How to Manifest Friends, Mentors & Incredible Relationships w/Bumble Founder Whitney Wolfe Herd Pt 2

I'm so glad you're here for this incredible part two episode with founder and CEO of Bumble, Whitney Wolf Hurd, who shares stories and insights she's never shared before, and she's sharing them today right here with you. So if you are ready to get unstuck and start to manifest new and meaningful friends, mentors, and relationships in your life, even if some

of them haven't worked out so well in the past, this episode is going to change your life today. Coming up in this episode.
Whitney, I'm crying. I am crying my lashes off.
On the outside, the world watched this incredible woman with an 18-month-old son on her hip take Bumble public. I remember seeing it everywhere.
I remember you and I weren't friends yet at that time, but I remember seeing it and seeing the confetti everywhere and your yellow blazer and like all the things and you're everywhere on the cover of every magazine. Everyone is just watching you with so much awe and inspiration and excitement.
You have shared that while that all looked one way on the outside. And I think so many of us will see that and be like, oh my gosh, it feels like Cinderella, you know, at the ball.
It feels like a fairy tale coming. It feels like the coolest moment in the world.
And you say that was actually one of the worst days of your life. Definitely.
I went home and cried after the IPO. Why was I crying? You have a download at 17 saying this is your purpose.
When you're literally at 17 on a plane, one of the lowest moments in your life, trying to come out of an abusive relationship. And now we're sitting here and millions of people have been impacted by the offering of Bumble about the, you know, what you've imagined and what you helped create.
I will share one story of something that changed my life. This is so wild.
And if you're not, if you're not a believer, you should probably go take a coffee break. And I thought, okay, this is it.
This is literally hell on earth. She said, I was in a toxic marriage for a very long time.
And I read about you. I read about what you did with Bumble.
And it gave me the courage to leave my marriage. And once I had rebuilt my strength and my self-confidence, I downloaded Bumble because of you.
And I've never met anyone with my fiance's name. And he is the love of my life.
And he is is wonderful after an abusive marriage, which is basically my whole story. It was my whole purpose.
If that's not the universe telling you that, you know, check, the intention was pure and good. I don't know what else is.
She's the one to tell you you're going to be okay. okay yeah when you literally also don't know if you're

dying that's right have you ever or do you ever now deal with imposter syndrome not anymore no i was riddled in it i climbed up to the top of this mountain and then I crashed down. The stock fell 80%.
I stopped getting invited to the top of this mountain, and then I crashed down.

The stock fell 80%.

I stopped getting invited to the cool conferences.

I said, oh yeah.

And hell, it hurt.

It hurt.

Many a tears were cried when those invites didn't roll in.

And that's where I'm at now, Jamie.

You can't hurt my feelings anymore. You can't.
I went through some version of like an ego death. And now I'm like, let's go.
Let's lead with love. I'm not leading with fear.
I'm not going to lead with insecurity. I'm not going to lead with like, what's someone going to think about me? I do not care.
Genuinely. And I can say that sincerely.
I think you can tell I don't bullshit you. You get what you get with me.
And I wasn't there a year ago. For you to have two days crying just over a year ago, and then to come out of it with this kind of a freedom.
Oh yeah. Oh yeah.
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Jamie, you're so inspiring. Jamie Kern Lima.
Whitney Wolf Hurd, welcome to the Jamie Kern Lima show. Thank you.
I'm so happy to be here. When you talk about like doing it for us and you shared about everything you went through as a teenage girl and just the moment on the floor after Tinder and just realizing clearly like how you're going to help the collective us.
Can you share, Whitney, the number of people who have written you messages because of their experience with Bumble, who have gained confidence, who have gotten in touch with their self-worth, who have left abusive relationships because of the offering. Because of, you know, you talk about Walt Disney imagining this whole thing and it's like, and it all started with the mouse.
It's like this all started with you and your experiences and everything you've gone through. You have a download at 17 saying this is your purpose.
when you're literally at 17 on a plane, one of the lowest moments in your life, trying to come out of an abusive relationship. And now we're sitting here and millions of people have been impacted by the offering of Bumble, about what you've imagined and what you and your team help create.
How does it feel in your soul to know how many people continue to share stories with you on how what you've created has changed their life and how they've left abusive relationships and they've decided to do things differently in their own life because of the offering you've put out in the world. Well, thank you for acknowledging that.
And you said a very important word, which was team. And I've got to say for anybody listening, like the team you're surrounded with is really where the magic is, right? Like the team is everything.
Um, so just like deeply, deeply grateful and indebted to our team past, present, and I know future. Um, I will share one story of something that changed my life in terms of a success story.
Uh, this is so wild. And a lot of people, if you're not, if you're not a believer, you should probably go take a coffee break because you're going to think this is a little abstract and out there, but I promise you it's the truth.
I, after I had my first son, Bobby, my husband, he was raised by his grandfather who was a deeply, deeply influential person in my life too. He was one of the only people that really believed in me and supported me through the departure of Tinder and the building of Bumble.
And he was just this figure of like strength. And he was really the man in the arena.
It was his favorite quote. He had it framed everywhere.
An impressive, amazing man who defeated all the odds. So I got pregnant at 29.
My husband and I got pregnant with our first child when I was 29. And we found out it was a boy and we knew immediately we're going to name him Bobby Lee after granddaddy, who was Bobby Lee.
This is all relevant to answering your question I'm setting at the stage. And so we have our beautiful baby boy,

