Rewind with Karen & Georgia - Episode 32: Just the 32 of Us

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Speaker 3 Hello. Hello.

Speaker 3 Welcome. To Rewind with Karen and Georgia.

Speaker 1 That's right. That means it's Wednesday, and that means we're recapping one of our old shows with all new commentary, updates, and insights.

Speaker 3 And today we're recapping episode 32, which we named Just the 32 of Us. I thought we were done with the number pun.

Speaker 1 I mean, I can hear myself, and this may not have happened, but I can absolutely hear myself in my memory going, yeah, but it's so funny.

Speaker 3 We have to go back just for this one. Yeah.
Like,

Speaker 3 you know, you can't, don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

Speaker 1 If there's a good one, if there's just the 32 of us. That's pretty funny.

Speaker 3 It's so good.

Speaker 1 So join us today as we take you back to September 1st, 2016,

Speaker 3 when Sausage Party was still in theaters.

Speaker 3 Classic. It's a classic.
And now we can all be day one listeners.

Speaker 1 Okay, here's the intro of episode 32.

Speaker 1 Hello, welcome to my favorite murder. My name's Karen, and I sure love murder.

Speaker 3 How about you, girl over there?

Speaker 3 This week, Girl Over There is played by Georgia Hartstark. George Hartstark.

Speaker 3 Georgette Hartstark. And gee, I love murder, too.

Speaker 1 And,

Speaker 1 of course, engineer Steven is here standing by with his mustache and his

Speaker 1 stuff, his equipment, his general style.

Speaker 3 His general style. It's

Speaker 3 recording of the per cast. Oh, thank you.
Yeah. Welcome.

Speaker 3 Still trapped in the basement.

Speaker 3 Vince, so we have our murderinos that we call people who listen to this podcast. I don't, we didn't make that up.
No, we didn't, but that's what people call it. Okay.

Speaker 3 And Vince said that, so Stephen has the per cast about cats.

Speaker 3 Vince said that

Speaker 3 the people who listen should be called pervert.

Speaker 3 With three R's. Right.
That's really exercise.

Speaker 1 You got to do that.

Speaker 3 I'm going to start doing it. Vince said you can have it.
Thank you, Vince. He said, you can tell him you can have that.

Speaker 1 That's a free one from Vince. Free one.

Speaker 3 Cool.

Speaker 1 Hi, everybody. It's episode 32.

Speaker 3 Wuzza. I'm going to bring Wuzza back.
Are you?

Speaker 1 I've already threatened to do that.

Speaker 3 Waza.

Speaker 3 And that's how she got murdered.

Speaker 1 She was so hacky. The town killed her.
The city killed her.

Speaker 3 She got killed.

Speaker 1 Do you have a housekeeping?

Speaker 3 I mean, I have things I just generally want to talk about.

Speaker 1 Well, I'll say mine that are internet-specific.

Speaker 3 That are important.

Speaker 1 Yeah, mine are important.

Speaker 3 Yours are.

Speaker 1 Babby, you be quiet because it's my turn.

Speaker 3 How much I hate TV.

Speaker 1 Oh, did you watch The Last Night of?

Speaker 3 I fucking, I just, I don't, there's a block and I mean to and I haven't. No.
The answer is no.

Speaker 1 Well, then you don't want his DNA inside you.

Speaker 3 And you'll never get to have it.

Speaker 1 He was also on Colbert.

Speaker 1 We actually watched it at work because enough people at my work like him that we were all like, let's watch.

Speaker 3 Is he cute and watching?

Speaker 1 He is perfection. It's, there's something like Disney-esque about the scale of the size of his eyes to the rest of his face.
His nose lips.

Speaker 1 Like he got a nose job. It's so perfectly shaped.
And then in general, he just has the, he has the charisma, but he's very low-key. Like he's smart enough to know not to overplay it.

Speaker 3 We're talking about Rizamed. We're talking about Riza Med.

Speaker 1 Britain's own.

Speaker 3 And he's got the British accent, man.

Speaker 3 The street British accent.

Speaker 1 Yeah. Stop it.
But he can do any British accent.

Speaker 3 Because

Speaker 3 I only heard him speaking in a British accent when he was rapping, so I was like.

Speaker 1 Yeah, he was trying to, he was turning it a little bit on, but

Speaker 1 also I saw him in the

Speaker 1 Unwilling Fundamentalist. What's that movie? He stars in a movie

Speaker 1 about an fundamentalist that doesn't want to be

Speaker 1 who doesn't. The word isn't unwilling, though.
Sorry. It's part of the title.
I'm his number one fan. But in that one, he had like a posh British accent.

Speaker 3 No, I want it to be dirty, please.

Speaker 1 Jesus. Keep it dirty.
Hi, Vince. It's Karen.

Speaker 1 She said more gross stuff about Riza Med this time.

Speaker 1 The thing I wanted to mention was

Speaker 1 a woman named Leam Moffat made us this amazing animated opening

Speaker 1 to our

Speaker 1 podcast theme song. You can see it on the Twitter page.
You can see it on the Facebook page.

Speaker 3 I'll put it on the, we have a new Facebook fan page because people told us that that's how you're supposed to do things.

Speaker 1 Don't, don't be closed off all the time. Maybe open some stuff up.

Speaker 3 Yeah, so we have a new Facebook fan page. I will post it on there.
It is, it's your, like, how do you, how did you feel watching it with your music and your voice?

Speaker 1 I couldn't breathe. Yeah.
And, but also, I, it's that weird thing of like, it's very strange when someone holds up something you did and goes, now here's something I did to match it.

Speaker 1 Like, it's just magical. I love it.
Gorgeous. And it's the cutest, like, the style of it is so like, there's a little skeleton in every scene.

Speaker 3 Oh, and the way it so moves.

Speaker 3 The way everything flows and moves.

Speaker 1 But it's creepy. Very creepy.
It's all perfectly done. So Leanne Moffitt, thank you so much for

Speaker 1 doing that and thinking of us and participating in that very creative and cool way.

Speaker 3 Thanks to everyone who create, like, there's so many cute drawings of us, even though we berated them last week. They like it.
I know. I keep posting them on Instagram.

Speaker 3 We have an Instagram, my favorite murder, and I just am constantly, I like, can't stop posting all day, and I feel like I'm getting annoying because there's just so much cool shit to post.

Speaker 1 Well, it's fun to be able to go like, well, here's hair because the people like it when you notice their shit.

Speaker 3 It's, you know,

Speaker 3 my favorite one from our last episode is,

Speaker 3 you know, the part where I go, dough, a dead body, a female dead body. Someone took a photo of my face and put it over.

Speaker 3 the face in um sound of music sound of music where she's singing on this on the hilltop to all the children and And it's just my little face, like a perfect photo of me with my mouth open, like looking like I'm singing.

Speaker 3 And it says Do it.

Speaker 3 Stephen showing it to Karen right now.

Speaker 3 I will put that on the Facebook page too. Really? Isn't that amazing? Who did it? Jessica P.
Thank you, Jessica V.

Speaker 1 Well done, Jessica P. That is hilarious.
Because also the George's face, her mouth is open. It looks like she's going, hey,

Speaker 1 but she's holding a guitar.

Speaker 3 That's hilarious.

Speaker 3 So much good shit.

Speaker 1 Good. You know, sadly, somebody put my face inside of Selena's face.

Speaker 3 Oh, no.

Speaker 1 No, no, no. It's not truly, sadly.
Oh. This is a comedy podcast, but

Speaker 1 it was a picture of me before I stopped drinking. You can find such a range of hideous pictures of me online.

Speaker 3 It's hilarious. I ate it.

Speaker 1 It's not cool at all.

Speaker 3 When your weight fluctuates,

Speaker 3 and you get photographed for things a lot. Yeah.
And you just.

Speaker 1 You just kind of have to separate. And you just have, like, my thing is just like, whatever.
I know what I I look like.

Speaker 3 Mine's not.

Speaker 1 Oh my god, this one where they put my face and just, I'm pretty sure it was Selena's picture. It was like big 80s hair with the pink background.
Did you see that, Steven?

Speaker 1 It was, I was like,

Speaker 1 is that Charles Bronson wearing a wig?

Speaker 3 Like, it looked horrifying. I hate that.

Speaker 1 But of course, I'm not complaining because, of course, all the people who saw it were like, oh my god, this is so cute. Where you're just like, what?

Speaker 1 Anyway, I had to complain. And also, just we looked it up.
This was in, oh, wait, this, if it, if it was from the minisode, then you might not know what we're talking about.

Speaker 1 But last week's mini-what's that?

Speaker 3 We have to say correction corner.

Speaker 1 Correction corner, meow, meow, meow.

Speaker 1 Georgia talked about a lady who had a disease. And many doctors, frighteningly enough, listen to this podcast.

Speaker 1 Yeah, because those are the people, or medical students, I'm not sure, people who know how it's actually pronounced.

