Camino de Santiago w/ Jasmin Shah | You Be Trippin' with Ari Shaffir

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You ever heard an award for photography?

No.

Never?

Okay, I was going to say an award-winning photographer.

Hold on, Bennett, one second.

My parents think I'm pretty.

Okay.

Where you been and where are you going?

This is our race travel show.

Yeah, we're going to talk about travel today.

It's you'll be tripping.

Yeah.

Hello, everybody.

Welcome to UB Trippin', the travel podcast that takes you to interesting places around.

It's not a travel guide, it is an experiential podcast.

Today, I have on a woman I met in Paris, France at Rolf Potts Writing Class, an accomplished photographer and an accomplished traveler herself.

Please welcome Jasmine Shaw.

Hi, thank you.

Jasmine, where are we going today?

We are going to the Camino de Santiago, specifically Camino del Norte in Spain.

Very cool.

I love a hike.

Yeah.

So I I had not heard of this until Michelle Wolf told me about it.

I didn't know anything about it, but it's pretty famous.

Very famous.

It's been around for

hundreds, thousands of years.

Whoa.

Yeah.

What is it?

It is a pilgrimage hike.

It started as a religious hike, but it now I think maybe about only 15% of the people were...

Oh, yeah.

Is it?

I got a map here.

So it's

from around here.

It's from France into Spain.

Well, there's multiple versions

that are,

there's like multiple different routes, but so I picked, anyway, so the normal is just the Camino de Santiago, and then I did the Camino del Norte, which is hugs, like starts in the Basque region and Irun, Spain, and it goes, hugs the northern coast of Spain, and then the last week I go down into Santiago.

They all end in Santiago, de Compostela.

Okay.

And so it's like,

is the Norte and the Sewer?

Is that it?

Are they the same amount of time?

There's the Camino Francesse, which is what, like, there was a movie with Martin Sheen.

No, not Martin.

The, who's the dad?

Charlie Sheen?

No.

Oh, Martin Sheen.

It was Martin Sheen, yeah.

That he did called The Way, and that's the Camino Frances.

And that kind of, that goes from France and like kind of more like through Pamplona and but it's more central and the route that I did hugs the northern coast and so you're like seeing the coast the whole time, and it's really beautiful, but also really hilly that I hadn't accounted for.

Yeah, it's hard, yeah.

Um, oh, I should also say, Jasmine is an accomplished uh photographer.

I gotta give people, especially when you're not a comb, I gotta give people like some credits so people take you seriously.

Um, but regardless, she's a traveler, yes, I am a traveler, um, and I'm a nomad, also.

Are you really?

Yes, I don't have a lot.

Oh, yeah, I haven't had a home since

July, July 1st, 2019.

Really?

Yeah, since before the pandemic, Yeah.

Awkward timing because that made it really hard.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And then I lived in a van for a year, sold the van this March, and then now I'm

back to

traveling.

Go ahead.

Nope.

Mostly only in America or everywhere?

The van?

No, I mean, just nomad life in general.

So the nomad life started off with an international bent.

So I was traveling all over, and then I was in Morocco actually March, March up to March 14th 2020 March 15th 2020 when shit was going down with COVID and so I hustled back to the US because I just didn't know what was going on and then

and then

yeah COVID figured I didn't have a house to stay in place at so I just luckily had some friends who I was like able to crash at their place and then eventually I rode trip all over the US just in a rental car And then I bought a van, had it built in my home, and I lived in that for a year.

Now I sold that, and now I'm back to international nomadding.

You know what I understand?

You ever hear somebody try to explain space to like a kid, the infinity version of it?

And they're like, it goes on forever.

And then they're like, but what's after that?

It just keeps going.

And then what?

There is no then what?

It just keeps going.

My thing with nomads is like, but where do you live?

It's like, you don't?

But like, there's never been that and

just like backpacking, like travel, right?

Like, do you hole up somewhere?

I am, I'm actually going in December, January.

I'm going to Mexico City for two months.

And that's going to be like a pretty long stay for me.

And I'm really

looking forward to that.

Just having like a base.

It might be time for me to start figuring out like a little bit of a base.

But no, I've just been.

bouncing.

And it's really great.

Really diary.

It is very, very cool.

But it's, it's, yeah.

But that's what gives me time to go on a walk for five weeks.

Yeah, I've always

don't have the time for that.

Yeah, not at all.

Yeah.

That I want to go, like, that, you know, buy a bike in like southern Vietnam and then like sell it in northern Vietnam or vice versa.

And it's like, it's like three or four weeks a time.

You've got to follow it.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So let's talk about this one.

Okay.

Yes.

How long had you been thinking about this?

It had been, I'd heard about it probably like 10 years ago.

So it was always there, but I think I hadn't had time for it and hadn't um but it was just like oh that like seems like an interesting walk and yes it started as a religious pilgrimage but now it's like maybe 10 15 percent of people are doing

yeah I didn't it was mostly people who just felt like going for a long walk you know the thing about brutalist architecture yeah um so there's these no they're not called Berlin something with a B a husband and wife team and they just photograph these like um factories they think they're just gorgeous these factories and they're works of art and people ask them like what are they making there?

And they're like, we don't give a shit.

It's got nothing to do with why we like it.

Right.

You know, it's like, oh, I liked Mexico.

Like, well, how was it formed as a country?

Like, what?

Yeah.

Yeah.

I like it now.

Yeah.

It's so funny with these things, too.

It's like, is it a pilgrimage?

I'm like, I guess.

I'm not interested in the history.

No.

I mean, unless you know it.

No, I mean, I went to the museum at the very end and looked around and it was slightly interesting, but it was more about the walk.

Okay.

So how many days?

How long?

Like, what are you prepared for?

Oh.

Were you a hiker ahead of time?

Yeah, I like hiking.

Oh, so I had known about it for a long time.

And then two months prior, I had my grandmother die, my cousin died, and I sold my van.

And

I just

needed some time to walk it out and think and stuff.

So

then I just basically

planned it.

Like I had a month and a half before and just kind of was like, you know what?

I've got some free time ahead.

And was it end of May, June?

Let me go do that walk and then that's how that came about

um look at this idiot i thought that's always in and out

um sorry that's okay up come on up up up banned it up up up up up do it yeah

what's up buddy okay um first of all this is awesome the alone time is what i envy the most yes yes did you did you get i mean i people would i could see people saying it'd be lonely but i would be like yeah oh it'd be so nice i mean as a nomad i am alone a lot because i'm just out in the world away from friends and family um but i was because of I just really wanted to think and I really, so the Camino del Norte is a less traveled one than the Camino Frances.

Is that why you chose that one?

Yeah.

Yeah.

So I chose it because I wanted one and also the coastal views.

As a photographer, it just looked beautiful.

So I wanted that.

And,

you know, it just looked epic, but it also looked like many less people.

And so until like some of the days when I wouldn't see a fellow

pilgrim

for a whole day sometimes.

And then I was like, okay, this is going to be like pretty lonely.

Or like, this is like maybe a little more than I thought.

But

most of the time, I would see other pilgrims.

And you can always see people on like the locals and the bars and cafes that you're stopping at.

But so it goes through towns?

Yeah.

It goes through towns.

It goes through.

And yes, I've been, I hike a lot, so that was easy, but you don't need a whole lot of technical skill to do this.

It's just walking.

It's not like scrambling or anything.

There are a couple moments, but no.

But you are carrying a heavy pack.

You're carrying everything that you need for the whole entire time, which for me was five weeks,

515 miles.

515 miles.

Yeah.

Let's get back to it for a second, but like when you're done with this, you must feel cool.

Right?

I mean, you must feel like sick.

I felt accomplished, but honestly,

I got kind of depressed after

because the thing that I'd been doing for five weeks that made every single day just like super, like wake up, you know, you know, brush my teeth, put on sunscreen, get my pack all sorted, get everything ready, and just like, it's a matter of like, how much am I hiking that day?

