Too Many Cooks Spoil the Borth

Welcome to the Judge John Hodgman Podcast.

I'm Bailiff Jesse Thorne.

This week, we're clearing the docket.

How are you, Judge Hodgman?

I'm very good, but you know what, Jesse?

I feel like we got to give the docket something special this week.

I agree.

I feel like just the two of us is not enough.

Well, normally I enjoy it very much, but I just something about this week makes me want to take it up a level.

If only there were a special guest who could sit in with us, but unfortunately, we can't have everything we want.

Goodbye.

It seems impossible.

I think we're just going to have to Bill Withers this thing, just the two of us.

Wait a minute.

What?

Who is that?

I can't see because I'm in New York, but I heard someone enter my courtroom.

Wait, sir.

Excuse me, sir.

Yes.

Are you comedian Kurt Brownauler?

Yes, I was just passing through.

I realize now that this is a dead end.

Yeah.

I mean, you're one of my favorite comedians.

Would you mind staying?

Oh, um,

you know, I have a little bit of time.

Sure, sure.

Is that okay with you, Judge Hodgman, if I invite comedian Kurt Brownauler to stay?

I would be thrilled.

Kurt, I am not only a fan, I dare say I'm a friend of Kurt Brownawler's, and I'm very happy to have you here.

And as you learned navigating the mouse maze that is maximum fun HQ, it all ends at a dead end in the studio.

That's how Jesse gets most of his guests.

Yeah.

It feels a little like a trap.

Well, I mean, there is cheese in here, so you got what you were promised.

Right.

Now slide down the door to entrap Kurt, and let's get this thing going.

Okay, of course, Kurt is here.

He's got a new special, a new album.

It's called Trust Me.

Just aired on Comedy Central, and you can grab it on the Comedy Central app, and it's cc.com.

You can also get it on Amazon and iTunes.

I got it on iTunes, personally, and I enjoyed it very much.

It was very, very funny.

And Kurt, you're a real human being, and I always enjoy that about your comedy.

Thank you.

I think that's a wonderful compliment.

Kurt, we're going to rely on your real humanity as we answer these questions on the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

The first comes from Vanessa.

I invited my friend Jessalyn over for a taco dinner.

When she arrived, the shell served was a tostada.

She says I deceived her.

I contend that other than folding the round corn dough in half, the ingredients are the same, refried beans, fresh guacamole, fresh salsa, and fresh cut cilantro.

I seek the court to order Jessalyn to no longer question the veracity of my dinner invitations and admit tostadas and tacos are interchangeable.

I also seek punitive damages of one homemade enchilada dinner.

Well, before I go in on my ruling, let me just say, Kurt, I don't presume that anyone ever listens to our podcast.

And maybe there's some new listeners.

Normally on the Judge John Hodgman podcast, we have people

call in with their actual disputes and we talk to them and we get a different somewhat of a different point of view from people in the world who might not have podcasts.

But every now and then, we clear the docket and we just take a bunch of cases as letters to us, thus returning this podcast to the root of all podcasts, a couple of white guys talking to each other.

And

in this case, a couple of white guys talking to each other about food.

I totally expect this podcast to go top of the charts because of this.

We're talking about food.

Judge Hodgman, we're not just white guys.

We're privileged coastal elite white guys.

That's true.

And I don't want to brag, but I am heterosexual.

So I've really

and an only child.

I've never had to share nothing in my life.

So I am perfectly in place to judge this small, small, small, petty, stakeless dispute.

But before I do, Jesse Thorne, you are a man of the West.

Kurt, you live in the West.

I'm constantly being reminded that we in the East have no idea of what a taco really is.

Do you have an opinion on this, Jesse, as a person who is an aficionado of tacos, tostadas, tortas, chalupas, or whatever it is?

Judge Hodgman, we started this recording five minutes late.

I'm not going to go ahead and tell you what I was throwing into my mouth, but let's just say it torn't a burrito.

Okay.

Suffice it to say, torn a burrito.

Well, here's the thing.

Can you define the difference between a taco and a tostada for just a dumb New Englander like me?

By the way, I'm from New England.

Yeah, a tostada is a thing with a hard-fried shell and a base of, it usually has a base of beans, not always, I think, but it usually has a base of beans and is

round and flat.

