The Low-Cost, High-Return Strategy for Affordable Housing | DJ Thielen

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When the meteor hits the center of the ocean, it takes time for the for the waves to hit shore, right? And I think that everything that's happened with the debt, with credit card debt, with home foreclosures coming that are being held back. I think that I believe that people that's happened with the debt with credit card debt with home foreclosures coming that

are being held back crazy i think that i believe that people to get in now and learn the game now and get in the in and understand how to navigate and how to make money with various uh strategies yep i think the opportunity in the next four to five years is going to be like nothing that we've ever seen. I really do.
What is up the signs of flipping family? I'm back with an incredible guest, one of my favorites already. And here's why he is an ex professional baseball player and played for my favorite team, the San Francisco Giants.
But he's also an incredible real estate investor, businessman, coach, and just an all-around great human being. Today, we're

talking to DJ Thielen. What's up, dude? What's up, my man? My man.
Yeah, I'm excited. Oh,

I got something for you, actually. Come on, man.
I'm hopeful. Here's the thing.
Yeah.

So, dude, here's the thing, right? Here's the thing. Rookie card, 1993.
There's a funny story

behind it. I'll tell you later.

But, yeah, it's only worth a buck 50.

But, you know, I mean, if you hold it close, I might go up to 250.

Priceless for me right there.

That is priceless.

Yeah, dude.

I mean, I was so excited to hear we were bullshitting about, you know, your baseball journey.

And I'm like, yeah, I'm a super Giants fan.

You didn't even tell me it was Giants.

Yeah, yeah.

You're like, no way.

And so that's how we connected, dude. I'm super excited to have you here.

Yeah, man.

So, they... you know your baseball journey and i'm like yeah i'm a super giants fan you didn't even tell me it was giants yeah yeah you're like no way and so that's how we connected dude i'm super excited to have you here yeah man so thank you for this this is phenomenal dude side and everything this is phenomenal i love it one of one my man look at you young good looking out in the fields love that right on listen the the connection connection between sports and business to me is so pivotal.
And I want to jump right into that. And because there's something that we want to go through about the mindset it takes to be a professional athlete, what it does, believe it before you can see it.
The same is true about business. Absolutely.
So let's jump into that. Oh, dude, 100%.
So So I think, you know, look, I, what I come to know, um, at 53 now, um, is we're, when it comes to anything in life, it all starts with our belief in ourself, right? And obviously as a guy of faith and a believer, um, that's a big part of it too. too but you know if you don't believe in yourself you're nobody else is going to yeah right so the level that you believe that you can do something is a level that you're going to be able to achieve that and so just like I was sharing with you right before this in the third grade I have that piece of paper back there and I wrote down one time like in the third grade I a baseball player, or what do you want to be? I want to be a professional baseball player.
I'm the best player in the minor leagues. I literally wrote that on that, right? So no lack of confidence at 10 years old.
So then I want to play professional baseball, blah, blah, blah. So you fast forward many years later, and I thought about it more than once, but I wrote it down in the third grade and something I wrote down once in the third grade ended up manifesting.
So I'm a big believer in manifestation, writing out the perfect day, vision board, all of that, which we can get into. But I think that, you know, you just have to believe in yourself.
You just do. So let's stay on this for a second because I say something that could be triggery to some people, but people have this ability to believe in Jesus.
Yourself, myself. Have you ever shaken Jesus' hand personally? Have not.
Me neither. Shocker.
But at what level of faith do you have that Jesus walked this planet planet that did everything that was in the bible your level of faith and belief is unmeasurable right yeah but people won't do the same thing for themselves that's where i go whoa bro like this is insane you will believe in a person that rightly so walked this earth, changed the earth.

There's literally like.

That you haven't seen. Nobody has.
There's no one walking the planet right now that has said, hey, I shook Jesus' hand. Nobody.
You don't have one person that can corroborate with you that he is there and he's real and all that stuff. But when you, DJ Thielen or Justin Colby or anyone who wants to help people reach limits beyond where they were that they have reached.
And we ask them to believe in it blindly that you can achieve this thing you're trying to do because you've achieved it and I've achieved it. And then we know is doable.
Somehow there's a breakdown in the belief system. Yeah, that they don't believe they can do it.
They can't align themselves. But again, it could be triggery, but they're willing to have such a deep belief in Jesus Christ.
And I say, there's something amiss there because it's the same level of belief, if not probably deeper. Yeah.
Well, I think a lot of it too, right? As we know, stems from childhood, right? If somebody, I think there's a lot of us, I mean, I grew up with ADHD massive. Like, I mean, dude, I can't believe I was never on medication.
Like, that's how extreme. So massive ADHD, no dad, had some abuse, you know, poor financially, single mom working two jobs.
And I think that you either take that and go, you know, you learn from it. Like, hey, I understand what it means to work hard.
I understand what it means to, you know, be a good parent, right? Or the best parent that my mom knew how to be, right? With what she was given. So I think that you either become the victim or the victor, but it's really a choice.
I mean, there's a lot of people that grew up with alcoholic parents and they either become just like that or they go, I'm never going to do that. So I think that in knowing what we want, we can really get to our goals or manifest by knowing what we don't want.

