Casey is not one to listen to authority.

I think it's good because I've gotten a few answers that I was looking for.

Well, we'll see what Judge Hodgman has to say about all this when we come back in just a moment.

Hi, I'm Amber Nash, the voice of Pam Poovy on the groundbreaking FX animated comedy Archer.

Remember Archer?

I sure don't.

That's why I started rephrasing an Archer rewatch podcast on maximumfun.org.

Join me and a bevy of special guests as we discuss every episode of Archer starting from the very beginning.

Archer executive producer Casey Willis and editor Christian Danley will provide insight and fun and help help me remember everything I've forgotten about Archer, which is a lot.

So, join me on rephrasing an Archer Rewatch podcast on maximumfun.org because I can't wait to watch Archer again for the very first time.

The Wizards Answer 8 by 8.

The Conclave's call to demonstrate their arcane gift, their single spell.

They number 64

until

a conflagration 63

and 62 they soon shall be, as one by one the wizards die,

till one remains to reign on high.

Join us for Taz Royale, an Oops All Wizards Battle Royale season of the Adventure Zone every other Thursday on maximumfun.org or wherever you get your podcasts.

It's Judge John Hodgman.

I'm Jesse Thorne.

What have you got going on, John?

Well, Jesse, I'm very excited that we can now announce the comedy stage lineup at the Solid Sound Festival.

This is the every other year festival of art and music that is hosted and curated.

by those wonderful fellows known as the band Wilco

in North Adams, Massachusetts, way out west in the west of the east, not too far from Williamstown, not too far from Albany, only a couple hours' drive from Boston itself.

North Adams is a wonderful town with a great, big, old electrical parts factory in it that isn't an electrical parts factory anymore.

It's a great, big, beautiful installation art museum called Mass Mocha.

And every other year at around the end of June, Wilco comes and takes over the whole thing and builds a bunch of stages and performs a bunch of great Wilco songs.

And they invite a bunch of other artists to come and perform and show their art and and their music and their storytelling.

And they invite me for some reason to curate a comedy stage, which happens indoors, which is wonderful for any kind of music festival because comedy outdoors does not work as well.

But it's always indoors

in a wonderful auditorium there.

And we have a wonderful bit of comedy coming for you right this very June.

Yes, I will be there as host.

That's the most boring part.

The best part is this.

My co-host, of course, will be the wonderful Gene Gray, occasional guest bailiff of this very program,

along with such comedic talents as geniuses named like Dave Hill, Sidney Washington, Brittany Carney, and Todd Berry.

We're all be there performing for you.

Todd Berry.

Todd Berry, famous stand-up, Todd Berry.

One time I

drove Todd Berry around in my 65 Dart

for SF Sketch Fest.

And

the whole time I drove him from the hotel to this one party, he goes, hey, man, this is a death trap, man.

Comedian Todd Berry dies in death trap car at SF Sketchfest.

That will not be the headline at Solid Sound because Todd Berry never dies, he kills.

This is an incredible lineup.

And if you don't know these comedians,

you know me and Gene, of course, from the show.

But Dave Hill, Sidney Washington, Brittany Carney, Todd Berry, look them up, get to know them.

The auditorium roof is very high, but we're going to bring it down.

Go to solidsoundfestival.com to join us for one day, Saturday is when all the comedy happens, or the whole weekend.

It's a really wonderful time, and I'm really looking forward to seeing you there.

And by the way, speaking of New England or Regional in the southeast portion of Canada, I just got to say it again.

Paul F.

Tompkins is performing at the Waldo Theater in Waldo, borough, Maine.

It's such an weird, unusual chance to see PFT really up close.

And one of the rare times in the state of Maine, get the to it.

Go to Paul F.

Tompkins, you know, search him up, find his thing, buy the tickets, tell him I say hi.

I wish I could be there.

I can't, but I'm really excited that he's going to be there.

Also, Paul F.

Tompkins, I want to say a special thank you for being on our show during next fun drive.

And also, thanks for leaving those Coke Zeros in my refrigerator here in my office.

I'm enjoying them for free right now.

Jesse, what do you have going on?

Hey, I got some really cool stuff going on on Bullseye with Jesse Thorne right now.

I hope everyone will take out their podcast apps and subscribe.

We just had Allison Bree, the great Allison Bree, and Keita Takahashi, the creator of

one of the most brilliant video game people of all time, the creator of Katamari Damasi, among other totally

amazing games.

Coming up on Bullseye, I believe it will be next week,

an interview that I just recorded that I just loved getting to do with Cole Escola.

They are one of the funniest human beings on earth.

They have a show running in New York right now called O Mary, where they play Mary Todd Lincoln, like an insane drunk Mary Todd Lincoln.

