"All Up In The Macabre" (w/ Sarah Paulson)

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Ready? Set forward. I'm stressed.

Speaker 1 I got invited to a Friendsgiving, and now there's the big question of what to bring. Well, just bring a bottle of Casamigos.
Oh, Casamigos, of course.

Speaker 1 Nothing brings people together like a batch of Casamigos margaritas. A Casamigos margarita really is the perfect cocktail.
Plus, Casamigos goes with everything. Turkey, stuffing, mac and cheese.

Speaker 1 Oh, I was thinking more cranberry juice or ginger beer, but that works too. Well, you know, the iconic rule of culture number 743.
Anything goes with my Casamigos.

Speaker 1 This France giving, you know what everyone will be grateful for? Casamigos. I was going to say you and Casamigos.
Oh,

Speaker 1 let's keep it in that order. Please drink responsibly.
Imported by Casamigo Spirits Company, White Plains, New York. Casamigo Stequila, 40% alcohol by volume.
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Speaker 1 Hey, hey, hey, or should I say, ho-ho-ho? It's me, Matt Rogers, and in the words of another Christmas icon, it's time.

Speaker 1 I'm back with my new nationwide tour, Matt Rogers' Christmas in December. Yes, it's time to remember when Christmas is.

Speaker 1 I'm hitting the road all of December with Henry Kaperski and the whole band performing my album, Have You Heard of Christmas? along with a bunch of other little surprises.

Speaker 1 So if you're in LA, San Francisco, Seattle, Portland, Philadelphia, DC, New York City, Boston, Toronto, Chicago, or yes, Orlando, Florida, I want to see your gorgeous ass.

Speaker 1 Go to mattroogersofficial.com or head to my Instagram at Matt Rogers though and hit the link in my bio.

Speaker 1 Until then, stream the album, get your look together, and get ready to deck the damn halls at a venue near you. Christmas in December, you in my heart.
XOXO, Santa Boy.

Speaker 1 Look, man.

Speaker 1 Oh, I see.

Speaker 1 Oh, my. Bowen, look over there.
Wow, is that the culture? Yes, goodness. Wow.
Las Cultoristas.

Speaker 1 Jay Dom, Las Culturist.

Speaker 1 I was just touching base with you before we got on because you and our guests share something.

Speaker 1 You're on the real SNL. She was on the fictional Studio 60 on the Sunset Strip.
She played a Christian sketch comedian. I'm halfway to that.
I just have to be witness. Yeah.
And then I'll be there.

Speaker 1 One of these days, someone will see you. What's your background with Christianity? Do you? Okay, so we are on this ride.
We're off to the races. I'm a confirmed Catholic.
Get this.

Speaker 1 You were confirmed? I went all the way through. My parents.
You heard so much about it. it.
And then I got, I don't talk about my Christian.

Speaker 1 It was not Greek Orthodox. No, I was Greek Orthodox.
And then we moved. And my parents were like, you know what? Let's just be Roman Catholic because it's basically the same.
And so then,

Speaker 1 you know, don't tell him. And don't tell him about us.
Don't talk about it. I don't know his opinion.
It's ruler culture number eight. I don't want to know.

Speaker 1 I don't know about the Pope's opinion and not us. What does the Pope kind of do? When the Pope went to one of your Chicago shows back in the day.
Just to be like, hey,

Speaker 1 I knew I saved that face. It's like when Taylor Swift recognizes someone in the crowd and it's the Pope.

Speaker 1 Honestly, he's probably a Taylor fan. Play Swift too.
Isn't. Anyway, my confirmation name, it was between,

Speaker 1 this is so my life, too. I was choosing between Christopher and Blaze.
You already have one of the apostles' names. Matthew.
I picked Christopher too. I stayed there.
Blaze? No, I didn't pick Blaze.

Speaker 1 Blaze, but I could have. I-S-E-Z or Z-E.
B-L-A-I-S-E. That is the, there is a, there is a saint, Blaze.
Oh, that's right. People don't know this.
And he was the saint of, I believe, fire.

Speaker 1 I'm making it up. I don't think there is.
Yeah, Saint Sebastian. I just picked a gay name.
Speaking of names, our guest is Harrington Lane. Harrington Lane.
Well, that's a very dynasty-coded name.

Speaker 1 Esquire. Esquire.
Yes.

Speaker 1 When I got on the Wikipedia for the show and I read the, first of all, the names of the real actresses in the cast was one thing.

Speaker 1 And then reading the character names really blew me away because Kim Kardashian will be playing Allura Grant Esquire.

Speaker 1 My name is Allura Grant. I'm your lawyer.
Oh my God. Hey, you made it.
Meet my friend Allura. You've met Allura.
And you turn at someone who looks like Kim Kardashian.

Speaker 1 You go, oh, that's the definition of overstatement. What is Alora the saint of?

Speaker 1 Okay, guys.

Speaker 1 There we go. There we go.
It's fung background. Fucking all's fair.
Fucking Alls Fair. This show

Speaker 1 made in a lab and the Ryan Murphy lab, which is one of the best labs. For us, I think.
For us, you've got our guests. You've got Kim, Naomi, Nisi, babe, Nisi, babe.

Speaker 1 Judith, Nisi, Miss Liz Burks, Miss Liz Burke Lee.

Speaker 1 This is this is a dream. This is a dream and a half.
It's a fever dream that I cannot wait. It's going to be on Hulu.
You're all going to be watching it.

Speaker 1 Tony winner. Emmy winner.

Speaker 1 Culture award winner. Culture award winner.
I'm sure it's something. We've got a lot of categories.
Icon 400, honore a a

Speaker 1 figure of great

Speaker 1 talent, renown, and more. We are

Speaker 1 super gagged and more to have the one, the only Sarah Paulson!

Speaker 1 Looking

Speaker 1 I came dressed like Amelia Earhart today.

Speaker 1 I did. Explain the.

Speaker 1 It's just Celine. It's the new Amelia.
It's the new Amelia, and I'm just, you know, representing her representative. Yeah.
It's like a person who's more, I'm a terrified flyer also.

Speaker 1 So this is like not, it doesn't work together. I think it's incongruous, but that's why it works.
That's how I've decided.

Speaker 1 We were saying like the, the looks that were being turned at the premiere was just, I guess, the, just like us showing us into a new world of what red carpets can be.

Speaker 1 Yeah, especially if Kim Kardashian is your co-star, because what happens is Kim sends someone to do a little walk sea woo,

Speaker 1 goes and takes a video of what the carpet looks like, comes back, and Kim is like,

Speaker 1 like this. Whoa.
Yeah. Like, where's the lighting? Where's the thing? And so when we were all standing there looking more ravishing than we've all ever looked,

Speaker 1 and we saw these pictures and we were like, what is the story with this? And it's because Kim went and dealt with the lighting. So we were lit all from below and above.

Speaker 1 Like the Oscars doesn't have lighting like this.

Speaker 1 It's like, you know, and then she went and made sure that we had it in Paris and we had it in London. And so.
So you're privy to the Woxy Woo video. Are you seeing the video?

Speaker 1 I have not seen the Woxy Woo video, but I was told that Woxy Woo happened. She gets the info and she's like,

Speaker 1 no. And I just, I got to say, sign me up for that.

Speaker 1 Yeah, sign my face up for that. You know, if you can just follow me around like this all day long, that's really the actor was incredible.
No, it was just, I was like, who is that?

Speaker 1 Looking at my own face. I was like, who is, who is that?

Speaker 1 And it's like, it's just me with really excellent lighting. You don't ask yourself that question very often, do you? Who is that? Because I don't, I, I mean, you're a great chameleon.

Speaker 1 I can look like different things. You were Linda Trip on the bus.
I was Linda Tripp once for a spell. Yeah.
It was one of the greatest spells of my time. It was like one of my favorite spell.

Speaker 1 That spell was like,

Speaker 1 oh, Alakazoo, Wiggity Woo, boom, Linda Trip. I mean,

Speaker 1 it was like one of my favorite. I like a peg leg and a black tooth.
That's like what I care about from an acting standpoint. Like,

Speaker 1 do I have a, you know, is there a hump in the back? Have you played a pirate yet? Like, today I'm playing a pirate.

Speaker 1 Today I'm the pirate of the skies. Look if

Speaker 1 Amelia went down hard and like wasn't. I think she did.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 It wasn't confirmed at this point. Like Amelia went on.

Speaker 1 I think she's gone. She's gone.
I still think we can find her somewhere, the plane or something, but I digress. I think we should do a big, gay, modern hunt.
Funeral.

Speaker 1 Oh, I was going to say funeral, but let's hunt her funeral. But we could also get the right minds.
I think we've been on the wrong track. Like, we don't need the aviation experts.

Speaker 1 We need some like gay people. We need a

Speaker 1 Laura Grant.

Speaker 1 Yeah, Carrington Lane.

Speaker 1 And Glenn Close as Dina Standish, just on the case.

Speaker 1 I love Dina Standish. Dina Standish.
Emerald Green is actually.

Speaker 1 actually Milan. Green, green, Milan.
And by the way, in Paris, Tiana, like all our costumes were in these different rooms, like at these events. And it's just, we all have our names.

Speaker 1 And then it's just Milan.

Speaker 1 And she's like, did they not give me a last name? And I was like, it's like your share or Madonna. Exactly.
Or just Milan. Mononym.
100%. It's amazing.
What can you tell us about Carrington Lee?

Speaker 1 I love your dynasty coded thing, which

Speaker 1 it's got to, I mean, I don't think Ryan and I ever discussed this, but it was a foregone conclusion to me that this was Alexis Carrington. not

Speaker 1 because this is just like, and I am playing that person on the show. I am your, your, you know, esquire, villain esquire.
It's giving antagonists. She's given antagonists.
She's given out for blood.

Speaker 1 She's given revenge till she dies. And she will be revenging.
Because essentially, these ladies started their own law firm. They leave Dina Standish.
They leave the great Glenn Close. Yeah.

Speaker 1 Go off on their own fly the nest, and they don't take me with them. And I am the greatest lawyer, in my opinion.
And in also Glenn Close's opinion.

Speaker 1 Like I was, not Glenn Close, Dina Standish's opinion. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
I was the star of the thing. And, but I'm a, you know, I've got a bad attitude.
I see. And so nobody wants me around.

Speaker 1 And so then they start throwing firm and they leave me behind. And when you leave this girl behind, she's going to come for you.
Yeah, she's going to come for you. Oh, so basically it's that.

Speaker 1 But it's basically like a little person who was injured and now she's out for blood. Great.
You know, hurt people hurt people.

Speaker 1 And we hope to see her hurt very badly back and forth. You are going to see a lot of hurt and then hurting.

Speaker 1 Yeah. People's husbands.
I don't care.

Speaker 1 Let's just go for it. Delicious.
I mean,

Speaker 1 I'm getting to that age now where I am thinking about how my own abandonment issues have calcificated. Because this is not something I've thought about until my 30s.
Yeah. Abandonment is,

Speaker 1 she's a motherfucker. She's a very fucking fucker.
And she really,

Speaker 1 some people retreat. Some people go all in in terms of like how they're going to recover.
Some people's calcification around the original wound means they can no longer function or let anything in.

Speaker 1 Some people become like really desperate for some attention and won't let people go that they should let go. We're three actors here.

Speaker 1 Or you become three desperate, desperate, attention-seeking freaks. Yeah.
Speaking of desperate. Oh, wait.
So I think, so definitely the first time you hit my screen was Studio 60.

Speaker 1 And I remember being like, who is that? And I think many people in the world were like, who is that? Finally.