Speaker 3 Well, sorry, not sorry. I'm not a doctor or a medical student.

Speaker 1 Never say sorry, not sorry. Just don't be sorry.

Speaker 3 Oh, okay. Yeah.
I thought you were berating me for trying to bring that back when you're trying to bring, what was it, Lou? Oh, good point.

Speaker 1 No, throw that right in my face. I accept that.
You're 100% right. But I hate sorry, not sorry, because you don't have to be sorry at all.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 I saw that crop up in like girls talking where it's like,

Speaker 1 look, sorry, that's not sorry. Where it's like, no, no, no.
What you start out is look, motherfucker, and then you say your actual opinion. Sorry, I'm I'm yelling.

Speaker 3 Don't apologize.

Speaker 1 I'm so tired.

Speaker 3 Oh, you're right.

Speaker 1 I'm so tired.

Speaker 1 Here's how you pronounce it.

Speaker 3 Well, now I'm having a fucking seizure.

Speaker 3 Jesus.

Speaker 1 I got it. There's like, that's a sound clip from some guys on the radio or something in England who also didn't know how to say Guillain Barre syndrome.

Speaker 3 Guillain Barre? Well, so there. Well, consider me wrong again.

Speaker 1 Consider me always wrong.

Speaker 3 Correction. Connor.
Correction, Corner.

Speaker 3 What else?

Speaker 3 How are you? What do you want to say? Anything?

Speaker 1 I wish you guys could see Georgia right now. Her legs are so far up in the air.
She is the most casual person I've ever seen in my life.

Speaker 3 This is the loungiest.

Speaker 1 You're fucking lounging in your home.

Speaker 3 Lounging so hard right now.

Speaker 1 As is your American right.

Speaker 3 Stephen, can you take a photo of me lounging up right now? I'll put it on the vent. It's fixed my sweat.
I'm also sweating.

Speaker 1 That's cool. Sweat lounging.

Speaker 3 And I got a Mimi cat on the

Speaker 3 photo. It just happened.

Speaker 3 Check it on the, well, let's plug our places. Instagram.com/slash mypa murder.
Oh, the face.

Speaker 1 That's like a picture. Finally, a picture of myself.
I'm not mad.

Speaker 3 I love it. Look at those cheekbones, Karen.

Speaker 1 I wasn't even really sucking them in.

Speaker 3 Parts a bit off. Look at you.

Speaker 1 You look so hilarious.

Speaker 3 That's my entire butt. Also, that's going to end up on, that's going to end up on WikiFeet.
I promise you. And I have a WikiFeet page.
I mean, look at my feet. They're pretty fucking cute.

Speaker 3 Let's be honest.

Speaker 3 You deserve it. Thank you.
Yeah. I'm going to own it.
You know why? Because I don't have a Wikipedia page. So I'm okay with WikiFeet.
So you're going to be fine. Here we go.

Speaker 1 You got to break in somehow.

Speaker 3 Do you know what else pisses me off? What? I'm not going to tell you. Never mind.
I am pissed off that my high school, they have like a list of like alumni who have done things

Speaker 3 not on there.

Speaker 1 Where's the list?

Speaker 3 On Wikipedia?

Speaker 1 Oh, please, will someone who's good at computers go onto Wikipedia and edit that page?

Speaker 3 What's the high school name? Woodbridge High School. In Irvine, California.

Speaker 1 Woodbridge High School, Irvine, California.

Speaker 3 Also, let everyone know I hate, I hated them all. I hate them all.
No, don't put that word in.

Speaker 1 Now, this is your high school WikiFeet page.

Speaker 3 Okay, the fan page. Okay, here's, this is hilarious.
So I try to start the fan page.

Speaker 3 We can't use the word murder in the title because Facebook is like, we recognize a word that you can't fucking, you can't say because you're not, you're a grown adult. And you know what I mean?

Speaker 1 I'm fine.

Speaker 3 So it's MFM podcast

Speaker 3 is the name of the Facebook fan page. Cool.

Speaker 1 So you kind of have to be an insider to know that it's just the initials. It's like winky wink.

Speaker 3 And then I think that means also that maybe your friend, your family and friends won't know that you're part of a murder group. I think that's going to say MFM.

Speaker 3 Yeah, I think that's what people are worried about.

Speaker 1 Until they see the logo.

Speaker 3 Again, grown adults.

Speaker 1 Yeah. I mean, that's the other thing, too.
Of all the people we know that say, I'm not weird. I'm not alone.
you know, all that excitement.

Speaker 1 Well, now it's turning into, because then the second wave seemed to be

Speaker 1 people at work keep catching me listening to this and giving me dirty looks or seeing my logo and giving me a weird look.

Speaker 3 Yeah.

Speaker 1 But we just got a tweet from somebody who sent a picture that said,

Speaker 1 was it on the Facebook page or Twitter? I can't remember. Where they hang up.
a sign on the door that says murder time do not come in and then listen to the podcast at at work all together.

Speaker 3 Oh, like the whole crew does? Yeah.

Speaker 1 Well, I mean, she didn't, she was very vague about all of it.

Speaker 1 I'm shouting her. I should find the name, but if you guys hear this, will you please send us at least slightly more information so we can give you a legit shout out?

Speaker 1 Because it made me laugh so hard when I saw that podcast.

Speaker 3 Or send us a photo of all of you listening. Secretly.

Speaker 3 Also, I love that I've been noticing in the Facebook page, like I'll look at some comments sometimes late at night and it'll be like comment, comment, comment.

Speaker 3 And then someone will will comment to someone who already commented and be like alex you're in this group you're in a murderina like oh my god melissa i can't believe it we're like we're totally good like it's people keep recognizing their friends in there and it's like hilarious and i love it well the same thing happened to me with my sister's best friend adrienne who i talked about i think on the very first episode she had a hometown Yeah, she, well, she loved Richard Ramirez.

Speaker 1 So when I said, who should I talk about, it came out of her mouth so fast that that's when I discovered she was a murderino before the podcast had even started.

Speaker 1 And it it was shocking because I known her since she was 12 years old and I was 10 years old and never knew that that was an interest of hers. So she recently started listening.

Speaker 1 She went backwards through it and has been texting me constantly of like, dude, I love this podcast so much. And Adrian and my sister were two of the most evil teenage girls anyone could have.

Speaker 1 had the nightmare to grow up with. They were sullen and sulky.

Speaker 1 And the only way they would let me hang out with them when she spent the night on the weekend, she would come and stay the whole weekend with us.

Speaker 1 But they would lock the door and leave me out of the room. And what I had to do to get in the room with Laura and Adrian was make up a lip-sync dance routine to a Papanatar song.

Speaker 3 Well, we're not moving forward right now on this podcast until you fucking do that.

Speaker 3 Let's relive your nightmares.

Speaker 1 We just basically play a Pap Anatar song.

Speaker 3 But

Speaker 1 that's all it would be. And then you'd be like, right now she's lifting her legs straight above her head.

Speaker 3 Oh my God, That's so big sisters, man.

Speaker 1 Well, and also just if you're younger and you hate your sister, just know that's going to change around when you're like 22. And then you're going to be besties for the rest of your life.

Speaker 3 You're going to become the cool one. Exactly.
My sister knows what's up.

Speaker 1 Well, and also I have my sister and Adrian to thank for like all of my training because that's pretty much the most professional training I got.

Speaker 3 And then

Speaker 3 on stage. It was pretty good.
I think my, I'm scared. I think my dad might start listening to this.
Because

Speaker 3 what?

Speaker 1 I thought he was already.

Speaker 3 I don't think so because he was like, I was hanging out with him over the weekend and he was like, Tell me about your thing. Like, they don't understand that it's a thing.

Speaker 3 And I was like, oh, it's this thing. And I'm like, well, he doesn't know how to download a podcast.
And then he looked at his phone and he showed me the podcast. And he was like, this?

Speaker 3 And I was like, uh-huh.

Speaker 3 Yeah, no. It's okay.
He's cool.

Speaker 1 He doesn't care about the F-word, does he? Oh, my God.

Speaker 3 No. My God, you can't have me as a child and care about the F-word.
Care about a lot of things, honestly. I think he's happy that I'm alive, survived my own.

Speaker 3 I am too. I mean, that I'm alive or that you're alive.
But you're alive. Nevertheless, me too.

Speaker 1 It was supposed to be a compliment.

Speaker 3 Oh, thank you.

Speaker 3 All right. You guys, we're going to get into our favorite murders.
Yes. We're going to take a quick pee break.

Speaker 3 We'll be right back for my favorite murder. Skippers,

Speaker 1 this is your time to come on home.

Speaker 3 Come on home. Be right back.

Speaker 1 All right. That was a big, long one.

Speaker 1 Did you really not ever finish The Night Of? You've never seen the end?

Speaker 3 I didn't ever finish it. I just.

Speaker 3 I'm so impatient with shows. Like, I just don't, I can't get through anything.
If I get through a series, it should get an Oscar immediately because it's good.

