Nightcap Hour 1: Unc & Ocho react Shilo Sanders WAIVED by Bucs + Stefanski denies Shedeur “Sabotage”

This is an iHeart Podcast.

You're juggling a lot.

Full-time job, side hustle, maybe a family.

And now you're thinking about grad school?

That's not crazy.

That's ambitious.

At American Public University, we respect the hustle and we're built for it.

Our flexible online master's programs are made for real life because big dreams deserve a real path.

Learn more about APU's 40-plus career-relevant master's degrees and certificates at apu.apus.edu.

APU, built for the hustle.

I'm Dan.

He's Ty.

Hello.

And we're the Solid Verbal College Football Podcast.

Tune in for previews, recaps, bits you won't hear anywhere else, and all the emotional support you need as a college football fan.

Join us all season long as we ride the roller coaster of this ridiculous sport.

Listen to the Solid Verbal College Football Podcasts on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

We don't just love college football, Ty.

We live it.

This is Larry Flick, owner of the Floor Store.

Labor Day is the last sale of the summer, but this one is our biggest sale of the year.

Now through September 2nd, get up to 50% off store-wide on carpet, hardwood, laminate, waterproof flooring, and much more.

Plus two years interest-free financing, and we pay your sales tax.

The Floor Stores Labor Day sale.

Don't let the sun set on this one.

Go to floorstores.com to find the nearest of our 10 showrooms from Santa Rosa to San Jose.

The floor store, your area flooring authority.

Ready to supercharge your small business?

Xero, that's X-E-R-O, helps you take control of your finances with easy-to-use accounting software.

With automation and reporting features in Xero, you can spend less time crunching the numbers and more time understanding how your business is doing.

So if you're ready to join the 4.2 million subscribers globally, search Xero with an X or visit zero.com/slash iHeart.

Terms apply.

The rivalries, the marching bands, the upsets, Saturdays just got way more fun.

College football is back.

Think you know the game?

Put your college football knowledge to the test with DraftKings Sportsbook and turn your picks into big payouts from live betting during the game to rivalry week odds boosts and so much more.

DraftKings Sportsbook have everything you need to stay in on the action from kickoff to final whistle.

Whether you're betting your go-to team or or making moves mid-game as momentum shifts, Saturdays are yours to own with DraftKings Sportsbook.

Here's something special for you first timers.

New customers bet $5 and get $200 in bonus bets instantly.

Download the DraftKings Sportsbook app.

Use code Shannon.

That's code Shannon for new customers to get $200 in bonus bets instantly when you bet just $5.

In partnership with DraftKings Sportsbook, the crown is yours.

Hello, ladies and gentlemen, and thank you for joining us for another episode of Nightcap.

Y'all know who I am.

I am your favorite unc, Shannon Sharp, my partner and co-host.

He's Liberty City's own, Madding's Ratings Adjuster, Bingles Ring of Fame honoree.

He's a Pro Bowler.

He's an all-pro.

He's Chad Ocho Cinco Johnson.

Please make sure you hit that subscribe button.

Please make sure you hit that like button.

And guys, do us a favor, go subscribe to the Nightcap podcast feed wherever you get your podcast cast from.

We'd like to thank each and every one of you for your support and your continued support because thanks to you, Nightcap has ascended to heights we could have only imagined, and especially in such a short time.

So, thank you again for your support and your continued support.

My Konyak Laportier, just head over to LaportierCogyac.com to grab your bottle.

Please make sure you go follow my media company page on all of its platforms.

That's Shay Shea Media and my clothing company, 84, with 84 being spelled out.

That link is pinned in the chat.

We've got Grammy nominated rapper La Cree joining us a little bit later.

But first, Ocho, the headlines.

The Buccaneers informed rookie Shiloh Sanders today that he's being waived.

His agent, Drew Rosenhaus, Robert Bailey, a former teammate of mine with the Ravens, added, We're hoping he gets claimed of waivers.

Ocho, where do you think Shiloh will land?

You know what?

