How To Protect Your Money During a Turbulent Election Cycle

This is the Ramsey Show, where you come to talk about your life, and we want to help you in the areas of your money, your work, and your relationships, all three of those areas.

Well, they affect each other.

And if you're not winning in one, well, you're probably losing in the others.

I'm Ken Coleman.

George Camilla with me.

One of my favorite people to host the show with.

I think everybody knows that.

I'm increasingly being told that by people that we meet.

People do ask me, Ken, who's your favorite to host with?

And I always say...

Yeah.

Yeah.

And I should reciprocate.

It's George.

It's Ken.

So there it is, folks.

We are affectionately known by some people as the root beer float of the Ramsey Show.

George says he's the root beer and I'm the vanilla ice cream.

I'm not going to argue with him.

But one thing.

You got more sarsaparilla.

What can I say?

One thing we agree on is that the phone number to jump in is 888-825-5225.

888-825-5225.

Now, let me point this out really quick.

We're going to get right to the phones.

Okay.

We're getting more and more calls.

James the Peruser is telling us.

And we've got some lined up today.

People are thinking about the economy.

People are thinking about the election.

They have a choice to make.

This happens once every four years, kind of like the Olympic.

You don't want to miss the Olympics, and you kind of want to decide.

And so we're going to be taking on your calls today.

So we've got this is your show, And this is what you want to talk about.

So we're going to do it.

And we're going to apply our classic and timeless principles to help you win with your money and help you figure out what does my vote have to do with it?

And do who I vote for, does it actually make a difference?

We're going to cover that a lot in this hour.

So let's get to it.

You ready?

I'm ready.

All right.

Crystal is going to start us off in Orlando, Florida.

Crystal, how can we help?

Hi, guys.

How are you today?

We're doing great.

How are you?

I'm good.

I just wanted to know, what can I do, what can we do to, you know, recession proof a job or find a job that's recession proof?

Yeah, those are two different questions because the first question is, is what can we do to recession proof our life?

And my pal George Campbell, I'm going to let him take that one.

And then the second question is very different.

Can I get?

Or George, maybe it's, is there a recession proof job?

So two different questions.

Let's start with the first one.

Go ahead.

How does she and her husband recession proof their life?

Because I think she's indirectly asking that.

Is that fair, Crystal?

That's true.

Yeah.

All right, let's take on that part.

We got this a lot during the pandemic.

How do I sort of pandemic-proof my life?

How do I create a bulletproof financial foundation for my family?

And the answer is simple, Crystal.

Don't owe people money, have money in the bank, and be investing for the future.

And so if you are completely debt-free, you have an emergency fund of three to six months of expenses.

Well, if that job loss does happen, it's not going to be fun, but it's not going to throw you into a tizzy either.

You're going to have money to get by.

You don't owe people money, so the income is less of an issue.

So that's what I would recommend on top of investing for the future and not touching that money and not freaking out.

That's what most people do.

They have no savings.

They tap in, they get the credit card, the HELOC when times are bad, and then they never climb out of that.

So are you in that spot right now?

No, but I am a stay-at-home mom right now, and I am looking for a full-time job, and I just kind of, I'm finding that it's a little slim pickings.

So I've I've been looking for about you know a few months what are you looking for and well the pay is a big thing just because I have to put one of my children in daycare so it has to you know level itself out right so anything like you know customer service or something like that but the pay has to be there and I have you know

for me maybe like 18 to 20 bucks an hour and the area that I'm at those jobs just aren't paying that yeah one of the things to look at that is not area specific is customer service jobs online and phone customer service work where you could actually do that at home and not have to put the child in daycare potentially.

If you have some help around the house, maybe an older grandmother or somebody wants to help, a lot less expensive.

But I would be looking at that.

I don't think it has to be Orlando based to make the $18 to $20 an hour.

In fact, I know it doesn't have to be for that customer service type role.

Well, I have been looking around a lot and applying like, you know, through a lot of

larger corporations and stuff, but they're just, I'm not getting callbacks and trying to get through HR for something like that.

It's just not, it's not happening.

Yeah.

Well, I get it.

You're going to have to, you're going to have to hustle and we're going to have to think about relationships first.

I'm going to give you the book, The Proximity Principle, as my gift to you, which will do a deep dive and help you think through, okay, what are the relationships that I have so that I'm getting around the resume lottery process?

Because that's a very discouraging and quite frankly, not a very effective way to kind of get a job these days just because of AI and the amount of people applying.

And so I'll jump in here

on what George said.

We need an $18 to $20 an hour job, however, we can get it.

If we can get it remotely, at this point, it's better for you from a childcare standpoint.

But I would encourage you, it's out there.

But to your question, because now I understand your question is rooted in frustration.

And now you're seeing the signs of what's going to happen with this economy.

We're seeing the unemployment rate now up over 4%.

But the jobs report that just came out this week says we're holding steady.

We didn't have unemployment jump up.

So we're still in a decent job market.

But the answer to your question is the only job in the world that is recession-proof is that of being a parent.

Because when you said I'm a stay-at-home mom, I went, that's the only recession-proof job.

Meaning, you're not going to get fired from being a mom.

Okay.

So the reason I'm saying that is this:

there is is no silver bullet career or profession that if a recession causes a company to lay somebody off, they don't just go, well, you know, at some point, everybody's job is up for grabs.

Well, a lot of people gravitate to government jobs because they see them as more stable.

They go, well, I'm not going to get fired as a USPS driver or a teacher.

Okay.

I still wouldn't call that recession proof.

And I'm just being completely honest.

So what you're looking for here is Crystal, is you're looking for

something that is as close to what they called essential workers during the pandemic.

It drove me nuts.

And I think to the extent that you could be working for some trades,

you know, could you do customer service for some local tradespeople in your area?

Because they're small businesses.

They're always looking for help.

I would be looking that direction.

Okay.

I can definitely do that.

Yeah, I've been looking at smaller businesses too.

And,

you know, a lot of what I get is we've had a lot of applicants or like they fill it super quickly.

And I'm not trying to make excuses that I'm, you know, haven't been able to find a job.

Oh, I know.

I know you're not.

It's a lot of competition.

And, you know, were you working outside the home before?

I was.

And it was kind of just

answering phones.

I was a verification specialist, just verifying people's backgrounds and the jobs that they've had previously.

I think you need more confidence in the skills you do have, Crystal.

Right now, you're kind of going, well,

I was just answering phones.

And I've been being a mom, and that's why I think you need to lead with the skill set you do have.

And I think you have more skills than you think you do.

Yeah.

And I, and Crystal, I'm going to, I'm going to re-emphasize, I think the small business is where you need to go.

These larger companies, you're just another name, and there is so much competition for them.

But I'm talking like the guy that's got a crushing plumbing business and he can't find anybody to help take his phone calls.

But you're just sitting there going,

I can do this with my eyes closed and, you know, one hand behind my back while my kids are running around throwing goldfish all over the place i i think the small business owners and this is you in your church community your sports communities your wherever you and your husband are doing life who's got a small business that just needs an office manager or some administrative help crystal's been the coo of her own home and so i think you need to look at that's what i need to do i know how to handle the operations that's as close to the recession proof as possible is where you are the right hand and the person who makes a tradesman's life a lot easier crystal you can do this hang on the line we'll get you the book The Proximity Principle.

For the rest of you, don't move, quick break, more of your questions coming up.

This is The Ramsey Show.

Welcome back to The Ramsey Show, where we help you win with your money, win in your work, and win in your relationships.

The phone number is 888-825-5225.

Triple 8-825-5225.

An interesting unintended theme hour around,

you know,

the economy.