but very unfortunately, granddaddy had gotten very, very ill just weeks prior, and he was hanging on for dear life just to make it to see this baby boy be born. And as fate would have it, was not my due date.
Our son, Bobby Lee, was born on granddaddy's birthday, December the 9th. And we named him Bobby Lee II.
And I've never met anyone named Bobby Lee before. It's kind of a strange, like, it's not Johnny.
It's like a kind of, you know, a unique name, like the double pairing of these names. And this is relevant because this answers your question.
So after I had our son, granddaddy tragically was able to see him just on FaceTime. He said, happy birthday, kind of said, I give you my life.
And after that, he really never spoke again and he passed. So five days after Bobby's born, it's granddaddy's, we're getting ready to like prepare for granddaddy's funeral, Bobby Lee, the first funeral.
And I woke up that morning about to fly to the funeral with a really crazy headache. Like I've never had a headache like this.
I thought, something's not right. So I text the doctor, they say, lay down, it's hormones, it's take a nap.
I looked in the mirror and I was a balloon. I was like, what has happened to me? And so I thought to check my blood pressure because I had read an article about a woman who swole and got a headache and ended up with a stroke and had something called postpartum preeclampsia.
And I said, God, I better check my blood pressure. Lo and behold, my blood pressure was something like 180 over 125 or 130.
It was very, very serious. So the doctor said, get to the hospital immediately.
So here I am, I'm leaving my newborn child at home, not alone, thank God, obviously. And my husband has to leave me at the hospital to go deliver the eulogy at a thousand person funeral or however many people were there.
So I'm in this bed in the hospital. They cannot get my blood pressure down.
I have very, it's called help syndrome. I have help syndrome.
Your liver enzymes are out of control. Your blood pressure is out of control and it is fatal.
You can die from this. And very tragically, it is a huge portion of maternal deaths, preeclampsia and post-preeclampsia.
So here I am, I'm laying in the dark. They put you in the dark on something called a magnesium drip.
And I literally think, oh, this is as bad as it gets. You're not with your new baby.
You're being told we're going to do our best, but no certainty that you're going to get better, which is the truth. No one's telling you you're going to be okay because they don't know.
They're going to do their best. And your husband is at the funeral of the one man that has been like an inspiration to you.
And I thought, okay, this is it. This is literally hell on earth.
And shortly thereafter, a woman walks in the room. She's a nurse at the hospital and it's dark, but she comes in and she grabs my hand.
I can see her and I can hear her. She turns the lights on and she says, hi, sweetheart.
And she says, you're Whitney from Bumble, right? And I think, oh God, like not now. I can't give jobs right now.
Like I, you know, someone's nephew wants a job at Bumble all the time. And I'm like, this is not the time I'm dying.
Like, can we save this for another day? And she pretty quickly, after she tells me, listen, I know I'm violating HIPAA.