I'm not sure where he will land.

There's some teams out there that could use some depth, especially at the safety position.

I'm not sure what the Bengals look like

in the secondary.

I think Steelers can add, the Saints can add to

their secondary as well.

He's going to get claimed.

Where he gets claimed, I'm not sure where that would be yet.

Listen, for one, he has Austin representation and Robert Braley and Drew Rosenhaus.

Obviously, they represented me while I was playing

during my tenure.

He will get picked up.

Where he gets picked up, I'm not sure, but he has the right person in his corner to make sure he gets another opportunity to play the game that he loves sometimes your last name can be a blessing and a curse it's not normal that free agents have breaking news that they're being released he's an undrafted free agent

and because his name is sanders the blessing and the curse people said was young and he only got an opportunity because his last name is sanders

I haven't, I mean, maybe you can recall the last time an undrafted free agent, it was breaking news that he was getting released.

Well, actually.

He was getting waived, whatever the case may be.

Go ahead, Ocho.

Anytime it's a rookie, especially an undrafted rookie, the only time they make the news, Uncle is when they get in trouble.

Right.

Is there an arrest of some sort?

Anything coming out of college where they've gotten in trouble.

And, but that's pretty much it.

Because of the last name is why it's breaking news.

And it just, it's like you say, Unc, it's a gift and a curse.

Yep.

And

I just, you know, hey, you sit back and you reflect and you're like, okay, it didn't work work out here.

Maybe somebody gives me an opportunity.

It works out somewhere else.

You don't know.

This is the first time that Shiloh has been told he's not good enough.

I mean, he's been a phenomenal player.

Obviously, he got his first start with the University of South Carolina.

He got a D1 scholarship.

His father gets the job at Jackson State.

He goes and joins

his father and his brother at Jackson.

And then when his dad gets the head coaching job at CU, he follows, you know, the two sons follow their dad there.

This is the very first time.

And it's really hard because think about it, Ocho.

I think he's 24, 25.

And for the first time in 24, 25 years, somebody has told you, you're not good enough.

Now, it's one thing if, you know, you get cut from your high school team, you get cut from your junior varsity team or something like that.

He's 25.

But think about it.

Think about this, ladies and gentlemen.

I mean, for the first time in your life, you're in your mid-20s.

Yeah.

Before somebody ever tells, someone ever utters to you, you're not good enough.

Forget it, forget it be a sport.

Maybe it's a job.

Maybe it's something, but to be told you're not good enough because your whole life, you've dreamed about being an NFL player or your whole life, your dream job, whatever the case that may be, you've dreamed about holding this dream job.

And then all of a sudden, they're like, you're not good enough.

Per Yahoo sports, we're told that Buccaneers enjoyed having having Shiloh in the building, viewing the son of Deion Sanders as a good kid, who's at all times respectful to everyone.

Shiloh could, in theory, sign with the Bucks practice squad after clearing waivers.

The bigger question is whether he's good enough to compete and play at an NFL level.

That's always the case.

That's what you weigh, Ocho, because if you bring somebody back on the practice squad, you're saying with

a year under his belt and our system, developing,

we think he can develop into a player that could play for us.

Yes.

Get offense, defense, and maybe he's just a backup.

Maybe, hey, they pay backups just in case people didn't know.

They do pay backups in the NFL.

And, you know, he can be a special, a special teams player.

Punt, punt, return, kickoff, kickoff, return.

Maybe he could be, whatever the case may be.

Now, that's what the Bucs organization, that's what they have to weigh.

Todd Bowles and that staff.

I forget the general manager.

I just was reading something the other day about the general manager because he was talking about,

what's the linebacker they let go?

He was LSU'd.

They ended up letting him go and he goes to Philly.

Now he's found a home.

I think he's at the Texans or maybe the Raiders, whatever the case may be.

But

I just saw his name.

That's what you have to, that's what you're up against.

You got 16 spots, so that's a lot of people that you can bring in.

