The Mighty Eagle of Mid-Tier Comedy Performers

Welcome to the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

I'm Bailiff Jesse Thorne.

We're in chambers this week, clearing the docket.

And with me is a man who needs no chair because he's sitting on a pile of sky miles, Judge John Hodgman.

That's true.

I did have a you know,

there were a lot of sky miles that I had accumulated over our years of touring together in the Judge John Hodgman podcast live show and other professional responsibilities and duties.

Duties.

Good one.

Yeah, I know, right?

But

the past, you know,

for the past 18 months or so, 14, 15 months,

I've been flying around.

I'm sitting on these sky miles.

They don't expire.

Why don't I turn them into a throne?

Yeah.

So I've got a throne of sky miles and Biscoff cookies that I collected off of Delta Planes over many years.

Jesse Thorne, the times, they are a changing, to quote the bard of all boomers, Mr.

Robert Dylan.

Sure.

I'm familiar with him.

And

soon I've got to spend those sky miles.

I got to dismantle my throne and put them into use to get us into the air and across the country and in front of people again.

John, would you call Bob Dylan a rock star poet?

Because that's what I would call him.

In my opinion, he's as much a poet as he is a musician.

Well, he's a Nobel laureate for poetry.

Sure.

Yeah, in poetry.

I was just like, can you imagine all the poets holding their heads in their hands that day?

All the professional poets.

This thing's only given out once a year to one poet a year.

I chose the road less traveled.

I mean, no disrespect to Bob Dylan.

Bob Dylan is a great musician.

Of course.

An essential artist.

The fact that I do not have the DNA receptor for Bob Dylan does not mean that

he is not an essential artist.

I don't get it.

Who are you to complain?

You have the DNA receptor for Tom Waits.

Well, that's what I was going to say.

Nobel laureate of my heart.

Let's get into the docket.

Here's a case from Mike and Kennedy.

I don't want to yet, Jesse.

I have to tell you something.

What's that?

I feel terrible.

Why?

Physically destroyed.

Do you know why?

Why is that?

I saw friends.

I saw human beings

for a prolonged encounter.

No, no, no.

I definitely assumed.

No, no.

They recently reunited.

Yes, I have not assumed that.

Everyone likes Joey best now.

You know what?

Matt LeBlanc, the sleeper star of the friends.

No one knew.

No one gave Matt LeBlanc his props in his time.

But then in episodes, so good.

Matt LeBlanc is great.

But I've not, no, the reunion of friends has not touched my eyes in part because Paul Rudd wasn't there, but also in part because

I was away this weekend.

Our friends, Jonathan Colton and yours, Jonathan Colton and Christine Connor, and their families and our families, our old friends, invited us to go to their home in the mountains of upstate New York in an undefined location because we were all vaccinated.

And it's the first prolonged social overnight encounter I've had

with some of our dearest friends.

We've seen them, but this is a long stretch of being in and breathing in rooms with people who are not in my family and talking to them.

And I, when we got home yesterday, I was like, I got to go to bed.

I feel like I just got hit in the stomach a hundred times.

Not because it wasn't pleasant.

It was just like my body wasn't up for it.

Like I, if I go out, if I go out for lunch with someone now, I lose my voice the next day.

I'm just not used to this level of encounter.

I think I might have an ear infection from it.

I'm not joking.

I don't know what's going on.

They took a plane ride?

Yeah, I'm like a baby.

That's right, because the babies don't, babies don't fly on planes that often, and their heads get all stuffy with the change in pressure differential.

They're not used to it.

They develop no tolerance.

All my tolerance is gone.

I used to be king of the skies, Jesse.

Now I'm grounded for life.

The mighty eagle of mid-tier comedy performers.

Wow.

Yeah, let's move on.

I think we'll move on then.

Thanks.

Here's a case from Mike in Kansas City, Missouri.

By the way, anytime on one of these shows I say Missouri, people send me different ways to say the name of that state.

And that's really much about it.

That's really interesting because I thought when you said, by the way, you were going to walk back your mid-tier roast.

But okay, I got you.

Let's go on to Missouri.

Look,

I'm bottom of the barrel.

I'm a rotten apple.

Look, we're none of us Bob Dylan.

So what are we even talking about?

Why do we even exist?

You got to cut around the wormholes if you want to eat me.

Well, you know what?

You're a sweet, crisp, gala apple, and so am I.

Thank you very much, but I'm a sundowner.

I say Missouri because my dad

was from Kansas City, Missouri, and that's how he said it.

So go suck a lemon, people who are mad about how I say Missouri.

I don't know that anyone,

however you want to say the name of that state, it's fine.

Just don't show me.

Missouri.

So be on showing everybody.

How about this?

Change your motto.

Keep it to yourself, state, Missouri.

Mid-tier comedy.

My wife and I are both introverts.

However, in most situations, I'm more gregarious than she is.

There is one area, though, where she finds me to be curmudgeonly.

I refuse to answer the door when we are not expecting company.

I maintain that the doorbell or knock is a request, not a demand, and therefore we can ignore it and go about our business.

Additionally, I propose that in the time of COVID, not answering the door to strangers is being extra safe, even though we're both fully vaccinated.

I would like the judge to recognize that I'm being socially appropriate by not answering my door to unanticipated knocks and rings.

So, Jesse.

Here's the thing.

I live in New York City almost all of the time.

When someone rings the buzzer in our apartment buildings, and of course we all have apartments that are perfect recreations of the sets of friends,

you say, who is it?

Traditionally, you used to say, who is it?

You know what I mean?