We're going to be talking about that and what's going on with this presidential election and things of that nature.

That's a little bit more of that coming up.

But first,

it's August, George, and around here, that means we've got some incredible deals.

I guess Dave just tells everybody, slash prices in August.

It's how it's always what it looks like.

So we've got the $12 sale is what it's actually called.

This is happening through August 31st.

So everything we're talking about, the parenting advice, making more money,

purpose in the work, the whole nine yards, saving money,

avoiding all the stuff.

We've got it.

So

$12 on everything.

Smart money, smart kids,

baby steps, millionaires.

Let's see.

What else we got?

Building a not-anxious life.

And your own book, Ken, from Paycheck to Front.

From Paycheck to Purpose.

You made the $12 sale.

That's a heck of a deal.

You're not in here?

Not yet.

My book is too new.

I think they wait.

Oh, that's right.

Yeah.

It's too fresh.

I don't want it.

Yeah.

I don't know.

I wish.

I mean, I want everyone to have it.

Yeah.

But I think it's a few bucks more.

Yeah, it's still on there.

It's still there.

Add it to the cart.

There it is.

Ramseysolutions.com/slash sale.

Ramseysolutions.com/slash sale.

All right.

James is up in Kansas City.

James, how can we help today?

Hi.

How are you?

Good.

You guys,

I just got we sold our company here recently, and the proceeds are well into nine figures.

Wow.

Congrats.

Thank you.

We're concerned

about not making trust fund babies with for our heirs in the future.

So I thought, you know, we've got lots of attorneys that are helping us and stuff, but I'm not getting the kind of advice that I'd like to hear from them.

So what are your worries?

That they're going to become entitled and they're going to blow through millions and millions of dollars and implode their life?

Yeah, what is it?

Shirt sleeve to shirt sleeves in three generations or something like that.

So how old are the kids?

Well,

they're anywhere from 40 to non-existent.

Okay, so these are not children.

Well, I'm not worried about my own kids.

I'm worried about the kids I won't even know, my great, great, great-grandkids.

Let me free you.

I'm so sure that you should be doing that because you don't have any say in it.

Yeah, allow me to free you and tell you that you have no control over what happens with future generations and their behavior.

All you can do is raise great kids.

Do you think you've done a good job of raising great kids and becoming great adults?

Yeah, I think so.

Of course, you know, you look back at it and you always think you've done something wrong.

I'm sure I did.

Well, no, but Poe Buddy's nerfic.

That's what Ken always likes to say.

Poe Buddy is nerfed?

Po-Buddy's nerfic.

What is wrong with you?

You're not on your meds today?

Is that having a good time with our friends?

I've never heard that before.

Well, Google it, Ken, get a clue.

All right.

But, James, the thing is here, you don't have control.

It sounds like you've raised great kids.

I understand you've got to, you feel the weight when you're talking about nine figures sitting out there and you don't want these people to implode their life generationally.

But I think the best thing you can do is talk to your own kids and go, hey, this changes our family tree for a long time.

Let's have a conversation about what we want to do with this generational wealth we've created.

Okay.

Have you done that?

Yeah, we're we've been doing that, and we've got a series of family meetings that we're going to start up with this fall.

And

we were trying to planning on starting

some

kids' programs where they'd start donating out of their foundation to local charities, start that at like age eight, run that to age 20.

And in each, they would have to decide as a group which charity they wanted to donate to.

So if you had an age group of eight to 12 and then 13 to 16 and then 18 to 20 or something, each one would get a little bit more money to donate.

Okay, so there's kind of this, there's some strings attached here, and that's perfectly fine because it's your money.

And you can set certain milestones within the trust to say, hey, if they do this, this is what they get.

If they graduate college, here's what happens.

If they get a job, if they they get married, and here's the conditions.

It's okay to set it up like that.

And so you can decide, but I would make sure that your kids know what's going on, that you're all in agreement with the value system of which we're making these decisions.

Is that we want to lead with generosity, we're going to invest wisely, we want to have a work ethic.

No one's getting a free ride, but you also don't need to clutch it so tightly that it destroys your life in the meantime.

Yeah, and that's I'm not too worried about that, but

it is a bit of a guilt trip.

So, yeah.

What are you guilty about?

Well, we're in a small community.

So you feel like it's not fair that you have all this wealth and other people don't?

It's a little bit that way, yeah.

All right, so I've got to jump in.

I've got to jump in, James, because I think this is all mindset for you.

And you're a really good person, okay, which is why you feel the way you feel, but you've got this thing all twisted in your head.

So I'm just going to ask you a couple quick questions.

Did you work your butt off when you started and built that company?

Yeah, for 50 years.

For 50 years, James, you worked your butt off.

Did you start off with a ton of money?

No, we started off with $400 a month.

And when you sold the company,

did you pull one over on the company that bought it from you or the people that bought it from you?

Or was it an absolutely fair market rate and absolutely worth what you got for it?

It was a good deal for everybody.

Yeah.

And is everybody in your small town, do they have a right to live the same life that you live, the same circumstances?

Do they have a right to the money that you made?

Well, they could do it.

I mean, anybody.

I didn't ask you that.

I said, do they have a right to it?

No, they don't.

All right.

So, James, you're a really good man.

But just because you've done very, very well in a small town, and that puts you in a very small percentage of people, you're probably the wealthiest person in your town.

That doesn't make you a bad person, and thus you have nothing to feel guilty about.

You've done nothing wrong.

In fact, everything you've done is actually right, correct?

You can make that argument.

My wife's a little more conservative than I am.

Okay, well,

what does she think about all this?

Well,

she's on board with it.

But,

you know, in the Midwest here, you're just not flashy.

You're just not very flashy.

But no one's talking about being flashy.

But I got to tell you, James,

by the way, I don't know if you're walking up and down steps while you're talking to us.

James is getting his workout in as we speak.

But she's on the move.

I got to tell you something.

Hey, James.

We lost you, James.

Speak directly into your phone.

I got some guys upstairs with a pallet jack.

Oh, the pallet jack.

I can't tell you how many times that's happened to me on a phone call.

Classic.

But, James, listen to me.

You've got to be

the most low-key nine-figure earner I've ever talked to in my life.

You're borderline sad about it.

And that's just crazy.

You just don't need to feel like you've got to slink around and apologize for this extreme wealth.

You just don't.

You've earned it.

So do something good with it.

And you don't have to be flashy, but you can do something good and doesn't have your name in volume.

You can impact your community.

You get to give as much of this away as you'd like.

And so I want you to feel a freedom here versus feeling like you're in a prison.

We are.

Good.

We are.

We're probably giving away

half of it is probably what we're doing.

Oh, fantastic.

Just get a little bit of

a little bit more juice in your step here.

Let's be a little bit more excited about this.

It's not a massive problem.

Nothing to be worried about.

Nothing to be scared about.

This is an opportunity to live like no one else.

And so I would tell you to do it.

We're cheering for you, my man.

I tell you.

Do some things you never dreamed of when it comes to giving, when it comes to spending, when it comes to investing, building wealth, leaving a legacy.

I think you need a dream meeting with your spouse, a dream meeting with your kids.

And then once you have exactly that clear vision of what we're going to do with this, it's going to put some pep in the step.

Yeah.

James is going to check on the pallet, Jack, guys.

George and I are going to take a quick break.

And before you know it, more Ramsey Show and your calls are right around the corner.

Welcome back to the Ramsey Show.

I'm Ken Coleman.

George Campbell joins you this hour.

The phone number for you to jump in is 888-825-5225.

To the phones we go.

Joy is joining us in Bowling Green, Ohio.

Joy, how can we help today?

