Ep 212: Garth Marenghi

November 01, 2023 1h 0m

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Dreamweaver, doomsage and Sunday Times best-selling horror writer Garth Marenghi joins us in the Nightmare Restaurant this week. Listen to this episode now, before it’s too late…

Garth Marenghi’s new book ‘Incarcerat’ is out now in hardback and audiobook, published by Coronet. Buy it here.

Garth’s previous book ‘Terrortome’ in now available in a limited pleather-bound edition. Buy it here.

Garth is also on tour. Buy tickets here.

Recorded and edited by Ben Williams for Plosive.

Artwork by Paul Gilbey (photography and design) and Amy Browne (illustrations).

Follow Off Menu on Twitter and Instagram: @offmenuofficial.

And go to our website www.offmenupodcast.co.uk for a list of restaurants recommended on the show.

Watch Ed and James's YouTube series 'Just Puddings'. Watch here.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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Welcome to the Off-Menu podcast, Taking the Pumpkin of Humor, carving in the face of friendship with the knife of the internet and putting in the candle of

interviews.

It's a scary special James.

That is Ed Gul.

Oh, that's good.

Oh.

Ed Gul.

Goolbull.

Ed Gulbul.

My name is James Screamcaster.

Dead Gamble.

That's normally what I would go.

Dead Gamble.

Thank you.

And James.

Mames Acaster.

Oh.

Welcome.

Together we own a haunted restaurant.

And we invite in a guest every single week.

And we ask them their favourite ever, start a maid course, dessert, side dish, and drink, not in that order.

And this week, our guest is

Garth Marenghi.

Garth Marengi,

a famed international horror writer, James.

Amazing writer.

Of course, also had the amazing TV series Garth Marengi's Dark Place.

Yes.

Unjustly cut short.

Yes.

But, you know, we got to, I think when we were teenagers, it was finally aired and we got to see it.

And it's always meant a lot to us Ed yeah you know I know it's a horror series but it's found a home in a lot of comedians hearts absolutely and as have Garth's most recent books

Terror Tome which came out last year absolutely fantastic

I listened to the audiobook of that I absolutely hoovered it up with my ears

and Garth has a new book coming out well it's actually out it's out as of yesterday if you're listening to this podcast on the day it is released because of course Garth's new book Incarcerat was released on halloween uh i cannot wait to get stuck into this james it's going to be scary scary stuff so be warned reader beware you're in for a scare i believe it follows on the story of uh the horror writer nick steen from terror tome oh which i'm very excited about i love the i love the character of nick steen and garth really can uh

weave some uh incredible passages and weave some dreams as he's a self-proclaimed dream weaver and this is the dream restaurant so it's quite exciting to have him in yes very very exciting i i wonder what he's going to pick james it would be awful to have to banish him from the dream restaurant like a demon that's the thing every single week of course we have a secret ingredient if the guest picks it we will have to banish them from the dream restaurant this week the secret ingredient is egg in

soup egg in soup egg in soup egg in soup uh was of course a dish that was featured on garth marengi's dark place it's like a fried egg yeah in a soup the egg is cooked in the soup the egg is cooked in the soup it's something i've done before you've done it i've done it before because of garth No, I think I just did it anyway, although who knows how that man has influenced my dreams and nightmares across the years.

So perhaps it was Garth's influence.

No, you just get the soup going on the pan and crack an egg into it and it cooks in there.

Wow, I mean, you know, it does sound quite nice.

You're not even going to.

What kind of soup did you do it with?

Just with a tomato-based one, normally.

Lovely.

You can do it with a cream of tomato.

It's very good.

I would say it also looks very nice on Garth Moringi's Dark Place.

It's one of the only pleasant-looking things on that show.

Yeah, yeah.

It's a gruesome affair, most of that show.

Yeah, well, look, this is a big deal for us.

Absolutely.

We're interviewing one of our heroes.

I can't wait to get stuck in.

Should we just open our doors?

Let's open the doors to the nightmare realm.

This is the off-menu menu of Garth Merengi.

Welcome, Garth, to the Dream Restaurant.

Right.

Yes.

Welcome, Garth Merengi, to the Dream restaurant.

I've been expecting you for some time.

Yeah, did you get the message?

I got

my PA to call ahead.

I haven't brought anything.

Because it's not Esponito?

It's not a real restaurant, is it?

No, it's not.

It's a restaurant of the mind.

It's a dream restaurant.

Yeah.

I mean, your mind has housed many a world.

Well, I mean, I thought...

I'll be honest with you, I thought this was a reboot of After Dark.

Do you know what that is?

No.

No, it was a late-night TV discussion,

post-meal discussion that various practitioners of the horror genre would meet around a table around table discussion of all all things pertaining to the dark arts that's what i thought this was a reboot so to be sat here in a fictional fictional yeah yeah imaginary not enough for a novel

just being honest yeah yeah no we've been told that before it's an okay it's an okay idea but it's not enough for a novel there's not enough meat for a novel were you turning this into a novel what do you think we need to add if we were to turn it into a novel we need a plot yeah and we don't even know where this is going no no we don't know i mean you can't sit down and write a novel without really having some idea of where you're going to end up oh do you so you always know where you're going you don't just stare at the blank page and wait for inspiration not always you've got a destination in mind i know what i'm doing yeah i guess we yeah we've never really considered turning this into a novel i don't think because we're wise yeah because we're here to sort of discuss what you're thinking with the dream restaurant this is all going to come from from your mind you're putting the pressure on me yeah we're drawing out of okay but i'm not giving you ideas Okay, we won't use any of them.