Like usually between 10 and 22, 23 miles a day.

And so that was all I had to do was just walk.

And then once I finished, it was like, fuck, like, what do I do?

What's your life now?

Yeah.

I think women get like that.

after childbirth and then like

men and women both get like that after a wedding where it's like it's all geared towards this thing and then like

but then it's like now what you know I don't know yeah I get like that after I do a comedy special yeah just like a depression of like ah fuck that's over

yeah so it was very like just obviously I felt fucking awesome when I walked into Santiago de Compostela and was like I did it because I didn't know there were some points where I really was unsure my feet started I really like screwed up my feet a little bit in the process.

And so I wasn't sure if I was going to finish it.

You thought about quitting?

No.

Never.

I

would.

That's not my personality.

I wouldn't.

Unless like physically I really fucked up my feet.

But I think I was okay.

I just had to

tape them up and like do all the stuff to keep going.

Is this a specific time of year or just keeps going?

It's not like a race.

No, and you can start any day you want to start.

Everyone starts whenever they feel like starting.

And then you also can hike just like some people just hike a week of it or some people hike, go fly in, especially the locals or Spaniards just will hike a week and then they'll go back to their job and then the next year they'll hike the next week and do that.

Oh, wow.

And they're like starting to go back to that place they finished and then keep going.

Like a video game.

Yeah, but I

had the time and also I am a very kind of like, I want to do the thing as it's supposed to be done.

So I did the whole thing.

I have so many things.

And solo.

And solo, right.

People do it together a lot.

Yes.

Yeah.

Yeah.

But I wouldn't, I think I saw some people that were together like, you're lucky.

Actually, let's take aside for a second.

The difference in solo travel and group travel.

I wouldn't really know much about group travel.

I very rarely do it.

Most people don't have the time to travel like I do.

I mean, obviously, no one else is a nomad.

I have traveled with friends.

I do have friends.

I always find it's just a thing of like every decision has to be by committee.

Yeah, I don't like it.

You can't be like, oh, I'm going here.

It has to be like, are you guys okay with this?

Right.

Or like, or like, let's say I'm like, I don't feel like going today.

Everybody's like, we can all stop.

And you want to be like, no, no, you guys go.

I'm just, my shins hurt.

Right.

And it's just so annoying.

It is nice to be able to talk, but like,

I've had some amazing trips with friends, like going up to

up to Ladakh in India, like with a friend and just like this amazing kind of

we were up in the mountains and just like, I just remember like laughing so much and it was really fun.

You know, we just, and then we have such these like shared experiences.

So that trip was like a good trip, but I've also had some where it's just like, you just not quite

vibing with each other and it can get really stressful.

I am much more of a like.

Also, how do you walk away?

If it's like at home, if it's here in New York and like we're like, you know, friends and then we're just like, I'm not feeling you anymore.

Right now, you're just like, I'm like, no, I'm busy.

Yeah.

And you just don't have to talk.

You can't really do that when you're on a trip together.

Like, what even you're busy?

We're here together.

Yeah.

You know?

My trick is I usually go for a run in the morning.

And then sometimes my run is just going to get a coffee and sitting quietly by myself.

And like throw water on your face.

I'm like, oh my God, I'm so warm.

I'll bring you a coffee though.

I'll always bring a coffee coffee back.

Yeah.

So tell me more about this.

Okay.

So there's so much I want to fucking talk.

It's so cool.

But like, I did a hike in Myanmar and it was like a four-day hike.

Some people were like, hey, this is the thing we all did.

You know, when you're like here from other travelers, something cool.

Yeah.

Okay.

I knew maybe two of the people and then met up with, you know, on a group.

And then we realized one of my friends was on it.

from Austria.

And she goes, they have these like hiker huts in Austria.

And you just go up and stay up in the Alps.

You hike from hut to hut to hut, four to eight hours okay uh it's different it's not through towns but then we had this theory that there's like and this one is probably the most famous one the one you did yeah that there are these super long multi-day hikes the appalachian trail pacific coast trail there's probably that everywhere

uh probably a ton in china there's one in japan that really that seems really interesting like buddhist temples really yeah um

oh what an episode so far huh guys you got to check out jasmine's photos they're amazing they're really amazing they'll take you places.

She's just on regular website, Jasmine Shaw, J-A-S-M-I-N-E-S-H-A-H

dot com.

And on

Instagram, why don't you give her a follow?

I bet we could double her follows right now.

She barely has any.

It's crazy.

She's addicted to the art and not to the promotion.

Jasmine Shaw photo.

on Instagram.

I'm having a blast.

I got shows coming up in Brisbane and Sydney, Sydney, and that's the end of my tour.

Right now I'm on the Great Ocean Road.

It's such a fun trip.

You'll hear about all this trip all about this.

You hear all about this trip on the Patreon, this week's Patreon, patreon.com slash you be tripping.

That's it.

Check out my special drew.

Check out Jasmine.

Give her a follow right now.

Let's get back to the episode.

Oh, I heard.

Vinyls, they're going to up the amount of signed ones.

The totals made are still gonna be 1,000,

but they figure out a way.

So, until the pre-order is done, you can get

signed vinyls shipped to you, as well as the shroom fest shirts, July 20th, 21st, 22nd.

This year, stuff will all go out in July, probably first week of July, maybe second week.

Grinders are also available, all at the website ari shape.com.

Please tell me I was in this.

I like to have fun, everybody.

Fuck your studio.

Back to the episode.

Yeah, so like, it's just this thing of like, I don't know, hiking from spot to spot, but this one is through towns.

That's way different.

So like, where did you eat?

How did you decide?

Or like, what do you do?

So the thing that made this so appealing over like the Appalachian Trail or Pacific Coast Trail or any of that stuff is like you get to stay.

They're called Alberghaes.

They're essentially hostels, but they're for pilgrims.

Or sometimes they're just like normal hostels

or towns.

And then there's actually hotels and whatever, but you don't have to ever camp so you're not like carrying all your shit you don't have to carry your food or a stove or a sleeping bag or you carry a sleeping bag because some of the

I actually had like the silk sleep sack thing and then like a little blanket that I can't do.

Yeah, we do this in Austria.

Yeah.

And that was enough for me for the time line that I was there.

It wasn't super cold.

It was actually really hot most of the time, so that's fine.

So then you have these alberges that are like anywhere from donation based or to like 20, 25 euros a night.

But you're in a bunk, you know, room with a bunch of other pilgrims.

And some are you can reserve head, but some are you just like walk up.

Which

and then and then settling?

Are you like, are they going to have a space?

Yeah, I didn't like that.

I think my being an American thing like started to make kind of hard.

And also,

you're walking a lot.

I didn't want to be fucking tired.

And then they're like, you got to go to the next town.

I'd be like, no,

I don't want to go to the next town.

I did push it.

Yeah.

There was one day that I really was just like pushing it.

I had chosen the, sometimes there was multiple routes on the way.

And I had an app that kind of like gave the, the way.

And I always chose the, there's sometimes be like a little easier inner one that would be on roads and then there'd be a coastal version.

So you were really on the coast, but you were on trails sometimes.

And then you're going up and down, up and down constantly.

And I chose that one that one day.

And it was so beautiful, but so fucking high.

I was just like, you, I think I probably, I think I cried that day.

Yeah.

There was, there was multiple days.

I was like crying because of just exhaustion.

Yeah.

And like, will I make it?

And then I finally got to this.

I don't understand what it is.

Yeah.

And then just being stressed, like, will I make it?

Will I get a bed?

I don't know.

Cause that particular town, there wasn't many options.

So I was, you know,

usually if

the Alberga is sold out, you could find something else or, you know, that just involved spending a little more money, which I was fine with.

But

yeah, after that, I started kind of reserving ahead just because it

would.