Kurt, some have said that you have a base of beans.

What do you think?

Is a tostada significantly different enough from a taco?

that Vanessa has a right to complain?

I think it comes down to respect.

You know, I think that this is an issue of respect.

And if these two items, a taco and a tostada, have been named differently, purposefully named differently from the creators of the cuisine, then there is a difference in mouthfeel.

There is a difference in approach to eating.

There is a difference in simple shape and size.

So I would say that, yes, there is a significant difference.

And if you invite someone to a taco dinner dinner and are served tostadas, it is grounds for refusal to eat.

However, they still would be delicious.

Yeah, tostada, I'll also mention sometimes it has that thing where it's like scalloped edges made into a sort of bowl.

Like a flat heller plate.

Yeah, as with tortilla chips, these are all things that you do with tortillas

when making them into tacos is no longer palatable.

It's sort of like when you use

stale bread to make toast or bread crumbs or croutons.

Or French toast, pimper du.

Exactly.

The tostata is the pamperdieu of the taco.

Now, here's my concern.

So my initial feeling is,

yes, Jesslyn

has a reason to object here.

She was not served tacos.

No.

However, my secondary concern is that Vanessa defines tacos as a thing with refried beans, guacamole, salsa, and cilantro, which is not what is in a taco.

Tacos have meat in them and not beans.

I mean there are types of tacos that exist that have beans in them, but tacos are a very simple food, which is fresh tortillas, meat, salsa, and onions and cilantro, a little lime, whatever.

I think we can stipulate that Vanessa has no idea what a taco is.

Yeah, that seems very clear.

She's serving tostadas and calling them tacos.

And they are different, as you point out.

She's probably only eating taco bowls at the Trump building.

And also, I feel like if you showed up at her house and she said, come on over for hot dog night, and then she had cut the hot dog up into tiny pieces and put it on white bread and made a sandwich out of it, and you would say, This is not a hot dog.

This is bunches of meat on a sandwich bun.

You've served me franken beans

on hot dog night.

Yeah.

But what you describe, Kurt, would be a sandwich.

It would be a sandwich.

However, a hot dog is not a sandwich

as we know.

Thank you, Kurt Browneller.

And here is what a taco and a tostada have in common.

Neither of them are sandwiches, but they share some foodie DNA.

They are different.

As Jesse pointed out, a tostada exists to make use of tortillas that are no longer fresh.

You fry it into a stiff platter.

And why is this distinction important?

And particularly in a social context?

Well, Kurt, you pointed it out.

Tostadas are harder to eat.

Tacos, you pick it up and you shove it in your maw.

Tostada, if you're going to eat it with your hands, it's like eating a 45 LP.

Not even a 7-inch.

45.

Yeah, that base of beans isn't going to help get it down your throat.

It's going to hurt and it's going to be messy and whatever.

And therefore, it's unwise to serve one to a guest because...

They might not have a spindle adapter.

Yeah, exactly.

Jesslyn didn't have time to prepare.

If she knew she was coming home for tostadas, she might be wearing a plastic jumpsuit or a poncho.

And instead, she's going to get mess all over her clothes, and it's your fault, Vanessa.

I will not order in your favor.

I will order in Jessalyn's favor.

I will, however, honor at least a little bit of your request.

I do order the punitive damages that you asked for of a homemade enchilada dinner.

Jessalyn should serve you a homemade enchilada dinner and call it enchiladas, but actually, it's Beep Wellington, just despite you.

Here is something from Caitlin: My sister Megan refuses to take my book recommendations.

She says I've consistently ignored hers.

My argument has been, her favorite books are dense.

They're mostly books about war and nonfiction.

The books I've recommended have widespread appeal.

Examples include Bleak House, the Executioner's Song, and Raven, a biography of Jim Jones.

Widespread appeal.

Our cultural exchange hasn't all been one-sided, though.

I've watched far more of her movies and TV shows.

Even though she's much younger, her taste in movies has had a profound effect on mine.

I seek a judgment declaring that all recommendations should be lumped together.

She claims books can only be weighed against books, movies against movies, and so forth.

Well, Kurt Brownoller, as guest of this court, did you understand any of that?

I think it's a little confusing because the issue at hand is that she reads less of her sister's book recommendations because they're dense.

