"The Protagonist" (w/ Heather Gay)

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Speaker 33 I'm stressed.

Speaker 35 I got invited to a Friendsgiving, and now there's the big question of what to bring.

Speaker 4 Well, just bring a bottle of Casamigos.

Speaker 36 Oh, Casamigos, of course.

Speaker 6 Nothing brings people together like a batch of Casamigos margaritas.

Speaker 37 A Casamigos margarita really is the perfect cocktail.

Speaker 6 Plus, Casamigos goes with everything.

Speaker 41 Turkey, stuffing, mac and cheese.

Speaker 4 Oh, I was thinking more cranberry juice or ginger beer, but that works too.

Speaker 35 Well, you know, the iconic rule of culture number 743.

Speaker 41 Anything goes with my Casamigos.

Speaker 47 This Friendsgiving, you know what everyone will be grateful for?

Speaker 41 Casamigos?

Speaker 48 I was going to say you and Casamigos.

Speaker 30 Oh,

Speaker 6 let's keep it in that order.

Speaker 51 Please drink responsibly.

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Speaker 53 Terms apply.

Speaker 63 Hey, hey, hey, or should I say, ho, ho, ho?

Speaker 52 It's me, Matt Rogers, and in the words of another Christmas icon, it's time.

Speaker 58 I'm back with my new nationwide tour, Matt Rogers, Christmas in December.

Speaker 49 Yes, it's time to remember when Christmas is.

Speaker 67 I'm hitting the road all of December with Henry Kaperski and the whole band performing my album, Have You Heard of Christmas? along with a bunch of other little surprises.

Speaker 70 So if you're in LA, San Francisco, Seattle, Portland, Philadelphia, D.C., New York City, Boston, Toronto, Chicago, or yes, Orlando, Florida, I want to see your gorgeous ass.

Speaker 43 Go to mattroogersofficial.com or head to my Instagram at Matt Rogers though and hit the link in my bio.

Speaker 73 Until then, stream the album, get your look together, and get ready to deck the damn halls at a venue near you.

Speaker 58 Christmas in December, you in my heart.

Speaker 74 XOXO, Santa Boy.

Speaker 76 Look, man.

Speaker 77 Look over there.

Speaker 45 Wow, is that culture? Yes, goodness.

Speaker 42 Yeah.

Speaker 30 Las culturistas.

Speaker 78 Ding, dong, dung. Las culturistas

Speaker 80 calling.

Speaker 66 You really spaced out your syllables there.

Speaker 84 You know, I'm really thinking about the sounds I'm making and being so intentional about them because I'm actually reporting to you live from Grand Rapids, Michigan.

Speaker 87 Let's go.

Speaker 88 I'm in the home state of one Henry Kaperski, and we are what?

Speaker 89 Rehearsing.

Speaker 90 For the Christmas in December tour.

Speaker 85 And celebrating Thanksgiving.

Speaker 64 You know, there are some celebrations.

Speaker 92 There definitely is breaking of bread.

Speaker 66 Oh, my favorite thing to break. Well, one of the best things you can break, to be honest, a thing that you break, and people are happy that it's broken.
And that's a rule of culture number 67.

Speaker 96 Yes.

Speaker 76 See, bread, that's a thing that you break, and people are happy that it's broken.

Speaker 99 Because everyone's going to be full, the best thing to be outside of happy parentheses generally.

Speaker 63 Yes. I want to check in with my girl.

Speaker 88 Are you happy parentheses generally?

Speaker 66 I couldn't be happier.

Speaker 79 She ate that.

Speaker 102 Yeah.

Speaker 90 Let's talk about Wicked for Good, a film in which you star fifth billing.

Speaker 100 I said, let's get the SAGNO.

Speaker 66 Let me demystify some things for everybody.

Speaker 104 So the way billing works with these things is

Speaker 66 not at all commensurate with someone's involvement, important

Speaker 88 movie.

Speaker 64 Hard disagree.

Speaker 66 It is a thing that the wonderful brokers, the people behind the scenes with these deals and these contracts work out on your behalf.

Speaker 66 Trust and believe I was not out here fighting for billing over my incredible co-stars who inarguably do incredible, more important, more emotionally resonant work in this film.

Speaker 66 Let's just, let's just leave that there. And I'm sorry if that pisses people off.

Speaker 107 It's not my fault.

Speaker 95 It's just how the biz works.

Speaker 80 Okay. Can I say something?

Speaker 84 Can I say something here?

Speaker 89 Can I offer something back?

Speaker 87 I can confidently say you were my fifth favorite thing about the movie.

Speaker 79 So I'm fifth biddled, but Michelle Yeo and Jeff Goldblum are whatever, like seventh and eighth, right?

Speaker 98 Yeah, but everyone knows about the width and the and.

Speaker 85 The width and the and are only given to people of great esteem.

Speaker 81 Like they are, basically, if you are and blank, what they're saying is, thank you for deigning to do this.

Speaker 112 Yeah.

Speaker 113 No matter what movie you're in, if you are in the and Jeff Goldblum in this case, spot, it means thank you, King.

Speaker 79 Thank you, King.

Speaker 90 It's actually different cultures speak speak for thank you, King.

Speaker 111 Your name means thank you, King.

Speaker 66 And there's something very powerful about if it's your name on the credit, and then what follows is as the cowardly lion.

Speaker 76 Oh, absolutely.

Speaker 75 Period. Or as Dr.

Speaker 66 Dillimond.

Speaker 93 Yes.

Speaker 66 And that's another cultural way of saying thank you, King, to Peter Dinkledge and Coleman Domingo.

Speaker 114 100%.

Speaker 64 I would say that with.

Speaker 90 is also it's like the silver medal like if it's with michelle yo it's like thank you queen thank you queen thank Thank you, really, truly thank you.

Speaker 85 But also, like, you're in the cast.

Speaker 87 Jeff Goldblow occupies rarefied air as the and.

Speaker 85 And the only thing more valuable than that is of course.

Speaker 80 And, well, yes.

Speaker 89 Okay. Which is, of course, of course.

Speaker 88 And introducing.

Speaker 117 Oh.

Speaker 85 And introducing means we are ready to really say something.

Speaker 64 So here's what I'll say. There wasn't really that that we didn't get that in this movie, but that doesn't mean there wasn't great esteem in the casting.

Speaker 85 and when i say when i saw you fifth build i did the math and i said he was my fifth favorite thing what were the what were they for

Speaker 106 number one number one my favorite thing is the sex slank it that is number one my favorite thing and covering and the for to get the pg rating you know they shot an alternate take where jonathan bailey's nipples were covered Let me tell you something.

Speaker 71 We got no nipple.

Speaker 80 We got all slank it.

Speaker 122 I log on and I'm like, what did you want?

Speaker 118 Did you want quivering, quivering, Cynthia Arrivo's alpha book green?

Speaker 63 Do you want her quivering with the towel in front of her, dropping the towel like she's Kate Winslet in Titanic?

Speaker 113 No, you need this to be PG. It's wicked, you absolute freaks.

Speaker 79 You absolute freak.

Speaker 124 Also, you want to see thrust?

Speaker 66 This bitch has been living in a tree for the past 12 tide turns. She is cozy.
She's comfortable.

Speaker 100 She's cold. She's out.

Speaker 125 There's no infrastructure.

Speaker 97 She's comfortable.

Speaker 118 She's comfortable in her skin.

Speaker 113 Green.

Speaker 81 cozy with who she is, slanking.

Speaker 127 Been down, been out.

Speaker 87 Rewrite it, Beyonce.

Speaker 88 No, I'm saying.

Speaker 118 And then she topped Fiero, pegged his hole.

Speaker 69 You know what happened.

Speaker 82 If Johnny had his way, rewrite the script.

Speaker 92 So that was number one.

Speaker 108 What an amazing premiere that was in New York.

Speaker 66 I was so happy you were there.

Speaker 70 Oh, my God.

Speaker 83 That was, that was the biggest premiere.

Speaker 79 that I think I'll ever go to.

Speaker 101 It was really so major.

Speaker 88 They, I mean, they just, they go for it because it it is a spectacle wait can i say my other top five things

Speaker 85 and then you give me a bts fact about all of them okay so one was a sex blanket two ariana grande and cynthia arrivo at the doors yes for good into the doors i swear I think of you every single time.

Speaker 111 I really am powerless to that song and that moment because I just think of you, my best friend.

Speaker 88 My best friend.

Speaker 85 And I was sitting across the aisle from you at the premiere and we were sort of apart.

Speaker 112 And I was like, girl, who can say?

Speaker 129 And I was, because I was a couple rows behind you across the aisle and I kept glancing over at you during that song.

Speaker 127 I didn't want to look back because I didn't want it to be too emotional.

Speaker 76 I didn't want to, I didn't want to go very emotional. That's okay.

Speaker 77 I know. I love you so much.

Speaker 131 I'm so enough for the both of us. I love you so much.

Speaker 66 Okay, so that's the door.

Speaker 79 Oh,

Speaker 66 BTS, quick BTS, fact about that.

Speaker 66 There's a lot of chatter about how that was quote unquote improvised because that was said in this, that was maybe in an interview in passing.

Speaker 66 So, there's, I guess, that, let's just clear something up. There's no way to like improvise that, a shot like that, right?

Speaker 77 No, no, no.

Speaker 66 But what I think what is maybe being lost is that it was found in rehearsals.

Speaker 118 And there's a couple of things that get lost.

Speaker 88 So, this is this is understandable.

Speaker 66 There's a kind of a sort of cost. So, like, getting Ari, Cynthia, and John, I'm Chu and Alice Brooks, the amazing, amazing cinematographer.

Speaker 66 I think they, the, the four of them kind of found that together. Um, and so I think somehow the word improvise got thrown in, and that just, that just really confused people.
So, that's actual BTS.

Speaker 64 Well, all I saw about it was Ariana saying that there were certain parties. And listen, in filmmaking, there's always going to be certain parties.

Speaker 87 It's actually rule of culture number nine.

Speaker 76 In filmmaking, there's always going to be certain parties.

Speaker 87 And certain parties wanted the scene cut like after they saw a cut, and it was fought for.

Speaker 88 And eventually, it stayed in.

Speaker 80 And I'm so happy they did because to me, that's that's the

Speaker 89 movie.

Speaker 79 That's the story.

Speaker 92 That's kind of the point. You know what I mean? So, that number three, a little bit of Ariana Grande peeking out during thank goodness, which I think is a conscious choice.

Speaker 64 Oh, yes, when all the confetti freezes in the air, and Ariana, as Glinda, has her private moment, which, by the way, is one of my favorite things about the entire wicked score is that moment in Thank Goodness.

Speaker 71 And I thought that part was so nailed. Like, and I loved that the moment got so personal that I think as a little bit of a nod, a little bit of Ariana Grande came out in the voice and the vocals.

Speaker 71 Yeah, it wasn't as resonant and performative.

Speaker 135 And

Speaker 88 she killed that.

Speaker 80 And I'll put her under my whole three, like, killed the entire movie.

Speaker 93 Killed the entire movie.

Speaker 119 Killed the entire movie from the second she heard she got the part until the second she finished it.

Speaker 137 What did she say?

Speaker 66 She was going to take such good care of her. And then, number four, I'm going to guess, no good deed.

Speaker 46 You know, no good deed.

Speaker 111 The fact that Cynthia can still, you don't really get how far she is pushing it vocally and how I'm sorry, but no one else could do it like her because no one could take it to the vocal places it goes.

Speaker 64 That song is also so difficult to learn to sing.

Speaker 71 And I got to go with them again last night.

Speaker 111 We saw it again and we watched No Good Deed and we all just looked at each other and beamed because that song is so fucking good.

Speaker 86 And Cynthia, no one can sing it like that and hold that stardom on screen.

Speaker 93 No one. 100%.

Speaker 118 Nobody.

Speaker 66 And to end on a wide with the monkeys and

Speaker 66 Kumco in the background, there's you're showing a lot of, a lot of space, holding space, as it were, in that shot, and you can still hold the center.

Speaker 76 Yeah.

Speaker 113 And I think.

Speaker 66 And number five is me.

Speaker 87 Oh, sorry. Number five is you.

Speaker 108 No, you were.

Speaker 66 No, you wanted to slip something else in there.

Speaker 71 No, I know what number five is because I came here with my top five.

Speaker 87 I thought fifth build my top five.

Speaker 100 Fanny, again, first of all, Mrs.

Speaker 79 Morable.

Speaker 71 I know that was improvised.

Speaker 66 Well, that was improvised. And no one, we did not rehearse any of that, trust and believe.

Speaker 64 Did she just accidentally say Mrs.

Speaker 116 Morable?

Speaker 117 Bronwyn,

Speaker 66 bless her heart. I fucking love you.
She is incredible. Give it, let's give it up for Bronwyn James, everybody.

Speaker 80 Legend.

Speaker 97 The Shen, Shen, to your fanny.

Speaker 83 I see you.

Speaker 131 I know what it's like to stand next to this bitch on his left at all times.

Speaker 120 And I

Speaker 127 felt represented.

Speaker 108 We switch sides every now and then, me and her.

Speaker 80 Sometimes. Sometimes.

Speaker 76 And you and I switch sides.

Speaker 118 You're just comfortable on the right.

Speaker 71 You just want to be on the right. Sure.

Speaker 112 I know this about you.

Speaker 66 That was improvised.

Speaker 131 She said, Mrs.,

Speaker 8 can I get you anything, Mrs.

Speaker 66 Morable? And then, of course,

Speaker 79 I had to change. Mrs.
Morable?

Speaker 77 She's married.

Speaker 95 Married.

Speaker 132 Shout out, Fanny.

Speaker 66 Today, on the date of this recording, Sunday, November 23rd, is the last performance of Kajay Kennedy, the fanny in wicked for the past three years on Broadway.

Speaker 109 I got to meet her at a Tai T a couple years ago.

Speaker 87 It was so

Speaker 76 amazing.

Speaker 100 The best place for fannies to meet is Tai Tea.

Speaker 116 That's Uncle Trail number 50. The best place for fannies to meet is Tai Tea.

Speaker 88 I have never seen so many fannies than when Tai T is popping off.

Speaker 132 Oh, it's all fannies. But

Speaker 66 I got to meet her then. She's.
Incredible. And then tonight is her last night on Broadway after three years of doing over three years of doing

Speaker 42 that.

Speaker 66 So, so amazing. So proud of you.

Speaker 66 What a work ethic. What a schedule.
What a talent. Love you, Kaje.
So, so, so cool.

Speaker 90 Well, congrats to the whole team because the movie was a huge fucking hit.

Speaker 88 Of course it was.

Speaker 64 Of course it was.

Speaker 71 I can't wait to see it be made into a theme park, specifically in Epic Universe, which, by the way, is popping off filing permits.

Speaker 114 They're expanding, girl.

Speaker 85 They said, let's make the.

Speaker 93 What are you seeing?

Speaker 120 I'm seeing things.

Speaker 111 Let's just say, like, you know, I've had to go to my little coping mechanisms and you know that one of them is going on like the theme park blogs and checking construction.

Speaker 113 Yes. It's a soothing thing for me.

Speaker 93 I'm, I love this.

Speaker 135 During a stressful time.

Speaker 80 And so a stressful but good time, but like.

Speaker 66 Yes, stressful but good. Okay, so you're, you're, you're seeing the permits.