Speaker 1 But you were iconically Lynette's sister on desperate housewives which was really a formative

Speaker 1 culture in our life oh i love this oh no i remember you from it this was you do yes this was a moment in my career where i you know not a lot was happening was not a lot was happening and then felicity huffman who was a was a good friend of mine then is a good friend of mine now was like hey you know i think i was at some party with mark cherry where he has a grotto there's like a swimming pool grotto

Speaker 1 envisioning this thing

Speaker 1 and i was like i think there was like a charade tonight and then i think i got you know like a little crumb thrown my way where I could be Lynette's sister, which to me was like.

Speaker 1 Really good cast thing. Yeah, and it was Carrie Preston was the other sister.

Speaker 1 Elspeth. Elspeth.

Speaker 1 And also, she on True Blood, that is an underrated performance.

Speaker 1 Carrie Preston's been giving underrated performances her whole career. Excellent.
Her husband. Her husband, too.
Yeah. They're just so good.
So good. So good.
Actually, you know what?

Speaker 1 I remember that was like when ABC was like kicking ass and Michael Emerson was Ben Linus on Lost. And then also, yes, but wasn't he also doing something else at the same time? He He was on a show with

Speaker 1 Jim Coviesel?

Speaker 1 Jim Caviezel. Yeah, I said it.
Christ on the Christian episode.

Speaker 1 Really nice work. Strong.
But strong. Was that true?

Speaker 1 It was a show.

Speaker 1 Jim Caviezel was on some procedural essay.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 1 Something. But I feel like he was doing double duty.
It was like the time when someone like Michael Emerson could do both. Yes, and then

Speaker 1 his wife was on all the other things. And True Blood, and it was just like a thing.
And now she's Elspeth. Now she's Elspeth.

Speaker 1 Completely taking over not just the airways, but also the commercials. Okay.
Oh, the Elspeth commercials.

Speaker 1 Arays and scarfs and Elspeth. I just love it.
I just love it so much. You're going to see a lot of the Elspeth Halloween costumes, I think.
Oh, yeah. That's right.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 The other prediction I make is a lot of Gladys from Weapons. Of course.
A lot of Gladys.

Speaker 1 There's going to be a lot of that. But

Speaker 1 both of those are like colorful women. Colorful women.
I just hate Halloween. Right.
Okay. Talk about it.
Actors tend to Halloween. Yeah.
I don't want you to ring my doorbell. Okay.

Speaker 1 I don't want to have to talk to little people,

Speaker 1 children. I don't like the dressing up.
I'm like, oh, God, it's like the one day of a year. People are just like, I get to be.
Right.

Speaker 1 And I'm, you know, I understand that I get to do this in my life and I've been so blessed and I'm so happy and lucky.

Speaker 1 And I'm also just like.

Speaker 1 My costume today is me. Of course, I'm myself today.
Yep. Here's my thing.
I hate a pumpkin spice latte.

Speaker 1 I mean, I could go on about this when I've got my minute to write, but I'm saving something else for that. But like, I don't want your pumpkin spice.
I don't want it.

Speaker 1 i don't like pumpkin pie i don't like anything pumpkin i don't like the color orange i'm just it's not my vibe halloween's not my time sorry so i want to tell you something you look at my life of a show girl cody phone right now yeah i do this is not a good time for you because

Speaker 1 the sided orange is it i don't like it i don't like it then how do you get through this time of year um i do i i i muscle through it yeah and i have often worked with wonderful hair makeup people and they love to do the trailer in the Halloween jam and there is like nightmare for before Christmas stuff and like someone's like,

Speaker 1 like, cobwebs everywhere. Cobwebs everywhere.
You come in and you're like, oh.

Speaker 1 It's just like, I don't know why it makes me so aggro, but because I love candy. Yes.
Never been happier about candy in my life. And you famously are in a lot of scary shit.

Speaker 1 I'm in a lot of scary shit, but I'm the biggest scaredy cat. I don't watch anything scary.
Likewise.

Speaker 1 I don't watch any of those, what are those really scary movies with Patrick Wilson and Vera Farmiga? Like two. Oh, the conjuring.
The conjurings. I absolutely cannot with a doll, a creepy doll.

Speaker 1 Megan's not forgetting.

Speaker 1 No, none of it. Yeah.
But then you did see weapons? I did see weapons because I got tricked. I went with my friend Jason Butler Harner.

Speaker 1 I went with Jason Butler Harner and Pedro Pascal, and we went to see this movie. And

Speaker 1 trickster, famous trickster. Trickster, famous trickster people.
Yeah, he's a famous trickster. And I didn't know.
I didn't know what I was, I didn't know. And you felt jilted.
You felt jiltilistic.

Speaker 1 Except for, to me, it's like the performance of the years in that movie with Amy Madigan. It was just to me, I'm like, well, thank God.

Speaker 1 Amy Madigan is being given an opportunity to do what Amy Madigan can do better than anybody else. And she's just a genius.
And I'm just like here for an, I want someone to accept an Academy Award

Speaker 1 for a movie like that. Because James McAvoy and Split.
I mean, do we need to talk about like, I mean, like, not even nominated. Like, what are we talking about? Yeah, one hundred.

Speaker 1 Tony Collette in whatever that scary movie. Yeah,

Speaker 1 Perroterry. Heritage.
Heriterry.

Speaker 1 Yeah. I mean, these performances are, they're not easy to do.

Speaker 1 And like, nobody wants to give. Ellen Burston and the exorcist, Linda Blair and the Exorcist.
Why aren't we giving statues to people? This is another thing.

Speaker 1 I mean, I've got a lot of ranting to do, obviously, but I don't think that's the same thing. Those horror movie horror movie performances.
They don't get the respect.

Speaker 1 Peter Nyongo and us should have been nominated. Correct.
I thought Daniel Kulya and us should have won Allison Williams and get out. That was such a horror.
I love that nomination.

Speaker 1 I think Sitters is going to get a good show and get awards. You're probably right.
And, you know, I recently, I'd be going on the Gold Derby. I like to go on the Gold Derby, too.
I'd be going on it.

Speaker 1 I'd be going. I'd be going.
And so. Shockingly high, Amy Madigan and the supporting actress, like people are predicted.
Predicting it because I think things are changing.

Speaker 1 They're changing, but also I think there's so much respect for her that predates this sort of genre moment that people are like, oh my God, we want Amy Madigan seen by all of us all the time everywhere.

Speaker 1 And if this is the, you know, and it's just also undeniable. And that movie is like a sneaky horror movie.
Yeah. It's not like blood and guts horror movie.
It's more of a psychological thing.

Speaker 1 And so you think you're watching, like, you got people like running around like this, you know, and it's like, are you a bird? Are you? Do you know what I mean?

Speaker 1 Like, oh, look, we can pretend it's not.

Speaker 1 This

Speaker 1 of it, yeah. And also the way that she styled it, Bowen always says, like, it serrates the movie.

Speaker 1 Memorable and serrated. I love that.
But there's a pretty bloody gory moment.

Speaker 1 It's true.

Speaker 1 It's the first time in a long time that I've had to cover my eyes at a few. Yeah.
And it's always the gay couple that get it. I know.
Remember it too? No, probably not because you didn't see it.

Speaker 1 That one I didn't see. You didn't see it.
That one I didn't see. But you'd be going on the gold derby to decide what you're going to do or about what's going on for your friends.

Speaker 1 Interesting questions.

Speaker 1 Are you like going for your own ballot and being like, what are people saying? Or are you like, my friend so-and-so is up for it? Are they gay? So basically, I

Speaker 1 do remember voting. I always vote for you.

Speaker 1 But I like, I remember going, and the first time I voted for SAG, I really surprised myself because I was like, wait, all my favorite stuff isn't even what's in the conversation.

Speaker 1 Because we're not, you know, I don't know how many ballots you've been sent, but they're ones that I'm like, ah, what even is it? Like, you know, they're, they're big when you get to be a nominator.

Speaker 1 And it's like, I take this so seriously. I'm like a freak about it.
I never vote.

Speaker 1 I mean, if you're brilliant in something, but like I liked something else better and you're my best friend, I'm still voting for the thing I like

Speaker 1 that. Because I just feel like you want to honor the greatness of the performance and not just like your friends.
And I just don't, I can't. I watch, I will not vote in a category I have not seen.

Speaker 1 Yep. Yeah.
Just won't do it. I take it very, very seriously.
I want you to look Pedro in the eye and vote against him.

Speaker 1 I did vote against him this year. Who'd you vote for? I voted for

Speaker 1 at Emmy's? Yeah. It was him.
Well, because he was kind of big. No, I voted for Adam Scott.
Oh,

Speaker 1 yeah, yeah. Sorry, Pedro.
Sorry, P.

Speaker 1 I couldn't help it. It was the performance to me that was just

Speaker 1 so good. Yeah.

Speaker 1 My main thing about Halloween, I agree with you. But my thing is everyone's everyone's on about fast fashion and stuff, right? It is like the most unsustainable holiday.
Yes, that's true.

Speaker 1 It's like people just wear a thing once and then throw it out. Yeah, they don't fuck the packaging that it comes in, the plastic and the thing.

Speaker 1 Exactly. Some dog is suffocating in the corner because they like got inside it.
Oh, you see where I went? I'm sorry. No, it's okay.
It's really good. So it can happen.
It can really happen.

Speaker 1 I don't follow you for that.

Speaker 1 I just, see, the thing is, you briefly lived in the macabre there. I did.
As someone who like literally lived, you lived in the macabre for years.

Speaker 1 You were all up in the macabre. Title Title of that.
All up in the macabre. All up in the all-up in the macabre.
That's a good title of it.

Speaker 1 All up in the macabre. I did live in it.
I did live in it. How do you do that? I'll never forget the scene of you and hotel, which is the one I tried to watch because of Gaga.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 And basically, what happens to Mr. Greenfield? Oh, yeah.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 I had to tap out of that. It was so cool.
And you were in this

Speaker 1 watching it. I got to watch it.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 How do you do that?

Speaker 1 Yeah, I was on set for it. I saw it.

Speaker 1 Whatever you're thinking, it's way worse. It's like a giant conical dildo.
Yeah. Right? He gets fucked to death.
Fucked to death, but with like a real drilling. Ryan.
Ryan. You're sick.

Speaker 1 You're sick, but you know, I'm here for it. Something's in my eye, guys.
Whatever. It's fine.
Dirt, except Macabre. No, macabre.
Something's in my eye. First of all, macabre or Macabre.

Speaker 1 Let's get on the same

Speaker 1 page.

Speaker 1 Macabre. Macabre.
Thank you. I mean, I like...
Well,

Speaker 1 people make fun of it. They're like, oh, Mr.
Frenchman, we, we. And I'm like, no, it's just how you're first language farm.
No, no. Is Is your first language French? Not technically.

Speaker 1 You're a Frenchman? No.

Speaker 1 Born in Australia. I moved when I was six months old.
So you could say English and Mandarin were the first things that like hit my ears, but then we moved to Quebec. Oh, so that kind of French.

Speaker 1 Then French was like spoken the most in my life for a while. What? And then hard left into English.

Speaker 1 But you didn't have any sort of like Australian accent. Did you hear that poor of all things? No, no, no, no.
It wasn't good. No, I've got a couple of friends and all we do is this.

Speaker 1 That's really good.

Speaker 1 We just love to do it. It's great.
My makeup is from New Zealand. Yeah, from South Africa, right? I can't remember.
Very funny.

Speaker 1 Remember? No, it's no.

Speaker 1 I love that.

Speaker 1 I love when people said no.

Speaker 1 It's getting old for me. It's never going to get old.
You don't never get old.

Speaker 1 Oh, but somebody taught me a secret about how to say, and being a really great accent for this voice, is to say, rise up lights. Rise up lights.
Rise up. Rise up lights.
Rise up lights.

Speaker 1 Rise up lights. Rise up lights is the same thing as saying razor blades.
Rise up rises up. You say, rise up lights.
Rise up lights. Rise up lights.
Rise up lights.

Speaker 1 My on-ramp into Australian is always... Oh, yeah.
Oh, yeah.

Speaker 1 Oh, yeah.

