Episode 78 - Beef Security

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Hello, and welcome to the Beef and Dairy Network podcast, the number one podcast for those involved, or just interested, in the production of beef animals and dairy herds.

The Beef and Dairy Network podcast is the podcast companion to the Beef and Dairy Network website and a printed magazine brought to you you by Scottish Wine.

Now, security is a basic human need, like water, shelter, or beef.

But new figures published this month by the British Beef Security Watch, or Bubbasoa, show that burglaries of beef have risen by a shocking 60% this year alone.

We don't know why, but it is thought that thieves perceive that beeves are easy to retrieve.

It's hard to conceive, but in some cases these beef thieves hope to deceive to achieve when they heave sheaves of beeves into their sleeves and then take their leave.

The owners of course then relieved of their beeves.

At least this is what this podcast believes.

Frequent targets include beef farms, slaughterhouses and butchers.

And someone who knows all about this is Keith Poggles.

Hello, this is Keith Poggles.

I'm a security consultant these days.

I run Poggles Security Solutions.

Previously, you might have known this as the Iron Vanguard.

We did have to change that name.

That turns out to be the name of a fascist youth movement in Armenia.

And

they've got the dot-com.

They got in quick.

Well, thanks so much for talking with me today, Mr.

Poggles.

We've seen the headlines this week.

Beef break-ins are up 60% this year alone.

There seems to be some kind of trend.

Farms, slaughterhouses, butchers being broken into, beef being stolen.

I would imagine that business is booming for Poggles Security Solutions.

Just talk us through

the service that you provide.

Well, as you say, there's never been a more important time to protect your beef.

It's chaos out there.

And what you need is somebody who knows what they're doing.

We make sure no one is going to take your beef.

So the idea being, essentially,

we go in and we try and steal your beef.

And more often than not, we'll succeed.

And people will say,

how did you manage that?

I thought we had everything

sorted and we'll come back and say, well,

here's what you need to do.

So when you go to these properties, what kind of security measures do people tend to have?

Doors.

They often use doors, and they'll lock those doors.

Interesting.

Yep.

And I'll have to often explain to them: well, look,

we can get that door open.

That surprises a lot of people.

These doors you're talking about, I imagine, are the kind where a key is needed to, and

you know, correct me if I'm getting the terminology wrong, unlock the door.

Yeah, with a key system.

so you'd have um

oh yeah how to describe it so uh

so the key will be specific to that particular door um

yeah

tricky for you then yeah so we wouldn't have access to the to the particular key but there are ways to um open a lock without the key really and i think people need i think people's eyes are finally opening to that I think there'll be a lot of people listening who

you know maybe they have their own beef facility of some sort and they may well have spent a lot of their own money on these door systems with the unique key that corresponds to the unique door.

And who can blame them?

Because

that message is sit out there.

If you want to get a door.

There are ways to,

you know, get through a wall, isn't it?

And

close the wall behind you.

I'm not here to say that we shouldn't have doors at all.

But I think people maybe have been led down the garden path a bit by some of the door campaigns out there that have convinced people that a door is going to stop people getting into their premises.

I wonder whether maybe it's bred a kind of complacency.

You know, I don't need to worry,

I've got doors.

There is a complacency, and you think the door was invented, goodness knows, it must have been 100 years old at least.

You know, times move on, you know, don't they?

So

listen, I'm well famous.

I turn up and I see there's a door, I'm happy.

You know,

because we're getting through there.

Somebody who has recently upgraded their security system is the owner of the Roberts Slaughterhouse in Clankegan, Wales, Eli Roberts.

Not only has his slaughterhouse complex had doors for many years, he also employs full-time security personnel.

However, in recent weeks, he has fundamentally changed the makeup of this staff.

I went to meet him to find out more.

What would you say if I told you I could find an employee that was loyal,

strong,

a tremendous endurance,

ruthless when he needed to be ruthless, and would work for nothing?

Well, that's not an employee anymore if they're working for nothing.

Well, what if I told you they didn't know that?

Okay.

I mean, we have really sort of hit the pay dirty here because

I am quite proud to say that I have hit upon employing chimpanzees.