This is a show that's been on my shortlist for a long time.

I cannot wait to see this show.

I can't wait to listen to this on Bullseye.

It is so funny.

Oh, my gracious.

And they are such a brilliant person.

In addition to being brilliantly hilarious, Cole is truly one of my comedy heroes.

So

listen to that interview.

That's all on Bullseye with Jesse Thorne.

And let's get back to the case.

Let's get back to the case.

Please rise as Judge John Hodgman re-enters the courtroom and presents his verdict.

So, first of all, I'm going to dismiss the countersuit right away,

which is the Casey wanted me to redistribute comedic talent from Ruggs, who's not using it, to Casey, who wants it.

Even if I were capable of doing that, and I want you to take this in the right way, Casey, the reality is Ruggs is funnier than you, and you'll never be funny.

Agreed.

I mean, you are astonishing good company, but you remember when I asked Jesse Thorne after you made that reference to the movie We Bought a Zoo?

I do.

And I said to Jesse,

what did you think?

What did you say when you bought that zoo?

And I want everyone to go back, and we should put this time code into the episode notes so people can go back and find this moment.

The pause that Jesse deployed

before saying,

I said to myself, we bought a zoo, was the perfect amount of time.

And he knew to pause and not to pat myself on the back, but I knew.

Jesse very well.

And I knew to set him up for that.

And I knew he was going to do something really funny with it.

And he did it.

And he did it by not saying something for a while and then saying exactly the right thing.

That's an element of comedic genius that I believe Ruggs has, which is called laying back.

You don't lay back, Casey.

You lean in.

I will say this.

You're not a hack, but you take a different approach to life.

And I want you to take this as not an insult.

You're wacky.

You're finding the wackiest things to do.

Eccentric is a nicer term for it.

And in both cases, I respect these impulses.

Life is a theater to you.

And you're trying to make it as interesting and fun, as dramatic as possible for yourself.

And what I like about you is that you're, to a degree, you're not trying to make the world wacky for anyone else but yourself.

It is okay to curate a life for yourself yourself that is as wild as your dreams can contemplate.

And it is equally okay to invite people to participate in this

strange life that you're curating for yourself or this atypical life or this fun life of actual and economic misadventure.

But it is not okay to rope people in without their full consent.

Now, here's Rugs where I think I need you to do some work.

You know, yourself.

You have found a place in your life where you are perhaps not completely satisfied such that you have zero dreams or ambitions left.

Like, that's not who I think you are, right?

You're not someone who's like, well, I didn't get to be a comedian, so I got to bring this guy down back to normal.

I got to make him be as boring as me, or else my choices are wrong.

That's not where you're at.

I think you are genuinely sort of befuddled and concerned about,

you know, where the wackiness begins and ends in the life of the cousin that you care so much about.

And that's a reasonable thing to feel concerned about.

And like, I understand why you're getting these texts and kind of having to roll your eyes a little bit.

Like, now what?

A bank, a space station.

How's he going to get up there?

I get it.

And I believe that you are just genuinely happy in your life and you're doing what you want to do.

I don't think anyone, believe me, when I say to you, I don't think anyone should be forced to be funny.

It's a horrible, horrible thing to ask of someone.

If you feel like being funny, be funny, whatever.

You have a happy life, and you have to just accept

that Casey has a happy life too, by his own definition.

And part of that acceptance is:

look, I know cousins is going to be cousins, but you need to disentangle yourself from this feeling of cousinly.

I don't know the adjectival form of cousin.

There is one, I bet you.

Cousinly obligation.

He's a grown up.

You got to let him do his thing.

If he's not hurting anyone, he's got to do his thing.

And if he's hurting you,

then you have the right to just say no.

You understand what I mean?

I don't think he's doing anything consciously to hurt you.

I don't think, I don't even know if he's hurting you.

Do you know what I mean?

But it's like, if he's putting obligations on you that you don't like or trying to rope you into his otter fostering scheme or whatever it might be, like he can build a theater in his warehouse, but that does not give him the right to insist that you perform in it.

You don't perform for him ever.

You're an adult who is entitled to your life and the boundaries that you set.

And I, and I get it because I'd be worried too if my cousin might be buying every municipal building around me and putting me into some kind of, what's the Jim Carrey movie?

Truman show situation where the whole world is controlled by your cousin and you're the only one normal one left.

But that's not going to happen.

That's not going to happen.

You don't have to go over and do electrical work for your cousin.

I didn't like it, Casey, when you're like, well, you know, this guy always just shows up.

You are presuming that your cousin is going to come help you.

And perhaps you're not aware that as a charismatic oddball, and I've followed more than my share of charismatic oddballs into various misadventures that have made my life more exciting and

interesting.