Speaker 1 Very resonant language. Oh, yeah.
Yeah. Oh, yeah.
Oh, yeah. Up here.
With a Christian? With a Christian? Oh, yeah.

Speaker 1 Okay.

Speaker 1 There you go. But a bit hard.

Speaker 1 I like rise up. Rise up lights.
Rise up lights. Rise up lights.
Rise up lights. What are rise up lights? You know, like, just think of the word rise.
Okay. Up.
Like lights.

Speaker 1 You're just like rise up lights. What's the favorite accent you've ever done?

Speaker 1 I haven't really done a ton of them. Yeah, I was thinking of that.
I don't really get to do that often. I'm usually just like running from a clown or

Speaker 1 you don't need it as a crutch. Yeah, it's not a crutch for me.

Speaker 1 I like to live in my Linda Tripp world and my Marshall Clark. I like a wig.
You like a wig. Mom really likes, Mama likes a wig.
Mama likes a wig. My mom really likes a wig.

Speaker 1 Mama excels in a wig, loves a wig. The Marsha Clark of it all, by the way, that was, I'll never forget the Marsha, Marsha, Marsha episode.
Talk about going to Gold Derby.

Speaker 1 I was like, let me go on to Gold Derby, make sure that I'm not crazy. This is at number one for everyone.
Oh, my God.

Speaker 1 That was such a slam dunk, like such a well-deserved Emmy win after you being overdue at that point. Thank you.
By the way, we also saw Appropriate. You're brilliant.

Speaker 1 Thank you. But I do want to ask, the Kim K of it all figures into people from Zoj Simpson famously.
Yes. Did you touch base with her about that?

Speaker 1 You were during it. No.
Of course. No, I barely talked to Marsha Clark before.
I mean, I didn't talk to Marsha Clark before we shot it, so it wasn't until we were like episode six or seven.

Speaker 1 i think i had finished the marsha marsha episode and ryan's like if you want to reach out to her you can do it now because now you've faced it you can't even then you hadn't met her no no we had a real drunken night one night after like i was into episode seven or eight of the 10 or 12 i can't remember how many there were 10 i think yeah and then that was that like i saw her mole like i literally saw her face through a spinning like revolving door and i was waiting there and i was like i was so entrenched by mole in my love for marsha clark at that time because i was so inside it yeah and then i remember like seeing like her walk through the revolving door and like, I swear to God, there was a glint of like sparkly sunshine right on the mole.

Speaker 1 And I was like, moly, moly, mole.

Speaker 1 It was like I had like a cinematic, like slow push-in on the mole. And it was like, there she is.
I can't believe it.

Speaker 1 And she was, no, she didn't, but I was like, I guess I need to.

Speaker 1 Yeah. She was really hesitant about the whole thing.
She'd only been like raked through the coals publicly.

Speaker 1 So the idea of like a dramatization of this when nobody writing about it was actually there, the idea that it was going to be, I kept trying to say, like, this is going to be, I really think like the angle, I know, I can speak about what the angle is for sure.

Speaker 1 And I don't think you'll be upset by this. And she didn't really have a lot of faith in that.
But then I think obviously it all, it all I guess it's like, why, why would anyone who'd been only

Speaker 1 for decades, like just, you know, where the

Speaker 1 fault of losing the, you know, whatever it was was sort of laid at the prosecution's feet. And it just was a mess and then just always, always, you know, poked fun of and all this stuff.

Speaker 1 And so anyway, it just, I can't remember what your question was, but but I was about

Speaker 1 to say, Gold Derby. Yeah.
I love the Gold Derby. No, but it was about Kim because now you're in a show with her.
And that was like something that I think like artists

Speaker 1 didn't really understand. That was the like

Speaker 1 the inception of the credentials. Chris was really good friends with Nicole, best friends with Nicole.
And so that was a real thing. So yeah, Selma Blair played her.

Speaker 1 I can't remember who played the children, but just recently Kim told me that there were people who played her on the show, like played Courtney and Kim, I think.

Speaker 1 There were. Yeah, and I don't remember that part because it was a section I I wasn't in.
So I paid very little attention to it. You know what I mean? I still haven't seen it to this day.
Really?

Speaker 1 Usually the usual of your work? I had always watched my work before then because I think I was so still thrilled that like someone was letting me do it. I was like, look at there I am.

Speaker 1 And now I think in particular with that was the first time where I was so obsessed and like deep in it

Speaker 1 that I felt like if I watch this, I'm going to see every time she was left-handed, I pick up the pen with the wrong hand. And oh, God, I'm going to see all the things that are wrong.

Speaker 1 And so, and then when the response was so robust, I thought, now I'm really not going to watch it because I don't want to be like, What's the big deal? I don't know, right?

Speaker 1 Yeah, and you also don't want to

Speaker 1 convince yourself of like the reality where they're all lying. Exactly, which is really something I'm very good at doing.
I get that. So, I just was like, I don't want to do that to myself.

Speaker 1 Why don't you let this one be

Speaker 1 enjoyable and see what that feels like for me? Totally, you know.

Speaker 1 I feel like your work is so perfectly balanced between like something that is grounded in reality and something that's that's actually happened in the world, Studio 60, let's say, or People vs. OJ.

Speaker 1 And then it's also the corollary is like the can't be heightened reality as well. Like, is this a toggle-free where you have to like sort of change modalities based on what the project does?

Speaker 1 I don't feel toggly, I think. And that maybe is why I'm able to do it.

Speaker 1 Because the Ryan thing, I do think particularly, but even in other things I did, I did this movie called Run about a child that I've munched in where I'm trying to make my child sick so she'll stay with me.

Speaker 1 And even that is a sort of like extreme universe to live in. And I think the horror genre in general asks for a little bit of big swings.

Speaker 1 And I feel most comfortable there somehow. And I don't know whether it's because my mother called me Sarah Bernhardt since I was a tiny child.

Speaker 1 And I've always had sort of big reactions to things that maybe are outsized. That's for my therapist, not for the both of you.

Speaker 1 But you know, I have, I have

Speaker 1 outside reactions.

Speaker 1 I think I'm a big, I have a big, big emotional response to things, big and small. I think the register is a little bit different.

Speaker 1 The register is like, it really, the pendulum can swing way, way farther than most, I think.

Speaker 1 And so therefore, in that world, it doesn't seem off, off, uh, the, or out of the realm of normal to have whatever reaction my character's having, even though an average person might be like, that is, you're really freaking, this is too much.

Speaker 1 It's too big. And it's surreal.
And it's surreal.

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Speaker 1 What I love about the horror genre, like, on its face, is you kind of can get away with

Speaker 1 benefits. That's the other, that's the other thing.

Speaker 1 imagination is then exploding that's the dirty little secret to me is that like there are no rules like when you're playing a real person i actually feel most free then because i have all the boundaries have been set yeah and then i can do whatever i want inside it because i know what the truth is and i know like i just there are certain facts that are not up for my interpretation.

Speaker 1 Whereas sometimes when you have too much like paint to play with, you know, if you like pour all the paint in the world like on the ground, you're going to come up with just some weird muddy color.

Speaker 1 It's not specific enough. So it's like, if I have too many choices, it makes my head sort of pop off a little bit in a way that's not helpful.

Speaker 1 That's why I'm just like, let me play all the real, I'll be the lady who plays all the real people till the end of time. Nothing would make me happier.
That would be amazing.

Speaker 1 Nothing would make me happier. But when you were saying with Marcia, it was tipping into a zone where you're like, I'm going to look at which hand she uses to pick up.

Speaker 1 How she walked. She was a dancer.
She had a little bit of a, she was always sort of standing a little bit in first position.

Speaker 1 There was so much amazing footage of her, which is, which was rare, which is like her walking into the courtroom where like they're just hallway cameras, but you don't, you're not really thinking about being on camera.

Speaker 1 Whereas like when I played Nicole Wallace before Nicole Wallace became like a household name in Game Change, like there was no footage of Nicole Wallace not being performance Nicole Wallace.

Speaker 1 So like speaking on behalf of the White House, whereas I could watch stuff also with Linda paparazzi videos and things where I could watch her move without her like public facing self.

Speaker 1 And so that was like a real gift because it was like, oh, I'm seeing what you're doing without an awareness of a camera. Right.
Which where can, when can you get that? It's really rare.

Speaker 1 So it was very exciting to me to be able to have very specific things from which to pull from. And then I felt really free because I knew what the rules were.
Under the veneer you saw. Correct.

Speaker 1 Yeah. Scraped that tooth enamel off,

Speaker 1 got all the way down to the gum line. And I was like, I see what's really here.
We've got gingivitis. We've got gingivitis.
Diagnosed. Diagnosed.
Let's ask the question. Okay.

Speaker 1 So we've been kind of flitting around it, but Sarah Paulson, what was the culture that made you say culture was for you? I love your answer. Well, for me, it was the VHS

Speaker 1 of Oscar's greatest moments, 1971 to 1991. This is a VHS.
It cannot be purchased or gotten in any other way. And

Speaker 1 I had this, I still have this VHS.

Speaker 1 And Billy Eichner actually also is obsessed with this. And when we had a conversation one day, our heads were both like, I didn't think anybody else really knew about this.

Speaker 1 And he had it transferred to a disc so that then, I don't know how I would do it now.

Speaker 1 Now i did of course he did but like as a present like a rap present when we were finished with a chorus or something beginning but this is something like i watched so much that it was like how i learned about like sashine little feather and the battle thing and the nudist streaking across you know the stage when elizabeth taylor was trying to you know watching every academy award win and every sort of like show opener and liza dance it was like I don't think I knew who Liza Minelli was before I watched this when I was like 14 or whatever.

Speaker 1 And I was, but I just over and over and over again, and I can memorize people's speeches and Ruth Gordon's speech.

Speaker 1 And like, it was like a, it was like somehow having a living, breathing encyclopedia of pop culture moments that meant something to me, obviously, because of my dreams and fantasies and hopes of like one day standing there with that hot little

Speaker 1 guy, tight ass in my hand. Golden man.
Golden man in my hand.

Speaker 1 Yeah, that it was just like getting to see it all, but it was all just.

Speaker 1 Right there. It was like having a computer before you could have a computer.
It's like being able to Google every little moment about it and what people were wearing.

Speaker 1 So it was like a mixture of the fashion influx, cultural fashion moments mixed with like political statements that were being made, mixed with like the performers of the day.

Speaker 1 And also sort of recognizing that like the world was, the performing world was so much smaller back then.

Speaker 1 It was the same actors over and over and over again getting nominated and the same, it was just, there was not this saturation of the marketplace.

Speaker 1 And so like, there were these 10 spectacular actors and these 10 spectacular actresses and these 10 filmmakers.

Speaker 1 And it's like things tended to be kind of uniformly excellent back then in that time period. And they don't make some of those movies anymore.
No, they do not.

Speaker 1 But it was a real, like, I remember just buying that, like purchasing that at the video store. I think I rented it and then I went and found it and bought it.
And where did you buy it?

Speaker 1 Like, in Brooklyn, in Brooklyn, where I lived. Yeah.
And it was just like in the VCR and it was just like on repeat, repeat, repeat.

Speaker 1 And I do think, even as I'm talking to you about it now, like just the Bob Mackey of it all and the

Speaker 1 share, oh, the shared, one of the greatest things that my best friend and I, Amanda Pete, are always saying, she does this whole bit where she comes out in her like early, early acting moment.

Speaker 1 I don't, I think it might have, maybe it was two times that are on this video. Yeah.
One of them where she comes out and she's bringing up

Speaker 1 reading the list of nominees. And I can't remember who she's standing with, but her line, she has to say, Marvin Hamel, Hamill, I'm going to mess it up.
Marvin Hamlish. Yeah.