I asked Eli what was attractive about replacing human security guards with chimpanzees.

Two words.

Human error.

And I'll give you another word as well.

Greed.

So security, the plant is very important to me.

You know, it's

it stops people breaking in

and stops people breaking out, more importantly.

I was employing a couple of the local lads to be security for me but

the workforce was depleting.

I mean it depletes anyway.

I mean through industrial accidents and malnutrition and whatever but I mean it people were escaping.

I say the word escape it makes me sound like I'm culpable but I mean they were people were leaving without permission and

cost me an arm and a leg.

Cost them an arm leg when I found them as well.

And

you can't trust people and then they want to pay rate Oh, you know, I this is this is inhuman.

I said, Well, I tell you what, then I'll get someone who is inhuman,

right?

If this is below you, right?

You think you think you're an apex predator, you think you're king of the castle, you think you're top of the pyramid, are you indeed, right?

I'll tell you something about nothing, right?

Any one of those lads that work for security for me, put them in a cage with Jill.

Jill's a chimp, Jill's a chimp, she'll take her face off.

She'll take her face off, take their face off, take their face off, take their face off, yeah.

What does Jill ask?

Asks nothing in return.

so really you see a chimp as the perfect security guard think of it right they'll work all day they're hard as you like

they got no no sympathy whatsoever they got no compunction about uh going uh in an inadverted commerce too far i assume when you take them away at a suitably young age they they they develop a bond with you you know i become like a father figure to all those chimps So do the chimps here, do they think you're a chimp?

Yeah, they think of me as like a hairless,

as a hairless chimp, I suppose.

Which, let's be honest, is what is what we are

I was interested in how Eli had obtained the chimpanzees.

Do you know how much a chimp cost?

I've got no idea how much.

$12,500 US.

Right.

I'm going to laugh, man.

What does it cost to drive a transit van to Central Africa?

A couple of hundred quid.

Tops.

And you get like 40 or 50 chimps in the back of a transit, easy.

Is what you're telling me that you didn't pay the going rates that that i assume is you you pay a poacher which is you say twelve thousand pounds no no twelve thousand five hundred dollars

is is the is the market price legitimately to go and buy a a chimpanzee on the open market in america legitimately legitimately yeah i mean from a you know like a private zoo like they have over there you know right i could have paid forty thousand dollars and had a giraffe but that's no good to man no fucking beast yeah i need security if i needed leaves nibbled off the top my trees then i'd think about going to south africa with a with a transit and bringing back a giraffe but then i'd have to cut the roof off the transit.

And, you know, you never get out past customs.

So let me just clear this up then.

Yeah.

You could have bought chimps from a private zoo or private collection in America for $12,500 each.

Dollars each, sure.

Yeah.

And how many have you got?

Working for me now.

Yeah.

40.

Right, 40 chimps.

So

you could have bought them, but instead you...

Am I right in saying that you drove a transit van to Central Africa?

Well, I do the mathematics.

I mean, 40 chimps, well you're talking best part of half a million quid.

You know transit I had it anyway.

Drove through France, down through Spain.

I had a meet

near Gibraltar, took me across to Morocco, down through Africa.

Took about two or three weeks all in, you know, lovely.

And then yeah, I mean it's purely down to how

how dedicated you are and how much you want those chimps, you know, and

I wanted them.

So

I got them.

You drove to Africa with your van?

Yeah.

what happens next did you speak to poachers is that scum of the earth scum scum of the earth poachers yeah

it is absolutely rife in africa poaching do you ever hear about poaching of uh chimps going on in in in wales um no well exactly so they got a they got a safer life they bring them to wales where they can live without fear of being poached so you've stolen the chimps from the wild

yeah in order to when they're young like take them away get them away from the parents young right you get more in a van then and you're saying that by doing that, you're protecting them from poachers.

Well, yeah, because I mean,

like I said, poaching in Africa is absolutely endemic.

But I mean, there's almost no poaching of

primates in Wales.

So, by bringing them here,

if anything, I'm keeping them safe from poachers.

But do you think that some people might think you are being a poacher?

Well, no, because I'm not killing them for their ivory.