Right. Like for me, it was like my dad wasn't there.

It's like I'm going to be there for my son.

And that was the beginning of, you know, he was born and I was going to take a year off and go back and never did.

So I think that in knowing what we want is great, obviously is huge.

But also knowing like how we don't want to be and knowing what we don't want or how we don't want to be can also lead us to how we want to be. If that's.
So do you, you know, you've coached hundreds, thousands of people. I mean, you've been around a long time helping others achieve.
Yeah. Do you find that the motivation of what you don't want is stronger than what you want? Or do you find people's desire or motivation to get what they don't have or the thing they want is stronger than what they don't want? That's a good question, man.
For me, I think the motivation for what I want is stronger for me personally. But I think the key is, is you have to keep reinventing.
So when you hit those goals, you gotta be humble enough to go, okay, these were my goals. I'm getting close to them.
Let me move out another five years, 10 years, right? And you keep moving that, knowing that you're probably never gonna hit it. But like, if I do hit it, Hey, let me, 10 years.
Right. And you keep moving that, um, knowing that you're probably never going to hit it.
Yeah. But, but like when, if I do hit it, Hey, let me, let me set some new goals that are bigger and badder and right.
And let me push that out again. So I think that where you don't get comfortable, I think that you always have to be willing to push the envelope and not get comfortable because I, I just feel like, um, you know, we're, always be better.
Yeah. And so just chasing that best version of us, I think.
Yeah, I think, you know, it's funny. I've coached thousands of people in the real estate space specifically.
And and I come to find that people tend to be more motivated by the thing they want. Although for me, I'm a little bit more like you.
I didn't want to be to be my mom my daddy and stepdad all alcoholics my mom made a depressive uh pill popper like the whole thing right yeah and i'm more motivated but what i don't want to become or what i didn't want or the reality of what my childhood was then i'm necessarily motivated i mean there's a combination sure but that definitely was the motivation for me to get off my ass and go do the thing.

Now I'm at a place in life where it's definitely

more motivated by like, oh, I'm not even,

I can achieve even more.

And there's more out there to go do.

But it is an interesting question I'm posing too

because I think it's people, you know,

are either led by the carrot or the stick.

And I think people have to rectify like,

is it more important for you to not have the thing you don't want? Or is it more important for you to excel and achieve? Because I believe we're all here to go to the moon and back. Like we are here to live our highest highs, live the epic life, right? So how does this kind of getting back to this transition of sports to business, how do we connect those two? Because there's a lot of the mental similarities there.
I just think that, you know, and I think that a couple of things. So when it comes to anything in life, it comes down to our thoughts, our beliefs, our habits, our routines.
That's

really what it comes down to. So I think a lot of times people are like, well, how do I believe in myself? How do I get into action? You've got to get into action.
It's the Tony Robbins success cycle. It's like, as I get into action, when I ask people, what do you think it starts with? Is it action? Is it belief?

Where do you think it starts?

And everyone picks it wrong.

And it's seeing it.

It's already seeing it as if it already happened.

Without actually feeling it.

See it before you feel it.

And then you see it in your mind.

So when you see it in your mind, you're going to want to take more action.