That's the issue at hand.

However, what she's asking us for is she's seeking that books and movies be lumped together, which strikes at the heart of, I think, a lot of us.

That seems crazy.

Caitlin wants to say, I take a lot of your movie recommendations, so I don't have to take a lot of your book recommendations because they're boring.

We're even Stephen.

Okay, so the question is, are all recommendations to be taken as a whole if you're going to be saying I should take about as many of yours as you take of mine?

Or should it be within each category?

So I have to take about as many book recommendations as you take from me, and so on and so forth.

I feel like because of the level of commitment to a movie and the level of commitment to a dense non-fiction book are vastly different, they cannot be equal.

As soon as she said that this biography of Jim Jones had widespread appeal, I checked out.

Also, that that means that if those are the widespread appeal books, the books she's not reading are really intense.

Hey, Caitlin, I have not drunk the Kool-Aid.

Thank you very much.

It's a story about mass murder.

Not just mass murder, child murder, too.

Yeah.

Yes.

True.

Is a book more of a commitment if it's a light page-turning crowd pleaser like Raven, a biography of Jim Jones?

John, you have to include child murder if you want to hit all four quadrants.

Well, I will say this.

I am totally going to read Raven a biography of Jim Jones, if I can manage it.

It's a horrible, horrible, terrible story.

And

certainly very dark.

And she also loves the executioner's song and

a little bit on the nose, Bleak House.

I would read a biography called Ballin of Jim Jones from the dipset.

Fair enough.

But I think it's fair to say that Caitlin has her own peculiar taste in books.

So she shouldn't be throwing stones at the glass glasshouse of her sister's taste in war stories and dense nonfiction.

I think what this really circles around is the idea, is a recommendation an obligation?

Is there a debt?

If you give someone a recommendation of a book and you ask them to read something, are they suddenly in debt to you?

And I would say, absolutely not, ever, ever, ever.

No.

Just because someone has an idea doesn't mean that you have homework now.

That's terrible.

People have their own time to manage.

And I'm sorry, I love Caitlin that you want to engage in cultural fun with your sis, but don't give her a bunch of homework.

If she doesn't want to read that book, don't do it.

And if you're not reading the books that she's recommending, how dare you?

How dare you, Caitlin?

And then to lump movies with books, as Kurt Brown points out.

I mean, it's apples and oranges.

Yes, they're both two pieces of delicious hand fruit of about the same size.

Well, then I guess that's where that comparison breaks down.

The point is,

what you got to do, Caitlin, is get the guilt and feeling of obligation out of this relationship and simply talk to your sister.

And you both choose

some book neither of you have read and you read it together, like a book club, sister's book club.

That's something that should have been obvious from the beginning.

And the fact that you missed that, Caitlin, means you really need my help and now you have it.

Judge?

Yes.

I have something that might help them if they think about this recommendation of a a book in terms of the relationship you have with a book.

And I think when you read a book, you have a relationship with that book.

So that is a lot like saying that if you have to read a recommended book, it's a lot like saying you have to long-term date someone, someone set you up on a blind date with.

Yeah.

Which is ludicrous.

And you're only setting yourself up for disappointment.

Because if we're to carry out your metaphor a little bit further,

let's say, you know who I love Kurt, my wife, She's the greatest.

You should be married to her for a while.

Try it out.

Now, you guys might have a terrific time, but your relationship to my wife is never going to be the same as my relationship to my wife.

And I'm like, what's wrong with you?

Why don't you love my wife the same way I do?

And then you're like, because I'm a normal human.

I'm not a bigamist.

That said, I will say this.

I recommend to every single person who is listening right now,

and this is a binding recommendation, the book Vacation Land by John Hodgman, due out in October.

Oh, that's very nice of you.

And I appreciate that plug very much.

But I can't make that be the first book in Sisters Book Club because I'm still writing it.

They can't wait that long.

Kurt, you got a book you love?

A book I love right now?

Yeah.

That you're going to force on Caitlin and her sister?

This is an easy one, and they probably have already read it.

But What We Talk About When We Talk About Love by Raymond Carver, Book of Short Stories.

Great book.

Great book.

Easy to read.

Short.

And if I remember correctly, it does involve at least one child's death.

There is one story.

It's a very sad book.