Speaker 71 Yeah, I mean, I think unfortunately they're going to go, go kind of ham on Harry Potter.

Speaker 69 Right.

Speaker 85 But we can, we can hope for some stuff.

Speaker 71 I want to see Zelda get built and they have the rights.

Speaker 75 Well, I think they're going to wait for the movie to come out and then see it.

Speaker 66 Cause and then the first, the first first look stills have been released and it looks very, very interesting. A lot of melding of different eras of Zelda.
You've got Breath of the Wild, Zelda.

Speaker 66 Like Zelda is in her Breath of the Wild geish, but while Link is in his like Twilight Princess geisha, it's very, I think, I think we're going to see something very new.

Speaker 71 I guess Breath of the Wild would be what you'd want to see, right?

Speaker 66 Yes, because it's the most recent and it kind of has the most... feels the most cinematic in a lot of ways.
Like it's just the scoring is very minimal.

Speaker 66 It's like, I think they could do really interesting things with a filmed like a very japanese but still western quote unquote like amalgamation like there's there's something just so profound about those games like i would really love to see that be adapted but maybe maybe that's too much to ask because it is like a fucking 70 hour game and how can you distill that to two hours but we'll see um that is very exciting what else in the culture well i was just gonna say like this world of zelda that you describe yes would it be possible to be on a boat that flies?

Speaker 87 Like a flying boat?

Speaker 63 Could it, you know what I'm saying?

Speaker 102 Because I think that's what I want the Zelda ride to be.

Speaker 71 I want to fly a boat through Zelda.

Speaker 93 I'm trying to think.

Speaker 93 There is, there are flying things in

Speaker 117 Zelda.

Speaker 76 It's very possible.

Speaker 66 You will fly on a Zonai device, which is, it can be made into a boat.

Speaker 114 Do you think that if we dream it, it's possible?

Speaker 99 Really answer.

Speaker 93 Yes, but it depends.

Speaker 88 Oh, I hate the trepidation with which you respond, but I asked a question.

Speaker 112 I should have been prepared for both answers.

Speaker 66 My trepidation

Speaker 66 cannot be held against your

Speaker 105 naivete.

Speaker 88 My God.

Speaker 111 That sentence has never been more true.

Speaker 79 I'm sorry. I'm sorry.

Speaker 66 It did not feel good to say.

Speaker 86 I have thought of myself as naive for like all week.

Speaker 66 Isn't that such a gorgeous name?

Speaker 93 Why are you naive?

Speaker 84 Okay, so I'm going to speak on something.

Speaker 88 I was naive to think that I could just like post photos of Fraser and I and that people wouldn't be like, oh, it's a hard launch.

Speaker 83 But I was just so excited that I met the most wonderful person and I was just like posting about my life.

Speaker 144 And like, then suddenly it was like, uh-oh, just Jared.

Speaker 88 So I guess I was naive because I wasn't exactly ready for like any attention in that regard because I didn't think people would care.

Speaker 93 You're not thinking about that.

Speaker 94 You're not thinking about the attention.

Speaker 92 No, I was not. And so, um, but now that it is out there, I feel I do.

Speaker 84 I don't, I recognize that some people listen to this podcast now as it's gotten a little bit more popular and are just like, oh, the guests or whatever.

Speaker 80 But like, I do feel like we've had listeners for a very long time.

Speaker 88 And so I'm not just going to like not bring up.

Speaker 117 Of course.

Speaker 81 I'm definitely dating Fraser.

Speaker 122 He's definitely the best the best and bowen's met him i love him so much and that seems to be the common refrain amongst all of our friends and so that's that you know i adore the boy he's wonderful i love him and also that will lead me to bravo come because this is the heather gay episode this is the heather gay episode our

Speaker 86 true true bestie our true bestie that we made in cam but i do want to say just some bravo things because this is because people from bravo are going to be listening yes or Bravo fans, Bravoholics.

Speaker 79 I ran into Melissa and Joe from Jersey.

Speaker 80 I think the Teresa thing is real.

Speaker 111 I think that that is genuinely a thing that they're doing like off camera.

Speaker 87 I don't know what changed.

Speaker 119 Congrats to Gia Judice.

Speaker 80 She won special forces.

Speaker 64 I want to say congratulations. That does not sound easy to me.

Speaker 80 The sentence blank won special forces.

Speaker 64 I'm on my feet.

Speaker 93 I'm impressed.

Speaker 66 I'm impressed.

Speaker 71 And I met Dolores.

Speaker 66 You met. Oh, my God.
You two are kindred spirits.

Speaker 95 And that is a wonderful woman, a wonderful person, a wonderful woman.

Speaker 111 She put her arm around me and she said, you get me.

Speaker 84 And I was like, let me tell you something. I do.

Speaker 81 I was like, you remind me of, and she goes, I know all your aunts and cousins growing up.

Speaker 111 She's like, I understood when you said that.

Speaker 92 Like, you really get me.

Speaker 114 I was like, I'm walking arm in arm with Dolores.

Speaker 117 Miss Catania, she's, oh,

Speaker 66 Traders winner, Dolores Catania.

Speaker 42 Oh.

Speaker 131 What was the thing that she and she did with What's Her Face?

Speaker 66 It's like she got Marge to like like text Dolores while she was talking to

Speaker 47 she texted Marge

Speaker 66 Yeah, something Jackie had said Marge texted Dolores something Jackie had said about her while Dolores was talking to Jackie and she said she said immediately was like you said this in the most like oh I wish I had that and I I will if that if I am confronted in that situation I will I will pull it Dolores she is Dolores my stab and I think I publicly on video sort of like gawked at you or just sort of balked at you saying that Dolores is your favorite housewife I was like Dolores and I and I do take that back.

Speaker 66 She makes total sense.

Speaker 146 I think you were just surprised.

Speaker 80 I was surprised.

Speaker 71 The thing is, like, I'm so lived in with Dolores, I don't feel the need to be like mentioning all the time, like, oh, and by the way, I love Dolores.

Speaker 85 Like, Dolores is my family, and sometimes family business is private business.

Speaker 70 Yes, like, sometimes family, but I'm gonna raise my voice.

Speaker 97 Sometimes family business is private business.

Speaker 147 My God,

Speaker 66 you're lived in with Dolores.

Speaker 149 I am incredibly lived in and centered.

Speaker 30 Girl,

Speaker 80 I literally, when I think of you two interacting, I see so much more than I think I see like a travel show.

Speaker 82 Yes. I think I see like

Speaker 80 I see real collabs between you and Angie.

Speaker 66 I was texting her as I was watching her fucking fingernail fall off or whatever it was on the yacht.

Speaker 66 Remember like when she was in, she was in the costume and like she like slammed the door on her finger?

Speaker 92 I mean, yes, the pain.

Speaker 132 It felt, I felt it.

Speaker 91 I felt the pain for we are connected.

Speaker 66 And I texted her. I was like, Angie, this is the hardest thing I've seen in a long time.

Speaker 107 Yeah.

Speaker 66 Watching you in pain like this is very hard on me.

Speaker 39 Yeah.

Speaker 66 And she was very touched by that. And I think we grew even closer.

Speaker 120 Honestly, she's such a warm angel.

Speaker 84 Just like Heather Gay, I will be on Watch What Happens Live with Heather Gay.

Speaker 101 The day after December

Speaker 132 is released.

Speaker 92 Or the day before December. No,

Speaker 80 the day before Gen Shaw is getting released and you know it's going to be a topic and I feel like people are going to be watching that app because by the way salt leak is fully on fire incredible fully on fire bronwin is a favorite of mine I love bronwen yeah I have to say like this stuff with her husband is becoming really compelling to me absolutely I'm just like I'm just like I can't I need to find out where this goes with Todd with the mom unfortunately that mom yeah

Speaker 131 I mean I don't want to I don't want to comment on the situation too much because it's, it really, especially after Bravacon, it's like, these are people.

Speaker 64 No, 100%.

Speaker 80 You know what I mean?

Speaker 119 And by the way, Bronwyn, one of the coolest people there.

Speaker 101 Of course. Definitely.

Speaker 80 Very chill vibe.

Speaker 101 Always looked really great.

Speaker 88 Brahma was one of the coolest people there. And also all of the Salt Lake ladies are

Speaker 95 top 10s.

Speaker 88 I met Marisol.

Speaker 40 I mean, come on.

Speaker 84 I got to see some of my faves.

Speaker 92 I ran into Gina, my Long Island girl.

Speaker 152 Oh, my God. You and Gina.

Speaker 70 Wendy being there was crazy.

Speaker 87 And now there's even more. They're saying that.

Speaker 66 40 credit cards, aliases.

Speaker 76 It's really not looking good. Not looking good.

Speaker 66 I feel for that. I feel for those children most of all.
I feel for both of them too. It's, well, this is our episode with Heather Gay.
We recorded this.

Speaker 75 a little while back.

Speaker 66 So we are, you know, Matt and I are not operating from a place of being totally caught up to the below deck crossover, what happened with Meredith and Brittany on the plane, obviously.

Speaker 66 But we are, we do mostly just like shoot the breeze on can and just getting to know each other in the last few months and how special that's been. We do love, Heather's one of us.

Speaker 66 You know what I mean?

Speaker 154 Love Heather. She's a good time.

Speaker 114 She's a good person.

Speaker 89 Like she's a good girl.

Speaker 79 She's just, she's, yeah, we love.

Speaker 88 And we think you're going to love this. You just said the words, Meredith on the plane.
And I got so stressed, reaching, fumbling for my beta blockers, like, please.

Speaker 88 Anything to calm myself. That's the kind of television.

Speaker 80 We didn't even talk about Pluribus. Next time, let me catch up.
Oh, wait.

Speaker 115 Say what you want to say.

Speaker 117 It is incredible.

Speaker 66 A lot of chatter about how it's like doing the Vince Gilligan thing of

Speaker 66 having an amazing pilot. Oh, no, not, not the Vince Gilligan thing, but it's just like the thing recently where it's like things have an incredible pilot and then they kind of like peter off.

Speaker 66 But I'm like, that's just,

Speaker 66 I think that's just TV. I disagree.
I think Pluribus keeps the ball in the air in a very, very cool way. Like, I'm really interested to see where this goes.

Speaker 101 Takes big swings. Yeah.

Speaker 80 One thing about it is that is not Vince Gilligan's reputation.

Speaker 8 I was going to say, that is not his reputation at all.

Speaker 66 Breaking back to not like pop off with the pile and then simmer down.

Speaker 71 That I would argue got better as it went. It got so good, I had to tap out because of stress.

Speaker 88 And also, Better Call Sol, I mean, I was always told, like, oh, Ray Seahorn, Ray Seahorn for Better Call Sol.

Speaker 85 And I was like, I just wish that Better Call Sol was something that gave me a little bit of a chub, but never.

Speaker 89 Ploraboose.

Speaker 114 Pluribus.

Speaker 89 Pluraboos.

Speaker 155 Pluribus.

Speaker 117 It is

Speaker 66 very special. I'm really enjoying it.
It has something to say about a lot of things.

Speaker 132 You can really graft on a lot of things about the current day onto it.

Speaker 133 Anyway, enjoy it.

Speaker 75 We'll talk about it when you're caught up.

Speaker 80 Yeah, we'll see you in a few weeks.

Speaker 81 We'll check in again before the EOY.

Speaker 93 For now, enjoy this episode with the one and only Heather Day.

Speaker 62 Okay, so you know how the world is a chaotic, swirling ball of total stress right now?

Speaker 156 Well, we have a new Hulu show from Ryan Murphy that will give you the much-needed break from reality.

Speaker 65 And whether you know it or not, you are already completely obsessed.

Speaker 158 It's called All's Fair, and Ms.

Speaker 46 Kardashian plays Allura Grant, the most in-demand divorce attorney in Los Angeles.

Speaker 160 Get it?

Speaker 161 It's All's Fair, as in All's Fair in Love and War, and she's a divorce attorney.

Speaker 18 Love it.

Speaker 168 Now let's talk ensemble because allura does not go it alone she breaks off from a crusty male dominated law firm to start her own legal coven with some absolute forces of nature naomi watts niece nash betz tiana taylor and glenn close yeah hello glenn close and of course you need a villain so say hello to sarah paulson as the nemesis and these ladies are brilliant complicated fearless and when they all come together nothing can stop them.

Speaker 35 I'm talking about the lawyers on the show and the actresses playing them, by the way.

Speaker 37 But hey, if you're you're thinking this will be all courtroom drama and no drama drama, relax.

Speaker 173 Allura, that's Kim's character, has plenty of twists and turns in her personal life.

Speaker 174 Her professional life crashes into her personal one, and uh-oh.

Speaker 175 So, how does this super lawyer fix her own mess?

Speaker 168 With a little help from her besties, of course.

Speaker 56 So, this series has it all: scandalous secrets, high-stakes courtroom drama, more shifting alliances than Kim's other shows, some OMG twists, and friendships that rise above it all.

Speaker 166 And of course, everything is gonna look amazing.

Speaker 176 It's got some unapologetic glam, a work hard, play harder lifestyle.

Speaker 54 Every scene just sparkles.

Speaker 34 Everybody makes compromises in their lives.

Speaker 65 Lame men, underpaying jobs.

Speaker 60 Well, stop.

Speaker 163 Just stop.

Speaker 27 And never settle for anything less than fabulous when it comes to your next streaming obsession.

Speaker 3 All's fair, now streaming on Hulu and on Hulu on Disney Plus for bundle subscribers.

Speaker 50 Terms apply, drama guaranteed.

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Speaker 106 You're one of my loved ones, too. Ah,

Speaker 76 Look, man.

Speaker 77 Oh, and look over there.

Speaker 45 Wow, is that culture? Yes.

Speaker 42 Goodness. Wow.

Speaker 30 Las culturistas.

Speaker 191 Ding-dong.

Speaker 130 Las culturistas calling.

Speaker 192 It's a day that's been in the making.

Speaker 76 Hmm.

Speaker 155 It's crazy to say, like,

Speaker 192 well, we connected in the south of France.

Speaker 102 Dot, dot, dot.

Speaker 149 Meaningfully connected in the south of France at a convention and then CamCon.

Speaker 195 At CamCon.

Speaker 140 Cam, CamCon.

Speaker 107 CamCon. I'm so sorry.

Speaker 93 Convention in Cam. That's right.

Speaker 38 And struck up a true, genuine friendship.

Speaker 186 And then she shows up to the culture awards, slays it.

Speaker 39 Crushed. Crushed.

Speaker 8 They were the most

Speaker 197 stars in the room.

Speaker 196 Well, yeah.

Speaker 106 Kristen Wigg does her, comes in for rehearsal.

Speaker 38 She does her thing. She, you know, sees all these plays, goes, oh, yeah, this person's here.
This person's here.

Speaker 129 Freezes in her tracks.

Speaker 66 The Salt Lake City girls are coming.

Speaker 59 I said, everyone except Whitney, who's

Speaker 198 touring in Australia.

Speaker 199 Just to let you know how big the lives have become.

Speaker 94 They're touring in Australia.

Speaker 87 Touring in Australia at the awards here, there, everywhere.

Speaker 134 I mean, this is a historic episode.

Speaker 109 Correct me if I'm wrong.

Speaker 152 Our first in-person housewife, in-person guest

Speaker 200 of a current housewife.

