Your Financial Journey Is a Marathon, Not a Sprint

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host, Rachel Cruz, number one best-selling author, Ramsey personality, co-host of the Smart Money Happy Hour with Mr.
George Camel on the Ramsey Networks, and my daughter. She's my co-host today.
Open phones at 888-825-5225. LaTonya is with us in Michigan.
Hey, LaTonya, welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hi, Dave and Rachel.
Thank you for having me. Sure.
What's up? I was calling to ask, me and my boyfriend have been together for about two years. He lives there in Spring Hill, Tennessee, and I live in Michigan.
And we've discussed getting married, and he has plans on relocating to Michigan, but he's not willing to relocate without securing a job first. And he's been applying, but his lease ends in June.
And I'm just wondering if you think it's a good idea to wait for him to secure a job to come to Michigan to find a place together or if I should move out. I live with my dad.
Me and my daughter moved in after I got divorced. And so I was just wondering what you both think.
So I'm, I'm a little bit confused. So he's, do I think he ought to come to Michigan without a job? Is that the question? Well, no, he doesn't.
Well, I'm asking if you think I should move out of my dad's house, like before he secures a job here, or if I should just wait until he does secure a job here and me and him move in somewhere together. Well, I think, you know, you're asking me, so I'm going to tell you, I would get married before I moved in together.
Our plan is to get married. Well, before you move in together yes like the like but once he once he

comes yeah yeah are you engaged no okay he hasn't asked me okay well we're getting these things out

of order as far as i'm concerned i'm an old school guy so um my daughter is sitting next to me if my

daughter called me like this i'd be going oh no no no no no no we're gonna get these things in the

All right. We're getting these things out of order as far as I'm concerned.
I'm an old school guy. So my daughter is sitting next to me.
If my daughter called me like this, I'd be going, oh, no, no, no, no, no, no. We're going to get these things in the right order.
Okay. And so we're going to say, okay, you said you have a daughter? Yes.
Okay. You would not tell her to move in with a guy that she wasn't married to, would you? No, I would tell her to get married first, but that is our plan.
It's just like I live with my dad. We're not engaged.
Might be your plan. It ain't his.
Yeah. So I think what's – so to answer your question, just like point blank, and then maybe we can kind of backpedal and talk through more of the why but no I would stay are you are you paying rent with your dad or are you just living there no okay yeah so I would live there with your daughter he needs to come move rent somewhere find a job once he's stable or feels you know that well enough to be able to say, okay, yes, now we're going to get engaged.
You guys have been dating for a long period of, you know, two years. You're both adults.
You probably know, yeah, we can make this engagement faster. We don't have to be engaged for three years, right? We can have a wedding.
It may not be an extravagant wedding, but we'll get married. And then the next step then would be, okay, now we have formed a family unit and we're going to live as that.
And I think the problem is so often like we fast forward that process. And what's difficult too, is we have found over and over and over and over and over again, and even more recent research has come out to show like, even from not even a financial perspective but just a quality of life perspective the happiness among couples is higher with those who actually didn't even live together before married married and then live together than those that lived together even before and so you know we're you just see all of this play out and i think too what's what's hard is we see the other end of that we see we get the calls of people that everything screwed up everything messed up and you you know you move in together and then he can't find a job and it's been a year and you're starting to pay his bills like it just gets real messy real fast and so from a relational and financial perspective the cleaner those lines can be honestly it's just it makes the process Smo smoother and it may not be like what everyone does or, you know, fill in the blank, but it does.
It just, it makes the process again from a relational and a financial perspective smoother. So no, I would not move out of your dad's place.
I think, you know, you probably have a great setup there. If you wanted to move out with your daughter and rent somewhere on your own, you could, but I would say, I would him move here figure out the job and the place to live and then um and that could all happen in a short period of time i mean he could get a job yeah he could get a job you could get engaged you could get married and rent an apartment and move out i mean that could all happen in the next nine months you know six months it could happen in one month it wasn't i mean if he got the job and moved up there and got married you know that doesn't have it doesn't require this lengthy right right uh uh process uh but but but no i would definitely not move out of your dad's place uh into an apartment with an unemployed guy who i'm not married to no that that just you know as rachel said that sounds like no fun at all there's nothing in there that sounds fun from an old dad perspective.
You know, I mean, really, that's just like, no, daughter, don't do that. So for your sake, for the sake of your kid, you just went through hell with a divorce.
I mean, come on. So last thing we want to do is sign up.
Let's just say, all right, get a job, get engaged, get married. And that can all happen in, you know, a 10-day period of time.
I don't care. Get out of an apartment and move in that it's just line the dominoes up and push them down you know that's but yeah there's um and i appreciate he doesn't want to come back there until he has something to come back to job wise sure that's responsible on his part so very very good stuff open phones here at 888-8255225.
Rachel Cruz, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host. George Camel and I did the first night of the Investing Essentials last night, if you're listening to this live.
I heard it went great. I heard it was a great night.
George did an amazing job. The other guy, I don't know.
I don't know. He's still out.
He's struggling. They'll put a survey out to the audience and let them grade.
They will? Okay, good. I'll feel better when I don't look at that.
Okay. So last night was night one of our virtual event, Investing Essentials.
We covered all investing principles. We went deep into the mutual fund discussion, talked about all the traps and the bad stuff.
Tonight we're going to do, and it's primarily me tonight, I'm going to open my playbook on real estate.

And here's how I decide to buy a piece of real estate.

Here's what I want it to look like.

And if you're wanting to learn how to invest in real estate, we're going to go into more detail than you would want.

I'm going to nerd out. We're going to unpack all the math formulas.
We're going to show you how it's really done in the big leagues and not on Tic Tac. And so the guys on Tic Tac.
And I would say, if people didn't know, a little insight, if you weren't doing what you're doing, you'd be in real estate full time. It's what you were doing before you were doing this.
But you like real estate's your next love. You love all of this.
Yeah. But your next love is, I mean, you.
Oh, I've got a degree in real estate. I had an hour meeting with your husband who runs our real estate today.
We're looking at a piece of ground to develop right now. I mean, I had an hour meeting on it this morning.
I love it. He'll say my favorite Dave is real estate, Dave.
He just gets like real, like he gets excited about it. You love it.
And so you're the best. You're one of the best teachers on the planet for it so it's fantastic and we actually do it it's not theory so we own about 600 million worth so if you want to talk about real estate we're going to do that tonight go to ramsey solutions.com tickets are 199 and uh slash events at ramsey solutions.com get your ticket join us this evening uh if you're late hearing this there might be a way for you to do it anyway't know.
Figure all that out, but we're going to put the material out there so you guys can get helped. This is the Ramsey show.
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Give them a call at 800-356-4282. Rachel Cruz, Ramsey personality, number one bestselling author, is my co-host today.
Shante is in Atlanta. Hi, Shante.
How are you? I'm doing well. How are you doing? Better than I deserve.
What's up in your world? Okay, sir. About a year ago, my daughter was killed in a murder-suicide by her husband.
Whoa. I'm going to try to get through this.
Oh, I'm so sorry. Wow.
I have custody of my grandchildren. They left three children.
One he had from a previous marriage, but I have two, which was theirs. Because of this, they have a house in Texas.
I've been paying on this house for almost a year. I'm trying to figure out if I should keep paying for it because it has to go through probate or continue to take care of