It's my last day at the hospital. I've been here for 35 years.
I had to come see you. The nurses were talking about you back in the nurse station that the Bumble founder was here.
And I didn't care if I got in trouble. I came to talk to you.
She said, first of all, you're going to be okay, sweetheart. And she grabbed my hand.
That was the first time someone told me I'd be okay. And she said, I had to come tell you something.
She said, I was in a toxic marriage for a very long time and I read about you. And I read about what you did with Bumble and it gave me the courage to leave my marriage.
And once I had rebuilt my strength and my self-confidence, I downloaded Bumble because of you. And I've never met anyone with my fiance's name.
And he is the love of my life and he is wonderful. And I saw that your baby's name is Bobby Lee.
Because they write it on the wall outside the hospital room when you're a new mom with a baby. She said, that's his name.
She said, I met Bobby Lee on Bumble after an abusive marriage, which is basically my whole story. It was my whole purpose.
And it was Bobby Lee's funeral and baby Bobby Lee was at home. And this woman's life had been enhanced by a man named Bobby Lee that she met on Bumble.
So if that's not the universe telling you that, you know, check, the intention was pure and good. I don't know what else is.
She's the one to tell you you're going to be okay. Yeah.
When you literally also don't know if you're dying. That's right.
So that's the power of what this has been for me. That story is exactly a through line of this whole journey.
And I think we all can connect with these synchronicities in the world, right? If we trust and believe in it. And that's just one example.
Whitney, I am crying my lashes off. That's really great.
Crying my lashes off. By the way, that's a great tagline or like comment.
Crying my lashes off. It's just so powerful.
It's so powerful. And I think a lot of people, you know, have gone through the hard times and through hearing your story are going to understand also that their best days can be ahead.
That's right. And your worst days can also be little cracks of light.
Yeah. Right.
That was, that was the worst day ever, hands down, but it ended up being pretty profound, right? That experience was profound. So I think we have to fall down to learn the lesson or see the good.
You know, I love, one of the things I love so much about this show, this podcast, and these conversations is we so often talk about the story behind the story. And I think that's really where so many people get their inspiration and then they see what's possible.
And, you know, on the outside, the world watched this incredible woman with an 18-month-old son on her hip

take Bumble public.

And I remember seeing it everywhere.

I remember you and I weren't friends yet at that time, but I remember seeing it and seeing

the confetti everywhere and your yellow blazer and like all the things.

And you're everywhere on the cover of

every magazine. Everyone is just watching you, um, with so much awe and inspiration and excitement.
Um, and you have shared that while that all looked one way on the outside, um, Um, and, and, and, and I think so many of us will see that and be like, oh my gosh, it feels like Cinderella at the ball. It feels like a fairy tale coming.
It feels like the coolest moment in the world. And you say that was actually one of the worst days of your life.
Definitely. I went home and cried after the IPO.
Why was I crying? There's so much more coming up in this episode. You are not going to want to miss it.
But first, I wanted to share this with you. In life, you don't soar to the level of your hopes and dreams.
You stay stuck at the level of your self-worth. When you build your self-worth, you change your entire life.
And that's exactly why I wrote my new book, Worthy, How to Believe You Are Enough and Transform Your Life for You. If you have some self-doubt to destroy and a destiny to fulfill, Worthy is for you.
In Worthy, you'll learn proven tools and simple steps that bring life-changing results, like how to get unstuck from the things holding you back, build unshakable self-love, unlearn the lies that lead to self-doubt, and embrace the truths that wake up worthiness. Overcome limiting beliefs and imposter syndrome.
Achieve your hopes and dreams by believing you are worthy of them and so much more. Are you ready to unleash your greatness and step into the person you were born to be? Imagine a life with zero self-doubt and unshakable self-worth.
Get your copy of Worthy plus some amazing thank you bonus gifts for you at worthybook.com or the link in the show notes below. Imagine what you'd do if you fully believed in you.
It's time to find out with Worthy. Imagine, what would you do if you fully believed in you? My weekly free inspirational newsletter is packed with tips and tools to help you find out.
It's called One-on-One with Jamie, and it's delivered right to your inbox each Tuesday morning. It's a love letter from me to you, from my soul to yours, and I hope it brings you the words and messages you need at just the right moment.
Plus, when you're a part of my free inspirational newsletter community, you'll be the first to get behind-the-scenes content, inspirational messages, and be the first to learn about upcoming events and more. It's the place to be.
And I sure hope you'll join me there. So if you're not on the list yet, you can sign up for free at jamiekernlima.com or click the link in the show notes below.
And here's to becoming unstoppable together. And now more of this incredible conversation together.
You have shared that while that all looked one way on the outside, and I think so many of us will see that and be like, oh my gosh, it feels like Cinderella,

you know, at the ball.

It feels like a fairy tale coming.

It feels like the coolest moment in the world.

And you say that was actually one of the worst days of your life.

Definitely.

I went home and cried after the IPO.

Why was I crying?

Why?