Hi, so I have a question in general, how we can change our federal politicians, meaning, is there a way that we as the people could institute term limits for our congressmen?

We already have term limits for governors and obviously presidents, but is there something that we can do?

I mean, because they're not going to vote on it, they're not going to approve their own term limits.

What can we do as people to get this changed?

Yeah, well, good question.

So for those of you who can't remember learning about this in the fifth or sixth or seventh grade, give you the quick answer.

There's two ways that the American people could bring forth an amendment to the Constitution.

And it would take an amendment to the Constitution to actually create term limits for the United States Senate and the House of Representatives.

The first is, I think you know this, Joy,

a congressional proposal.

So a current member of Congress on the Senate side or the House side could put forth a proposal to amend the U.S.

Constitution because this is

not legislation.

This is an actual amendment to the Constitution in order to get term limits.

So it would take one of the 435 members of Congress, right, Senate, House,

to actually put the proposal forward.

And then it would take a two-thirds majority vote of both the House and the Senate to actually get this going.

That's never ever.

Just to get it going.

No, no, to get it through.

No, no, it would.

The proposal, one person could do it.

To propose it.

Absolutely.

But Joy, you're right.

Those men and women up there are never going to vote to term limit themselves.

There's no way on the state level that we could say.

Yes, you can.

Yes, you can.

I'm getting there.

I'm getting there.

Sorry, I had to give you the full picture.

All right.

The other way it can happen is a constitutional convention.

And this is where two-thirds of the 50 states, so that would be 34 out of 50 states, could call for a constitutional convention.

then propose the amendment, which would be term limits, and then the ratification process would require three-fourths or 38 out of the 50 state

legislatures by conventions to vote for it.

So if you said, all right, we want a term limit.

So you'd have to have a majority of 34 states would all have to agree, their House and Senate would say, all right, we're doing this convention.

Then they take it to the convention, and out of the 34 states that said, yes, we should talk about it, 38, George, would have to say, vote in a majority, by the way.

So Tennessee's House and Senate would have to vote for the amendment, and they would have to be with 37 other states.

38 states total, Joy, would then amend the Constitution, which, by the way, while we're talking about this, last week on the show, I proposed a balanced budget amendment.

So, Joy, the answer to your question is this would have to be a groundswell, a grassroots movement.

where the state legislators and the governors of those states said, we probably should listen to the people of our state and we should do this.

So it's going to take a massive grassroot movement, massive, massive organized George.

Grassroots movement.

And Joy, that's the only way it happens.

And the framers of our Constitution, by the way, they made it this difficult on purpose so that you can't just, you know,

get an angry mob together and change the Constitution.

So is it difficult?

Yes.

Is it possible?

Yes.

Will it happen?

Probably not.

Thanks for your vote of confidence.

Joy, listen to me.

Joy, I want you to hear me say, on the record, I'm for term limits.

I would propose it right now if I were in Congress.

And my proposal to anybody that wants to take it to their congressman, by the way, if you want to call them, here's the proposal.

One term in the Senate, which is six years, George, and three terms in the House, which is six years.

Everybody gets six years to do damage or do good, and then you're out.

So, Joy, I'm for it.

I'm also for a balanced budget amendment.

And I'll say this again as I said it last week: this is a money show, and our audience is always thinking about money.

You vote with your wallet.

And I'm telling you, the balanced budget amendment would be the first thing, Joy, I would do.

I would put term limits second.

I would like to see the American people say, you know what?

We should require the federal government to balance the budget so that we don't drain our

resources, our tax dollars

for debt.

I ran into into Bob Latta a couple years ago and was asking him some local questions.

And to be honest with you, he told me that you have to be in D.C.

so long to get appointed to the right committees to make any difference.

That basically, even if he is there his entire career, he would just be getting to where he needs to be to make any change.

Yeah, that's absolutely right.

That just left me hanging with my mouth open and frankly disgusted.

Yeah, you should be.

But here's the deal: we need more people to be disgusted, not with the other party and not with the other candidate, but be disgusted with both parties and their management of the resources in this nation.

Because we could argue about all these social issues and all this other stuff.

And by the way, where we are in, I'm just going to say this while I'm on it.

I'm just going to say this.

No one can stop you except for everyone in the booth.

No, here's the deal.

Our political discourse in this country has now devolved on both sides to insults and accusations.

When I listen to both candidates talk, I don't hear anything about a vision for the future.

I don't hear it.

I don't hear about a vision for let's balance the federal budget so we don't mortgage our children's futures away.

What are we doing to actually make Social Security solvent today?

I just don't hear it.

So anyway, enough of that.

It's no solutions.

It's more fear-mongering and going, life's going to be better if you vote for me.

To the spirit of Joyce question,

the American people through their state government can make a huge difference.

And that's how you're going to have to do it.

Yeah, I have very little faith in any of this happening in my lifetime, especially because in this situation, Ken, the very people who would lose power are the ones who vote on it in one of these solutions.

100% right.

So why would they do that?

Why would you, yeah?

So, you know, Civics 101 there, it is possible.

But let's say this:

we have millions upon millions of Ramsey show listeners and viewers, YouTube, podcast, radio.

I'm not saying we should do this,

but

if the millions and millions of people that are listening to us and watch us were to say, you know what,

let's take a shot at this, let's mobilize, let's get after a balanced budget amendment, and let's take it to our state representatives and state senators,

and maybe even a governor.

You know what?

Would you get it done right away?

Probably not.

But if you got 20 states that went public and said, we're proposing a constitutional amendment,

we need 14 more.

You might see it happen.

So I do think over a period of two to six years, you could probably get to a point where it was even possible.

But this is about money.

And I think the American people should be uniting around money,

not social issues.

Just

what is the result of us being $30-some trillion dollars in debt?

That's not just a, whoops, it's a line item.

Well, just like we do with our personal finances, at some point the number becomes so astronomical, it becomes fake.

It becomes this like monopoly money situation.

And you go, well, our grandkids will deal with that,

which is frightening.

But, George, I'm going to say something that you may be shocked by, but if I were to put you in the room with the Congressional Budget Office and all the committees and everything, and

I put you in a room and I said, we'll give you guys

three square meals a day.

You get eight hours of sleep.

You're back in there.

I believe we could fix it that you could balance the budget.

Now, people are gonna fight over it, but the point is, you could balance the budget, you absolutely could.

Well, you know, it's spend less than you make.

It sounds that simple, but it really is about that.

That's it.

You literally could go, well, this is a little, this is like the Netflix subscription.

Yes,

we're feeding.

You're sending Netflix.

You're like, you're sending how many billions to this country every day?

Start looking it up.

Can we cut that subscription?

Yeah, we got an option.

We got a new feeding program for the rare spotted owl.

Okay, love the spotted owl.

But they're not as important as my kids.

Got it, George.

Got it.

The spotted owl folks would like to have a word with you, Ken.

You see my point?

Yeah.

But what would you say to the person who would fight you over the Netflix subscription?

You'd say cut it, would you not?

Well, we have to agree on the goal.

If the goal is to spend less money, now we got to go, where are we going to cut it?

All right.

See?

You come at a financial agenda.

That's from a financial standpoint, then George Campbell's the hero.

I'm in.

I love it.

We'll see if we can get George elected.

Get the government on an every dollar budget.

It's time.

Coming up next.

How how does the Fed changing the interest rate up or down affect you every day?

We'll discuss it next.

This is the Ramsey Show.

How we doing out there, America?

Hope you're having a good day.

We are.

I'm George.

I'm Ken Coleman.

That's the first time I'm in the break.

A boy can dream.

You know, a lot of people call me Ken accidentally on the show when they call in.