myself and pay off my debt, which I have a student loan that is about $80,000, but I had to put that on pause in order to take care of this house. What is the house worth? Well, according to a young man I had to go evaluate it, it has a little over $100,000 in equity, $100,000 to $130,000 in equity.
Why is the probate not clear a year later in Texas? Well, I believe that's my fault because I'm living here in atlanta and the house is in texas so i had to travel back and forth of course to take care of things there and the babies are with you it was hard to find a lawyer the babies are with you now and um in atlanta right yes okay it was hard to find a lawyer. Well, $100,000 is a great part-time job.
Sir? I said, making $100,000 for your new part-time job called getting this house probated and sold, that's a nice part-time job, $100,000. I'm already $20,000 in, and I'm getting nervous.
You're're missing my point if you sell the house you get a hundred thousand dollars in your pockets what you told me right yes ain't nothing else you're doing gonna pay you that so i'm gonna make this a priority you're twenty thousand dollars in meaning from lawyer fees travel all of you're saying, and you're like, I'm nervous. No, she's not.
You've been paying the payment. Taking care of the house, making sure it stays secure.
Yeah, you need to go. Do you have any time off available from work, or have you used it all up with this tragedy? Okay.
I'm also a caretaker for my mother-in-law so i'm home so i have so you're married yes sir okay listen to me if i wave a hundred thousand dollar check under your nose and say go get it that's where you're sitting you need to go get the hundred thousand dollars which means you need to prioritize and say someone else take care of-in-law for a week. I'm going to haul my butt over to Texas, get a lawyer, get this thing run through probate, get it on the market with a real estate agent, get it sold, put $100,000 in my pocket for the good of you, your family, and these babies.
Okay. May I say something else, sir? Sure.
Okay. So when it goes through probate, a lot of the fees will eat into that.
Am I correct? There's not any big fees in probate in Texas. Okay.
No big deal. Okay.
It's a few hundred dollars to get a lawyer and get the thing before the judge. Tell the lawyer to tell the judge the story.
This is a tragedy. These children, these babies are dependent upon this asset to take care of them with their granny who's taken them in.
We need to fast track this thing right down the rails, judge, and the judge will go, oh yeah, I'm going to take care of this one. This one ain't dragging out.
Stamp, stamp, stamp, boom. House is on the market and you're out of here.
Texas is not a difficult state. Okay.
I mean, I've called like 10 lawyers. Hopefully I found one.
Hopefully I have not paid the fees. Okay, here's what I want you to do.
Let's stop. Let me help you.
I'll guide you through it. But what I need you to do is make this a huge priority.
If I told you I would hire you for one week and pay you $100,000

and you had to go to Texas for one week, you would go do that.

Yes, sir.

That's what's in front of you, okay?

So I want you to go to RamseySolutions.com.

I want you to find one of our ELPs for real estate,

our Ramsey Trusted Real Estate ELPs. What city in Texas is this? It's a city called Temple, Texas.
All right. And what's that outside of? I believe, oh, my gosh.
What's it close to? Because I don't know that one. Baleen, Texas.
What? Austin. Austin.
I mean, Austin is like an hour and a half away. Okay.
All right. So I want you to get a, one of the Ramsey trusted real estate agents.
I want you to get on the phone with them today. I want you to ask them to help you find a probate attorney.
Tell them this story. They will help you run, run this to ground.
They can help you find an attorney. You can get on the phone with an attorney and the real estate agent will help you if you're going to list the house with them, right?

Yes. And they'll know somebody in the area, and they'll know an attorney that does probate work, and the probate attorneys know the judge in probate.
They can pick up the phone and call the judge and go, look, here's what we got. We got these two babies in a murder-suicide, horrible situation.
And when these babies are about to lose their only asset, we don't get this done because granny lives over in atlanta and can't get this household judge we need a little help and boom we're gonna get this thing done girl well thank you dave i hope so you know you you're gonna get it done i'm saying you you're gonna lean into it this is your new part-time job that pays a hundred thousand dollars this is your part-time job that pays a hundred thousand dollars and this is more important than taking care of your mother-in-law for the next week when you say when you believe me i've been there five times trying to get this done yeah so what so i'm curious what the what you said i you know i've been trying you've you've been down there. What holdups are you finding?

Like, what are they telling you?

Trying to find, trying to find them.

I believe I found a lawyer finally.

I paid the fees.

I haven't heard from them yet, unfortunately.

I don't know what's been done.

How long ago was this? Right.

About a month ago. Your job's called them every day till they get their finger out of their ear okay yeah okay this is like my tent lawyer i'm telling you i've been trying okay all right you hang on or you jump on ramsey solutions i'm sorry and get a hold of one of the real estate agents to see if you can get some help over there.
Because the thing is,

you're... Ramsey solutions, I'm sorry, and get a hold of one of the real estate agents to see if you can get some help over there.
Um, cause, um, the thing is your job is put pressure, heavy pressure on this

whole situation so that it spits out a hundred thousand dollar check and you've kind of hit or

miss. Well, the lawyer didn't do it.
And well, I did it a month ago and I hadn't followed up.