You filled up the transit

with 40 baby chimps?

Infant chimps, I would say, not babies, yeah.

Yeah, okay.

It's still not clear to me, actually, how you sort of got them in the van.

All you gotta do,

I shouldn't be telling you, I should be really going to business yourself and getting your own bloody chimps.

But

I will tell you, right?

So, but

if I catch you doing this,

I will cut your throat.

And I mean that.

I do mean it.

Get a transit van, right?

Park it up.

Put a couple of leaves and branches around the door.

Open the back doors.

Put a little ramp in there, right?

Get something like

a big pot of food.

Big, big, like bananas they go crazy for, right?

Get a few bananas in a pot, they can smell it.

Open the doors there, get a bit of banana stew on a go.

Chimps turn up

wide-eyed with appreciation, usually, you know, they,

oh, what's this we got?

Yeah, oh, this is a, it's a magic, magic free sauce of bananas.

And wow, we haven't got to go up a tree to get it.

It's just you for us

and uh eat their fill and then when they're sleeping drive to the next place so when they wake up and they're still in the back of your van yeah are they angry it's hard to tell with a chim if they're happy they're they're screaming their heads off

if they're in pain they're screaming their heads off if they're missing their family they're screaming their heads off you know you never know what it is and what about the the people there i i know it's a very sparsely populated area of of rainforest but there are people there working for charities who stop poachers and that kind of thing you know what do they have to say about this?

Oh,

bloody do-gooders, you mean?

Yeah, I met a few of those over there.

Right.

Did they have a problem with what you were doing?

Well, let me tell you what they tell you what they have a problem with.

Stop at a transit van.

Hello, my name is Janet Bingham, and I am the mother of Warren Bingham, who sadly went missing in the Democratic Republic of Congo.

Warren disappeared at the age of 19 two months ago.

I asked Janet to tell me about what he was like.

Warren was a lovely child.

Lovely, but I think it's fair to say he never quite fitted in.

You know those girls at school who've got a horse and their only friend is the horse and they talk about a horse all the time?

Well, he was sort of like that, but he didn't have a horse.

Right.

So it's fair to say he wasn't a popular child?

No, no.

I would say deeply, deeply unpopular.

Popular with me, of course, not so much with his father.

Right.

So a troubled childhood or?

Troubled.

He took great comfort from nature, the natural world.

I remember coming back from work one day, and we've got quite a large garden with a sort of, I don't want to say lake, but sort of a large pond, let's say.

And there was a swan.

that you know sometimes used to come come into the garden and he was there chest bare trying to ride the swan.

You know, he'd fashioned a little sort of little tiny reins for it.

And I was having none of it, you know, pecking all over the place.

But he was going full pelt.

And he was on the water, so he was kind of using it like a sort of natural jet ski.

Exactly.

And, you know, with it thrashing around, it was building up quite a lot of speed.

And he was sort of speeding around the pond.

He was sort of having the time of his life.

You're painting quite a vivid picture of his early childhood, this child who'd loved nature, riding a swan around the garden.

Did this interest in the natural world continue into his teenage years?

Absolutely.

He threw himself into nature in all kinds of ways.

I did actually get a little bit worried at one point because he did sort of share the bed with the dog and they sort of became very sort of, I wouldn't say romantically attached, but there was definitely some kind of real depth of feeling there.

So, Janet, tell me about Warren's decision to go to the Democratic Republic of Congo.

Yeah, so Warren decided to go to the Democratic Republic of Congo, and obviously I was worried about that.

His father, however, I think it's fair to say, was sort of less concerned.

He, in fact, seemed delighted.

Miss sort of seconds after Warren had left the house,

my husband was turning his bedroom, Warren's bedroom, into what he called a scream therapy chamber.

And he started fishing out of the recycling all the egg boxes, bits of cardboard, bubble wrap, taping them to the walls of this little room.

He put a duvet on

the wall, and he'd invited his friends over to sort of just scream obscenities.

And that's actually filled even more, filled up even more now with recycling and soft furnishings.

And now only a man can just sort of crawl in there into a little space and they all take turns.

Right.