Speaker 1 And she cannot, and she says, Marvin Hamelschmisch. Marvin Haml Schmisch.
Hamelschmisch. And then she goes, sorry, Marvin.
And it's like the funniest, most like, she's so charming and so relaxed.

Speaker 1 And then another time she comes out in a giant headdress after she won, I think. She's truck, yeah.
She said, as you can see, I got the Academy handbook on how to dress like a serious actress.

Speaker 1 And I just was like, but it's like, I got to see like. Early Day Share.
There's Bette Midler making fun of the way someone is,

Speaker 1 too many people are nominated for like one, like there were four songwriters. She's like, also known as four on a song.
And it was just like, I mean, I just remember all these like really,

Speaker 1 oh yeah, for

Speaker 1 moon and what's the song in New York City? Um, When You Get Lost with the Moon in New York City, New York City, the best that you can do.

Speaker 1 Yeah, it's all in love. Yeah, just a song from Arthur.

Speaker 1 And she's just like out there doing her bits. And it's just like, I was just like.

Speaker 1 over it was like a tsunami of information yeah fashion you got to be like encyclopedic and i was just like having this knowledge of stuff that like none of my friends knew what i was talking about we share that because our we we got really into i believe for us it was 97 so there was the titanic oscars the

Speaker 1 billy crystal

Speaker 1 out and then he comes out and he's like boop boop and does his thing he comes off on a horse he comes out on a horse

Speaker 1 and he comes out on a horse and then he does the thing where he turns it off with a with a colours out so good so good see was the academy putting this compilation out like who was i think it's possible that the academy put it out but i'm not a hundred percent sure but i sure can let you know because thank you because the the thing is as you're describing this it's like sure like anyone can like look up on youtube like these moments but you need something somebody

Speaker 1 curating it exactly and it is curated so and it just goes through and you see everybody's clothing i mean i remember having a conversation once with jessica lang about the oscars and fashion at the oscars and she said we used to just whomever was doing my costumes on that movie we would maybe go to the sax fifth avenue yeah and we found a dress like that happened once and another time it was you know it's like what it has become and you can see when you watch this compilation of like somebody just pulling some halston number out or Halston coming up with I mean it just it's just unbelievable to see the way it changes yeah Bette Mittler just said that on Watch What Happens Live because he was, he was asking her about her nomination for the Rose.

Speaker 1 And she was like, well, I mean, this is back in the day when like you didn't think about what you were wearing. Literally, she went, she was like, I think that was my dress that I still have.
Exactly.

Speaker 1 I went. It was all very new to me.
I didn't get the gravity of what it was to be nominated. I enjoyed it, but it's just not the industry it is.
I mean, Keaton drove herself to the Academy Awards.

Speaker 1 You know, it was like that the year she won. Yeah.
It's like parked her car under the Dorothy Chandler Pavilion. Wow.
It's just like, it's just not, it's just such a different

Speaker 1 thing now.

Speaker 1 It's, and there was such a purity to it that my initial love, I'm pleased for myself that I was alive during at a time where I could have had that experience of watching this in a kind of pure way where now it's, I'm not saying it would suck to win an Oscar now at all.

Speaker 1 I'm just information about it.

Speaker 1 I have information about what it was and what it was for people and the importance and the sort of, I mean, the first Academy Awards that were handed out was just like in a room it wasn't televised and it was like a banquet.

Speaker 1 And it was just, and now it's become this like

Speaker 1 gold derby race to the top. You know what I mean? And like, it's wild.
Well, this is what I want to say.

Speaker 1 Like, there was, someone on Subway Takes recently was like, my take is like, if you have a stylist, that means you're not a stylish person. I'm like, well, no.
Interesting.

Speaker 1 And then I think, I think that some, some, some, some, some cool fashion person. Right.
And then, and then it was, it was 100% agree.

Speaker 1 It was just like, oh, but yes, but I see what you're trying to say, but the fact is, this is just like another element in whole

Speaker 1 decimalist thing that we have with awards now. And also,

Speaker 1 back then, there were fewer things to like, fewer ways to express your, like you, maybe I could say that that might have been true 20 or 30 years ago, but now there is, there's too much stuff.

Speaker 1 Logistics.

Speaker 1 There's just like too much. Yeah.
And like, how would you even know where to begin? Right.

Speaker 1 Unless you're Kim and you go back through all the archives and you pull them. And like then she does these things where I'm like, what is this dress? And she's like, 1994 Galeano.
And I'm like, oh,

Speaker 1 i'm wearing a new celine but congrats to you you know what i mean like how do you feel though about like the six month or seven month oscar race now like i how i wonder like as someone who loves it because we love we talk about this a lot like i'm a person who like remember from premiere magazine used to be able to pull out like ballot or movie line magazine premier magazine remember that you'll like pull out ballots and like I just love it.

Speaker 1 I love it. Yeah.
And I'm one of those people. This is off topic, but I'll get back to your thing, which is, I don't want you to talk to me at the Oscars party.

Speaker 1 Like when I'm watching, have you been to that? Yeah, I'm watching. I remember that we were there last year.
So you go sometimes to the Vanity Fair dinner, which I've been to many times.

Speaker 1 It's a real honor to be there. I love it.
You're with all these incredible people, but people are talking, they be talking.

Speaker 1 And I'm one of those people who's just like, I really, I care a lot about it. About it.
We're at the finish line.

Speaker 1 And we're at the finish line and we are waiting for best actress and they are making us go crazy. And it's just like I am.

Speaker 1 you know, the crazy person who does not want to be talked to during an awards ceremony. I want to watch it.
Yep. People are like, oh, are you bummed you're not going? I'm like, oh, hell no.

Speaker 1 I'm in my pajamas. It's a big deal.
They're coming over after. We're going to go to the party after, but I just want to watch.
Anyway, the six-month run to me is

Speaker 1 arduous.

Speaker 1 And also, I think sometimes like,

Speaker 1 I'm not going to say who, who, but I have friends who have gone through this. All of it.
And have had like just the

Speaker 1 just like the thing where you have these hopes. I know.
These little twinkly dreams and hopes that then get dashed because someone has entered the race that wasn't expected.

Speaker 1 That's now won the National Board of Review. And does this weaken your chances? Because, and it's just like, like sports.

Speaker 1 It's like sports now where you're like, well, she won all five things leading up. So the odds of her losing is just really, and then you've got

Speaker 1 it just, it just puts everything.

Speaker 1 Holland Taylor, whom I love, obviously very much, who's my partner in life and things, in all things that matter to me, is always talking about like, why are we doing this to each other? Yeah.

Speaker 1 Because it's so subjective. What is the greatest? And why are you turning it into this thing of this is is better than that?

Speaker 1 All of the things that go into what make a great performance, like there's so many variables from the actors you're working with to your editors to the, you know, the movie itself, whether it lands for people.

Speaker 1 You can be the greatest performance in a movie. If the movie doesn't work, does that ruin your chances?

Speaker 1 It's like, it's such a really psychotic thing to do to little fragile people, like performers, like little artists, performers not necessarily cut out for the athletic.

Speaker 1 Or the cutthroat component of it.

Speaker 1 And I went through this during the Tony's, which to me was the most arduous of them that I had ever been fortunate enough to experience because you're actually doing the show

Speaker 1 while it's happening. And then like, you know, your stage manager will sweetly say, we had 10 voters in tonight, like after you're done.
And you're like,

Speaker 1 oh, fuck. Like, and you're like, and then you know, exactly, but act two.

Speaker 1 And I'm like, why are you telling, like, and you then start to like figure out whether or not you thought your performance that was like

Speaker 1 every like as you get towards the end of your run, you're like, you only have 20 performances left.

Speaker 1 And like, it gets sort of stolen from you with the worry and the fear that you had an off night or something that just maybe didn't quite land or the audience was quieter.

Speaker 1 And did that mean that they weren't as into it? And it just like, and then you're like out there in the morning doing your like, good morning, Americas, and you're talking to all the people.

Speaker 1 And it's, it's just, you've been on vocal rest normally while you were doing your play for the whole time. And now you're out there.
Now you're on pounds of steroids and you're campaigning.

Speaker 1 And as much as I was happy to do it, because I was. Truly, it was like the seven-year-old in me was like, I can't believe this is happening to me.

Speaker 1 It still was also like, whoo, like, and then I also had to deal with my hunger. Yeah.

Speaker 1 It made the hunger worse. And I think it's so

Speaker 1 cool of you to admit. Oh, I wanted it and I wanted it very badly.
Thank you. You deserved it.

Speaker 1 And honestly, but, and I was going to say, like, sometimes I feel like for both your Emmy Wynn and your Tony Wynn, you were the front runner on, I know, because of Gold Derby, we were aware.

Speaker 1 This episode is after Gold Derby.

Speaker 1 But like, but

Speaker 1 this is a big part of like

Speaker 1 what got me aspirational about all of this is like, and it felt like going to that site you could be a part of it and so when they make you the frontrunner that feels like almost more pressure I've been the frontrunner on that gold derby and not it's not and I've not won that's happened a couple of times actually

Speaker 1 but you know so you kind of have to take it all with her but it does it does make it's like

Speaker 1 to me it's like you're a horse at a race and you've been running the same race and you know you're doing what you're doing and then all of a sudden they put like a carrot in front of you and then they just keep moving it further and further away but like you're getting closer and closer and all of a sudden you're so hungry yeah you're like if you don't get me that carry

Speaker 1 pins the cookie it hurts the cookie

Speaker 1 i didn't know that it was there and now that i know it's there now i really want it yeah yeah yeah you know it's like it just it's so funny where all of a sudden it's the possibility of it makes you you absolutely have to have it fucks up your expectation it fucks up your expectation and then it's

Speaker 1 he's been nominated five times well the oh my god the thing about you've won i've never won

Speaker 1 but the horse is the horse doesn't know the horse doesn't know the horse has no idea what the race is the horse doesn't know what the race is, and the horse is just running it.

Speaker 1 But you're now atop the horse. But we know the horse.
You know the horse. And you were just the horse, but now you're riding on top of the horse.

Speaker 1 And now you're like, come on, you can do it. And it's like, I'm just tired.
I just want to run the race. I know.
And you're like, but look at this, this hoe back here. She's coming up.
She's mouth

Speaker 1 up. Yeah.
And I got to, we got to keep going.

Speaker 1 And then it puts this whole little thing of competitiveness around it that's just not natural. I've had some friends of mine who have been like, oh, it turned dark.
It turned dark. It can turn dark.

Speaker 1 Our friend, your friend, I think, Kate Blanchette was on this podcast. And she made some headlines because she just expressed something very similar to this.

Speaker 1 She was like, I think, what if we did it where it was just no cameras around? And then that became a whole story.

Speaker 1 It's like, oh, no, don't even, this is, this is like someone who has been celebrated by this

Speaker 1 contraption of

Speaker 1 time.

Speaker 1 Yes. And it's like, she must be coming from a place of knowledge about this.

Speaker 1 Yes, it's really, I think it just puts a tiny bit of, and I can just hear like people a bit groaning, being like, oh, cry me a river.

Speaker 1 But it's like there's something about an artistic pursuit that is worth celebrating the pursuit like the pursuit is all and then when you start putting these other things on it it starts to become too heavy wears the it's whatever that phrase that heavy is the head that wears the crown and it's just like you want so much to not care.

Speaker 1 And then if you do care, you care too much. And it just becomes this dizzying, vulnerable making thing that I think we should normalize a little bit where people are just like, aren't you excited?

Speaker 1 And you're like, I'm scared. I'm hungry.
I'm in this dress all the time. I really want it.
I feel like I look old and fat and tired. And,

Speaker 1 you know, just, it's a whole thing. We were sitting in that room and, and I, we loved Mikey Madison and Anora, but when Demi Moore lost, it was kind of just like the air left.

Speaker 1 I remember feeling like, I wish we hadn't done anything.