So you're not putting the pressure on. I want you to put the pressure on be mama bear i want you to lean in and take care of this situation and um which too you've got to you too i mean this happened a year ago i'm like you're probably coming out of this fog i mean i can't even imagine i can't imagine how how much pain is involved i mean it's just yeah i like this.
There's so, there's so much, but I hope this call for you gave you more of the confidence and the motivation to say, okay, I am doing the right thing and push forward. Because sometimes, and I could feel this, like you hear probate, I mean, it's a very intimidating idea.
If you don't deal with lawyers and you don't deal with judges on a regular basis, regular basis right i'm like there's a level where this can feel very intimidating and you almost can outsource it which i think is what she's done she's yielded a lot to these lawyers but what you're giving her the permission and the mandate is to be like you can you can not that you can quote unquote do more but like you can step into this role with more aggression and that's and you should most lawyers need desperately need someone to tell them what to do often often and that's like my goal in life is to tell lawyers what to do often you need to boss them around they're not used to it and it's really good for them when somebody finally does it so and it's good for you because this needs to get done. This needs to get done because you're paying a payment, that thing's sitting there eating you alive instead of blessing you.
And when it's eating you alive, it's affecting these babies instead of blessing them. This $100,000 would go a long way to take care of your family and therefore you being able to take care of these babies.
I'm so sorry you all have been through this, Shanta. It's horrible.
But get one of the real estate agents over in the area to help you run point on this and then you lean into it. Growl, mama bear.
Go get them. There's a hundred thousand dollar check laying there.
Don't let anybody keep you from it. Go get it.
Go get it. Don't walk away from this.
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Okay, this is a funny one. I just read it.
Today's question comes from Steve in Indiana. Would your snowball plan help get America out of 36 trillion dollars of debt? And how would you budget it? I wish Trump had you on the Doge team.
Yeah no I don't fit in with people that do stuff. No I don't fit in in anything in DC.
It is kind of fun to watch them take a machete to the ridiculous spending. You don't have to be of any political ilk to think that you know machetes to the ridiculous spending are necessary.
This is out of control.

For sure, I mean, it's a funny question, but the truth is that running a government of any size, the state of Tennessee, for instance, the last several governors I've been friends with, and it's a different endeavor to run something like that than to run a business or run your personal account. The principle of being debt-free still stands.
And it's a good principle. And the principle of living on less than you make still stands.
And the principle of good management or good frugality still stands. So, I mean, I can give you an opinion, but it's probably worth exactly what you paid for.

I observed under, for instance, Bill Clinton was the last president that had a balanced budget that we actually did not run.

I mean, he did it.

Some say that he did some of that off of, I mean, the tax code that was in place at that point was put in place by reagan um and so uh the lowered taxes the laugher curve art laugher famous for was the reagan stuff all the way through wasn't bush one and then clinton yeah yeah but the um it was but I mean, H, you know, was running the same camp, was running the same day, except he raised taxes on one thing. Yeah.
And that got him baked. But the, anyway, politically.
But the point being that there's really good evidence that the Laffer curve is true. Art Laffer has the, is known for the theory of, to a certain degree, as you lower taxes, the economy heats up because the people that are making money are putting money back into their businesses, and they make yet more money, and they pay yet more taxes, even though the rate is lower.
Now, there's a point of diminishing returns on the curve. It is a curve.
It's not a straight line. But if you lower taxes, it heats up the economy and you end up collecting more revenue.
So if you want to increase the federal government's income from taxes, income

tax, then you would, oddly enough, lower taxes. It seems oxymoronic.
It actually does work.

And so if you want to get out of debt, one of the things we tell you to do is get an extra job, right? I mean, increase your income to get out of debt. So that would be part of the equation.
Let's increase the income of the United States of America by increasing the revenues produced by the tax system by, oddly enough, lowering the tax rates to cause that to happen and stimulate the economy. And that does work.
And I mean, people that have studied John Maynard Keynes and are socialists, which John Maynard Keynes was a socialist, Keynesian economics are taught in almost every economics class in professor land out there. But I'm not a believer.
I'm an Adam Smith guy. I'm a free market guy.
And I really do understand this stuff. So anyway, all that to say, you would increase the income.
And then of course, you would do what Doge is doing. You cut the snot out of the expenses.
So if you could ever get it right side up, where there was more income than outgo, in other words, there is no deficit. Yeah.
Not only is there no, because deficit means you're going in the hole every month and if you you got to turn that to get out of debt right and then could you start to pay off the debt absolutely you could and and what's weird is the way that stuff works on a governmental level it would happen it would be really quick because of the way the thing would feed on itself because the other thing that's tied into this is there's what's called monetary policy meaning that when the government takes a trillion dollars out of the economy by borrowing it by issuing bonds to cover the deficit that trillion dollars is not out there running around in the economy to stimulate the economy. So when the government runs debt, it sucks the bone marrow out of the economy because it drops currency down.
The amount of money that's moving around is shortened considerably. And when you start putting all that back, or when you just stop some bone marrow out, and then on top of that, you start putting some back, you know, the thing could really heat up and the revenues could go through the roof.
It could be rowdy. And so that's one set of theories that gets you there.
But this is the first time in my lifetime that i've seen anyone that had the political uh uh didn't give a crap the political don't give a crap in order to just walk in there with an axe and a machete and just start chopping down everything in sight and it's um i i didn't know if i'd ever see it you it truly had to be somebody that didn't care because he can't because he can't be elected again so if you don't like it screw you you know and it's like it had to be somebody doing that because if anybody cares about being re-elected then you know every little person you piss off by cutting one of these programs is a voter and you start worrying about being reelected or not. But when you truly reach the point of I don't give a crap, and apparently that's where this bunch is.
I mean, it's interesting to watch. And by the way, that's also the thing that happens with individuals.
You guys out there, when you guys get out of debt, you reach a point you don't care what your brother-in-law's opinion is about what you drive, because he ain't paying the payments anyway. And he doesn doesn't get a vote and so you're going to go do radical stuff to get your life back and get out of debt and there is some correlation to this sure sure and that it's it's interesting it's an interesting discussion sure has got people uh 44 days 44 days he's been office this is it's wild it's just wild it's it's entertaining his longest day of the union ever last night francisco is in des moines iowa hi francisco how are you hey mr amsey thank you for taking my call sure what's up hey so i have a question regarding a possible uh job change so where i'm at i currently make about about $128,000 per year.
I commute to work, so that translates to about $400 to $450 per month in gas, and my insurance is pretty expensive where I'm at right now. The job offer that I got is where I live in town, and I would be saving an additional $750 per month.
my question is, is that enough to, I guess, warrant the job change? Um, me and my wife are currently on baby step number three. You're making more money.
If you're making more money and it's closer to home, what's the downside? Uh, the downside is, um, as a body auto body tech, uh, work is pretty inconsistent here in town but where i'm at it's like it's never dipped down so that's the only thing that's kind of worrying me is like the the possible steady ruining ruining ruining possible steady flow of income so you get paid by uh the job by the hour not by so this might not be a raise uh actually it is a two dollar uh increase i know but if you get less work the two dollars doesn't matter exactly that's kind of my concern have you asked around what people are getting i mean do you have a ballpark of like yeah this seems realistic to be high months, then there's going to be low months, but do you have a middle ground at all from other people in the field? No, no, I don't really. How many people is this place you're talking about going to employ in your position? There's two other techs there.
Are they staying busy? They're kind of, for them, yes. When I talk to the general manager manager they're looking for someone that kind of can put out more volume because the techs they have right now are kind of just um yeah but is he gonna is he promising you're gonna stay busy uh he promised me that i was gonna stay busy he just didn't say for how long yeah just just tell him uh that he has to guarantee you financially that if we're not busy you're're paying me anyway.
And that takes the risk out of it. Negotiate a different deal with a potential employer.
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Rachel Cruz, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today. Megan is with us in Orlando.