Speaker 1 Can you think of an example of a series you got through because you liked the lead actor the way I, of course, was returning week after week for my friend Ruzaman?

Speaker 3 No, but I can think of one that I got through even though I don't like the lead actor and that's how good was.

Speaker 3 But this might get us in trouble because it's Ozark.

Speaker 1 Oh, you're not a Bateman fan?

Speaker 3 I love Jason Bateman. I think he's a great actor.
He just does this thing that drives me crazy. And

Speaker 3 you'll never not see it again if I tell you, or he goes, okay, at the end of every sentence, okay?

Speaker 3 Okay.

Speaker 3 Yeah, he's being

Speaker 1 casual, improvisational, real

Speaker 1 talking.

Speaker 3 Exactly. And I know that and he knows what he's doing, but I can't ignore it.
And I can't be like, that's a character because Jason Bateman keeps fucking doing that.

Speaker 1 Yes, that's right.

Speaker 3 But it was such a good show that I was able to get past that. Wow.
So, yeah.

Speaker 1 I think we can leave that in.

Speaker 3 Okay.

Speaker 3 Okay.

Speaker 1 His hands on his hips.

Speaker 3 Okay. Okay.
Yeah. No, leave it.
Let's fucking, let's get some fucking drama stirred up on this podcasting.

Speaker 1 Come on, cross, cross-podcast

Speaker 1 rivalries.

Speaker 3 Come on, they've never heard of us. Let's fucking.

Speaker 3 Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 1 Well, here's how they will hear of you. Do you know that

Speaker 1 you talked about that you didn't make it on your high school's Wikipedia page?

Speaker 1 You are now on your high school's Wikipedia page.

Speaker 3 I know some beautiful Marterino fucking went and added me. I wonder if it's still there and said that she hated it.
Georgia attended high school, da-da-da-da-da, and she hated every minute of it.

Speaker 3 Hey, yeah.

Speaker 3 Hey. That was an honor.
That was definitely one of those moments in the podcast where I was like, wow, this is like, this is real. This is huge.
This is like cool.

Speaker 3 It's huge. And I was so appreciative of it.

Speaker 1 What I think is funny is that it's the Wikipedia page for your high school. It's not even like your Wikipedia page.

Speaker 1 It's like, you were bummed about something that's real sub-sub

Speaker 1 sub,

Speaker 3 you know. No, because every high school Wikipedia page has people who of note who attended, every single one of them, including this one.

Speaker 3 It and had like these random like you know sports fucking commentator or whatever and i'm like i could can i i think i i think i've reached that excuse i was on cooking channel can i please have it you know yeah so i mean i bet yours has one too Did we ever look it up?

Speaker 1 I doubt it. I mean, no.

Speaker 3 I don't think a high school that has like literally 200 kids at it in a small town in Northern California has a Wikipedia page. Yeah, this was a big one, too.

Speaker 1 Yeah, we may have done unless we broke the law somehow, which

Speaker 1 or like because we got a nice new football field or something, but I don't think so.

Speaker 3 Yeah, yeah, okay. I don't know.
Okay, it's like you get your high school's like low key and mine is like, you know, high key, high key

Speaker 3 in the highest key. I think we should post the photo on the, when we post this episode on socials of the couch photo of us.
One of my favorites.

Speaker 1 One of the great casual photos. What's the real word I'm looking for?

Speaker 3 Ass shot, just complete

Speaker 3 butt shot of me. Yep.
Georgia. Ass and feet.
Wearing her hot pants.

Speaker 3 Yep.

Speaker 1 With me with kind of my weird bald spot of like my cowl, my cowlic bald spot that's always been there.

Speaker 3 What's noticeable in this is your cheekbones. Every time this gets posted, people comment on your cheekbones.

Speaker 1 I'm very blessed. Very blessed.
Thank you, Pat. That's all Pat Kilgare's doing.

Speaker 3 Ah,

Speaker 3 those feet. I don't know who those are on me.
Thanks. Dad, I think those are Marty's.

Speaker 1 It would be amazing if you found out you were making so much money on Wiki feet right now.

Speaker 3 Man, honestly, if fucking, if fans only,

Speaker 3 whatever it's called, existed in my 20s, I would have made some serious cash on those feet. Yeah.
But what are you going to do?

Speaker 1 All right. Well, let's get into George's story right now about the murder of Selena.

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Speaker 1 Right? It just came out of the bag. I think I put it on and walked directly to a record with you.
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Speaker 3 Goodbye.

Speaker 3 Hey, we're back, skippers. Hi.
Hi.

Speaker 3 Friends.

Speaker 3 All right. My favorite murder this week

Speaker 3 is Selena Quintina Perez.

Speaker 3 No.

Speaker 3 And the reason I'm doing it is that it is audio engineer Stevie Ray Morris of the Purdue's favorite murder tribute.

Speaker 4 I, yeah, no.

Speaker 3 You've been sending me shit. Yeah, I was like sending you text and I was like, oh my God, I'm watching.

Speaker 4 And then

Speaker 4 Aaron Brockovich did like a true crime

Speaker 3 that I watched yesterday.

Speaker 4 Well, I grew up listening to Selena because I'm half my family. I'm half Mexican.
And so that music was always playing.

Speaker 4 And I remember like even listening to the music, just feeling really sad for Selena.

Speaker 3 Were you little when she died, so you didn't know yet?

Speaker 4 I mean, I knew it affected because I would still go over to my family's houses and stuff.

Speaker 3 She was huge.

Speaker 1 She was like Madonna times 20.

Speaker 3 Well, I'll tell you all about it. Oh, oh.

Speaker 3 Stephen, quintinilla?

Speaker 4 Quintanilla. Oh, I don't.
I mean, I'm Mexican, but I don't know how to speak Spanish.

Speaker 3 Okay, I wrote it down. Like, I was very.

Speaker 4 I didn't know how to speak Spanish either.

Speaker 3 I know. I know.

Speaker 3 Put your fucking skin.

Speaker 3 Both of you, shut up.

Speaker 3 Oops. Oh, Karen, your doorbell phone is ringing.

Speaker 3 Selena Quintinia Perez was born on April 16th, 1971 in Lake Jackson, Texas, and was called the Mexican-American Madonna.

Speaker 1 Oh, I must have known that. I've watched a movie with J-Lo.

Speaker 3 I I haven't seen it.

Speaker 3 Wonderful. Gosh, she's beautiful.
They were both beautiful. And she was poised to become a crossover success when her death turned her into a legend.

Speaker 3 Selena's father discovered Selena's, quote, perfect timing and pitch and helped his kids form a band. And she was like nine years old when they started performing.
Wow. The band, once

Speaker 3 her parents lost their family restaurant, the band became the family's main source of income. And they were in poverty.
And this career, Selena's career, just took them out of poverty

Speaker 3 because they were evicted from their home during the Texas oil bust of 1982 and they moved to Corpus Christi, Texas, which sounds very hot, doesn't it?

Speaker 1 Yeah, I think it's super southern in Texas, like down in the Gulf, maybe. Right.

Speaker 3 That's a donal guess. I know.
I was like, right. Do I want to?

Speaker 1 Well, my cousin Cheryl lived in Corpus Christi when I was like in junior high.

Speaker 1 But why do I ever say anything?

Speaker 3 Is that a big military town? I think it is. Yes.

Speaker 1 In fact, it has 25 that I've been talking about.

Speaker 3 Let's just talk about Corpus Christie for the rest of this.

Speaker 3 So then the family band began recording music professionally. And in 1984, when Selena was, I think, 13, the band released its first LP, Selena

Speaker 3 Los Dinos.

Speaker 3 Fuck, I hope. I hope it doesn't.

Speaker 1 Selena and Fred Flintstone's dog.

Speaker 3 Dinosaur.

Speaker 3 Hate mail can be sent to Karen Kilgaroff.

Speaker 3 I'm just translating. Karen Kilgaroff's apartment or house, the address is.

Speaker 3 So yes, Stephen, you are correct. Selena was a third generation Texan of Mexican descent, so she didn't grow up speaking Spanish, so she didn't know any, but she learned all her songs phonetically.

Speaker 3 And when her popularity grew, she had to learn it, and she did very quickly.

Speaker 1 Just like Roxette.

Speaker 3 Like what?

Speaker 1 The band Roxette.

Speaker 3 What were they, German?

Speaker 1 Yeah, or Swedish or something.

Speaker 3 Oh, they had to learn English?

Speaker 1 Well, no, they just sang phonetically. They didn't know what they were saying.
That's funny.

Speaker 3 Must have been love, but it's all in that.

Speaker 1 That she had no clue what that song was.

Speaker 3 Oh, but it's so powerful.

Speaker 3 But it sounds so powerful.

Speaker 1 The ignorance makes it powerful.

Speaker 3 That's what it is. Like, because that's what love does to you.
Makes you a stupid idiot. That's right.

