Blind Justice

Welcome to the Judge John Hodgman Podcast.

I'm Summertime Funtime guest bailiff Monty Belmonte from WRSI 939 the River in Northampton, Massachusetts.

One last time, I guess.

It's the last day of summer.

And yes, that was a Hamilton reference.

Yes, indeed, Monty.

This is September 21st, broadcast date, recording date, September 2nd.

It is indeed almost the end of Summertime Funtime.

This is the very last episode this year of the Judge Sean Hodgman podcast that I will be recording here in WERU 89.9 in Blue Hill with

summertime intense guest engineer Joel Mann.

Hi, Joel.

Hi, John.

Oh, my God, Joel.

Wow.

You have to clear your throat.

And we are clearing the docket.

Blind justice style.

Yeah, blind justice style because

my internet is so compromised up here that I did not even see this thing until I I got to WERU, and I haven't had time to read it.

And Monty also just received the docket, so we don't know what the cases are.

And so we're going to be, we're waiting in.

I've not even had a chance to even think about any of these.

It's going to be blind justice.

It's going to be snap judgment.

And it's just going to be freestyle end of summertime fling.

Blowout.

Love it.

And Joel, you're going to weigh in too.

Okay, I'm ready.

All right.

Patrick writes,

it is the summer and very humid in Kansas City, so I frequently walk around my second-story apartment in no clothing to be more comfortable.

My wife, Paige, frequently becomes upset due to lights being on and curtains slightly open, which she says makes it so neighbors who may be walking their dogs see me as I live more comfortably.

I believe that, due to the fact that I live on a second story,

any person who sees me has to make an active choice to look into my windows and should not be surprised to see a person exposing privates in their private home.

Should my wife stop asking me to put on clothes when it's so hot and sticky, or should I be more considerate of any possible passers-by/slash peeping toms?

All right.

Summertime, fun time, guest bailiff, Monty Belmonte.

I have an opinion on this.

What is your opinion?

Go.

I think I hate nudity, and I fear my own nudity, probably because my mother referred to nudity as shamy all growing up.

So my vote is

like a never nude from arrested development.

And yes, don't be nude in front of your windows.

Although I appreciate other nude people.

Well, sure.

I mean, maybe maybe you should go to Kansas City and appreciate this dude.

Yes, I will.

Your mother called it Shamie?

Shamie.

And it didn't even dawn on me until I was in my 20s.

She called nudity Shamie?

Nudity was referred to as Shamie.

Oh, they're running around Shamie.

Catholic, you know.

Yeah, I do know.

My family's Catholic.

I never heard that.

I mean,

we weren't a bunch of free-lover nudists or nothing.

But still.

Anytime that you can guilt somebody, I just think that that that goes along with the territory of growing up Catholic in Boston.

Yeah, well, I don't know.

We've lived parallel lives in a lot of ways, but not in that one.

I mean, we never used the term shaming, let me put it that way.

Nor did we walk around in the nude in our home.

But then again, I never grew up in Kansas City, where I have heard things are up-to-date and awfully hot.

It gets hot in Kansas City.

I was there.

I was there for the big slick charity event that Paul Rudd and Rob Reggle and Jason Sadegas run every year and raise a lot of money for the children's hospital there.

It's a lot of fun.

And that was in June, and that was plenty hot.

And I'll tell you something, I wouldn't have minded a nude event.

I think this guy should be allowed to,

a guy should be allowed to do what he wants in his home.

He shouldn't be walking out onto the sidewalk this way or going out and getting the paper or what have you.

That's a thing that we used to have, papers being delivered to your door.

But if he's an upstairs and wants to walk around in the nude, whether that is to beat the heat or have some excitement in his life or just walk from the shower to his bedroom,

it's none of anyone's business what they see.

If they're looking into windows, they take their chances.

They might see some stuff.

So don't look in people's windows

is the way I take it.

And I'm sorry that his wife doesn't like his nude body.

It's a little weird walking around in the full nude, not even in underwear.

I don't even see how that, to me, that seems hotter and stickier than anything else.

But

I'm not going to begrudge a guy's habit.