Speaker 126 Yeah, I think you're right.

Speaker 94 We've obviously had housewives on before, but this is breaking new ground, and I couldn't think of anyone better.

Speaker 201 No, because I think that we've been on record as saying that Salt Lake City is the girl.

Speaker 50 She's the one.

Speaker 128 John Oliver went on Colbert.

Speaker 202 And even kind of espoused to the audience the ways in which it is Shakespeare.

Speaker 203 Yeah, you start seeing it cross over.

Speaker 102 We actually, we were just in P-Town and we re-watched season two's what we can only call what goes down in the beauty lab parking lot.

Speaker 204 It doesn't stay in the beauty lab parking lot.

Speaker 117 It's all over television and television history.

Speaker 106 But that is minute-by-minute perfect television.

Speaker 94 I would agree.

Speaker 205 And it continued to be.

Speaker 102 New York Times best-selling author of Bad Mormon and Good Time Girl, star of Real Housewives of Salt Lake City from the beginning, very much the, and I think that everyone would agree, very much the protagonist of the show.

Speaker 149 Mogul, Beauty Lap, and Laser. Mm-hmm.

Speaker 139 I'm dying to go.

Speaker 196 Oh, we're going.

Speaker 106 I want to get an old Thera treatment there.

Speaker 207 And actually, I want a little bit of a consult on the episode.

Speaker 95 Oh, yeah.

Speaker 148 Yeah, and I'm not scared of it.

Speaker 106 I'm not scared of it either.

Speaker 137 Let's do it.

Speaker 117 This is, I say fearfully.

Speaker 109 This is our truly dear friend.

Speaker 209 We love her.

Speaker 196 The one, the only Heather Yay!

Speaker 88 You're on Lost Cult.

Speaker 13 I am so honored to be on Lus Cult. Never thought this day would come, but it does feel like a final, it's like important that it's happening now.
I think my phone is ringing.

Speaker 104 Well, what could this possibly be?

Speaker 76 What could they possibly be saying?

Speaker 127 Angie Katzeneva said.

Speaker 116 Pick up the phone.

Speaker 104 You pick up the phone.

Speaker 98 Pick it up and put it on speaker.

Speaker 151 Put it on speaker.

Speaker 13 Hey, Ange.

Speaker 76 Oh, she hit me. Oh, she hung up.

Speaker 64 Damn.

Speaker 128 So wishy-washy, that one.

Speaker 13 Listen, she probably panicked. She's on right now.

Speaker 91 She probably realized that.

Speaker 127 And we want her on, too, for

Speaker 76 the phone call.

Speaker 13 Angie Kay is an incredible friend, an incredible housewife. She also recommended before the sizzle reel by me and on my behalf.
And I recommended her year after year until she finally was on there.

Speaker 102 Which was what, season three, they brought her up?

Speaker 13 Season two, they revisited and she came on as a friend. Season three, she was a friend and then like full-time.
Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 87 But you knew from the beginning.

Speaker 13 Yeah, she represents such a huge part of Utah and of Salt Lake City specifically. Yeah.

Speaker 211 The Greek community.

Speaker 13 And she has been exactly who she is since she was 15 years old. Sitting like reverse on her desk in Mr.

Speaker 13 Carter's math class, like with a scrunchie on top of her head, entertaining all of us, not knowing a single answer to a single math problem.

Speaker 13 And me being so glad I was in a lower math class so I could just have fun and make friends and still pull an A.

Speaker 42 Yes.

Speaker 194 But this was the same math class you're saying?

Speaker 13 Yeah, this is 10th grade Mr. Carter's math class.

Speaker 121 But then clear this up because wasn't the narrative on the show that you guys did not get along in high school?

Speaker 76 No. Am I going to be a million?

Speaker 13 No, the narrative on the show is that she hurt my feelings by coming on the show as Lisa's friend and Jen's friend.

Speaker 195 Oh, and that is real.

Speaker 13 And so when she, so the first scene I had, I was like, I don't like her and I'm not going to accept her.

Speaker 13 And then, you know, so then we like, but, you know, what we, you know, the true nature of our relationship superseded kind of all of that show BS, you know, that happens. It's a weird thing, you know?

Speaker 201 I mean, it was a great moment.

Speaker 143 Like we were getting ready for the culture awards.

Speaker 123 It was the night before and I was really racked with nerves.

Speaker 138 And I remember Melissa and I went back to the hotel and I look across the lobby and there's Heather and Angie coming in from like, I don't know where you guys have been.

Speaker 76 You guys have been out the night before the culture awards, having so much fun, cackling, laughing, looking like.

Speaker 136 peas in a pot.

Speaker 203 And I was like, see, we haven't really seen this version of Angie and Heather on the show yet.

Speaker 146 And then to watch it in real life, I'm like, oh, this is like a part of the show I want to see.

Speaker 97 Yeah.

Speaker 151 Like the two of you.

Speaker 13 I think you will see more and more of it, you know, because as like the friendships change and evolve and deepen, like we just are more comfortable, like not hurting other people's feelings by hanging out all the time.

Speaker 13 You know what I mean? It's just, you, it's just the nature of it. Like it's deepened our relationship in a way that

Speaker 13 is really like important to someone at this phase of life for me.

Speaker 76 You know what I mean? Yeah.

Speaker 13 To have a high school friend, I've known her since she she's very special.

Speaker 210 She's 15 years old. Yeah.

Speaker 102 The picture you paint of her is so visceral, like sitting on the desk with the high pony, like not knowing.

Speaker 13 She's like, green and white stripe gap, rugby shirt, collar popped.

Speaker 202 Rugby shirt. So she's so of the current time in that

Speaker 89 garb.

Speaker 199 But see, like, doesn't, doesn't that, like, I wonder how you do with that, you know, refraction of, oh my God, this is someone I've known since 15.

Speaker 197 Also, we're on TV together representing something about Salt Lake City.

Speaker 216 And

Speaker 38 there's just all this other stuff.

Speaker 106 And you guys just have to like perform a version of yourselves in a way that like is authentic, but also like you need to like draw some connection to like that younger self of you, like that, that younger version of you.

Speaker 13 Yeah, the younger version of us. And I think that's what makes it so fun and

Speaker 13 deepens our friendship is because you could put us at 7-11. We're going to be doing the same bitch.

Speaker 76 You know what I mean?

Speaker 13 Like when we're together, we're kind of, it's just that energy feeds off each other.

Speaker 184 And like, I'm always performing.

Speaker 13 I've been been performing since I was in kindergarten.

Speaker 76 You know what I mean?

Speaker 13 Like, everything's more fun if it's a bit performative.

Speaker 88 Yeah, well, you got to amp it up.

Speaker 71 Thank you for speech.

Speaker 196 Don't we know?

Speaker 5 I think you're putting the hard tea on kindergarten.

Speaker 13 Well, kindergarten, because I-

Speaker 151 It's the way it's spelled.

Speaker 210 Kindergarten.

Speaker 76 What am I doing?

Speaker 218 I am the word Smith that I'm a best-selling author.

Speaker 76 I'm not a bad thing.

Speaker 215 What did that feel like?

Speaker 147 Not only when it came out, but also like when Bad Mormon went on that bestseller list.

Speaker 155 That's crazy. Yeah.

Speaker 13 Bad Mormon, the book, has been for sure like the greatest jewel of all of this experience.

Speaker 13 And not only because it felt great to like write my story and

Speaker 13 process all that. I mean, it's so cathartic.
It's so therapeutic.

Speaker 13 And it was just, it felt like an incredible privilege to revisit that and like kind of honor the girl I was then and like that I was in a position now to look at it with perspective because I tell people a lot, they're like, oh, when is he going to leave the church or when is she going to leave the church?

Speaker 13 And I'm like, it's not leaving the church is like, it's like leaving who you are. And the only way I've seen it happen for people like me is if something bigger comes along.

Speaker 210 Right.

Speaker 13 Something bigger comes along that offers you more than what you've always counted on. Because that's kind of, you know, ambition, the human spirit, like the drive to exceed.

Speaker 13 And like housewives came along and offered me more than I ever anticipated I could have. And the book gave me the opportunity to explore that.
And so the book has been my great connector.

Speaker 13 I meet people on the streets. It's what they love.
They resonate with it. It's, we're doing a documentary about it.
You know, it's like, it means so much to me.

Speaker 13 And I was posing for an ad where I had to hold it. And so I was just kind of like reading it, laughing out loud.
I love every word. I'm so proud of it.

Speaker 13 And like, I hope it outlasts me for a hundred years. You know,

Speaker 5 I think your story, I think you talking about leaving the church being this like

Speaker 106 developmentally important,

Speaker 106 the most important thing

Speaker 108 in any Mormon's development, former Mormons development as they leave the church is kind of like your defining thing as like a boundary breaking person, right?

Speaker 186 It's like you broke, like the boundary was the church for a second.

Speaker 75 You broke out of that.

Speaker 106 Then you're, you know, in order to define that though, you have to get in the boundary first, right?

Speaker 106 And so, like, whether that's like housewives, whenever you, you know, however long you do that, at some point you will break out of that boundary.

Speaker 106 But it requires getting in the boundary first and it requires sitting down to like write the book.

Speaker 152 You know what I mean?

Speaker 5 Like that is part of, that is the action of like breaking out of whatever box people have put you in.

Speaker 13 That's exactly how it happened. When I was first approached, I couldn't even read the email saying, write a book called That Mormon.
I mean, I shut the laptop.

Speaker 13 It was just so, I would never have put my name, my face on anything derogatory about the church or about who I still wasn't sure I wasn't, you know? Yeah.

Speaker 13 And then just through time, like you start to like recognize that boundary becomes less oppressive and like less defining of your options in life, you know?

Speaker 13 And like now I couldn't think of a better title. You know, I wanted to be a good Mormon.

Speaker 218 It was very hard for me.

Speaker 140 Yeah.

Speaker 76 It's also an incredibly sticky title.

Speaker 99 You know what I mean?

Speaker 136 Like bad Mormon is a title you just don't forget.

Speaker 136 And you get, you, not only are you explicitly saying what it is, but also as you read it, you discover like it's about self-judgment, which is like so much.

Speaker 192 And it's really, I guess it's kind of similar to coming out of the closet, right?

Speaker 112 It's like

Speaker 76 you do that.

Speaker 203 And then I think there's like a perception of like, oh, this person left the Mormon church.

Speaker 136 They left, you know, Scientology.

Speaker 123 They're coming out of the closet. They're leaving a marriage, et cetera.

Speaker 126 Good for them.

Speaker 203 That is when the work really starts because that's when you find out who you are.

Speaker 76 and i feel like one of the really compelling things about the first really few seasons and ongoing of salt lake city housewives is of course it's fun because it's a housewives franchise franchise in life franchise in this housewives franchise yum um it's in this bespoke place salt lake city which we hadn't really explored before but what was the most compelling thing was I think especially you,

Speaker 126 you're watching you find out who you are.

Speaker 138 You know what I mean?

Speaker 104 Like seeing your limits, even with alcohol, with going out, with doing all these things.

Speaker 134 It's

Speaker 205 really very fascinating.

Speaker 201 And I wonder what you get watching it back.

Speaker 13 Well, in a way, I feel like I got back what I felt reality TV gave to me when I was living in such a culture bubble.

Speaker 13 You know, my bubble of culture was so intact that like...

Speaker 13 It took a lot to penetrate that. And reality television as a married woman was the first time that I saw examples of women that weren't Mormon, dutiful wives.
Like, that's how inclusive my world was.

Speaker 13 And I think that it's like watching people live their lives out vicariously.

Speaker 13 And I've said it a few times, but like there's that scene when Tamara's in the back of the limo with whatever, you know, I don't remember his name now because he's nameless.

Speaker 13 And she says, I want a divorce. Simon.
Simon.

Speaker 13 She's like, I want a divorce. And like, I heard her say that.
It penetrated my heart.

Speaker 13 and I thought oh my god that would feel so good to say wow I'm watching a woman say something that I could never say I could never even think it

Speaker 13 and like watching that just became a way to like you know suddenly see beyond the world that you were expected to live in forever But that was what kind of like chipped it the veneer for you was was reality television.

Speaker 133 Yeah.

Speaker 13 Well, oh, so the whole point to get back, I forgot. I got so distracted

Speaker 13 is that like that gave a lot to me.

Speaker 13 So, when I had the chance to be on the show and be a housewife, like, I knew that, like, no matter ugly, whatever was coming, like, I was just going to put it all out there because I wanted to put out into the

Speaker 13 media that gave back to me. You know what I mean? Contribute to the forum that gave me what I needed.
What I needed was vulnerability, authenticity, and just women speaking unfiltered.

Speaker 13 And so, on the show, I felt an obligation to the audience, to reality TV as a genre,

Speaker 13 and to, you know, my own opportunity. Like, I'm here.
I'm not going to like take it from someone else that's going to be real. You know what I mean? And I'm just going to do it.

Speaker 13 And that's like kind of the sacrifice. Like,

Speaker 13 but it's so humiliation abounds, you know?

Speaker 38 Well, I mean, of course, like, like putting yourself out there is, is,

Speaker 5 quote unquote, like humiliating in some fashion, right?

Speaker 109 Like, even we experience a degree of that, but it's like to have the books plural, even Good Time Girl is a really sticky title.

Speaker 139 You can't forget.

Speaker 112 Especially because of it popping up on the show.

Speaker 77 Episode one.

Speaker 5 But I think with the books, that is

Speaker 186 such a, I mean, it's, it's the way I feel about the podcast

Speaker 106 in a concurrent sense of like a show like SNL, where it's like, I'm in service of something else and an ensemble and it's, it's wonderful.

Speaker 108 But then having the podcast with my best friend is like a fucking lifeline because I'm like, oh, I get to like make sense of things with someone I love one-on-one.

Speaker 132 We bring in people we love.

Speaker 106 And that is, I'm sure in some sense, more isolated what the book is, probably.

Speaker 13 Yeah, absolutely. And it's, and it's, in, it's, it's in your zone, you know?

Speaker 106 But in terms of the genre of reality TV, like you know at this point that like the show and what you've contributed to it is the peak of it.

Speaker 202 Like it is the best reality TV maybe ever.

Speaker 210 I really thought a couple of times there's a lot of people.

Speaker 13 Have you seen Housewives of Salt Lake City in general or the whole housewives of salt lake city?

Speaker 136 No, I think that it's like it's like the housewives of Salt Lake City, I think

Speaker 79 stands out.

Speaker 138 And I don't know if you can really feel that because it probably you understand because like there is like a buzz around it and you can just see.

Speaker 85 But sometimes like when you're when it's you, you can't really tell what it is that's hitting because there's this weird like what's like dysphoria almost about like what is like actually in the world and what is is my algorithm telling me but like we're out here on the outside of it being like salt lake city feels different because it tells a new story you know a lot of the other housewise franchise i think that what the issue is with some of them is it feels like we're not telling new stories yeah sometimes it feels a little bit repetitive with salt lake city it's like a couple things these are women that pass the ball where it's a true ensemble and it feels like we're hearing a new stories And I think that that's like, like, I don't recognize any of the stories being told on this franchise.

Speaker 106 And gosh, they were even playing a game with Angie Kay and Demi Lovato on Watch It Happens Live where it was, you know, Angie or Demi picking like from each of the cast, like most likely to do this, this, that.