Speaker 3 Okay.

Speaker 3 Grew in popularity. In the year 1987, she won the

Speaker 3 Taneho. Oh, God.

Speaker 1 Tejano?

Speaker 3 Tejano Music Award. I like, I was watching videos to get this correctly, and I'm just screwing it all up.
Tejano Music Award for female vocalist of the year.

Speaker 3 And then she landed her first major record deal with Capital at Latin in 1989.

Speaker 3 So she performed several times at the Houston Astroderm to sold out crowds of more than 60,000 people.

Speaker 3 And after her death, time described her as

Speaker 3 the embodiment of young, smart, hip Mexican-American youth

Speaker 3 from a tight-knit family and a down-to-earth personality, a Madonna without the controversy.

Speaker 3 Essentially, she was a huge Mexican-American star in her community and was poised to become a mainstream cess.

Speaker 3 And that community was obsessed with her and proud of her and felt like, you know, she was one of their own.

Speaker 3 She was a big fucking deal. Yeah.
And she seemed like a very sweet person. Everyone in her band was her family, except the guy, the guitarist they hired, who she ended up marrying.

Speaker 3 Like, they were, they seemed like good people.

Speaker 1 It's like a Jackson 5 situation. Totally.
Super talented, young kid.

Speaker 3 Yeah, but not creepy. And her dad was the manager.

Speaker 1 So they were very like a partridge family.

Speaker 3 There we go. But actually,

Speaker 3 or like a Mansed family.

Speaker 3 Fuck.

Speaker 3 Cut that out. Don't cut that out.
Not sorry. All right.

Speaker 3 Where am I? Cut to mid-1991. Yolanda Saldivar.
She was.

Speaker 3 So you've seen all these photos of her and videos of her. She was, when she got arrested, she was 35 years old.
What? That's, quote unquote, my age. She's 35.
She looks like a fucking grandma. Yeah.

Speaker 3 Okay, so 91, Yolanda Saldivar was around 30, and she was an in-home nurse for patients with terminal cancer and just a fan of Tejano music. Just a fucking random woman.

Speaker 3 She had a history of stealing money from her employers as well as trying to become intertwined with the lives of other performers.

Speaker 3 And she attended one of Selena's concerts and became a fucking psychotic fan.

Speaker 3 With the intent of starting Selena's fan club, she started obsessively calling Selena's father, leaving almost 15 messages until he gave her permission in June of 1991 to be the president of the fan club.

Speaker 3 Which sounds like, okay, you know what? Take this, run with it, do your thing, right?

Speaker 1 Right, because you're harassing us. Yeah.
So, I mean, that's, it's, it's the thing that they didn't know back then that people know nowadays, which is don't engage.

Speaker 3 Right.

Speaker 1 Yeah. 15 calls to anybody at any time is too many.
Yeah. I don't care if like you have a flat tire and you're calling it a lot of people.

Speaker 3 But it's almost like too many calls.

Speaker 3 And she wants to run this thing and make us more money. And it's a thing that we haven't started.
And maybe it'll help her with her. Like, this is what I'm thinking was there.

Speaker 1 You know what I mean? I'm just saying that's three calls.

Speaker 3 Totally. In a day? Totally.
Totally.

Speaker 3 Also, like, you don't need to have contact with her after that. Okay.
So as president of the fan club, she was responsible for membership benefits, collecting money and promoting Selena,

Speaker 3 all that kind of thing. And she actually didn't meet Selena until December 91, but they became close friends and Yolanda became a trusted,

Speaker 3 trusted by her whole family. In 94, she became Selena's assistant and quit her job as a nurse.
Oh, I didn't know that. Yeah.

Speaker 1 I did not know that. I thought she was just the fan club.

Speaker 3 No, she became her assistant. She quit her job as a a nurse, even though she was making more money as a nurse than she was doing this.

Speaker 3 Like, she was just so obsessed and had posters all over her house. And people come over.
She would just make them watch Selena videos, talked about nothing else, and was just like

Speaker 3 kind of like crazy about Selena. Wow.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 I was kind of that way about kids in the hall for a little while, but it was a dark period of my life.

Speaker 1 Yeah, I was just, I had flunked out of college and I was just weirdly obsessed. It was when they were running them on Comedy Central and I just, it was the only thing that made me happy.

Speaker 3 That laugh was the creepiest. That was, I've never heard that laugh before.

Speaker 1 I just realized, I mean, every, we all have the potential. Everybody likes a thing

Speaker 3 like crazy. And wants them, like, has this feeling of like ownership and like, yeah.
And like, I, no one understands it the way I understand it. It's almost made for me kind of a thing.
Yes.

Speaker 3 But have you met them and told them that?

Speaker 1 See, my thing is that, and maybe it's just from working in TV, I really don't like celebrities. Like, there's nothing more disappointing.

Speaker 1 And I think most people know it these days from reality TV and stuff. Celebrities are very disappointing in real life, except for us.

Speaker 1 Yeah, no, they're just, I mean, the most they'll be is slightly pleasant, but for the most part, you will, you will have regretted trying to be like, hey, can I get a picture?

Speaker 3 I'm a big fan or whatever. You're not going to get Julian and it's some obscure thing.
And they're like,

Speaker 3 they don't care.

Speaker 1 It's super weird. It's like, you know, it ruins it almost.
So

Speaker 1 good luck, everybody.

Speaker 3 Good luck in life with your fucking cute little fantasies.

Speaker 3 All right. Well, then, so in 94, Selena starts opening fashion boutiques.
She has two of them opening up. It's called Selena, Etcetra.

Speaker 3 I didn't know that. Yeah, I didn't either because she has this crazy style.
It's very 90s and very like on point, like, you know, almost Madonna-y, but a little more hip. Right.
It's cute.

Speaker 1 It's those huge, well, Well, from what I remember in the movie, there's like a lot of ruffles and a lot of like, you know, shimmery, velvety pants and stuff like that.

Speaker 3 A lot of hoop earrings and red lipstick. And yeah, it's pretty fucking sweet.

Speaker 3 So

Speaker 3 she's opening these clothing, these fashion stores and asks Sal Devar to become the manager of the boutiques.

Speaker 3 So Sal Devar, because of doing this, is authorized to write and cash checks, had access to the bank accounts associated with the fan club and the boutiques.

Speaker 3 And Selena gave her an American Express card for the purpose of conducting company business.

Speaker 1 So she put her stalker, she made her stalker the CEO of the company.

Speaker 3 I know that she's the stalker, though. Oh, right.
Oh, yeah. Selena has no idea that she's the stalker.
She just thinks she's a good friend of hers.

Speaker 1 That's like willing to do all this hard work.

Speaker 3 Yeah, that's like, you know.

Speaker 3 Selena's in this bubble of becoming famous and touring and all these things.

Speaker 3 And this person is becoming a trusted confidant has and and is a huge fan and clearly is an intelligent woman if she's a nurse yeah

Speaker 3 totally okay

Speaker 3 yeah and everyone said she was very manipulative and good at you know being manipulative yeah um 15 calls that's all i have to say yeah 15 calls it worked somehow so within a year salvivar um had mismanaged the boutiques and they were failing.

Speaker 3 And then upon investigation, the family finds out that Saldivar had embezzled more than, I saw $60,000, but I also saw $100,000 and forged checks from both the fan club and the boutiques.

Speaker 3 But Selena refused to believe it. She was like, no way, that's my friend.
Like even her father, who's a manager and her husband and brother were like, dude, they were like, dude.

Speaker 3 I'm probably not like that.

Speaker 3 But eventually, Selena.

Speaker 3 kind of sees some shit going on and believes it. And the family fires her, tells her not to come near Selena.

Speaker 3 But Selena still wanted to to become friends, stay friends. She was like, you don't work for me anymore, but let's stay friends.
So at this time, Saladivar purchases a snub-nosed.38 caliber revolver.

Speaker 3 And here's what I think is the fucked up thing is.38 caliber hollow point bullets. Then the bullets were designed to cause more extensive injuries than normal bullets.
Oh, no.

Speaker 3 Which like throws out later we'll talk about it. So on March 31st in 1995, she convinces Selena to meet

Speaker 3 her alone in a days in motel room, promising to restore, to return financial documents that she had stolen and telling Selena that she had to come alone and that she had, that Yolanda had been raped and needed someone to talk to.

Speaker 3 I know.

Speaker 3 And this, she has to make up this lie because three other times in the past couple of weeks, Yolanda had tried to get her alone and it had been foiled every time and her husband had come or they had met in a parking lot or something like that.

Speaker 3 So Yolanda was trying to get her alone. Yeah.

Speaker 3 So in the hotel room,

Speaker 3 they kind of fight over

Speaker 3 the

Speaker 3 documents. And as they're doing that, the gun comes out and Selena turns to run and out the door and Saldivar shoots her in the back as she's running out, severing an artery leading from her heart.