I mean, on the surface, I should be popping bottles, celebrating. I was a wreck.
I was so depleted. I was so disconnected from myself.
It was all about getting there. It was all about like getting to the top of this mountain, like exhaustion, complete exhaustion.
And that beautiful baby on my hip that was there in the videos and the photos with the confetti, like that little baby had not seen his mom rested, energized, calm. It's so long and so long because I felt like, you know, I have to get there.
I have to do this. I got to do it.
I got to do it. I got to do it.
I got to do it. And I think this quest of like the greater good, it can also come at the expense of ourselves.
So I think that's such a lesson that I've learned over the last year of time. I don't call it time off.
I call it time in, you know, they always talk about, I, I, we don't do time out with, um, our kids, but it's so funny's so funny. I'm always like, okay, Bobby, it's time for time in, not timeout.
Let's do some time in where we need to go in. We need to like reconnect because it's all so crazy out here.
So crazy. So, so crazy.
There's like so many things that are pulling at us and needing us and depleting us and draining us and drowning us.

And if we don't go in and replenish our energy, what do we have left? We're shells. We're just vessels.
And I think this year in or wherever it's been, right? In this different realm has been such a gift because I've had time to sit and pause and reflect and realize like all the shiny objects just don't matter. Like if you're not healthy, your team's not healthy.
If you're not energized, the customers aren't energized. Like you have to, you have to set the tone at the top, you know? And also don't pretend to women around the world that you can bounce a baby on your hip and take a company public for $15 billion all on a Monday.
And it's just all gravy because that's not true. It's hard.
It's super hard. And that's okay, right? You can do it, but you can't do everything all at once without something breaking.
And the thing that broke was me. It was me.
That's what broke. And so I had to put it back together.
I have had so many experiences at cosmetics where I was like, everything is crushing it on the outside. And exactly the words you said earlier, I felt like a vessel of a person, like barely alive, like in total survival mode, like an absolute robot.
And I still have to fight to not be like when I launched Worthy and did this big event where we had 260,000, you know, people live. It was like, everything was the most incredible.
And also for me, that's the struggle of like, okay, wait, but if I am not full and rusted and all the things, if I'm burnt out doing this. That's right.
And so, okay. So when you mentioned the year in, you know, you're still obviously all in at Bumble, highly active, all the things, and you brought another person to the CEO world.
Yeah. And then now after a year, you're back in now as CEO.
I am. What does it now look like for you? Yeah.
What changes, you know, I mean, the whole world still puts the same expectations on any public company, CEO, all the things. And, and you know, what shifts are you making? Because what you said is so powerful.
It's like, oh my gosh, how are your customers going to be energized unless you're energized? So it actually on the outside could look like, oh, I love that they're working 120 hour weeks, but that's not necessarily the best strategy. That's right.
Yeah. So I think I'm going back with a lot of perspective.
It's funny. One of my board members said this profound thing to me.
She said, everything's better the second time around. You know, if you think about the first time you do anything, it's always, it's new, it's scary.
You're learning on the job. And the second time around is just profoundly easier.
And you have perspective, you have wisdom, you have learnings. And so I think I go back with the energy of love.
Like Bumble has always been at its core about love. And what I've realized in this time in, whatever you want to call it, the entire meaning of life, genuinely, and I'm sure we could go ask all of the philosophical and spiritual leaders that we know and don't know.
And if we asked them, we kind of said, define the meaning of life in one word. We asked a hundred like spiritual leaders or evolved people.
We asked them the meaning of life in one word, and they have to pick one word only. I'm going to bet, it's a guess, I'm going to bet that 80% or more say the word love.
I'm going to bet that. And I fundamentally believe that that is the meaning of life.
And if I have the opportunity or dharma or whatever you want to call it to help spread love in the world, then sign me up, put me in coach. Let's go.
Like let's get back in the arena because that's a noble mission. And if I can assemble the special forces of love around me to go out and help re-instill

love in all the ways, through friendship, community, your romantic love, and most importantly,

through self-love, that can be transformational for people.

So that's where we're going back with.