Speaker 1 I remember being in the audience when Olivia Coleman won the year of Glenn Close and Olivia Coleman thing. And there was an audible sound in the audience.
Oh, we were.

Speaker 1 And it wasn't because people weren't excited about Olivia Coleman because it's one of the great performances of all time, the favorite.

Speaker 1 But I think this expectation was Glenn was finally going to get her Oscar. Yeah.
Her Ross. And it was six months of this.
And then there she was in this gold guy. It was this incredible.

Speaker 1 And then it was like, like,

Speaker 1 there was a sound. And I remember being like, oh, I can't handle this.
This is just. No, it was hard.

Speaker 1 And, you know, I, it's just, there's something about it that at the same time, I'm like, I can't wait to campaign for one. That means that, I'm just kidding.

Speaker 1 That would mean that I was like in a movie I was proud of and excited to be in the middle of the day. Well, I remember

Speaker 1 you had deserved buzz for, I think, 12 Years a Slave or Carol. I mean, you've been in great films.
I've been in some great movies. Yeah.
Yeah.

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Speaker 1 What do you think is, because probably nowadays it's a little bit different than it was, obviously, but is it directors that drive you? Because you're in a lot of great ensembles, too.

Speaker 1 Yeah, I mean, I think the truth is, like, I wish I could pretend that I was the architect of my career in a way.

Speaker 1 Like, I don't know about you guys, that I often feel like I just sometimes say yes to something that speaks to me, but I'm not always.

Speaker 1 I've had conversations with Kate about, like, she is really thinking about a director and she really, and I do sometimes, but like, I'm mostly just so excited that someone wants me to

Speaker 1 be there that if it's something I think I can I mean I will say the one thing that I think really drives me is actually the level of terror I have about my ability to do it and that makes you want to yes and the more terrified I am to do it the more likely I am to say yes but there's more like hemming and hawing beforehand

Speaker 1 And fear is a big motivator for me to do it. And it's surprising to me because I'm a little bit of a nervous Nelly, I would say.
And it's weird for me to be saying that. Is the fear

Speaker 1 in you reading what's on the page and

Speaker 1 what is happening in the script makes you nervous? Or is the fear in that you're reading it and you don't get it at first? No, it's my fear is that like, is what I think it is what it is? Got it.

Speaker 1 It's like a combination of like, intellectually, am I, is this hitting where it's, am I, do I get what is desired here?

Speaker 1 Do I know what to do? I mean, like, I think about this all the time. I haven't auditioned for something in a very, very long time and I miss it.

Speaker 1 Because when you walk on a set for a job you've auditioned for, you know that you are there because what you did for this very thing

Speaker 1 was the thing that they decided they wanted. So you don't walk on and going, oh, God, they asked me to be here because of my Marsha Clark performance and this is a different piece.

Speaker 1 And, or they want me here because of some other thing they saw. And so then I end up going, I don't know if they know what and who it is and if my take on it is right.

Speaker 1 I love that feeling of knowing I've earned a job based on what I did for that specific job. And then I feel more confident starting the day.
Otherwise, it feels really,

Speaker 1 I don't know. I, I just, it, it, it, it ratchets up my, my terror of failing when I have not earned it.
But it might like, of course, you know,

Speaker 1 and then have, because this is a thing that I've expressed to, let's say, my team. Yeah.
Like,

Speaker 1 and they're just like, oh, yeah, sure. I'm like, I would love to audition.
Like, please don't ever tell anyone that I don't audition. Like, I don't read for stuff.
I would love to read for something.

Speaker 1 And they're like, yeah, yeah, yeah, whatever. Still haven't in a while.
Yeah. And I almost kind of want to do it for this exact reason.

Speaker 1 Like, have you, has this been a thing that you've talked about with your people where it's like, they're like, no, but Sarah, like, I did say it recently, I feel like, but on some level now, the other part is like everything's happening on Zoom.

Speaker 1 So it's like, I think about the number of jobs that I got in my early career, which were not many, but when I got them, it was because of my experience in the room and a director going, could you try this?

Speaker 1 And then I did try it. And

Speaker 1 they either liked it or whatever, but like, or my little banter with them as I was leaving the room or whatever it was, it happened because of a personal connection in the room, some sort of thing of, and I remember

Speaker 1 you collaborated. I remember auditioning for The Goldfinch, which was a movie nobody saw, but one of my favorite books.

Speaker 1 And I got the job, but the director wouldn't cast me until we had a FaceTime or we were supposed to see each other in person, but we couldn't because he was like, I don't have people on my set I've never like sat down and had a conversation with because what if that's a vibe where it's like not going to be great for

Speaker 1 a myriad of reasons.

Speaker 1 But like that, that that was the last time I auditioned and the last time I had an experience where a director was like, it's important to me to have actual contact with you before you're on my set.

Speaker 1 Wow. Just in case, you know,

Speaker 1 who knows what all the reasons are. But it makes a lot of sense to me.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 You have to, I think the most important thing that you realize once you start working more is that people just get it and we can move on.

Speaker 1 So taking a note and applying it quickly is one of the most important things. It's one of the important things.
And it's how you can tell that a person can move quickly and think quickly. Right.

Speaker 1 Because that's what you need on a set where you're doing, you know, especially television. It's like you're doing 10 pages of dialogue in a day.
Yeah, that's why the self-tapes of it all.

Speaker 1 I just think of it. I don't get how anybody gets a job.
I don't know how anybody gets a job. I'm just like, the self-tape thing is a nightmare.

Speaker 1 I don't think I've ever met anyone who liked to listen to the sound of their voice on a voice memo or on a recording of any kind. It's hard.

Speaker 1 And then just take your face, blow it up on the thing, and then be like, deal with it. And it's just really, it's hard to do.
Or imagine being like, yep. Yeah.

Speaker 1 There are some people who are like, you know, it's like that.

Speaker 1 Niecy Nash is like that. It's like, all I want to do is just a little dose of Niecy Nash, who just is like,

Speaker 1 I look great. And you're like, you do.
I love that.

Speaker 1 She's goddamn right. She's goddamn right.
Yeah. And I'm like, just touch me a little bit.
Just let some of it rub off on me.

Speaker 1 The Nisi Renaissance. Oh, the Nisi Renaissance.

Speaker 1 Getting On was one of them. I mean, did you guys tell me? I mean, what can a person do to get Getting On back on the air?

Speaker 1 With Lori Metcalfe,

Speaker 1 the greatest actress in the world to me, Lori Metcalfe, just get it back on

Speaker 1 now. Yeah, we really love that one.
Alex Borstein, I mean, so good.

Speaker 1 I mean, I think TikTok was kind of having fun with the whole, like, when like they're trying to, they're talking about giving to the translator. Yeah, yeah, that was really

Speaker 1 getting on, like, was what happened right before all three of them like re-cropped off again because that was right before Ladybird. Yeah, it was before

Speaker 1 Maisel.

Speaker 1 And then Nisi in everything. Everything.
That's right. Dahmer winning the Emmy.
Yeah, yeah. All of it.
All of it. Oh, I love it.
I love a Nisi round. Do you have a favorite Oscar win?

Speaker 1 Oh, a favorite. It's a big win.
That's a big question.

Speaker 1 I don't know that I do. Oh, I've got one.

Speaker 1 What is yours? Mine is a little basic, but it's Julia Roberts Aaron Rockovich. That's just one of my favorite movie star performance.

Speaker 1 Big movie star performance, but it was in a grounded Soderbergh thing. I just liked that it just.
That she won for it. She won for it.
After all of her stuff.

Speaker 1 God.

Speaker 1 I'm going to share this one because it caught me by surprise, but I loved it. At the time, I was like, I can't believe they voted for that.

Speaker 1 And I'm obsessed that they did was Tilda Swinton and Michael Clayton. Oh, and she won for Michael Clayton.
Yep. That's a good one.

Speaker 1 And do you remember at the end of that movie when he's walking away from her because he's told her, like, I got you. And she just collapses.

Speaker 1 I was like, uh-huh. Fuck yeah.
Till this wins.

Speaker 1 Yeah. That was God.
And Catherine Dana Jones in Chicago because it's so

Speaker 1 performance. I just love a music.
I love when a musical comes through. It just perfectly matters.
I guess I'm going to say Jessica Lang in Tootsie

Speaker 1 because it is an extraordinarily special performance and

Speaker 1 she should have won for Francis. Yeah.
Now, you can't beat Meryl Streep and Sophie's Choice. It's not possible.

Speaker 1 That was the same year. So Jessica was nominated.
I think, is it possible? Wait, Jessica, was Jessica nominated for two Academy Awards in the same year? I think she may have been one of those.

Speaker 1 Meryl Streep won for Sophie's Choice, and the other nominees, this is good.

Speaker 1 Jessica Lang, Francis, Sissy Space Deck, missing, Deborah Winger, Officer and a Gentleman, and Julia Andrews, Victor, Victoria. Right.

Speaker 1 And did Jessica win for Tootsie that same year for supporting actress? Let's look. 1982,

Speaker 1 this was

Speaker 1 best supporting actress was Jessica Language. So I'm right about this.
Thank you. I like my Oscar stuff.
Have you been Lewis Rotel? No. Oh, I think I have.

Speaker 1 Yeah, yeah, yeah. You guys have the same.
I got it in there. I got it in there.

Speaker 1 And Jessica Lang, I think the reason I think that performance is so underrated, and I mean, she won an Oscar, so not that underrated, but like in terms of why people don't necessarily know, it's just playing the girl in a movie like that with Dustin Hoffman

Speaker 1 being an absolute like

Speaker 1 next level genius. And to have this this sparkly, she was so sparkly.

Speaker 1 And just like, but it was also the juxtaposition of that performance with Francis, which her performance in Francis is one of the, for me, unparalleled. I think it's really,

Speaker 1 and Kim Stanley, Kim Stanley, who is my favorite actress of all time, who played her mother in that movie. Kim Stanley was my wallpaper on my phone for a very long time.

Speaker 1 And there's a very great book called The Female Brando about Kim Stanley. She's really extraordinary.
She did so few movies, but she did a lot of stuff on stage.

Speaker 1 But she's, remember, she she calls her little sister in that movie. She's her mother.
I mean, it's really. I've never seen Princess.
You've got to get it. I mean, just let's please watch it.

Speaker 1 And the next time I see you, just tell me that you know what I'm talking about. It will quiz your ass because it's really some of the best acting ever.
Also, they make so few movies like that now. So

Speaker 1 right after you, Jennifer Lawrence is coming in, and we just watched Dina Lee. Oh, I can't wait to see it.

Speaker 1 It's like Cassavetes. It's great.
It's Women Under the Influence. Yeah, it's another Cassie Claw.
I mean, it's one of those things that's just like, oh.

Speaker 1 Like, who won over Jenna Rowlands for Women Woman Under the Influence? God, this is really

Speaker 1 74. That's the year I was born.
Woo!

Speaker 1 Okay, so who won it?

Speaker 1 That was Ellen Burston for Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore. Okay, I'm going to say something really unpopular.
Okay. That was incorrect.
And that was the year after she had lost for The Exorcist.

Speaker 1 So she was excellent in both movies. She was beyond excellent in Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore.
Nobody could be better. She's an extraordinary actress.

Speaker 1 Jenna Rowland's performance in A Woman Under the Influence is just like somebody walking a tightrope a thousand miles above sea level. It's just not, it's not normal.

Speaker 1 It's it's an it's I mean, I'm not saying that Ellen Burston shouldn't have won an Oscar. I mean, am I going to go to jail for that?

Speaker 1 You know what I mean? Decades later, she would deserve it for Requiem. She beyond the pale and did not get it, right? Yeah, did not get it.
Was she nominated? She was nominated.

Speaker 1 She was nominated, but I believe that was within the year of Helen Hugged. Hold on, wait.

Speaker 1 Let me see this. Wow.
So, this is when it gets so crazy. I know.
That's so, and this is why Holland's point is to be really, really taken. Truly.