Hi, Megan. Welcome to The Ramsey Show.

Hi, Dave. Thank to the Ramsey Show.

Hi, Dave.

Thank you for taking my call.

Sure.

What's up?

So I've kind of gotten myself or my life into a big mess, and I stumbled across your show, and I'm trying to take steps to get out. Um, so I guess I would be in baby step too.
Um, yes. Um, the problem I'm running into is before I came across your show, um, me and my fiance, I was, I was really big on trying to get us to kind of put our money together and kind of tackle this together.
Now that I've kind of came across that,

I've kind of came across that, I learned it's a big no-no to put your money together before you are married. And I am the breadwinner of our house.
We have 10 people in my home. So between we have five children and then I just adopted my nephew and I have his big brother at my house too.
So I'm feeling all of this pressure. I work two full-time jobs, and I'm just trying to get control.
He works a full-time job at the hospital working on hospital equipment. What does he earn? He annually probably about 50.
And what do you earn? I want to say when I looked at his. Last year I made 160.
Doing what now? What do you do? I'm an ultrasound technician. You're working a lot then.
Yeah, I do full-time nights, and then I take calls full-time days. So I pretty much do 24-hour shifts.
so the two of you, and the two of you have five children? I had two from a previous marriage. Well, not marriage, just relationship.
And then I put myself through school as a single mom, and then I got my career. Then I met him, and we got pregnant quickly.
And then since then, we've been together for six years.

Okay.

And you guys have three kids together?

And he's your fiancé.

And when are you planning to get married?

Well, at first, we put it on hold because my father fell ill and I was his caretaker.

And then we just haven't done it.

One, finances. I felt like it was silly to spend money for a wedding.
Well, let me ask you this. I'm just curious, and I'm not trying to be sarcastic or anything, but you're functioning in every way almost as if you're married now and have been for some time.
So what's the difference in that and getting married this weekend for $50? I'm scared because my children. What are you scared of? You already have children.
You live together. You support him.
What is there to be scared of? My child from another relationship and my nephew that I just got custody of, they're not big fans of him. They're not what? Big fans of him.
Yeah, I feel like there's red flags. They don't like him.
They think I deserve better. Six years.
Yeah. Two children.
Too late to ask some child their opinion of this guy yeah they don't get a vote we're in we're in we're in therapy together working on some relational issues do you feel like you'll be with him long term i mean do you want to marry him um i mean most of the time i i do feel like that but it's more like we we go through the motions of raising our kids so sometimes i wonder like once the kids are grown up the longevity if that makes sense sometimes it feels like we're in this you guys you guys are fabulous can kickers you've kicked the can kick the can kick the can kick the can put it off kick the can put it off all these reasons and and then still functioning as if you're married and the reason i'm bringing all this up is it's not working for you i'm listening to you and there's no fun in your voice at all i think there's just a lot of fear and i tell a lot of pressure because he's coming to me now, and he's like, okay, let's put our money together, and I'm like, we're not married.

No, we're going to get married is what we're going to do, or we're not going to put our money together, and also, you know, if I woke up in your shoes, what would I do? That's how I answer questions here, okay? so my friend Henry Cloud

is a famous psychologist

and

he wrote a book called

Necessary Endings

and he wrote a book called Necessary Endings. And he says you end any relationship, whether it's your job, whether it's contact with an extended family who's toxic, whether it's a situation like you're in, whatever the relationship is, you end it only when you lose hope that it can get better and be right.
Does that make sense? And so I'm not going to be sitting here this time next year if I'm you in this exact same quandary wondering if this is going to be okay. We're going to get in there with this therapist and go, look, we're going to walk around this really, really hard for 90 days, and we're going to see some serious progress, or I'm going to call this.
Yeah. That scares you even more, doesn't it? It scares me because of the children.
I don't want a broken home just because we're not.

But you need to decide, don't you?

This painter, get off the ladder, right?

Yeah.

Because you don't think the kids are suffering in this situation?

Of course they're suffering.

They're suffering from all this ambiguity.

They don't know what the flip's going on

because their mom doesn't know what the flip's going on,

and their dad doesn't know what the flip's going on,

and we're all just running around in circles

trying to make enough money and throw it in the middle of a pot and we're running a little commune over here and it's not working relationally am i missing something i think i'm i'm just afraid to get married and then he's you're afraid of not getting married you're afraid of getting married yeah i just want to take care of my family and i think you know but here's the thing financial wise it makes sense for us to get married but no personal no it doesn't not not if you're not if you're not going to be married because divorces i mean marriage is grand divorce is 50 grand no we don't go through that um yeah the uh so but you guys relationally need to make a decision okay are we the two adults in the household going to join forces and then take care of the little people or are we is it best for us and the little people to be separate but if we're going to join forces we need to get six years and you guys are dancing and dancing and dancing and dancing and dancing it's you know because the other thing is you put all of your financial dreams and everything on hold in the process too. It's very difficult to make progress mathematically in this situation.
Yes. And that's why I'm struggling with that.
That's what actually prompted your call. And then I got all Papa Dave on you.
Yeah. I just downloaded the Every Dollar app which is it's tough for me because my income fluctuates so i'm struggling you'll be able to do that really really easy when the two of you are married you can put a hundred two hundred ten thousand dollars in that puppy and start crunching through this stuff and you and him are on the same page and two grown-ups are running this house not the kids the kids don't get a vote yeah well it's new for me because he's never wanted to put our money together it's always just been very separate you don't want to put your money together until you're married but you guys have got to make a decision about this marriage you either need to make a decision we're going to start working very hard on the relationship and by this point and that's For marriage to be the outcome.
The marriage is the outcome. Or we're going to start working very hard on the relationship.
And by this point, and that's just a- For marriage to be the outcome. Yeah, the marriage is the outcome.
Or we're going to call this. We're going to break this thing up.
We're going to drop a grenade in the middle of it. Because what you're doing, you're telling us.
We're not telling you. You're telling us.
The way you're doing life right now doesn't work. I'm afraid to get married.
I'm afraid to break up the house. I'm afraid I can't get traction with the money.
I can't get control. This is what you called us and started saying.
I'm just repeating it back to you. And so you can't keep doing the same thing over and over again and expect a different result.
That's the definition of insanity, right? Yes. So that's what you're going to do.
I'm going to beg you as my new friend that I love for the sake of you, for the sake of him, for the sake of these kids, you two need to look at each other and look at this therapist and go, okay, we're going to make a decision. And in the next 90 or 120 days, we're going to see such significant progress in this relationship that it's not perfect.
There's always going to be some fear. Yeah.
That's normal. But we're seeing progress to where we have hope enough that we can call this what it is, a marriage.
Yeah. And then you put yourselves together, and then you start managing those little people and you start managing those dollars and it all