Do you you know what I mean?

But then sometimes you got to tell the charismatic oddballs,

I'm okay, dude.

Thanks.

I mean, look, I want you to have everything you want in life.

Jesse Thorne, did I ever tell you about the time that I left my wallet at the Coolidge Corner movie theater when I was working there one summer in college?

What happened?

I would work my shift and I left my wallet.

And then I, but I forgot, I just forgot my wallet there and I went to go get my haircut.

And the guy who was cutting my hair, his name was Ivan.

And I was in the middle of the haircut.

I'm like,

can't believe I forgot my wallet.

I got all freaked out.

I had to borrow his phone to call and make sure my wallet was okay because

I don't love to live in ambiguity.

And they found it was fine.

Sat back down to resume the haircut.

I said, I can't believe I've just walked out of there without my wallet.

And Ivan said,

You're a dreamer.

Keep dreaming.

That's what I say to you, Casey.

You're a dreamer.

Keep dreaming.

But

make the world that you want as weird as you want it to be.

But don't hurt your spouse.

Don't hurt your cousin.

Don't implicate others in stuff that they don't want to be a part of.

You know, be sensitive when someone says, you know,

I don't want to get a text about every Castle Bank library.

decommissioned post office or whatever you're going to buy.

And the thing that I will order you to do, since I'm I'm not ordering in Ruggs' favor, sorry, Ruggs, I feel you,

but I am ordering to you to do this.

If you're going to be wacky, get serious.

I mean, I do think that accumulating properties

with these ideas

and then just letting them rot in place.

I don't see how that could possibly make you happy.

I want you to live in a castle with a falcon and or make ice cream in a warehouse and/or, and this is the one I really like, buy a bank and start an anti-escape room, a reverse escape room.

So I am ordering you as an authority figure

to buy a bank,

maybe with the proceeds of selling that warehouse,

and start that business as soon as possible.

You will probably,

I don't know, it's just such a great idea.

And I think that i'm gonna give you two years to do that and if it's not done in two years that's your life i don't know who cares you'll know that i'll be disappointed and maybe that'll be meaningful to you this is the sound of a gavel

i'd buy that for a dollar

judge shun hodgman rules that is all please rise as judge sean hodgman exits the courtroom

rugs how do you feel

I feel good.

I think the judge nailed that

right on the head there.

So I feel good about this.

And I've gotten some answers.

So thank you very much.

Casey, how are you feeling?

Wow.

That was an incredibly insightful ruling.

Yeah,

I think the ruling is great.

And

I respect and I will follow it.

Absolutely.

Guys, thanks for joining us on the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

Thank you so much.

Thanks for having us.

Another Judge John Hodgman case is in the books.

We'll have Swift Justice in just a second.

First, our thanks to Redditors Floofy Monster Cat and Nick Wester for naming this week's episode Property Cousins.

You can join the conversation about this episode and our show and our network in general over there on Reddit, maximumfund.reddit.com.

John,

that's a good vibe corner of the internet.

Good vibes only there at the maximum fund subreddit.

It's great.

Every post on the maximum fund subreddit is a lot of fun to hang around in, and I go over over there all the time.

And I just want to say, like, you know, the folks who are suggesting these titles, they're really, really creative, really, really fun to read.

This week's title, it wasn't a legal pun.

It was just a reference to Property Brothers, one of the things that I like.

And so that's, and a couple of people thought of it.

And it's always nice to realize that some of your weird obsessions are resonating against someone else, but that's the reason.

You go in there, you make some puns, you have some funs.

You never know what we're going to pick for the show.

So go on.

It doesn't have to be a legal thing necessarily, although it tends to be what it is.

Have Have fun over there.

Maximum fun, if you will.

Maximumfund.reddit.com.

Evidence and photos from the show are posted on our Instagram account at judgejohnhodgman.

John, I also have a new Instagram account.

I have disentangled my

menswear Instagram account, put.this.on.

Which is a great follow, by the way.

People should follow it.

It's true.

My new personal brand Instagram account, my podcasting and comedy-related Instagram account is at We Bought a Zoo.

No, it's at Jesse Thorne very famous.

Oh, that's great.

Jesse Thorne, very famous.

I'm going to follow it right now.

Follow and subscribe to at JudgeJohn Hodgman and, of course, at Jesse Thorne, very famous, and at John Hodgman, and put dot this dot on over on Instagram.

And we just want to say thank you to Apple Podcast listener, iTriumph Still.

That is their handle on Apple Podcasts.

They gave gave us a five-star rating.

I Triumph Still say about the show, quote, every Thursday when my kids have nap time, Judge John Hodgman is my companion, a reward for almost making it through another week.

This podcast is a comforting, entertaining, unmissable part of the week.