Unless like some of the Alberga's said they had 100 beds, I was like, well, that's, I know I'm good.

It's fine.

I don't think I'm like worried.

But if it's like 30 beds, that's stressful.

And I don't want to have to go really fast walking.

I want to go slow and stuff.

You don't want to really show up late at night and just go in.

Not even like late, but just like if I see a cool.

So also, you don't have to bring any food.

You just stop at the bars and cafes in Spain.

So you're in Spain.

That's like really good food.

And so

some rural, sometimes cities, like you go through everything.

You're just, I mean, 550 miles, you're, you're walking through

everything.

So

I would get up

and then get ready and head out and then go to find my first little,

usually, I mean, they just call them bars.

They start drinking pretty early there, but you can also get coffee.

So I would get a cortado and then a little bite to eat, usually a...

tortilla española, just egg and potato, and then have that,

start walking, usually head and get another cortado somewhere along the line and then after that switch to beers um really yeah yeah i'm walking really slow so it was fine it was like it's nourishment and then then get a sandwich i mean i really carb loading yeah it's like it is carb load i was like i'm walking that's fine um

i wouldn't like have multiple yeah at a location it'd be like one and then go um and then

And then I never really brought food with me.

I very rarely had even food in my pack because I always felt fairly confident I would be able to find something.

I there were some days that were longer longer stretches and I would bring

bars.

Yeah.

Or, you know, nuts and fruit and whatever.

Sometimes I or sometimes I would have like some jamon and some bread and make a little sandwich for myself on the way.

Yeah.

Uh, was the language an issue?

I don't speak Spanish very well.

I speak a little bit.

I was trying to learn more.

I don't know.

If you're if you travel a lot, I just have

it

it doesn't bother me to not be able to communicate always

like perfectly.

I feel like I'm pretty good at miming and like getting through or being okay with like

I can get through like my basic necessi necessities like food, bathroom, water, all of that.

So if you can do that, then do you learn any words when you go to places like that or other places?

Yeah, I mean, I try to

do one through three, three, please, bathroom, food, just food.

I don't have to go to a restaurant or whatever, just food, and then like, where is?

Yeah.

And then please thank you.

Yeah.

But like, that's enough to get by with Miami.

That's enough.

Yeah.

I also learned, I've started to learn, I

like, I'm full, weirdly enough.

Because sometimes locals want to just like keep feeding you.

That's a good word.

I never left the U.S.

until I moved to Japan when I was 25, much like Rolf, I think, was like he had moved to Korea.

And one of the first things I learned, and still remember, is onake pai, which means I'm full, because they would just like keep feeding you.

Oh, wow.

And then after just getting back from India, it's bus was the enough.

Yeah, enough.

It's so funny.

Israeli do it too.

And then you're like, if you're like, I can't, like, you're not going to finish on your plate.

Like, it's my third helper.

I have to put more on my plate.

Yeah.

And they just got so mad at you.

So, but that they generally get impressed.

If you can say it in the language, then they're like, oh, respect.

Okay.

Then you can be done.

Yeah.

So,

but yeah, no, I was able to communicate enough.

I would get frustrated sometimes.

I mean, I would want to talk, especially on the days when I wouldn't see any pilgrims.

It would be nice to like communicate a little bit more with locals.

But

like in the Basque region, they would speak Basque and then, which

that I didn't know at all.

That's right.

In Spain, they speak like three different languages.

These dialects, yeah.

Or languages.

Actually, Bosca is like different than...

Well, they speak in Barcelona.

It's something else.

Catalan.

Catalan.

Yeah.

It's like related.

That one's more related.

Bosque is not related at all.

I actually did learn some words in Bosque because

you're walking slowly, and so you're going through the region.

It's not like you're there for a day.

You're there for like a week and a half.

So it was.

Yeah, you know what I like about travels?

Like, what's Spain like?

And you're like, it depends where.

It's like I was saying, what's America like?

Right.

I don't know.

What are you talking about?

Right.

It's wildly different.

Yeah.

The language is different.

That's nothing.

Right.

And then at the end, I was in Galicia.

That's also a different language.

So.

Yeah.

What surprised you about this?

Like, what kind of things were you not expecting at all that were like, oh.

What surprised me?

Maybe you were super prepared.

I don't know.

No, I wasn't prepared.

I think I didn't.

I was prepared, and

I really didn't know what was going to happen.

You know, like, I just didn't have

I was prepared for like not knowing what the fuck I was doing.

Yeah.

So I was just prepared in that.

Um,

I was just gonna go and see.

I can't think of what surprised me.

Anything disappoint you

before that you didn't get to?

Get to see, or get to, I don't know.

Um,

no huge,

like,

stories for me, or like,

I was hoping maybe I might meet some people that would be, you know, I've seen, this was like something, I've seen some people talk about like their Camino friends that they, you know,

but I also realized,

yeah, which I actually made some friends.

I'm so any of my friends, I did make some friends and I have that, but I didn't have the where i joined and then just like had this like immense bond but you know why because i wanted to walk alone so that was my fault too is i would shy away from the larger groups of walking and stuff um i mean it's a give and take when you want yeah yeah

um

yeah you the way you did it was you're a photographer yes so I remember you talked when you talked to the class about it in Paris, it was like that you wanted to get back to like real film.

Like talk about that a little bit, like your relation to film and

yeah.

So I'm a photographer and when I first started photography I started in film but it's been

17 no even more than that.

It's been a very long time since I've shot with film.

It's all digital.

It's all digital.

Wow.

And

I just I

I just knew I wanted to photograph because it makes me, I know it would bum me out to not have a a camera, even though I wanted to, this to not be like a work trip necessarily or make it like all about photographing.

So

I thought about like

back to my roots of photography.

And the first camera I ever used was a Pentex K1000.

And I thought, let me just take that and take film.

And then I also took a Holga for fun, which is square.

It's a plastic camera.

It's kind of like a toy camera.

It's really light,

but it's medium format and and square images.

And it kind of has this like dreamy quality about it because there'll be light leaks and all the stuff.

So I brought that.

But that meant I brought like 35 rolls of film and two cameras, which ended up adding quite a bit of weight.

And you can't like,

once I would shoot the film, I mean, I have to keep carrying it.

So there's no way to like offload anything.

It's just like I was carrying it.

So that was a, but that's on me.

I'm just used to always having to carry a lot of.

This is the problem with souvenir taking on like long trips where it's like, really, the only way to do it, I remember I got this in Myanmar and hiked around until I think I went to Thailand after Myanmar and I'm like what the fuck do I do it's just taking up room right you have a backpack and that's it and just taking up room and then eventually I was like oh I gotta find a

just a post office right and like send it home the slowest way possible yeah um

it seems like that might be the only way to do it's like I gotta get rid of this along the way yeah with film I got a little like that would just kill me if yeah you know it can go through sensors and stuff like that I just didn't want to do that.

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So I just kind of carried it and dealt with it.

And it was a really interesting experience too to shoot with film again instead of digital because for so many years and working, you know, I would, if I see one thing I want to photograph, I'll take, I'll take a picture, I'll look at it, and I'll be like, oh, and I'll like take a bunch more, I'll like check.

And now it was like, if I saw something, I would take a picture.

And then there was nothing to look at, nothing to compare, nothing to know if I got it or not got it.

I just like would put it back in my waste pack and then not think about it.

It was like a really nice gift to myself to just like shoot it and then I'll see in a couple weeks if it's good or not.

Yeah, there's a thing now.

I mean, you've been traveling so long.

When did you start?

A year-ish,

like traveling and getting lost.

Like first international was

2001.

2001.

Yeah.

Pre-cell phones, pre-smartphones.

Yeah.

So like the difference between

you must have seen a change in hostels or wherever.

The difference between people being able to connect versus not,

and then the taking the picture and the constant taking pictures, unlimited film versus limited film.

Right.

I see this all the time in New York or anywhere.