Speaker 75 And they just had all of your headshots.

Speaker 152 And just even above the nose.

Speaker 137 Above the nose, I was like, these are indelible people.

Speaker 209 They're iconic, recognizable women.

Speaker 108 And we salute the contribution.

Speaker 201 It's perfectly cast in a way that has to be sometimes frustrating when you want to rip the throats out of your cast members because you know that it's like a cast that kind of can't change.

Speaker 76 Like, sorry, Bravo.

Speaker 13 We've tried, you know, we can't.

Speaker 13 We've, you know, we all think that we can evolve and change. We all think we're improving and we just are exactly who we are.

Speaker 13 And there's so much comfort in that to me, you know, like I love people that are awful and people that are great.

Speaker 13 I love all people, you know, but I just like when they show up and I can know what to expect. Consistency is key.

Speaker 13 And I think Salt Lake City brings these consistent personalities because we're authentic to who we are.

Speaker 223 Yeah.

Speaker 206 I think my favorite moment from the premiere and

Speaker 102 we were commenting on this was when Whitney Rose admits that her business failed.

Speaker 103 And it's, it's, that is, because as a housewife, there's all this like modern expectation.

Speaker 136 And, you know, Salt Lake City housewives, I remember they did that book, like Not All Diamonds and Rose.

Speaker 204 And Salt Lake Housewives isn't even in that because of how new it is in the grand scheme of things.

Speaker 102 Like it's this like post-housewives housewives show where all of you come in and like are expected to not only hit the ground running as like entertaining pop culture figures, but also business people.

Speaker 99 You know, if you do it correctly, putting in air quotes, you have something outside the show for you.

Speaker 138 And I thought that her sharing that it did not go well, especially when such a huge part of her narrative when she was starting it was how badly it needed to succeed because Justin had lost his job at the time.

Speaker 102 Like, I think that that was a really important moment because I do think you guys are at a point where it could go in the direction that is like, we know what we've got here.

Speaker 102 And so let's continue to produce it.

Speaker 143 Or we know what we've got here.

Speaker 58 And what makes us special is the authenticity.

Speaker 67 And that felt like an authentic, real moment of her being like, hi, I failed.

Speaker 79 Let's talk about it. Yeah.

Speaker 13 And Brittany, don't bring it up. Five minutes into the RV trip, you know?

Speaker 38 I mean, Brittany's being herself too. Everyone's being herself.

Speaker 13 Exactly, which is why it works. And I think that there,

Speaker 13 we really, something that's unique about Salt Lake City is that we really are all each other has.

Speaker 13 And I don't know, I can only speak for myself, but being on the show doesn't have a lot of currency in our community.

Speaker 13 Like not at the grocery store, not at the mall, not amongst our closest friends and family. They really don't talk about it.
They don't acknowledge it.

Speaker 13 Certainly with me, they don't talk about the book. You know, they don't talk about this.
Like they just talk to you about your children and like innocuous things.

Speaker 13 Like probably with Whitney, it's soccer and with Lisa, it's Henry. You know what I mean? But they don't give us any currency for the fact that we are.

Speaker 13 on this show that is such a hit and that has changed our lives so fundamentally. And I think part of that keeps us like, you know, tight and humble.

Speaker 218 And I mean, humble, but tight.

Speaker 13 And it makes the show that much more important and our stories that much more cogent because it's, you know, it's all contained.

Speaker 71 Yeah.

Speaker 62 Okay, so you know how the world is a chaotic swirling ball of total stress right now?

Speaker 156 Well, we have a new Hulu show from Ryan Murphy that will give you the much-needed break from reality.

Speaker 65 And whether you know it or not, you are already completely obsessed.

Speaker 158 It's called All's Fair, and Ms.

Speaker 46 Kardashian plays Allura Grant, the most in-demand divorce attorney in Los Angeles.

Speaker 160 Get it?

Speaker 161 It's All's Fair, as in All's Fair in Love and War, and she's a divorce attorney.

Speaker 18 Love it.

Speaker 51 Now let's talk ensemble because Allura does not go it alone.

Speaker 59 She breaks off from a crusty male-dominated law firm to start her own legal coven with some absolute forces of nature.

Speaker 167 Naomi Watts, Nici Nash-Betts, Tiana Taylor, and Glenn Close.

Speaker 169 Yeah, hello, Glenn Close.

Speaker 15 And of course, you need a villain, so say hello to Sarah Paulson as the nemesis.

Speaker 26 And these ladies are brilliant, complicated, fearless, and when they all come together, nothing can stop them.

Speaker 35 I'm talking about the lawyers on the show and the actresses playing them, by the way.

Speaker 37 But hey, if you're thinking this will be all courtroom drama and no drama drama, relax.

Speaker 173 Allura, that's Kim's character, has plenty of twists and turns in her personal life.

Speaker 174 Her professional life crashes into her personal one and uh-oh.

Speaker 175 So how does this super lawyer fix her own mess?

Speaker 168 With a little help from her besties, of course.

Speaker 177 So this series has it all.

Speaker 178 Scandalous secrets, high-stakes courtroom drama, more shifting alliances than Kim's other shows, some OMG twists, and friendships that rise above it all.

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Speaker 145 You have this memory of Angie, high pony, green rugby shirt.

Speaker 139 What is your memory of us going to be going forward as you go? Oh, I've known Matt and Bone for 15 years.

Speaker 88 Yeah, what's the image?

Speaker 210 Listen, guys, Can't Lions.

Speaker 76 Which we all can't remember a specific one because we were so turnt.

Speaker 13 Well, I mean, listen, I can remember.

Speaker 76 Can I take a look at this?

Speaker 67 I mean, I know mine, and I'll say it.

Speaker 47 It's me.

Speaker 102 I remember I was over with a couple of the summer house people. I turn around.

Speaker 192 I see it's you sitting on a bench crying, and Bowen is on his knees in front of you,

Speaker 203 clasping your hands like this.

Speaker 192 And you guys are having one of the most emotional moments in humankind history.

Speaker 210 And I was-I was kneeling.

Speaker 17 I was kneeling.

Speaker 203 And you were talking about how it had been your first time in Cannes since your Mormon mission.

Speaker 102 And you were talking about that a lot during the press that we were all doing together.

Speaker 221 That's wild.

Speaker 102 That's why first of all, out of that, out of all places in the world, that's where they sent you as someone that's then supposed to be like well-behaved.

Speaker 76 Yeah.

Speaker 78 One of the horniest, most gorgeous places in the world.

Speaker 138 And then that you randomly for this thing later, years and years later, when your life is totally different, you're also sent there on a different mission, which is to tell your new life story.

Speaker 39 Yeah.

Speaker 13 Crazy. And that's like, I thought when I was there as a Mormon missionary, I thought I was of the world, you know, this worldly bilingual, you know, change maker.

Speaker 13 And I thought I could never be this happy because I was so indebted in the service of others. My testimony of the church was so strong.
I was doing the Lord's work. I was ruining people's lives.

Speaker 13 And it was for the right. You know what I mean?

Speaker 215 You were an incredible Mormon.

Speaker 13 I was, I was so, I thought I am, this is who I was born to be, and I could never be happier. And at the same time, I was miserable and it was so hard.
And it was soul, you know, gutting.

Speaker 13 And I, to come back there now and feel like the same person, the same enthusiasm, the same ambition,

Speaker 13 the same zest for life and for the people, but to be there on terms that were authentic to me, it just felt like, how, how? How did I get this opportunity?

Speaker 13 And that's what I was weeping to Bowen about.

Speaker 76 Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 210 I'm here. I'm here.
You're here.

Speaker 13 And who gets to do that?

Speaker 137 I mean, I think you were also just exhuming all of these things that maybe you had forgotten about.

Speaker 106 I remember you very distinctly telling me while I was kneeling to you, you were like, I think that was when you were like,

Speaker 106 we would have to get, like, the church told us for these missions that you would go into people's houses and within one minute, be on your knees with them and pray.

Speaker 109 Like, it had to be that.

Speaker 200 It's like the sales people.

Speaker 13 We trained. We trained.
We had conferences where we trained.

Speaker 13 We'd walk up and say, if they opened the door to us and said, you know, these two beaming missionaries, you know, in t-shirts and full dresses, we have a message of hope and love for your family.

Speaker 13 Can we come in? If they said, come in, we grabbed their forearm and said, can we offer a prayer and knelt down?

Speaker 108 Within one minute or five?

Speaker 211 Was it one or five?

Speaker 217 Within one minute.

Speaker 134 Within one minute.

Speaker 203 Get on the ground, they said.

Speaker 13 Because, and they said, like, most people, when you kneel, they're like going to kneel. That's just human nature.

Speaker 13 And most kind people in the world are never going to turn down a prayer. Sure,

Speaker 13 offer us a prayer, throw us a prayer bone, and then be on your way.

Speaker 13 But then you kneel down with them and you pray with them that they will be open to receive the message that you're about to give them. And it felt highly manipulative.

Speaker 222 But it's also at the same time, I mean, yes, just the intention is maybe manipulative.

Speaker 152 But then if you're describing like just offering a prayer to someone, there is like, it's so dissonant.

Speaker 107 There is like, there is a kindness to this.

Speaker 13 Of course, there's a kindness and a love, but like, why make them kneel?

Speaker 13 Why, why do it in a way that we know is a tactic to get us to stay there longer and to, in effect, shame them for turning us out?

Speaker 102 Because I'm sure that what they're arming you with is, of course, these skills, but what's behind it is the fact that you genuinely believe that what you're going to do is better their life.

Speaker 78 Change their life for their family.

Speaker 188 So that's an indoctrination. That's a different family.

Speaker 199 Yeah, that's you being indoctrinated in something.

Speaker 102 That's not you manipulating.

Speaker 110 It's simply, it's actually you really trying to help.

Speaker 76 Yeah.

Speaker 13 And that's where, that's why I find the church so fascinating and the culture that comes out of the church so fascinating. And the fact that I had three daughters that I was training to be

Speaker 13 that exact version of me. And now one's living on the upper west side of New York City, one's at University of Miami in a sorority.

Speaker 218 I don't even want to mention.

Speaker 76 that. Yeah.
No, you don't go to Utah.

Speaker 67 You're not a sorority girl at University of Miami and not raging.

Speaker 13 Exactly. And then I have my freshman daughter at Utampa.
And like, none of my friend's kids have even left the state of Utah. And a lot of them are married.

Speaker 13 So I have, I'm an anomaly in my neighborhood and in my community. And Angie is one of my true friends from

Speaker 13 high school that is, I mean, think of that, you know, like everyone else we know is married with, and some of them are grandparents already.

Speaker 5 So that's what you're saying, like that's what tightens you.

Speaker 17 That's what humbles and tightens.

Speaker 13 There's not a lot of people like us in our community at all

Speaker 220 at all.

Speaker 13 Not a lot of women business owners, not a lot of women entrepreneurs. The highest brand you can get at our Nordstrom is Rag and Bone.

Speaker 76 Yeah. It's a good brand.
It is good.

Speaker 13 I love Rag and Bone and I love Citizens of Humanity, but sometimes the audience wants us to show up in

Speaker 96 something more. That's what you mean.

Speaker 211 And we love our audience.

Speaker 24 I do want to ask about that, too, because again, like Salt Lake City City being

Speaker 102 relatively new, even though it's in its 60s, and it still feels like it was born after the creation of what a quote-unquote real housewife looks like is, et cetera, what that image was born into, you know, television's television watching community's heads.

Speaker 204 So when you show up and the nicest store in your Nordstrom rack is the Rag and Bone, which is really for men, right?

Speaker 129 Don't they really just pretend I'm more, it's more, yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 76 So they weren't even healthy.

Speaker 211 Why are you so gendered, Matt?

Speaker 191 Why are you so gendered?

Speaker 97 No, what I'm saying is just like

Speaker 214 the

Speaker 102 opportunity shore, but also expectation to be as glam as Erica Jane.

Speaker 138 Like, what goes on there when like you collide with the other housewives?

Speaker 204 That has to be so intimidating.

Speaker 99 Of course, I'm talking about like girls' trip, but also BravoCon and like watch what happens live and just like, you know, showing up as a housewife.

Speaker 79 How did that feel? How are we interacting with that?

Speaker 13 Well, for me, it was like, I mean, I did everything in a stretchy Zara. every confessional is either stretchy Zara or Macy's or Dillard's, you know,

Speaker 13 prom 50% off for my first season. And that's like this set, the stage of life I was in.
Also, the clothes that fit me. So, I mean, I felt like I was doing the best I could.

Speaker 13 And I admired, I had such a fandom and respect. And like, knowing how hard it is to like just

Speaker 13 do all of it, you know, these, there's not a lot of women over 40 thriving and doing these types of things.

Speaker 13 So, like, these were were the first mentors in my life, like the first women that I saw get divorced and thrive, that I saw not have six children and still have a fulfilling life, you know, not talk about casual sex.

Speaker 13 I mean, I know this sounds naive, but like this is the world I lived in. So everything to me was like,

Speaker 13 I mean, I didn't feel threatened. I felt like.

Speaker 76 You know, take me with you.

Speaker 221 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 13 Show me the way. Inspired and just, yeah, inspired for sure.

Speaker 94 It showed you another way and honored but i think also embarrassed but honored you know you don't want to bring them down i don't i don't know i think like i get that because i because you talked about this in while we were in cann like on on a panel and i think you were just saying like i

Speaker 108 i saw housewives and it broke the mold on what women my age could do what the possibilities were yeah and you're i think that is going to be true for a while for for every woman in america you know it's like every woman who maybe is a single mom or, you know, an entrepreneur or like just is juggling all these quote unquote unconventional things, especially in a very conventional,

Speaker 106 conventioned place like Utah or, you know, in the Mormon church, like you're talking about something very powerful about television and media.

Speaker 108 And I think you've like taken that mantle so well.

Speaker 106 And I think that is, I think that is why people really

Speaker 190 kind of like are drawn to you as a housewife and they say that you are the protagonist of Salt Lake because you understand as it were the assignment my memory of you is hold on is this phone background that I still have Heather Gay smoking a cigarette that is you in a red dress

Speaker 13 a good time girl I said I'm going to smoke and I'm going to drink when I'm in cann this time

Speaker 148 we almost got you to hook up with that guy remember but then we found out he was gay well they always are

Speaker 13 up the redhead and I wept because I'd never been thrust on a man's shoulder like that before.

Speaker 210 I did. You were reaping the whole time.

Speaker 153 It was pure joy.

Speaker 13 Did we not have the most spectacular time?

Speaker 218 We had the time.

Speaker 207 I was saying, we got back and we're exhausted for weeks.

Speaker 106 I took us a month together.

Speaker 13 Please, you went straight to Beyoncé in Paris.

Speaker 76 You guys already have to stop trying to put it in. We were in the middle of writing.

Speaker 104 We were trying to put together the culture awards.

Speaker 162 You have to imagine.

Speaker 110 We were in the middle of writing the culture awards.

Speaker 249 Can we talk about the culture awards?

Speaker 76 Let's talk about the culture awards.

Speaker 13 I mean, what's our time frame?

Speaker 184 No, we're great.

Speaker 210 The culture awards, you guys.

Speaker 80 That was a bunch.

Speaker 13 It changed award shows forever.

Speaker 137 Stop it.

Speaker 13 It's like, it's the Chapel Roan of Award shows.