They say, hey, Ken, great stuff.

That's happened to me, too.

What a great honor it is.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

My favorite is when I'm on and someone calls me Dave.

That's always fun.

You just have to move along.

Yeah, so I caught myself.

I'm Ken Coleman, actually.

He.

I think you're Congressman Coleman today.

It's got a ring to it.

Oh, boy.

Nope.

Nope.

Don't want to do that at all.

Let's be very, very clear.

I just want to be mayor of a small town.

Is that so wrong?

I think you could do that well.

You know, just walk around waving to people.

Yep.

You're always ribbon cutting.

At the fair, the county fair, I think you'd be a huge.

That's it.

I don't want any real responsibility.

Just let me cut ribbons.

Yeah, I think you'd be great at that.

888-825-5225 is the phone number.

Okay, real quick, we're going to get in the news and very relevant to you as we speak today, okay?

And so here we are.

We're going to talk about the interest rates, George, the Fed, right?

Jerome Powell.

I've been mean about Jerome before.

I have criticized Jerome in the past.

And I don't want to criticize him today, but I want to point out that he is the chairman of the Fed.

The Federal Reserve.

The Federal Reserve.

So here's the deal.

Everybody's going, what is he going to do with interest rates?

What's he going to do with interest rates?

A lot of people predicting.

They passed on the last meeting.

They didn't do anything.

A lot of people predicting.

Quarter three, quarter four.

And

it affects the debt situation that people are borrowing.

So I'll throw it to you, George.

The credit card.

When people are looking, they're hoping, okay, if he drops it, maybe I don't have to pay as much.

But guys like you and me, one of the great positives of the Fed raising the rate

is we save more money.

That's true.

When the Fed lowers the rate, it makes borrowing money cheaper.

When they raise the rate, it makes borrowing money more expensive.

Now, on the flip side, when you think about a savings account, we've also seen savings rates go up with borrowing rates go up.

So if you are saving money, this is a great thing for you.

If you've got $10,000 in a savings account that's growing at 5% instead of 2%, you're happy about that.

That's right.

But if your car loan is now 8% instead of 5%, you're upset about it.

And so, for those trying to borrow money actively, this hurts them.

But guess what?

Consumers have been borrowing money anyways, Ken, because we've seen the consumer numbers go up.

It's not changing at all.

We've seen inflation not cool at the rate they want to because largely consumers are spill, it's still white hot.

People are still spending money, they're still borrowing money, which is kind of hurting the very thing they're wanting, which is inflation to cool.

That's right.

So, the correlation between the Fed raising interest rates and how it affects mortgage rates is he's rate, those are the bond rates.

So it's the bond rates.

And so when the bond rate changes, it does have an indirect effect on mortgage rates.

It's an inverse relationship.

Inverse, but he's not directly when he's moving.

It doesn't automatically mean your mortgage provider or anybody else is going to change their rate, but it has to do with that.

Now, here's some other things we just want to kind of explain.

How does it affect you?

One of the biggies is employment.

Jerome Powell came out a year and a half, two years ago, and said, we're going to start to raise rates because we've got to cool inflation.

And the way they try to cool inflation is raising the rate, which it does it in two ways.

It's way harder to borrow.

That.

But what happens is, is that companies, because a lot of companies are using debt for operating expenses

or some type of leveraging, you know, around goods and services, then what will happen is they start to cut costs because their borrowing costs went up.

And so they'll cut costs by dropping employees.

So layoffs, okay?

That's a big one.

The other thing you got to think about, too, is they want to see unemployment go up in high times of inflation.

And he said this because people spend less.

And we are a consumer-driven economy, George.

We're not a manufacturing-driven economy.

We're a consumer-driven economy.

In other words, we're all just passing each other's money around.

That is the American economy.

And you need that to happen in order to keep this whole thing going.

So when people stop spending, guess what happens?

Companies aren't making as much money.

Slows it down.

They lay it off.

So those are the two factors that when you see interest rates go up, usually you see unemployment go up.

When you see interest rates come down, again, unemployment tends to drop as well.

So that's what's going on.

The inflation itself, costing goods and services across the board, the housing market, tremendously affected.

That's the big one as people are clamoring about is if we can get these rates down, more people, that we can get the housing market sort of stimulated again because it's been pretty stagnant lately.

All right.

So here's why we bring this up.

Just as we took a call to start the show, how can I recession proof my career?

You want to recession-proof your life, and you want to make sure that whatever Jerome Powell does and the Fed,

it doesn't affect you that much.

Because if you're trying to borrow out your eyeballs, then it affects you.

That's right.

Because every rate, every turn, the car loan, the credit card, the student loan, the mortgage, it all affects you.

But when you go, you know what, I'm not going to play the game.

That's right.

I'm going to get out of debt.

I'm going to pay off the house.

That's right.

Well, then the rates, you're going to yawn.

Well, that's what's on top.

That's what happens to you and me right now.

The only thing I get irritated about on the rates is when I'm like, oh, my savings rate just dropped.

And that's what we're going to see happen.

If you have a savings account, what's likely going to happen?

You're going to go, oh, it went from five to four, seven, five.

Yeah.

By the way, real quick point on this, because this plays into what you teach and Dave teaches on investing.

Earlier this week, we saw a massive stock drop, right?

The Dow lost over a thousand points.

NASDAQ was probably, what, 500 points off, something like that.

Anyway, point is people were panicking, and one of the lead economists in this country came out and called for an emergency rate drop.

Wow.

Well, the Fed must have yawned and ignored him.

It didn't happen.

I thought that was a crazy reaction.

They don't just go, well, one economist said it, Ken.

We have to do it.

No, they don't.

But two days later, same economists came out because the market has already rebounded.

Largely got it all back.

The next day, $650 up, and I don't know what it's done today.

My point is, this is the roller coaster that you talk about.

So if I lost cell phone service for two days, I would have come back and go, what happened?

Oh, nothing.

Exactly where we were.

Essentially.

Big whoop.

Not point for point, but pretty darn close.

So all that to say,

I do expect a Fed rate, the Fed to drop the rate probably in the next month or two.

And it probably won't be as drastic as people are hoping.

It's been just inching.

I would say a quarter point,

maybe a half point,

but probably a quarter point.

I see the Fed probably going a couple of quarter point raises, excuse me, drops, just to kind of ease back in because they dropped it too low before.

It's a very delicate game they're playing.

It is.

And so I get you don't want to mess with this too much.

But what's interesting, Ken, is when it comes to real estate, people are going, well, Ken, if the rate went from seven to six, it would allow me to buy a house.

Let's go to Jennifer who has a question, I think, around this.

Jennifer, how can we help?

Hi, Ken and George.

Thank you for taking my call.

Sure, what's up?

It sounds like you touched on my question a little bit because I was wondering how the election and mortgage rates correlate.

Specifically, I mean, for an example, some of my friends and colleagues were looking to purchase a home, and they're suggesting that I wait until see who gets elected into office.

But I'm wondering if it's actually worth waiting for, or like you said, the decrease in the market.

Are you ready to buy a home financially?

Yes, we are.

And do it.

I would too.

That's the only factor that matters.

I don't think the election itself.

Here's the dirty little secret, Jennifer.

Who is in the White House matters to a lot of people emotionally.

It doesn't matter as much as you think financially.

Your mayor, your city council, your county commissioner, your state politicians have way more impact on your actual household income and your expenses than the president of the United States does.

I remember, I'm not going to say which party, as I don't want to offend anybody.

But I remember as a young, I was in politics, George, and I remember

a party won and it was not my choice.

And I was probably early 20s and I thought the apocalypse was coming.