So I take the opposite position.

And though I am usually the arbiter of right and wrong on this podcast, because this is the last time I'm going to see you for a while, Joel, I'm going to throw this to you.

Who's right, me or Monty?

I have to go with Monty.

It's his wife who doesn't like it.

His wife doesn't like it.

He's got to respect his wife's wishes.

Wife doesn't like his shamie.

Sorry about that, Kansas City.

Patrick,

put on a robe.

All right.

Joel ruled on that one.

Joel rules.

Joel, all right, let's move on to the next one.

You know what?

I'm going to read.

I never get to read these, so I'm going to read this one to you again.

This is totally blind.

I've never, I don't even know what this is.

Mike writes, what is the proper order of operations for sports fandom, and how does it apply to the legal precedent of liking what one likes?

My God,

that is a big wall of text.

Let's see if we can get through it.

Each year, my

sports fan, obviously.

You like sports, Joel?

Sort of.

Yeah, that's right.

Joe Bird and the Field Hippies.

What league did they play in?

American.

American.

American,

was it the American Mind-Altering League?

Their first album was United States of America.

They were a good team.

Each year, my wife and I alternate enjoying the U.S.

Thanksgiving holiday.

All right.

You know what you got?

Here, I'm going to...

Mike, listen to me.

First of all,

I know that it sounds like I say a lot of words, and probably I do when I don't need to say as many as I should.

I'm up here in the land of E.B.

White, and that sentence was terrible.

What I just said was terrible.

It was, don't use too many words.

Just because I get away with it doesn't mean you should do it.

Each year, my wife and I alternate enjoying Thanksgiving

at either our home in Iowa City, Iowa, great town, or my mother's home in Lincoln, Nebraska, terrible town.

Sorry, Lincoln.

Never been.

Where we also are also able to attend the now annual, or you should say, where we also attend the now annual football game between the University of Nebraska and the University of Iowa.

My father-in-law is a devoted Oklahoma fan.

He recently moved to Des Moines, and we are happy to have him and his wife join us in the fall.

He's already made it clear that as a new resident in Iowa, he will be cheering for the home team at the game instead of deferring to his hosts.

I can't understand any of this.

What?

I think I get it.

What is it?

What is it?

So his father-in-law is coming over, and he's going to going to root for the home team instead of the team that he rooted for all along?

It's either that or the opposite.

He's coming to Iowa and he's going to root for Iowa or he's going to root for Nebraska.

He's going to root for Iowa even though his son-in-law's favorite team is Nebraska.

Got it.

Because Iowa's a home team.

I seek a clarification.

There's no wonder Jesse Thorne does this and not me.

I seek a clarification to the J.J.

Ho internet legal precedent that one likes what he or she likes.

Does one who likes what he likes simply because it is in direct contrast with what another likes get to lord that like over the other person?

Or is that just being a doofus?

Mm-hmm.

In a practical sense, oh, this is a relief.

I seek an order that my father-in-law must wear Nebraska colors and cheer for my team or remain neutral in both dress and signs of support as he doesn't really have any skin in the game, as it were.

In fact, the order of operations for sports fandom would suggest that he cheer for Nebraska whenever they're not competing against his beloved Oklahoma sooners.

What?

I don't care what you think, Mike.

Let your father-in-law do whatever he wants.

If you want to still like Nebraska,

yeah.

People like what they like.

And what you're asking me is, like, it seems like he's liking what he likes just to get under my skin.

Maybe he likes that.

Maybe that's what he likes.

So I'm going to let him like it.

Because frankly, you got under my skin and I'm looking for a little weird father-in-law revenge.

So go Nebraska.

No, go Iowa.

Go Iowa.

Go Hawkeyes.

Hawkeyes, right?

Iowa City is Hawkeyes.

I guess so.

I don't follow college sports at all.

Okay, Monty, do you take a different position?

Nope.

Same position.

That's the correct position, I believe.

Okay, Joel?

Let him root for whoever he wants to root for.

Yeah.

I mean, really.

This is literally a tribunal, and we all say, you're wrong, Mike.