The one where Lyle Lovett is the baker in the movie.

It's very sad.

And so Caitlin will like it.

If she likes Jim Jones' stories, she'll like

this dark and wonderful book by Raymond Carver, what we talk about, what we talk about, love.

It's easy to read.

It's a book of short stories.

And what about a movie, Jesse Thorne?

You're going to give them a movie.

I'm giving them a movie.

Okay, I just saw John Wick 2.

Yeah.

John Wick 2.

I did not see John Wick 1.

What?

I don't get out to the movies very much, but I'm on paternity leave right now.

And we just reached the point where our lives were stable enough that I didn't have to be like

preventing our baby's death.

How much is that?

Where it's like four weeks in.

Okay, my wife is due any moment.

Yeah, this is our third child, though, so that is an extra complicating factor.

So I had spent several weeks with every waking moment of my life dedicated to cooking, cleaning, child care, usually those things plus child care at the same time and working all at once, despite being on leave.

And I had...

Is that why you didn't read all those books that I assigned to you?

And I realized I had a morning off, essentially, that I had no work appointments and my wife didn't need me for a few hours.

And she literally said to me, I do not need you for a few hours.

Leave.

So I went to see John Wick 2, the story of Keanu Reeves, a high cheekbone cipher

who goes through the world murdering various people in spectacular fashion, just beautiful and compelling fashion for no discernible reason.

They just say what the reason is very briefly, but it is otherwise completely discarded.

And it is one of the most enjoyable movies I've seen in several years.

There's a part where Lawrence Fishburne, best known as Cowboy Curtis from Pee Wee's Playhouse, comes in and just hams it up in the most wonderful way, like completely compelling hammy performance that is not camp at all.

It's just grand.

And so many beautiful set pieces of people doing karate shooting.

I loved it.

I like genuinely loved it.

And the nice part about it is that, unlike a lot of other movies that have like really big, compelling set pieces, but not much else to say for them, they have excised all the dumb parts.

So while there is very little reason for the things to be happening, there is not an extended sequence, dumb sequence, where they're explaining why the things happen.

Like there is in like Fast and the Furious 5, which I saw, which also had a lot of cool stuff happen in it.

But then there were like four scenes where you just want to put your face through the screen because it's so dumb.

They've just transformed those into one sentence.

Well, we know that Caitlin loves murder and that Megan loves war.

So John Wick, by the way, official title John Wick, Chapter 2, is first movie in Sisters Movie Club.

And what we talk about when we talk about love is first book in Sisters Book Club.

You guys got to do that.

Now, if you had not said John Wick 2, I would have recommended, but there is no obligation.

I went on a date with my wife to see Get Out.

the new awesome movie by Jordan Peel, which I will not spoil for you.

You probably have figured it out already, but it's fantastic.

And my recommendation for both Megan and Caitlin is that they go to see Get Out with My Wife, just like I did on Saturday.

It will be magical.

The docket's only partially clear.

We'll come back and finish what we started in just a minute.

You're listening to Judge John Hodgman.

I'm Bailiff Jesse Thorne.

Of course, the Judge John Hodgman podcast, always brought to you by you, the members of maximumfun.org.

Thanks to everybody who's gone to maximumfun.org/slash join.

And you can join them by going to maximumfun.org/slash join.

The Judge John Hodgman podcast is also brought to you this week by Quince.

Jesse, the reviews are in.

My new super soft hoodie from Quince that I got at the beginning of the summer is indeed super soft.

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Here's something from I'll say Shin, X-I-N.

I'm sensitive to caffeine and avoid coffee in the afternoon.

The other day, an overworked colleague and I argued about the merits and detriments of an afternoon coffee break.

He'd rather suffer insomnia than slog through afternoon drudgery.

I think that this risks health and happiness, since sleep contributes to both.

He says, I'm an old fogey who can't deal with sleep loss and am risking professional success by losing out on afternoon productivity.

Who's right?

I'd like damages awarded, please.

Okay, first of all, I'm just going to plug the warm drink that I'm drinking right now.

I love coffee and I'll drink it all day long.

But after the election, I put on 10 pounds because I did not give a hoot about anything for a while.

So now I'm trying to slim down again.

That's right.

This is some lifestyle talk for you guys.