Speaker 3 And it came out the front of her chest on the other side. So it's kind of like a shoulder shot.

Speaker 3 And Selena's running towards the motel lobby as she's bleeding. And Salvar comes, there was a witness said that he, she chased after her, pointing the gun at her and calling her a bitch.

Speaker 3 Selena ran 130 yards to the motel's lobby and collapsed on the floor. And meanwhile, Yolanda's now trying to escape in her car.

Speaker 3 And it was theorized that she's heading to the recording studio where the rest of Selena's family is to kill them too. That's what they thought.

Speaker 3 But a police officer who was around the corner responded, stopped her, and instead of getting out of the car, she pulls the car into a parking space

Speaker 3 and gets kind of blocked in in this parking spot. So she's in her car, in a parking spot, with a gun, won't come out.
In the meantime, the motel staff is trying to help Selena.

Speaker 3 An ambulance comes in less than two minutes, but Selena's pronounced dead at 1.05 from loss of blood and cardiac arrest.

Speaker 3 Her last words were, this fucking makes me want to cry, her last words, Yolanda

Speaker 3 Salvar, room 158. Those were her last words, like not tell my family.
I love them.

Speaker 1 She was just trying to make sure they knew who did.

Speaker 3 Yeah, which makes me so sad. It's just like the last words out of your mouth are about your killer's name.
Well, yeah.

Speaker 3 I mean, I know, like, I know, like, you should get them out, but then I just wish it could then be like something sweeter. She was only 23 years old.
Oh, no. No.
Baby.

Speaker 3 Well, an autopsy is performed. And this is what I thought when I heard about her running after getting shot.
She died of heart failure. Wait, no.

Speaker 3 We realized Selena's heart, fueled by adrenaline, and I think from running,

Speaker 3 pumped all the blood out of her circulatory system. So I feel like if she hadn't run, she either might have gotten shot again by Yolanda, but she, but, or

Speaker 3 the blood might not have.

Speaker 1 It's those hollow point bullets.

Speaker 3 Yeah. I mean, I don't think you can get shot and it comes out the other side and you can survive that, right?

Speaker 1 No, because isn't that part of it is like they explode inside you. And so when they come out, they just, instead of a bullet hole size coming out, it like rips out.
I mean, those things are evil.

Speaker 3 Yeah.

Speaker 3 That's the thing is. So event.
So Salvar is trying to say, I'm just trying to say that it was an accident, that she was going to kill herself. But it's like, well, why did you buy those bullets then?

Speaker 3 Yeah. Like you clearly had a motive.

Speaker 3 So meanwhile, there's a nine-hour nine-hour standoff with Yolanda in which she is in her car with the gun to her head, hysterically on the phone with the hostage, with the negotiator trying to say that she didn't mean to kill her.

Speaker 3 She was in an accident. She was trying to kill herself.

Speaker 3 And all these other excuses. But ultimately,

Speaker 3 let's see.

Speaker 3 She gave herself in and she got arrested. She's tried for first degree murder and claimed that the gun, quote, accidentally went off and all these other excuses, but ultimately it didn't work.

Speaker 3 And the jurors deliberated for less than three hours. And on October 23rd, 1995, they found Saldivar guilty.

Speaker 3 She's sentenced to life in prison with a possibility of parole in 30 years, which is going to be March 2025.

Speaker 3 But everyone's like,

Speaker 3 She is so incredibly hated in Texas. She will be murdered.
And she has to be in solitary confinement because of that, because the rest of the...

Speaker 1 Everybody wants to kill her in jail.

Speaker 3 yeah everyone in jail who was huge selena fans her whole life wants to fucking murder her yeah that's i mean yeah yeah so she's she spends every day 23 hours a day alone in a nine by six foot cell

Speaker 3 um

Speaker 3 let's see so the case has been described as the most important trial for the latino population and it was compared to the oj simpson murder trial

Speaker 3 it was one of the most publicly followed trials in the history of texas wow her posthumous 1995 crossover album, Dreaming of You, debuted at number one on the billboard charts and became triple platinum.

Speaker 3 That just gave me chills. I know.
She was the first Hispanic artist to have a predominantly Spanish-language album debut and peak at number one.

Speaker 1 That's so fucking cool.

Speaker 3 I know.

Speaker 1 I mean, terribly sad, but also

Speaker 1 because I remember that being in the movie where it's like the

Speaker 1 it's a tragedy anyway. Yeah.
But this was someone who was poised on the verge of crossing over at a time before

Speaker 1 that was like before JLo, before any of those things.

Speaker 3 Well, we remember like in the late, you and I, and people are age remember in the late 90s, like this huge,

Speaker 3 this huge Latin pop explosion. And that was like the first time it became mainstream.
So Selena's doing this in the early 90s. Yeah.

Speaker 1 So she's before Ricky Martin, before like any of that, where it was kind of like the sexy, you know,

Speaker 3 Shakira, anyway. That wasn't, yeah, that wasn't wasn't on

Speaker 3 American pop radio. Yeah.
Like that was not on there at all. So she was kind of a trailblazer and seemed like a good person and this fucking psycho bitch

Speaker 3 fan.

Speaker 3 Like I didn't, I didn't know. I always pictured it differently.
And it's just like

Speaker 3 so fucking tragic.

Speaker 1 Well, it's also fascinating that thing of like when you can, it's like when you were saying, you know, she's just this random person, but you do trace those things of like a person who embezzles a person who um like those kind of smaller crimes it that's how every story goes like this where it's like they always have a background where they're trying to get anything they want at any price and they have like gray area morals too yeah like I don't like, yeah, someone, if I knew a friend embezzled money, I would not trust that person.

Speaker 3 You're not allowed to steal money from other people. It's not your money.
No.

Speaker 1 No, you don't get to have a lot of people.

Speaker 3 You have to abide by certain rules in life and not screw other people over.

Speaker 1 And you don't want to be that person. Like, I remember there was a cafe I was working at when I was

Speaker 1 a teen, and I had it

Speaker 1 in my mind. I decided that I could take a $20 bill when I was closing at night so I could buy beer because they only paid me minimum wage.

Speaker 3 This whole rationalization. Totally.

Speaker 1 And I did it two times, was

Speaker 1 racked with guilt about it. And And then the manager told me, did I tell you this?

Speaker 1 The manager, who was also my friend, like someone I hung out with, he goes, I don't, something's going on. We're always short.
I think it might be the janitor.

Speaker 1 And then I was like, oh my, because that's what happens. You steal, somebody else could go down for it.
Or like, I mean, the idea that he even would suspect this person who has nothing to do with it.

Speaker 1 Then I thought maybe he told me that because he knew it was Dead. Because it was always me.
He did. Or it was me the two times.
And that was just a manipulation, which God bless you, genius move.

Speaker 1 Yeah. But also, like, and then I, like, the next week, I was talking to my dad on the phone, and we were talking about something else.

Speaker 1 And then he goes, Karen, there's some people out there that just can't keep their hands out of the till. Oh, and then I almost threw up because I was like, I almost wanted to go, that's me.

Speaker 3 My dad is, my, my sweet dad is talking about bad people.

Speaker 1 And I'm the bad person.

Speaker 3 You don't want to be the bad person. No.

Speaker 1 You don't, you don't need whatever the thing is you think you need.

Speaker 3 You don't. And get your own.
Get your own.

Speaker 1 Get your own. You can

Speaker 3 yeah

Speaker 3 keep

Speaker 3 your hands out of the kitty that's super weird that i talked about that picture so weird sorry about that i didn't know i don't care it's super like we've never talked about her before no not at all that is super weird

Speaker 3 All right. Wow.

Speaker 1 That was a big story to cover. Do you have updates? Yeah.

Speaker 3 I do. So Selena's music and legacy, of course, continue to live on.

Speaker 3 After her death in 1995, a wax statue of Selena was unveiled at Madame Tussaud's Hollywood, and she was inducted into the Texas Women's Hall of Fame at Texas Women's University.

Speaker 3 Netflix, of course, released Selena, the series, and in 2023, Rolling Stone ranked Selena at number 89 on its list of 200 greatest singers of all time, which is incredible.

Speaker 3 Also, MAC released a limited edition Selena makeup line,

Speaker 3 and it's been 30 years since Selena was murdered, which is crazy that it's been so long. And that means that Yolanda Saldivar is eligible for parole this year.

Speaker 3 Her file will be reviewed, including letters of support and protest, and a case summary will be prepared for the board voting panel. Her parole review date is March 30th of this year, 2025.

Speaker 3 So that's something to keep an eye on.

Speaker 3 It's such a high-profile case. You know, I can't imagine she's going to be paroled.
Not that that's what it's about, but.

Speaker 1 No, but I mean, that was such a that story of like a person so inside turning on her is such a nightmare story. It's like

Speaker 1 it's not this woman was not a serial killer. She was not like this

Speaker 1 a hardened criminal in this way. It was something horrible happened.