I'm a Red Sox fan, and if I went to New York City because my son-in-law or somebody I loved lived there, I would not wear Yankees.

You could not pay me, well, if I was in a film or something, maybe, to wear Yankees paraphernalia.

I just don't do it, no matter where I go.

Right.

But that

I like what I like no matter who the other person is.

Yeah.

Yeah.

You're just stumping for the Red Sox.

There's not even a parallel to this.

You're just going to Iowa City and rooting for Iowa City.

Oh, yeah, that's right.

I thought that Nebraska.

He's his home team.

That's right.

He's doing the opposite.

Okay, I forget it then.

I don't know.

I don't even know what I think.

It was confusing because I read it bad and Mike wrote it bad.

Both sides are to blame.

We both have got to read our Strunken White.

Go ahead.

You read the next one, Monty.

Josh writes, A colleague accused me of stealing mustard out of the break room refrigerator at work.

While I did not purchase the mustard, I submit that condiments, especially inexpensive ones in large containers, are fair game in a communal fridge.

Anything that dispenses from a spout is meant to be shared.

Am I right?

Well,

Monty, I have an opinion,

and that is, how does Josh know that

the person who bought the mustard isn't using that spout to squirt it directly into their mouth?

Maybe they're using that as a must as a mustard nipple.

In which case, that would not be a shareable item

but i would say generally speaking

you start saying that you can't use my mustard you might as well be saying that was my salt packet from the

takeout place

and i think you can tell by my

simpering voice that i have no sympathy for the character i was just inhabiting So I think Josh is wrong and the colleague, no.

So I think Josh is right and the colleague is wrong.

Monty, what do you think?

I think stealing all condiments is fair game.

And sometimes I even take a little cup and steal mouthwash out of the bathroom that somebody buys all the time and I don't even know who.

Yeah, now

if you have mustard and it's your special mustard and you put a piece of masking tape on and say, this is mine.

Great Boupon.

Monty.

Monty's.

Yeah.

Right.

This is Monty's Great Boupon and Monty's personal mustard nipple.

Then it's a different story.

Right.

But this is not the situation.

If you want

to to say you have to say, pardon me, do you have any grape coupon?

And then I would say, yes, please have some from my mustard nipple, which I feel shamey about showing you right now.

Oh, Joel, what's the protocol here at the W-E-R-U communal fridge?

Here at Community Radio,

we see it both ways.

We have our own individual

products, but then we do share the big ball of ketchup.

Yeah, but this is

a freeform community radio station.

I thought none of you believed in property.

Well, we have had deep discussions about that, but the reality is that we do have our own personal property.

And we don't want to share it.

Don't mess with my yogurt.

No.

Well, yogurt.

You want some peanut butter?

Go for it.

Right.

Even peanut butter is different, I think.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Who buys the peanut butter?

The community.

The community?

Everyone has to tithe.

Let's find Fundrive for ERU peanut butter right now.

If you call WERU right now, you can buy

the skippy slash chunky nutty.

Now, what is the peanut butter you eat?

No, he's Monty, you're way off.

It's organic, no sugar, and you have to get a shovel to get it out.

Chunky or smooth?

Smooth.

Yeah, well, you're welcome to it.

I'm not going to have any of that.

I like chunky.

What were you saying about peanut butter, Monty?

We could do a fun drive for WERU's peanut butter fund.

Yeah, but you said that peanut butter was different somehow.

Oh, I think it is, unless it's clearly marked as communal peanut butter.

Like yogurt, I think it stands in a different category.

I don't view peanut butter as a condiment.

I think that it's ketchup and mustard.

There's no peanut butter nipple.

I think it's on the line.

You have to understand, I mean, you look, you live in Northampton, so it's pretty crunchy down there.

But the number of vegans who are up here, they may need that protein right away.

Maybe an emergency situation.

But there is an understanding here in the studios of WERU that peanut butter is go-for-it land.

And yogurt is, I can't believe it's not disgusting.

I can't believe it's this disgusting.

You can keep it.

I don't want it.

Yogurt.

Greek yogurt or reg?

Greek.

Greek.

Well, that's pretty good.