Thank you for using our podcast to put your kids to sleep.

Very soporific podcast.

We love making it for you.

And if you're listening to this on Apple Podcasts right now and you're still awake, why don't you give us a rating and review?

It really does help new listeners to find the show.

And And hey, look, if you're not listening on Apple Podcasts, that doesn't mean there's nothing you can do.

Why not share this episode with a pal?

You can share it if you don't know what podcast app they use.

You can share the YouTube version of the show with a friend and say, hey, here's a great thing I heard.

Maybe you have a friend who's a warehouse enthusiast.

That's right.

Our YouTube channel is

really taking off.

So you can share it right there off of YouTube.

That's JudgeJohn Hodgman Pod on YouTube and TikTok.

Judge John Hodgman was created by Jesse Thorne and John Hodgman.

This episode, engineered by Dan Lovelace and Steve Musa at the Sycamore in Plain City, Ohio, are thanks to them.

Our social media manager is Natty Lopez.

Our video editor, Daniel Spear.

Our audio editor is AJ McKeon.

Our producer, the ever-capable Jennifer Marmer.

Now, Swift Justice, where we answer your disputes with quick judgment, Mo Down Joe on the Maximum fund subreddit says, by the way,

you know what my new podcast is going to be?

No.

Just saying Reddit usernames out loud.

There you go.

My mother wants me to respond in the affirmative to every text message she sends.

I feel that modern apps for texting make this redundant and pointless.

You know, over there, the New York Times magazine column, I got to reiterate a piece of settled law, which is don't end end texts with a period.

And don't get pedantic when your younger person in your life says, hey, you don't end the texts with a period.

That means you're mad.

And then the older person goes, that doesn't mean I'm mad.

That means I use proper punctuation.

And I was like, yeah, no what?

Yeah, you know what, petant dad?

That's wrong.

Your young person in your life is trying to teach you how to speak a new dialect of English that has developed in this very informal way on text, which means if you end it with a period, it means you're mad.

Don't put a period or maybe put three dots or something.

Learn to speak the language that you're using.

So I'm very forgiving typically of young people who don't want to text the way their parents want them to, with this exception, respond to your mom.

Don't leave your mom or dad or stepdad or person in your life who cares about you hanging.

Leaving it on red or whatever it is is not enough.

You need to at least just tap a thing that says thumbs up or heart or exclamation point, something that lets them know that you're alive and out there and receiving the message.

It's meaningful to these older people who care for you.

So sorry about that, Modown Joe.

You don't have to respond in the affirmative.

Just saying yes every time would be weird, inaccurate, and maybe a kind of torture for your mom.

But if your mom texts you, just let her know that you got the text.

She cares about you.

John Jan, did you see that screen cap I sent you of a text that my mom sent me about the Max Fun Drive?

Yeah.

It was pretty great, right?

It was pretty good.

We're not going to read it on the show.

No.

It had some expletives in it, among other things.

But

mom texts are fun.

Yeah.

Mom texts are fun.

And did you give her a thumbs up?

I think I gave that one a heart.

I hearted that one.

That deserved everything.

I also read it out loud to my therapist.

That's a nice thing to do

if your parent or parental equivalent texts you and you love them and you love what they said,

not only heart them back, but just say, I read this to my therapist.

And screen cap it and send it to John and Jen.

Yeah.

Today we learned about ice cream college.

And frankly, I'm still furious that it took us so long to learn about ice cream college.

Casey said it's a real thing.

I intend to find out next time we get to Madison.

But while we're waiting for Madison, I want to hear some more disputes about ice cream.

And it doesn't have to be just ice cream.

It can be ice milk sherbet.

it could be fro-yo,

any frozen sweet treats.

Look, it's still a little chilly here in the springtime, Brooklyn, but I'm getting ready for some of that water ice talk.

I'd love, I'd love a ref.

It's going to be summertime soon.

I want to hear all about your refreshing frozen sweet treats.

Is your ice cream college?

I just want to say this one.

This line was written by Jennifer Marmur.

Do a credit where credit is due.

Is your ice cream college rivals with the local frozen yogurt university?

Oh, I hate those snobs at Fro Yo U.

Did your roommate take the last it's it that you were saving?

Hey, here's one for you.

Tell me more about regional ice cream treats and why they're so good.

We want your cold confectionery disputes at maximumfund.org slash jjho, which happens to be the website where you can submit all of your disputes.

That's maximumfund.org slash jjho.

No matter what your dispute is, that is the lifeblood of our program.

So please gin something up, go to maximumfund.org slash JJHO and send it in.

We'll talk to you next time on the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

Maximum Fun, a worker-owned network of artists-owned shows, supported directly by you.