You'd walk the five miles from the SETI to the front door in your massive downtown apartment and hit the buzzer and go, who's there?

And the answer was routinely, Chris,

who's got.

And you would figure out whether that was someone you knew or not.

Like the announcement on a subway train.

Yeah, exactly.

Exactly.

Station.

Why is the station parts clear?

I know.

The station is always clear.

To be fair, sometimes the station is unpronounceable, such as Hoyt Skimmerhorn.

But in any case,

nowadays, in most contemporary apartment buildings, Hoit

Skrimmerhorn.

You have a little video screen.

You can preview who the person is.

You don't have to

even ask them.

You can be as

introverted, even to the point of antisocial, as possible.

If the bell rings and it's someone you don't recognize, you just walk away, knowing that they are many, many locked doors and floors behind you, and they cannot see in or register that you're there.

But, Jesse, you live in a city called Los Angeles where most people have, you know, often live in standalone homes where someone might, like, like in Missouri, someone might knock on the door or ring the buzzer

and

they might see you through a window.

What do you do if you get in Los Angeles?

What's the etiquette if there's a ding-dong that you do not expect?

Is it okay to do that?

Do you just ignore it?

I don't even have a doorbell.

Really?

I mean, I have a doorbell, but it's inside a locked gate.

Okay.

So how do people indicate that they want to get in?

They call me on the phone.

Okay, fair enough.

No one ever just knocks on your door?

You know, the delivery people throw the packages over the fence.

Right.

People that I'm expecting, I leave the gate open for them.

I don't know who...

I live on a street that ends in a dirt road.

It's barely a street.

Yeah,

to call it a street is generous.

So there's no casual, you know, there's no Jehovah's Witnesses wandering down my street to tell me the good news.

It's really just people who intend to come to my house.

Well, let's throw it to Jennifer Marmor.

She also lives in the city of Los Angeles.

Hi, Jennifer.

Hi.

In Los Angeles, is there a etiquette for someone knocking or ringing that you do not expect?

Do you need to go and check the door?

Yeah.

We have a peephole in the door.

I'm too short to look out of it unless I'm wearing taller shoes.

Oh, no.

So if I'm the one who's home, then I have to go, who is it?

Right.

And

we live in a

white skimmer horn.

We live in a four pounds.

Sorry, go ahead.

We live in a fourplex.

And so, and the, so it's just like a row of four doors, just one next to each other.

Um, and

often what will happen is somebody will be knocking for the neighbor, but like we hear it.

And so I have to go check because also my dog is losing his mind, um, assuming people are coming to, you know, do harm.

And yeah, I

kind of just ask who it is.

And if it's someone that you're not expecting, you just back away slowly from the door.

You know what?

I tend to open.

I mean, I don't know.

I don't tend to open it, but like I, it's a case-by-case basis because

there was a time when people were canvassing for,

you know, various political candidates.

Yeah.

And,

you know, this was, I think, I guess before COVID, just before COVID, but we would talk to them unless the baby was napping.

And then we put up a sign that said, we're voting for such and such, but we'll vote for your candidate if

they're the nominee.

We have a sleeping baby.

Don't knock.

Right.

This isn't a good answer because it's all just, it's a case-by-case case.

But

I do feel like

I can't just ignore it because it's very clear that we're home.

Right.

You know, the window is right there.

They could see that

my kid is doing stuff and I'm sitting there.

Yeah,

I would never ignore a doorbell or a buzzer because I am curious to know who is out there.

That is natural curiosity.

They call me curious, John.

Yeah, that's the other thing for me is that even if I'm not expecting somebody, I'm like, ooh, did somebody send me flowers or something?

I got to go see who it is.

Yeah, Yeah, it's an interesting point, you know, because I have

a wooden horse.

I've always wanted one.

But

I have the luxury of being able to see who is ringing the bell.

And if I know them, and I can talk to them remotely, and I am totally secure.

And the truth is, let's just start out by saying, don't open your door to a stranger.

That's how the movie Strangers happens, The Strangers, scariest movie.

Don't open a door.

You're late at night.

Someone's knocking.

Don't open the door.

And she goes, is Tamra here?

Scariest moment in the scariest movie.

Is Tamra here?

See you later.

Scary.

Didn't have to do that, Scott Speedman.

Liv Tyler knew.

Don't open the door to a stranger.

Barbicane station.

And there's a special weirdness.

You know, I get a little, and I'm feeling, I'm feeling Mike in this case, because I get a little hinky just thinking about going to a door where there's a stranger on the other side going, is Tamara here?

And even looking through a people, I would feel that feels intimate to me and a little scary.

Do you know what I mean?

In a way that it isn't in New York City where I am truly removed, like I am peering down from a tower, I'm untouchable.

But like just getting on the other side of that door and there's a stranger that I don't expect, I understand why Mike feels a little ambivalent about this.

Makes me feel a little, a little nervous to think that who could be on the other side of that door.

I saw the strangers, could be one of them.

But Jennifer, you raise a very interesting point.

Because just this morning, I received two buzzes of my, of my buzzer here at my office in Brooklyn, New York.

The first one I knew was the pho soup that I had ordered for my lunch.

I let that person in right away and ate that pho as quickly as possible.

And then I'm settled down and I've already got this one in my mind.

Buzzer buzzes again.

I'm like,

is that Mike from the podcast?

Is that Mike from the docket testing me?

Is it one of the strangers?

Is it a bad guy?

What's going on?

Why is this happening?

I go and I think about like, do I just ignore it?