What I'm doing, what gets me through the day without stuffing my face all day long,

I get, and I'm going to buzz market this brand because it's good.

Kitchen basics brand, chicken stock, beef stock, or vegetable stock if you're a vegetarian.

First of all, it's the only kind you should have in your pantry.

All the rest are terrible.

Sorry, Pacific, whatever, you're terrible.

And then I put that into a mug, right?

And then I microwave that for two minutes.

Right now I'm doing the chicken.

And then I add some chili and garlic paste from the ethnic foods aisle at your grocery store, Thai chili and garlic paste, basically sriracha flavor, and some soy sauce and some black pepper.

And forget it.

That is the greatest afternoon drink of all time.

I'm almost crying.

I'm so excited about it.

Did I gross you guys out with that recipe?

You're just drinking hot.

broth at home to not eat food.

Hot broth at home to not eat food?

Later on, I'm going to have a delicious and guilt-free,

healthy dinner.

But in the afternoon, to get through those hungry times, instead of what I was doing over the winter, which is just shoving slices of white American cheese in my dumb mouth, I'm drinking some healthy bone broth.

I can't even hear the word broth without thinking of a shirt that my Jordan Jesse Go co-host Jordan once saw

that said,

it was like one of these shirts from a non-English-speaking country that features an English phrase, and it said, too many cooks spoil the borth.

I think we have a title for this episode.

Anyway, down to this ridiculous thing about coffee.

If this is an intellectual debate about whether coffee is appropriate or not, I feel like, Jinn, you are wasting my time.

But if you literally want me to order your coworker not to drink coffee just because you have a problem with it, well, then you're also wrong again.

You need to recognize other people have agency over their own bodies.

Why just let your guy drink whatever he wants in the afternoon, whether it's coffee or bone broth or, well, probably not blood.

That would be bad.

You guys disagree with me on that one, Kurt.

How do you feel about coffee?

I agree with you.

Right.

Simple as that.

Yeah, I think that there is nothing to be done about the caffeine habits or absence of others.

Yeah.

Like, trying to mess with that is a fool's game.

My wife is a coffee enthusiast, and I don't drink any caffeine at all, generally speaking, although I have had a cola today.

But

I don't drink it because it contributes to my migraine headaches and I just never drank coffee, so I never got on that train.

But

I would never deign to try and mess with my wife's caffeine habit.

It's a fool's errand.

You're going to touch the third rail.

Why do it?

And it goes the other way, too, because not only is Jin

trying to get me to force her coworker to not drink coffee in the afternoon, her coworker is casting aspersions at Jin.

Now, first of all, I don't know that.

Have we established that Jin is a woman or a man?

No, we have not established that, nor have we established a consistent pronunciation of that name.

We apologize, Shin.

All right.

Or Jin.

Look, we all live on a spectrum, and that goes for name pronunciation as well.

I apologize for mispronouncing your name at least two times.

If you write in and let me know what the answer is to both how you identify in terms of gender and how you would like me to pronounce your name, I will correct the record in a future episode.

But for now, I will say it goes both ways because not only is Jin trying to control his or her coworker, but the coworker is throwing shade at Jin, saying that Jin, he or she is an old fogey who can't deal with sleep loss.

And this kind of banter just makes me say, why don't you guys just

kiss and get it over with?

Yeah, a real Sam and Diane situation.

Yeah.

One of you is going to have coffee breath, and the other one's going to have delicious chicken broth breath.

My co-worker, a former relief pitcher for the Boston Red Sox,

he's very handsome.

Here's something from Jason.

I'd like to bring a case against Judge John Hodgman.

Uh-oh.

Oh, my goodness.

Wow.

Whew.

Somebody's attacking the independent judiciary.

In episode 300, Rogue Hate Court, the judge failed to mention Connecticut as one of the six states in New England.

I find this surprising as the judge both worked and attended university here

at the University of Connecticut.

Connecticut University at Ohio, it was technically called.

The Constitution state is fortunate enough to belong to both the tri-state area and the group of states that make up New England.

If I win this case, I ask the judge judge make a formal apology and admit Connecticut is the greatest state in New England.

That is a bold request.

It is exceedingly bold.

And I will say that Jason was not, believe me, the only person to notice that I did not mention Connecticut in the list of New England states and Commonwealth.