There'll be a cool shot.

Yeah.

Roses or something like that.

And you see people, they're almost embarrassed to take the picture because as soon as they get it, they walk off.

And you're like, stop, literally stop and smell the roses, but they can't do it.

Yeah.

This seems so freeing the way you did it.

Yeah, it was great.

It was a nice, like, I wanted it also as as maybe it would make me think differently when I got my digital camera back and was working, you know, just like thinking about it.

Because I had to kind of, I had a limited amount of film and I had a very long walk ahead of me.

So I also had to kind of judge like how many photos can I take a day.

So I started off taking a lot of photos and then I was like, whoa, I got to be careful because I might like blow through the film.

And then I like went a week where I took hardly any photos because I like pulled way back.

And then I kind of got into a groove after that where I could just like, and basically what I chose to photograph was just like what am I seeing what do I want to remember what is interesting to me and not always like the most epic photograph I mean I would inherently try to make it interesting of a photograph but

it was it was just like whatever whatever just like made me curious what type of stuff would you be into like

faces faces but I did less of that I don't know there was something it was

less portraits than i normally do that's normally what i photograph um

but more just kind of landscape um

people's like houses laundry on a line beautiful light the

beautiful like the hay um the weird the huge huge bales of hay which i will always if i smell this smell again i will be taken right back to the communo it's the smell of hay that's been sitting for a really long long time.

It's like weird, sweetly fermented smell that's like kind of unpleasant, but also really nice.

It's very specific smell that was like almost every day I would smell it along the way.

Is it farmland there?

Yeah, there was a lot of farmland and

yeah, you ever drive through like a cow pet and you're like, ew, but like yeah, so sometimes it'd be like mixed with manure, which wasn't great, but sometimes it would just be the hay, but it was very like a sweet fermented smell of hay

so i would took some pictures of hay you smell that sense no you have not no i haven't been any farmland you could get one of those like smells immediately take you back somewhere else that one i know like that one will take me back so interesting yeah

um

yeah these pictures are a cool way to like remember and it's like what do you take and the the idea of like i only get one shot at this seems like it'd be wave freeing

instead of taking like on my phone it's always like seven of almost the the same shot, trying to get it perfect.

And then they're like the same.

And sometimes, I mean, even I'm a photographer and I can like sometimes see the difference between photos.

I was like, why did I like take that many photos of that one thing?

It's like,

whatever.

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah, I was actually going to ask you about the smells.

Oh, yeah.

That's interesting.

How much does this cost?

Well, it costs nothing to do.

I mean, just to be on the trail.

You're just hiking or walking.

Um, so it's just really hotels instead of a hotel.

Like, let's, where did you start?

What city did you start in?

Irun, Irun, Irun.

So let's say you're hanging out in Irun.

It's just like you're either in a hotel there or you're at a hotel nine miles away.

Right.

And then eight miles from there, four miles into

hotels.

Yeah.

Or Alberges.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So that cost is the same.

Right.

And actually, so I would stay in Alberga's, which were pretty inexpensive, but then sometimes it's hard, I don't know, staying in bunk beds

with like a whole bunch of people.

Yeah, and you're really tired.

So I started looking in occasionally to

solo rooms and they would be like sometimes 40 euros.

And I was like, you know what?

Go for it.

I'm going to go with that.

Like, and your own bathroom.

And then you can, because you would, I was washing my clothes every night in the sink, just be really nice.

Like, you just like go in the room, like strip, wash all your clothes, like shower, relax, like, just be like, ah, no backpack, no nothing.

Then get ready, go out.

It was just more pleasant.

No, no people snoring.

Yeah.

You know, do you ever have those any of those super long beds where it's just like you're just like your spots from here to here?

They're just like the pillow.

And so you have to get up like towards the foot of your bed.

Yeah.

And you can't like sleep with your elbow out because you'll just be elbowing somebody.

Wait, you were like.

It was just a long, like a 30-foot long mattress.

Oh, and they're just like, they put

pillows up.

No.

Oh, really?

No.

I was the worst one.

And you're like, there's nowhere to like not hit somebody.

No, no.

I had that where it's like a long bed where,

you know, I felt like maybe there was one where it was like here, but it's just like one really long mattress, but twin size.

And so then one person's here, one person's in the middle,

and then one person's at the end.

So it's like, feet, who do you, do you want the feet by your head or do you want, right?

Yeah.

Um, but I'm five, two, so that's not too much of a problem for me.

Oh, right.

Yeah.

Did it feel safe at all?

Unsafe?

Never unsafe.

Do I ever feel?

No.

I travel all over

generally by myself, so I have a pretty good sense of like what to do and not to.

I've never really gotten, never had anything bad.

happen.

So, and this is just walking.

I mean, obviously, there's like

shit could go down if there was some horrible person on the trail, but you're just walking.

I felt really

like everyone was the locals that you passed through the towns, everyone was really nice.

Like, I wasn't sure, like, maybe they'd be annoyed by these pilgrims, but they're very used to it.

It's what's been happening for hundreds of years.

Yeah, right, right.

So, it's like not weird for somebody to be able to do that.

No, and it's a,

you know, you're spending money, so that's good too.

Um,

but no, I felt safe.

And yeah, so the cost is,

you know, the cost of your Alberga or hotel or whatever.

25 to 40.

Yeah.

Not much.

Or like zero to 40, because if you stay in Alberga, this donation, not zero, I would, I probably give 20 there.

So five to I think the cheapest one was five euros to 40.

And I was there in Europe while the dollar was just getting stronger and stronger to the end where it was just the same.

So we're in Paris.

It was like,

it's actually not this cheap.

You just pay

for it.

And it was so cheap.

Yeah, it was nice.

Not crazy like Asia or like Latin America, but like

really nice meals for like six, like you couldn't even come close to that in New York.

I know this is an expensive town, but like.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I love that.

Yeah.

And then like the coffees, a cortado would be a euro.

50.

Oh, great.

No.

The

so breakfast would be maybe with the tortillas bino, breakfast would be three to four euros.

Sometimes I would throw in some orange juice, you know?

Awesome.

Flip slash out.

Awesome.

And then lunch would be,

you know, a bocadillo, just a sandwich.

Dinner, also, like, I was generally

food was pretty inexpensive.

Spain is pretty inexpensive compared to even Paris.

So that was not bad.

Occasionally, you would have like the good lunch

deals that you would get, the starter, the

That's lunch.

Yeah, maybe.

In Ecuador, that was the term for a set amount was just lunch.

Okay.

It was like on where, but it's like TNS on where it meant, like, do you have the lunch deal?

Oh, yeah.

And they were like 250, $3.

It was more than that, but it would be like 10 euros to

18 euros was like a really fancy one, but also included like wine.

Wow.

I did do one time.

I walked with a woman and we got a really fancy lunch, like a set, and had wine.

And that was the rest of the hike that day was a little rough because it was like a really big lunch and like wine.

Split a bottle of wine and then walked 10 more miles.

And that was like, oof.

But

it was also one of the most enjoyable meals because it was nice to sometimes share that.

Yeah, yeah.

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What other type of person was on this?

What are the other pilgrims like?

Were they from?

So it started off.

I felt like I saw a bunch of people from the states and I was kind of like, didn't want to see that.

But then I took a couple day break because I had, um, years ago, I was in a car accident, hurt my back.

Um, and the carrying the backpack triggered, like, it flared up the one spot on my back.

So I had to take a couple day break.

And so that kind of got me off the timeline of who I'd started the first couple days with.

Um, and so then I was a different timeline of people.