Speaker 1 And it doesn't feel the same as the story of the usual stories that we tell of, you know, a man being out there trying to kill every woman that he sees. Right.

Speaker 3 But she took advantage of this vulnerable person in a way that was so ugly and then, and then killed her when that person found out about it it's just so cold-blooded to me that and just

Speaker 3 horrible yeah let's keep an eye on that and so this is another kind of epic story that you've done that gets brought up a lot and uh so let's hear Karen's story about the Zanku chicken murders

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Speaker 3 Goodbye.

Speaker 3 Did I talk about your murder yet?

Speaker 1 What's interesting is

Speaker 1 you've lived near it. I'm sure you've heard about it.
Okay.

Speaker 1 Because

Speaker 1 it's the Zanku chicken murders.

Speaker 1 And there's one

Speaker 1 on my way from work driving here. There's one here.

Speaker 3 I drove by one. Let's tell everyone, let's give everyone directions from Zanku chicken to my apartment.

Speaker 1 That's why it got real vague. Yeah.

Speaker 1 But

Speaker 1 this,

Speaker 1 so my mouth is watering.

Speaker 3 Zanku chicken is so good.

Speaker 1 Zanku chicken is legendary in Los Angeles.

Speaker 1 If you've ever visited here, if you have friends that live here and you're not wealthy, you've probably eaten here because Zanku chicken is the best food that you can get for a decent price.

Speaker 1 And everybody knows it and everybody talks about it. It's up there with Roscoe's chicken and waffles

Speaker 1 in that way of like, if you're here, you have to go try this.

Speaker 3 Definitely. And Pinks hot dogs, that kind of thing.
Pinks is shit. It's so shit.

Speaker 1 But it's fun to stand in line drunk.

Speaker 3 So go there. Not going to lie.
I have fucking shopped some chili dogs my day.

Speaker 1 But for 20 years, I've driven by Pinks and watched people standing in line at three in the morning to get those hot dogs. So the first time I went there, I was like, this is going to be crazy.

Speaker 1 And it was just hot dogs.

Speaker 3 It's just hot dogs, but yeah, they're gross in a good way.

Speaker 1 Yeah, it's like greasy,

Speaker 3 drunken food. Total, totally.

Speaker 1 Okay, so

Speaker 1 there, I got most of my information from this awesome article from Los Angeles magazine that was written by a guy named Mark Arax. And it's from April 1st, 2008.

Speaker 1 There's way more information than I could even entertain. So if this interests you at all, look at that.
You can Google it and it'll come up right away.

Speaker 1 And I remember reading this probably five years ago because The when this murder happened everybody knew about it all of a sudden and everybody was crazy freaked out about it It'd be like your local mom-and-pop cafe like some terrible thing happening there But the story behind it is kind of fascinating because it's like so in Los Angeles There's a there's a city that's right behind the hill that says Hollywood on it right behind that city is both Burbank and Glendale.

Speaker 1 I mean right behind that mountain is Burbank and Glendale and Glendale has the single largest population of Armenian

Speaker 1 people that isn't Armenia in the world. Wow.

Speaker 1 It's huge. And Armenians came there after

Speaker 1 they were, there was the Turkish genocide, which there we see parades about and

Speaker 1 flags about. And it's like, it's weird because I never heard of anybody being Armenian until I moved to LA.

Speaker 1 And now I feel like I know a ton of stuff about the Armenian culture simply because, like, I live in Burbank, I live close to Glendale. Yeah.
So anyway, this is this

Speaker 1 restaurant, Zanku Chicken, was started originally in Beirut, Lebanon, by a man named Vart.

Speaker 1 And the pronunciation on this is going to, if you're Armenian or if you're just not

Speaker 1 a valley girl, it's going to offend you. Vardkis Iskandarian and his family started the first Zanku chicken in Beirut in 1962.
Oh, Oh, wow. And

Speaker 1 then they brought it over here in 1983.

Speaker 1 And it was the chain actually was opened by Mardeiros, who is the son.

Speaker 1 And his parents were not interested in having a restaurant in America. They wanted to do dry cleaning, maybe go into the suit business.

Speaker 1 They looked into all these other businesses that were more kind of reliable than a restaurant. But

Speaker 1 Mardeiros believed that this, he looked around and he saw how few Middle Eastern restaurants there were

Speaker 1 with such huge populations of people that would appreciate the food. There was almost no food to feed them that was like from their home.
Totally.

Speaker 1 So they opened their first restaurant at the corner of Sunset and Normandy

Speaker 1 in

Speaker 1 East LA.

Speaker 3 Holla. Hey.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 the LA Times said it's the best roast chicken in town at any price, which is kind of really saying something for the little shishi restaurants they have here.

Speaker 1 The Zagat Guide would say that Zanku was one of America's best meal deals. Oh, my goodness.
America, not just LA, which is cool.

Speaker 1 Jonathan Gold, who's a very famous food writer, he adores Zanku chicken. reviewed it and said the chicken was superb and nothing in heaven or on earth compares with the garlic paste.

Speaker 3 Oh my God, that garlic paste.

Speaker 1 The garlic paste is what everybody talks about and it was invented by Marduros' grandmother.

Speaker 3 Shut up.

Speaker 1 And his mother makes it, made it all by hand.

Speaker 1 So it was a secret recipe.

Speaker 1 People still don't know what's in it. It's this white paste that you get with your chicken and your rice and your hummus and your pita.
It's a little tub.

Speaker 3 It's like a side on the side.

Speaker 1 And it is tangy and pungent and garlicky, but there's something else going on. It's kind of like butter.

Speaker 1 Like you can't figure out, all you want to do is eat it and put everything that you eat into it.

Speaker 3 Then for the next day, you're belching garlic. Yes.

Speaker 1 It's filled with garlic.

Speaker 3 You reek of,

Speaker 1 it's quite an experience. Yes.

Speaker 1 So that was kind of their secret weapon.

Speaker 1 Aside from the fact that they figured out that other rotisserie chicken places, they realized you have to move the chicken itself and you have to play with the temperatures.

Speaker 1 You can't just keep it on one temperature all the time.

Speaker 1 So they basically kind of went in there and tried to figure out how to give people who wanted to eat authentic Middle Eastern food the best version of that food and not just go like, here,

Speaker 1 here's whatever,

Speaker 1 which is amazing. Apparently, one time on Curb Your Enthusiasm, Larry David referred to it as chicken so good it could end the rift in the Middle East.

Speaker 1 So like everybody in LA knows about that.

Speaker 3 It was also in a Beck song. That's right.
That's right.

Speaker 1 There's a list on Wikipedia of all the popular culture things. There was somebody on Buffy the Vampire Slayer also liked to eat there.

Speaker 1 So

Speaker 1 they started as this hole-in-the-wall chicken place. And after, I would think like over two years, they were making $2 million a year.

Speaker 3 Holy shit.

Speaker 1 And half of that was pure profit. Oh, my God.
So

Speaker 1 they were doing, obviously, great.

Speaker 1 There were rumors. Oh, so in this article, this is one of my favorite things.
In this article,

Speaker 1 this guy, Mark, the writer, talks, starts out by talking about the Armenian culture and everything.

Speaker 1 And he says, there's a saying that little old Armenian ladies say in Armenian, which is, let's sit crooked and talk straight, which totally made me think of us.

Speaker 3 Oh, my God.

Speaker 1 Isn't that the best? Let's sit crooked and talk straight. That's basically let's gossip.

Speaker 3 That is us to achieve. I know.
I'm fucking in love with it.

Speaker 1 It's the best. So, of course, in the Armenian,

Speaker 1 I keep saying culture, but what I mean is community.

Speaker 1 This family rose to prominence, obviously, because they're all of a sudden started making this tons of money and their food was crazy popular.

Speaker 1 But they also were huge philanthropists and gave so much back. So, they were kind of famous within that community because they were a huge part of it.

Speaker 1 So, there was gossip. It was never confirmed that Pepsi was offering the company $30 million for the chain and the trademark.
Holy shit.

Speaker 1 And this was when it was kind of like peaking in its popularity.

Speaker 1 And at that same time, even though Medeiros's parents did not want to expand, they just wanted to keep that one, the first shop.

Speaker 1 He was like, he kept fighting to expand. He's like, we have to do it.
We have to do it. So finally, they agreed to split.
And what they agreed to do was,

Speaker 1 I think it's Mardeiros.

Speaker 1 Sorry if I know I'm pronouncing his name wrong, but they agreed that he would take the concept and he would build the chain.

Speaker 1 And any stores that he opened doing that, whether they failed or succeeded, would be on him.

Speaker 1 Because that's basically what the family was afraid.

Speaker 1 Let's not lose all our money. We got a good thing.
Let's just keep this good thing going. And in return, he would sign over his stake of the original in Hollywood to his parents and his two sisters.

Speaker 1 But they weren't splitting. It wasn't, they weren't, they weren't, you know, it was, they were still completely together as a family.