I am deeply, deeply embarrassed, but you guys know it was just a mistake, right?

I mean, how many times have I talked about the Hartford Whalers on this podcast?

How many times have have I talked about Peter Good, the designer of the Hartford Whalers logo?

How many times have I talked about Pepe Pizza in New Haven and that time that I saw Public Enemy in 1991 at Toad's Place in New Haven?

I thought it was so cool, but I was overlooking the fact that I was seeing Public Enemy when I was attending Yale University.

It's not the coolest.

I love Connecticut.

My best friend, Jonathan Colton, guess where he's from?

Connecticut.

He's a full-on nutmeger.

That's why you call someone from Connecticut.

These are things I know.

Nutmeg State.

Did you know that, Kurt?

No, I did not.

Yep, nutmeg state.

I knew it as the Constitution state.

Yeah.

Well,

it's a half the state goes for Constitution, half the state goes for nutmeg.

It's a big fight.

I'm making that up, but it's a joke that I could only make up having deep understanding of the state mottos of Connecticut.

Now,

do I feel a fool?

Of course.

Do I apologize?

Very, very deeply, and I am very sorry.

Am I now cornered into saying that Connecticut is the greatest state of New England?

Hell no.

And you wouldn't even try that if you didn't know on some level that that was that Connecticut is a fine, fine, fine state.

But that's about all we're going to say about it.

I would go further and say Connecticut's the worst state of New England.

How dare you?

I'm so sorry, but that is my feeling.

Kurt, Connecticut's the worst state.

Do you have a ranking of New England states in Commonwealth?

Yes, I do.

And it is, there is a competition currently for the worst state.

And I will tell you who's in competition right now.

Please.

New Hampshire, Connecticut, and Providence, or Rhode Island.

Rhode Island.

Yeah.

So those are in competition, and they shift from the bottom often.

But I would say Connecticut is my worst right now.

Top,

I'm going to have to go.

Top is Massachusetts.

Second is Maine.

And do we have any more?

It's Vermont.

Oh, Massachusetts, Vermont, Maine.

Vermont, the ice cream state.

Oh, no.

Massachusetts, Vermont, Maine.

Then New Hampshire.

New Hampshire.

You know what?

As I rank them, Rhode Island's now at the bottom.

Now Rhode Island's the worst.

It's a constantly shifting ranking.

It is like the sands of the Sahara.

It constantly evolves, but is always what it is.

All right.

There you go, Connecticut.

You're not the worst, according to Kurt Ranal or A Man Who Knows.

Well, they're the worst again.

No!

Sorry.

This is like the stock market.

Yes.

There's many millions of little computers firing in my brain trying to.

I'm getting a ticker tape out of a telegraph machine that's updating me on the status of Connecticut, and it does not look good.

Connecticut's down.

Bye now.

Hey, great news.

When we come back in just a second on Judge John Hodgman, we've got a listener letter about nightmare gerbils that's coming up in just a minute on the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

I'm Emily Fleming.

I'm Jordan Morris.

And I'm Matt Lieb.

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And real cheapskates.

On every episode of our podcast, Free with Ads, we ask, why pay for expensive streaming services when you can get free movies from apps with weird names?

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Tune in every week as we take a deep dive into the internet's bargain bin.

Every Tuesday on maximumfun.org or your favorite podplays.

The Flop House is a podcast where we watch a bad movie and then we talk about it.

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He's just standing above the toilet with a heartbreak.

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Find it at maximumfun.org.

Welcome back to the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

This week, we're clearing the docket with our good friend Kurt Brownoller.

He's got a brand new special from Comedy Central.

You can get it on your Amazon, your iTunes, your CC.com, your Comedy Central app, and couldn't be more recommendable.

I saw, Kurt, by the way, that you dipped back into the skywriting well.

You're a real skywriting enthusiast.

Really, it was almost just a tip of the hat to the skywriting.

You ran a Kickstarter at one point to skywrite things.

Yes, I ran a Kickstarter so that we could write a joke in the sky, and we raised $6,000, and we wrote How Do I Land over Los Angeles.

It's a real good joke, Kurt.

Thank you.

Thank you.

It's a real good joke.

And that was also the name of your first album, if I remember correctly.