Speaker 191 It's your favorite award shows.

Speaker 117 It's award show.

Speaker 127 Next year, the Chapel Roanov Awards shows.

Speaker 193 Having you guys there amidst all of what was happening, what I loved was...

Speaker 13 All the throwaway shots to me having the time of my life.

Speaker 76 Absolutely love. You think we were going to use that?

Speaker 138 You know what I knew we kind of did something there?

Speaker 143 At the end of it, like we're walking back in.

Speaker 148 We had taken a moment to ourselves after the show.

Speaker 102 And we're walking back in and we see the one and only Mary Cosby.

Speaker 146 And she is in this red sort of becloaked gown

Speaker 116 with her gloves. Full gloves.

Speaker 147 And she turns to us and she said, I enjoyed myself.

Speaker 78 And she said, my husband said, you better know who they are.

Speaker 126 She goes, and I do know who you are, Matt and Bowen.

Speaker 130 She goes, we need to have a picture.

Speaker 110 I was like, yes, we do.

Speaker 94 The fact that Mary asked for a picture of the picture.

Speaker 13 I mean, that was bestowed upon you. I've known her for years.
Never have I received such honors.

Speaker 192 It was like she was throwing us some bread as dogs.

Speaker 62 I was like, wow.

Speaker 13 It was like Queen Elizabeth looked over and did the hand.

Speaker 127 That was not a common thing for her to do, right?

Speaker 13 No, yeah, that's incredible.

Speaker 201 The fact that, but then it's so funny because in the edit, I was doing the edit of the show.

Speaker 138 And of course, we're looking for audience cutaways, et cetera.

Speaker 99 And almost every time the audience was cutting over to you guys, what I loved was how seriously Maryam Cosby was looking at everything.

Speaker 147 She was just like, I don't know.

Speaker 125 It did take her like a second, I think, to register what was happening.

Speaker 141 And then at some point, we did win her over.

Speaker 144 But I was just like,

Speaker 42 you won her over.

Speaker 76 You win everyone over.

Speaker 13 And like, it was an incredible, incredible experience.

Speaker 106 Oh, thank you for doing it.

Speaker 13 For doing it. Like.
It should happen every year and I want third row seats where I don't crap.

Speaker 76 The plan is to try. Oh, my God.

Speaker 138 What is your favorite show on Bravo?

Speaker 199 Like, what is the, what, I have two questions.

Speaker 136 One, before we ask you the real question, who is the housewife that made you say housewives was for you as a, as a real housewife fan?

Speaker 175 And is there a show on Bravo besides Housewives, whatever, that's your fave?

Speaker 210 Tamara, perhaps, as you mentioned earlier.

Speaker 13 I mean, that's interesting, but like, no, because Tamra terrifies me.

Speaker 76 Yeah.

Speaker 13 That moment was so raw, and I just really appreciated her forehead.

Speaker 76 But like,

Speaker 13 honestly, I

Speaker 13 that said housewives could be for me, it never occurred to me. Right.
Even until the final call, sizzle reel, it still never occurred to me. But honestly, I would say Vicki Gunvelson.

Speaker 218 Vicki.

Speaker 77 Oh, wow.

Speaker 13 Vicki Gunvilson, because I feel like I feel emotional, isn't that?

Speaker 76 You just talk about your emotional.

Speaker 13 She just

Speaker 13 was herself, you know, and was just obnoxious and in the best way.

Speaker 149 Of course, she was

Speaker 13 got a lot of crap, you know, had to overcome a lot, but just like showed up, had a great business, was proud of who she was, was proud of what she wanted in her relationships, went after it, got it.

Speaker 13 You know, the whole Dawn thing was so painful, but I related to it.

Speaker 13 I could see, and I just think, I just think Vicki's story is pretty remarkable.

Speaker 76 Yeah.

Speaker 13 And she deserved, you know, that when she was in that.

Speaker 13 mustard colored velvet dress. I don't remember what she was mad about, but I'm on her side.

Speaker 91 Yeah.

Speaker 78 You know the thing that

Speaker 210 she did

Speaker 13 serve that show well.

Speaker 142 Oh, she deserved it.

Speaker 217 You know what I mean?

Speaker 123 I think she should still be on it, but that's just my opinion.

Speaker 143 But the thing about Vicki is

Speaker 136 she was, it's like we say often, she was always herself.

Speaker 148 She was always herself.

Speaker 102 And it's great that she was like the OG of the OC, really the first real housewife because She it's it's kind of like when Kelly Clarkson won American Idol, they hit the jackpot.

Speaker 98 Like Vicki Gunvelson being the first real housewife,

Speaker 141 the family van. They hit a jackpot because there was a family vanish.

Speaker 76 Yeah, there was a model for what

Speaker 62 this show was and the kind of person that it revolves around.

Speaker 215 And she is Orange County.

Speaker 134 You know what I mean?

Speaker 13 And you saw how housewives kind of evolved her, you know, and it's changed my physical appearance and like the way I show up to stuff. And you just, you see how the process like changes you.

Speaker 13 But like, you know, I just, it's never, I've never thought of that before but that's just what came to me in this but i bet you recognize yourself more when you look in the mirror now oh for sure absolutely absolutely like i feel like i like am in my zone and i am so

Speaker 13 like proud of the girl that like had to overcome so much more to get me here like you know i look back and i think the courage and like the guts like also everyone hated me and was so mean to me season one and two you know they thought who is this dummy?

Speaker 13 Let's, let's oust her.

Speaker 198 You know, she doesn't represent the ground.

Speaker 184 Just like

Speaker 91 the cast.

Speaker 76 The cast.

Speaker 143 You felt like they were not rooting for you.

Speaker 217 Oh, for sure not.

Speaker 42 Yeah.

Speaker 98 Was that jealousy? Because you couldn't.

Speaker 91 I don't think it was jealousy.

Speaker 13 I thought it was like, I'm not going to be seen with her. Like, I thought, like, this is beneath my level of

Speaker 13 panache and image. And so, yeah, it was really, really hard for me season one and two.

Speaker 98 It's really interesting because I remember like after season one was, season one was a success, especially like, and it really snapped in in the last few episodes.

Speaker 52 And it was kind of a little bit you guys realizing there was something off with Jen.

Speaker 99 And then obviously season two, it becomes a pop culture phenomenon.

Speaker 102 But I remember watching that, and it was very clear in those reunions that people had seen themselves depicted in a way they didn't expect.

Speaker 112 Like, I think that probably a lot of people did expect to look look like the protagonist of the show, which was clearly, I mean, and everyone's incredible in their function on the show.

Speaker 138 But I do think you are, your story speaks exactly to why a franchise exists in Salt Lake City.

Speaker 223 And I think that that's kind of just an undeniable, just narrative choice.

Speaker 102 Yeah.

Speaker 80 So that had to be humbling for people.

Speaker 13 And surprisingly in a bad way to a lot of people.

Speaker 221 Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 152 But you were someone with who came into the show with self-knowledge, which which might not have been said for your castmates.

Speaker 190 And that was probably

Speaker 106 something that set you apart, but also like was very,

Speaker 106 I don't know, like a little bit weird for them.

Speaker 107 I think you probably just like were ahead on that.

Speaker 200 Like, hopefully that's how that's how you look at it in hindsight.

Speaker 13 Well, in hindsight, I just think like I never thought I would be there and they never thought I would be there. And then when I was there, everyone was just like, what the fuck?

Speaker 76 You know what I mean?

Speaker 130 Like in terms of casting at all?

Speaker 151 Yeah. Wow.
Yeah.

Speaker 38 You know, I don't want to make this, I don't want to relate this back to myself, but like, I relate on this level of like,

Speaker 145 I never expected to be on a show like SNL.

Speaker 186 I would always watch, I was obsessed with the show. I watched every week, but I was like, you know what?

Speaker 108 Would be a dream to be a writer.

Speaker 106 And I was, and it was great.

Speaker 196 And then it took like an audience or maybe like some coworkers some time to be like, oh yeah, Bowen's here, you know, but like there's something about sticking with it and staying.

Speaker 106 And whether or not you win over the respective people,

Speaker 152 you at least like, you know, you kind of appreciate the things that are intact about yourself.

Speaker 106 Like, I, I, like, I would not say you've changed very much since you've started on the show.

Speaker 152 You've been yourself, you know?

Speaker 13 I just think I'm seeing more now, which is

Speaker 66 a good feeling.

Speaker 13 A good feeling, but also sad, you know? Yeah.

Speaker 13 That there's so many things that keep people from seeing who you really are.

Speaker 77 Wow.

Speaker 207 And that's, that's really, really interesting. And how, how,

Speaker 201 in a way, it's like

Speaker 102 when there's a camera on you, it almost like it emboldens you to like say this thing.

Speaker 136 Like you do get the sense like across the franchises, like a lot of people started in marriages on the shows that like clearly weren't working.

Speaker 102 And a lot of people say like, oh, they went on the show to get a divorce.

Speaker 147 Maybe not consciously. but unconsciously.

Speaker 13 But it's an opportunity. It's a lifeline.
You know, like I was at the darkest, saddest point in my life when the show came around. You know, I was in a business that was failing.

Speaker 13 I was trying to build it back up.

Speaker 210 Was it failing?

Speaker 13 Well, when I bought it, it was, yeah, like it was, it was, I started out every day, like $1,000 in the red. He had taken out like a hard money loan with some offshore person I couldn't even contact.

Speaker 13 You know, I was just, so I had to like build this business. And in building it, I met a lot of people.

Speaker 13 And that's what connected me to like casting because I knew a lot of these, you know, hot girls getting injections.

Speaker 117 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 13 But the business was a success. And that's where I really started to like pull myself out.
But like, to be on television, that was never, you know. And the plan.

Speaker 184 Yeah. It was, yeah.

Speaker 13 I mean, in the plan, it was, it was just like.

Speaker 141 It wasn't even an Alexa Connection.

Speaker 13 It was me watching DeGrossi Jr. Highs like, you know, a 10-year-old thinking, you know, if you don't get it as a Nickelodeon kid, you're never going to get it.

Speaker 221 Of course. You know what I mean?

Speaker 76 Of course.

Speaker 104 So do you still watch everything on Bravo?

Speaker 13 Yeah, I watch everything and I love all of it. And I really love, I love Southern Charm.
I love Below Deck. I love Captain Jason and I love Captain Carrey.

Speaker 13 And I did Below Deck Adventure with Captain Carrey.

Speaker 136 I was going to ask you about what it's like to be on Below Deck Adventure.

Speaker 13 It was so fun. It was incredible.
It was totally incredible. We went to Norway.

Speaker 76 Oh, that's so great.

Speaker 13 The fjords, like things you would never see from land or even on a screensaver on your laptop.

Speaker 76 It was really incredible.

Speaker 80 You're like, wow, this is real. And not just.

Speaker 116 I know.

Speaker 13 Sometimes I'm just like, this looks just like my screensaver.

Speaker 210 It's amazing.

Speaker 102 I didn't see a lot either growing up.

Speaker 68 Like,

Speaker 99 we had like a working class family on Long Island.

Speaker 102 So now that I get to my adult life and get to go places like Can, it's like so amazing.

Speaker 136 And you do take it for granted because there are so many people that don't have,

Speaker 102 even if they dreamed, it don't have agency access ability to go to all those places.

Speaker 132 Yeah.

Speaker 13 I mean, my first international trip was as a traveling companion for a little person that needed help like with their luggage and stuff because I wanted to see the world.

Speaker 77 Where'd you go?

Speaker 13 Can.

Speaker 184 And not can, sorry, Cancun.

Speaker 76 Cancun. Same day.
Same interesting. Cancun.
Yeah.

Speaker 77 It's probably similar. Cancun and Cancun.

Speaker 217 Cancun Can.

Speaker 13 I wept on the white sand beaches of Cancun.

Speaker 76 Do you know I want to come back?

Speaker 76 Am I going to come back?

Speaker 13 You know, you just have this angst and this like desire for a bigger life, but your circumstances, there's just no path to see it.

Speaker 194 Well, and then like your parameters change as soon as you have a kid or three kids.

Speaker 13 Yeah.

Speaker 104 Like big mistake, huge.

Speaker 76 Don't do that.

Speaker 195 I'm like, you know, I mean, I just graduated.

Speaker 13 I'm an empty nester. I can say it.
Yeah.

Speaker 42 I'm a parallel from millionaire.

Speaker 211 Oh my gosh.

Speaker 155 How does that feel?

Speaker 13 Incredible. It's my rum spring.
I love it.

Speaker 96 Yep.

Speaker 129 Was that, was that true in Cannes or it was still, no, was Annabelle still?

Speaker 149 Can kicked it off.

Speaker 68 Kicked it off.

Speaker 21 Annabelle went to Tampa or what?

Speaker 184 No.

Speaker 13 Annabelle went to Tampa two weeks after I got home from Cannes.

Speaker 252 Wow.

Speaker 184 But like Cann kicked it off for sure.

Speaker 76 Wow.

Speaker 13 And now it's like I'm being like totally intentional about it. We're really working hard.
I know you've both recommended me to Raya. I'm still on the wait list.

Speaker 97 Wait, what?

Speaker 153 I recommended you to Raya.

Speaker 13 Sam Lansky's put in a word to like the CEO. I have every person, Andy, everyone's working on it.

Speaker 191 But that's it.

Speaker 218 There's something about my age group.

Speaker 205 Oh, give me a hundred.

Speaker 13 Maybe my emotional stability. I don't know, but Raya does.

Speaker 66 I don't think emotional stability is a prerequisite for Raya.

Speaker 21 I'll tell you that much.

Speaker 121 At least among the gay men.

Speaker 13 But I'm not online. I'm just so like, that would be my first foray, but I am being totally like, I want to date now.

Speaker 13 I didn't want to do it when I was a mom.

Speaker 97 It's just, it's a weird question.

Speaker 79 What's a good first date for anyone out there that's listening?

Speaker 13 For all the straight guys in a group, like at a dive bar, like last week, and just like hanging out and like having a vibe and then like for sure going home together.

Speaker 128 Yeah, yeah, great.

Speaker 77 You want to, you want to have your one night stand there.

Speaker 99 I do know your vibe.

Speaker 77 We have to be able to do that.

Speaker 76 I can't believe it asking me this.

Speaker 98 It's for the people at home.

Speaker 153 Honestly, it's for the straight guys listening to Lost Coach, which they are.

Speaker 144 They are out there.

Speaker 76 They're out there. Are they?

Speaker 123 No, honestly, a lot of Katies out there have said, you know, my boyfriend will sometimes just have you guys on because they'll have indoctrinated them in the ways of lost cults.

Speaker 76 And how to look smart and be cool.

Speaker 62 Okay, so you know how the world is a chaotic, swirling ball of total stress right now?

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Speaker 35 I'm talking about the lawyers on the show and the actresses playing them, by the way.

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Speaker 173 Allura, that's Kim's character, has plenty of twists and turns in her personal life.

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Speaker 13 okay let's ask you the question heather gay what was the culture that made you say culture was for you so i've i have like a 10 000 of them obviously because every time i listen i think of one but when I was thinking about this one, I was trying to remember like the first moment that really kind of penetrated the bubble of the culture culture that I was raised in because it was very, very

Speaker 13 inclusive. I don't know how to explain.
I was a bubble boy.