Speaker 1 The garlic paste was still made by his mother at all the Zancus, which I just can't get over is this woman who was probably at the time in her,

Speaker 1 I would say probably late 60s, early 70s.

Speaker 1 And they say in this article, they talk about how this mother,

Speaker 1 I think her name is Margaret,

Speaker 1 spelled with R-I-T.

Speaker 1 She worked, she got up at 7.30 every morning and went into work and worked till 7 o'clock at night.

Speaker 1 And when she was done cooking for the restaurant, she would start to cook for the people that worked at the restaurant.

Speaker 3 Oh, my goodness.

Speaker 1 Like, cook people their homemade, you know, food from home that they liked.

Speaker 3 Take a break, honey. No, she couldn't do it.

Speaker 1 She was like obsessive, which I love. Oops, sorry.

Speaker 1 That reminds me of my grandma. Like, my grandmother's index fingers were both bent at almost.
like right angles because of how much she cleaned. Oh, my God.

Speaker 1 Because she was, she came over here from Ireland when she was 17 and she was a maid maid for most of her life until she met my grandfather so it's like those old country people are just like we're here to earn it we're here to fucking get it you're able to you're able to it yeah that's right and also if you start a business you got to put give it your all so you make it into something and they really did they were this amazing family success story um and mardeiros well he would constantly say to the whole family success means nothing if we don't stay as one greed must never rear its head There's plenty for all of us.

Speaker 1 And so he had a sister and she had two sons and they loved all of each other.

Speaker 1 They were cousins, but they were, they felt more like they were each other's, you know, he had four boys, she had two sons, they were all, you know, very, very close.

Speaker 1 In fact, his wife was quoted as saying, before we married, he told me, I'm going to live with my parents my whole life. I will never leave my mother.

Speaker 1 She was queen of the house, not me. Next to God, it was his mother.
Holy shit. So just to give you a sense of that.

Speaker 1 So

Speaker 1 Medeiros is diagnosed.

Speaker 1 Sorry, I don't have the date on this, but I believe it was in like 2001, I think,

Speaker 1 or so.

Speaker 1 He gets diagnosed with

Speaker 1 inoperable bladder and brain cancer.

Speaker 3 Holy shit.

Speaker 1 So he basically felt like he knew something was wrong. He had pains in places, but he didn't go to the doctor.
He avoided it. And so by the time he went in, it had spread.

Speaker 1 So he holds a family meeting and he tells his mother and his sister and his wife that he's dying and that when he dies, he wants the Zanku business to go to his four sons.

Speaker 3 Oh my goodness.

Speaker 1 Now, the problem there is that his four sons were at the time and had been for a couple of years fuck-ups and in ways where the oldest son had been caught trying to cheat on a law school entrance exam and so was bait had been a top student at I think it was at Woodbridge University and so he basically got kicked out and was like barred from ever taking the test because he was going to cheat wow so after that he became an evangelical Christian he was like one of those guys that stands on the street like with a bullhorn yeah um

Speaker 1 The second oldest son was tried for attempted murder when the pimp of the sex worker that he had just

Speaker 1 visited

Speaker 1 stole money from him. And he ended up chasing him up the freeway and shooting at his car.
And he ended up getting

Speaker 1 tried for attempted murder. Wow.
And it turned out to be a mistrial.

Speaker 1 So he never had to go to jail. But of course, that mark.
And of course, you know, if this is the richest family in the community and shit like this starts popping off,

Speaker 1 everyone's talking about it.

Speaker 1 Then the two younger were basically just on drugs. But when I was reading this article, it sounded so harsh, but it's like, that's that thing of like,

Speaker 1 I feel like you can't get rich quick like that and have things just go great.

Speaker 3 Yeah.

Speaker 1 Because once you start getting all the money you want and you can buy all the things you want, then you start wanting the things you can't have.

Speaker 3 Yeah. And it gets a little nuts like that oh i got it um look at my riches i just please watch your behavior is what i'm saying

Speaker 1 um

Speaker 1 okay so when he makes this announcement the room goes silent because that's he's saying yeah they're the ones that should get it and his sister and his mother are both just staring at him and um

Speaker 1 Let's see, it says his mother sat stone-faced.

Speaker 1 She didn't ask what kind of cancer he had or what the prognosis that the doctors gave gave him instead she blurted out in armenian your sons the shadow they cast is not yours and then she got up and she walked up the stairs and shut the door holy

Speaker 1 now she lived with him as he had said him and his wife rita um

Speaker 1 she wouldn't speak to him so she would

Speaker 1 get up at 7 30 every morning go to work come home they'd be standing in the kitchen she'd get a glass of water and go upstairs and shut the door.

Speaker 3 Your son's dying. Yes.

Speaker 1 And as he was getting chemotherapy, as he was losing his hair, he ended up losing 60 pounds.

Speaker 3 Oh my God.

Speaker 1 He was, he was dying of cancer. Silent treatment.
That's so sad. It's really fucked up.
And it's,

Speaker 1 um, it's very old country. I mean, it's, it's, it's how some people are.
It's hard.

Speaker 1 Um, and obviously, I think knowing, at least based on what the wife says, the relationship that he had with his mother, this was breaking him. It was, it was terrible.
Sure.

Speaker 1 So after a year of the silent treatment,

Speaker 1 he went into his mother's room and he took down the, there was a picture of him as a child in Beirut with her when he was like four years old that she had kept up on her dresser. He took it down.

Speaker 1 He took out the picture. He ripped it in half.
He burned the half with her on it and he crumpled up the half with him on it and threw it away and then put the frame back up.

Speaker 3 And

Speaker 1 two days later,

Speaker 1 their house catches on fire.

Speaker 3 Wow. Yeah.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 1 And their house, him and his wife almost get caught in the house. They have to get rescued by firemen.
The house burns down. The mother takes, you know, her stuff or whatever.

Speaker 1 I don't know how much she had left and moves in with the sister. So she's gone.

Speaker 1 And that's the last.

Speaker 3 Did the house catch on fire? We don't know.

Speaker 1 No, but he, as he's going into his sickness and on, you know, I'm sure tons of painkillers and in a weird place, he's telling his son Steve that the fire is his mother's doing, that she knew based on what he did to the picture

Speaker 1 that that's, that was her.

Speaker 3 And oh my gosh.

Speaker 3 I can't stop doing that.

Speaker 1 Stephen, we need a new setup.

Speaker 1 Sorry.

Speaker 1 So, yeah, he's hallucinating basically and saying that

Speaker 1 that it was somehow her doing.

Speaker 1 He believed that his mother and her sisters and his sisters were plotting against him.

Speaker 3 They are to not give your fucking kids

Speaker 3 this goddamn business.

Speaker 1 Well, yeah, I mean I mean yeah.

Speaker 3 Yeah.

Speaker 1 They were it's it's everybody's worst nightmare. It's kind of like, oh, so this is actually what it comes down to really at the end.

Speaker 1 So Steve, having to hear this and of course loving his grandmother and being in the middle of it said, can't you ever forgive her? And

Speaker 1 Mardeiros was quoted as saying, God will forgive the devil before I can forgive my mother. Holy shit.

Speaker 1 And then he said, because this is a mother, not a devil, which is super sad. It's like, yeah, ultimately, your mother turned her back on you when you were in your worst place.

Speaker 1 And also, it's that thing of, I'm sure,

Speaker 1 After years and years of busting her ass to make this restaurant work, he was going to come in and be like, here's how it's going to happen. So it's like giving bad news and bad news.

Speaker 3 It could also be like, you know how some people get mad at someone who's sick because it's easier than the sadness you can feel? Yes.

Speaker 3 So she might have been mad at him that she had to watch her son die. Yes.

Speaker 1 And it's easier than it's a thousand percent easier.

Speaker 3 Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 1 That's it's a stage of grief.

Speaker 3 Totally.

Speaker 1 But she,

Speaker 1 yeah, it's it's hard. Yeah, because when someone else has a disease, then it's all about them and how hard it is for them.
You can't be mad at them. Like, I'm sure she had tons of guilt.

Speaker 1 It was just this impacted problem.

Speaker 3 Yeah.

Speaker 1 So anyway, on January 14th, 2003, Mardeiros, who had been bedridden and was dying, gets out of bed, puts on a white silk suit that he hadn't worn in 20 years,

Speaker 1 gets a 9mm handgun and a 38 caliber revolver whoa and walks down the stairs of his house his wife Rita couldn't believe what she was seeing dude and she she said in the way it's written in this article for a man so near death cancer everywhere he looked beautiful so he's having some weird last yeah later on in the article they went

Speaker 1 He does not have that outfit on.

Speaker 3 Okay.

Speaker 1 So they think that she's remembering it because it's this crazy moment, and she's remembering him basically as his beautiful young self that she fell in love with.

Speaker 3 I'm going to cry.