Yes, that is correct.

How do I land?

And now when you got the guy to write How Do I Land in Skywrighton over LA, and I followed this, but I don't think I ever learned.

Did he?

And I, again, I presume it was a he?

Yes.

And does he have a name that is easily pronounced?

No, I do.

I have it in email and I do not know it off the top.

We'll say it's Jin.

So when Jin the Skypilot was spelling out the How Do I Land,

was he doing it old style, like

scripting it out, or was it programmed into a thing and they pooped it out?

Do you know what I mean?

I can answer.

Yes, of course I know what you mean.

It was the former.

The latter is actually five planes flying in tandem next to each other that have digital printers, essentially, that they poop out.

And so then they do the

dot matrix in the sky.

It looks like dot matrix in the sky, and usually it will just repeat over and over and over again because they'll just fly sort of in a line and just keep saying the same thing.

No, the one I got is one, the sky pilot, as we refer to him, Jin, is he's one of four sky pilots in the United States who still does this type of skywriting, and it is the original skywriting.

He's a sky pilot.

Is he also a captain of tomorrow?

He is

a captain of tomorrow.

And so he does have to draw each arc of each letter independently.

And so what happens is that once the first letter is up and the second letter begins, the first letter begins to blow away.

So

it is a very difficult and time-consuming observation to figure out what it says.

But through the miracle of modern technology, we are able to photograph each letter and then put it together as if in a perfect windless world what the message would say.

He's one of four traditional skywriters left.

In the United States.

In the United States?

Mm-hmm.

You know what those guys should not do?

What?

Fly on a plane together.

Too dangerous.

They'd also be giving each other tips, you know, backseat flying the whole time.

Very long.

That's the worst backseat flying.

But that's the old news.

The new news is your new and your first Comedy Central special called Trust Me is now available anywhere you can go.

And ladies and gentlemen, if you don't know Kurt, you get to know Kurt.

He's an incredibly funny, decent guy.

He's co-hosted one of the greatest comedy shows in Los Angeles, if not the United States, hot tub for years and years.

How long have you been co-hosting that with the great Kristen Shawl?

12 years.

12 years.

You can't host the greatest comedy show in Los Angeles for 12 years without knowing someone about comedy.

This guy gets it.

You probably already know exactly who he is, but I'm urging you, in my full judicial voice, go to your computer or your video on demand service of your choice and get a look at this thing because Kurt's wonderful.

That's all.

I also want to mention before we get back into cases that Max FunCon and Max FunCon East tickets are on sale right now.

Max FunCon June 9th through 11th in Southern California.

Kurt, you came to Max FunCon one year, didn't you?

No, I want to come though.

I was actually on a cruise.

Max FunCon.

Oh, you were on BoatParty.biz.

I was just one of them.

Boatparty.biz.

So much fun.

We've got Max FunCon in Southern California coming up June 9th through 11th.

And then Labor Day weekend, September 1st through 3rd in the Poconos.

But get your tickets now at maxfuncon.com.

And if you just like want to know what it is, go to maxfuncon.com or just post about it like in the Reddit or in the Facebook group.

Someone will explain to you about it because I know it's a weird thing that's difficult to wrap your head around.

It's very strange.

Why do these strangers go into the woods to watch comedy shows and

engage in the physical act of intimacy?

The question answers itself.

John, you've got your own festival event coming up.

I do.

I am curating, once again the comedy stage at the Wilco Solid Sound Festival, where I believe I saw you once, Kurt, way back when.

Is that not so?

Many, many moons ago, yes.

That's right.

This year, the festival runs from the 22nd to the 24th of June at Mass Mocha, the great old electrical factory that's been turned into a large-scale installation art museum in western Massachusetts, specifically North Adams, Massachusetts.

Wilco does two big shows Friday night and Saturday night, and then there's music and art and fun and food all throughout the days in a really wonderful place that is dear to my heart, Western Massachusetts, which is in New England, Jesse.

It's the region that I'm from.

By the time this comes out, the lineup will have been announced, so I am safe in saying that if you come to see the comedy show, you're going to be seeing me,

Eugene Merman, Nick Offerman, Aparna Ncherla, Gene Gray and Quelly Chris doing the show show, and Michael Ian Black.

So it's fun.