So your husband and his friends are taking turns to, just to make this clear in my head, they crawl into this space that's kind of full of packaging, essentially, and soft material and just scream out their frustrations.

Yes, they often, they scream out their frustrations, and often he will, I can just hear him saying, Janet, Janet, and it will be muffled.

They'll shout out all kinds of things.

I heard one of them shouting about cursed beautsop, but I think that might have been more of a sort of

amorous shout.

A sort of a lustful cry.

Yeah, a lustful, I'd say lustful cry.

Do you think that's,

you know, I know I'm not here to talk about your husband.

I'm here to talk about Warren, but

I'm interested in this nonetheless.

Do you think that's a healthy mental space to be in?

Just kind of screaming your wife's name into a doovey?

I mean, it's very much the man I married.

Don't get me wrong.

I mean, nothing about this is unexpected.

I mean, if you'd asked me the night before my wedding, where I saw myself in 40 years, I'd say, we are going to be living in separate bedrooms and he will have a special little room, our son's bedroom, that he has turned into a room where he can masturbate and scream.

I'm beginning to get a picture of the kind of home where Warren was brought up.

And it kind of helps me understand actually why he may have wanted to go and do some volunteer conservation work somewhere as far away as the Democratic Republic of Congo.

Yeah, no, I would say that our family home was not happy by any stretch of the imagination.

But I mean, to be frank, that's how I I would want it to be.

I sort of feel like there's a lot of mollycoddling of children and people in general.

And, you know, I mean, that gives me some comfort to think that Warren chose to go to one of the most war-torn countries on earth to the jungle, but he was well prepared for that by his childhood.

Eli Roberts met Warren in the jungle two months ago.

You know, some bloody university student from Britain got over there to bloody do a good deed.

They get a a bloody job, I don't know, to get a proper job.

Not trying to stop me from giving it, you know, liberating chimps on a gap year, whatever that's supposed to be, God knows what that means.

A gap between his ears, I think.

Standing in front of the van,

you know, big, big sign on a big, like, holding like a placard saying no to poaching.

He had his badge on, like a lanyard and stuff, and some sort of idea with him.

Screaming and shouting blue murder, you know, calling me all sorts of names and all that.

Only for him to jump on a plane, but it's not okay for the the chimp to get in a transit and go back to Wales.

And suddenly, Mr.

Bloody Imagabia, a student with his dreadlocks, wants to try and stop a transit van and thinks,

in what can only be described as an extreme lack of judgment, that if he stands in front of the transit van, I'm going to stop.

And I had to go, well, basically, Tiananmen Square on him.

I knew something was wrong when I stopped receiving WhatsApp messages from Warren.

And the thing is, I was receiving them very, very frequently.

Daily, I'd receive messages of him in the arms of yet another chimpanzee.

Once he put a wig on one of the wig, I don't know where he got that from.

You know, to some people, that would be heartwarming, but for me, you know, I did sort of worry slightly for the chimpanzee, you know, because it did remind me somewhat of him and Belle,

Leigh Labrador, and their very close relationship that they enjoyed.

So, yeah, it was a sort of this sort of gallery of chimpanzees and my son.

And so, when that stopped, i knew something was terribly terribly wrong and i um popped on a plane to the democratic republic of congo

running warren over with the transit van is shocking enough but more shocking still is what he then did with his lifeless body and the thing was i mean luckily for me i just chucked the uh

i chucked the student in the back of the van then and didn't have to feed the kids in the back they're the chimps into morocco you know the local lads nice enough fellas there you know they they were they i just said listen have a couple of credits lads and uh if anyone comes poking a nose around there just tell me he's been uh he was bitten on the on a cock by a spider

so uh yeah i mean

i'm sure i'm sure he's he's missed by someone but uh i certainly didn't miss him

literally as soon as i arrived i um went straight over to the charities hq met some lovely gentlemen They actually told me what had happened is Warren had been bitten on the end of his penis by a a large spider and died.

I mean, it's amazing you had to fly all the way there for them to tell you that they didn't think to ring you or

let you know that

he'd been bitten on the cock by a spider.

No, it was

a dark day in what's been a very, very dark life.