starts coming together in a much cleaner way but this you run around trying to mother hen everything from the outside with no connectivity doesn't work and no you don't combine your money with him until you're married this is the ramsey show what does the future hold for business ask nine experts and you'll get 10 different answers. Economic growth or a recession.
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Open phones at 888-825-5225 jim is with us in houston texas hi jim welcome to the ramsey show hello i'm honored you're taking the time to help me and millions of others with our money questions well thank you thank you how can we help i am a 40-year-old widower and ready to date again. However, my truck is 25 years old, and I perceive the ladies I want to date will judge me based on the vehicle I drive.

It shouldn't matter, but as a guy of average height and average appearance, I don't have the charisma to overcome a poor first impression.

The question is, should I spend $5,000 to $ ten thousand dollars to buy a car for the sole purpose of dating to find my future wife? Wow. There's a lot going on here.
Jim, oh my gosh, I cannot wait to talk about this. It's a great question.
It's a great question. Okay.
Jim, where are you at financially? No debt, no mortgage, no kids. No debt, no mortgage, no kids.
What's your net worth? 1.3. What do you make? $132,000.
Regardless of women, you should get a better car. Oh, okay.
Your car sucks. You're a multimillionaire.
Go get you a dadgum car, son. Oh, okay.
And then the women is a different issue, but yeah, I mean, really, you got a million dollars. You don't drive a 25 year old pickup truck.
I mean, you can, but there's no point in it. Um, and so go get a better car, but I would not ever purchase a car to attract a lady

because you're trying to attract the wrong kind of woman at that point.

You don't want a woman who comes to you for the car.

Correct.

Not a good connection.

So, no, I mean, we want her to love the gym that Rachel and I i already love dude you're a great guy one person i just don't know who that is yet no it's okay you don't have to if you impress them with the car it's the wrong woman have you had dates jim and you've got shallow woman and you've gotten feedback about it i'm just curious what's causing you to think it's the truck i have been on a second date that was going i thought very well

the conversation was good and when we walked out to the parking lot she said oh you're driving that and i never heard from her again but she doesn't now i try and i hide the truck on the other side of the parking lot i'll walk her to her car leave but hey listen that that's a good thing that you ran that one off. Okay, can I say this? I mean, seriously, do you want to marry somebody who judges you by your...
No, no, no. This is a shallow chick.
Excuse me, let the woman talk for a second. Have at it, woman.
Here's what I would say, though, Jim. Not that it's shallow, but you would wonder out of curiosity, like, oh my gosh, am I going to have to be the one that keeps this household afloat if it goes in the future? Like if she doesn't know your financial state, again, it's not a judgment on just like the car itself because there needs to be more conversation.
But I would think as a woman, though, I'm like, I don't know. Am I going to have to be the breadwinner for you know what I mean like a level of are we gonna be on food stamps because he drives this truck that's the question I don't know yeah I mean like so the first impression thing again it's not for a shallow purposes but for her to know like no you from it you're responsible and you you know all of these line up oh then I don't care what kind of car you drive i just know the man that i'm marrying i'm entering into a relationship with that i'm not having to be the one to like hold us up financially right if you go to branson missouri and you were to visit the walmart museum on the square in branson missouri one of the things that's in there is sam walton's ancient pickup truck

that the billionaire drove to work every week which is and if you walk off from him because

he drives that pickup truck you would be known as a financial moron i mean seriously i know i'm not

honestly i'm not saying not to date someone that has a crappy car it's not that it's just to know

that like oh yeah you you are a guy that can you know hold you know hold life on his own like that's

Thank you. saying not to date someone that has a crappy car.
It's not that. It's just to know that like, oh yeah, you are a guy that can hold life on his own.
And you really do, Jim, because of where you are financially. I'm not saying to go buy a new truck for those purposes.
I'm just giving another