And

then it was like, I didn't really see Americans for like I got off this I don't know why it would have been that I was on this it was just like random but then I was with mostly Europeans

and

that was

cooler yeah yeah it's like I don't want to talk to people from yeah I saw I had a picture of myself in maybe Myanmar yeah and and I remember some posting some comments like that's a lot of white people and I'm like yeah but they're like they're Germans and you know and like English people it's still like you meet other travelers right yeah you talk about like how much vacation time do you get in australia you know yeah you're learning about other cultures it's while in a third culture yeah yeah

um

so and then yeah a lot of uh spaniards a lot of um i became friends with these two italian guys

um oh those ones you had a picture of yeah okay Yeah,

that we just kept running into.

We talked a bunch at

an alberga so i would go sometimes to the solar once i started got a taste for like getting my own room i was like this is really nice yeah so but then because i was by myself that would just be like walking all day and then being by myself at night

and

i'm okay with that but sometimes that would just get a little too lonely you know and introvert um

you don't know an introverted extra extroverted introvert no introverted i don't know whatever i'm both but i definitely need my time alone to recharge.

That I definitely say, regardless of what you are, it's just like you need a certain amount of alone time and a certain amount of like

I need more alone time than together, right?

Yeah, but then at some point you're like, hey, it might be after two months, like I gotta have a conversation.

Yeah, no, mean is like after a couple days.

Yeah,

yeah, that's when I always get the most social.

Yeah.

I'm super lonely, and I'm not able to just talk to strangers.

Yeah.

But after being so lonely, it's like you just sit down with people, like, where are you guys from?

And I'm like, this is how people really normally are.

Just friendly.

It feels so cool.

Yeah.

No.

And that's the nice thing about the Camino is that if you see someone with a backpack, you can just talk to them.

You know, they're doing that thing.

And you have this shared thing you can talk about.

That was the other depressing thing about finishing.

And I was back to being solo, but without any reason to just talk to a stranger.

And I was like, oh, I'm just going to be back to being alone again, which

it's okay, but

intense sometimes and harder for me.

I get nervous about like approaching people, but the Camino made it really easy.

And that was a nice thing.

What do you think about this?

I have this theory that I've never really done.

When you see at the airport, you'll see somebody that's a backpacker.

It's like a hosteler.

They have the big backpack, maybe the yoga mat, sleeping mat thing.

And just like they have stories.

So just be like, where you been?

Tell them about someplace cool.

And they'll just start sharing.

But I never do it, but I always wanted to.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Did you, was there any like romance shit or not really?

No.

No.

That was maybe one of my disappointments.

That you thought maybe.

Some Spanish playing for two stops.

Yeah.

No.

But it's fine.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It would be cool.

Something about being gone where you're like, it just makes everything like ups the romance of the, you you know yeah

yeah what were the toilets like

fine always I mean in Spain it's like

sit down yeah yeah yeah flush toilet paper

flush toilet paper

yeah all not throwaway toilet paper no

flush yeah okay yeah that's cool I think that's just Latin America mostly really I think so it's Asia also or Asia yeah and like Middle East I think it's a lot of places, but I don't know.

Yeah.

Well, not Europe, I guess.

Yeah.

I've not encountered in Europe.

Yeah, I'm trying to think.

That was always

pretty easy.

I wasn't a fan of the like the shared bathrooms in the Alberges.

Like it was, you know, the stalls.

I mean, that's just like hostile stuff too, but it's just like you're like so tired and you're trying to like balance yourself and like wash some stuff.

And then there's just like some old German dude walking around in a towel and you're like

I also hate taking like

a real dump with people walking by that I'm gonna have to face

you know yeah it's just like embarrassing and especially if like it's not up to you how it's gonna smell and sometimes they smell worse than others or if somebody's like oh like damn it yeah in Spain actually so with the bathrooms there are usually like it's just unisex like sometimes you walk in and and it'll be a shared bathroom and there'll be one stall for women one stall for men but they're like right next to each other so that is

a little like yeah as far as that yeah also if i was a chick i would not want to be next to a dude dump it's like this is one of the things that makes you guys better than us it's like well we do shit but yeah but it's not that horrific you know ungodly smell that a man can achieve like are you rotting from the inside

um

yeah what did you have anything that you're like if you had to tell somebody what to do, I want to hear like what you do different.

And we're like, oh, you've got to, you've got to see this, this spot, or you got to get some of these like sandwiches or like, you know, not even specific spots, but it sounds like the Cortados are really cool.

I mean,

um,

don't carry too much.

Like, you really need very little stuff.

And, and

so it was just like

two shirts, one long-sleeve shirt.

Two shirts.

Yeah.

Yeah, you wash it at night, right?

Yeah.

Would you dry it on your back?

Dry it like on hanging on the bunk bed at night or whatever.

And then if it wasn't dry by the morning, you'd pin it to your backpack and dry it while you were walking in the sun.

I had a pair of pants and a pair of shorts.

And I had like a dress that I would use and wear at night after I'd showered and when I was washing my other clothes.

And then

I think three pairs of underwear.

Yeah.

Four pairs of socks.

Why four pairs of socks?

Did you double up?

Sometimes you would change.

Yeah.

Oh, I got pretty bad blisters.

Yeah, you were.

And then.

Were you hiking boots or

they were hiking shoes?

Okay.

And then.

What did you get?

What were you?

What are they?

They were hokas, but I actually ended up leaving those at a hostel somewhere along the night and swearing at them.

I bought new ones.

I really did not like them.

They did not serve me.

Hokas.

Yeah, no.

Could you, that's another thing.

Can you like re-up stuff?

Like you completely tour something?

Could you be like, you can't?

Yeah, because you're passing through some of the, you're passing through, like I passed through Bilbao.

That's a really big city.

And then I passed through Quijon.

That was another big city.

Yeah, so you're passing through, like, and they have pharmacies everywhere.

So you can just go stop at the pharmacy for whatever you need.

You have a cold, you can be like, get cold medicine.

Yeah.

You don't need to bring any of that.

And it's all the same stuff.

You know, it's not.

Do you get, I always get beholden to the shit I have.

So it's like way better to not have it because I'm like, I can't drop that.

And so I carried around two pairs of jeans through the hottest region in the world.

Yeah.

Until eventually I'm like, what the fuck am I doing?

And it's like, here's one.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It sounds way smarter to like not have to not have to be beholden to it.

And it's like, if you need it, you'll just find it.

Right.

And yeah, you can buy clothes or you, I did stop.

There was a decathlon as a store that's like an kind of

REI of Europe.

And

so i think at one point i was like oh i'd rather have like a tank top so i bought that and um

like a little i forgot what i bought some little other little things but you can buy them along the way and whatever i felt like i needed um do you have period issues sorry

like is that an issue for um i mean as a woman yes it did happen

yeah it happens um but it's

you can buy tampons along the way and whatever and then i think I just

left them, left the remaining supply at a hostel along the way.

And I was like, I don't

think, yeah, I don't want to carry this along.

I don't need it until I need it again.

And then when I need it again, I'll just stop at a pharmacy.

There's almost no chance you're going to get a new period a week later.

No.

It's like, no, I'm not.

Yeah.

No.

So I was like set for the rest of the hike.

So I was like, done.

Cool.

Very cool.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So bring very little.

Be open.

don't, you know, I did start booking ahead sometimes just because I wanted to, but I would only do like a day or two ahead.

I wouldn't be booking, like some people had like their whole thing booked out and that just seemed like if you just you're having an off day and you feel like going less, you know, you don't want to like force yourself into having to walk so far or you like meet some people and you're like, you know, I want to hang in the hostel they're in and or like just like hang out in the town they're going to be in or you're like, I want to be ahead of them because I don't feel like hanging out.

Yeah, or just like, I never had anywhere really don't like, but I was just like, maybe I just want to like

get ahead.

Could you go away from

the Camino a little bit and then back in?

Like off the route, then back, you know what I mean?

Like do a little detour?

Yeah, but that would have involved walking more.

Yeah, right.

So, I mean, I generally stayed on the Camino.

I think one day I walked from the route to dinner and it was an extra, like, three miles round trip.

It was to this extra, this town that was so cute and beautiful that it was worth it.