Speaker 104 Osmonds were it.

Speaker 13 I only knew people of my kind and that believed and thought I thought the world was flat. No one told me different.
Everyone reinforced it.

Speaker 13 And I had one friend and we're still friends, Jessica Miller. Shout out.
She's a good time girl.

Speaker 184 She,

Speaker 13 her older brothers picked us up and brought us home from school one day, which I don't know how or why my mom allowed it, but it did.

Speaker 184 It It happened.

Speaker 13 And they played Violent Femmes Blister in the Sun in the car.

Speaker 13 And I was probably in like third grade.

Speaker 117 Yeah.

Speaker 137 What was the feeling?

Speaker 13 Every part of me lit up. You know what I mean? I understood none of it and I understood all of it.
And like it, it changed like my chemistry. And I thought, what is this song?

Speaker 13 What? I know, like knowing I wasn't supposed to be hearing it and like I can never unhear it. and I came alive.

Speaker 208 You had a mini awakening.

Speaker 13 A mini awakening. And then we went to her house and her brother served himself a cup of peppermint schnapps with ice.
He was about 16

Speaker 221 in a short glass. The more 16 year olds.

Speaker 13 You can have a sip if you want. I, of course, refused it because I'd already listened to Violent Femmes.

Speaker 76 Right, you were done for the day.

Speaker 13 But like the first time that I had independent income and like the ability to go through the cassette tape, you know, at

Speaker 13 whatever the store was called at the ball back then, it was like, i like sought it out i thought it was like illegal bootleg stuff like that wasn't allowed so what was the typical music that you were listening to with the osmonds like i mean osmonds of course but like simon and garfunkel you know my parents had great taste in like family music yeah classic things classic things yeah i loved but then i got turned on to indigo girls and dar williams and sean colvin and like i just kind of had like a deep foray into sean colvin sean colvin wow so so is that how are you listening to that in secret?

Speaker 13 Once I started working when I was 15 at Teddy Bears Frozen Yogurt, and I always had discretionary income to buy music. He was just talking about how he

Speaker 133 moves.

Speaker 94 You didn't Mac and Moose in Utah or Colorado.

Speaker 77 What were your Colorado years?

Speaker 13 My Colorado years, I left in 89.

Speaker 117 Oh, wow.

Speaker 13 So I was, it was Teddy Bears, then it was Golden Swirl Frozen Yogurt.

Speaker 102 So you were a fro yogurt?

Speaker 13 I used my experience at Teddy Bears to leverage a lead employee position at Golden Swirl, which I see.

Speaker 142 Yeah, you really stayed on to to do high school.

Speaker 78 Being entrepreneurial about it.

Speaker 13 Always, always, yeah.

Speaker 203 Yeah.

Speaker 123 So, so I connect with this.

Speaker 204 I remember my song was The Roof by Mariah Carey, and it was just about like the rain hitting her skin on the roof while she made out with who we found out later was Derek Jeter, and that that was her sexual awakening.

Speaker 123 And I believe I was eight or nine listening to it, and there was something about it that I didn't need to really understand it to understand it.

Speaker 99 You know, it's and music is special like that.

Speaker 220 Yeah, Don't so you think?

Speaker 13 It is. And like, and when it comes from a source and you think, it's like another world.
Like there is another world and realm that exists that I have not yet been introduced to.

Speaker 218 And I want to understand.

Speaker 250 And how are people even thinking to express themselves like this?

Speaker 13 Exactly. Because it never would have occurred to me.

Speaker 210 Right.

Speaker 139 But that song in particular,

Speaker 31 did the brother tell you who the violin themes were?

Speaker 75 What this like...

Speaker 13 No. I just like

Speaker 184 understood it.

Speaker 117 That song okay

Speaker 13 is clear and and occluded you know what i mean yeah it's i just understood it i don't know i felt it like awakened me okay i wanted to stain the sheets i don't know what this yeah you wanted to stain the sheets i don't know what she said you even whispered in here

Speaker 89 you know things about stains in the sheets oh they happen i don't even know why

Speaker 42 you know

Speaker 76 they were eating dinner in bed yeah they were eating pasta they had arabiata sauce all over them That's what it was.

Speaker 210 It could be a million things. Let's not ask questions.

Speaker 124 Exactly.

Speaker 76 Well, and it's all.

Speaker 78 Let's just listen and feel the music.

Speaker 136 But it's, you know what it is?

Speaker 102 Like that song, and very in particular, we say this word a lot.

Speaker 35 Serrated.

Speaker 207 Serrated. Unforgettable.

Speaker 201 Basically, it's like there, it's, it's, it's got a rough edge.

Speaker 76 It's got a rough edge.

Speaker 221 I understand serrated.

Speaker 13 Exactly.

Speaker 76 You know, you know what I mean.

Speaker 13 Lots of ups and downs. Right.

Speaker 76 Cuts right through.

Speaker 151 Yeah.

Speaker 109 Serrated, you.

Speaker 79 You know what I mean? You've had to cut through your life.

Speaker 117 Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.

Speaker 223 I love that answer because it's private.

Speaker 97 You know what I mean?

Speaker 125 It's like, it's like a very private, explicit, illicit thing.

Speaker 205 And just had to rub against everything you had been told about

Speaker 138 the way you should feel.

Speaker 102 And just that as the culture that made you, Heather Guy, say, culture was for her, is like, you can, you can feel the memorability of that.

Speaker 13 Yeah. And like, it's, it's tangible.
Like, this, I'm not going to be able to be who I'm expected to be. This is going to be be harder than I thought.

Speaker 13 You know? Wow.

Speaker 76 That is quite queer.

Speaker 13 Oh, I feel I have like

Speaker 76 I feel like I feel connection.

Speaker 13 I feel like I write from a queer perspective. I really do.
Like, I feel like my books have quite a queer perspective, if I'm allowed to say this out of programming.

Speaker 249 Yeah, you are.

Speaker 94 It's about.

Speaker 151 I'm not going to be queer.

Speaker 219 I'm only 50.

Speaker 222 You're breaking out of a boundary. You're breaking out of something that, you know, someone else has sort of like boxed you into.

Speaker 75 And now you're in control of, well, I'm going to get into the box because that's part of my process.

Speaker 75 That is part of my identity as an artist, a writer, you know, all of these things, a public figure, all these things should be, you know, I think are already driven by that idea.

Speaker 8 I'm being a little like.

Speaker 94 I'm totally with you.

Speaker 13 And in terms of culture, I mean, think of your podcast and speaking on culture, like, isn't there something like fascinating about the fact that like, I came out and like my only mentors of culture are housewives?

Speaker 13 Like, these are the women that like, I

Speaker 13 am figuring out how to be, how to form my life after. I mean, think about when you came out.
Like, you have to, like, you think of who, who, what kind of person am I going to be?

Speaker 13 And I have no examples of that. I know, I knew no divorced women thriving or with their own businesses, none.
Right. And so now it's like, and I see women now that have overcome and have resilience.

Speaker 13 Erica Jane is a huge inspiration to me. The way that she is just like reinvented and she's, you know, I just admire that, like the tenacity, the resilience, the grit.

Speaker 13 Like it is not hard out it is not easy out there and it is not easy to come back from like people being really horribly cruel you know i feel like still shiny yeah i feel like also when you went on ultimate girls trip one of and that was a hard season to watch it's so hard because you realize quickly that you're a guppy in the in the fishbowl.

Speaker 13 And I didn't come in thinking like, I really did come in like a fan, like excited to make fun TV with these incredible dynamic.

Speaker 13 That's how I feel about it. Like for me, me, the creative process of it is like, I am a theater kid.
I grew up doing road shows and family performances and talent shows. And like, I was a pianist.

Speaker 13 Like, this is like what I love to do. So, like, it seemed fun.
Like, we're going to have theme nights and dinners, and we're going to all give each other shade and laugh.

Speaker 13 And, like, you don't understand or expect kind of the menacing or the meanness of it. Yeah.
And I, I really learned, I mean, that's when I became really close with Alexi and Marisol.

Speaker 76 Really? Absolutely.

Speaker 13 So they are, they are too, like, I was with them on Sunday at the Miami game. Like we are close.

Speaker 128 You love Alexi and Marisol.

Speaker 13 I love Alexi and Marisol. They are the real deal.
And they defended me right out the gate on that trip. Yeah.
And they also gave Whitney hell for not, you know, supporting me.

Speaker 13 Like they were true, true friends. And so I think those types of dynamics give everyone an opportunity to kind of show their true colors.

Speaker 94 Yeah.

Speaker 152 I mean, there's the mistake that I'm going to say as a non-housewife, but I'm going to, I'm going to kind of you could be one so,

Speaker 252 be great.

Speaker 145 There's a mistake housewives make, which I think Giselle is guilty of constantly, which is like, it's the way that like some people think like meanness is funny by default, especially like when like, when guys like flirt with you, like they're like they kind of like neg you a bit, like they're mean to you.

Speaker 106 And you're like, wait, no, that's not, that's not what's not as charming or that's not winning anyone over the way you think it is.

Speaker 186 And I feel like Giselle and a certain subsect of housewives do that, where they're like, let me be,

Speaker 106 let me just be nasty and cruel.

Speaker 213 And then like, let me drum up this like inane drama with like this classe Azul bottle.

Speaker 137 It's like, who fucked up?

Speaker 124 That was so lame.

Speaker 203 It just also wasn't fun to watch.

Speaker 206 Do you think she would have been kinder to you if the cameras weren't rolling?

Speaker 248 And has she been kinder to you?

Speaker 13 She's totally kind to me off camera. You know, there's no moms with three daughters.
You know, like she's, she's like, we had fun, didn't we? And I'm like, did we?

Speaker 218 We did not have fun, ma'am.

Speaker 71 I mean, she made like a really nasty comment about our friend Joel Kimbooster's penis size.

Speaker 98 And then it was racist.

Speaker 141 It was racist. But it was just like not cool.

Speaker 136 And then we were checking in with him and he was like, no, I thought we were totally great.

Speaker 102 Just like kind of an example of someone who's one way and then another.

Speaker 151 Which I

Speaker 210 sometimes wonder, I'm like, do people think we can't tell?

Speaker 76 Oh, we can't tell.

Speaker 219 You know?

Speaker 136 But then again, there she is, a success on the show year after year. Clearly, they keep her.

Speaker 194 But she's, I don't know.

Speaker 66 She's a success in her little fiefdom.

Speaker 152 She's a success in a very limited capacity.

Speaker 121 Like no one outside of like this fandom specific to Potomac gives a shit.

Speaker 91 She makes things happen, which is what I think.

Speaker 13 So I also think, honestly, she's incredibly beautiful.

Speaker 188 She's very beautiful and definitely.

Speaker 13 She's intoxicating on screen to me. Like she can be saying mean, mean things.
And I'm just like,

Speaker 13 I mean, I don't, I want the green-eyed bandit or it's Robin, the green-eyed bandit, but I just fall for the green-eyed bandit quite a bit, which sometimes messes with me too, because I'm like, I should be prettier.

Speaker 76 I always

Speaker 195 like diamond dozen, Pretty people everywhere.

Speaker 152 Doesn't really work on me.

Speaker 76 No, everyone.

Speaker 153 It's actually really cool.

Speaker 42 You really buy people everywhere.

Speaker 219 Beauty.

Speaker 126 I always want.

Speaker 155 I always try.

Speaker 203 Like, even with the ones that I'm on record year after year, like, it's just because people act like themselves.

Speaker 223 You know what I mean?

Speaker 134 Like.

Speaker 98 And I guess you kind of learn that after a certain point.

Speaker 147 And even when you go back to shoot Salt Lake season after season, at a certain point, this is now the sixth season that's airing.

Speaker 87 I bet you've arrived at the fact that like, you know what?

Speaker 102 This person is just always going to be themselves.

Speaker 104 When do you stop trying?

Speaker 13 Well, I'm a, I'm never going to stop trying.

Speaker 76 You're never going to stop for

Speaker 76 just a court gesture, just like,

Speaker 125 you never even stopped trying with Jen.

Speaker 13 No, and Jen is, Jen was, you know,

Speaker 184 a force and a friend.

Speaker 13 And I love people. I sometimes say brain on fire.
Like, I love friends where they keep me on my toes. And like, everything they say is interesting or polemic polemic or, you know, just challenging.

Speaker 13 And I don't know if that's just trauma or what, I don't know what that's about, but like there is a part of me that thinks I can be good enough to this person that they will change and like me eventually or treat me well eventually.

Speaker 13 I

Speaker 13 can't, you could, a therapist could tell me that's never going to happen. I'd be like, but I can.
Like I can love them. through it.
I can't. And I know I can't, but.

Speaker 139 Your view of friendship is that it allows for the the challenging stuff, the polemic stuff, the stuff where you're like, this is not like, there's no such thing as like, this is not how a friend should talk to me necessarily.

Speaker 106 Like, is that what you mean?

Speaker 13 Like, well, it's just like, I know they're horrible, but they're hurting. Like, I'll get the caged, I'll get the caged animal.
I'll show them that they can trust me.

Speaker 210 As long as they're, I'll get them to treat me well.

Speaker 38 As long as they don't hurt you.

Speaker 247 I think that's what as friends.

Speaker 184 I like being hurt.

Speaker 42 Oh, Heather.

Speaker 85 Do you know how frustrated that is?

Speaker 125 Do you know what I'm saying?

Speaker 153 Like, there's no watching the show.

Speaker 102 That is the thing I think as a fan watching the the show with you, Heather Gay, is we just want you to know you

Speaker 102 deserve better

Speaker 247 in the friendships, too.

Speaker 99 Like you fought so hard in all these aspects of your life.

Speaker 102 And then I do think there is something with female friendship where you want to believe some of these women are going to treat you better.

Speaker 102 And I remember with Jen, because obviously, you know, we're fans of

Speaker 76 all of the leaves. We're going to treat me better, just for the record.

Speaker 48 Well, we wish that you would.

Speaker 79 So with Jen, though, I mean, when it felt like you kept making excuses for her and, you know, kept up a certain ruse

Speaker 215 with Jen now, she's going to be released pretty soon.

Speaker 151 How are you feeling about that?

Speaker 13 Just

Speaker 13 not really feeling anything, you know.

Speaker 126 Will you make a call?

Speaker 13 Oh, no.

Speaker 13 I don't think, I think that I have closed the door on that for good reasons, you know, and like, but never, I mean, I don't know what the future holds, but like, I also feel like kind of my whole arc on housewives, like, you know, maybe Jen is coming back, you know, and that's my perfect exit.

Speaker 13 How, you know?

Speaker 80 How possible do you think that is? What that I've seen. She comes back.

Speaker 98 Well, that I never think of, well, first of all, they're both different questions, but A, how possible do you think it is that she comes back and returns to the show?

Speaker 13 I mean, I think as viewers of reality television, we know that it's an absolute possibility. Yeah, sure.
I mean,

Speaker 13 I think as human beings on the planet Earth, know what television is about. Right.

Speaker 13 It would be ridiculous to say that it's not a possibility, of course.

Speaker 106 And then in turn, the idea of you then leaving the show is.

Speaker 13 It wouldn't be Jen related, but it would just be the cyclical timing of everything, you know?

Speaker 76 Sure. Yeah.

Speaker 186 I mean, so then you're saying that you've closed that chapter.