I found it extremely moving speaking to the gentleman.

Tell me about the emotions you feel when you find out

your son has died because he's been bitten on the knob.

I I was devastated,

sad, but then there is something lovely about it because to me, being bitten on the penis by a spider is a noble death.

I mean, Warren loved nature and nature loved him.

And to die by the bite of a spider on his private part is, you know, I mean, the best any of us can hope for.

There's definitely great comfort in knowing the manner of his death.

I'm interested in whether you ever had any suspicions about

the manner of Warren's death.

If anything ever sort of didn't add up to you about the story, do you ever feel it's implausible that he died because a spider bit his tallywhacker?

Are you trying to suggest that he wasn't bitten on the cock by a spider?

Has it not occurred to you that it's strange that, you know, I believe you weren't able to see body over there.

No, I'm

no.

What you don't understand is what the gentleman explained to me, is that when you're bitten, the poison actually sort of dissolves your body and sort of rumples up and then evaporates.

So, no, I wasn't able to see his body.

What would you say if I told you that I personally had information

about the real story of how Warren met his end?

I mean, if you're trying to tell me he wasn't wasn't bitten on the cock by a spider, I honestly don't know what I'm going to do with myself.

Right.

Okay.

So that's something that's very important.

You know, that seems to have

something that's quite important to you.

It is, because it.

Warren being bitten on the cock

by a spider, it might sound strange, but in the madness madness of the last couple of years, this has been sort of a sort of a glimmer of hope, a sort of natural order.

And I'll tell you something else.

I actually visited a spiritualist in Glastonbury, and she told me that I, in fact, was a spider in a past life.

So,

just hear me out here, it's almost as though I bit Warren.

and caused his death and I find great solace there.

Well the information that I had about the real story about how Warren met his end was just that

I happened to know that it was a really big spider.

Thank you.

Thank you so much.

I was interested to know whether Eli had had any trouble with the chimps.

They'd been good as gold.

You know, there's going to be

a bit of a power struggle

at the beginning.

You know, there's going to be a

uh literally well i was going to say doggy dog it was actually chimpie chimp but um

you know so the third year there's a boss now big steve you know they know he's the boss oh so big steve one of the the chimps has kind of risen to the top big steve's the big is uh is the is the big chimp on the site yeah and as a mark of respect

for a fellow uh

a fellow striving to be to become the best i've um i've given him uh a crossbow you've given one of the chimps a crossbow yeah big steve yeah And does he use that?

Oh, yeah, he's, I mean, his aim is not the best.

But I mean,

yeah, he's shot it a couple of times.

I've got to load it up for him.

He hasn't worked out the draw mechanism yet.

But I mean,

I'll draw it and cock it for him.

And

he makes a funny little scream like he does and just fires a trigger.

And

yeah.

Well, he lacks in accuracy, mind.

He makes up for it in a lack of more.

So,

you know.

So I guess they've got this kind of almost human-like kind of society and hierarchy.

Yeah, yeah.

So, yeah, with Big Steve at the top and then a kind of a system that's emerged.

That's really interesting.

There's a harem of female chimps, and there's, you know, there's people who work for him.

They're up there cracking, cracking security team.

They really are.

I mean, as far as the crossbow is concerned, you know, what Big Steve lacks in accuracy, he makes up for with a lack of remorse as well.

Because, I mean,

well, this is a funny story.

When we got back to Wales from Africa with the van,

I'd been in such a rush

to get as many chimps in there as possible and get out of there.

So

didn't make enough thorough checks.

I'm very honest with you, you know, but I was obviously doing my best in difficult circumstances.

Well, the only bloody, one of the, what I thought was an infant chimp turned out to be a silverback gorilla.

What, right?

Yeah, Lenny, I called him.

He was big, big, big old boy, Len.

Well, so when you put him in the van, he was a silverback at that stage, or he was a baby gorilla who no no he was a four full-grown silverback yeah you did notice no no it was uh it was dark and uh

i was still bloody uh chuckling to myself what the uh the gap student that um

thought he could stop a transit van you know so uh so at what point did you realize that one of the juvenile chimps was in fact an adult gorilla i thought someone was afoot when we got to like north africa i was waiting to get on on on the little boat there and uh hell of a racket from the back of the van and i i i had a little peek inside there there was a uh and this

like a shadow in the back, and it looked like a I thought I thought one of the chimps had grown a lot in the last couple of days.