I'm literally, I'm legitimately scared because it's so uncanny that it just happened as I was thinking about this case.

And I hit the video and there's a man standing down there with a big bouquet of flowers.

And I said, I can talk remotely.

I said, I don't think those are for me.

And he said, are you Judge John Hodgman?

They're from Mike.

No.

He said, I've been ringing the other, the other doorbell five times, and I've got to give these flowers to this person.

I was like, this is exactly why Mike's got to check the door.

If Mike doesn't check the door, someone isn't going to get their flowers.

I know it's scary.

I get it.

But someone could need some help.

Someone could be in trouble.

Someone might be trying to deliver flowers or a package or medication and they have the wrong address or they want to figure out if this is the correct address.

You got to live in.

Look, I know it's scary to go out into the world.

I understand and appreciate introversion.

I've never been more introverted in my life.

I just spent a weekend with some of my oldest and best friends whom I love.

And I feel like I got hit by a bus.

And all I want to do is crawl back into my pandemic hole and not come out for a month.

I get it.

But we got to go out.

We got to see what's happening in the world a little bit.

We have to be out there a little bit.

We have to be able to see.

We have to be able to see and make ourselves available to help if we can, while maintaining first and foremost our security.

And thinking about that, I realize now that probably

that guy's flowers were probably poison.

Maybe that's true.

I think probably someone got some pretty flowers.

There are plenty of security-based reasons

to consider whether and how to open the door for someone.

But

I don't think

that Emily Post or whatever would endorse

making a personal choice whether to accept that someone rang the doorbell.

Yeah.

I think just sitting there, particularly, I mean,

if you're in a single home, like you might be in Missouri, that's how I pronounce it.

Show me where I'm wrong.

Show me where I'm wrong, Missouri.

Or whatever, like if someone's and

you're just sitting there going, oh, nothing's happening, I'm not here, I'm not going to do it, and they can just kind of walk across the lawn and look in the window at you.

Come on, you know better than that, Mike.

You got to get up there and make sure everyone's okay.

John, did you know that Missouri was originally called the Tell Me State?

Then it took a writing class at the Learning Annex?

Terrible.

Okay, here's something from Jeff of Pueblo, Colorado.

Dear Judge Hodgman, I have an intense fear of lotions, creams, soaps, shampoos, gels, mousses, rubs, rouges, pastes, or basically anything else meant to be applied to the human body.

What about tinctures?

My fear is so intense.

Poultice?

My fear is so intense that I would classify it as a phobia.

My wife laughs at this and frequently chases me and or startles me with lotion-covered hands in a pretend attack.

She defends this by saying my fear is ridiculous and made up.

She also points out I used to tickle her even after she had asked me to stop.

I know I took the tickling too far.

I realized years ago that her involuntary laughter was not a signal that she was enjoying things as much as I was, and so I stopped doing this.

However, to this day, she will pretend to attack me with some cream or another.

I seek an injunction against my wife.

All right, this is going to be a quick one because obviously everyone knows.

We've already ruled on it very recently.

If someone feels they have a phobia about a thing,

you don't get to choose their wrong.

If they're scared of a thing, You got to respect their scaredness.

Maybe you find out that your spouse is a bit of a scaredy cat about lotions and and unguents.

That's okay.

It's okay for them to be as scared of those things.

It's not cool to make fun of them with your lotion hands.

And

is it

by the same token we've ruled on this before?

Don't tickle people.

Don't touch people unless they're okay with being touched.

And particularly if they say stop, you stop.

You learn your lesson, you adjust, you apologize,

you correct course from then on.

And here's the good news: Jeff did it.

Jeff did it, Jeff's wife.

Jeff stopped.

I understand.

You're still mad about it.

Jeff tickled you too much.

Jeff tickled you beyond your comfort level.

Jeff shouldn't have been tickling you at all.

You know, shame on Jeff, I say.

I think shame on Jeff.

Jeff says too.

I think he gets it.

You've held him accountable.

There's no need for vengeance.

You don't have to scare him now.

That's wrong.

I hope that he uses bar soap at least, though, because I'm worried that Jeff smells.

I understand he's not okay with body wash or any kind of gels, but he's got a.

I hope he's got some bar soap or something.

A lot of people at UC Santa Cruz told me that you don't need to use soap, your body will rebalance itself.

But all of those people were smelly.

That's the balance that they're seeking.

They want us all to be smelly.

Then none of us will notice anymore.

I would encourage Jeff.

You know, no binding ruling.

It's his choice.

But I would encourage Jeff to get help with this phobia simply because

a lot of

lotions, creams, shampoos, pastes, poultices

are useful and valuable in day-to-day life, not least of which is sunscreen.

I mean, Jeff has some very wide-brimmed hats.

Nobody wants to get skin cancer.

Well, but Jeff could get the solid block sunscreen.

So Jeff could

cover himself up.

The kind that a cartoon lifeguard wears on their nose?

Yeah, that's right.

What I'm saying is, but you can put it all over your whole face and then cover yourself up completely in a white caftan robe

and then wear a broadband hat and sunglasses.

And that way nobody knows you're invisible.

Then everyone knows you're Marlon Brando in the island of Dr.

Moreau.

There's one to look at.

Talk about scary movies.

The only reason, look, all this is settled law, Jeff and Jeff's wife, who has a name and is a whole person in her own right eye, I'm sure.

Jeff's wife, you were wronged, but

Jeff has apologized and I hope atoned.

And it is wrong to disrespect people's phobias.

I've got a phobia.

It's called submechanophobia.