Speaker 106 on Jen,

Speaker 38 that like you are, you are, you are someone who is generous with friendship.

Speaker 222 You allow for a lot but then when it's done it's done yeah it's done it's done for now for me okay but of course i have no idea where it's at for jen and what's on her side and i am so you know what i mean because i'm tying this back to like you having to like permanently in some way permanently say goodbye to a lot to the people in your past from leaving the church like you are you have you have a model for this and that's that's that's a good that's a good way to move through the world in some cases like you you you say goodbye to people in your life with some permanence, yeah, and things tend to get better.

Speaker 13 And so, I'm that scared me for a long time, but it doesn't scare me as much anymore.

Speaker 102 That's a huge moment in life: actually realizing, you know, what

Speaker 201 I'm going to be okay without this person, and I could be okay

Speaker 112 without these, this person.

Speaker 9 Like, because sometimes it's because when you are

Speaker 205 indoctrinated in

Speaker 193 what you, what you are understanding to be like empathy and goodness.

Speaker 250 It's like once you let that go, you can like people are harder.

Speaker 117 People are the hardest.

Speaker 221 Yeah, like that's the thing. Yeah,

Speaker 217 it's true.

Speaker 212 Yeah.

Speaker 52 And so I think that's why it's like it's harder to understand, but you do, you can understand it as a viewer, is it's like, you are someone who cares a lot.

Speaker 102 And we can even see that and feel that from you, even knowing you as well as we do, which we went on one sick vacation and we've hung out at an award show where we got to.

Speaker 13 It's real, guys. It's real.
Yeah, every day.

Speaker 76 It's real.

Speaker 22 Because you want to know what?

Speaker 143 Like, we do consider you a friend because we can tell how much you genuinely care. And that comes through the screen.

Speaker 101 It really does.

Speaker 13 I love the show. I love the women.
I have, it has changed my life forever. And it's like an incredible privilege to do what we do and to like have access and to like be in can partying with you guys.

Speaker 76 Like you can take Lisa Barbara.

Speaker 78 You could have died the next day.

Speaker 77 You know what I mean?

Speaker 142 Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 13 And it was really, it's just like, there's, I just feel like

Speaker 13 I don't know how my life could get better.

Speaker 117 Yeah.

Speaker 102 That's really, that's wonderful.

Speaker 99 One last question before we move on to I don't think so, honey.

Speaker 76 Were you guys having fun together at the Culture Awards?

Speaker 103 Like, were the Salt Lake Housewives? Were you guys able to put things to the side at least for that funny?

Speaker 13 Yeah, we're the queens of that. We had the best time.
Plus, when we're on top and we're there, and everyone, like,

Speaker 13 it felt like we were the biggest stars in the movie.

Speaker 76 It was so wonderful to us.

Speaker 221 I mean, you think we're going to bicker about bullshit?

Speaker 13 No, yeah. Like we,

Speaker 13 I mean, there is genuine love there on my side for all of them. You know, they have changed who I am.
They have shaped who I am.

Speaker 13 They are, they are why I'm here and who I've become, which is crazy, you know, because so much of my life was shaped by such different forces.

Speaker 13 And so, yeah, we had the best time. Like, I laughed, I cried, I wept.
I'm not even going to say it was better than catch because it was obviously.

Speaker 13 And And it was just like everyone had such a good time. And did you guys hear how Angie harassed Jeff Goldblum?

Speaker 128 No, don't tell us about that.

Speaker 76 What happened?

Speaker 13 Well, I will tell you that, like, she had good intentions, but her presentation was awful. She went up to him and said, my daughter loves dinosaurs.
Will you make her a video?

Speaker 78 I mean,

Speaker 210 if only he knew.

Speaker 218 I

Speaker 76 probably understood.

Speaker 13 But then she backpedaled and made it all make sense. But I was like, that's not your line.
You have to.

Speaker 219 I think that's a good idea.

Speaker 210 Because he made a beautiful video.

Speaker 76 Of course he did. He did.
He's a gentleman.

Speaker 40 And he's a lovely man.

Speaker 13 Oh, my gosh. And his wife, they were great.

Speaker 196 Emily, she's the best.

Speaker 145 But I think Jeff and Angie are on the same brave wavelength.

Speaker 76 They're in the same plane of reality.

Speaker 194 There's curious people who just, you know, are, you know, just.

Speaker 13 She's like, oh, she likes, oh, absolutely.

Speaker 13 It's her specific dinosaur. You know, it was just like they were off to the race.

Speaker 66 Two characters talking to each other.

Speaker 77 You know what I mean?

Speaker 151 You and I'm telling you, like, it made my heart leap out of my chest to see you guys like having fun together.

Speaker 69 I loved it.

Speaker 155 I hope you're coming. I hope we see more of that on the show this season.

Speaker 138 So before we go out of thanks so honey, what's the come on the season?

Speaker 13 To come on the season, there's a lot of really, really fun, fun laughter. We have a lot of fun.
We wear a lot of costumes. We are into our themes.

Speaker 13 You know, you do see us go on a yacht with Captain Jason.

Speaker 112 Yeah, I bet that's a jam.

Speaker 252 It is a jam.

Speaker 76 He really is hot.

Speaker 39 So hot.

Speaker 13 So hot. And it's just a battle of me v.
Brittany.

Speaker 221 Obviously, I lost miserably.

Speaker 84 We have to say, Brittany has definitely stepped into her iconography.

Speaker 13 Listen, Brittany should know that she may have a short game on the app, but I've got a long game. And Bravo Con is in a few months.

Speaker 211 Well, she should know.

Speaker 13 She should beware. You know, I have history with Captain Jason.
I plan to like,

Speaker 149 you know.

Speaker 13 lean in on that.

Speaker 69 And then I'll know where the party is when we're there.

Speaker 13 Absolutely. And I just think you'll see some growing pains in some of our friendships.
And I think that it's good.

Speaker 13 We go to Greece. We go to Greece, OPA, and that's the best moment.
I mean, Greece was spectacular. And there's a moment we're on a hill with one of Angie's family members.

Speaker 13 And I felt like I was on vacation. Like I forgot

Speaker 13 that I was, you know.

Speaker 75 Working, as it were.

Speaker 13 Well, we never say working.

Speaker 76 I'm so sorry.

Speaker 210 We forgot that we were on a girls' trip.

Speaker 76 We're not best friends in Greece.

Speaker 128 Yeah, right, exactly.

Speaker 117 All right, well, we can't.

Speaker 76 We forgot we were in scene.

Speaker 142 We're never scene.

Speaker 190 I know, I do admire how people on all the shows are like, not, you never say the show, it's the group.

Speaker 76 I love

Speaker 117 the ladies.

Speaker 175 Well, when we were in reunion, not never at the reunion.

Speaker 77 Well, when in New York,

Speaker 210 in New York.

Speaker 13 But you know what a lot of the drama's going to be is when we were at the Lost Culture Awards.

Speaker 221 Stop.

Speaker 252 Are you kidding me?

Speaker 13 An Audible Gasp.

Speaker 129 An Audible Gas from our executive producer.

Speaker 222 There's drama post-culture awards.

Speaker 13 Well, depending on how well this gets at it, it's short.

Speaker 76 I will say, if we start to get a lot of money.

Speaker 78 So there is.

Speaker 13 There is. A lot of things went down intergroup wise.

Speaker 127 Are they going to cut to the culture awards and in flashback? I hope they do.

Speaker 13 I'm going to do my very best to make sure they do.

Speaker 3 I have to say, oh, my God.

Speaker 153 I don't know if you know who I am, but.

Speaker 13 Receipts prove

Speaker 13 timeline screenshots, and I believe a lot of it's on footage at the Last Culture Awards.

Speaker 223 All I want is for at the reunion, someone to go to someone else.

Speaker 146 You owe me an apology for what you said at the Culture Awards. For what you did at the Culture Awards.

Speaker 127 We were at the Culture Awards.

Speaker 144 No, and you were disrespectful to Jeff Goldblum.

Speaker 13 Listen, Jeff Goldblum's just the tease. We have three or four storyline things that happened there that will come up.

Speaker 254 So

Speaker 127 you were disrespectful when Ben Platt was singing.

Speaker 42 Oh, no one would do Danny Dallas.

Speaker 76 You got into it with ourselves.

Speaker 13 But I had to introduce Lisa to a couple of people she didn't recognize.

Speaker 76 Listen, I'm just kidding. Here's what we'll say.

Speaker 145 Here's what we'll say: if there there are cutaways to the culture, if the culture awards is mentioned in any, you know, explicit way, you will be getting a recurring yearly invitation.

Speaker 13 Is that all it takes?

Speaker 124 Incentive.

Speaker 76 Incentive.

Speaker 186 That's the thing. No, no, no.
You're invited anyway.

Speaker 210 I'm just kidding.

Speaker 188 Is for literally the culture awards to come up and then me and Bowen come out in gallons as friends of and sit at the end of the couch.

Speaker 219 We just both sit on each end.

Speaker 78 We're going to be the most, I think.

Speaker 118 And then I go, you owe me an apology.

Speaker 254 And I'll say, you're a friend of.

Speaker 78 When do you want Snowflake?

Speaker 76 You and I

Speaker 207 from across from no man's land all the way when you're sitting on the end screaming at each other whitney goes i wasn't there

Speaker 210 i wasn't there she was so missed i know

Speaker 13 i know and like i we were all text well not all I was texting her the day before and saying, listen, just, you know, go off your phone for like 48 hours.

Speaker 221 It's going to be real painful.

Speaker 104 Whitney, we missed you.

Speaker 128 You were definitely sorely missed.

Speaker 13 And she was so phenomenal in this first episode.

Speaker 96 She was. She really was.

Speaker 13 It was like, but if you had been there, it was like she's in all of her furs.

Speaker 249 I've lost my entire fortune.

Speaker 218 Yeah.

Speaker 13 You know, it was like people who are in the middle of the day. You did.

Speaker 147 There was something about the fortune.

Speaker 210 Yes. Yeah.

Speaker 13 At one point she said fortune. I think they softened it, but it was like, I've lost her.

Speaker 76 My entire fortune is gone.

Speaker 102 I do, fortune is one of my words.

Speaker 204 I like to say, my fortune.

Speaker 77 I love fortune.

Speaker 77 Heather has a great fortune of beauty.

Speaker 154 She has a beautiful fortune of beauty. I think that's a good idea.

Speaker 42 That's that's what they would use fortune.

Speaker 62 Okay, so you know how the world is a chaotic swirling ball of total stress right now?

Speaker 156 Well, we have a new Hulu show from Ryan Murphy that will give you the much-needed break from reality.

Speaker 65 And whether you know it or not, you are already completely obsessed.

Speaker 158 It's called All's Fair, and Ms.

Speaker 46 Kardashian plays Allura Grant, the most in-demand divorce attorney in Los Angeles.

Speaker 160 Get it?

Speaker 161 It's All's Fair, as in All's Fair in Love and War, and she's a divorce attorney.

Speaker 18 Love it.

Speaker 51 Now let's talk ensemble because Allura does not go it alone.

Speaker 59 She breaks off from a crusty, male-dominated law firm to start her own legal coven with some absolute forces of nature.

Speaker 167 Naomi Watts, Nici Nash Betts, Tiana Taylor, and Glenn Close.

Speaker 169 Yeah, hello, Glenn Close.

Speaker 15 And of course, you need a villain, so say hello to Sarah Paulson as the nemesis.

Speaker 26 And these ladies are brilliant, complicated, fearless, and when they all come together, nothing can stop them.

Speaker 35 I'm talking about the lawyers on the show and the actresses playing them, by the way.

Speaker 37 But hey, if you're thinking this will be all courtroom drama and no drama drama, relax.

Speaker 173 Allura, that's Kim's character, has plenty of twists and turns in her personal life.

Speaker 16 Her professional life crashes into her personal one, and uh-oh, so how does this super lawyer fix her own mess?

Speaker 168 With a little help from her besties, of course.

Speaker 177 So, this series has it all.

Speaker 178 Scandalous secrets, high-stakes courtroom drama, more shifting alliances than Kim's other shows, some OMG twists, and friendships that rise above it all.

Speaker 166 And of course, everything is gonna look amazing.

Speaker 176 It's got some unapologetic glam, a work-hard, play-harder lifestyle.

Speaker 54 Every scene just sparkles.

Speaker 34 Everybody makes compromises in their lives.

Speaker 20 Lame men, underpaying jobs. Well, stop.

Speaker 163 Just stop.

Speaker 27 And never settle for anything less than fabulous when it comes to your next streaming obsession.

Speaker 174 All's fair.

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Speaker 74 Terms apply.

Speaker 50 Drama guaranteed.

Speaker 178 This episode is brought to you by Ross.

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Speaker 185 A Santa's secret weapon?

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Speaker 31 Okay, think about your favorite holiday moment.

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Speaker 188 All right, we gotta do it. I don't think so, honey.

Speaker 110 It's time to get our giggles out about things in culture.

Speaker 99 Okay.

Speaker 148 So this is our 60-second segment where we take exactly that amount of time, one minute, to rant and rail against something in culture.

Speaker 99 I have a thing.

Speaker 148 I've realized that something that I never thought I'd have to do is going to be something I

Speaker 139 got to do. Okay.

Speaker 106 This is Matt Rodgers. I don't think so, honey, his time starts now.

Speaker 207 I don't think so, honey. I think I have to learn to ski.

Speaker 192 I've started seeing someone who skis

Speaker 147 and

Speaker 192 it's a big part of

Speaker 102 this person's life.

Speaker 143 And I feel like it was already a big part of my sister's life.

Speaker 76 And this is like when I

Speaker 136 thought this was a good thing to bring up on this episode because I don't think so, honey, me skiing ever before this.

Speaker 250 I really do feel like I'm going to get hurt.

Speaker 123 And what I really don't think so, honey, is an injury at this point in my life.

Speaker 126 Like who needs a torn ACL at 35?

Speaker 186 You know, I don't think so, honey.

Speaker 199 That being said,

Speaker 144 I'm told it's quote unquote fun.

Speaker 166 I'm told it's quote unquote easy to do in the beginning.

Speaker 98 The bunny hills, I know those sound kind of simpler because a bunny is a very simple animal, the way it hops, et cetera.

Speaker 134 But the thing is, like, I don't know about me and my coordination i'm a six foot one 15 seconds not known for my dexterity and but i would say you know what i'm saying it's like i was never good at like the surfing and the the this the snowboarding or whatever five seconds is so new to me i will try i don't think so honey though if i get really hurt you have to pay for it oh oh and that's what i'm meditating

Speaker 76 how did i get rope

Speaker 13 to do an i don't think so honey rebuttal to that i don't think so you can if you want

Speaker 108 yes this is what this will count as yours and then it will go to me no you probably came in with a topic.

Speaker 13 No, I didn't. And I was panicky.
I was going to make you guys. Now I've got one.
Let's go.

Speaker 188 Now you've got one.

Speaker 8 Okay. Okay.

Speaker 106 This is Heather Gays. I don't think so, honey.
Oh,

Speaker 106 another historic episode. We're going out of order.
This is Heather Gays. I don't think so, honey.
Her time starts now.

Speaker 13 I don't think so, honey. Matt Rogers using I Need to Learn to Ski as a ploy to let us all know about his newest friend.

Speaker 117 Come on.

Speaker 13 And the fact that he might need some extra help on the hill.