You know, I had no idea how fast they grow.

But yeah, by the time I got back to Wales, open the van up, and uh, Lenny, I called him,

huge thing.

Um, yeah, full-grown bloody silver back in the back there.

So, uh, this is,

and there's an important life lesson to be learned from this as well, because uh, I, you, you naturally assume then that big Lenny's going to be the boss.

And

well, yeah, how did he

get on with the rest of the the chimps?

Because obviously he's a different species.

Yeah, and he was.

I hate to say the word bully, but I mean, he liked to

put it about a bit.

But by complete fluke, there was no skill involved.

But

yeah, so one of the first people that

Big Steve shot was Lenny.

Complete fluke with a crossbow, yeah.

Bolted him in just below the left eye, and he was dead right at the floor.

I mean, it was a

a course.

I mean,

if Steve

popular before that, I mean,

afterwards, he was

king of the castle.

Well, let's talk about their role as security guards.

You say that they're doing a good job.

Have they had to apprehend anyone yet?

Or, you know, is it just a case of

sitting around and twiddling their thumbs?

We had a runner about three weeks ago, we had a runner, usual sort of thing.

Oh, I want my freedom.

You know, I haven't been paid for weeks.

I haven't seen my family.

I'm still terrified.

All this sort of nonsense.

And

Big Steve was, you know,

he wasn't involved himself.

It was two of the other fellas there,

Chris and Helen,

two of the younger ones.

And they off like a blinging shot after him.

And he got up near the

not far from the bus station right there.

And Helen grabbed him by the collar, jumped on him, had a cracking, lovely jump.

And he sort of toppled backwards.

And then Chris went straight for the face, basically took the face off, near enough.

And then Helen was making a hell of a racket.

And she just was, I could see it out biting and just bit a couple of his fingers off.

And that was it then.

Done.

So,

you know, didn't kill him.

He's back.

He's back on the site now.

He's,

I gave him two days off.

And he sort of just got the eight fingers there.

But I mean, there's plenty of the people from the abattoir who've got less than 10 fingers.

He did, if anything, he fits in better now.

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After acquiring the chimps, Eli contacted Keith Poggles at Poggles Security Solutions to ask if they could test his new security system.

Something which proved to be much harder than Keith had assumed.

Yeah, a tough night, actually.

So tell me about when Eli called you.

It was out of the blue.

I hadn't heard of Eli before.

And he said, look, you know, you're the best.

Are you up for a challenge?

yes, of course.

He said, I won't tell you what we've what we've done, just see if you can get in.

And he um, he didn't, he went for any pay, it was the diamond package.

The Poggles diamond package is basically a full military assault on your premises to see if your security system can stand up to it.

Tens of trained professionals will try and steal your beef, including former members of the armed forces, armed vehicles, and bad dogs.

We're completely honest, we put it on the website as a bit of a joke.

We didn't think anybody would go for the diamond package.

We had to buy a helicopter.

Oh, right, it comes with a helicopter.

Yeah, it comes with a helicopter.

We had to buy that.

We didn't have that.

We had to learn the basics.

Turns out that's quite hard.

Had to call in a lot of favours, soldiers, and we've got a lot of dogs.

It was an astonishing level.

It seemed like overkill.

But it wasn't.

Yeah, it was not

at all the assaults began at 2 a.m keith was at poggles hq watching the events through the body cams of the soldiers got about 30 men uh and um

on this chopper and then there's there's ground units coming in with with dogs

that's all

which fly under the radar they drop in

It's all go, you know, it's It's all going perfectly.

They land.

No one in the courtyard.

Courtyard's clear.

Unbelievable.

You're thinking to yourself, Roberts has absolutely...

He's messed this up.

There's a door.

Not even locked.

Corridor clear.

We're looking up and down the corridors.

We're going, where have they hidden these?

What is this?

So, you know, we're.

Where have they put the beef?