I'd like it too.

We have a communal sharing food place, so

it says here, Monty throwed a break, but I guess what?

I'm going to do it because this is Upside Down Land on the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

We'll have more more items from the Docket plus listener letters on Cincinnati-style chili after the break.

You're listening to Judge John Hodgman.

I'm Bailiff Jesse Thorne.

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Let me ask you a question.

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And

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We're back with the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

I am Judge John Hodgman.

We're clearing the docket in a topsy-turvy sort of way today.

Blind justice, having not read a single word of any of the cases that were submitted.

We're just getting them blind and we're judging them.

And it's not just me, it's also Fun Time, Summertime Guest Bailiff, Monty Belmonte, and gravelly-voiced guest engineer Joel Mann here at WERU.

Monty, of course, is down at WRSI The River in Northampton, Massachusetts.

WERU is in Blue Hill, Maine.

WERU.org or WRSI.com.

Calm.

All of our condiments are purchased by our advertisers.

Exactly so.

And if you want to check out these fine radio stations and donate to their respective peanut butter funds, I highly encourage it.

Meanwhile, we're moving on.

Who read the last one?

I did.

You did.

Yeah, you got the easy one about mustard.

I got the weird one about sports.

Let's see who wins this one.

Emily writes, oh, here's another five-paragraph one.

What's going on?

You're getting all the good ones.

I am bringing this case against my husband of 12 years, Justin.

Justin's way of chewing gum seems wrong to me.

Right off the bat, this is the best case we've ever heard.

Joel, mark it in the book.

Is it marked?

Marked.

All right.

Monty, mark it in the Commonwealth of Massachusetts book.

Marked.

Marked both in Maine and Massachusetts.

Best case ever.

I usually keep gum in my purse, and oftentimes when we are driving somewhere, he'll ask me for a piece.

He unwraps it, chews it for approximately 30 seconds, and then spits the gum out the car window.

I have a few issues with this.

One,

it seems wasteful of the gum.

to chew it for such well it's not wasteful of the gum it's wasteful of your husband but it seems wasteful to chew the gum for such a short time two spitting gum out into the the environment feels like littering, because it is, since gum doesn't break down quickly and is not native to the habitat outside the car.

Justin may also argue that something as small as gum barely impacts the environment until which he spits it.

Additionally, he will say that the gum has lost its flavor after 30 seconds and has done its purpose of freshening his breath, so there is no point in continuing to chew it.

I am seeking an injunction.

I want Justin to no longer spit his gum at the car window.

I would also like the judge to order him to supply his own gum if he wishes to continue to chew it in this manner and for the judge to encourage him to chew it for longer than 30 seconds at a time.

Monty Belmonte, I have an opinion on this.

What is yours?

She must be buying terrible gum if it's losing its flavor literally in 30 seconds.

Like, you know, the bazooka, the little comic book in there, those are the only kind of gum that I've ever encountered that really in almost 30 seconds actually loses the flavor.

That being said,

You should chew the gum until the flavor is gone and then properly dispose of it.

You can't, as she mentioned, throw it out the window because it is not native to that environment and does not break down.

So I would issue that injunction if I were a judge and not a bailiff.

Right.

I know that you are a dot-com down there.

You are a commercial radio station.

So

I don't know what you get for talking about bazooka bubblegum on my podcast.

That's who pays for the peanut butter.

I can openly trash their lack of flavor, but they still pay the bills.

Well, since the the door is open to this,

I haven't had bazooka in a long time.

I don't like bubble gum.

I'll tell you one I don't like.

And this is sad because it was my mom's gum.

It's trident.

That goes away after that.

That little nugget they give you, that little

nugget, like, you know, it's not even a cheat clay.

Tiny little rectangle.

It's a tiny little rectangle.

You barely have anything to chew in that thing.

And yeah, it's done for me.

30 seconds.

Nine out of 10 dentists love it.