perspective to think, oh my gosh, is he doing anything with his life, right? I'm not saying that you're not jim does that make sense anyone am i making sense or am i sounding shallow i'd rather have the opportunity to evaluate her character directly than she dismissed me based on a hundred percent and if she's willing to dismiss you without learning more about your character based on the truck this is not marriage material i agree you know send her back to the digital thing that she came from that's all good you know go away chick and that that honestly you dodged a bullet the digital thing she came dodged a dating app you dodged a bullet okay so but all that anyway all that aside i think you ought to go get a better car for you okay for you and you could drive the pickup all you want to drive it but i think you ought to have a better car in the driveway for you you've earned it you do not have to drive a piece of crap anymore you live like no one else and now you can live like no one else right with the status symbol of choice a bmw no that no that's not the status symbol of choice the status symbol of choice was a paid off mortgage which jim you've done taking the place of the bmw but go get a better car i'm not saying you have to go spend a hundred thousand dollars on a car but i mean you're driving a fifteen hundred dollar truck i mean be very content he may be fine he ought to get a better car's Sam Walton. I tell these people all the time to get a better car.
But I wouldn't do it. I would never do that to attract.
The kind of woman you get, the kind of person, woman or man, if you're in a dating relationship that you attract based on your positions is not marriage material. Agreed.
He looked at me again. I agree.
I was arguing. I don't know what this whole other thing you did a while ago was but yeah it was just to just to know like okay i'm not having to be the breadwinner right i'm like i don't know i don't want to be on food stamps i don't want someone that's like yeah that's like not working but at least ask at least ask a question instead of saying see ya a hundred percent agree i know so you're driving this truck because you're a billionaire or you're driving this truck because you're poor and don't work much? Exactly.
Well, it's just the idea of like, I don't know. I don't have to like.
You could ask a question. Yeah.
I don't know. He's 40 years old.
Jim, I'm rooting for you. You're a great guy.
And I hope this call, I'm going to just pray this over the, over the internets that this call call maybe some lady's like, Jim, I'm interested. There you go.
If you are. Houston's a little town.
Shouldn't be hard to find. You look for the old truck.
Look for the old truck in Houston, Texas, Jim. Like there's no old trucks in Houston, Texas.
There's not a chance you're going to find out. I just appreciate.
I appreciate him. That's I appreciate him and I really do and I'm sorry you're a widow or two whatever that story was I hope nothing but the best Jim I'm cheering you on yeah me too I hope you find a great lady out there me too we should do a Ramsey dating app no no it No.
It would end up like this call. Terrible advice.
Bad advice from both of us. I think so.
We flunked that one. That wasn't our best call, Meredith.
Hey, it's worth what you pay for it, baby. This is the Ramsey Show.
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Amy's in New York City. Hi, Amy.
Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Thank you for taking my call, Mr.
Ramsey. Sure.
I am 55 years old. In a divorce settlement, I got a simple IRA of $1.2 million.
I cannot work due to some health issues. My concern is I'm concerned about my burn rate and ways to mitigate my taxes.
I know I'm getting a 10% early withdrawal fee because of my age and, of course, income tax. I'm not sure what to do.
You said you're not able to work because of your health? Yes, I have some cognitive issues that I'm not getting hired. Okay.
And this is your only asset, your only source of income? Correct. I have no debts, and I have no assets.
Wow. Okay.
And why New York City? Well, when I got the settlement, I decided to work on my bucket list. So I did a couple things like jump out of an airplane and move to New York City.
And then I started looking at my bucket list is both Dave. Dave likes to jump out of airplanes and I love New York City.
So you check and check. So I'm living my life.
I really do love it. And then I sort of went, wait a minute, minute i need to make this last another 20 30 years and then realize that's probably not going to happen the way i'm going through with my burn rate the reason i asked is not because i hate new york city but because it's one of the most expensive cities in the world to live in and we're worried about a burn rate so those two things don't go together that's what was running through my head so um uh you know i'm probably going to locate somewhere near people i love and frequently visit new york city rather than try to live there that would be probably half as expensive you're quite right that's an idea okay that's going to affect your burn rate there is i i don't know of a i mean do you have a good financial advisor in your corner um i have someone who's managing the ira but not a financial advisor no i feel like i want like a tax strategist.
Well, there's not. Financial advisors.
Go ahead. Go ahead.
Financial advisors want to make me save enough money, so I'll have $1.2 million when I'm 100 years old and in a nursing home, and I don't want that. I have no one to save my money for.
I want to be able to live my life now. I'm in.
I'm with you on that. So a good, the way we define a good financial advisor is not someone that tells you what to do, but someone that teaches you and then you can make good decisions.
So what you're calling us for is the same thing. You're calling us for good information.
Is there some way I can get at this money and lower my burn burn rate because i did do a little math here and this is not working and that's that's the essence of your question so um i am not aware um with your cognitive stuff there's no formal disability is there like you've not applied for ssi or something have you i have but with everything that going on, they say it's probably going to take a year or two years before everything might check out. Okay.
Well, you're talking about the upheaval with the Trump administration? No, this was even before. No, it doesn't take two years to get SSI approved.
Okay. Unless there's some, I mean, do you have good doctor's opinions and so forth to submit to prove disability, correct? Yes, I do.
Okay. There's just a long waiting period, I've been told.
There's no disability insurance anywhere in the whole mix of this discussion, right? No, I have to pay for my insurance. Yeah.
Okay. All right.
I didn't think so, but I'm just, I'm just fishing here. Okay.
So what I, what, what I want you to, I want you to go to Ramsey Solutions. I want you to check out the SmartVestor Pros, and these are investment advisors that we have vetted.
They have to have the heart of a teacher or they don't become one of the people that we put in the SmartVestor program, okay? They don't work for me and they don't work for you unless they teach you something and advise you rather than direct you. Yeah, I just had our meeting.
My husband and I meet with ours once a year and we just had ours yesterday. And I'll tell you, a great financial planner or, you know, someone walking beside you, an investment professional, their job is to help you live the way you want to live, Amy.
So, and how to do it responsibly. And they should have a basic knowledge, if not a pretty comprehensive knowledge on taxes as well.
Like they're going to see a holistic view of your life. And so a good, you know, someone that's on your side is going to hear you where you're not very risk averse.
You know, you're kind of like, yeah, I want to, I want to live and jump out of airplanes and like do it all. I don't want to die with that.
I need to get, I need to get you to 59 and a half with the laws that I understand because that gets us past the 10% hit. All of that, yes.
But you are going to get taxes on whatever you pull out. Income tax, there's no avoiding that.
No, but I'm just saying a good financial planner is going to look at all of that, know the ins and outs of it. They're going to be able to run a pro forma and be able to say, okay, here's this, this, and this, and this throughout the years.
I mean, you're going to get a detailed plan with this person, and that's what you need. Right now, you don't, right? I mean, it's a little bit kind of all up in the air.
If you had a gross income of $130,000 a year,

my. And that's what you need.
Right now you don't, right? I mean, it's a little bit kind of all up in the air. If you had a gross income of $130,000 a year minus taxes, could you live on that and do your dream? Minus taxes, taxes, that would put me more than 22%? No, it would put you down about $80,000, $75,000, $80,000 take-home pay.

It would be tight, but yes.

Probably not New York City.

Yeah, probably not.

Probably not.

Probably visiting New York City, but not living there. Okay, but see, that's once you get to $59,500.

Because if you can produce 10% on 1.2 in good mutual funds, which I know you can do, then that's $120,000 a year,

okay, minus taxes. And it is taxable.
You're not going to get away from that. This is a taxable event.
And then if you said also, okay, I'm going to plan out, I'm 55, I'm going to plan to be broke at 90 okay and so i'm gonna i'm gonna let i'm gonna set up a 120 000 minus taxes plus a burn rate to hit me at zero at 90 then you know there's a formula that you can put in a calculator and do that um but it sounds like i don't know what this money's invested in but if it's producing north of 10%, you know, you should be able without

even touching the nest egg to bring that 10% out every year. You follow me? Yes.
And that's the

kind of thing I want to start looking at. And then I've got a 10% penalty from 50 to 5 to 59 and a

half, and I've got my tax rate, and that's going to erode this nest egg a little bit at a time.

But I think you've been spending 200 a year, right?

That's correct, yeah.

Okay, and you're right.

I was guessing, but you're right.