Where are the cows?

No beef down here.

And then

there's this noise.

What's that noise?

Patrol.

We can hear some movement in the walls.

What your first thought is, we found them.

It's the cows.

You think this is it?

This is it.

They've put the- they've put the the cows in the walls.

Fake walls.

It's a classic you know you've got to be very careful this close with that many cows there's a lot of methane you know no live ammunition because that could go up but uh

it was not the cows making the noise

i had barely seconds to see what actually it was there before just a barrage of shit

flew at us

It was uh

it was like

just a rain of shit.

It was you know

a medieval battle and the arrows are flying down except it's it's shit.

I'm you know apologies for the for the graphic image there, but this was a lot of shit being thrown.

And through through this melee, through this sort of mist of haze of feces and detractors,

40 frenzied chimps

tear through the men.

Control, we're under attack by overestimate.

30 or 40 chimpanzees.

It was...

It felt like an hour, but it must have been...

a minute, 30 seconds.

Holy shit!

These are trained men, but 40 chimps

throwing that much shit.

They'd presumably...

been eating beef.

They'd got that boost.

They've got that energy boost.

And it was...

We screamed, you know, the dogs get the dogs in there

But the chimps were ready they they bonded quite quickly with the dogs and they they rode them around they're born entertainers chimps

The thing is these soldiers, okay,

they're trained, but they're trained to kill people.

And there's that second's hesitation.

A chimp.

Should I?

Can I?

Are they endangered?

Is this the what?

Is this the ones, the palm oil ones?

Is this them?

You know.

And that's that's all it takes.

In that split second, you've lost the advantage.

Oh, you've gone.

And it's fair to say that they are violent.

Oh, they're wearing the guts like Christmas hats.

They're riding the dogs around.

I mean, it's quite...

By this point, they know they're on top.

Imagine sort of a feral apocalypse, Krupps.

So of all of the staff members that you sent into the Roberts slaughterhouse

How many came back?

Well chips always leave one

They always leave one

bastards are everywhere

Harry Bobby

Yeah, he's quit the job actually doesn't work for me now.

I think that's understandable isn't it?

Yeah

well better luck to him.

Well that's it isn't it that's all you can say that's what I said.

Sorry about the, you know, chimp slaughter.

And so I assume that the following day you had to ring Eli and

give him the good news.

You know, you weren't able to steal any beef.

He rang me.

I mean, he was, you know, he was excited to do it.

Yeah.

And I just had to sort of, you know,

say, well, look,

well done, first of all.

Then I, second of all, I just said, listen,

just be careful.

Watch your back.

Because

40 chimps, that well trained, now with dogs,

they could turn.

I asked Eli whether he thought the chimps would turn.

Did he think that one day, Big Steve might challenge his authority?

I hope he does.

I mean that.

I hope he does, because I've seen that look in his eye.

And he's thinking, hello,

I can be the big dog here.

I can run the whole place.

And then

I would love nothing more than to go mano a chimpo with him.

But anything.

Even if he was wielding a crossbow?

Well, I mean, that's neither you nor that.

His aim is bad.

What I would do in that situation, of course, is I would take the crossbow off him.

I'd distract him in some way, I'd probably

get like a pencil and jam it in his ear or something like that.

And then when he was screaming in pain, take a crossbow off him

and I'd shoot him in the uh in the well, in the chest probably, or the stomach area.

And then as he was bleeding out, I would take my top off, bare chested, and I'd thump my chest over him, you know, stand on his on his torso, and then um

I would be known as king of the chimps by the other chimps then, but um it hadn't come to that.

There's not a day goes by, I don't think of him, I relish him challenging my authority.

But as it is, he's happy with what he's doing, and I'm happy with him doing a good job for me, so he knows who the boss is.

So, what would you say to the people?

I feel like I have a responsibility to say this,

who would say these chimps deserve to be in their natural habitat?

Oh,

they're not right.

Let me ask you a question, shall I?

Let me flip it on and ask you a question, right?

These people are saying this:

Are they naked?

Probably not.

Are they covered in their own extreme?

Unlikely.

Is their hair ever been cut?

Probably.