It'll be fun.

One other thing I'll just talk about, if you want to hear more bone broth recipes from me, John Hodgmail,

and also get other details about what I'm doing and obsessed with, you might want to subscribe to my lifestyle newsletter that I started a little while ago.

Go to bit.ly slash Hodgmail, H-O-D-G-M-A-I-L, and more or less weekly, I'm going to send you a list of topics that I find interesting, including how to jerry-rig a bone broth that'll get you through the afternoon without losing your mind, and also not eating American cheese.

By the way,

I really like white American cheese, and you can only get it in Maine, it seems.

There you

Here is a follow-up.

So we played our live from Philadelphia episode recently, and we caught up with two of the litigants from episode 94, Bleached and Mounted Bones of Contention.

That was Nick and Sarah.

I sent them one of two nightmare gerbils.

These were unsolicited gifts that I received of terrifyingly disgusting

some kind of rodent creature that had been mounted barely competently for presentation with the barest competency.

They were definitely appeared to be animals, but no other determination could be made, and thus they were named nightmare gerbils after the way that my dad pronounces the word gerbil, and specifically the way he pronounced gerbil the time that he told me that he had stepped on my hamster.

I've stepped on your gerbil.

He sat me down.

He said,

Jesse,

last night I stepped on your gerbil.

Anyway, these things were very poorly mounted, and we discovered that that nightmare gerbil, which we had sent to Nick and Sarah, had lost almost all of its fur,

which made it even more terrifying.

We had also sent away one other nightmare gerbil to the winner of an essay contest as to who deserved it most, slash least.

And the winner was named Shaylin.

She wrote in with a story of her own.

She says, I'm sorry to say my gerbil met an even more violent end.

A month after receiving it, our usually well-behaved dog broke into the curiosity cabinet and consumed it entirely, leaving only the tail and wire armature.

The dog was fine after an $800 x-ray.

To console myself, I placed the surviving tail in a bell jar, which is now prominently displayed on our mantelpiece.

Well, I commend you for your bad judgment in items to display in your home.

Shaylin, I'm very grateful to you for that.

And it's nice to know that the dog did not eat out of your curiosity cabinet that piece of the shroud of Turin that you have.

I like the fact that the normally well-behaved dog just sensed, that thing's got to go.

Even if it kills me, I'm going to eat that gerbil.

And also, he even got into the curiosity cabinet.

I appreciate the dog's get up and go, his moxie, if you will.

Oh, he's a very curious dog.

He saw something that needed to be done.

He opened a curiosity cabinet and he destroyed the nightmare gerbil.

Yeah, that's really true.

This is like the John Wick of dogs

getting it done.

For no reason.

For no reason.

Shalen sent us a picture of the tail in the jar.

It's almost as terrifying as the gerbil itself was.

And we will be posting it on our website at maximumfund.org.

Just click on Judge John Hodgman.

Our thanks to Shaylin for sharing that follow-up.

If you have a case for Judge John Hodgman, go to maximumfund.org slash JJ Ho.

That's maximumfund.org slash JJ Ho.

Our show produced by Jennifer Marmor, our guest this week, the great Kurt Brownaller.

Thank you for having me, both of you.

Kurt Brownawler, of course, has a new stand-up comedy special on Comedy Central, which you can download to buy from iTunes or Amazon or get from Comedy Central's various websites and apps.

He also has a podcasting empire of his own.

I have a new podcast coming out with my wife called Wedlock.

It's going to be on Audible.

It's all about relationships.

And I have a podcast with Joe DeRosa over at Feral Audio called Emotional Hangs, which is about adult friendships.

I'd love to have you on, both of you.

And it's all about adult friendships and getting vulnerable with each other.

I just came over from Feral Audio in Burbank, California, where I recorded an episode of Everything's Coming Up Simpsons, a very fun Simpsons recap podcast, a tip of the hat to our friends over there at Feral Audio.

John, thank you for another great Judge John Hodgman episode.

What a weird thing for me to say to you.

We're going to have to break that down on Kurt's new adult friendship podcast.

Yeah, it sounds like you guys are pretty good friends.

I'm just sitting over here in Brooklyn by myself.

Well, everybody, we got to get Kurt off to a late-night television appearance.

We'll talk to you next time on the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

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