You can't do that mathematically

because you're going to end up on Alpo at some point in the story rice beans yes yeah yeah well no dog food is what i was talking about but yeah the you know so we don't want to do that we don't want to do that so yeah let's i do think you've got a doable situation um because what happened it sounds to me like is you know you went through this divorce and you've got these cognitive things that you're dealing with and you said, all right, I'm doing the bucket list, screw it. And you kind of got some of that in the last 18, 24 months in the rear view mirror.
And now you're kind of going, okay, now I got to get real about this. Did I understand? Is that, is that what happened? Yes.
Okay. Yeah.
I think. I think you're ready to sit down with somebody and not end up with 1.2 million when you die, but also, but you know, let's use some of it and hit the bucket list, but let's not have the burn rate, as you said.
And if you can jump on that disability too and get some income coming in, if you can get that SSI through, and maybe a SmartVestor Pro can help you run that SSI through. If you happen to run into somebody who's got a little bit of knowledge on that, that's helpful.
So, anyway, hit the Ramsey Solutions website. Find somebody to sit down with that's got the heart of a teacher to help you, as Rachel said, live your proposed life, not theirs.
This is The Ramsey Show. Listen, I know a lot of you would rather watch paint dry in slow motion than file your taxes.
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That's RamseySolutions.com slash SmartTax. In the lobby of Ramsey Solutions on the debt-free stage, Philip and Heidi are with us.
Hey, Philip and Heidi, how are you? Hi, good, are you? Doing terrific. Welcome.
Where do you guys live? Indianapolis. All right, very fun.
Welcome to Nashville. Thank you.
And how much debt have you two paid off? $300,000. Whoa! A little change.
There you go. How long did it take to pay off $300,000? Long six years.

Yeah.

Wow.

And your range of income during that time?

We started at right around $100,000, and then we had the numbers there for 23, and it was

like 219 at the end of 23, and then I finally did the taxes last week.

We made it over 250.

All right.

Wow.

What do y'all do for a living?

I'm a physician assistant.

I'm a nurse practitioner.

Ah, okay.

A couple of medical folks.

I was going to say $300,000 might be a mortgage,

but it could be student loans.

It is exactly student loans.

It's all student loans.

Wow, you had a mortgage worth of student loans.

We had a mortgage.

Wow.

Yeah, more in student loans than we do in the house. Yeah.
Very much. Wow.
But you're out. We're out.
You're done. We're done.
And now you're making a quarter million a year between the two of you. So hello.
Okay. That's a good thing.
Wow. Congratulations.
All right. What started this whole journey? Tell us about six years ago.
So six years ago, we actually went through Financial Peace University with one of our older churches, and then we moved to the Indianapolis area and got involved with our church now and decided that after Phil was done with school, that we were just going to pay it off and just get it done and be rid of it. And through lots and lots of hard work, we started with the envelope system and then went to the every dollar app yeah so we just in little bit by little bit and we got it done well congratulations that's a lot yeah i mean this is like a lot of money yeah wow i mean when you sat down and looked at that you went 300 000 in student loan debt you had to have an oh crap moment yes we.
We started off with little thermometers that we made because I was raised by two teachers. So I need very visual aid kind of person.
And so we started having these thermometers of like coloring it. And after six pages of thermometers, we stopped that.
It was a little overwhelming. So much.
So much going on. Oh man.
Okay. So during this time, because six years, I mean, that's a marathon, right? I mean, we, you know, two years is usually kind of average with consumer debt.
So people that do mostly student loans, we see that it's kind of the long game, right? So what was the hardest part in six years? I know you guys are, we're probably tired. I mean, I know you probably hit a wall at certain points thinking, oh my gosh, we're still in this.
I feel we hit two walls yeah we have two kids yeah oh so we had two wall tickets so thing one and thing two and thing two and you know it it was funny uh like our oldest is six surprisingly we started hanging off it's like oh hey we're pregnant yeah um our oldest is six and our youngest is three and both of them started out lives with a little bit of medical debt. You know, just they're great now.
Everything's wonderful. But, you know, keeping tithing, keeping everything saving, but also paying off debt as fast as we could, making sure they were OK.
Those those were some hard times of making sure that we stayed within budget, but still were able to connect with the boys, but also connect each other and pay off debt as fast as we could was a huge priority so the two walls were amazing we love the walls but we love them but they came they came strong yes yeah I mean that's a big deal though for real I mean like anyone that has a baby like you're like it's a it's a life-changing event let alone two happening during a process like this so kudos to you you guys. Thanks.
That's great. So great.
So which of the six years did you make the most progress? The most progress? Probably the single biggest year was last year in 24. Just because the income went up? Income went up and there were some changes with some pay time off with work and all that, that they ended up cashing out both of ours.
So we had like two extra months worth of income just come in PTO and they switched over to a different plan. So didn't lose out on any available time off for us.
So that was a big one because yeah, our final payment was like $46,000 and change that we just did all at once. that was a really rough two weeks of just like no one can get sick no one can get injured everyone has to be very cool for these two weeks until we get everybody hold your breath hold your breath hold your breath here we go yeah i got the uh i i definitely see the math part of that i'm wondering was your intensity up because you could see the finish line? Yes.
Absolutely. Yeah.
I mean, we were saying for the last couple of years, this is finally going to be the year, but there is something different coming into 24. Like this is finally going to be time for this to happen.
So, and I knew I was going to have to cash out some PTO to make that goal by the end of 24 but i didn't know it was going to take all of my pto and all of hers at the same time but ended up being that with the workings of everything else with work that if i had done it earlier in the year it wouldn't have worked out we had to wait on them to make the changes that we weren't in the place for them to even make those changes so god really worked it out for us yeah to make this come together at the end because when it all came in to the checking account it was less than 200 that was in the checking account can more than what we had left to pay it was a total god thing yeah we're done we can be done tonight but then we have 200 for the next two weeks that's right everybody yeah and merry christmas literally hold your breath and merry christmas by the way thing one and thing two we're out of debt yeah wow congratulations you guys so there's a um a 24 year old couple listening right now or a 26 year old couple listening and they just looked up and saw they've got $300,000 in debt talk to them tell them if it can be done what they should do it can always be done so I mean what what can't be done I think the other thing to remember is you know you the the phrase live like no one else you can live like no one that this is temporary, you know, $300,000 is overwhelming when you look at it on six different paperwork of thermometers. But that little bit by little bit, keeping each one that's slowly paid off, slowly paid off, it really does build that momentum of, oh, we're so close.
And, you know, like it sounds silly, but even going under 100,000, we're like, oh, we're under a hundred thousand. That's for so close.
Almost like, you know, a half marathon or when they're like, wild 10, you're almost done. You're like, no, I'm not.
So it was like that under that a hundred thousand mark was, is definitely a huge moment of, oh, we can, oh, we're so close. We are so close.
So yeah, I think just knowing that little momentums and having those little victories, and we have such a great support system with our families and our friends, and, you know, just a ton of support was huge with us. What was the hardest part? Probably just the length it took.
Yeah. Just staying focused for that long.
Yeah yeah and just how little progress was being made