And then we had eight years of that person, and my life actually got better during the eight years of a time of a person.

And I was like, I'd never vote for that person.

So that's happened to me a few times.

And so

George is right.

Get it now.

Interest rates are starting to edge down a little bit anyway.

You can always refi.

What do you and Dave say?

Date the

buy the house, date the rate.

Yeah, marry the house, date the rate, and that's that's what you'll do.

And if the payment, you know, the payment's not going to be fun right now with the rate, but if you can afford it, you know, we talk about 25% of your take-home pay going toward this, then don't wait on the sidelines.

Don't wait for the market to change.

Don't wait for someone to get elected because the economy is largely, you know, it's not connected to who's in the White House.

It's more influenced by the Federal Reserve and what's happening in the economy.

So keep your eye on the economy, not the election ads, and that'll help you.

Yeah, and let's also mention ramseysolutions.com/slash real estate.

It's a fabulous website for

you to, Jennifer.

It's free.

We've got all the Q's and all the A's that you could possibly imagine to help make you feel even more confident with the answer we just gave you.

But yes, you should buy right now and just sit back in your new house, pop some popcorn, and watch this election craziness.

Know that you've got the right house for you.

Good hour, George.

Thank you.

This is the Ramsey Show.

This is the Ramsey Show, where we help you win in your life, specifically winning with your money, winning in your work, and winning in your relationships.

The phone number to jump in for your questions, 888-825-5225.

888-825-5225 is the number.

I'm Ken Coleman, George Campbell with me today.

And we like to have some fun while helping you out.

So let's get to it, shall we?

Bobby is up next in Fort Worth, Texas.

Bobby, how can we help?

Hey, Ken, George, thanks for taking the call.

I appreciate it.

You bet.

So, well, the short and sweet version,

I'm looking at accepting a job that pays $6,000 less per year.

How much?

$6,000 less.

$6,000 less.

Okay.

Yeah, $6,000 less.

Okay.

To give you just a little bit of background on that,

I've been with a company that I work for now for about six years,

and I've always loved the position that I was in and what I was doing.

And recently, I was moved to a new team, and my job, responsibilities, and functions have completely shifted and changed.

So I was no longer doing what I was doing in the past.

So, and I don't like it.

It's not my passion.

It's not my desire.

It doesn't fire me up every day.

So I started looking for other jobs over the last five months, and I found one.

It seems like they have great leadership, and I just got a really good...

a really good feeling and vibe when I talked to everybody that I interviewed with.

And so I got an offer, and I tried to counteroffer to get it closer to what I'm making currently.

But the gap as it stands right now is $6,000.

My question is.

What's that?

My question is, is that a wise decision?

It might be.

Might not be.

I need to know more.

So first thing I want to know is.

Is it in the field that you want to be in or is it the type of role that you've now figured out?

This gives me the juice.

I'm excited.

It is in a similar field, but a completely different industry.

Yeah, but that's not what I'm asking.

I'm saying, is it in the field you want to be in, or is it more of, is it in the type of role that you go, this is a role that I was wired to do?

Oh, no, it's definitely a role that I was wired to do.

Okay, that's the good news.

All right.

So is there a path for growth over the next year, two, three?

Did they...

Did they project?

Yes, they said that there's a lot of growth, and they also mentioned several times that they promote what from within for the managerial positions, which is what I'm running for.

Okay, so how clear are you?

And I'd love to note the details.

What does the growth look like?

What do they tell you?

And I want to know financially what is the growth is what I'm looking at here to kind of weigh in.

Sure.

So I did ask about annual raises to see what the percentages are.

And they say on average it's about 3% a year, which is more than what I get now, actually.

Oh, wow.

What is the actual number?

What is the offer?

The offer is for $83,000.

And you can pay all of your bills with room to spare with margin with that?

Oh, yeah.

The only debt I have is my mortgage.

Okay.

My mortgage is

$500.

This is $500 a month gross.

The offer

they've offered you is $500 less per month.

on a gross check.

So after you take taxes out of that.

Probably closer to $400 or 375, something like that.

Yeah.

So if you start amortizing that through your budget, which is what's George asking.

So it sounds like you got the margin.

So again,

glad you asked that, George.

That's a key question.

But I think if it puts me on the path to, we didn't get the answer beyond the 3%.

I'm talking about what are they, did they project what some promotions could look like?

Do you see, if you're on this rung of the ladder when you get in, what it could look like?

Do those roles exist right now?

I'm sorry, say that again.

Do the roles exist that you're looking for, those those leadership roles you're saying you want?

Yes, they actually told me during the interviews that they've recently promoted some of their team members to be supervisors and or managers.

So, what would those positions pay?

The pay I'm not sure of.

I didn't ask for the pay,

but they would either be paying what I get paid now or more.

But I did ask them about a time frame.

They told me that they do not promote based on seniority, They promote based on your performance of your job.

And if you have the aspirations to become a supervisor or manager or beyond, then they want to be able to lead you down that road because they have a lot of great people within the organization, but they really just want to stay at the level of a subject matter expert in their field and their job and not actually manage, you know,

have anything like that.

Bobby, that's a really good sign that they're telling you that in the interview process because that tells me they're a company that's pretty healthy in how they promote leaders.

They'll give people the opportunity, but if they don't want it, they don't force them into it.

I like that.

That's what we see happen is they go, you're really good at this, Ken.

You should lead people.

And you're like, I'm not.

I don't want to.

That's not what I want to do.

So

screen flags for me so far.

Me too.

I don't have any issue.

I understand they're not going to tell you exactly what you could make, but if you had a general idea that, yeah,

if I do a good job, I'm going to be making six figures over the next two, three, four years.

I don't think this is risky, and I'd say I'm fine with this because it's such a small cut

and you have margin in your life.

Yeah.

Do you have a family, Bobby?

No, I'm single.

Okay.

That makes this easier.

Oh, yeah.

I'd say take it.

I do think there's a ton of risk here.

Yeah.

The formula, Bobby, that we're walking you through is, does it make sense in the short term?

And does it make sense in the long term?

That's the only time I'm for someone taking a pay cut.

But the asterisk is, you have to be able to absorb it.

And I don't mean like by the penny.

You're not just scraping by, but if you have margin

and then we meet those other things, if we have margin to absorb it and it's actually putting us in a better position short-term and long-term, it's a no-brainer.

Right.

And also the other part of this equation is the

peace of mind that I probably will have shifting to this job that is more in line with what I like to do versus what I'm doing now, which

is what you're going to try for.

Yep.

Okay.

That's why I'm saying that's a short-term win for you, mentally and emotionally.

Removing the frustration.

So it's a win.

It's the win.

Yeah.

So I like this move for you.

I really do.

Okay.

Awesome.

Well, I appreciate that.

Absolutely.

That's one win.

We have a win today.

We have a win.

And highlight, George, I'm highlighting that he can do this.

Because he has no debt.

If he was in crippling debt and that $400 made all the difference, we'd go, this might not work out.

Especially it's a single income.

We'd tell him not to, actually.

Certainly, my advice would be like, if you're in the middle of the snowball, no,

every penny matters.

Now, if he was making a lot more, we'd go, okay, this is going to help you pay off debt faster.

So it's not, you know.

Well, point out, it's a very good point.

I don't know.

I always wonder this.

Have we ever had a debt-free screamer who didn't make at least a little bit more over their debt-free journey?

I've never seen it.

It's almost always,

Dave, or one of us.

We started out 80, went up to 120.

We started at 60, went up to 85.

Yeah.

So winning with your money is always about increase.

Not just are we cutting expenses, but are we increasing our income?