No, we won't use any of them.

For our own financial gain.

Yes.

Okay, well, if you're happy to sign to that effect,

then we'll proceed.

Has that happened to you before?

Have any other novelists taken your ideas?

All the time.

Yeah.

Naming no names?

They know who they are.

Well, your latest novel, Incarcerate.

Let me stop you there.

It's not technically a novel.

It is

a novel consisting of three mini-novels.

Okay.

Oh, wow.

Would that be short stories?

No.

A short story is is between i don't know 2 000 and 7 000 words a novella is anywhere between 14 000 words and 30 000 words these basically pan out at around 35 000 words so it's in that sweet spot between novella and short novel i'd say so it's three three short novels basically three short novels and do they do they intertwine of course yeah

I don't think anyone's ever done that before, have they?

Released three short novels at once?

No.

This is the first.

It says, bury your head in this book, and then dot dot dot permanently.

I hope so.

It's quite chilling.

It's important to have a warning on what I write.

You know, that's me giving the reader something back.

A friendly warning this could hurt.

You've been described as many things.

A fight and a man.

A frightenerman.

A fightnerman.

Dark scribe.

Doom Sage.

Yes.

Archduke or Darkdom.

You missed that one out.

Sorry.

Archduke of Darkdom.

Who described you as these things, Garth?

I did.

No, this is about a horror novelist, this book it is next

where did you get the inspiration for that hard to know really um

i guess most of my characters are horror writers of of one kind or another yeah so i'm sure i'm sure i lent upon my own innate knowledge of the uh of the profession and forged something quite profound about said profession.

But yes, I drew upon my experience in the in the horror industry.

I drew upon the problems I've had with various people associated with the industry over the years, particularly editors of one description or another,

and also my general readership that have changed over the years, thankfully.

Some of them were quite difficult in the early days.

Your readership.

My readership, yeah.

Do you want to expand on the difficulties you had with your readership?

Yeah, well, for example, I refused to sign books now.

Only in extreme circumstances because I had a very difficult period in the early stages of my career where, you know, people would be expecting me to sign, well, anything from perineum to

breastage.

You've got to draw the line, haven't you?

You have to draw the line somewhere.

I can't spend time signing your body.

I have to write.

Yeah, that's fair enough, I think.

Now, obviously, we're in the dream restaurant here.

This is, you know, from your dreams, but you're...

Yeah, I'll go with this.

I'm going with this, Golem.

But you normally deal in nightmares, is that fair to say?

Yeah.

So how do you feel about putting the nightmares to one side for today and going with dreams?

As I say, I thought this was a reboot of After Dark, so I'm not happy about it, but I will do it.

If you delved into your dreams now and looked at the restaurant, what do you see?

What is Government?

A mess.

Lots of blood, flesh, of one kind or another.

Yeah.

Beast or human, who knows?

And is that where you would like to eat if you were going to this dream restaurant?

If you stepped into a restaurant, is that what you'd like to see?

Not particularly.

You just asked the question.

But what would you like to see then if you were going into a restaurant?

A seat.

Comfortable seat.

A stacked bar and hopefully a kitchen out the back.

Yeah.

Okay, that's good.

Not a lot of people mention that there's a kitchen out the back, actually.

No, that is the point, actually.

Thank you, Guff.

Would you be, and I think I might know the answer to this, but would you be dining alone or with friends?

Ideally alone, but no more than three.

Otherwise, conversation tends to get dispersed among various guests and then I get, well, frankly, I get a bit offended or bored.

Who would the other two people be?

If they were two other people with you, who might they be?

My wife Pam,

who generally accompanies me most places.

She's not here today, but she's having some new leather fitted.

And our slaughterer.

I have a personal slaughterer who

runs a farm up near us.

And I would probably have him here because he knows how best to sort of dispense with the animal and present the best part of it for consuming.

So would that be happening at the dream meal live in front of you then?

I like to see, you know, I like to see what I'm eating, it's last moments, essentially.

So yes, I would, I would probably, the slaughterer would invite Pam and I aside, you know, maybe a room out the back, you know, side side to the kitchen, you know, health conscious, hygiene conscious.

There would be a slaughtering area quite close to the kitchen.

And we would go out there and we would select and we would watch it.

And then we'd come back, have a drink and

and await you know what it turns into.

That's lovely.

I think people,

a lot of time people say you know if you couldn't kill an animal yourself you shouldn't eat it i think if you can't meet it seconds before it dies and okay the story precisely yeah precisely it's respect at the end of the day toward toward the beast

well we always start with still or sparkling water neither

beer or wine yeah i don't want water i want beer or wine Is there a reason for that?

Have you never trusted water?

Well, have you read my book?

Can water die?

That was the tagline.

I can't remember the title.

Bottom line is, it can't.

Now, that's a frightening thought.

Yeah.

Because all water ends up coming back round again.

Yeah.

And it remembers what's been done to it.

Of course, yeah,

it would.

Do you think it's going to be happy coming back to you having passed through him?

No.

I guess it's like a filtration process.

But you think that's what they tell you.

Yeah.

But you're saying that when we urinate.

I'm not saying.

Yeah.