early on yeah just knowing no just got to keep with it keep going was it worth it absolutely we we laugh we're like we've been like out of the my nervous phase for you know like a month of you know not everyone can breathe again and our three-year-old can be absolutely feral again and break any bone he wants. But it's one of those things where someone else is like, what are you going to do now? It's like, breathe.
We're just going to breathe for a minute, knowing that we can be done and start dreaming fun things again. And then now looking at our mortgage, it's like, oh yeah, we can do that.
Because it was less than our two loans. at that little thing look at that little mortgage yeah that's great it's all about perspective that's awesome yeah well done you guys thank you guys very proud of you that's a lot and you did it thank you amazing good stuff you changed your family tree we did absolutely you changed yourselves in the process the work that god did inside of you while you were doing this was pretty incredible.
Absolutely. You're different people than you were six years ago.
That is definitely true. Are the boys here? They are not.
No, they would be running around the studio probably hitting every corner that they could find. So especially our three-year-old.
It's going to be a peaceful debt-free scream for you. Having to juggle at all.
It is funny. our six-year-old will say you know like do we have do we have the do we have we call it the fun money you know like do we have the fun money this month to be able to do this because we would still do little things but yeah he would be like do we have the fun money this month it's like maybe next month that's right oh so great you guys way to go you guys philip and, Indianapolis, Indiana, $300,000 in student loans in six years, making, wow, $100,000 to $250,000.

Count it down.

Let's hear a debt-free scream.

One, two, three.

We're debt-free!

Yeah!

Oh, yeah, baby!

Woo-hoo-hoo-hoo. No feeling like freedom.
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Georgia is in Birmingham, Alabama.

Hi, Georgia.

How are you?

Hi, I'm good.

How are y'all?

Better than we deserve.

What's up in your world?

Well, I was actually calling because my husband is very obsessed with you in a good way. And big on living like no one else.
So later we can live like no one else. I've always admired and appreciated the dedication.
But lately, it's kind of taken an extreme turn and seems to be taking a toll on his mental health and quite honestly um mine as well lately so my question is how do you suggest finding a balance between financial responsibility and unhealthy fixation well we need dr john deloney i think i think i'm qualified for this I don't know. I mean, what in the world? How is his mental health slipping because he's extremely focused on a goal? That usually has the opposite effect of not mental health problems.
I understand. Exactly.
So it just seems to be the only thing that he can really think about and it seems

like he sees that we're in in his mind he thinks that our financial situation is like way worse or we're not where we should be in life right now even though in my opinion I think that we're you know in a good place okay how long have y'all been working on this? Probably recently, like the last two or three years. So for three years, he's been super intense.
Pretty intense. And what about you? She's tired.
Yeah, it has really been, like, I don't want to seem like I'm like, I'm grateful for his dedication and all the effort that he puts into it, but it starts to kind of make me feel like, should I be worried? Even though I don't feel like we should. Okay.
So the two of you sit down and do a budget following our stuff, right? We are on the every dollar budget. Okay.
So when you guys sit down and do that there's it's not a hopeful yay raw we're making progress instead it's a doom scroll it's more of like we should be doing more he feels like he's not doing enough um what what give me an example what he feels like i mean like you're you're like, I want to buy some food. And he's like, no, you can't have food.
Well, not to that extreme, but like if we do want to go out to dinner, it is still like, oh, we got to tighten up. We don't have any car payments.
We don't have any credit card debt. We don't have any student loans.

We've got over a hundred thousand in retirement.

What is it?

What is it?

You're, I'm sorry.

Do you, do you know what baby step you're on?

I do not.

Okay.

So you're really not plugged into all this stuff.

You're just watching him do it.

It's yeah.

It's gotten to the point where it's like, I kind of dread talking about it. it so are y'all are y'all out of debt except your house yes do you have an emergency fund of three to six months of expenses we do okay then that puts you on baby steps what we call four five and six which means you should move from we teach that you and if he listens thisently, he should know this, that you should move from intense to intentionality in baby steps four, five, and six.
Four is we're putting 15% of our income away for retirement. Five is we're addressing kids college.
And six is if we have any other money after we live our life, then we put that towards the mortgage because we want to get the mortgage paid off in the next five to 10 years. And that is not intent.
We teach and live like no one else. Don't go out to eat.
Don't go on vacation in the first three baby steps. And you're that's getting out of debt and having an emergency fund, not counting the house.
And you're past that. You should have moved from not going out to eat to going out to eat in your budget with no guilt.
Yes. That's our teaching.
Okay. So what we're saying is you guys got past the emergency stuff of getting out of debt and the emergency fund, and he refuses to take his foot off the gas.
Yes. Okay.
And he's obsessing over every little thing, and it's spinning him out is what it's doing. It really is, yeah.
It's stressing him out more than giving him freedom, yeah. Yeah.
Yes. Which is such an interesting, we talked about this on another show last week together, how money becomes an idol for so many people.
And some people it's the chase of more, more, more, nicer, nicer, nicer. But on the flip side, it becomes an idol in this case where you're so obsessed with it in a negative way that it's like literally eating into the quality of your life because it's all you're thinking about.
And that's not it should be there should be a lot more freedom um and so there's something in him yeah at the baby step that you're on he's doing it wrong if he's if he's that obsessed with our show and with what dave ramsey and rachel cruz teaches we don't teach what he's doing we tell you to be intentional I don't want you being wasteful on this, but it's not intense. Okay, the intensity is no going out to eat, beans and rice, rice and beans, no vacation until you get yourself out of debt and accept the house, baby step two, and finish your emergency fund.
You told me you've done that, right? Correct. Okay, so now we're just saving for retirement, kids college, and we're working to get the house paid off.
And that is intentional. That's the stage you move up in car with cash.
That's the stage you buy a new couch if you need one with cash. That's the stage you go on a decent vacation with cash.
That's the stage that you go out to eat in your every dollar budget. All of those things should be in your every dollar budget and there should be room for them.
What's your household income, Georgia? Around 150 together combined. Yeah, so you make plenty of money to become millionaires and to change your family tree and do the things I just said in that last series of sentences.
So I agree. Okay, so what we want you to reach for, and him too, him is who I'm talking to, I guess, is financial peace.
There's no peace in this discussion. It's that, as Deloney says, let your shoulders drop and exhale.
And he's never done that yet. Right? Yeah.
And, I mean, he's 25, so it's this intense here in this part of life. I can only imagine that if we don't do something about it, it's just going to get a lot more input.

Yeah, I think you guys need to sit down maybe with a good marriage counselor or maybe with your pastor, because this is kind of a spiritual thing at this stage.

It's an emotional and spiritual thing.

You just got to learn to enjoy the ride now.

You've done a great job and you need

to enjoy the fruits of your labor. My guess is this is an intense dude, period.
That he probably

is this way about a lot of things. I don't, I don't know anybody like that, but, um,

but it could happen. This is the Ramsey Show.
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Bada bing, bada boom. All right, I'm getting out of here.
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