And do you feel like

strengthening self-love makes you even more of a kick-ass CEO? One million percent. Yeah.
How can you lead others if you can't lead yourself? Yep. Right? Yes.
Million percent. Um, you know, have you ever, um, or do you ever now deal with imposter syndrome? Not anymore.
No, I was riddled in it and insecure and scared. And what's this person going to think about me? Oh, did I hurt their feelings? Like, what are they going to say? What are they going to write about me? What's the article going to say? Petrified.
And that was a trauma response. That was coming from a place of fear.
I was operating from a place of fear, fear of not being loved, not being accepted, not being enough, not being good enough, not being, you know, whatever you want to call it. And I think I just, you know, this is important too, because we spent a lot of time talking about all these accolades, like, oh, the IPO and the, it was a $15 billion company and, you know, the Forbes and da, da, da, da, da, da.
But what people maybe don't realize about the last year is I climbed up to the top of this mountain and then I crashed down. The stock fell 80%.
I stopped getting invited to the cool conferences. Oh yeah.
Do you know how many invites I did not get to these like big macho masculine rulers of the free world conferences that I was invited to for eight years, they all stopped. The invite stopped coming in.
I stopped getting phone calls. I was irrelevant.
But you know what was beautiful about that? There's so much more coming up in this episode. You are not going to want to miss it.
But first, I wanted to share this with you. In life, you don't soar to the level of your hopes and dreams.
You stay stuck at the level of your self-worth. When you build your self-worth, you change your entire life.
And that's exactly why I wrote my new book, Worthy, How to Believe You Are Enough and Transform Your Life for You. If you have some self-doubt to destroy and a destiny to fulfill, Worthy is for you.
In Worthy, you'll learn proven tools and simple steps that bring life-changing results, like how to get unstuck from the things holding you back, build unshakable self-love. Unlearn the lies that lead to self-doubt and embrace the truths that wake up worthiness.
Overcome limiting beliefs and imposter syndrome. Achieve your hopes and dreams by believing you are worthy of them and so much more.
Are you ready to unleash your greatness and step into the person you were born to be? Imagine a life with zero self-doubt and unshakable self-worth. Get your copy of Worthy plus some amazing thank you bonus gifts for you at worthybook.com or the link in the show notes below.
Imagine what you'd do if you fully believed in you. It's time to find out with Worthy.
Imagine what would you do if you fully believed in you. My weekly free inspirational newsletter is packed with tips and tools to help you find out.
It's called One-on-One with Jamie, and it's delivered right to your inbox each Tuesday morning. It's a love letter from me to you, from my soul to yours, and I hope it brings you the words and messages you need at just the right moment.
Plus, when you're a part of my free inspirational newsletter community, you'll be the first to get behind the scenes content, inspirational messages, and be the first to learn about upcoming events and more. It's the place to be.
And I sure hope you'll join me there. So if you're not on the list yet, you can sign up for free at jamiekernlima.com or click the link in the show notes below.
And here's to becoming unstoppable together. And now more of this incredible conversation together.
I stopped getting invited to the cool conferences. Oh yeah.
Do you know how many invites I did not get to these like big macho masculine rulers of the free world conferences that I was invited to for eight years? They all stopped. The invites stopped coming in.
I stopped getting phone calls. I was irrelevant.
But you know what was beautiful about that? And thank you universe, God, whoever you are, for giving me that opportunity. Because I learned that that's not what matters.
That's not the point. And hell, it hurt.
It hurt. Many a tears were cried when those invites didn't roll in.
When I found out early after stopping being CEO, I'll never forget when I got uninvited to this one conference, this like macho, masculine, cool conference, I cried for two days. It hurt my feelings.
So this would have been just a little over a year ago. Yeah.
It gutted me. The same way I probably would have cried in middle school when the girls didn't invite me to a birthday party.
Or I remember fourth grade, there was a group of girls, fifth grade, didn't get invited to the birthday party and I didn't want to leave my room for, you know, the whole weekend. That same inner wounded, not enough part of me was so triggered.
As an adult, being upset that I wasn't invited to this conference

with all the big wigs, right? Humans don't change. We just play on different scales.
Like, you know, the cool kids table just changes. It gets bigger.
It gets more interesting. It gets scarier.
I mean, you've got to disassociate from that stuff. It's going to be there no matter what.
you don't have to play that game.