It's my fear of underwater animatronics.

It's on the internet.

I found out about it.

Submecanophobia is also the name of a fictional band that I just invented.

And we're going to create a tour t-shirt for submechanophobia for summer 2021.

It's going to be the t-shirt of the summer.

I'm going to imagine a whole tour, a touring route for submechanophobia,

an incredible prog rock band.

But

even though my fear is irrational, I don't want anyone chasing me with any underwater robots.

Stop doing it, Jeff's wife.

The only reason I brought this up is that

the idea of being chased around a house by a person with lotion on their hands is legitimately scary.

That's scarier than just regular lotion.

Yeah, just squelching their way through the hallway.

Yeah, I'm like, you know what?

I didn't need to hear this case at all since it's such settled law, except I wanted Jeff to have some justice.

And also, I wanted to say, I used to think that The Strangers was the scariest movie.

Now I know Lotion Hands.

That is going to be the scariest horror franchise of the next couple of years.

Lotion Hands 1, Lotion Hands 2, Lotion Hands 3, Return of the Poultice.

Yeah, let's do it, John Krasinski from the office.

We're going to take a quick break to hear from this week's partner.

We'll be back with more cases to clear from the docket on the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

Hello, I'm your Judge John Hodgman.

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The Judge John Hodgman podcast is also brought to you this week by Made In.

Let me ask you a question.

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Let them know Jesse and John sent you.

Welcome back to the Judge Sean Hodgman podcast.

We're clearing the docket this week, and we have a case from Kyle in Washington, D.C.

My wife and I just bought a camper.

It was mainly her idea, as the kids and I were perfectly happy and tents.

Now she wants to name the camper.

I think naming vehicles is hokey and only appropriate if the vehicle is part of a fleet, like the USS ship name.

She wants to name a campaign.

Best name for a ship.

Best name for a ship.

That's really good.

That is.

It's like the no-name brand of ships.

She wants to name it CC.

as in Cozy Camper, and had a whole ethos developing around the cozy camper lifestyle.

I just want to camp.

P.S.

I want to put bumper stickers on the camper to memorialize the places we've visited, but she says no bumper stickers.

But at the same time, she says bumper stickers from anywhere are fine regardless of whether the camper was taken there.

I'm a bumper sticker purist.

Stickers are only appropriate if the item upon which the sticker rests visited that place.

We wouldn't put a bumper sticker from Hawaii on our camper.

Question mark, exclamation mark, question mark, exclamation mark, question mark.

Strong close on a question mark.

Well,

there's a lot to take in here.

A couple of different issues.

But first, I just want to go back and mention, I forgot to mention, speaking of lotions, pastes, and gels,

one of the young people that I visited over this weekend is averse to condiments of any kind.

Mustard,

my beloved mayonnaise,

hummus, no thank you.

Wow.

Which is not a condiment, but any sort of dip as well, ranch dip, nope.

Blue chip.

And nope.

And

when it was put to him, what would you say is the base repulsion?

He kind of looked in the air for a while and he said, I guess you would just say, I don't like any savory pastes.

And I'm like, you know what?

Respect.

Yeah.

Respect.

Even I, mayonnaise's greatest champion, must respect.

It is a savory paste.

And therefore, in that context, it is disgusting.

Good for you.

You know, once in college at UC Santa Cruz, I asked my friend Ben Smith

why

he was a vegan.

And to be clear, I have nothing but immense respect for the vegan lifestyle and vegetarianism more broadly, both of which are responsible choices for our planet.

Ben Smith said to me, He shrugged.

He said, I think I just like extremism.

Honestly.

And I was

like, you know what?

You're doing it right.

You're doing your thing.

That is one of the top extremisms to pursue.

Good for everybody.

You know, I didn't go to UC Santa Cruz, but I've heard that among its noted eccentricities,

including its eschewing of all shampoos, conditioners, lotions.

Popularity with unicycles.

Yeah.

Including mountain unicycles, a specific type of unicycle for riding on trails.

I've heard the only acceptable deodorant in the UC Santa Cruz community is

vegan cheese.

Yeah.

Did you know that at UC Santa Cruz, I knew multiple people who lived in the woods under a tarp?

All under the same tarp?

No, they each had their own tarp.

Well, that brings us back to this case, to each their own tarp.

Yeah.

First of all, let's talk about this bumper sticker thing.

Jesse Thorne,

you live in the car culture of Los Angeles.

How do you feel about bumper stickers?

Thumbs up, thumbs down, don't care.

I do have a few travel-style bumper stickers on my car.

All right.

There's not really anywhere to put bumper stickers on the bumper of my car.

I recently obtained at a flea market a bumper sticker for my favorite baseball team, the San Francisco Giants.

Right.

From the late 1970s

with their

flagship station, KNBR 68, the Sports Leader.

And I realized that my car did not really have a place to put it

because it's a two-tone bumper.

So there's not really a solid.

But I do have a few of those kind of

trunk label style stickers in the back side windows of my station wagon.

And they do represent places that car has visited.

I have one for San Francisco, one for Sequoia National Forest,

and I have one that says

I have a property in the particular town in Sequoia National Monument where my cabin is.

And that's because if you park on the street, that way the firefighters won't just push your car off the side of the road if you're

going through.

Right.

Yeah.

No, he's okay.

He has a cabin here.

We won't destroy his car.

Yeah.

So do you think there's something to this bumper sticker purism?