Read the book.

Okay.

Yeah.

But you can't remember the titling.

Yeah.

You remember the tag tagline, though?

That water.

He can Google the tagline.

Yes, he can.

Can water tagline?

Do so.

I will.

So yeah, you wouldn't want to ever consume anything that's disgruntled is what you're saying.

Pretty much.

That's why you want to witness its last moments a lot of the time.

If you could witness the water's last moments before drinking it, say if you're drinking.

Well, I do.

As I say, it doesn't die.

Yeah, yeah.

But you sort of see the last of it pass through you.

Yeah.

So you essentially wave goodbye, but you know it's coming back.

It might not come back to you, though, might come back to your nearest and dearest.

Yeah, that's that's a good point.

Yeah.

With beer, is there not quite a lot of water used in the production of beer?

No idea.

I think there is.

Does that not scare you?

Well, I'll do my research first.

Yeah, yeah.

So you'd like wine or beer?

Do you have a preference between wine or beer?

Not particularly.

Do you ever go to

one of each?

One of each.

That's perfect.

That's still unsparkling, really, isn't it?

In a way.

Yeah.

Depends what kind of wine you want, I guess.

Yeah.

It depends if you're having a spritzer, really.

Yeah.

What sort of wine?

No, you're not.

What sort of wine would you like for the wine bit?

A soft wine.

Yeah.

Or a soft.

Yeah.

Gentle.

A gentle wine and a very heavy beer.

A hard beer.

Soft wine, hard beer.

What sort of percentage beer are we talking in terms of alcohol?

Enough.

Okay.

Enough to kind of screase the wheels early doors.

Yeah, when you never know what's going to happen at the meal.

Yeah, that's that's the point.

I mean, do you know what Pam would have at this point?

If you're having a good time.

Oh, she'd match me glass for glass.

Or I should say goblet to goblet.

goblet for goblet you would like you would she will match me i only drink in goblets i don't drink in uh glasses i didn't know that about you that's great i can see because you've only got glasses on the table yeah we if we had known that's that's benito's fault yeah benito's the producer of the podcast he's called the great bonito because he used to be a magician guth all right you're a mesmerist

okay well

when you are we'll talk

I've sensed him some distrust towards Benito is it because

well you don't trust anyone who practices magic or the arcane arts yeah you know often often they're nice often they're quite friendly very friendly people at times too friendly in the right circum in the in the wrong circumstances they're too friendly but you know just be wary be wary we're always very wary of him good yeah yeah are you familiar with the work of derin brown and uh

yeah yeah do you have opinions on those kind of like he's not exactly john d

No no

who's John Do John Dee?

A dark magician from the, well, probably the 14th, 15th, 16th century.

I say all three because I don't believe he died.

And I think he was alive before he was around.

So it could be three different centuries that he was practicing in.

Wow.

Like water.

Poplums or bread.

Poplars or bread, Garf Merengi.

Poplobs or bread.

Poppadoms or bread.

Well, Poppadoms.

And quite a few, please.

How many are we talking?

What's the dream of that?

Five for me, five for Pam.

So is she matching you Poppadom for Popadom as well?

Yeah.

We often race.

Yeah, yeah.

So it's she usually she usually comes in quite a close second.

A close second, yeah.

And the dips, too, please.

Yeah.

Are we talking all the dips?

Like what ones do you want?

All the dips.

I didn't touch the salad dip for a very long time.

15 years, I think, of curry eating before I actually decided to give it a go.

And actually, it's a good compliment to the other spices.

Yeah, when mixed with the other ones, it's very effective.

Not on its own.

On its own, you know, well, you know, it's nothing on its own.

It's just a salad.

Yeah.

But combine it with the other elements and and you have you have magic don't you yeah yeah look at the bonito there yeah that's i've estimated mesmer just trying to engage him in some kind of conversation because i don't know what he's thinking yeah and that is a concern yeah yeah

it is you say 15 years of curry eating

did that when did that start when did you have your first curry oh childhood I think.

I mean,

it's the food of choice for the horror writing community.

Is it?

Yeah.

Most conventions will revolve around curry-based conversation, essentially, and discussion.

The best conventions are where you can get a curry-based theme for breakfast, lunch, and dinner.

And only select hotels will do that.

The only problem is the hotels that do do that often have a bed bug problem.

When you're at these conventions, who are you hanging out with and chatting?

Well, I don't really hang out with anyone, people will try and hang out with me.

Yeah.

Essentially, I'll tolerate a little bit of that.

But at the moment they start handing me their own novels in progress, that's when I'll cut the conversation short and move on.

You'd strike me as somebody who wouldn't let them down gently if they tried that sort of stuff.

You'd be a fool to, because they'll persist, believe me.

They'll hang on.

What do they want from you then?

They want my mind.

They want my mind and they want my success.

Guess what?

They're not me.

They're not going to get it.

It's very hard to break that to someone.

You have to do it hard.

Yeah.

Because they do think that if they linger long enough and if they hang on to you for long enough, they'll somehow suck up some of your innate essence yeah it's not true won't work so if i came over to you with and i brought i brought my you know new novel that i'd written and said garth could you give me some advice on this what would you what would you say to me no okay and that just said take it away yeah take it away because if i get so much as a glance of that a glimpse of it you could sue me for potentially stealing your copyright or whatever.