So we talk a lot about spending less on the show, but the other side of margin is making more.

And that's where you've been able to help so many people.

And by the way, you know, I know I'm not the money personality, but I'm the income guy.

Let's go.

Let's take some of those calls.

I like it.

Let's make some money because

the people out there, they'll be making some good money, and we're here for it.

There you go.

Thank you for the clarification, George.

Although, if you're offering a pay increase, Ken, I'll gladly accept.

Thank you.

I'll talk to you about it during the commercial break.

Don't move.

We're right back with more of your calls.

This is the Ramsey Show.

Welcome back to the Ramsey Show.

I'm Ken Coleman.

George Camill is alongside this hour, 888-825-5225, 888-825-5225.

888-825-5225.

We're going to take your money questions.

I can help you figure out ways to make more money.

I just met a dude in the lobby who was telling us his success story.

He's crushing it.

So I can help there and George will help you save more of it and budget it correctly and all the things.

And so we'll talk about those issues today.

Triple 8-825-52255.

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refy.com slash ramsey may not be available in all states all right can we get some questions from our youtube audience and uh here's a few that kind of are in the same bucket and they are all around this sort of election season, politics, the economy, investing.

What do I do with my money?

So here's a few and we'll kind of pull back the curtain on these.

Should we dial back on investing during a weak economy to have more cash on hand?

Speaking from a lower middle class perspective that does own a home and currently no debt except a car payment.

Should we dial back investing?

Yes, I would dial back investing, but not because of economic reasons.

It's because you have a car payment that's holding you back and you need to pay that off in case there's a weak economy.

I want you to owe nobody anything.

So that's part of it.

But would I change my investing habits because of any economic factors?

Absolutely not.

I invest the same when the market's doing great, when the market's doing poorly, and you can call it dollar cost averaging, which is a simple way to say you invest the same amount every month, no matter what's happening.

Those are the people that win, Ken, not the people who jump in and out because they feel the market's going to do or it just did, and I'm going to pull the money, I'll put it back in.

Those people always lose in the end.

Well, I want to call out what happened this week.

So

we had a massive, massive shakeup in the stock market on Monday of this week.

And then here we are.

We're crawling back.

In fact, I'll pull it up while we're talking, but had you got out after the thousand-point loss, it was over a trillion dollars lost in one day.

Had you gotten out, you wouldn't be.

benefiting you wouldn't have the recovery that's right and you would have gotten too late so that's part of it you can pull up the numbers i'm going going to move on to this next question, which is related.

Should I wait to invest more until after the election?

Again, what we've seen, there's no history that shows us that if you invest the day after the election, it's going to be a win and you shouldn't invest until then because we've hit many record highs.

I think we're going to see more record highs until the election.

There's going to be dips.

It's going to go up.

It's going to go down.

And so when you just invest no matter what, you're going to see your rate of return be higher than those who jumped in and out and jumped in and out of this roller coaster.

By the way, quick update.

The S ⁇ P, as we sit right now, has inched upward on Friday,

and

it has almost reversed the weekly fall.

So the massive fall on Monday has almost been completely reversed.

Within the span of a week.

Yeah, so just real evidence here, straight out of the headlines.

It's unbelievable.

Unbelievable.

Should I wait to invest more until after the election?

No.

Just invest more now and just keep investing.

And so how much?

When?

How does this work?

Well, if you're debt-free with an emergency fund, invest 15% of your gross household income into retirement accounts.

That's how that works.

Once you've got the house paid off, you can invest as much as you'd like, increase it to 20%, 30, 40%, 50%, 60% if you'd like.

But again, Dave Ramsey doesn't change his investing habits during election years or during economic times.

We know that investing in good times and bad, when it's bad, you're buying the stocks on sale.

You're buying these mutual funds at a discount.

When it's doing well, well, your money's growing for you with compound growth.

So I'm happy either way.

Last question here.

Where should we be investing right now since the market has taken a downturn?

The market.

The general overall U.S.

economy.

I believe in it, still can.

The S ⁇ P 500, which represents the 500 largest companies, that's where you're going to be putting your money.

And we have a split when we talk about mutual funds across four types.

You want to diversify them.

There's growth, growth and income, aggressive growth, and international.

And that helps you sort of spread, you know, you don't want all your eggs in one basket.

And so when the U.S.

economy might not be doing well, those international funds will probably help balance it out.

Aggressive growth, these are the wild children.

You don't know what they're going to do, but you want that balance with some of the growth and income.

The old companies, the Home Depots that have been around forever, we know they're not going to skyrocket, but they're going to continue to grow at a solid rate.

So that's how I do it.

Those four types of mutual funds, that's in my 401k.

They're in Dave's 401k.

And so you can kind of see what funds that you have in your retirement accounts fall into those categories.

And if you need help, reach out to a smartvestor pro ramsey solutions.com They can help with that.

Yeah, good stuff there.

All right to the phones we go triple eight eight two five five two two five TJ is up next in Philadelphia TJ.

How can we help today?

Hey Ken.

Hey George, how you guys doing?

Thanks for taking my call.

We're doing well.

Happy to talk to you.

What's up?

All right.

So I'll keep this short.

Thanks for reading my message.

I've been laid off of my motion graphics role in the healthcare industry for almost a year now, along with hundreds of thousands of others in the tech field.

Now, I'm aware that older strategies like walking in person with a resume, applying on LinkedIn, or even new strategies like using AI to update my resumes and stuff like that aren't the best solutions anymore.

And it's best to network and have someone get you from in, from the inside.

So I'm doing everything I can to expand my...

uh my network and i can refresh my skills in my career to continue the passion that i love so that being said i'm trying my hardest to update my skills to land a new role.

But even if I land something, there are still hundreds of thousands of other people like me who are stuck.

So my question today is, does the presidential election, can that affect the job market at all?

And who can I vote for to best impact the job market for job seekers, especially the tech field?

Okay, so the first question is, yes, presidential elections and the candidates who represent a party and then ensuing policy platforms, because both candidates, major party candidates, including your third-party candidates, your Libertarian, your Bobby Kennedys,

all presidential candidates have a platform.

And I don't think the average person actually goes on their website and just reads through their platform.

I think that's probably a good start.

But the answer is yes to the first question because these policies do, in fact, have consequences,

good or bad.

And when you're talking about jobs,

there is a difference in philosophy

between the two major parties on

what creates jobs.

And you've got to do your homework on that.

I'm not going to tell you how to vote.

You didn't necessarily ask me to, but you got close.

And I think what you have to look at is: what do you believe, TJ,

is

fundamental policy that makes it better for the job economy.

Now I'll tell you what I think okay and I'm not talking about party and I'm not talking about candidate.

I believe

that

lowering taxes for small business is a fundamental policy that will always have

a positive effect on the job economy.

Why?

By the way, folks, I'm entering into territory, George, that I know is so fun when the show is so big.

I'm enjoying this.

So I'm going to say this.

I'm going to say this to folks.

If you don't disagree with me,

if you disagree with me, I'm okay with it, actually.

I'll never read any comments you say about me negative because I don't get in the comments.

George, know that.

That's right.

I read them too, Ken.

I don't listen to them.

But what I want you to do is, I want you to actually research what I'm saying.

Because this is not my opinion.

So, for instance, fact number one: small businesses as a percentage of jobs in the United States are the biggest block of employers.

So, if you were to look at a pie chart of who creates the most jobs in America, small business.

So,

I believe in lowering taxes, keeping taxes at as low a rate as possible for small business owners because

they are the ones that are hiring people in the zip codes all around this majestic country.

That's one thing I would look at.

So which candidate,

which party platform supports that?

That's just one example.