Would you put a Hawaii bumper sticker on a camper that it will that will never go to any of the islands of hawaii i think in both of these cases from my perspective yeah there is no absolute rule but kyle's wife seems cool and i like her plan i agree with you and here's the thing kyle

i follow on instagram one or two of these uh van life accounts

These are beautiful young people who live in beautiful vintage camper vans of the old VW bus variety, et cetera, et cetera.

Mitsubishi Delica.

I don't know if there's a Delica life account.

There ought to be, man.

There are many.

There are many.

People living in them.

Yeah.

People love living in those delicas.

How many delicas do we live in on the daily?

Mise many, many, many.

Now that we're all getting out of the house, including Kyle and his family, like, Jesse,

Jennifer, Jennifer Marmer, you're our tour manager when we go on the road.

Yeah.

Would it be possible to just do a delica tour?

Yes.

Like, we get a delica, right?

Possible and happening.

And we could.

Thank you.

Okay, good.

Done and done.

Thank you.

I mean, the thing about these van life and these delica life Instagram accounts is that it's not about

the journey or the destination.

It's about the van.

It's about the lifestyle.

It's about people creating a fantasy of a mobile life inside this little, beautiful, perfect thing that can go anywhere.

And I don't know, Kyle, whether your wife, who has a name and has a whole life of her own, her own van life,

is into these kinds of accounts the same way I am.

But it sounds like if you said that she's developed this whole ethos developing around the cozy camper lifestyle, it sounds like she might be.

It might be part of a vision she has for how she wants to spend her life

out there in the world on the road on vacation.

And that vision is different from yours.

You and the kids just love tents.

You say you just want to camp, right?

As though just camping is a default analog normal that everyone needs to respect.

You just want to have a tarp and put it among the redwoods.

Yeah.

Only UC Santa Cruz students actually have to live outside.

Well, everyone else is a choice.

Who had the radio show that came on before mine?

He was about 65.

And he lived outside?

He lived in a tarp in the UC Santa Cruz campus.

Yeah.

That's a true lifestyle choice.

I want to see some of those Tarp Life Instagram accounts.

That would be cool.

Hashtag Tarp Life.

But I mean, even

the kids at UC Santa Cruz, they don't have to live outside.

You go outside into the woods.

It's not a life.

It's a lifestyle.

It's a fantasy that you are role-playing at when you go out there and you camp under the stars and

you cook food over fire and you

imagine that you hear

Blair witches out there in the woods coming to get you.

That's all the funs.

That's all the fun part.

It's not something you have to do.

And there is no normal to role-play.

There is no normal.

to

the fantasy life that you are engaging in.

I mean, frankly, I think you should all be dressing like elves.

That's a good fantasy.

Yeah, that would be dope.

And your wife has her own fantasy, and her fantasy is a cozy camper with a name, CC,

and is a fantasy camper that can go, that can, even though it will never leave the continental United States, it can bear a bumper sticker from Hawaii.

Because in her mind, this camper can take her anywhere.

And maybe to a certain degree, I'm going to be harsh, Kyle.

Maybe part of the fantasy is to take her away from you.

Not far away.

Same campsite.

You know what I mean?

Your camping LARP involves tents.

Maybe that's not comfortable for her.

Maybe that's not as fun for her as her camping LARP, which is

being in a cute, cutesy little camper with a name that's got a little daisy and a vase inside of it or whatever.

And it's a little bit more comfortable for her.

You can all LARP on the same campsite.

You and your kids can be in the tents, and your wife can be in her named camper Cece.

And if that still bothers you, then I'm going to, this is

an order for Kyle's wife right now.

Get a second camper.

Get a second camper that never leaves the garage.

Call that the USS Killjoy.

Now you got a fleet of campers.

USS Cece?

USS Killjoy.

And you know what?

Better yet?

USS Blair Witch is a better name for it.

Put whatever bumper sticker.

Look,

when you're in a partnership, in a life partnership, you know, like sometimes you just got to let the other person have their thing.

And sometimes the person isn't going to come right out and say, my thing is I want a really cutesy camper.

Sometimes, especially when it involves expenditure of money, a person will feel the obligation to say, this is for all of us.

Sometimes it's not for all of us.

Sometimes it's just for one or two people in the family.

And if they feel strongly about it, let them have it.

Let them have it.

Let's go easy on each other a little bit.

John, I have a new favorite dog on Instagram.

Oh, really?

Yeah, bad news for City Willie.

Uh-oh.

Demoted.

City Willie called into Jordan Jesse Go last week.

I don't care.

I'm over City Willie.

That's not true.

I still love you, City Willie.

Bumped down to the mid-tier.

Mid-tier dog, City Willie.

Make way for new top-tier Instagram dog.

Let's hear it.

Archie was here.

Archie was here.

Let me check it out.

Oh, this Archie, what a pup.

What a pup.

Philadelphia-based scruff dog, Archie was here is.

Archie.was.here.

And guess what?

Archie was here is friends with City Willie.

Oh, that's right.

They like to play together.

You've turned what a completely understandable and natural evolution of taste and dog preference into a real

roast of City Willie.

A real stab in City Willie's back.

John, I have to admit, it is not dissimilar to how I ended up dating my wife.

No.

And that worked out great.

We've been together for over 20 years.

I got to say, Archie.was.here, a pretty good-looking dog, that's for sure.

Here's a case from Margaret in Cincinnati, Ohio.

I have a dispute with my husband, Greg.

I love to be outdoors, breathing in the quote, fresh air, unquote.

And sometimes I think that if one is feeling bad, getting some fresh air could make them feel better.

Greg, however, doesn't believe in the concept of fresh air, proclaiming that all air, indoors or out, is the exact same air.