You could say, ah, you glimpsed my paragraph here and you've come up with a very similar paragraph in your new novel, Mr.

Morangi.

I want some of your millions.

It's not really millions, it depends.

Hopefully, it will be.

But do you see what I mean?

It's very dangerous.

So I have to keep that away from my vicinity because they're trying to trap you.

That's right.

Yeah, this sounds like the voice of experience.

Maybe someone's accused you of glimpsing their paragraph.

It's not pretty, it's you know, but it's a fact of the industry.

Yeah, and you guys probably have it to a certain well

to a certain extent.

But we could never write a novel, so clearly, yeah, yeah, hence the the podcast the format yeah which isn't an art form by the way podcasting podcasting there's a lot of talk about it it's not an art form it's what it is it's three plus this guy

sitting in a room just talking yeah you've never thought about doing a podcast yourself i'm too busy writing yeah how long in the day do you write what's your schedule like when you're writing a book like incarcerate well i dream I mean, I don't sleep, I dream.

I dream, I wake, then it is a waking dream for a while, which hopefully will turn into a waking nightmare.

Then I'll start writing.

Then I'll stop for,

what's that

channel for lunch discussion program?

Loose Wimming.

No, that's the other one.

Anyway, I turn all those off if Pam's had them on.

Yeah.

And I'll sit in the lounge and just eat.

Then I'm back to writing.

And then I'll, you know, finish around about six o'clock, call the slaughterer.

Yeah.

And

dine and then back to dreaming.

So you say you have lunch.

If you're, you don't, this doesn't need to be part of your dream menu, but what's the best sort of brain fuel for you when you're writing?

Brains, funnily enough.

It doesn't particularly matter what the animal is, but brain is a good thing to absorb, I think.

Yeah.

Do you feel like you get anything, any of the sort of thoughts that were in the brain of the animal initially?

I suppose it depends.

I mean, I don't particularly want a cow's thoughts, you know?

Yeah.

But it tastes nice.

Yeah.

Start with your dream starter, as any good meal would.

What did I put down here?

Yes, a very large prawn cocktail.

I love prawn cocktail, and I can't stand it when it's small.

Yeah.

But this is the stipulation.

Like we spoke about earlier, I want to see the prawns and pick them.

Right.

Yeah, we can do that for you.

It's the dream restaurant.

So of course we can do that.

So I don't know how you get them in, but whether there's a tank I can look at or a trawler nearby that I can go and pick them from a...

you know, plastic crate or something, a net, but I'd like to see them.

And this is all part of respect for the animal in question.

you know it's it you get one small moment to commune with them before they get boiled so a prawn cocktail with prawns that i've selected maybe some flecks of lobster again i'd like to see the lobster of course like to see crab if there's some crab a bit of a i know technically prawn cocktail is prawn but you know throw some other things

it's going to be a big prawn cocktail a large one seafood yeah yes when you see the prawns when they're alive what are you looking for in the prawns that makes you want to pick them a certain look yeah a certain look in its eye eye yeah or cluster of eyes you know it's very hard to tell with a prawn is yeah they've got all those things in the way i suppose a knowing look a kind of a a sense of i know what you want from me yeah i'm happy i'm happy to put down my my prawn life and feed you because ultimately what you are doing is benefiting your species you know in order to evolve your species i know that my species must pass and i'm happy to do that and you can sense all that in a look i'm a writer will the slaughter be slaughtering the prawns?

And if so, ideally.

How do you slaughter a prawn?

Good question.

I mean, he has a number of ways and devices to go to town on them.

See, I could elaborate, but

you'll probably edit it out.

I would have thought.

Yeah, it would get cut.

Yeah.

It's too much.

It's too gross.

And obviously, you will have some lettuce in the prawn cocktail.

Yeah, not much.

Don't like the lettuce part.

Lots of the sauce, though.

The sauce is good.

The Mary Rose.

Yeah, what is it?

Get it?

Just in a jar.

jar it's fine jar's fine you trust the jar it's best way you don't know who's prepared it otherwise did you again back to water so that must be an issue in restaurants if you'd like to know who's prepared it yeah you're quite well i will always call up in advance yeah and get their cv sent through yeah and um if i think they're up to the scratch you know my slaughterer will approve if we're out and about if we're back at home then the slaughterer will kind of do it all but if we are away then i will i will get the cv and i'll run it past him that's good does the slaughterer live in your house or do they sometimes

Sometimes, if we're having a heavy weekend, he'll come over

and we'll put him up.

But no, he's always around.

He's only a phone call away, pretty nearby.

Yeah, I mean, he's a phone call from us.

You can usually hear him shouting quite close by.

Okay.

So you kind of know that he's.

Yeah, you'll hear it.

You know, you can hear his handiwork from a mile off.

Of course.

Yeah, yeah.

Do you know if anyone else uses him as a slaughterer, or is it just you?

I don't know that.

I doubt it.

I doubt anyone would.

why why do you doubt anyone would use it isn't pleasant no for most people but i'm a writer of horror so yeah you know it doesn't phase me it inspires you if anything so it inspires me i i it it nourishes me as a writer of horror what do you think of the genre the state of the genre at the minute terrible stone yeah terrible stone tv horror you you yourself were treated quite unfairly in that genre and now when you see modern tv horror there's probably more horror series now than ever before yeah How do you feel when you see him?

Go watch Dark Place.

Yeah, go watch Dark Place.