Well, there we are.

So they can be all high and mighty, how come they're not in their natural environment?

And yet they are quite happy not to be in their natural environment.

Oh, so you think a human's natural environment is just to...

We don't think it is.

What's natural, isn't it?

So you think it's natural for humans to be naked?

Of course, that's how you're born.

How you come out is how you are.

That's natural.

Everything else is by nature, not natural, right?

So unless you're standing there naked as the day you were born, covered in bits of your own excrement with matted hair and unkempt beard and nails caked in mud, then you're not being natural yourself.

And now you can tell me that chimps should be in their natural habitat.

Well,

I tell you what, go live in your natural habitat first, and then you can throw stones.

And in fact, and try throwing stones, because I can tell you something for nothing.

A chimp can throw a stone further and harder than you can.

And one of the big fuckers has got a crossbow.

Okay, okay.

Well, I take your point.

Yeah.

What about the legal aspect of this, which is that what you've done is almost certainly illegal?

Here we go.

Legal.

Who said legal for who?

Legal for who?

So someone in London, in Westminster, can sit there on a green leather chair and tell me what's legal and what's not legal.

And then some bloke with a flipping horsehair wig and a gown and a wooden hammer can tell me what I can and cannot do with a chimp.

Don't be so bloody ridiculous.

So, do you feel like the chimps have their own system of

legal system, really?

Natural justice.

Right.

Which is what, you know, what makes the world go round.

You know, they think of all the species, all the hundreds and millions and thousands of species in the world.

Only one of them have got a crown court.

How long have we got courts for?

Courts?

Yeah.

I don't know.

A couple of thousand years.

How was the earth?

4.5 billion years old.

Universe is 13.5 billion years old.

13.5 billion years.

Unfathomably large.

Not only larger than we imagined, but larger than we could imagine.

And expanding exponentially.

And millions of species.

Most of which, the vast majority of which no longer live.

They've lived and died.

They've shuffled off this mortal coil.

They've had their chance at the wheel.

Right?

And every day, more and more stars are being born, and more and more planets are coalescing.

And every day, the universe expands, and it's not only bigger than we can imagine, it's bigger than we can imagine.

And you're telling me that if all that unfathomable vastness,

that enormous magnet, we literally cannot even begin to wrap our heads around how big it is.

And in all that infinite space, in all of that,

you think that that some bloke telling me that I can't put a chimp in a transit van and give him a crossbow is law.

It's some immutable truth.

That's ridiculous, isn't it?

A big thanks to Eli Roberts, Janet Bingham, and Keith Poggles for those interviews.

And Poggles Security Solutions is offering a deal to all Beef and Dairy Network members.

It's 50% off the price of the bronze security package.

And that comes with a free guarantee that they won't kill any of your security guards unless completely necessary.

And if they do, they say they will clonk them respectfully on the back of the head with a heavy torch.

So an open casket funeral entirely possible in that scenario.

So that's all we've got time for this month.

But if you're after more beef and dairy news, get over to the website now, where you'll find all the usual stuff, as well as our off-topic section, where this month we look back at World War II and ask, could the whole thing have been avoided if Hitler, Stalin, Chamberlain, Emperor Hirohito, and Franklin Delano Roosevelt had done karaoke together on the deck of a naval destroyer on the eve of war?

The answer's no.

So, until next time,

beef out.

Thanks to Alastair Satchell, Tom Bell, Mike Bubbins, and Amy Mason, and also all of the listeners who answered the call on Twitter and provided the voices of those poor, poor soldiers being torn to shreds by chimps.

You all did a fantastic job.

Okay, until next time, goodbye.

This week on Maximum Fun's pro wrestling podcast, Tits and Fights, Austin Creed, best known as WWE's Xavier Woods, tells us why his fans find him so easy to love.

So I think it's less me being good at it and more people wanting to be a part of something.

And it's very easy to be a part of these things because I constantly am screaming about what I'm interested in.

Austin Creed on the perfect wrestling podcast, Tights and Fights.

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She says she's the devil himself.

That thing is not my daughter.

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Well, there is, and it's Ono Ross and Carrie on Maximum Fun.

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