When you take more action, you get great results. So you see, it starts with seeing the results, right? Then you're going to be motivated to take action.
Then you get good results. And then that leads to tapping your highest level of potential.
And this thing will spiral, I found, either for you or against you, right? And so if you think that, if you can see it in your mind, that whole thing, if you see it in your mind, you can hold it in your hand. It really is true, man.
It really is. And so I think that, um, for people to, to see it in their mind, that's why I'm a big believer in vision board, but then you got it.
You got to take action. Like you got to get into, I think that's where the rubber hits the road with a lot of entrepreneurs talking about entrepreneurship is people want this and they say they want this, but then it's like, yeah, but, and then they start coming up with all these excuses.
well but I'm working oh I got a kid well I've got this or that or whatever and then you got to get

around communities that or or events or whatever where there's other people that are actually have are busier than you and open and you go oh my god man this guy drives three hours a day for work has to get up at two o'clock to just to get a workout in and he's done 10 deals and i've got a guy like that i mentor right now he's done 10 deals's done 10 deals in three months. Right.
And so what's your excuse kind of thing. So I think you, I think the more that we're exposed and around people that are doing big things, um, that, that, that nucleus, right.
The core group, it, it, it pulls the best out in us. Yeah.
Really does. Obviously the sports and business world.
Now, why did you go down real estate? Like, you know, you leave professional sports and real estate becomes your new addiction, right? So why real estate at all the things you could have been doing? Well, yeah. So the funny thing is at first it wasn't.
So when I left, when I unexpectedly left ball, like a lot of people, right? Life throws you a curveball, no pun intended, and you just, you got to make adjustments. So as that journey started and kind of being a dad that I didn't have right down a new path, was I had a guy, Chuck Roberts, actually take me under his wing.
He was the number one sales guy in the country for home security systems, took me under his wing and basically started his first company that he built to a multi freaking million dollar company. And he took me under his wing and said, Hey, DJ, I was doing telemarketing.
He said, Hey, would you want to make some more money? Do you want to make some more money? Right. The power of asking a great question.
Yeah, yeah. So I said, I was like, yeah, of course.
Right. There's one year old or whatever.
So, uh, so I ended up, uh, he started his first company. I was his only sales rep.
It was a huge blessing because he took me under his wing and taught me. Um, I mean, I was running 40 appointments, 40, 50 appointments, uh, uh, a week at a Thomas guide.
We didn't have the the, right? So that taught me, that really taught me a lot. He taught me a lot about sales.
He taught me a lot about people. And I always loved helping people, but he taught me a lot about the intangibles of sales, having a process, you know, how to build a heart connection, how to how to build rapport, all of that.
Right. The basics.
And and really, that was the beginning of kind of my entrepreneur journey. I left there two years later, started my own company because I thought I knew, you know, you know, everything.
Yeah, you're not right. So so I did that and then got lucky and sold it some years later.
and when I sold it, that's what got me into real estate. I always wanted to get into real estate.
I always watched the Carlton Sheets, Russ Dalby, all that, the old school, Dean Graziosi, who's still, you know, killing it. But I used to watch these, Justin, and I used to say, I don't know what it was, man.
It was like just something in my soul was like, I just loved, I was just like, I want to learn that. Yeah.
So after I sold my company, I went to an event. It was Robert Allen and Kiyosaki, like a co-event.
Sure. And then, you know, they upsell you to the $4,000 weekend.
So I did that, and you come away with the big, thick books. Now, and I were talking about this, you know, it wasn't, uh, I wasn't the most studious kid in the class.
Right. So I'll leave it at that.
But so, you know, rather than going through these books, I just was like, Hey, I, everything in my life, how to hit a baseball, how to build a business. I just knew myself well enough to know I learned by doing.
Yeah. Right.
So I knew like I just got to get in the game. OK.
And I'll figure it out. So I jumped on eBay.
By the way, never. By the way, you guys never do this.
I jumped get a mentor. I jumped on eBay and I bought 10 homes for 50 grand.
Quick, quick story. Bought 10 homes, 50 grand.
Thought I was going to make, you know, all this millions of dollars yeah and everyone was telling me that I was crazy and I was going to lose all my money and so uh I fly out there to um uh Ohio Pennsylvania market I fly out there and I go to the first home it's torn down second one's like this right falling over and I after the first one I call the guy his numbers disconnect's like oh here we go right like here we go so um so it was like okay I gotta make a choice here and so from that um going back to how does baseball relate to entrepreneurship right it's kind of like you just you you just don't quit you know you just don't quit you just go hey this is the cards I'm dealt, right? I had a bat at bat. Get over it.
And let's have some good at bats. I want to pause you there because you said something that I think a lot of people really need to rewind and listen again.
But you say get a coach. And the reason why that's important is because if you had a coach and that you could call, hey, should I spend this $50,000 on these 10 homes? Most likely, if this coach was worth their salt, they would have said, no, don't do that.
Here's why. These four, you're going to lose money.
These four, you're going to likely break even. And maybe a best case scenario, these two, you make some money.
But that's best case scenario, perfect world. So you probably shouldn't go that route to start yeah if you had a coach at that moment you probably would have avoided the pitfall of the experience you just went through and people get so short-sighted and they go to youtube university and yes i get that we're on youtube and you're watching this on youtube now right or they go to podcasts and yes i understand the irony of them listening to some podcasts.
But they get so short-sighted to invest in themselves with a coach and they're not

investing in you. You run an incredible coaching business, Cheaper Homes, Cheap Homes University.