Has the new one just come out?

House of Usher?

Fall of the House of Usher.

Do you know him?

I do know Mike.

Yeah, I do know Mike.

I think he has a tendency to sit around the campfire too much and spin yarns.

You know, it's fine.

Yeah.

But, you know, I'm waiting for him to get back to me.

Is he perhaps going to adapt?

some of your work maybe he wants to uh he says says he wants to but uh

we haven't taught contracts yet is that is that exclusive you telling us that because that's quite exciting for everyone to see that crossover no it's not exclusive sorry it's it it it's it's not actually true

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Your dream main course, Garth?

Mm-hmm.

Beef.

A piece from every part of the carcass, please.

Heart, guts, not the balls, though.

I know a lot of people like the balls, I don't.

So please skip on the balls.

And also, I want to commune with the animal first.

I'd like to see it.

Yes.

I'd like to see it go.

Of course.

So is it also a sign of respect to not have the balls as well?

Is that part of the respect thing?

Do you really want to cover this?

Yeah, absolutely.

We'd love to

hear about the whole dish, really.

Okay, well,

I have tried the balls, but they're just obviously too chewy.

And and they repeat and the animal was dead when you tried that luckily for it yes yes so we've got so there's a lot of obviously a lot of different cuts available on a cow you know all the different normal cuts of steak but then like you say the heart the tongue all of that stuff yeah stuff on the head yeah you can eat as well what's your favorite if you if you could only have one bit from the whole cow and you you can have all of it for the dream meal but if you had to pick a favorite what would it be i would like its

left rear leg left rear leg the the haunch area yeah the um whatever That is on a cattle.

Not sure what that would be called, but like, yeah, I know the

area.

You know the area.

Yeah, the left haunch.

Rump, maybe?

Rump?

Yeah, I think that's probably what it is.

Why the left one in particular?

Well,

it's a little bit like when you're steering.

When you go and take your car into the thing and there's more weight on the right-hand side?

Yeah.

Cattles are similar.

They lean...

a little bit to the left, I think, which basically means they're exercising that muscle a bit more.

Yeah.

Sorry, to the right.

That's right.

So they exercise the muscle more on on the right, which means that is chewier and less tender.

Yes.

So you go for the left because that's the one that's had least, you know,

it's the less tough side.

It's tender and soft, like the wine.

Will you be looking in the cow's eyes as well before?

Yeah, they don't really tell you much, though.

There's not much happening there.

But you can watch.

You can look at them.

There's more of a prawn, more going on.

What's quite good, if you want a very good effect, if like me, you are prone to, you know, on Halloween, I will often decorate the house and I'll I'll often take an eye from one of these creatures and I will conceal it in mud in the garden on the front lawn so that anyone comes up, they might just see a glint of something, they'll look a bit closer and there's a real jelly-like eye looking up from the ground.

Cow's best for that.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

It's a good.

That's a good way to scare the kids on Halloween when they...

Scare anyone.

Yeah.

I don't really like, you know,

the key is to try and keep people away from your front door at Halloween.

Right.

So you don't like trick-or-treaters?

Oh, no.

They don't like me, more importantly.

But surely you're the house to go to.

That's the one everyone's excited for.

Exactly.

But I'm writing.

Yeah.

And I can't be putting up with, you know,

can you what?

Can you what?

What do you want?

Take a handful of those and go.

And what are you, what are you giving them?

What are you giving them a handful of?

Well, just sweets.

Just sweets.

Yeah.

Any particular sweet that's a favourite in the Merengi household?

Whatever is in the bargain bucket at Aldi

or other supermarkets of your choice.

We don't have to do balance here.

Oh, fine, Aldi though.

Yeah, if you're an Aldi guy, absolutely fine.

As a child, though, you must have enjoyed Halloween and trick-or-treating.

Yes, I did.

But again, I was always writing.

Halloween wasn't as big a thing when I was younger.

It was an American thing.

It was more Guy Fawks was the, you know, Bonfire Night

was the thing.

So there was a lot of setting things alight that I enjoyed.

Did you ever set anything alight that really sticks in your head as like the best thing that...

Well, we set a light at a local tramp once but we were caught now this feeds into my book in incarcerator okay yeah yeah okay i'm not just being frivolous yes yeah yeah yeah right it there's there's the third story in this yeah the randy man

that's about a tramp where he wasn't actually set alight In the story.

He's not set alight in the story.

He's actually drowned.

He works in a toilet.

He's a toilet attendant and he works in a toilet block.

And local kids pump the outlet pipes back into the toilet block and drown him in sewage.

That was a variation on an experience I had as a child where my friends, my mates and I decided to set fire to a local hobo because they do like fire.

This is the thing.

They're always around

fire.

And you know, when you see them in films, they're always standing around a fire.

Yeah.

Because they like fire.

Yeah.

Now, I'm not saying what I did was right.

It was wrong.

No, no, no.

It was wrong.

We didn't know then that they need the fire to keep warm.

We didn't understand that then.

We just thought

they like this stuff.

So do we.

What can we do?

Yeah, no, I understand that.

How do you want this beef cooked?

What sort of level is it?

Medium rare.

Medium rare, yeah.

All of it.

If you're going to do the heart, rare.

Yeah.

I like absorbing that pure.

But most other stuff.

Again, you've got to be a little bit careful where it's come from.

You don't know what can exist in uncooked meat.