I'm not saying it's, you know people like what they like and they chew what they chew but i'm a dentine ice guy big blast of menthol all in my mouth and i'll chew it i don't know i'm not timing it because i'm not someone's hyperattentive wife i'll chew it until i'm done with it and then i will appropriately dispose of it

or swallow it

yeah i don't i don't i don't go that way

i do

i swallow it i just don't

I don't believe in the old tale that it's going to stay in your system for 100 years or whatever it is.

Oh, really?

Yeah.

All right.

I swallow it.

I'm tired.

Watermelon seeds, everything.

Never mind.

End of friendship.

Okay.

All done.

Watermelon seeds?

Yeah, why not?

All that stuff's good for you, right?

Joel?

Hippies know this.

Watermelon seeds are good for you, but I don't think chewing gum, I think it's disgusting.

Chewing all gum.

All gum.

Yeah, it's tacky.

Stop it.

If you want to freshen your breath, have a mint.

Well, okay, so are you recusing yourself?

Yes, I'm highly biased.

Right.

Yes.

But here's the thing, though.

Step aside.

Here's the thing.

I think you're right.

I don't like hearing people's mouths when they're chewing gum.

Or watching them.

I don't like watching them.

And it's very rare that I will chew gum.

And I will chew gum when I wish to freshen my breath, which is an unusual circumstance because I do a crazy thing.

I brush my teeth.

I'm fine.

And so when I chew gum, I am essentially using it as a mint.

And therefore, I will not chew it all day long.

I will chew it like this dude chews it for a few, you know, for as long as it takes to get that gunky taste out of my mouth.

And then I will get rid of it responsibly.

So unfortunately for you, Emily, you are wrong.

All three of the justices on this tribunal agree.

Your husband is enjoying the gum the way he wishes to enjoy the gum.

And you, as a gum chewer, an extended period gum chewer, are grossing us out, to be honest.

But you can chew the way you want to chew, and he can chew the way he wants to chew.

You are right in that he cannot throw it out the window.

That is terrible.

Stop doing that, dude.

And if you don't feel like you want to share your precious gum, maybe you've got some expensive gum that you really love to savor while you munch and moisten it.

Then you're okay.

It's okay to refuse him gum when he asks and tell him to get his own.

Maybe he should just get some of those strips,

those mouthwash strips that you put on your tongue that look like future food.

That's probably the best thing for him.

Get some of those in the car.

And next time he opens his mouth to ask for gum, shove one of those in his mouth.

Then he can't even spit it out the window because it just dissolves.

Yeah, that's right.

That solves the chewing and the spitting.

And the breath.

We're just constantly solving mouth problems here at the Judge Sean Hudson podcast.

All right, you get this one.

Kristen.

Kristen writes, I'm writing to ask you to settle a disagreement between myself and my friend and co-worker, Alicia.

Our office provides multiple sub-par hot beverages for employee quote-unquote enjoyment, including coffee, tea, and packets of instant hot chocolate.

Our dispute pertains to the hot chocolate.

Our office purchases a certain national brand of hot chocolate endorsed by an adorable blonde girl living in the Alps, but not to be too generous, they only provide the, quote, no sugar added kind of the brand.

I say that this is a fine way to describe the hot chocolate, that the national brand is being upfront.

They are adding no additional sugar to their already sugared cocoa mix.

Alicia, however, argues that this labeling is incorrect because sugar was already added to the cocoa powder, which does not have sugar in it naturally.

While a seemingly simple and benign debate, our argument escalated quickly, and cocoa is now the official off-limits topic in an otherwise excellent friendship.

Please, Judge Hodgman, end this debate so we may continue our near-perfect friendship in peace.

Is a no-sugar-added hot cocoa label inherently wrong and/or misleading?

Monty, I have an opinion on this.

Do you?

Yes.

I'd like to hear it.

Intentionally misleading, although under the, I guess, the letter of the law, perhaps not wrong.

But I am not a fan of misleading labeling.

Right.

This is clearly a case where

this corporate cocoa product is trying to trick people into thinking that it is somehow better for them

when, in fact, it is just all powdered garbage anyway.

Correct?

I agree.

It's like when it says natural flavors on it, and it's the raspberry product, it's most likely that it is a flavor expelled from a beaver's anus, not actually a raspberry.