Is that their website where they can find you? Cheaphomesuniversity.com. Incredible coach,

incredible human. I encourage you to get there.
We'll talk a little bit more about why Cheap Homes,

but I mean, the reality is people are investing themselves not you they're investing themselves not me because they need to know what you the lessons you learned not necessarily the tactic you need to say don't do that because it was a hard lesson yes do this instead yes right that is really pivotal especially for people like you and me that tend to just blow through walls and ask questions later. I have coaches.
Jump off the cliff and build a plane on the way down. That's right.
Pack your parachute on the way down. Let's jump into why cheaper homes.
I'm curious. I've done a lot of real estate over my years.
I've done the million dollar flip. I've done developments.
I'm currently buying apartments and, and I'm still buying cheaper homes. So I have my answer.
Why cheap homes for you? So for me, you know, honestly, it was, um, I, my, my initial plan, I was living in Seattle, Washington in 2000 where there's no cheap homes, but okay. In 2005.
Yeah. Yeah.
Like nothing when I started. And, um, so I, I started there and I started there and and my my initial idea was okay I have a little money let me buy these cheap ones learn on them and then I can bring one I learned back and do it here in the in Tacoma you know Seattle area right and that was my initial thought and so as we know um life doesn't always work out the direction that we want, right? It's like this.
So I just was going to do it to learn initially. I picked up my first year, I picked up a couple dozen.
And, you know, I had contractors run off with money, couldn't find a good manager. Shocker.
And I, yeah, I started to very quickly understand like, oh my God, like, like this is, this is not what I thought. Yeah.
And, um, right. All the pain points, all the less, all the life lessons, trusting the wrong people, um, partnering with the wrong people, you know, you name it.
And so, but that was really the beginning and kind of the circle back and answer your question. Why cheap homes is as as I started doing this you know in 2005 and then 2006 had a buddy it was like hey hook me up with some of these right and so I got him a couple good deals and fixed them and all that and that was kind of the start of the our turnkey operation which we can talk about but for me knowing what I know now, the reason that I love cheap homes is one, it's super low risk, right? So it's a super low entry.
Almost anyone can get into it. Low barrier of entry.
Two is that if you know the right exit strategies, which a lot of people don't, they think, oh, I just have to fix it and rent it. That's the only strategy.
But if they know the right exit strategies, like being a bank, seller financing, buying them on seller financing, selling them on seller financing, and a bunch of other things, then I just feel like it's a low barrier of entry. It's low cost, high return, and low risk.
But it really all comes down to having, you know, who are you working with? Who are you learning from? Who are you taking guidance from? And I'm super thankful that like I'm at a point now, 19 years later and 4,000 deals that I've literally sold. And that doesn't count our holdings is I've learned so much that when people that I coach and mentor have an issue, I recently helped a guy, Eric, he brought an issue to me with a friend that had a property.
I said, dude, I can show you. I said, tell me the story.
I said, I can show you to get the house for $1,000 free and clear. And it's got a lady in there.
She wasn't paying, but we can get her to pay and I'll show you how to do that too. And he's like, what? Like, dude, how? Right.
And so and we did. And he did.
He's got the deed, got a house for a thousand bucks. The lady's paying 650 a month and the house is probably worth 60 or 70 grand.
So you go, how in the world? Right. And it's just it's knowing when you've been down that road.
All I tell people is where you're usually where you're probably at now. I passed that like 18 years ago right so i'm just farther down the road that's it and so i can just help not have you like oh hey you know wake up you know like get back and i'm like that uh what are you the guardrail yeah right i'm the guardrail so they don't they don't go like this and they end up they yeah they end up off in you know the wilderness and they get they get turned around and lost and it takes them five years to get back to the freeway right so I'm just further down the road and so it's great because like had I oh dude had I had a mentor one to be honest when I was in my mid-20s or I say early 30s uh at the at this point in real estate, I don't know if I'm being totally honest.