So you've got to be got to be careful.

I can see through the glass your publicist is going haywire.

I think it's because of the story you told a second ago about the

homeless person.

Yeah.

Well, you'll cut that out, I presume.

Well, it's up to you.

I mean, you said it's in that inspiration.

You asked me.

Let's get it out the way now.

There is nothing I am saying.

When I say that I was wrong,

I'm right.

I was wrong.

Yeah.

What was the question when we talked about that anyway?

We asked, what's your favourite thing?

You sure you said favourite?

I think so.

Or did you say

the thing that you most regret?

Well, I have to listen back to it.

I'm pretty sure I didn't say the thing you most regret.

I think it was in the sort of area of favourite.

Yeah.

Yeah, it was definitely one of the

most vivid thing I remember setting it on fire.

Yeah, it was vivid.

But you've said that you acknowledge it was wrong.

Yeah.

It was completely wrong.

And, you know, I got stiffly told off.

Who told you off?

I think his mother.

So your dream side dish, Garth?

Turducken.

Which is a beast consisting of three other beasts.

Yeah.

You have a turkey, you have a chicken, and you have a duck.

Yes.

These were actually bred for real in a laboratory in the late 1980s.

They fused these three different types.

Oh, wow.

And over time, we've managed to create

the actual beast, the actual turduck.

And it is a thing that does exist.

My slaughterer breeds them on a farm up where we live.

So it's actually a thing that it takes a while to dispatch it.

It does take a while to get rid of it because

it's quite hard.

You have to kill it three times, essentially.

Okay, so this is amazing.

This is my...

So I didn't know that.

I thought it was a bird within a bird within a bird or something, but you're saying...

I mean, that's how it's traditionally

cooked.

I'm saying we breed them.

Yeah.

Breed the actual animal.

I wasn't aware that anyone had managed this.

Your slaughterer managed it.

Yep.

How does it look?

What sort of elements of each of them?

It doesn't look appetizing, I'll be honest.

One of the heads is sort of appears through another one of the heads, you know?

And there are too many wings.

And so it doesn't look, which is why it's important to kind of deal with it as quickly as possible.

And it does take a while.

Which is why I have a slaughterer.

no he he's happy he's happy to do it yeah oh so it's not bred into one animal it's essentially three there's three heads are there six wings as well yeah there's a whole mixture yeah and lots of legs as well so it sounds like all three just kind of stuck together and that's essentially that's how it turns out yeah wow but on the plate it is beautiful

sounds terrifying yeah I mean I'm sure you can handle it but for mere mortals that's a lot to take yeah I wouldn't advise her do you watch the Taduccan being dispatched?

Is that part of the respect?

That's the only one I won't watch.

Yeah.

Because it just takes a long.

Yeah.

I'd happily watch it.

Do you know what's involved?

I know what tools are involved from time to time.

Go for it.

G-Clamps, workbench, sometimes.

What's that sort of square thing?

The handle and a...

Is it a set square?

No, that's maths, isn't it?

It's a handle like a square, like a blade, isn't it?

Yeah, it has got a blade on it, yeah.

This is really about keeping it still.

Yeah.

So you need advice and all of that sort of stuff.

And yeah.

And is there a way that you like your taduccan cooked and presented for you?

I mean I like that cooked very well.

Yeah.

You know,

it's three different birds, you know?

So, and bird is, you've got to cook bird well.

So you've got to cook bird well.

Yeah.

Cook it three times as long if you need to.

And are there any seasonings on it or any spices on it or anything like that?

Just salt and pepper.

Salt and pepper.

Keep it simple.

Yeah.

But there's enough flavor going on.

Yes.

Do you know what I mean?

Yes.

They compete and they contrast and they complement.

Yeah.

So just salt and pepper.

and would that go well with the uh with the beef do you think I don't care it for me it will I mean I wouldn't serve it to anyone else but I like to have you know I like I always get that thing when I'm eating you know you have the meal and you get instant regret I wish I'd ordered that one instead yeah or I don't know what you know and I the answer to that is order two order one as a side dish I don't you strike me as a man with regrets who dwells on the past or any regrets no no you move forward

grudges I'm slightly regretting the discussion we had earlier.

Yeah, we're aware of that.

And we know that you'll probably try and get us to take it out, but like...

It's too late.

We've got you on mic saying it's fine for us to include it.

And also, I think it's interesting to hear the background to

the Randy Man story.

It is.

Let me just give you a little bit of clarification for that before you jump.

Right.

So let me find the offending passage.

You find in the Randy Man.

The Randy Man.

Have you read it?

Have you read this, guys?

We only just got given it today.

Well, we definitely will read it.

we're big fans only just been given it

off the genre

here we go so here we go okay look and this you have to remember this is actually quite painful for me to read this because i drew on my guilt real life experiences yeah yep Ross suddenly realized as she turned her head away from the demon's terrifying weapon toward that squat building on the far side of the green that the rancid reek factory was none other than Randy's home.

A disgusting public convenience.

The local gents in Dankton Park was where Randy had been drowned by a local gang of youths.

He'd later emerged as a hideous dream demon hell-bent on supernatural revenge.

And, she thought desperately as she sought to evade the pursuing demon, there would have been no Randy Man novels at all if Roz hadn't advised Nick to add one crucial element.