But it says natural flavors and I think that's, I agree with you.

That's most, most likely.

You're right.

Look it up.

Look it up.

I've read articles about, especially the raspberry flavor.

Beware of it.

Says natural flavors, beaver anus.

That's not something you just pulled out of your beaver anus?

Nope.

Yeah, I read my Michael Pollen.

I read my Fast Food Nation

and the difference between artificial and natural, quote-unquote, natural flavors.

Yeah, labeling can be misleading, right?

Organic is a federally regulated term now

that does not necessarily mean that the food you're eating is most virtuous or raised near you or not shipped to you by plane or other carbon-emitting thing.

It does not mean that that animal was happy necessarily or raised in pasture.

It just means that certain check marks regarding antibiotic use were not used in the raising of that animal or that crop or what have you.

Similarly, no sugar added is a way of tricking you into thinking that somehow this packet of processed cocoa dust is somehow okay for you compared to the same packet from the same company.

Your friendship would be, I agree with you, Monty, but I take this to another level.

Your friendship is not being bedeviled by misleading labels, but the fact that you're drinking garbage cocoa.

Stop that.

Right?

I mean, hot chocolate is, first of all, should be a rare treat in one's life.

Why?

If you're drinking hot chocolate every day, then you're a baby, and you shouldn't do it.

If you're a grown-up, you should only drink hot chocolate from time to time.

And that thing that you drink from time to time should be the greatest hot chocolate that should pass your lips because it's a treat.

It should not be an easily made, powdered chemical stew that doesn't even taste like proper chocolate.

Take the time to make good.

I like, uh, I don't know if they still make it because there's been some Cadbury's labeling issues, but Cadbury's drinking chocolate, that's just chocolate that has been shaved such that you can put it in hot milk and it becomes a delicious thing.

In this day and age, if you're still, and I'm going to name it Swissmiss, if you're drinking that Swissmiss,

there's so many high-end hot chocolate.

Hot chocolate is one of the ways small

foodie stores are most likely to steal your money they want they there's so much fancy hot chocolate out there and to quote the the wonderful reta of parks and recreation treat yourself

don't you'd argue less and enjoy life more

joel

labels are always wrong I mean, look at it on the beer.

They say you can't operate heavy equipment.

Oh, boy.

That has never been a a problem.

I thought we were going down an Alex Jones

main conspiracy theory bent.

Instead, we're just going a much more mainstream, so to speak, main

alcoholism bent.

They're gum chewing, chocolate-drinking young people

who don't really know what's going on in the world.

Labels, you can't read a label.

Labels are misleading, just like politics.

Just whatever, don't look at the label.

Whatever it is, just put it in your

Well, we know they're not telling you the truth.

Right.

Invest in your own hot chocolate.

Kristen is right, and Alicia is wrong.

It is misleading and is also disgusting.

I also looked up the Beaver Anus thing.

And the Beaver Anus thing, it's called Castorium.

And it is used as a food additive, but Snopes lists it as mostly false and that it's mostly used in the fragrance industry now as opposed to the food industry.

But it is true that it has been used in the past.

As a flavoring.

As a raspberry flavoring.

So if you see, if you're in the break room at WERU

899 Blue Hill or WRSI 93.9 The River, and you see

a big bottle that's labeled Castorium,

don't even read the label.

Just go ahead and drink it.

Drink it.

Because all labels are lies.

Tastes like raspberry.

Yeah.

All right.

Finally, here is a letter we received from Zach regarding a recent topic on this show, Cincinnati-style chili.

Are you familiar with this, Joel?

Never heard of it.

All right.

Cincinnati has weird ideas about the service of chili.

Specifically,

that it should be served not over rice, but over spaghetti.

Spaghetti.

There are two main purveyors of this type of chili, Skyline chili and gold star chili.

This is the letter, by the way, Zach writing.

Continuing as Zach, the general consensus is that Skyline provides a superior product and is generally favored throughout the city and region.

The staples of Cincinnati chili are the conies and the ways.

Cheese conies are small boiled hot dogs on a steamed bun.