I don't know that I would have really listened to him the way that I would listen now. Sure.
Right. Like, like you think, you know, it all, you think that, oh yeah, yeah, whatever.
But now it's like, that's why I'm constantly going to events. It's why I was to you guys at Cody's event.
It's like, I just want to constantly be learning, constantly be growing around other people that are doing more than me. And I think that, yeah, knowing what I know now, I absolutely would have found a mentor because they would have saved me easy 10, 15 years.
And I would be so much farther ahead than where I am. But the blessing is I went down that road.
So now I can help other people not have to go and get beat up like that. I think every decade, I think I know it all.
20 thought I knew it all. 30 thought I knew it all.
40 thought, right. It's just this, you get, you get perspective based around the runway you go down.
Right. So being in real estate for 20 years, you get perspective of what you do and don't know.
And how could you have handled these things better? And what, you can only connect the dots looking backwards. So what was the moment that changed this thing? And so, you know, to your point, you know, the cheap homes, I still love cheap homes.
I'm still buying in Alabama. I'm buying in parts of Florida, which isn't quite as cheap anymore.
But I'm buying because what you brought up, the creativity that you have now. You can fix and flip it.
You can buy it, remodel it, and rent. You can do the more of the, you know.
Conventional. Conventional ways that we do this.
But let's talk about the creative side of things. I mean, you just talked about the seller finance notes.
Let's talk about some creative deals that you've done. Like, I like this example of the one you did with one of your students.
Talk about that. Like, how did you structure that where he's $1,000 into this property, the tenant's paying $650, owns it with the deed.
Talk about the creativeness that you can do with cheap homes. Yeah.
So, and plus, I think, too, Justin, affordable housing right now is huge. Huge.
Right? So, in these markets, there's a lot of markets, right. You, you know, statewide, Michigan, uh, Louisiana, uh, Louisiana, Ohio, Pennsylvania, uh, Indiana, um, Iowa, you know, there's some areas you don't want to be in some of you do, but affordable housing is huge right now, right.
With what's happening with inflation and, and cost of living and affordability and everything. So I think that's great.
But yeah, to answer your question. So yeah, long story short, he had a friend that owned this house.
The guy, a lot of times people do things and they don't even know, they use the wrong agreements. They use the wrong instruments, like contracts.
They don't really know what they're doing. It's kind of a chuck in a truck, backyard billy kind of.
Chuck in a truck. Chuck in a truck, right? I learned that from Myron Golden.
But it's like a chuck in a truck kind of ordeal. And so, yeah, he had a guy that worked for him that was in financial ruins.
He had this house. He didn't have insurance on it because he couldn't afford it.
He owed two years of back taxes or no, like a year and a half. So in that state, the state will take it, right? And basically sell it at a tax check.
So he was in kind of on the, on the fence of that happening. This lady in there owed him 300 or owed him $300, still hadn't paid him in two years.
Right. And so I told Eric, uh, I said, bro, um, it's super easy, right? Do a quick title search.
We'll make sure it's clean. And then all we're going to do is use a quick clean deed.
Um, I have a SimpliFile, which is a same software. A lot of title companies use.
I can e-record any document anywhere in the country. So, um, so I said, Hey, let's do a quick title search, check it.
Uh, and I said said what you're going to do is go to him and say hey i know this lady owes you 300 or maybe it was 400 bucks three or 400 bucks he hasn't paid you to fulfill the original it was like a land contract yep and so um but it wasn't recorded right so i said um why don't you go to him and say hey uh look you're in danger from so it's it's all about solving problems yep right not it's not about taking advantage of some people go all that take no it's not because he wasn't going to get anything right and so now he's getting at least a thousand dollars which helped him tremendously in his situation and and, Eric just said, Hey, would you take a thousand