Speaker 1 How can someone measure that Alice Doesn't Live Here's performance is better than this performance and that Ellen Burston in Requiem does not best Helen Hunt in

Speaker 1 I lied. Ellen Burston lost to Julia Roberts for Aaron Brockovich.
This was 2000. Well, they put her in lead? They did.
She should have been in supporting.

Speaker 1 I think it was the Ellen Burston of it all that made her push and support. She should have been in supporting and she would have won.
Does category fraud drive you crazy?

Speaker 1 It does, but I feel like I've committed it. Where and when? I feel like on Horror Story once.
It's not my fault. It gets decided.
Oh, definitely.

Speaker 1 I think there were sometimes I was put in lead because I technically qualified to be in it. Yeah.
Because maybe the supporting actor category was going to be too crowded.

Speaker 1 So someone at the studio made a decision to put me in the other one. And then I did get nominated in that category.
And I think it was the right thing. But I don't.

Speaker 1 Like,

Speaker 1 what's the most egregious version of category fraud that you have? And you know what's weird?

Speaker 1 In a reverse way, Anthony Hopkins is only in Silence of the Lambs for a little bit over 10 minutes and one best actor. Sure.
Whoa. Yeah.

Speaker 1 Because that movie is all Jodi Foster. Yeah.
And she won too, right?

Speaker 1 It is what it is. I understand why it happens.
I understand why it happens too, but it's just, this is why we should just abolish it all. By

Speaker 1 Kate was getting just like have a party. Everybody's nominated.
You all get your certificate. Everybody should get a statue.
You get your Oscar first and then we'll abolish it. Exactly.

Speaker 1 This is like

Speaker 1 because I do agree it's getting weird, especially like when the Golden Gloves are whatever, but like the comedy drama placements, like some the Emmys, it's like, okay, some of these things that go cold comedies, it's like so silly.

Speaker 1 I almost feel like everyone shows up to the awards and it's a surprise. Yes, like five awards get

Speaker 1 like, and there are just,

Speaker 1 I think that's really true. Like something should change.
Something should change. This is why we have our fake, goofy, fun award show.

Speaker 1 Which I wanted to go to this past year, but I was out of town, but I wanted to go desperately. Really wanted to go.

Speaker 1 If we have our drothers, we do it as many years as they let us.

Speaker 1 Why wouldn't they let you do it again and again? Wasn't it a delicious success? It was fun.

Speaker 1 You know how it is. But basically, when we were reaching out to people for the culture awards, we didn't know who was actually out of town or who was like.
Oh, no, I wasn't in town.

Speaker 1 I would have 100% been there. Okay, well, next year.
100%. Next year.
Allegedly next year.

Speaker 1 Allegedly.

Speaker 1 Allegedly.

Speaker 1 Another really good title of that. Yes.

Speaker 1 Allegedly. Allegedly.

Speaker 1 But anyway, you're right. I mean, I think we've actually gotten...

Speaker 1 This is helpful information because I think when Kate was here, I'm talking about this, like, of course, the nuance got taken out of it for the headline. Oh, yes.

Speaker 1 But I think this, like, let's please, y'all, EWs and ETs of the world, let's just really like

Speaker 1 it and do this conversation justice. You know what I mean?

Speaker 1 Because we care.

Speaker 1 It's because we care about it.

Speaker 1 It's also because it matters. It does matter to me in the sense that like little me watched the Tony Awards, watched the Oscars, watched the Emmys.
Like, I watched them, like,

Speaker 1 was obsessed with them and planned out political and mapped out. And

Speaker 1 you want to know why we have Viola Davis today being a lead actress? Because she was nominated for doubt because there was room for her

Speaker 1 in a supportive category that allowed a nine-minute performance that was that outstanding

Speaker 1 to be nominated. And so now she is the powerhouse Viola Davis that we have because she was an Oscar nomination.

Speaker 1 I have a whole thing that I want to do with petitioning SAG about this because I really feel

Speaker 1 that the SAG Awards in particular, they do everything. Everybody goes into one category.
Supporting actors are in the leading, like you, you can't, but why lump in?

Speaker 1 It's like also all the supporting actors, like there, there is not, it's like the buttress of a building. It's like the building cannot stand without, it's like you need all of it.

Speaker 1 And I just feel like there's a real diminishment of a supporting actor by way of not giving like space, room, and opportunity. And also the career change that it can affect.

Speaker 1 If all of a sudden you're, you give a nine-minute performance in something that is outstanding and then you find yourself in the same conversation with these actors who have been around forever and who you all of a sudden are have an opportunity to make a better living.

Speaker 1 You get more opportunity. It's just about the opportunity.
So it's it's like, and then within 15 years, you fully egot. That's right.
You know what I mean?

Speaker 1 If you're Viola Davis, if you're Viola Davis, yeah.

Speaker 1 Which there are so there are so many talented people out there like that deserve this the supporting stuff drives me nuts because I'm like, that's where the character actors get.

Speaker 1 That's where sometimes the best work is happening. 100%.
Agree. Every time.
I do, just before we go, want to connect you guys on the Studio 60 and SNL. Oh, yeah.

Speaker 1 Because that was such an incredible show, undersung show. And your performance in that, I think, really put you on the map in six, seven, eight, nine, 10 ways.
You know what I mean?

Speaker 1 Yeah, it did, except for, yeah, I think a lot of people didn't think I was funny on it, which is

Speaker 1 like a drama. But it was a dramatic and also like Aaron wasn't like didn't, Aaron, who is Aaron Sorkin, who's a genius,

Speaker 1 but like didn't have any writers there doing any like sketch writing. He was doing all of it.

Speaker 1 So like based on like some of the things I did in my audition where like I imitated this person and I imitated that person and I could do my impressions and things.

Speaker 1 but like it wasn't, it just didn't really become about that, you know.

Speaker 1 But like, also, every single time my character came on screen, it was like somebody was talking about how this, like, I was the Kristen Wig of the show, like, the world's, you know, I'm guilty of the funniest sketch performer, and then like they never gave me any sketches to do.

Speaker 1 And then, like, some people were like,

Speaker 1 exactly. And they're like, what is this? But you know, I was really playing Kristen Chennawith,

Speaker 1 who was Aaron Sorkin's

Speaker 1 love at the time. And so, like, that was its, you know,

Speaker 1 yeah, it was just a so she was conservative, and Matthew Perry was playing the sort of Aaron character, and it was just really.

Speaker 1 I thought that show was going to last forever. It was, yeah, because it was right after Friends, right after the West Wing, and it was like, well, look at me walking up to this right in this moment.

Speaker 1 And then, sure enough,

Speaker 1 nobody cared. What year did you move to LA? After I moved to LA in 1998, chic.
Great year, it seems like. 1988?

Speaker 1 1998? 98. 98.
98. 98.
98. I think.
When Hollywood was. When Hollywood, yeah.
But it's like, I kind of missed, like, back in the day, like when we were coming up, I was like, okay, like pilot season.

Speaker 1 Pilot season. Pilot season.
I know one and a half in and then it died. Oh, yeah.
Fine. Cause I moved out there, what, 2018? Yeah.

Speaker 1 No, we were still pilot season serious and like seeing all the same girls at every single audition and like going into like, I remember when I went to Test for Down with Love, this movie I did with

Speaker 1 the

Speaker 1 Tina Faye, me and Allison Janey and Courtney. It was just like us and like pulling up and seeing so-and-so walk to their car and Zach Brath was in there reading with a bunch of people.

Speaker 1 And then this one came in to read with this one. And then, and it was just like

Speaker 1 it was like, oh, it was a very different thing. And they were mixing and matching and putting different people.
And it was a whole thing where you would like be confronted with your competition

Speaker 1 and you learn a lot. And, you know, I remember testing for a pilot against Hillary Swank.
Wow. Like, oh, yeah, it was like a real, there was like a sea of us.

Speaker 1 And now like, we never, you never see see everybody anymore, except for like, we don't see each other in the trenches anymore. We used to be like, look at us all out here.

Speaker 1 Like, we were in our bathrooms this morning, like, la la la, like, putting on our makeup and running our lines and in the car, like practicing your stuff, and then getting there and asking for a highlighter and, you know, you know, all that stuff, signing in and seeing who had been there before you.

Speaker 1 And those days are gone. Yeah, the la-la-lam.
Yeah. The la-la-lam.

Speaker 1 When I was young. Yeah, exactly.
I never needed anyone.

Speaker 1 There was a time when I would be in multiple waiting waiting rooms for auditions with, for some reason, Leslie Bibb. And I'm like, Ellen.
Oh, I love that.

Speaker 1 The two of us being in, like, we weren't up for the same card. Also, Leslie Bibb,

Speaker 1 for me and Leslie Bibb to be in the same audition would be like hilarious.

Speaker 1 Again and again. But I was like, well, she would never remember this, but it's like, I'm sorry.
I bet she would remember. I think she would remember that.
I don't think so. She's so cool.
She's cool.

Speaker 1 She's cool. She's the coolest.

Speaker 1 On eBay, every find has a story. Like if you're looking for a vintage band tee.
Not just a tea, the band tee. From the last show your favorite band ever played.
You wore it everywhere.

Speaker 1 Then your boyfriend started wearing it. Which was cute until he dumped you and took it with him.
Which was not so cute. But he was.
I miss him. Anyway, now you're on eBay.

Speaker 1 And there it is, same tea from the same tour still living in your memory rent-free forever. Yeah.
Screw you, Dave. The things you love have a way of finding their way back to you.
Except Dave.

Speaker 1 But eBay isn't just forget whatever your ex slash XBFF stole back. We miss you.
It's also for that rare championship foul ball that you caught, then heroically gave to the kid next to you.

Speaker 1 You're welcome, Scoot. And where else are you going to find your first car? A RAV4 from 2003? The one you wish you never sold, but now finally got the chance to take back home.

Speaker 1 I'm buying a car on eBay for good this time. Shop eBay for millions of finds, each with a story.
eBay. Things people love.

Speaker 1 I'll take a tagline. What if your Wi-Fi wasn't just Wi-Fi, but the magic holding your whole holiday together? Well, with Xfinity Wi-Fi, it kind of is.
Picture this.

Speaker 1 Powered by their best, most elite, high-performing tech, this Wi-Fi doesn't just connect devices, it keeps the peace at home during the most wonderful and most stressful time of the year.

Speaker 1 It's kind of like having a little holiday helper working behind the scenes, making sure the holiday playlist never skips the beat and the video call with grandma doesn't freeze mid-cookie tutorial.

Speaker 1 It's Wi-Fi that keeps your whole home connected, so you can actually enjoy the holiday magic, chaos-free. The best present of all.
Let me paint a a picture for you.

Speaker 1 A holiday movie marathon is streaming in the living room. Your kid is video chatting their friends from their tablet, and your partner is shopping for too many gifts and cinnamon candles.
Ah!

Speaker 1 Not this season, not with Xfinity Wi-Fi. With Xfinity, you can boost the Wi-Fi to your device only.

Speaker 1 So when you go to upload 200 photos of that cat in a cute little Santa hat, you won't see that dreaded failed to upload message. Not this season, not with Xfinity Wi-Fi.

Speaker 1 And what if you had a way to make sure family time during the holidays had zero distractions? With Xfinity Wi-Fi, you can pause the kids' Wi-Fi and enjoy those special moments together.

Speaker 1 And if you're wondering what other parental instincts your Wi-Fi has during this busy season, Xfinity protects your kids when they're online so you know they're safe, even if you're busy making cocoa or taste-testing cookies.

Speaker 1 What? Someone has to make sure there's exactly the same amount of chocolate chips in each cookie.

Speaker 1 And what if your Wi-Fi could proactively fix issues before they even happen? Well, that's exactly what Xfinity Wi-Fi does.