Along the way.

Why?

What was cool about it?

It was like this old fishing village that looked the houses were built up on the side and they were colorful colorful and

it was just a really beautiful village, but it was you had to go down this big hill that I was like, fuck.

After dinner, I had to go back up it, but it was, I had, again, I was by myself.

I had

got a room by myself.

Did somebody tell you about this place?

Someone had mentioned it, and then I checked.

I was like, oh, that looks pretty cute.

And then I realized where I was staying wasn't too bad.

And I wasn't feeling trash that day.

You know, some days you were just like, no, I'm not doing anything.

And then some days I had a little more energy

and it seemed appealing to go explore.

Because also, like, when am I going to be in this random town somewhere on the north coast of Spain to have time to go to this?

So I walked to it.

But yeah, usually I didn't go too far off because

you'd be really tired.

Could you get in a car?

Did you get into any automobiles or any like during this whole time?

Because I imagine, like, let's just say I'm hiking through America and I get to like New York.

Right.

And I'm like, I want to go uptown.

I'm like, why get in a cab?

And then keep going, keep walking to Boston.

Yeah.

Um

No.

No, no.

So you'd walk everywhere.

Yeah.

Damn, interesting.

Yeah.

You just get so used to just walking that you just then walked.

Um

and it just

which has been nice since then to just

once you see on a map how far you can walk,

you're like, well, I can walk to my friend's house or I can walk, you you know, like, what?

When I go to LA, I do that.

People are like, let's pull over.

Like, what's wrong with you?

I'm like, going to fucking Whole Foods.

Like, yeah.

Do you want to ride?

I'm like, it's 20 minutes.

Yeah.

It's like my son.

People don't like it.

Yeah.

It's the same thing.

It's like you're attacking us.

We're doing it.

Yeah.

What's the farthest you went any day?

I think 23, one day miles was

pretty much a marathon.

Yeah.

Wow.

Yeah.

That day was long.

I did a couple in the 20 to 23 range.

Towards the end.

I started to get kind of be like,

okay, let's get this done.

Like in a good way, but like, let's, let's get this kind of going.

Yeah.

But it was usually probably more in like, I think a really happy, good day was like

14, 15.

I still liked it to be a good, solid walking day.

I didn't like the too short days sometimes, especially if you're by yourself, you didn't have anyone to hang out with, you're like,

what are you gonna go hard?

Yeah, like, what

if there's not much to do in the town,

then you're just kind of like hanging out, like drinking another beer in a bar, which is fun, but I would rather like spread out a really long walking day, be tired at the end of the day, have a nice dinner, go to bed, wake up, sleep well.

Yeah, I mean, that was generally pretty easy because you're so tired.

You're so tired, yeah.

Um, uh, did you walk at night or were you done by nightfall?

Well, in Spain,

I think the sun rose at like

6, 6,

no, 6.30, 7 a.m.

But it didn't set until like 10 o'clock at night.

So there was never any danger of walking at night.

Honestly, I rarely saw

night.

I felt like I would generally be like winding down by the time it was getting dark.

In Paris.

Yeah, it was like really.

Oh, yeah, it stays like 9:30, 10.

Yeah.

But there were some really foggy days.

There was one day

where it was super foggy.

I love the mornings.

I love waking up relatively early.

And then there's very little to get ready in the morning, get ready, go start walking.

And it was just like, there's something about morning, it's just like so peaceful and quiet, and you're out there by yourself.

And

but one day it was really, really like fog had rolled in off the coast, and and I was taking this path and

I couldn't really see where I was going.

I mean, it was like pea soup fog or whatever, you know, like you really can't see in front of you.

And

I heard the water and I finally like got close enough.

I looked down and I was on the edge of the cliff and there was like the water below.

It was like two feet for me.

Yeah.

So that was like the closest to kind of, that was like my major danger day.

Were there any animals that could catch at you?

There was cows and horses.

You would just be walking through people's feet.

No, no.

No attacky animals.

But that day, so the foggy day, I was like about to then like, I was like, oh shit, like, you know, trying to move in from that, but like still hugging, I had to like hug that.

to that was the closest to the trail I could get.

So just being really careful not to get too close to the cliff.

But like,

I was about to send a text to my friend with like my location, which would have been a really shitty text to send.

Just be like, hey, if you don't hear from me anymore, this is where I fell off the cliff.

But at that moment, I heard some people talking, and it was my Italian friends.

And that's kind of what, like, yeah, that's what made us like really friends after that was because I like went running to them and gave them a big hug.

And then we stuck together after that.

They were like, come with us, you know?

And then we just then after that we would walk together most days but like for for one week I kept running into them and then they took a different Camino route so oh really they took a there's like one route that is starts on the Norte and then it's called the Primitivo and it goes into the mountains where

so it diverts inland to through mountains whereas I stayed on the Del Norte which I stayed on the coast until I had to go south into Camino de Santiago Is Santiago

yeah it's a

it's

Santiago Santiago de Compostel it's kind of chaotic.

It's like really crowded.

Crowded full of locals or finishers?

Finishers and then just like it's a popular tourist city too.

I didn't really love it.

I kind of got there after like being solo and really quiet, going in, you know, it felt it was amazing to walk in to the cathedral and be like, I did it.

That's the spot.

That's the yeah, yeah, that's what you're, and then, but then after that, it was like, I just, I felt like a little overwhelmed with the amount of people.

Um, yeah, I bet, especially for me, like seeing almost nobody or

being overwhelmed with it, right?

Yeah, actually, in the last hundred kilometers of the um Camino, uh,

so

you have to walk, the whole time you're walking, you have something called the little,

it's like a little passport.

There's a word for it, and I'm forgetting it right now.

But you're getting stamps along the way to prove that you're doing this.

So you're like all the little bars that you're stopping at, all the little Alberga's, everything.

So you get a stamp.

Like a Facebook check-in?

Yeah.

Or whatever.

But it's like a stamp on it.

It looks like a passport.

Hey, cool.

And

so you have it as this thing, but for the last 100 kilometers, you really have to have the stamps.

You have to have two stamps a day to prove that you were like walking it, you know,

that you were doing the

stopping to get it.

Yeah.

Who do you prove it?

What do you mean?

Who do you prove it?

So then at the end, you go in San Diego, you go to get your like certificate to say you finished it if you want that.

I did it because it was there and it was free.

But

you have to show them the passport and then you can say like I started here and

then they'll write like where you started and um that your finish date but it's a um the last hundred kilometers are what you need to prove you did if you want to get that certificate so i did 800 some kilometers it didn't matter that i did that for the certificate um

but at the end it gets a lot more crowded with people so for those last hundred there were a lot of people even on the double they all converge at that point for the last yeah you converge in the last like okay two or three days i felt like which was was really weird to have almost there was like some parts where it was like

a crowded, like a traffic jam of pilgrims.

Um, weird, yeah, it was really weird.

Isn't it weird how you get used to a certain like amount of people or whatever, you know, language, or like, yeah, and then suddenly it's you're like right by like within a month, it sounds like where you're like, oh shit, I can't handle people right now.

Yeah, yeah, and I'm not like

generally bothered by it, but I was just so used to being kind of really quiet and solo and

yeah.

Damn.

Could you follow the routes okay?

With it was like mapped, was it like marked trails?

Yeah, so the whole way you have, there's like these little shell signs that you can see or yellow arrows.

So you really don't have to look at your phone or that would bug me to constantly.

That's what I do on hikes too.

I'm going the right way.

I'm going the right way.

And then it's like very rarely.

I would try really hard not to not look at my phone because that's

yeah.

So generally, any time that I would be like, Am I going the right way?

If I just would like look up and look around, I would see an arrow and I'd be like, I'm good.

I'm good.

And then there was a couple times that I didn't look and then I would have like, oh shit.

I walked past and then I would have to go back.

But whatever, it wasn't like that big a deal.