dollars and I'll take it off your plate? Cause if you don't, you're going to lose it. Cause your

name's still on the deed. Cause the deed doesn't transfer on a land contract.
You have to transfer

it. Right.
Yeah. So, so anyways, I just helped him solve the guy's problem.
And the guy was super

thankful, super appreciative. He gave him a thousand dollars.
We fill out a quick claim deed.

Um, and instead of doing it online for him, I taught him, right. I think that's the biggest

Thank you. super thankful, super appreciative.
He gave him a thousand dollars. We fill out a quick claim deed.
And instead of doing it online for him, I taught him. Right.
I think that's the biggest thing with mentorship. You can't do things for people who have to teach them how that was my biggest mistake when I first started years ago.
Now it's like, hey, here's the deed. Go down to the whatever county recorder's office, go to the county recorder's office.
They're very kind kind they'll help you record it right they'll tell you what you got to do help you record it and it'll be recorded usually same day next day and then they'll give you the stamp copy it's official you take the stamp copy you go to the house you talk to the lady and then here's how you approach them right and so anyways um so it's it's really just it all comes down to solving problems that's it and using but but a lot of people you know don't even realize like we talk about seller finance so seller financing is huge right now right huge have you done any um installment agreement sales tons have you so here so here's the key on seller finance this will be a huge huge nugget for people watching this to add value. Anytime you buy a property on seller financing, you need to use a promissory note of mortgage and a deed.
Run it through the title company, get title insurance. That's the way you want to do it for a couple of reasons.
One, it's safe because you know the title's clean. You got in title insurance, right? Two is that you're on the deed.
And so now any equity that you captured, if you got it for 40, it's worth 90. You just made $50,000 in equity, just snatching it, right? Then not counting the cash flow and all of that.
So you want the equity and you want to be on the deed, right? So if you buy a deal on seller finance, that's the instrument you use. If you sell a property on seller finance, you want to use either a contract for deed or a land installment contract.
The reason is because, a couple reasons. One, so a contract for deed, land contract, same thing.
It's a contract in exchange for the deed when the contract's completed. That's right.
Right? And the reason you want to do that, and we can record them or not record them, it's valid either way. But the reason that's important is you don't, like, one, you want to give them a reason to make their payments and pay you off.
Right. Right? So now they have an incentive, hey, once this is paid, you're going to get the deed.
Because there's a carrot at the end. So that's number one, which is huge.
Number two is that you want to be on the, obviously the deed until it's paid for because, well, let's say it goes bad. People go, what happens if they don't pay me? So in Pennsylvania, a default on a contract, a lot of people don't know, a lot of attorneys don't even know this.
They have a statute that a default on a land contract, if they default past a default date that's in the contract, it automatically converts to a lease, more or less a rental. Right? So they lose their equitable interest and their rights.
So at the end of the day, it's basically like an advanced eviction. It's not a foreclosure.
Wow. Right? And so, but just knowing, like, you can even buy a house on seller finance

with a promissory note mortgage deed. Your payment's $200 a month, and you go and you

collect $900 or $1,000, and you sell it on a land contract, contract for deed scenario,

and you just make the spread, right, from the $200 to the $700 gross, right? There's

Thank you. sell it on a land contract, a contract for deed scenario, and you just make the spread, right from the 200 to the seven gross, right? There's tax and insurance, but that's a great way for people that don't want to have rentals or they don't want to like, you don't have to fix it.
You don't have to do anything. You just pay the tax and insurance and you collect a check and you, right.
So there's, there's a lot of ways to do it that I don't think people just aren't exposed to, you know? So, so talk to me a little bit about, someone just brought this up literally, I think yesterday about installment purchases. Yeah.
Right. What is the difference between that and just a seller finance? I know it's, it's essentially the same thing.
I just have never structured the paperwork with an installment purchase. Yeah.
Right? But tell me the difference essentially is as a buyer, if you do that or as a seller, are you sharing ownership on the deed? Is that what separates the difference? No, on a land contract slash contract for deed, they're're the same thing article of agreement they're all kind of yeah the same um so that is what he's talking about someone brought it up you should do a installment purchase on this we're basically doing a land contract for if i'm buying deals very rare i never like to buy a deal and buy it on a uh contract for deed or a land contract. Correct.
The reason is I'm not the owner and I'm paying for everything and I don't have the equity and I can't refinance it. Right.
So all the benefits, I can't depreciate it. Right.
Whereas if I close on it with a promise or no mortgage deed, I take title. Now I can have the depreciation benefits.

I have the equity that I can't.

And yeah, that's the only way that I would advise people.

When you buy a deal, that's how you buy it.

You want to be on title.

Yeah, but if you sell properties, never transfer that and use installment contracts.

They're great.