I could keep going and going and going, but you have to look at and say, what do I think of these candidates

around their economic policies on raising taxes, lowering regulations, things like that that make it harder for people

to hire?

And that's why you get laid off.

So you do the work and vote your conscience.

This is the Ramsey Show.

Welcome back to the Ramsey Show.

I'm Ken Coleman.

George Campbell joins me.

Thrilled to have you with us watching, listening, wherever you're watching and however you are listening.

Triple 8-825-5225 is the number.

Triple-8-825-5225.

Shout out to an amazing group of people in the lobby today watching and remind you, you can come to our global headquarters.

I like to say global.

We only have one, but it's global.

It's It's our worldwide headquarters.

Worldwide headquarters.

We only have one.

Only one in the world.

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A great group of people out there today watching in the lobby.

If you'd like to learn more about come to watch the show, ramseysolutions.com.

All right, let's get to the phones.

Alicia is now joining us in Orlando, Florida.

Alicia, how can we help?

Hi, it's nice to talk to you guys.

You too.

What's up today?

So, question.

This might be a bit atypical, but I am 46.

My husband is 64, going to be 65 in January.

So right now he's working part-time, but on Social Security disability.

And he's approaching, you know, getting up into the retirement almost, but also has incurable cancer.

So that's why he's on the Social Security disability, which has come back.

So we're sort of in the area of we're not really sure economically with things going on.

You know, is it the right time at 65?

Like, that's a few months away to pull from his retirement

and take full Social Security because that's what the disability will turn into regular transition to regular Social Security.

Or not really sure what to do as we're kind of navigating everything.

I have four kids that, you know, getting ready for college.

One of them is going this August, and then, you know, two high schoolers getting ready to go on to college.

So I have many years left to work.

But

that's whatever situation.

Yeah, I'm just curious:

what's his health prognosis with the cancer?

What do you know about life expectancy?

What's that situation?

It's very aggressive.

We've been through stem cell transplant.

We have been through

a trial medication, 10 different lines of treatment.

He was in remission, just got out of remission.

So really uncertain right now.

It's very uncertain.

I'm sorry, Alicia.

That's really, really hard.

So sorry.

It definitely takes a toll.

Give us a snapshot of how you guys are doing financially.

So interestingly, we're not combined everything financially.

He's obviously a lot older, has two much older children from a previous marriage.

We've been together for 15 years.

But the stuff we do sort of have merge.

So I found you guys in 2020.

uncertain times and I'm like pay off all the debt got rid of all my student loan I own my house.

So I have a debt-free.

I have no debt.

Now, he, I think, has one or two credit cards he's unwilling to let go of, but he pays them off every month.

So I don't really hop on him on that because he's not all on board, but myself, I think I'm pretty like no debt ever.

And I'm teaching my kids that for sure.

Okay.

What's your income?

So I'm at $101,000.

And then through his Social Security and his

private practice, he's probably about like $110,000, give or take.

Some years he didn't work at all because he was in treatment.

What's his practice?

He's in treatment again.

He's a psychiatrist.

No kidding.

And he's doing that part-time?

Yeah, he's just doing that part-time.

He's still making

$110,000 doing all of this.

Well, that's with his Social Security.

Okay.

So with his disability.

So

what would that be?

He's got to wind down a bit

because know, his health is getting worse.

What's in his nest head?

Because you're saying, should we pull from his retirement?

Is it a bad time?

What's in there and how much are you going to pull out?

So at 65, I think he, if he has to close his practice, I think, well, we could probably just live off his regular Social Security payments.

But

he's got about 2 million

that is just all in retirement, though.

And that's separate from mine.

We kind of keep that stuff separate because that's the...

How much do you have in retirement?

I have a Roth, which I just started like after I got out of debt two years ago, with $13,000

and $175,000 in my 401k

and a stupid $11,000, I guess, whole life insurance policy my mom just gave to me last year.

She had it since I was a kid and was, I don't know, paying on it every year until it was like here,

basically itself.

Well, the good news is you guys are you're multi-millionaires.

What's your house worth?

We're 550.

Wonderful.

So we're probably approaching a $3 million net worth.

And here's the thing, you don't need to pull from the retirement account.

So why are you saying should we pull from it when you guys are

plus you're still working?

I am still working, and I'll be working for a while.

I just, I think for me, it's just, I get worried, like, putting the kids, like, I don't know, know i i hate to say this but you know education have you saved for college at all

i haven't nope i just got paid off my college honestly in 2020.

could you guys cash flow it over the next few years

yeah i am cash flowing i did cash flow my colleagues i keep hearing something

i think i know what's going on i could be wrong alicia

sounds like this i i don't know sounds like you guys are separate finances you're you're you're living married but you have separate finances he's fine that guy's he's he's fine.

But I don't know where the we comes in.

Is he helping you with the kids, your kids?

They'ren't his kids, unless he's the staying.

But he does.

So is he going to help with their college?

Yeah, he does help with the college.

He helps with like the everyday experience.

All right, but

okay, but with your income and let's say his health, you know, situation, he's going to be going on

Social Security.

I don't want to take help from him then.

Right.

Yeah.

So, George, there's the, I kept hearing that.

I think you guys need to sit down and lay it all out, maybe for the first time.

I agree.

So, here's all of our numbers.

Here's what it's going to take for these folks to go to college.

Here's what we're going to do in our budget.

We make $210,000.

What are we doing with it every single month?

And are we going to be able to cash flow this?

And if that means you guys slow down on some investing goals right now, that's so you got a paid-for house.

Your expenses can't be that high.

Do you know what your monthly expenses are to run the house?

Yeah, it's really low.

It's like $2,000.

I do, I have the every dollar.

I do the every Dollar Premium.

I love it.

I got it for my son.

Does he have a will?

Yeah,

we just redid and finalized that together now for the first time because we had two separate wills.

We had two separate everything.

God forbid.

So God forbid he doesn't recover from this and this thing.

We just don't know, but we got to be real here today.

And is there life insurance in place for either of you other than this little whole life policy?

Yeah, yeah, he's got a life insurance, although he's got two.

One, I think, is in a, in a, unrevocable

for his kids.

I don't know that

he can't change because that's something like he has to do with the pain.

Well, it feels like to me, it feels like to me, Alicia, and George, I want you to weigh in on this.

It feels like the only tension that you've got is around the funding of your four kids who are in a season of life.

He's already been there, done that.

And your finances are fine.

And you could pull from retirement if you needed to without penalty from his

at his age.

So if you need to cover the gap for college because you wanted to bless these kids, you're still going to be able to retire with dignity.

Yeah.

And if he's willing to do that, there's more than enough in his retirement accounts to cash flow your kids' college.

And if you got a will and you're the, and you're the, you're going to inherit it, I just, since that's where all your worry is, is how do I fund my kids' college?

And I get that because you don't want to go into debt and you've done the hard work to get debt for yourself.

But as his, as his wife, and you're fine.

Both of you guys are fine from a retirement standpoint.

More so.

More than

that.

And if it's invested wisely, that $2 million seven years from now will likely turn into $4 million.

And so think about that.

You're now 53, it's 4 million.

At 60, it's going to be 8 million.

And so that tells me if you guys aren't going to deplete this, which it doesn't sound like you need to because you're going to continue to work for the next probably 15, 20 years, that you guys are going to be just fine, but you need a plan in the meantime.

So circling back real quick for you, George, on her behalf, would you recommend that he start to pull his Social Security at 65, knowing what you know now?

If you need it.

If he doesn't need it, and it doesn't sound like he absolutely needs it right now with the income you guys have coming in.

If he stops working and he's slowing down, should he take the social media?