Could you ask for directions?

Yeah, or like

the

very first day, the very first hour when I was in Arun, I was just like, I was very emotional that day, like starting just because I was

that's a first spot?

Yeah.

And just like the anticipation of it, I mean, I had no idea how I was going to do walking this thing.

And,

you know, I'm by myself and just like, yeah.

And this old man,

this old boss man, he was like, almost like, say, hat, like really cute little guy.

He got excited.

He saw that I was a pilgrim.

I mean, it's obvious, like, you've got the pack on, you're starting.

And he

said,

he was like kind of pointing.

I knew I was going the right way, but he was pointing.

And then he said, buen camino, which is what.

people say

yeah um and i just started crying

and like his face was just like like, didn't know why.

And I was like, just like the emotion, like talking to, like, having one other person recognize what I was about to be doing was really

intense.

But yeah, people would

give you directions.

Generally, if a local saw that you were kind of,

the, the cities were the hardest parts to navigate because like you're in like, all of a sudden you're just like,

it's not Manhattan, but there was like some of the cities you'd be like right in like the downtown and it's chaotic and and like people are going to work and doing this and then you're like there with a backpack and you're walking.

They're not good.

Yeah, the streets, as I'm assuming, are not super concerned with the people coming through.

Right.

Probably like

which way to downtown, which way to do it.

Right.

The signs would be a little bit smaller, you know.

So that would, I feel, I felt like that would be the hardest parts was the going through the cities.

Yeah.

What would you have done differently now that you did it if you had to do it again?

Or regrets of not doing I don't know

I think

maybe

slower

I don't

take in scenery

yeah and just maybe talk to more people

I think I got sometimes I got a little in my head and was like very like I'm gonna got it I have things I got to think about but like you know there's time to think about things so you can like also talk to people.

The people, the times I would talk to people

were

like, really like gave me life, you know, some of the locals.

There was one time I had this amazing morning.

I had woke up early.

I was staying in a room by myself.

And I, there was an extra, like,

it was supposed to be, what was it called?

It was like this magical

beach.

And it was like an extra kilometer or two away from where I was staying but I could go on that and then catch the other the catch the trail so I found it on a map and I kind of figured out how to do it and I went there and I was by myself and it was just this just epically beautiful like and beautiful like the sun was rising for a photographer it was like the light was glowing I was just like so happy and then um

and then I walked and found the path and was walking for a while and I hadn't had a coffee at that morning for that.

And then I found a cafe

and the woman was like really chatty with me.

And then there was two local guys and they were chatty.

And it was just like, it was just a magical morning because they were happy.

And it was just us.

I was in their little morning routine.

And I had had this, I don't know, and they let me take their picture.

And

so those things like kind of made me,

I wish I would have learned a little more Spanish and talked to people a little bit more.

Tried, yeah.

Carmen's a language barrier.

It's hard enough just in a way speaking.

Yeah.

To meet people.

Right.

Like with the language.

I don't know.

But everyone.

Everyone interested in like in your story at all?

Like who are you?

Where'd you come from?

Yeah.

So you would talk to other pilgrims and people, you would share stories about like, you know, where you're from, what you're doing,

why you're doing it, or just like, how many blisters do you have?

Or where did you start?

How many miles are you doing?

It would just be

probably the same questions and answers.

Yeah, yeah.

The pretty, um,

but then you would have like longer,

if you would walk with someone a longer day, then you would have get into it, like more life stuff.

You would also like, you'd start sharing like deep personal stuff about yourself while you're walking with a stranger who I'll probably never talk to again, but it's because you're just in this moment and you also

neither of you have anything else to be doing but walking.

So, it's not like you're keeping each other from anything, so you could just feel like you could just talk.

Yeah, um, yeah,

um, we'll wrap it up in a second.

Yeah, this is a very cool trip, and it makes me want to do it.

When you tell somebody, when somebody's like, Oh, I heard you went on the you know, community of Santiago, do you get like an image that pops into your head of what that was?

Um,

yeah, it's I think maybe

it's a feeling.

It was a meditation of walking and it was just like this like very

the routine of it and the meditation.

And so it's more just like that feeling is what I think of and that's what I mean I would do it again.

I would yeah, yeah, yeah.

That one.

Maybe I would branch out and do a different version of it, but I I would do it again because it was like

as much as there were hard parts and really lonely parts and

my feet hurt,

that meditation was really addictive.

Like that, that feeling of just

going and the routineness.

I think because my life too is like there's no routine in my life.

So that was just really appealing.

Interesting.

Yeah.

Yeah, no one understands like that.

It's like, well, you had the weekend off.

And it's like, that's not enough to really let your mind go fallow.

Yeah.

To really have an occasional talk, but generally, like, it's like in travel too, like, they're like, a week.

I'm like, no, right around 10, 11 days in is when I really start feeling unconnected with my past.

And that's when I start to feel in this way.

Right.

Relax.

So it's like, yeah.

35 days.

How long was it?

Five weeks.

Five weeks.

Yeah.

So yeah, even and then even like the loneliness, like sitting in the loneliness and like just being like

feeling it

was

good.

Like too much at first and then like, oh, I'm used to it now.

Yeah.

And like learning to be okay with

me and

and then knowing what I needed was like, okay, now I need to talk to someone because that's what I need.

But then I'll go back to this.

And yeah, I don't know.

It was

not because I was forced to, but because like it just like

it was a good learning experience.

So I I would suggest it to everyone.

If you have time, you can do like,

you can just do portions.

You don't have, you know, I would suggest at least two weeks.

Yeah.

Longer than the hundred kilometers and like just

try to go to the least lesser crowded ones.

That's your vibe.

Yeah.

And you did some days where you're like, I'm not walking today.

I'm just staying at the hostel or the There were

a select days.

That was usually because, like,

hurt my back,

got a cold, was worried about being in a hostel.

Oh, yeah, rain.

Oh, rain.

There was rainy days, but I, those I just walked.

I didn't, I don't think I ever stopped because of

a rain jacket, and you're just like, I'm wet now.

Right.

And then like a cover on the backpack.

And then, like, once you get poured on, you're like,

you're just wet.

Yeah.

Right.

And you just keep walking I mean it's not great it doesn't feel great but the first time I got truly poured on there was one time where it was just like we just soaked except for the rain jacket but like my pants you know

and I was like just started laughing because I was like this is and then it was like storming there was thunder like I you know like just crashing.

I remember I was like doing, I'm not like one to do like a lot of like videos of myself, but I think I was like doing a video like, oh, it's raining.

It was like, all of a sudden, like, this huge thunder clapped at the moment I was doing it.

I was like, cool.

Yeah.

And then,

yeah, you just kind of go with it.

You lose all kind of like, you're not worried about how you look, how you, you know, it's like, it's like, whatever.

And then,

yeah, so I stopped because of that.

I stopped.

My feet hurt.

And then one time I was like, wanted to

like go shopping and buy like a couple little

thing like

the hiking like the tank top or I don't know I was just like I'll just spend a day here but there was probably only like a couple days in there

that I took like a day off so I think there was one day like I hiked all of three miles and that was because I had was still getting over the cold

but otherwise

yeah no it was just like some walking every day yeah you were talking about that writing exercise of like reminding stuff it just reminded me of like being in Indonesia and like being with this guy from Belgium we're on like mopeds and just that pouring rain.

And you just start laughing.

It's that thing.

You just start, it's so ridiculous.

Yeah.

And you're just like, it's my underwear is wet.

It doesn't matter.

And it's already wet.

You're already in a pool.

Yeah.

And there's like,

yeah.

Yeah.

There was someone was like, oh, do you try and find a shelter?

I was like, I'm walking.

You know, I was trying to explain it to people and I was like, I was walking in a field.

There's no shelter in a field.

Like I, there's nothing to do.

I had enough time from when I like felt the first drop.