I request an injunction that Greg admit there is such a thing as fresh air, and I ask you order him to relish in it.

Sorry, I wasn't paying attention to Greg's weird claim that all air is the same air, which is undeniably scientifically false.

Because I was quickly browsing through the axolotl hashtag on Instagram.

How did you get there from Archie was here?

I was just wondering if there was a axolotls of Instagram culture, the way there's a dogs of Instagram and other pets of Instagram.

Axolotl being the newt-like ancient creature that lives underwater.

They live in darkened underwater lakes, I believe underneath Mexico City, primarily.

There are quite a few illustrations of axolotls.

Boy, these are spooky-looking weird creatures.

Love them.

There are quite a few photos and illustrations of axolotls under the hashtag axolotl,

but very few dedicated axolotl-like pet pages.

So I'm going to give a shout out today to the axolotl twins.

The only one that I can see that follows two particular axolotls, Stella and Luna.

Stella and Luna, the twin axolotls, they're very, very adorable.

And their axolotl mom and dad, apparently, take very good care of them.

Good job.

They're very adorable, depending on how you feel about creatures that aren't entirely opaque.

Jesse, did you know?

They alternate between photos of Stella and Luna with little facts about axolotls.

Did you know axolotls can be sensitive to strong water flow?

I would imagine so.

Jesse, did you know axolotls can become impacted by gravel and large grain sand?

Oh, wow.

Yeah.

I mean, can't we all?

Anyway, go check them out, Axolotl Twins.

They're my favorite axolotls of Instagram until next week when I will change it up again.

John, Margaret in Cincinnati is entirely wrong about one thing.

Yeah.

Fresh air doesn't come from the outdoors, it comes from WHYY in Philadelphia.

Listen, Margaret.

Mark.

Boy, you know, the thing I love about Terry Gross is that when she says fresh air, you know that for however many years she's done this radio show,

you know,

five days a week, except for certain break times,

every time she says fresh air, you know, she's thinking to herself, I'm really glad I came up with that name.

Yeah.

She seems so happy that it's called fresh air every time.

You know, it's a solid name.

It's good work.

She named it that when it was a local show really

yeah

because uh because uh philadelphia public radio at the time was stale air and let me tell you something greg

air gets stale you say air inside air and outside air are the same uh my my uh air filter in the great state of maine would have you know differently because when we've got a fire going in the fireplace Boy, oh boy, does that thing turn red and start whirring?

Because that fire is pumping out all kinds of noxious gases that make it hard for me to breathe.

And I enjoy looking at that fire and I enjoy the pleasure that it gives to the person who builds it.

But that's why at the end of every day, I go up, particularly in the winter, and open my window to the frigid, cold, black, haunted forest and just suck in as much fresh air as I can because it is soothing and it is good for my lungs.

So yes, fresh air is a real thing.

We have a chance to get out there and enjoy it.

Please do it.

Make it part of your CC cozy camper life.

Fresh air.

It's not just a radio station.

It's also everything out in the world.

Let's take a quick break when we come back.

More justice.

You know, we've been doing my brother, my brother, me for 15 years.

And

maybe you stopped listening for a while.

Maybe you never listened.

And you're probably assuming three white guys talking for 15 years.

I know where this has ended up.

But no, no, you would be wrong.

We're as shocked as you are that we have not fallen into some sort of horrific scandal or just turned into a big crypto thing.

Yeah, you don't even really know how crypto works.

The only NFTs I'm into are naughty, funny things, which is what we talk about on my brother, my brother, and me.

We serve it up every Monday for you if you're listening.

And if not, we just leave it out back and goes rotten.

So check it out on Maximum Fun or wherever you get your podcasts.

All right, we're over 70 episodes into our show.

Let's learn everything.

So, let's do a quick progress check.

Have we learned about quantum physics?

Yes, episode 59.

We haven't learned about the history of gossip yet, have we?

Yes, we have.

Same episode, actually.

Have we talked to Tom Scott about his love of roller coasters?

Episode 64.

So, how close are we to learning everything?

Bad news.

We still haven't learned everything yet.

Oh, we're ruined.

No, no, no, it's it's good news as well.

There is still a lot to learn.

Woo!

I'm Dr.

Ella Hubber.

I'm regular Tom Lum.

I'm Caroline Roper, and on Let's Learn Everything, we learn about science and a bit of everything else too.

And although we haven't learned everything yet, I've got a pretty good feeling about this next episode.

Join us every other Thursday on Maximum Fun.

Welcome back to the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

We've got something here from Luke.

I guess I pronounce albums strangely with a very soft B.

V-like.

I don't know why I say it this way.

I'm from Cleveland, but I don't know that has anything to do with it.

You mean Cleveland?

I believe that's pronounced Cleveland.

Cleveland.

Yeah,

straight off the streets of Cleveland.

Ohio.

Cleveland, Ohio.

My wife interrupts the conversation any time I say this word to laugh at me and mock my pronunciation.

I say this word a lot.

I'm a musician and she's a dancer, so we talk about new music often.

Couldn't she just laugh to herself and let the conversation continue uninterrupted?

However, she's from Chicago and thus mispronounces the word pants.

So as an alternative to ignoring my pronunciation of album, I seek an order that whenever she laughs and says album sneeringly, that I get to say pants as a retort.

And then we both have to move on.

I believe I have some audio footage of Luke from Cleveland saying the word

album.

Have you listened to the last track of the Red Barat album, Sound the People?

Album.

Alvum.

Wow, he really does say it with a V.