Speaker 1 Because it's a really beautiful story. But she, they lived across the street from each other in Beirut, and she, he was 19 and she was 12.
And he was like, no, no, no, no.

Speaker 1 That's not when it started. That's when she first noticed him because he was like

Speaker 3 the high roller. Yeah.
Don't be freaked out.

Speaker 1 It's actually very sweet. And then when she got older, like she was 18 and he was like 26.
Yeah.

Speaker 3 They started dating.

Speaker 1 Okay.

Speaker 1 So it's very sweet. Like she was in love with him all her life.

Speaker 3 Oh, I'm going to cry.

Speaker 1 So she said, you're too weak to go anywhere. Please get back in bed.
And he said, I feel better. Don't worry.
I'm just going to go down to Zanku and see my friends. So she, to see an old friend.

Speaker 1 And so she, you know,

Speaker 1 was like, all right, I'll see you soon. But he didn't go to Zanku.
God damn it. He didn't go to Zanku.
He went to his sister's house.

Speaker 1 The housekeeper lets him in.

Speaker 1 she sits at the table. The housekeeper gives him lemonade.
His sister comes downstairs. She was in the shower.

Speaker 1 They sit and have a pleasant conversation and share some lemonade.

Speaker 1 Then Margaret, the mother, comes home from work around 2 p.m.

Speaker 1 and

Speaker 3 she

Speaker 1 greets him.

Speaker 1 She says hello to the daughter first, then she says hello to him, puts her stuff down, sits at the table, and the housekeeper goes downstairs to her apartment because she knows that they need to talk to each other.

Speaker 1 So they talk for about five minutes and it's just normal chit-chat.

Speaker 1 And then he reaches into his waistband for his gun and he shoots his sister across the table.

Speaker 3 Shut up. Like point blank.

Speaker 1 And then his mother screams and runs for the door and he runs after her and he blocks the door, stands in front of her, about like 15 feet away from the door, it said.

Speaker 1 And he raises the gun in Armenia and she says, Don't shoot me, please. And he shoots her eight times.
He shoots her once, she goes down on the ground, and then he stands over her and shoots herself.

Speaker 3 Holy shit.

Speaker 1 He looks around the room and sees his 23-year-old nephew on the stairs, frozen.

Speaker 3 No, no.

Speaker 1 And he just turns around, goes over into the living room, sits on the couch, and shoots himself in the head.

Speaker 3 Holy fuck, are you serious?

Speaker 3 So,

Speaker 3 oh my God.

Speaker 1 Now, Rita, the wife, well, at least at the time of this article,

Speaker 1 had to be in charge of all the Zankas.

Speaker 1 And it was this whole, they were in court about

Speaker 1 the trademark and who owned the rights to, it was, it's this huge thing.

Speaker 1 And I didn't even get into it.

Speaker 1 There's so much more to this article.

Speaker 3 The poor woman, after

Speaker 3 maybe years or maybe however long, taking care of her sick husband. Yes.
That's fucking stressful as hell.

Speaker 1 And raising four boys.

Speaker 3 Who are not doing, who are fuck-ups.

Speaker 1 Who were rich kids, you know, who were like, who were rich kids. And she was a very traditional

Speaker 1 kind of old school wife where she didn't work. She didn't go to the store.
She stayed home and was a housewife and took care of that family. And suddenly just got thrown into this.

Speaker 3 I would never want to raise rich kids, you know? No.

Speaker 1 Well, but also because that's not anything you have experience with. So like they're having a whole life that you don't even know.

Speaker 3 They can do whatever they want. Yeah.
So then

Speaker 3 after taking care of her sick, dying husband, then this happens and she has to be in charge of so much shit she didn't expect to be in charge of. Yeah.
That poor woman. Yeah.

Speaker 1 So I don't know. That's

Speaker 1 that rough story behind the best restaurant in LA.

Speaker 3 Who owns it now? Is it still in the forest?

Speaker 1 I think they still do, but I'm not sure. I didn't get like once the murder part was over, that article goes on forever talking about all that part.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 So I figure if people are super interested in who owns the rights to the chickens, you can go for it.

Speaker 3 But I don't give a fuck.

Speaker 3 I want to, A, my stomach is growling. I know.
Are you hungry now?

Speaker 1 Oh, that's, I want to eat four chickens.

Speaker 3 I do too. I'm like already thinking about what I'm going to order tomorrow when I go there.

Speaker 3 Okay, we're back. Karen, do you have any updates? There are a couple.

Speaker 1 So, and I've actually thought about this a lot because the line that journalist Mark Arax used when he wrote this article for Los Angeles magazine about the Zanku chicken murders that sit crooked and talk straight, which is an Armenian saying,

Speaker 1 as I learned from Mark Arax in that article, has basically people love that line and they love it for this podcast. So it's been brought up in relation to this podcast.

Speaker 1 So I just want it to be very clear that we didn't make it up. Mark Arax actually didn't, but he did.

Speaker 1 He found it and he, you know, that's that like beautiful, long-form journalistic work that someone does where they're like building out this world, not just like, you know, the hard and fast true crime journalism, but like this beautiful story of fully fleshed out of what's this family is all about and where they come from.

Speaker 1 So,

Speaker 1 I thought about that a lot afterwards because it was just like, man, that one part of an article got so kind of popular.

Speaker 3 Stuck. It totally stuck.

Speaker 1 So, thank any older Armenian lady you see the next time you see them if you like that saying, because that's who

Speaker 3 probably her mother said at first.

Speaker 1 Anyway, in 2006, a court ruled that the trademark that they were basically all fighting over for Zanku chicken, something I eat literally twice a week, minimum.

Speaker 1 Just have to.

Speaker 1 The trademark for that belonged to both sides of the family.

Speaker 3 That's what the court ruled.

Speaker 1 So Rita Iskandarian and her four sons own the Zankus that Medeiros opened.

Speaker 1 The surviving nephews inherited their mother's share of the first Zanku, the one in Hollywood, and they still co-own it with their aunt, though they all still battle battle over the trademark.

Speaker 1 Both sides have continued to basically expand the franchise.

Speaker 3 Yeah.

Speaker 3 One thing I love about this podcast is I think a lot of people who listen ended up when they come to LA for a vacation go to Zanku now and Del Taco. And I'm fucking proud of that.

Speaker 1 Hell yes.

Speaker 3 You know, if we, if we've given anyone any like good tips, that's one of the best, I think. I mean,

Speaker 3 go to Zanku.

Speaker 1 Yes. And go to Zanku

Speaker 1 because

Speaker 1 the Armenian culture in Los Angeles is huge. Definitely.
It's the second largest, densest population of Armenians outside of this country of Armenia.

Speaker 3 Yeah. Actually, that photo that we took is taken.
My first apartment in Hollywood was in Little Armenia. In Little Armenia.
And it was such a pleasant neighborhood and the shops.

Speaker 3 And I just, I loved it. Yeah.

Speaker 1 And that's Little Armenia. And then Big Armenia is Glen Hill.

Speaker 3 It's called Glendale.

Speaker 1 It's over there with the Kardashians over at the Carousel restaurant.

Speaker 1 But I think it's kind of cool because it's like this story, this restaurant is such a huge part of the city and the background of the restaurant is just as much a part of Los Angeles as movies and anything else.

Speaker 1 It's like, if you're going to Zancou on your trip out here, you're doing yourself right and you're really getting a true taste of LA, I think.

Speaker 3 Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 1 All right. This episode was originally titled Just the 32 of Us.

Speaker 3 I mean, it's classic.

Speaker 3 But just to humor us, let's see what we would name it these days based on something we said in the episode. So

Speaker 3 I like this one. Consider me wrong again,

Speaker 3 which I said during Corrections Corner.

Speaker 3 You know, that could be tattooed on my fucking gravestone.

Speaker 1 It's a real exercise in humility. Yeah.
Corrections corner as a practice.

Speaker 3 I think we've, we've really.

Speaker 1 We've set ourselves up really nicely to just do that inner work every week. How do we fuck up? How do we fuck up?

Speaker 3 In public.

Speaker 1 Yeah, for sure. Also, there's Skipper's Come On Home, which is us joking that skippers should come back, listen to the episode after they finish the intro.

Speaker 3 Yeah, start now. Yeah.
Press play now. Skip.
Right. Well, thank you for not skipping.
We appreciate you guys sticking with it.

Speaker 3 Even if you did skip in the beginning and maybe don't skip now, like, cool. Thank you.

Speaker 1 I feel like people listening to Rewind are the opposite of skippers. They're just like, we want to hear every

Speaker 1 dirty, fucked up thing you've ever done. We're going to be here for all of it.

Speaker 3 Yeah.

Speaker 3 We're going to hear every story. We're going to hear every horrible thing.
Every anecdote, every corrections corner.

Speaker 1 Yeah. All right.
Thanks, you guys. Stay sexy.

Speaker 3 And don't get murdered.

Speaker 3 Goodbye.

Speaker 3 Elvis, do you want a cookie?

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