Did you have, you know, from an online persona, you are friends with every celebrity, every cool person, every badass business person. I mean, you're everywhere, you're at everything.
So, so having this moment, it doesn't surprise me, but I didn't know about it. So it's taken me by surprise from that perspective just a little over a year ago.
And did you have any instances where you realized someone, and I won't ask you who, but someone who you thought was your friend actually changed when your business on paper looked different? Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So many people, but you know what? I can't blame them because you know why? That's the frequency they're on.
It's a radio and- Oh, that's so good what you just said. No, but it's true.
It's a radio. Yes.
And that's their frequency right now. It's not that something's different with you.
It's that you realize their frequency that. They are on a

different station. They're on a different station.
And I'm on a different station. We are in different frequencies and that's okay.
Some people like, you know, 98.1 FM and some people like 106.7. And we're on different frequencies, different strokes for different folks.
And that's where I'm at now, Jamie. You can't hurt my feelings anymore.
You can't. Not saying you ever would, but I'm saying out there, they, whoever this group is or next group will be or whoever it's going to be next.
Like you can't take that from me. It's mine.
Yeah. And I can tell you, it is the biggest gift I've ever been given.
Yeah. I went through some version of like an ego death and now I'm like, let's go.
Let's lead with love. I'm not leading with fear.
I'm not going to lead with insecurity. I'm not going to lead with like, what's someone going to think about me? I do not care.
Genuinely. And I can say that sincerely.
I think you can tell I don't bullshit you. Like you get what you get with me.
And I wasn't there a year ago. I'm just sitting here celebrating you right now.
Okay. That is wild to me.
It's not, it's not shocking, but here's the thing is that, you know, Oprah always says, when it comes to friends, it's easy to find people that ride the limo with you, but when the limo breaks down, you're taking the bus, the friends that ride the bus with you, that's who you want with you. That's who you want.
And obviously you're not riding any buses and you are CEO of one of the most successful companies in the world right now and all of that. And that's why it's shocking to me that everything you've done, everything you've built, everything you've gone through, everything you've accomplished, and on paper, something changes with the value of your company or a title and you're uninvited from something.
That's just like shocking. And to see friends change that quickly.
What a beautiful gift when people show you who they are. Yes.
And then for you to have two days crying just over a year ago, and then to come out of it with this kind of a freedom. Oh, yeah.
Oh, yeah. And by the way, it's kind of embarrassing to admit to all of this, right? But if I can't admit it, how can anybody admit it? Yeah.
Yeah. Like, cause we've all been there.
Whether it's the example of the grade school or as adults, we've all been there. And we, no matter who we are in the world, like the woman who's living in the small town and, you know, is trying to start her own, you know, small business.
Like she might feel this way with the other moms in the community. I mean, this can happen to us at any level.
And I think it was Mel Robbins who said recently, I saw a clip somewhere. It was like, let them, like, I thought that was so profound because I had never actually put those words together, the let them concept.
But the truth is like, just accept people for who they are. Like that's their frequency.
Don't change them, change you. Yeah.
That is such, it's so beautiful. It's so powerful.
It's hard to do for a lot of people. It's hard.
Yeah. Mel, who's a really good friend, launched her Let Them book, did the show.

So cool. And her whole thing is like, we spend so much time trying to control things we can't control, worrying about what other people think, all of it, giving away our power.
And we were just like, let them. Enjoy.
It's beautiful. I didn't know that you went through that just a little over a year ago.
That's, that's big. And there are so few women doing and operating and offering the world in business and in creativity, the kinds of things that you've done.
And so it's just, yeah, I'm just processing that you shared that. Um, because Do you know, I was going to ask you this, have you, maybe you're to this point now, it took me a long journey to get to this point, but so many women out there, we bond over, like we're taught to bond over being self-deprecating or our problems or putting ourselves down or, oh, I can't fit in my outfit, this, my house is house is a mess, you know, kind of a thing.
And then when something great happens to us, we kind of like dim our light or we don't want to boast or we don't. And I'm wondering because, you know, I'm wondering if you've ever dimmed your light or hid your success, or if you fully embrace it now.
I'll never forget, you know, you're on Forbes America's richest self-made women's list. And I'll never forget that when I sold at Cosmetics, Forbes called and they're like, you're on America's richest self-made women's list.
And I told my head of PR to not talk to them, not comment, tell them I don't want to be- Take us off. Yeah, I would be off of that.
I don't want to be on it. I panicked.
And I'll never forget, the Forbes reporter said, huh, this is really interesting because on the women's list, a lot of women request to not be on it. That's right.
And men probably want to be. The men call and argue for a higher number.
They fight and try to prove- That's all you need to know. That's all you need to know about the differences.
I was just like, oh, okay, but I just don't want to comment. I don't want to know.
And they somehow do all their own, they somehow through everything that's public out there and all the deals that happen, they get an estimate of people's net worth and you don't have a choice. You're either on it or you're not.
And so Whitney for years, if I would go to an event and they would want to introduce me as the keynote speaker and read my bio or whatever it would be, and they would have that in there, I would ask them to take it out. And if it ever stayed in, I'd have them change it and take out the America's Richest Self-Made Women and change it to like to like most successful or something.
But I asked them to take it out. Tell me why.
And it hit me. Yeah.
Yeah. It hit me that I didn't yet feel worthy enough of celebrating my own success.
And here's what did it for me. You talk about earlier, you talk about it's not just about me, it's about us.
There was a moment where it hit me where I'm like, wait a minute. The other women on this list, Oprah, Katy Perry, Taylor Swift, Beyonce, Whitney Wolf Hurd.
Do not include me with that group. They're amazing.
Being on a list like that, no matter who it is, it shows other people what's possible. That's right.
And I had this moment where I'm like, wait a minute, there's going to be someone out there that if they know I'm on that list, they're going to go, she's a Denny's waitress and had a dream and worked her ass off. And now, wait, maybe it's possible for me.
I'm a waitress right now and I have a dream and I have a book to write or a story to like a story to share. Maybe it's possible for me.
And it was me having to make it not about me and be about the higher vibration of us. Like, okay, wait a minute.
If I'm hiding this good thing that happened to me, I'm robbing other people that maybe see themselves in me and then believe it's possible for them. So for you,