There's no.

I was not expecting it to be that unequivocally.

There's no linear Yanni there.

That is Alvum.

By the way, good shout out to Red Barat, Sonny Jane, an incredible musician who leads an incredible band called Red Barat.

If you have a chance to see them in the fresh air out in the world, whoo!

Shout out to friend of Max Fun Phil Elberum of Mount Deary.

I mean, yeah, look,

Luke, you say that word in a distinctive way, real Cleveland-style album there.

I don't know why you say it that way.

I can appreciate why it has come up in your marriage before.

But

all this teasing has to stop.

You know, someone wrote in recently thanking the podcast for one of the maxims of settled law that we've developed over the years, which is if it's not fun for everyone, it's no fun at all.

And, you know, you say alvum weird, but it's just like,

we've all been cooped up together for a long time, chasing each other with lotion hands.

I get it.

We're all a little bit on edge.

We're all sick of each other.

Squelching down those corridors.

Yeah, if we're lucky enough to have been cooped up with a loved one for 15, 16 months, whatever it is,

like I appreciate it's like this, the little

things that make us want to chase each other with lotion hands and make fun of each other and pick at each other.

It's time to just open up those windows and let in the fresh air and let the stale air out.

I mean, here's a difference, Greg,

between fresh air and inside air.

It's dramatically more difficult to spread disease in fresh air.

One disease in particular, get it?

Gout.

You know, those droplets that come out of your mouth, the stuff that's in them dissipates much more quickly.

There's much more ventilation.

We all need to,

if not literally, at least figuratively, get out into the fresh air and

air out our bunkers to a certain degree.

And part of that means, you know, stopping, don't put any more poison into the environment inside by making fun of each other and

tickling each other and hurting each other.

Like, we've all had a couple of hundred really bad days.

So I think that your message, Luke, is a good one to take.

We both have to move on after that.

So I think your request is interesting, Luke.

I mean, not only do I order your wife, who is her own person and has a name and everything,

to stop making fun of you when you pronounce album in your interesting own style.

But you request that if she does it again, that you get to sneer back at her and say, payance,

payance, is how you spell it.

And then you both have to move on after that.

I agree with you, and I will allow that as long as it's one time.

One time.

She does it, you do it, and then let's just stop it.

In fact, make it a ritual.

You two sit in front of each other, go outside, if it's safe to do so in your area, go outside, sit in front of one another, and you say, alvum, and she goes, ha ha.

And she says, payance, and you go, payance, ha ha.

And then just stand up and hold hands and take a walk around the block and forget it.

Leave it behind you.

Judge Hodgman, have we received any letters this week?

We received a letter indeed.

The other week

we were talking a little bit about appropriate gifts to give at a wedding and the level of generosity to express at a wedding.

And

my advice was

be as generous as you can afford to be,

both financially and emotionally.

Generosity is a wonderful expression of love.

But I was surprised to learn

that

a number of people

simply give cash at a wedding rather than giving a gift off a registry or something else.

And I asked, and indeed, Jesse, you had pointed out that at your own wedding, which I was invited to, but I did not attend, and I have so far not given you a gift for, and I feel terrible about it.

So

watch the mails.

You know what?

Last week on the show when this came up,

I forgave you, but I'm taking it back.

Now I'm going to resent it forever.

Yeah, that's right.

That's right.

Changed my mind on that one.

Watch the mails for a real mid-tier gift from me being thrown over your fence sometime in the near future.

But I was like, oh, well, it may be a generational thing.

It's a change in culture.

Like, do, do people give gifts at weddings anymore?

Is it more often a cash gift or a donation to a honeymoon fund?

And indeed, Natalie in Manville, New Jersey wrote to say, I am an event planner at a wedding venue in New Jersey.

And I can say the current trend in wedding gift giving, in my experience, is that 95% of guests coming to the wedding will bring a card.

Some of these cards will include a check inside, but others will have contributed to the couple's honeymoon fund through the couple's wedding website.

Which, so there you go.

And I got a number of letters to that effect.

So I'm sorry that I am not up with the times.

I'm very old, especially after this long weekend when I just got pummeled with

social contact.

But she went on to write: In terms of calculating the amount to give,

I would like a ruling that wedding guests, please do not call the venue and ask how much it costs to have a wedding there.

Guests do it all the time.

I feel it's very rude.

Can you please rule that if you are invited to a wedding, you should give what you can or want to give and stop calling to make sure that you are covering the cost per plate?

Thank you.

Hope this helps.

Smiling emoji.

I smile emoji back at you natalie and to everyone who has written in letters absolutely natalie i i i give a blanket ruling if you are going to give someone

and i and i do say give someone i do not say gift to someone if you're going to give someone a gift of money or a contribution towards a honeymoon fund or whatever Seek your heart for what is an appropriate amount.

Don't bother someone at the wedding menu to find out just how much your dinner would cost there, just so that you can neutralize your chicken or salmon footprint.

Just give of yourself, won't you?

Not gift to of yourself, give of yourself.

I apologize.

I have a little hang up with the phrase, gifted.

I've gifted someone or someone gifted to me.

They gave it to me.

Please go ahead, Jesse.

I think it's important to remind listeners.

that what I think we said on that program, and I hope we were clear enough,

is that you should give generously relative to your means, your ability to give.

There are many ways to give generously.

And

the couple being married, or for that matter, thruple or quadruple.

Sure.

Or the single person being married.

I don't know if that's a thing, but maybe it is.

Absolutely.

I'm sure it is.

I am absolutely certain it is.