Mustard and onions are added, followed by Cincinnati-style chili, which is typically heavy on cinnamon.

and the meat within is ground very fine, and then it is topped with a mound of finely shredded mild cheddar cheese.

So, Joel, I misled you there because there was no spaghetti in there.

In the Midwest, a coney refers to a hot dog that is served drenched in chili, and you eat it with a, you don't eat it as a sandwich.

Well, listen to what I almost said.

You don't eat it in the style of a sandwich.

It's never that I said there was no similarity between a hot dog and a sandwich.

I was saying a hot dog is its own thing,

and never more its own thing than when it is served in Cincinnati under a gallon of cinnamon chili.

But here's the other part.

Now we're getting back to what I was talking about.

Other ways are as follows.

A three-way chili is spaghetti, chili, and a mound of cheese.

Four-way

includes either onion or beans under the cheese.

And a five-way Cincinnati chili includes both onion and beans under the cheese.

Typically, diners are provided with a small bowl of oyster crackers before their orders arrive.

Many people put hot sauce on the oyster crackers.

Pretty complicated.

Yeah.

Yeah, wow.

By the time you hear this, I will have already appeared with my good friend Sarah Vowell

in Toledo, Ohio, where we did a joint appearance there that I am sure was great.

I love Ohio.

I've never been to Cincinnati, but I've been to Ohio many times.

Love it.

Great state.

Wonderful state.

One of the great, great, great states.

But that's like you guys must be bored out of your minds.

You're putting hot sauce on oyster crackers.

I love it.

Fantastic.

A typical order might sound like this: small four-way onion, two cheese conies, no mustard.

End quote.

Hope this clears things up, says Zach.

It just actually posed more questions and introduced more mysteries.

And

if I'm able to do some investigation further into into this, I will let you know.

Hot sauce on crackers is

not only a really

almost baroque thing to do when you're already eating chili on top of spaghetti, but it's a great expression.

Hot sauce on crackers.

That's a great expression.

I was eating all natural potato chips.

Oh, you were?

All natural.

All natural.

And the waitress wanted to know if I wanted any dipping sauce for my chips.

I thought that was kind of odd.

Right here in Maine, in Brewer.

Oh, well, things are different in brewers.

Everything's legal in brewers.

But do you want to dip your potato chips in something?

It's like, what?

Monty, you ever dip your potato chips in a dip?

Like any kind of dip?

Well, yeah, a sour cream and onion dip.

That's about it, yep.

Right.

But this was, she had all kinds of other things.

What kinds of other things?

Are you buzz marketing some diner and brewery?

Because I'm going to go.

It was almost like salad dressing, you know, some ranch salad dressing or something like that.

That's delicious.

Yeah.

Honey, mustard, you know.

Go to the diner and order small four-way onion, two cheese, cones, no mustard, and see what they do.

And then put hot sauce on whatever they bring to the table.

No, I'm not going to do that in Maine, Monty.

It's my last, one of my last days in Maine.

And I am going to go to the Blue Hill Fair and I'm going to eat a non-sandwich called a hot dog.

A cone sandwich.

No.

What else?

Joel, last.

Bianca Sausage, if you can get one of those at the fair.

Now you're buzz marketing.

Bianca sausage, which is a big local sausage maker.

They make great sausages.

And

they make a sausage that I think you would enjoy, Monty,

having grown up in New England.

It's called Chinese sausage.

And the flavor...

It is the flavor of those bright red spare ribs you used to get in suburban Chinese restaurants outside of Boston.

You know what I'm talking about?

Yes, I love that stuff.

It's that it's really, and

I'm making no comment whatsoever on the geographical or cultural accuracy or appropriateness of calling it Chinese sausage, but it is truly something that I have never had in my mouth before that I find delicious.

And it just reminded me of one thing.

I was trying to think of what the weirdest main

culinary thing that I've encountered.

What would that be?

And I'll give you a hint, Joel.

Okay.

Is it off the road?

You mean literally off the

porcupines off the road?

Right, roadkill.

Is it a piece of gum off the road?

Right.

A piece of gum and some porcupine?

That's a good lunch.