I had seen it getting darker, but I thought maybe I might have time.

Yeah.

And then

I had enough time to like grab my jacket, put that on, put the cover on my backpack.

But after that, it was like, oh, no, this is, I'm just, yeah.

That's one thing I learned in Southeast Asia is like when you see the rain coming, just prepare.

Yeah.

Because once you're soaked, you're soaked.

You can't get soaked.

So like, just put it on.

If it passes, no big deal.

Take your jacket off.

I do remember getting to the place I was staying that night and I was so tired and that it was a,

that was, I had a room by myself and

the, there was nowhere to eat.

The, this hotel did have, she did sell me a beer, which I was like, can I please have a beer?

But then there was no food.

And I happened to have a pack of, a can of tuna and some old crackers that were like totally broken.

And the place to eat was, I would have had to walk in the rain like another like 20 minutes and then walk back.

And I was like, I just, I can't.

Like, now I'm like dry.

So like, now I can't do that.

So I just remember like having the tuna and like the broken crackers and put it in like the mug in the room and just like stirring it and eating it and just being like, this is actually pretty, pretty amazing.

Like this is all I need.

I just needed some substance and like, I'm good.

I love like learning what will do for you.

Right.

I was like, this is good.

Yeah, great.

Greg.

Some sriracha.

I'm selling.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I, um, there were a lot of just random meals like that that I was like,

yeah.

Damn, that sounds fucking cool.

I want to do that.

Yeah.

Okay.

So I try to do this segment sort of, whatever, at the end of these.

Okay.

Give me a place that's gnawing on you that you want to go to.

Okay.

Mine is Guatemala right now.

It's in my brain.

Yeah.

By the time this comes out, I'll have already been there.

And then

and then like a travel tip for everybody, especially since you're such an accomplished traveler.

I want to go to Western Africa.

I don't know exactly where.

I've been around Africa.

Yeah, just somewhere around there.

I've been to East Africa and South Africa and North Africa, but I haven't been to West Africa.

West Africa.

Liberia?

Places like that?

Yeah, yeah.

That's like the French reasons yeah um

I don't even know like I don't know much about it so it would be kind of I need to research I need to just go

and

yeah so there okay that's cool yeah and then a tip um

I think just be open don't you're not at home so it doesn't need to be like home just

see how it is other places I get I think a lot of people are like,

Yeah.

And it's scary.

Yeah, you're, you're not home.

So it's different.

Enjoy the different.

That's the whole point of traveling.

Yeah.

We talk about like, it's an American thing to make reservations.

And you're like, right.

Because your restaurant, it's open.

It's like, don't need a reservation.

They're like, what?

I said, just come back.

Or to like hurry when we were in Paris.

You know, you want to like, why is it so slow?

Why are they having us eat for, you know, it's like,

yeah, yeah.

No, because you're supposed to enjoy your meal.

You're supposed to sit there and enjoy it.

Be open to a new way of

their way of doing whatever it is.

Right.

I mean, it's hard.

It's not always easy to fight what you've had, but even just like,

I don't know, try everything you can try.

There's no good,

nothing

like a factoid kind of tip I have.

No, that what you said is like, be open.

Yeah.

That's a good point for sure.

Yeah.

Otherwise, there's no point.

And so, like, I just, I say yes to

most everything, and I get lost whenever possible because you have your phone.

You'll get back home.

It's fine.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

You'll figure it out.

Yeah.

But getting lost is just like,

it's the most fun.

Yeah.

People get so scared of that.

Like, what if we get lost?

And you're, you, you, like, they can't even comprehend that your reaction is like, sick.

Yeah.

And you're like, what, what?

No, it's a negative.

Like, it's not a negative.

No.

Find some new street.

Right.

And you just don't know.

I did that in Morocco in Fez.

Like, I just was like so excited about just walking.

And people kept trying to like steer me back, the locals.

And I'd be like, no, I just want to, I want to get lost.

And I try to do that

wherever I am.

Yeah, nice.

All right.

Hell yeah, Jasmine.

Thank you.

I for sure want to do the Community Symphony.

Yeah.

All right, everyone, subscribe.

And

yeah, I don't know.

Maybe we'll have merch by now.

Bye.

Thank you.

Bye.

Where can people find you?

I'll see that.

Oh, Instagram, Jasmine Shaw Photo.

Jasmine No E S H A H photo.

Yeah.

Jasmine Shaw Photo.

Okay.

There'll be links to it in the bottom.

My website, jasmine shaw.com.

So also jasmine shawphoto.com.

JasmineShaw.com.

Yeah, that's confusing.

But yeah, but

great.

Thank you.

Yeah.

Well, that's the episode, everybody.

Thank you, Jasmine Shaw, for coming and telling us about that.

What a fucking cool trip, huh?

God damn, if you just had a month,

if you just had a month, there's a way to do it.

I'm on the Great Ocean Road right now.

There's a hike you can do there.

100 kilometers.

100 fucking kilometers.

I was like, I could do that.

How long would that?

25 kilometers?

100 is like 60.

It's like eight miles a day.

Five days.

You could do it in seven.

Damn, if I had more time and the weather was a little nicer, the weather's fucking great.

What are you talking about, complainer?

One time when I was starting in comedy, I had this chick and

I was like, went to the garlic restaurant one time.

And I was like, damn, if I had the money and the time, they had this great banya calda.

It was $5.

It was a sage, just melted garlic.

clothes just ready to be fucking touched and just like disintegrate and they bring you free bread you get it before your meal.

We saved up once and I got it for like our anniversary or something.

And later I was talking about it was so good, the garlic rush.

The stinking rose.

And I was like, if I, when I get more successful, if I had the time and money, I would go there fucking every day.

She goes,

she goes, Ari, you're a stand-up comedian.

You have all day at home, you write an hour a day, you sit at home for fucking eight hours watching videos and shit, talking to your friends, smoking weed.

Like, like you have the time and it's literally $5.

Like, oh yeah,

I guess it's just on me the excuse now then.

Whoa.

Jasmine Shaw, what a fucking cool photographic journey.

Go to jasmineshaw.com on Instagram at jasmine shawphoto.

Is that it?

We'll do an insert if I'm wrong.

Next week, Matt McCusker.

Guys, wherever you're listening, I heard they don't suggest these on Spotify.

People tell me, like, I didn't know I had a new episode for fucking, whoa, four weeks they missed them.

Guys, subscribe, and so it'll tell you when there's a new episode, which will be next Monday, and it'll be the fucking wizard Matt McCusker

talking about taking us to Brazil.

Is that our first South?

No, we've had some South American ones.

It's our first Portuguese-speaking one.

Subscribe wherever you are.

I will be talking about this trip on the Patreon,

the Great Ocean Road.

That'll be this week's Patreon.

Maybe some pictures in there.

Patreon.com slash you be trippin'.

That's it, you guys.

Subscribe wherever you're at.

I'm going to be in

Monday.

Brisbane and Sydney.

That's all I got left for my whole tour.

Brisbane at the QPEC, something like that.

And Sydney at the Enmore Theater.

Two shows.

Second show added.

Brisbane shows almost almost sold out.

There will be no second show.

And then, fuck it.

I got a lot to tell you guys.

But anyway, that's it.

Subscribe, listen.

Thank you guys for tuning in.

Fuck it.

Leave a comment.

Tell us of your favorite experience.

Have you done the Camino de Santiago?

Fucking cool.

You know who else did it?

Michelle Wolfe.

She ran it.

I'm going to get her and to talk about her.

And you can compare the two.

That's what this podcast is all about.

And travel.

Guys, thank you very much for tuning in.

I'm Aurora Shafir.

Till next week.

Wait.

Ciao, I know this one.

This is Spanish.

I don't know Catalan, but

bonote.

No, that's Portuguese.

Well, I know how to say goodbye.

Adios.

Stupid.

That was an easy one.

Anyway, goodbye.