No run of ever popular sequels, no Randyman 2 Nightmare in Danktown, no Randyman 3 Mirror Streaker, no Randy Man 4 Night Stench, no Randyman 5 U-benders, aka U-bend or You Break, no all those other terrifying toilet attendant based horror novels leading up to the final installment, Randy Man 17, Death Plunge, Sally.

None of these would have existed if Roz hadn't advised Nick to make one small change.

See, the whole point of this is that Nick wrote a book where you didn't feel for the Randy Man, Randy Streak.

Roz, as his editor, advised him, you have to have sympathy here.

The Randy Man was a victim, okay?

Randy Streak is a victim.

That is the lesson I had to learn, as well as Nick.

That he wasn't just the boogeyman.

You you know the Randy Man was not just a demon he was a person who'd been badly treated okay that is the lesson that the book is about and that is what I draw upon when you know when I refer to what happened all those years ago that's fantastic also you seem to be through your writing there critiquing the uh film you know horror films and and uh

what would you think of like a lot of the modern day horror films and uh franchises not franchises

not much if I'm honest saw a film called Possum Have you seen that?

I have seen it.

I've watched it once.

What do you think of it?

Very slow.

Your dream drink, Garth?

My dream drink is, well, it depends what I had earlier.

If it wasn't wine, I'll have the beer.

If I had the beer earlier, I'll have the wine.

Oh, I thought you were having both the beer and the wine stuck to me.

Oh, that's true, isn't it?

In which case, I'll have a potion.

Any particular type of potion?

Ask him.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Bonito shouldn't.

Bonito could do this choice.

He can give you whatever potion you want.

Yeah, within reason, Bonito.

Rustle me up something interesting, but not dangerous.

In your ideal world, what effect would the potion have on you?

I would like it to expand time.

There's not enough time for me to write all I need to write.

There just isn't.

Having said that, I do believe in

reincarnation.

I do know that I will be reincarnated as another writer.

I was a writer in a previous incarnation, so but it's just a bit annoying to have to die and then start the process again because you waste those valuable years, you know, from nought to 2025 where you are, you know, growing again as a human being.

And getting used to curry again.

All of that, learning the lessons of who do you not or who do you, you know, play with fire with, you know, yeah, yeah.

You don't want it.

No, I mean, I've learned that lesson.

Yeah.

Do you know who you were in the previous incarnation?

What sort of things you would write?

I don't know his name.

I know of his work i can't say any more than that okay are you a better writer than him i like to think so do you think when you come back again you'll be an even better writer or do you think that's the undoubtedly yeah it all depends whether mankind has evolved enough to understand and learn from the work that i'm doing at that stage which i doubt so relatively speaking you might be as good because you evolve with it with each stage of evolution yeah you improve but relatively you're still like as good yeah i mean i mean i don't evolve because I am evolved.

I'm here.

I'm a sage.

I'm a doom sage.

I'm here to help and facilitate your minds heading towards the next stage of

evolving.

Evolvement.

Yeah.

So I don't necessarily need to evolve but you guys certainly do.

Yes.

Well thank you as well for helping us.

That's okay.

That is a step towards evolving.

Thank you.

Learning to say thank you and recognizing when your life has been improved.

Notice you sometimes occasionally glance in at Ed's tattoos.

Yeah, why did did you get those?

Just thought they looked nice.

I like the artists.

Just, you know, collect them.

I've got a really scary one here, Garth.

You might like this one.

It's quite scary.

Look at that demon there.

What do you think of that?

That looks like something you've covered up to change.

Was it an old girlfriend?

No.

No,

this is the original piece.

Ah, okay.

This is, it's got teeth coming out of its neck there.

Nice idea, isn't it?

It's quite similar to a story I once wrote.

Oh, really?

Did you get that checked?

No, I didn't.

I should have

asked the artist, for sure.

You are going to have to get that changed, potentially.

Again.

What was the story?

Because it's an infringement.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

I'm on Garth's side with this.

Yeah.

You know the story.

It sounds like you do.

I don't need to point it out.

I mean, I didn't, you know, it was the artist who came up with the...

They know the story.

Yeah.

I think they probably know the story.

Sorry, Garth.

I'm surprised we haven't successfully, you know, we've moved on to the drink here and, you know, we've got dessert around the corner, but like, I'm assuming we've left the savouries behind.

And as a fan of your TV show I was kind of slightly disappointed not to not to see broccoli on the menu

I won't touch it you don't like it Joe you know

you might think that was a frivolous moment

it I was deadly serious I don't touch it yeah so you do hate it I don't hate it I tire of it

actually I do hate it I do hate it

you can do great things with you know tenderstem broccoli now you can char grill it and it gets that sort of smoky you can dip it in cheese yeah hot cheese Yeah.

Which is nice.

I mean, Tenderstem wasn't as big when you made the series originally.

Tenderstem broccoli wasn't really a thing.

It wasn't in the Zeitgeist thing.

That's right.

I think Tenderstem came about because of that show, in fact, that episode.

I think people realized they had to do something.

Yeah, yeah.

Thus, Tenderstem was developed.

That must feel good to know that you've made a positive change in the world.

Yeah, I just wish we'd phased it all out as a vegetable.

That was the aim.

Yeah.

That was the true aim.

What other foods would you phase out apart from broccoli?

I would phase out

ice.

But I don't need to because that is happening.

Of course, yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

That's comforting to know.

Yeah.