Is there any difference in the contract from from a is it installment to yeah installment from maybe contract for deed other no they're they're the same thing it's interchangeable words i think that's what i got caught up it's essentially interchangeable words contract for needs meaning i'm going to pay you off over time and when i pay you off i get the deed yeah it's same an installment agreement. Yeah.
And a lot of times when we record them online, a contract for deed, a land installment contract, an article of agreement, they record all of them as a land contract. That's what it's recorded under.
So it's basically a land installment contract. Got it.
Officially a land installment contract. Got it.
Yeah. Okay.
So here's the reason why I still love the cheap housing is for everything you just said, is it creates options on your exit. And that's what I think a lot of people don't understand is a lot of people get in and let's just use wholesaling as an example.
You come in as a wholesaler, you're just a wholesaler, right? You need to go find someone who sees value in that property. If you're a fix and flipper, you are a hammer.
You got to look for a nail. You fix and flip.
It's all you do. If you're a long-term landlord buyer, you're looking for the right buyer.
Now you run a turnkey property company, so we can talk about that, but that's all the person is. But for the people that actually want to have some level of volume or business is a better way of saying that, then they need diversity in how they exit the property.
And cheap homes gives you the diversity. You can wholesale it.
You can buy and rental. You could fix and flip it.
You can sell it off as a seller finance. No, a land contract.
You just get the diversity in that. And people think I'm getting crazy in my old age, right? Why are you buying all this stuff in Alabama? I'm like, I'm buying a multimillion dollar apartment for $250,000 yeah I'm gonna have an affordable housing I get tax depreciation I keep it for the long term I have 40% equity when I'm done with the thing like that's why now is it a lift to get it there sure but it allows me to have you know 16 or 22 doors in a lower price market yeah than Miami yeah right um but that's also not for everyone I mean you run a very successful turnkey business yeah who would be the best turnkey type of investor who are you talking to there those are yeah those are usually uh people that are business owners entrepreneurs um they have a you you know, multiple six figure or even a seven

figure job. So they have the capital and they have the money coming in and they just need to leverage their time.
And so for like, those are usually the kind of people that we get properties for and we get them to them, Justin. I think I sent you one.
You know, the one I sent you was uh 60 000 uh new windows, new roof, had a tenant pay 950, right?

And so like, and the prices can fluctuate, but like, you know, like for somebody that's busy, that's working a full-time job, right? Like that's beautiful because it's a, whatever the return is, 12, 13, 15%, right? But in these markets too, what you got to understand is, and kind of a golden nugget is I tell people, you find the, in the cheap markets, you find the big cities and you go out 30, 45 an hour, hour 15, even up to an hour and a half. But you go to these tertiary outskirt markets and the reason this is so important for people to kind of grasp, and this is stuff I usually only share with my coaching, but I want to help people, is one, there's not as much competition.
Sure. So, you know, you can catch more fish.
Two is that there's not, because there's not a lot of competition, if you're doing emailers and postcards and having a cold caller call them, you're probably the only one hitting them up so you can get more deals. And then three is that in these outskirt tertiary markets, the population's growing, right? People are growing up in a lot of these places now and not leaving because it is affordable and they can make it there and they can work remote, right? Working remote.
The working remote changed everyone's game. It changed everything.
That's right. So now in these small cities, people are growing up there now and not going, man, I got to get the hell out of here.
They're just going, hey, I'm going to hang here. I can work remote.
I can have an app on my phone and sell sneakers or whatever I want to do. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And so I think that because there's so many options for working remote and because it's affordable, people aren't leaving.