No, but

anyone who lives in Maine who has eaten this

staple of gas station cuisine should never make fun.

of Cincinnati five-way chili.

Do you know what I'm talking about?

No.

Monty, do you know what I'm talking about?

You can't get it.

I'm assuming it's not fresh bananas here.

It's not fresh bananas.

It's unique to Maine.

I've only seen it in Maine, though my internet research suggests that it is a New England regional thing.

No idea.

No idea.

And I remembered it in the context

of Chinese sausage.

Yeah, that's right.

Now you know who the real judge is here.

These two guys came into my tribunal.

Silenced.

Chop suey.

Chop suey.

Yeah.

Never.

Do you know?

Never.

I'm not talking about American Chinese food.

I'm talking about

chili mac.

It's basically...

Well, here's what the Wikipedia says.

American chop suey is an American pasta dish popular in New England.

Despite its name, it has only a very distant relation to Chinese and American Chinese cuisine.

It consists of elbow macaroni and bits of ground beef with sauteed onion and green peppers and a thick tomato-based sauce.

You got any gum?

I know.

You want to freshen your breath after that?

I can't believe you haven't seen this.

Where did you have it?

The Agamagon Reach, the Agamagon Country Store.

They had a big sign out front, chop suey.

I went in expecting to see some sort of like Americanized Chinese food, but it was like Italian food.

It was, I think it was shells in this case with

a Bolognese ragu sauce on it and bell peppers.

And I've seen it two or three other times.

Chopped suey.

We used to have it on our school lunch menu all the time, and I was never getting that that time, that it's just the grossest.

I can't stand American chopped suey.

But do you recognize it now?

Was it tomato sauce on shells or, you know, pasta?

Well, I know what American chopped suey is, but I would not think of that as roadside food in Maine.

No.

Well, no, it's like caffeine chips.

It's gross school lunch food, yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

Well, that's what roadside food in Maine is often, too.

No offense.

Friday's Pizza Day in Maine.

I could talk about the casting inn.

I feel sorry for the editor who's going to have to make sense of all of this.

But yes,

American Maine Roadside chop suey is the Cincinnati Five-Way Chili of the Northeast.

That is my ruling.

Judge John Hodgman rules on on this docket and all of it.

And now we have to talk about what's coming up.

Today is the last day of summer.

I say farewell gratefully to Joel Mann.

I hope to see you next summer.

I surely hope so.

It'll be very

sad to see you go, John.

Well, that's all right.

And by the time this airs, I will have seen you laying down bass at the Port City Music Hall at the Judge John Hodgman Live Show, which is at this point in the future, but by the time this airs in the past, didn't we have a great time, Joel?

We did.

Yes, that was fantastic.

Thank you so much for inviting me, and

I just can't thank you enough.

But still, in the future,

the real future that we all share currently, our shows in London are selling really, really quickly.

This is part of the London Podcast Festival.

In fact, as of yesterday, I learned that we only had 15 tickets left to the Saturday show.

I don't know what's going on with the Sunday show.

By now, Saturday may be sold out.

But I do hope that you you will go to johnhodgman.com slash tour and check out the tickets for those shows by following the links or going to maximumfund.org and check out the event sidebar.

What's more, other Maximum Fund shows are also going to be there, including Bullseye, International Waters, and the Beef and Dairy Network.

So please, once again, go to johnhodgman.com slash tour or the event sidebar at maximumfund.org for tickets to all of these great shows in London at the London Podcast Festival.

Cannot wait to see all of our listeners there before they Brexit into whatever other dimension they're going to.

That'll be fun.

If you'd like to submit a case to Judge John Hodgman, you can do so at maximumfun.org slash JJ Hoe.

If you want to email us, it's hodgman at maximumfund.org.

Our engineers this week were Joel Mann at WERU in Blue Hill, Maine, and Christian Duenas at Maximum Fun.

Our producer is Jennifer Marmer.

Thanks for listening to the blind justice of Judge John Hodgman.

Happy birthday, Michelle, Joel's wife, whose birthday it was yesterday, and goodbye to all my friends in Maine.

See you next time.

MaximumFun.org.

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