Do you want another water?

I would like another water, yes, please.

Some listeners might spot an inconsistency here.

I'm still fearing it.

Yeah,

so you're not.

Yeah, okay, it's not a pleasant experience for you to be in the water, but you're on your second glass.

I'm doing it because you haven't provided beer or wine.

Or potion.

Would you like the potion to be smoking?

You know, in some horror films, there might be some smoke coming off of the top of the.

Yeah, maybe a little umbrella in the top as well.

Oh, yeah.

That's nice.

If you want.

Cocktail umbrella in it.

And in the goblet, of course, as well.

In a goblet, in a goblet.

You never told us about the goblet.

You've never described the goblet.

What's the one at home like?

Oh, it's large.

Yeah.

It's long.

Often it will require two arms to lift.

But it is, I think, genuine Nordic.

Oh, wow.

Or genuine Viking at least.

Where did you lay your hands on it?

Gift shop up in

Reykjavik.

It was a gift shop there.

Was the gift shop adjacent to a tourist adjacent?

A hot spring.

Yeah, nice.

I can't imagine you in a hot spring guy.

Oh, well.

Now you can.

That's why you're not a writer.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

My imagination is limited to what's in front of me, I guess.

I can't really.

Because I guess you could look at any of us and imagine us in any scenario.

Yeah, I can.

If you were to write a book about Benito, for example,

what situation do you think would best suit him?

A man who wanted it all

and took it and paid the price.

That's great.

Yeah, I can imagine him in that situation.

Only after you've said it.

Yeah, that's quite a...

I would read that book.

Yeah.

But now, if you do write that book, do you think we would maybe have like a...

Well, Ben would know that it was based on him.

I'm not writing it.

But I am copywriting it.

You cannot have that idea.

Right.

We can't have that.

We can't have the idea of a man who wants it all and took it and then paid the price.

No.

I'm copywriting that.

Those exact words.

I'm copywriting that whole plot development.

I'm copywriting story.

You've got to now because that's what AI are trying to do.

Yeah.

They're trying to copyright.

Are you worried about the rise of AI?

I'm worried about the rise of copyright plottage.

Plottage, copyright theft.

Yeah.

You know, if you steal plottage, it leaves writers pretty stumped.

I'm not so much frightened by the technology because I can always lift a hammer or something like that and I can smash the screen if I want.

You know, if there's going to be a fight between me and AI, ultimately I'm going to win.

Yes.

Because you're effectively speaking about

a screen.

Yeah.

An inert screen.

But of course, you remember from Terratome, the typewriter was very much the evil demon figure.

So technology.

One of.

But technology can be quite terrifying.

It can, but you can smash it.

You can smash.

I mean, I could smash these mics if I want.

I could smash the recording.

Yeah.

Well, I could, couldn't I?

You could, yeah.

You could.

You could smash them.

Yeah.

The recording's digital, so it's like on loads of, you know, it's, it can, it can go.

I can go around and smash everyone's if I want.

Yeah.

So you'd have to smash everyone's in the world.

Time permitting, but it could be done.

This is what you've got to remember.

Time permitting.

Yeah.

That's why I argue so much for the extension of time.

This is the one thing that holds things up.

Time permitting, we could go around and break everyone's computer screen in the world.

Yeah.

And on a space station if we wish.

Yeah.

But it's just that it's time.

It's the crucial element, always is.

We fall down on time.

Which is why you've got the potion.

You can expand time.

That's right.

So if you smash all the screens, then AI goes away.

And that's the end.

That's where AI is.

But then you come back to me.

You still want stories.

You people will need stories.

Human beings need stories.

They need tellers of tales.

Tellers of tales,

which is what I am, in order to evolve.

You'll come back.

You know, AI can't copy my thought process.

It can't tell a tale the way I tell it.

It can't come up with, for example.

Yep.

Let's go into the book again.

No!

yelled the voice of the nullifier, raging inside Nick's mind.

This cannot be.

I was about to wreak ultimate havoc on that very plane of existence.

I was that close to causing total ultimate destruction.

And then you came along.

How dare you?

Wow.

You see?

Yeah.

Yeah, AI.

Yeah, it wouldn't be able to come up with that.

Or the Randy Man.

It can't come up with the idea for the Randy Man.

Where did you get the idea for the Randy Man?

Well, we know that.

I was afflicted for some time with.

I mean, the name, really, in the sort of...

Oh, whether the name of the story.

Yeah, and the sort of the story.

I was talking.

I was afflicted for some time with a series of stonkons,

which I, which, the only thing that got me through it was to actually write about it.

So I came up with this.

Have you seen the Randy Man streaking through the night?

Have you seen the Randyman flashing them affright?

Wrapped up in his Macintosh with his grubby trilby.

If you aren't now dead in bed, then pretty soon you will be.

Watch out for the Randy Man who's living in your pillow.

Beware his grubby Macintosh when both flaps start to billow.

Seventeen times, Nick remembered.

Say his name 17 times and he'll appear.

And if the legend was true and you happened to catch sight of whatever the flashing dream demon kept inside that billowing rain mac of his, then blood would rush instantly to your extremities.

The body's internal temperature would rise suddenly under the collar area, and before you knew it, you were dead from exposure.

Not the weather-related kind.

Okay.

It's amazing.

To your knowledge, is there any other story that's similar to the Randy Matt?

No.

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