all the things that have happened, do you now fully embrace them? Or do you ever kind of like, you know what I'm saying? Like downplay your success. Well, first of all, thank you for sharing that.
That's so interesting. And I think you tapped something deeply true for women.
Like we are ashamed of being seen as wealthy or successful, or, you know, I think anything outside of beauty is not acceptable. Right.
And I don't mean beauty from a business standpoint. I mean, like women for throughout history have been applauded for being beautiful.
And so it's okay to be called the most beautiful woman in the world, but it's not okay to be called the wealthiest woman in the world. That is, that is who that, you know, I'm not saying that I've ever been called either.
I'm giving you a, um, kind of this juxtaposition of how I feel what you're expressing is due to the nature of what gives men and women value. And men are celebrated and desired, right? Traditionally when they are what? Wealthy.
Yes. Successful.
They can provide money. And women are seen historically throughout history as valuable because they are what? Yeah.
Beautiful. Beautiful.
Yep. And so I think what you're hitting on is actually extremely interesting culturally that we are in this, you're kind of the front line, like you and obviously the remarkable Oprah who came before us and, and all these other amazing women that came before, before like our generation, but this is new.
This is what like a couple generations of women being in business really as business women. So this is like a navigation.
And I think there's a lot of shame in feeling like we have more than other people might have. But you're right.
You nailed it. When it can be used as a force of inspiration and motivation, you got to harness it.
Yeah. And that's where I'm at.
I'm like, listen, if this just tells one young woman that to your point, if she's working at whatever restaurant or store, or she's coming out of an abusive marriage and has no savings and she can rebuild herself because there are other women in the world who have done it, girl, it's our duty. Like if we're lucky enough to have been given whatever opportunities and successes, even despite all the rejection and failure and all the pain,

like we've got to carry the torch. That's the way I think about it.
We have to. Yeah.
And it is new. It's new for so many of us to not dim our light.
And on that note, remember this episode is not just for you and me. Please share this with every single person you know because it can change their life too.
Coming up, this conversation is so incredible, so transformative, and also so inspiring that we made it into more than one part. And if you're ready to learn how to raise your vibration to get what you want and truly create your best life, you are not going to want to miss part three with Whitney Wolf Hurd coming up in the next episode of the Jamie Curran Lima Show.
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Post it and share it with others online or in your community who just might need the words and tools and lessons and inspiration in this episode today. You never know whose life you're meant to change today by sharing this episode.
And thank you so much for joining me today. Before you go, I want to share some words with you that couldn't be more true.
You right now, exactly as you are, are enough and fully worthy. You're worthy of your greatest hopes, your wildest dreams, and all the unconditional love in the world.
And it is an honor to welcome you to each and every episode of the Jamie Kern Lima Show. Here, I hope you'll come as you are.
Heal where you need. Blossom what you choose.
Journey toward your calling and stay as long as you'd like because you belong here. You are worthy.
You are loved. You are love.
I love you. And I cannot wait to join you on the next episode of the Jamie Kern Lima Show.
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