Speaker 13 Also, I don't think so, honey, a way for him to say, I'm going to need a lot of support. Don't expect too much.

Speaker 132 That But I have to pay for it.

Speaker 13 Yeah, like he's doing everything he can to make sure he gets some hot ski patrol guys to guide him down the bunny.

Speaker 13 I need a sauna and a hot rub.

Speaker 249 This is going to be harder than it looks.

Speaker 184 30 seconds.

Speaker 13 I don't think so, honey. Matt Rogers pretending that he's scared about getting hurt.
Torring ACL, when you're over 50, baby, your body is in great shape.

Speaker 184 And all you want is for us to tell you.

Speaker 76 You're not going to get hurt.

Speaker 13 You're a natural athlete.

Speaker 76 You're going to be a stud.

Speaker 254 Also,

Speaker 13 surfing has nothing to do with skiing, snowboarding, neither. So your plight is unheard and like you're going to be just fine.

Speaker 127 And that's one mana.

Speaker 42 Oh, my God. You killed it.

Speaker 211 You're right.

Speaker 97 I just need to shut the fuck up.

Speaker 249 I don't think, I don't want to get hurt.

Speaker 13 This body, it's a trophy.

Speaker 155 You are so good at skiing.

Speaker 133 You are.

Speaker 153 Honestly, I didn't know if this is a joke.

Speaker 219 No, but you're so good.

Speaker 76 I see you on the ski.

Speaker 218 I'm from Utah.

Speaker 76 I don't just moonlight there.

Speaker 218 I am

Speaker 42 also Bowen.

Speaker 254 I was in Eskimo Ski Club, Colorado.

Speaker 104 So I was a Keystone guy.

Speaker 186 I was a Keystone boy.

Speaker 94 We still go there.

Speaker 76 We were Beaver Creek Vale.

Speaker 95 I love Beaver Creek and Vale.

Speaker 155 I need you guys to hit the slopes.

Speaker 218 I would love that.

Speaker 13 Gowen and I will absolutely do anything together.

Speaker 78 Did you see us weeping together?

Speaker 136 No, I'm telling you, the way that I saw you guys absolutely connecting.

Speaker 102 Also,

Speaker 99 can I just share a little thing that happened in that same gazebo?

Speaker 13 Please.

Speaker 130 So I'm over on the side

Speaker 79 with with Amanda and Sierra from Summerhouse, who are

Speaker 79 both perfect.

Speaker 39 So, so good, so good. And so Kyle.

Speaker 116 So

Speaker 79 just stunning.

Speaker 203 And so we had been hanging out a lot with Amanda, but Sierra,

Speaker 146 because we were all doing Amazon.

Speaker 80 And that was a rare appearance for Sierra.

Speaker 76 Sierra wasn't one of the NBC girls.

Speaker 50 It was like Amazon or something.

Speaker 130 So it was finally, they were all linked up.

Speaker 99 And so DJ Kyle Cook was doing DJ Kyle Cook's cool boy stuff out there opening up for Ludacris.

Speaker 188 So Kyle comes in and he's amped because he just crushed

Speaker 144 he was just acting like he was like a kid on christmas morning

Speaker 76 for ludicrous

Speaker 30 in can it was awesome so great so he comes in and's like dude

Speaker 101 it was so great dude

Speaker 146 and then ludacris's person starts

Speaker 188 the opening dj starts playing so kyle's like we gotta go we gotta go and then like kyle runs off a bunch of people file follow kyle and i'm like okay we're gonna go and amanda goes oh i haven't even gotten a new glass of wine can we take a second and sierra is still sitting and she's like I know and I realize this is my moment to be cool in front of Sierra Miller so totally against my personality I'm usually running after Kyle Cook so I go I go in front of Sierra and Amanda I go yeah like why are we running

Speaker 116 and Sierra goes

Speaker 97 like for a second I was like doing drag to be cool enough in front of Sierra

Speaker 116 and then I like got to sit down and like talk to them for a second and I was just like, hell yeah, I did it.

Speaker 192 And then a half second later, aka now I'm like uncool. But I saw my second

Speaker 116 cosplay as like a school girl.

Speaker 76 And he like spent a moment.

Speaker 96 And then he ran off, of course.

Speaker 124 Then you heard, yeah.

Speaker 76 And I was like out there.

Speaker 136 But then we had such an amazing

Speaker 76 time.

Speaker 95 You got on their level as like you, you got their own.

Speaker 195 You got a code switching icon.

Speaker 13 You're talking to a Mormon housewife.

Speaker 221 Code switching.

Speaker 218 I mean, it's all I do.

Speaker 133 Yeah, it's all we all do.

Speaker 68 It was.

Speaker 201 It was truly, it was a good moment for me.

Speaker 197 Lots happened in that.

Speaker 106 A lot goes down on the gazebo. Yeah.

Speaker 133 And Springer Man.

Speaker 66 Loved it.

Speaker 102 Loved it all.

Speaker 136 Okay, so I've lost the phone.

Speaker 123 It's fallen underneath. Okay, I'll go quickly.

Speaker 13 Bowen's being left out of his one minute.

Speaker 134 This is Bowen Yangs.

Speaker 188 I don't think so, honey.

Speaker 102 And his time starts now.

Speaker 145 I don't think so, honey.

Speaker 106 The fact that I did not wait to get my first Botox at Beauty Lab and Laser.

Speaker 38 I got it done at the germ, and I really, genuinely was holding out on the next time I go to Salt Lake City, whenever that will be i will get my first okay botulism injection talks

Speaker 39 talks talks i'll get my first talks in my face my guy's a minimalist he says i say i have to raise my eyebrows and express myself for work he says i'll go minimal this is crazy 30 seconds i'm i'm i'm new to this you look amazing you seem so surprised this is this is

Speaker 78 Do I, do I?

Speaker 125 I seem so surprised.

Speaker 222 Can I, what's my range?

Speaker 96 I don't know about this. I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I'm gonna really ease up on it.

Speaker 129 I tried it.

Speaker 107 Maybe not for me all the time.

Speaker 213 Maybe now and then in like the summer when I'm like, oh, like I'm, you know, Matt, I want to look dewy.

Speaker 38 But I should have waited to go to Beauty Lab and Laser, a site of true history, television, culture, history.

Speaker 106 I'm sorry I did not go and be a patron to your business, Heather Gay.

Speaker 13 Comped for life, and you look perfect.

Speaker 104 Thanks.

Speaker 136 And that's one minute.

Speaker 153 I will say, it looks great.

Speaker 13 Raise your eyebrows for me.

Speaker 184 And now make an angry face.

Speaker 42 This is all.

Speaker 42 My lemons are still talking.

Speaker 30 My lemons are still there.

Speaker 13 Who advised him?

Speaker 192 See, my derm says he'll only ever give it.

Speaker 143 So I have it in between my

Speaker 80 brows.

Speaker 76 Your 11s, yeah.

Speaker 199 But my.

Speaker 13 It's actually the triangle of sadness.

Speaker 67 Okay.

Speaker 148 So I have it in my triangle of sadness, I suppose.

Speaker 136 But my derm says he'll never give it to me in my forehead because my brow is too

Speaker 128 flat and thick.

Speaker 71 What do you think about this?

Speaker 76 And I'm worried about my under eyes.

Speaker 13 When a guy says to me that he'll never give it to me in the area I have asked, I usually break up with him.

Speaker 42 Oh, oh my God.

Speaker 13 That works for Botox. That works for penetrative sense.

Speaker 144 That works for penetrative sense.

Speaker 130 Well, you know what he says to me?

Speaker 192 He goes,

Speaker 203 he's going to do, we'll do your 11s.

Speaker 136 And then he goes, and maybe a little bit over here, he's like, but I'll never do your forehead because I don't want your

Speaker 104 brow to droop.

Speaker 102 Because he wants me to be expressive as an actor, which, of course.

Speaker 98 But then I was like, but what about my under eyes?

Speaker 13 I am not expressive as an actor.

Speaker 128 No, you are.

Speaker 13 I cannot even lift a muscle on my face. I don't know if I'm smiling or crying or shocked.
And have, do you not feel my

Speaker 13 do not fear the needle, fear the furrowed lines that will age you prematurely?

Speaker 123 Well, like vulnerably, the only thing I'm really like not good about is like just my bags under my eyes and like the like the wrinkles under my eyes right here.

Speaker 224 He goes, You are a candidate for a lower blefo.

Speaker 192 And I was like, a what?

Speaker 76 A lower bleffo.

Speaker 76 A A lower bleffo.

Speaker 110 A lower bleferoplasty.

Speaker 99 So now

Speaker 13 I was thinking of something sexual that only Derm said to their favorite.

Speaker 193 I give them a bleffo on the slopes.

Speaker 13 I need a lot of help coming down the mountain.

Speaker 42 I need help on the buddy pills.

Speaker 102 And I need a bleffo stat.

Speaker 132 Oh, geez.

Speaker 102 But yeah, no, now just bleffo is something in my vocabulary.

Speaker 204 I'm telling everyone, well, you know, I'm a candidate for a blend.

Speaker 13 So you know who can give you, ask all the housewives. Have you had an

Speaker 13 upper blef or lower blef? We just say blef.

Speaker 95 B-L-E-T-H. B-L-E-P-H.

Speaker 112 So when I go to Bravocon, I'll just say Blef.

Speaker 13 L-B.

Speaker 66 L-B. I'll do L-B-U-B.
I'll do a U-B.

Speaker 76 Upper Bluff.

Speaker 128 Upper Bluff. Anyways.

Speaker 106 Well, Heather, I think we should take Matt to Gay Ski Week or something.

Speaker 149 Well, for sure. I'm on board.

Speaker 13 I'd love to coax you down the mountain.

Speaker 76 Now I have to.

Speaker 13 No torn ACL on my watch.

Speaker 203 I will be so good at the appre part.

Speaker 13 Oh, that's the only thing that matters.

Speaker 38 Apre is the funnest part, but you have to do the.

Speaker 202 It's interesting. You do have to like suffer through the actual skiing to make the opera even more enjoyable.

Speaker 13 Yeah, you have to feel the cold in order to enjoy the hot.

Speaker 221 Exactly.

Speaker 114 I get it. Okay.

Speaker 84 Well, much in the future.

Speaker 13 Listen, guys, Salt Lake City, I am your hostess. All the wives are your hostess.

Speaker 136 Well, you know, we're going to have to do like a couple of days with you, a couple of days with Anne.

Speaker 13 We'll just do an Airbnb and I'll bring them all in one by one. I'll make sure that they, you know.
kiss the ring before they're allowed to invite

Speaker 78 before they're invited.

Speaker 136 So

Speaker 102 Angie's first ever Watch What Happens Live was with Bo and and Yang.

Speaker 94 And she was like, you have to be completely nervous.

Speaker 13 She was nervous.

Speaker 106 She was so nervous. And she still thanks me to this day for making her feel at ease.

Speaker 129 And that was at a time when I didn't know how to feel about Angie because she was so new to being an official house dog.

Speaker 149 And I was like, I don't know.

Speaker 96 Like, I love Meredith. Like,

Speaker 196 what does this mean?

Speaker 222 Just the sweetness was so apparent.

Speaker 137 I was like, oh, she's, she's just an angel on this earth.

Speaker 197 I can already tell.

Speaker 38 You just have no choice but to be nice to this person.

Speaker 129 Yeah, she's lovely. And Sean and Electra were there.

Speaker 106 And then, you know, we just spotted it.

Speaker 145 She gave me her number.

Speaker 150 She's like, you are invited anytime.

Speaker 13 She's, I mean, she's wonderful. She also has a sliced tongue of great shade, which we should not despair.
We should honor equally.

Speaker 76 She's got a kill of hair.

Speaker 13 I love it. I mean, I think that she has the range.

Speaker 77 You look like a trampoline with eyes.

Speaker 78 I think you look like a trampoline with eyes.

Speaker 126 This is actually an all-timer.

Speaker 79 It's like a lot of times.

Speaker 76 Most of her minds are all-timers.

Speaker 13 They really are.

Speaker 133 My daughter loves dinosaurs.

Speaker 106 Can you make a video?

Speaker 117 Yeah.

Speaker 76 My daughter loves dinosaurs.

Speaker 219 One inch from his face.

Speaker 106 She's a great communicator.

Speaker 152 You, we can see how expressive you are. You are one of our great vessels of pathos and joy.

Speaker 133 You experience it all.

Speaker 38 You reflect the human condition back to us as we watch. Heather Gay, thank you so much for coming on our humble podcast.

Speaker 76 Yes, thank you so much.

Speaker 117 We love you so much. It's really fun.

Speaker 66 Salt Lake City's on Tuesdays on Bravo.

Speaker 76 Tuesdays on Bravo.

Speaker 102 87 Central.

Speaker 94 Correct? Correct.

Speaker 211 Who knows it's streaming.

Speaker 116 Who knows?

Speaker 142 Catching it on Leslie, yeah.

Speaker 125 And streaming on Peacock.

Speaker 117 Along with the Culture Awards.

Speaker 193 We end every episode with a song.

Speaker 117 Thank you for being a friend.

Speaker 42 Travel down the road and back again.

Speaker 89 Your heart is true.

Speaker 117 You're a pal and a confidant.

Speaker 104 I actually said friends and a confidant. It's pal.

Speaker 13 Am I allowed to join in, or is that like

Speaker 80 that is perfect?

Speaker 76 And if you threw a potty,

Speaker 42 invited everyone you knew

Speaker 254 you would see the greatest gift would be from me and the card attached would say thank you for being a friend

Speaker 21 Lost Culture Ace is a production by Will Ferrell's Big Money Players and iHeartRadio Podcasts.

Speaker 18 Created and hosted by Matt Rogers and Bowen Ying.

Speaker 226 Executive produced by Anna Hosnier and produced by Becca Ramos.

Speaker 150 Edited and mixed by Doug Bain.

Speaker 94 And our music is by Henry Spirsky.

Speaker 52 Get ready for your next TV obsession, All's Fair.

Speaker 50 Starring Kim Kardashian, Naomi Watts, Nici Nash Betts, Tiana Taylor, with Sarah Paulson, and Glenn Close, a team of fierce female divorce attorneys leave a male-dominated firm to start their own.

Speaker 9 Filled with scandalous secrets and shifting allegiances both in the courtroom and within their own ranks, these ladies know that lawyers are a girl's best friend.

Speaker 53 Don't miss All's Fair.

Speaker 23 Now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney Plus for bundle subscribers.

Speaker 53 Terms apply.

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Speaker 25 Like when you need to upload 200 photos of your cat in a Santa hat to post online.

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Speaker 157 It's like having a little holiday helper.

Speaker 6 And what if your Wi-Fi had parental instincts built right in so your kids are always protected online?

Speaker 74 It's Wi-Fi that's not just smart, it's brilliant.

Speaker 166 And during the holidays, that's a gift we all could use.

Speaker 145 Xfinity, imagine that.

Speaker 4 Ever ask yourself, what am I capable of?

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Speaker 31 Ford.

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Speaker 185 Okay, so you want your master's degree.

Speaker 113 You know you can earn it.

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Speaker 4 The packed schedule, the late nights, and then there's the unexpected.

Speaker 26 Well, American Public University was built for all of it.

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Speaker 1 This is an iHeart podcast.

Speaker 3 Guaranteed human.