Hey, if you've married yourself any time in history, please write and let us know because I'm sure that it's a thing.

And I mean that sincerely.

We're not going to make fun of you.

I'm curious about it.

But go on, Jesse, if you are marrying yourself or another.

They will be grateful to receive a generous gift from you, whether that generous gift is thousands of dollars from a rich uncle, $20

from someone who doesn't have much financial means, or just a thoughtful note in a card.

A generous gift can mean many different things,

but what you don't want to have is have it be a a year later, or in the case of my friend John Hodgman, 12 years later.

And you're looking back and wishing that you had been more generous.

Right.

Making some adjustments to my mid-tier gift.

Kicking it down to entry level.

No, no, no.

It's still solid lower mid.

Okay, good.

I just want it to be, I want, you know what?

I'm bumping it up to top tier, tier, but I got to pick something that's going to be totally smashed when your delivery person tosses it over the fence.

Oh, no.

That way I'm not.

The precious hummels that I asked for.

My hummels figurines.

No, I'm not.

That's my message to lotion hands.

You got tickled hard.

It's not time for revenge.

It's time to move on.

Jesse, I will not take revenge by sending you something expensive that you would like that will get smashed as soon as it's tossed over the fence.

I will make sure that you and Teresa get something that expresses my love and affection generously for both of you.

The docket is clear.

That's the thing.

Eventually, eventually, eventually.

No timeframe on it.

That's it for another episode of Judge John Hodgman.

This week's episode edited by Valerie Moffat.

By the way, John, Val Moffat has been streaming, producing live stream video of Jordan Jesse Go recordings on Sunday nights, Pacific time.

Ooh, what fun.

Yeah, if you want to watch us goof around on Jordan Jesse Go, we've been doing it around Sunday night at eight.

No promises, still in beta.

Right.

But like Jordan Jesse Go on Facebook, watch us goof around with David Bore or whatever.

That sounds like fun.

Where do I go to watch it?

Right there on Facebook, Jordan Jesse Go.

What a hoot and a holler that is.

I'll check it out.

I love hanging out with you guys.

It's the next best thing to being with you under a tarp in the UC Santa Cruz campus.

Our producer, the great Jennifer Marmor, wearing some signature eyewear this week.

Looks great, Jen.

Follow us on Twitter at

Thorn and Ann Hodgman.

Your mom hates them?

Yeah.

Wow.

I just turned around big time on Carol Marmer.

I was a big fan before.

I've turned against her because I support these eyeglasses.

She said that they hide my beautiful punim.

What can I say?

Jennifer Marmer, I just realized I missed a huge opportunity.

As soon as we were talking about you answering the door, I should have ordered flowers delivered directly to your house and just to see what would happen during the recording.

That would have been exciting.

So let's just pretend that that happened.

It was wonderful.

Thank you.

Beautiful flowers, right?

Follow us on Twitter at Jesse Thorne and at Hodgman.

And hey, why not follow Jen at JMarms?

Don't follow Carol Marmer, but you know what?

If you need a commercial real estate agent in the Los Angeles area, you could do a lot worse than Carol Marmer.

We're on Instagram at

the same time.

But you

what you're saying.

She's sort of mid-tier.

Mid-tier?

Mid-tier.

Yeah.

Make sure to hashtag your Judge John Hodgman tweets, hashtag JJ H.O.

And check out the maximum fund subreddit at maximumfund.reddit.com to discuss this episode.

Submit your cases at maximumfund.org slash jjho or email hodgman at maximumfund.org.

We will talk to you next time on the judge John Hodgman podcast.

Surprise, everybody.

It's your Judge John Hodgman here on the other side of the credits with yet another completely out-of-the-blue,

jaw-droppingly surprising post-credits sequence that you did not see coming.

Or maybe you did, because as you know, I've been featuring here after the credits some of the songs that listeners sent in based on my songwriting prompt, Write a Song

recounting the life and times of Gary Gygax, the creator creator of Dungeons and Dragons, incorporating his defection from that company just as things were really blowing up for DD in the style of the band Phish, while also mentioning telepathic Bigfoots.

It was a simple song prompt.

Many of you came through,

often nailing one or two or three of those requests, but all of you being really, really fun and interesting in your interpretation of the song called Gygax Departs, this fourth and final installment.

And I do mean final.

You don't need to write the Guy Gax song anymore.

Don't send them to me.

This is it.

This one comes to you from Christopher,

who wrote the lyrics, and his old college roommate Peter, who wrote the music.

He says, I think we hit all the requirements, emulating fish and working in the Bigfoot line, and I'm proud of what we came up with.

I'd love to share this with the other listeners.

Guess what, Christopher and Peter?

Your love-to-share wish now comes true.

Here it is.

Guy Gax departs.

But things got weird.

I kissed a dwarf, ran my fingers through her beard.

It It wasn't just D,

it always meant a little more to me.

He was salified weed and cocaine.

He was down with the satanic and profane.

But when we ask him how an pork's life starts, that's when Gygax departs.

He was the first dungeon master.

He led us in and out of every disaster

He made candles fly around the castle

And he didn't care when we thought it was a Bigfoot hassle We got on his last nerve When we introduced Dave The rogue half-link perf.

Now we pour out some dew for RGM

We rolled a one and no more will we see him

He was up pipe weed and cocaine.

And he was down to satanic and profane.

But when we start throwing cobals like jars, that's when Gygax departs.

And when we joke about a Minotaur's parts, that's when Gygax departs.

And though he's left us with a hole in our hearts, that's when Gygax departs.

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