Speaker 1 Like the friend who shows up with extra wrapping paper, bows, and tape before you even realize you're out. Because let's be honest, you never buy enough.

Speaker 1 Bottom line, Xfinity Wi-Fi isn't just smart, it's brilliant. And during the holidays, that brilliance, that's a gift.
Xfinity, imagine that.

Speaker 1 No one can resist a rule of culture. So here's one for the dating files.
Rule of culture number 72. Chemistry isn't just vibes, it's values.

Speaker 1 Because what's the point of matching with someone if you can't talk about the shows you binge, the books you dog ear, or all the hot takes you'll defend at brunch?

Speaker 1 I mean, you definitely definitely have friends who have met their partners on Bumble, and it makes sense.

Speaker 1 It's not just about matching with someone, it's about finding someone who gets your references, your obsessions, your whole vibe. With shared interests and prompts, you don't just see a profile.

Speaker 1 You get a glimpse of someone's personality, which makes it even easier to start conversations that actually lead somewhere.

Speaker 1 Plus, with photo and ID verification, you can trust that the person you're talking to is real. With that added peace of mind, it's so much easier to show up as your full self.

Speaker 1 So, whether your rule of culture is the best first state, start with the shared hot take on Renaissance, or compatibility is having the same hometown bodega order download bumble and turn those connections into something bigger download bumble and start your love story Ever heard of the Trans-America Trail?

Speaker 1 It's America's longest off-road trail, a 5,900-plus mile coast-to-coast monster. And now for the first time, Ford and Google Maps are bringing the full Trans-America Trail to Street View.

Speaker 1 It's one of America's most epic off-road adventures, and now every adventurer can plan, preview, and explore it themselves. How did they do it?

Speaker 1 By equipping the 2025 Ford Bronco Badlands with Google's new Street View camera, while the Expedition Tremor and Ranger Lariat carried the team and tools that made it all possible.

Speaker 1 You know, Matt and I weren't super familiar with the off-roading game until the summer when we took a dunes tour and went off-road. And now I totally get it.

Speaker 1 And I envy the adventure that people off-road take when they go to the Trans-America Trail. I may never drive on a road again.

Speaker 1 So whether you're planning to trek across the country or head out on a weekend adventure, scout out the trail on Street View. Explore, challenge yourself, and let your Ford handle the rest.

Speaker 1 The trail's waiting. You in.
Find the Trans-America Trail on Google Maps and hit the off-road. Ready, set forward.

Speaker 1 It might be time.

Speaker 1 This is our one-minute segment where we take exactly that amount of time to dress something down in culture that's got us twisted.

Speaker 1 And it's, we've come to the reality portion of the episode because I got a bone to pick with an icon. Okay.

Speaker 1 This is how Roderam about it. So, honey, it is time starts now.
I don't think so, honey, Jeff Propes.

Speaker 1 You're not going to get away with calling Parvity Shallow a one and a half time winner of Survivor. Incorrect.
She won two times. She won Micronesia, and you know that.
Yep.

Speaker 1 And she just won Australian Survivor, which is, I'm going to say it, not only more difficult version of Survivor, but a better produced version of Survivor. The besties of Survivor.

Speaker 1 American Survivor, you better get it together because they are lapping you. They are outclassing you around the world.
Do not play with me about Parv.

Speaker 1 Don't

Speaker 1 jeff.

Speaker 1 30 seconds.

Speaker 1 I've got a lot to say about the amount of twists in the show. I'm a diehard fan of the show for years,

Speaker 1 and I just, I don't think it's getting better.

Speaker 1 So, for you to pick on one of the great iconic winners of the show, I think just because she went and did Traders and that pisses you off,

Speaker 1 don't show, don't show that you're insecure, Jeff. Oh, no.
Because

Speaker 1 I will get you on my second cast. I don't think so, honey.
Nothing but respect for the queen, Parvity.

Speaker 1 Love you. Love you.
That's what that is. Listen.
That is a tough act to follow.

Speaker 1 I also really liked your energy. I really liked it.
I just, yeah. I don't really like it.
Are you a survivor person?

Speaker 1 In the beginning, I watched Survivor. You're a housewives person.
I'm a housewives person in a major way. So what are your recent thoughts? I mean, I'm obsessed with Salt Lake.

Speaker 1 I think I don't know what anybody, what I did to deserve it, but I ended up doing it. What did it for us? What did anybody do? What did we do?

Speaker 1 Because this is giving me, I don't know what's going on with Lisa Barlow. I don't know.
She's going through something. Something is really going through something.

Speaker 1 And the stuff with her and John, I'm a little bit like, what is that going to be? Credit card fraud. We don't know whatever's happening with Bronwyn.

Speaker 1 I don't know.

Speaker 1 That came out of nowhere.

Speaker 1 And something is sealed and we can't discuss it, she was saying. And I was like, what is sealed? She's like, it's sealed.
It's like a tragic if something happens. Yeah, but like what?

Speaker 1 Like how identity, like what, like what?

Speaker 1 Like, I think you can surprise yourself with like what is categorized as like male fraud, identity, like some things are weird and it might be something

Speaker 1 weird weird well you're a lawyer now i'm i'm esquire now but i'm just saying carrington lane would know carrington lane would definitely know and she yeah she wouldn't be friends with any of them she would hate them all

Speaker 1 yeah no yeah maybe she'd hang out with mary a little bit and i'm i can't figure out why does angie talk so slow Why does Angie everything with Angie?

Speaker 1 It's the speed. It's the speed and things.

Speaker 1 You know that you are my closest friend. Right.
And I'm like. Also, did you notice this about her? Something that's become very apparent is that the way she turns

Speaker 1 a side eye is very good. Someone did a super cut of this.
Angie Kay, our favorite. Our favorite.
Yeah, I love Angie Kay, but like, why are we, why is everything

Speaker 1 well? And when she thinks she's giving a very, like, like a big diss,

Speaker 1 it's like, she does it in this way that is so normal. Yeah.
Like, you are the Jen Shaw. I mean, you're like,

Speaker 1 is that supposed to be like a gauntlet thrown? Like, what are we throwing down? I can't. It's just, but I'm, I am the way I eat it up.
Of course. I mean, I just can't get enough.

Speaker 1 I think that Angie Kay solidified, obviously, high body count hair was great. High body count.
You know what Desperate Respect did? Trampoline with eyes or light. Trampoline with eyes.

Speaker 1 Trampoline with hair. Trampoline with eyes is so good.
High body count hair, but trampoline with eyes. But also, I mean, I just watched the one with Britney and her daughter.

Speaker 1 And that was, I just want to bring it down for one second and just say,

Speaker 1 this is really, I felt sad because what I can't understand about Britney is why she's always like, okay.

Speaker 1 Yeah. Everything's like, I know, I do.
When Whitney was like,

Speaker 1 you should want to deal with your daughter, she's like, I do.

Speaker 1 I do. And I'm just like, something's, is everything okay with Brittany? It has to cut through a lot of noise that has been like.
You mean the sound of like a flatline? Like,

Speaker 1 it's like an emotional flatline. It's like an emotional flat line.
It's like, I'm like, hello, is this on? Someone's there. Her daughter's like, I just.

Speaker 1 And the idea that she was this great mom and that like, it's almost,

Speaker 1 it's really hard when you have, when you're 12 and like you lose your mother to another person who isn't even your dad.

Speaker 1 Yeah, a guy who's obviously like love bombing and gaslighting her and a total narcissist. They gave her daughter a confessional.

Speaker 1 I thought that was a good idea. Was they giving a friend of daughter a confessional? But I feel like Brittany isn't a friend of anymore.

Speaker 1 I feel like something's happening to us or we're being given more.

Speaker 1 She's main cast. She's main cast now, right? Absolutely.

Speaker 1 I think she's a good spot. She deserves this spot.
I think for her to really like have a footprint on that show with that cast, that stacked cast, I think she deserves it. Why not? Okay.

Speaker 1 Is there anybody you'd you'd pull away oh this is so hard really tough i wouldn't do that i wouldn't do that you want to know what maybe last year i thought whitney felt absent agreed but this year

Speaker 1 i'm really into whitney right now yes i'm into like her being like yeah everything fell apart also what about it's the way she says um

Speaker 1 oh god what a second dick

Speaker 1 she says i fell everything is i instead of feel it's fell i fell and he tells

Speaker 1 my my helling journey i'm still i'm still helling who are you on recently on watch what happened who's your most i'm going on on wednesday with bronwin oh i'm i'm on i was last december with angie and he's been on with angie so we share angie kay i was on with heather gay lee serena

Speaker 1 dorinda who still to my day to this day to me is like iconic yes we recently sent a picture i in fact it was recent as last night of um dorinda and luan together together and the all i can say is that the photo had sexual energy

Speaker 1 Okay, well, Luann came to my, both of them came to my play. Luanne came to my play, and that was something.
Yeah, that was something. She is really something.
She's a star. She's a star.
Definitely.

Speaker 1 Moment Kit. I mean, she sang a little bit for me.
Did she? She did. At your show.

Speaker 1 At my show, because a friend of mine is my friend Carly Gallo is obsessed with her, and I videoed her, and it was like she thought she was doing a cameo, is what it felt like.

Speaker 1 She was like, darling, darling, cat. She's darling.

Speaker 1 I was like, it's just my friend on the face. It's really not.
But I was here for it. Have you ever gotten a housewife's cameo?

Speaker 1 No. Joel Cameo.
Like Jamie Lee Curtis style and like go there with like, remember when she went on? Do you remember when Jamie Lee Curtis's? When she went on Beverly Hills. She went on Beverly Hills.

Speaker 1 And she like brought her my hand in yours.

Speaker 1 I mean like a cameo, like

Speaker 1 a cameo video message. Oh, no.
Because you know that her lives are all on that. No.
No one's ever sent that to me, but I'm relying on you to do that.

Speaker 1 We won't do that for you. I'll pick.
Who would it be? We got one from

Speaker 1 Dorinda. Joel King Booster sent us one so that he could ask us to be in his wedding party.
And I got Dolores Catania. Oh, my God.
Love. Amazing.
Love.

Speaker 1 I just love the housewives. I'm very grateful for them too.
I mean, they used to help me survive a jet blue flight to New York is really how I started. Oh, yeah.

Speaker 1 When I would watch the OC from the beginning, and just like five hours later, I'd be like, in New York, don't want to get off the plane. Right.
I'm glued.

Speaker 1 I'm glued. I always appreciated your love for Bravo and Housewives vis-a-vis you being this incredible actor because I was just like, well, it has to be, it has to be.

Speaker 1 There's some part of me that is really fascinated by, you know, the thing you think when you read something and you go, no one would ever do this. Who would behave this way?

Speaker 1 And you're like, oh, no, there is no end to what people will do or behave, how they will behave. And the minute you decide that it's like an impossibility, it's like all the more.

Speaker 1 And this show to me is like evidence of that on a daily basis. And I'm just fascinated by

Speaker 1 human behavior. No, you couldn't make up Jenshaw.
You couldn't make up Ronwyn. You couldn't make up Mary.
You couldn't make up any of that. No, you certainly couldn't make up

Speaker 1 their heads like over here. Like, why is it on the side? Why is it on the side? We re-watched this weekend and then I don't know in the morning.

Speaker 1 You can leave Palm Springs.

Speaker 1 Security, security can leave if you're looking for the best episode of housewives it is all tricks no trust in that season the palm springs episode at the tricksy motel and i did ask heather gay directly if she was peeing or if that was vomit both i think it's both

Speaker 1 she's not sure she don't remember i don't think she remembers but i she's a friend i think yeah

Speaker 1 I she thinks it was vomit, and I think it was too late to

Speaker 1 win. It was coming from the water.
It was also coming from so low.

Speaker 1 I just feel like it wasn't.