Well, and the great thing is nobody's building houses in a lot of these small on-scirt communities. No one's building.
So what does that mean? Supply and demand. That's right.
And so everything comes down to supply and demand. And so what's happening in those cities now, like houses we were getting five years ago, $ to 750, we're easily getting 11 to 1200.
No problem now. So think about that.
And a lot of times the taxes don't really go up much, if any, right. But the rents have just skyrocketed because of supply and demand.
And so we help, we help people, uh, the turnkey The turnkey model is great for people that have money. They have capital.
They want to get in the game where they're like, dude, if you can, you know, because we get them the property, we fix it, we rent it, we manage it. We do everything vertically integrated.
So it's nice because they deal with me and really my executive, which is world class. So they deal with all my gals.
And then it's just a matter of taking care of them, over-delivering and capturing the repeat business. Once they do one and they see that it works and they trust you, then it's like, oh man, off to the races.
Hey, we want to buy four or five of these a year. So you create the repeat business, but you don't forget about the importance of constantly having some new business come in because you never want to be dependent on one source of anything, really.
Totally. Yeah.
You know, listen, we're saying the same thing over and over again, but I would tell you guys, if you aren't yet following DJ, follow him. Great human being, first and foremost.
So I give you that. Thanks, man.
But, you know, he really is the right educator for the time and days of today's real estate education is, is get into the deals, whether you're a turnkey person with like higher W2, you need some tax write-offs, you need, you know, return on your investment. Turnkey is the model.
I mean, that's just, if I had no time, all I'm doing is turnkey. I want to return on my cash, right? So if I have high income doctors, lawyers, other real estate investors, like, God, let me just dump some money in a turnkey scenario.
Plus Justin, as you know, dude, these people, a lot of them don't know these high earners. You can, the depreciation right now, this year it's 60%.
I think it goes back up though. I think right after this year.
If drugs get collected, it'll go, back to 100%. 100%.
But where you can depreciate 100% of that year one, bonus accelerated depreciation, there's criteria, but ultimately not getting hung up in the weeds. Like dude, most people, if they buy one or two or three or four investment properties a year and they pay 100, 200 grand in taxes or 50 grand or 80 grand, they can literally, as you know, eliminate their tax bill.
You can flow it through to your personal income taxes. And so a lot of high income earners, not just the return that they can get and all of that, right? But it's the tax savings that will, it's like you're either going to pay Uncle Sam or you can take that same money, buy some real estate assets that you have equity in, you have cash flow in, and you can get great returns.
Which one would you kind of rather have, right? A lot of people too, they don't look at it. I always tell people, you got to look at things LTV.
What's the lifetime value? If you buy one rental for 60 or 70 K and it's ready now for 11 or 1200, if you, I already ran the data on this. If you, if you're 50, like me, 53 and you live to be 103, I hold it for 50 years.
That house will pay me over a million dollars, right? And it doubles every 10 years. They go, oh, I'm making $1,100 a month.
No, that's paying you $1.4 million over your life. So imagine getting 50 of those, right? That's like $60 million that those houses are going to pay you over the course of your life, not counting the depreciation and all the other benefits, right? There's not a person that can make an argument that shouldn't be, like I say this all the time on my social media, everybody needs to be in real estate.
Yeah, yeah. Everyone, I don't care if you're 19 or you're 91.
Yeah. You need to be in real estate for everything you just said.
Income, appreciationoff right like that is everything right and so guys um i will tell you right now make sure you're following dj make sure you go to cheaphomesuniversity.com everything this man does he does it with integrity he does it with all of his heart he's an incredible human being and an ex-sanan Francisco baseball player. Brother, I appreciate you coming on.
Anywhere else do you want to point them? No, man. I think, look, I think that, I mean, those of you that want to reach out, also my IG is just at d.j.thelen.com.
That's d.j.thelen, T-H-I-E-L-E-N, Thielen, uh, dot com. So if you guys want to go to my IG, you can literally DM me, you can text me on there, but yeah, you can go to cheaphomesuniversity.com, um, and check us out, uh, get in touch with us.
Um, you know, jump on a phone call and really just see how we can help you personally, depending on your situation, because everyone's situation is different. And, you know, we're not high pressure.
It's kind of like, hey, what's going on? How can we help? If we can help, you know, we go, we kind of figure out, hey, where do we go from here kind of thing? And then, but yeah, I think, and yeah, I definitely think it's a great time. I'll end with this.
Justin's, I think this is really big for people to hear. And I'm not just saying this to like get business.
I really believe this. I went through the last downturn.
And I believe that I told everyone in 22, when everyone was screaming from the hill tops, 23 is going to crash. I said, no, it's not.
It's going to be this right my fiancee kristin always we talk laugh about it now and i think i'm i was right because when the meteor hits the center of the ocean it takes time for the for the waves to hit short right and i think that everything that's happened with the debt with credit card debt with home foreclosures coming that are being held back i I think that I believe that people to get in now and learn the game now and get in the, and understand how to navigate and how to make money with various strategies. Yep.
I think the opportunity in the next four to five years is going to be like nothing that we've ever seen. I really do.
I just think that there's going to be a lot of fear when fear is out there and there's uncertainty. people are going to be like nothing that we've ever seen.
I really do. I just think that there's going to be a lot of fear when fear is out there and there's uncertainty.
People are going to be more willing to sell their home, more willing to take a seller financed offer. Right.
So there's going to be a lot more ability to get deals, get them cheaper and even get them with great terms. So the next 10 years, you know, the best 10 years to be in real estate period.
I'm totally with you.

I'm going to buy everything I possibly can.

In 10 years, I'll look up and I'll say, all right, now what do I want to do, right?

Yeah, retire in Italy.

Something.

I'll take it.

Lake Cuomo.

Brother, appreciate you being here as always.

You're an incredible human again.

DJ Thielen is here at CheaperHomesUniversity.com.

And if this meant anything to you, if you found one or two gold nuggets,