Yeah, I would take it.

And if you don't need it, invest it.

But still take the payment.

And especially if he's not working, that's when you want to do it because you're not going to get dinged with penalty.

All right, good.

Alicia, you're okay.

And you got the answer that you're looking for there.

And wishing him the best.

Wishing him absolutely the best.

What a tough journey.

Hang in there.

You seem like a really strong lady.

And we're sorry for what you and your husband are going through.

All right, don't move, folks.

More of your calls coming up.

This is the Ramsey Show.

Welcome back to The Ramsey Show.

I'm Ken Coleman.

Thrilled to have you.

George Camel.

Yes.

George Ramsey is with me.

Is there a more American name?

I'm George Ramsey.

Oh, man.

Doesn't that change funny how the mind can just betray you at times?

Oh, boy.

Fun question for you, George Ramsey.

Hit me.

This is from our

overall Ramsey community, right?

We've got people all over the place, different platforms, and we get great questions.

We love when you send them in.

So this one came in.

What actions can everyday people take in local politics or voting in elections to affect positive change with respect to personal finance?

For example, anything to look for in county treasurers or local officials or ballot initiatives where our votes and voices might carry more sway?

Well, I got to tell you,

this is a question.

This gives Ken the juice.

I get a little excited.

Truthfully, if you want to affect politics, local is best.

The more local you get, the more impact you can have.

Well, the answer to the question is absolutely that.

Tip O'Neill, legendary Speaker of the House, who was a political rival of Ronald Reagan, famously said, all politics are local.

So I will quote him, and he's absolutely right.

And what he's talking about is that ultimately

that's where things move, the needle moves.

And so to this question, everyday people need to be holding their local representatives, everything from, yes, your county treasurer, county commissioners, your mayors, you know, the people that are running for elected office, and even those who aren't elected.

But if there are public forums and you are looking at your county budget, I mean, if George cared, I could see him like pulling up the Williamson County budget and diving in.

Might do that this weekend.

I think you probably should.

You probably find some things.

And

so you, in fact, can move the needle there.

And it's a lot easier to mobilize people.

It's a lot easier to vote someone in and out on a local level because you're talking about a small amount of votes.

And so what action can everyday people take?

It's to vote and voice what you believe is right.

That simple.

Voices it in your public forums, showing up at county commissioner meetings where you have open forums and you can speak.

And then the idea of organizing rallies and things of that nature.

I mean, these are all things that do move the needle on a local level.

So yeah, pay attention.

If you feel like decisions are being made that affect your local taxes, people don't pay a lot of attention to sometimes

the services, everything from your water to, you know, there's a lot of things that the average person doesn't pay attention to that are decided upon right there in their zip code.

You know, things that affect their everyday budgets, like trash services, water, and utilities.

You get real local.

I remember that we had, you know, some in our neighborhood, Ken, there was some issues, and we started going, all right, we're going to vote for a new alderman.

And that became the thing of the alderman, that's who's going to help us accomplish this.

A lot of effect on some of the household costs and the cost of living.

You know, when you hear that phrase, cost of living, you know, like, well, I'm moving from this place to this place.

The cost of living is a lot lower.

Well, again, That is driven by a lot of your local policies and local politicians.

And then the next level up is your state House representatives or state senators.

And you can find all the contact information online, and they're pretty easily accessible.

They'll probably respond to you, and so it's worth being the squeaky wheel if you want to see some change.

So, three things: be informed, voice your beliefs and feelings, and make sure you're voting.

Those are the three things you can do.

Saratoga Springs, New York, is where Christy joins us.

Christy, how can we help?

Hi, how's it going?

Thanks for taking my call.

You bet, we're having a blast.

What's going on?

Yeah, sounds like it.

So, I have a couple questions, basically.

So I've read the book.

I feel like I'm debt-free right now, but I have this solar panel debt.

And I'm just, for one, I just want to know, can I just lump that into like, oh, it's part of your mortgage now?

Or is that still just, it's a debt?

It's a debt.

I hate to turn your feelings down and tell you that you're

debt freedom was just a feeling.

That would be wonderful.

But yeah, Christy, this is a debt.

Let's get it aggressively paid off.

What's left on the solar debt?

Okay, so I have about $45,000 left on it.

It requires

about $14,000 payment on April 13th.

And then after that, it'll have about $32,000 left on it.

Are you going to have the money?

Is this like a lump sum payment you need to make?

No, that's over 300 months after April 13th.

Okay.

All right.

So how aggressively aggressively can you attack?

So I can, I can, so that's the question.

So I have this inheritance that I got.

Not me, but my husband.

He got about $100,000 from his grandparents.

We've already put $50,000 of that towards our kids for their $529.

And we paid off my husband's student loan debt.

So I have, and then we just paid off like onesie-toothie things.

So I have about $30,000 left of that.

Okay.

And then I have $15,000 in an investment account.

That's not returned.

Well, retirement, I have separate.

I have,

let's see.

So this is simple.

It looks like.

So you're saying, should you cash out the investments and should you take the 30 that's left from the inheritance and go ahead and just pay off the solar debt?

Yeah, that's my question.

But like my husband is

thinking about it because

we're going to be moving in less than a year.

And guess who doesn't care?

The solar panel company doesn't care.

You still have to pay them.

And so regardless of when you're moving and if and if it doesn't happen, the debt goes with you.

And so you need to just go ahead and pay it off.

And it stinks because solar is a long-term thing.

You're not going to see an increase of $50,000 when you sell the house with whatever the solar cost.

And so you didn't ROI on this.

And it's one of the, you know, the downsides of jumping into something like this, especially with debt.

But I would pay it off and pay it off today.

You might have capital gains on the investment when you sell those off, so be aware of what you're going to owe in taxes there.

Okay.

But I would just have a clean slate and then build it.

So then I kind of lose any kind of liquid money I have for closing costs.

For moving?

Yes.

Well, how soon are you moving?

This time next year.

So you have a year to save up closing costs?

Okay.

So, and guess what?

You have freed up that payment you were making to the solar company, right?

The solar loan.

Yeah.

So you're going to be just fine.

What's your household income?

We bring in $11,000 a month.

And you can't save up for closing costs?

No, we can't.

Making $11,000 a month?

Okay.

I'm playing with you to get behind.

I'm going to save the money towards

investment or do I put it

Pay off the debt and then build an emergency fund because you guys don't have one right now, three to six months of expenses, and then you'll still have time to save up closing costs.

Okay.

You have a year of just being on a budget, living on less than you make, taking control of that $11,000 you guys have coming in.

So you're going to be just fine.

But I would choose freedom.

You've already used the inheritance to pay off other debt.

I see this debt no differently.

Okay.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I mostly just wanted to know if it's like, can I count it as paying off a mortgage?

But yeah, I agree with a 6% interest rate.

It's kind of scaring me a little bit.

So

I'd get rid of it.

And it's not part of the mortgage.

And so we're not going to lump it with Baby Step Six.

By the way, you're not even, another little fun reason to pay it off.

You're not really realizing all of that until you've paid it off.

All the savings that these people think they're getting from solar panels.

It takes a long time to break even.

It's a long time to break even.

So go ahead and get it out of your life.

Yeah.

Swig a Pepto-Bismol and then pay it off.

It'll be fine.

Yeah, it's not fun.

All right, for all of you who are listening to The Ramsey Show on YouTube, watching on YouTube rather, and listening on podcasts, the show is about to end, but we got some more calls coming up in the Ramsey Network mobile app.

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Stay right there.

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George thinks he's going to be really great on a couple of the commonas that are lined up.

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Go finish it right now on the app.

See ya.