Speaker 1 Like the way it was coming out, the force, force, like the force fill out was like too low. If it came that high, if it came up from high enough,

Speaker 1 it would have been viscous. And it also would have lost its power down and it had a lot of force.
Totally. I think we should revisit it because we're scientists.

Speaker 1 We literally, like, I would watch it once a week. Also, our friend Jared watches the OC reunion that's about Brooks.
He like watches it to go to bed. Yes, that's what I'm doing.
He's like,

Speaker 1 he can't do it unless it's the, not, unless that thing is on. I'm like, um, Vicki's daughter.
Oh, God. What's her name? Jesus.
Coming out and like, like,

Speaker 1 whenever.

Speaker 1 A conflict between a mother and their child on a reunion. I'm like,

Speaker 1 I love it more.

Speaker 1 Are you ready? I've got a simple one. Straightforward.

Speaker 1 Bo and Yang's. I don't think so, honey.
His time will begin now. I don't think so many movie theater seats costing the same across the board in the same room.

Speaker 1 If it's front, two rows, it better not cost anything more than five dollars let's say if i'm on the sides it should be a little bit cheaper if it's centered it should be more expensive let's let's tier them out like theater i'm not saying we like price you know stratify this in this in a certain way but i'm just saying like it should let's treat it like a theater because that's what it is let's let's give it orchestra seating not that there's an orchestra but you know like let's there are certain seats that are objectively better than others in the theater we should pay accordingly make them more affordable for some people make them make make the if there's if the theater is a center aisle then we, then we forget about it and let's just, let's just call the whole thing off.

Speaker 1 Let's just shut it down. But I'm saying, if movie theater

Speaker 1 seats are all priced the same, then that just kind of flattens the experience of movie going at all. Let's just, let's just, let's give it some meaning.
Let's give it some interest again.

Speaker 1 I think it wouldn't save the industry, but it could go towards helping it. That's one minute.
And that's one minute. I a thousand percent agree with that.
Right. It's common sense.
It's common sense.

Speaker 1 Come on. And I would, I would pay the extra for the thing, or I would also be like, if it's the front two rows, I don't want to pay.
So it turns out that's all that's left.

Speaker 1 And I'm like, well, I'm not paying $15

Speaker 1 and like I need a massage afterwards. Exactly.

Speaker 1 Also, I have an issue with this is about theater, but previews, those tickets costing the same as during the run because it was gypsy.

Speaker 1 I liked how that turned out.

Speaker 1 I saw the third preview. It was not ready.
You know who was ready? Audrey. Of course.
Audrey was perfect.

Speaker 1 But the thing is, I was just like,

Speaker 1 and then I heard it got so much better. I did end up seeing it like again.
I heard it got better. So I went again.
And I was like, see, now this justifies the price. Yep.
Okay. All right.

Speaker 1 Are you ready? This is the opportunity for you to shred. You ready? I don't like the pressure, but I've got some shit to say.
Okay. This is Sarah Paulson's.
I don't think so, honey.

Speaker 1 Her time starts now. Okay, I don't think so, honey, that the pigeon is a rat with wings.
I feel very, very triggered by this. I want you to understand something about a pigeon.

Speaker 1 Pigeons have been taught to be near us, to carry our messages to our loved ones. Pigeons have been, they mate for life, first of all.
They are not dirty.

Speaker 1 We made them our city dwellers so that we could get them to take information to faraway lands, to stop wars, to tell somebody you love them.

Speaker 1 They were our messengers of our heart, our minds, our brains. It was their job to do work for us.
And we have had them now in the city. People step on them, people run them over.
They don't care.

Speaker 1 They don't feed them. They give them their trash.
They talk about them the way they are talked about. The way they are talked about, they are talked about as if they are disgusting.

Speaker 1 Yes, they mate for life.

Speaker 1 I watched a pigeon. I watched a pigeon make a nest for a cat just out of the goodness of its heart.
You know what? That cat didn't try to eat that pigeon. That pigeon hate must be stopped.

Speaker 1 I'm calling on the world to stop hating on the pigeon. And that's one minute.
Thank you. This is a movement, not a moment.

Speaker 1 This is a movement, not a moment. What the fuck did pigeons do? Pigeons didn't do anything to you.
Yeah, pigeons. They're not seagulls.
They're not seagulls. They're not shitting.

Speaker 1 They are not seagulls. They're not.

Speaker 1 And they would never take your bagel. They don't want your bagel.
No. They want to sit on your shoulder and they want you to tell them about your day.
That's what they want.

Speaker 1 And then if you would like to go give a message to Matthew across town, they will happily take it. They will take it there and they will deliver it to him in a scroll.

Speaker 1 They will, you could write it up. Yep.
They'll take it in there. Yeah.
Do that. Send a carrier pigeon to give him the next message.
Just let's put the pigeons back to work. They need to work.

Speaker 1 They need to work

Speaker 1 tuppence a bag. Tuppens a bag, tuppin'.
Tuppence a bag. Tuppins.

Speaker 1 They're doves. They're doves.

Speaker 1 And you want to do this to doves. They're doves in a beautiful, iridescent, like movie existing thing with a little bit of green on their head.
They love each other forever.

Speaker 1 They pick a person that loves each other forever.

Speaker 1 How could we treat them so terribly?

Speaker 1 They're monogamous. They're monogamous.
Monogamous people. Thank you.
I'm about to cry. Love a pigeon.
Guess what I grew up with? What? Grand Theft Auto 4.

Speaker 1 There is a whole side mission in that game where y'all know what I'm talking about? Flying rats. Nick knows.

Speaker 1 Flying rats and their pigeons?

Speaker 1 You have to go shoot them. I've been incentivized to shoot these birds.
Next time you look at that bird in life, just remember, that pigeon used to do your work for you.

Speaker 1 That pigeon sent a text for you, sent your email, delivered it lovingly.

Speaker 1 Bless the pigeons. Thank you.
You're welcome. Bust the pigeons.
Bust the pigeons. A third option for title of battle.

Speaker 1 She didn't think we'd have this many.

Speaker 1 My God. That was amazing.
This is a true, I mean, we've, I felt like

Speaker 1 in an extended conversation with you, I'm like, oh, this is a real savant of the culture of the industry. Yeah.

Speaker 1 Thank you for sharing these opinions. Interesting.
I just really

Speaker 1 love, I mean, we know when Krista Miliatti won the Emmy for the

Speaker 1 I love acting. And she screamed, I love acting.
And I swear to God, I went like this out of my chair. I levitated because it was like.

Speaker 1 There is a person saying what is in my heart out loud and being celebrated for it. And it's like puts her hand in the air and is like, woo, woo-wing to I love acting.
It's like,

Speaker 1 she just rocks the casbah and every other casbah, whatever anybody wants to do. She rocks the casbah.
She rocks every time.

Speaker 1 She's out. Always and always has.
And has the voice of an angel. Did you see her?

Speaker 1 Of course. She's just like next level.
She's next level in every way. She's the coolest person.
She's the coolest person that was able to stand there and say, I love acting.

Speaker 1 And I swear to God, I was like.

Speaker 1 Everything's going to be okay. That's my shit.
That's my shit. And I was like, I feel seen.
I know who I am in the world when a person can do that. And people are excited about it.

Speaker 1 And so, like, I just feel like normalizing excitement about what you love. I don't care how

Speaker 1 silly someone decides it is and it's so cringe because you love it. It's like, you know what's cringe? Thinking everything's so uncool.

Speaker 1 I'm just like,

Speaker 1 guess what's cool?

Speaker 1 Being passionate is cool. Loving what you do is cool.
Recognizing that you get to do something that you love and that people are like, yes, you get to do it. And I'm like, I know how lucky I am.

Speaker 1 I have friends who are more talented than I could ever dream of being who do not have jobs.

Speaker 1 So just love it. Love it because you get to do it.
Love it if you don't get to do it. Just keep loving it.

Speaker 1 And you know who's loving it? All of you. Because you're probably streaming All's Fair.

Speaker 1 I guess at least one episode is out now. Yes.

Speaker 1 And this. Three.
I think three are out now.

Speaker 1 Right. First three.

Speaker 1 First three. I like it.
You want three because basically the beginning is like letting you know who everybody is. And that takes a minute and you're kind of into it.
And then you got to get into it.

Speaker 1 So you got to like

Speaker 1 ride past one, learn who we all are. Yeah.
Get ready. Get to know all of you.

Speaker 1 Basically, like, I don't know if you've seen the trailer, but the trailer is like

Speaker 1 a lot. And it's a lot.
It's a lot. You know what? That's a lot out of this turnout.
It's a maximum. You're going to get maximalism.
There is nothing about this that is.

Speaker 1 I mean, I call Kim Kardashian beef curtains on National Television. As you walk through a vaginal hallway.
I walk through a cervical, a clown survey. A clown survey,

Speaker 1 Emerald Green, and I call Glenn Close

Speaker 1 George Washington on National Telescope. What more do you want? What more do you want? I love it.
Mayor McHead Cheese. I call them that too.
I mean, like, it's really good stuff. Head cheese.

Speaker 1 I don't want to ever hear head cheese on a TV show except if it's all-star. I'm not going to do that.
Mayor McHead Cheese.

Speaker 1 And with that, we end every episode with a song. Why is it this?

Speaker 1 Do you know this song? There's always

Speaker 1 tomorrow when dreams will come true. Yeah, why is it that?

Speaker 1 I don't know, but it was an episode of Saturday Night Live with Kristen Wigg and Fred Fred Armiston doing the thing where they were trying to sing the songs together and they don't know the songs.

Speaker 1 Yep. Yep, it was that.
That's what that was. Bye.

Speaker 1 Lost Culture Reaches is the production by Will Ferrell's Big Money Players and iHeartRadio Podcasts. Created and hosted by Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang.

Speaker 1 Executive produced by Anna Hosnier and produced by Becca Ramos. Edited and mixed by Doug Bain.
And our music is by Henry Kabirski.

Speaker 1 Want to tackle one of America's most epic off-road adventures?

Speaker 1 Well, Ford and Google Maps just trekked over 5,900 miles to put the Trans-America Trail on Street View so every adventurer can explore the trail. How'd they do it?

Speaker 1 By equipping the 2025 Ford Bronco Badlands with Google's new Street View camera, while the Expedition Tremor and Ranger Lariat carried the team and tools that made it all possible.

Speaker 1 So challenge yourself. See what you're capable of.
Let your Ford handle the rest. Find the Trans-America Trail on Google Maps and hit the off-road.
Ready? Set Ford.

Speaker 1 I'm stressed. I got invited to a Friendsgiving, and now there's the big question of what to bring.
Well, just bring a bottle of Casamigos. Oh, Casamigos, of course.

Speaker 1 Nothing brings people together like a batch of Casamigos margaritas. A Casamigos margarita really is the perfect cocktail.
Plus, Casamigos goes with everything. Turkey, stuffing, mac and cheese.

Speaker 1 Oh, I was thinking more cranberry juice or ginger beer, but that works too. Well, you know, the iconic rule of culture number 743.
Anything goes with my Casamigos.

Speaker 1 This Friendsgiving, you know what everyone will be grateful for? Casamigos? I was going to say you and Casamigos. Oh,

Speaker 1 let's keep it in that order. Please drink responsibly.
Imported by Casamigo Spirits Company, White Plains, New York. Casamigo Stequila, 40% alcohol by volume.

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Speaker 1 So expand your curiosity. There are over 20 sexuality and gender identities listed on Field.
And you can change. On Field, who you were yesterday may not be who you are today.

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Download Field on the App Store or Google Play.

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Speaker 1 Plus, they're free from chemicals, parabens, and dyes and are totally safe for sensitive skin. All right, let's bring some beauty to your booty, shall we?

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Speaker 1 For more details, head to goodwipes.com/slash Colteristas. Again, that's goodwipes.com/slash Colteristas.
Snag a free pack of good wipes. Good wipes, because butts deserve better.

Speaker 1 This is an iHeart podcast.