All those 16 players, Ocho, basically, we're saying that we believe with another year in our systems, offense or defense, we think down the line, he just needs a little bit more time to develop.

We think this kid might turn into a pretty good player for us.

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

Let's take another look at him.

Let's get a bird's eye view.

Let's stay with him for a year and let's see what kind of player he turns into.

So, hopefully, that's something.

If he doesn't get claimed off waivers, hopefully, he gets an opportunity.

Either it's the Bucks or someone gives him an opportunity because maybe he just needs another year to develop into an NFL player.

Maybe that's the case.

Maybe it isn't.

Everybody, everybody, that particular dream, everybody doesn't get to realize it, Ocho.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Because,

but you know what?

My brother had a very interesting take on a dream.

He said, you know what a dream is, Ocho?

A dream that comes true?

He said, it's a gift to yourself.

A dream is a gift to yourself.

You, I had very similar dreams.

I need to play in the NFL.

Got to.

There are no other options.

I didn't have a plan B.

I got my degree, but my plan A, B, C, all the way through Z was go play in the NFL.

And my determining factor was to get my family out of the situation.

Now, my brother gave us a head start,

but I wasn't, that wasn't good enough for me.

He did it.

I never thought there was nothing that my brother ever did that I didn't think I could do.

Not one thing.

He's like, I like he went to college, man.

I know I could go to college even though I wasn't the student that he was.

I didn't, he applied himself.

I never applied myself.

I was, you know, hey, I got this God-given ability.

I'll be extremely talented.

That'll get me by.

It's amazing.

I think it's amazing when I see kids that come from lineage lineage like a time,

like a Clay Matthews Sr., like a Bruce Matthews son,

Peyton Manning, when your father has something and you still have a burning desire

to get it for yourself.

That's very impressive to me.

Coming from our situations, Ocho, it's easy to be motivated.

Oh, yeah.

Being hungry, being hot, being cold,

it's easy.

Being rained on, it's easy to develop motivation but what happens when you have none of those extenuating circumstances yeah yeah you got to want it you got to want it you got to be self-motivated too and you got to understand when you when you have fathers that played in the nfl that were very very good not just you know you're regularly the average players then also as a child having to live up to that hype having to live yes the comparison of your father you not being as good as your father just yet maybe but sometime the pressures of having to live up to to in the shadow of a father that was extremely good at his craft can also be demoralizing at times if you're not focused and locked in.

I mean, a great example of one, one of the players who was able to do it, T.O.,

Taro Owens' son.

You know, I'm sure he's had to deal with all the all the outside noise, but having a father like T.O.

that's going to make sure you're prepared for all the nonsense that comes with, don't worry about trying to be me.

Just be you.

Just be best Tariq Owens that you you can be.

Hell, this past weekend, what'd he do?

Scored?

Tribute to pops?

You know, put you through the.

I'm talking about, dog, that has to be one of the greatest feelings in the world to have a son, to open,

or a daughter, whatever respective craft it is that they do or choose to be in, that that has to be a dope, dope feeling.

Of course.

I think the thing is, Ocho, the biggest thing is, is are you living in your parents' shadow or are you embracing it?

That's a good one.

That's a good one.

I would never force my child to do anything they don't want to do no i would never force my child to do anything listen i would love i would love it you know if you want to play football so be it but it's nothing i will ever force you to do you know why force you to do but you know why because playing football was your dream you don't know if that's their dream no see a lot of time when people force their kid to do something they're living vicariously through the child now i'm not saying in all situations because i think everybody wants their child to be successful at his or her chosen path right but a lot of times we we see the behavior.

And people, kids think about now, oh, my son is going to the NFL.

My son is going to be a major league baseball player.

My son's going to be a basketball player.

Let the kid, let a kid be a kid.

You're not supposed to look at your child as a paycheck.

You're not supposed to look at your child as the way out.

That's a good one.

That's a good one.

Or you're not supposed to live by character through your child because you weren't able to achieve the dreams that you wanted.

You couldn't do it.

So now you're going to put that.

Hey, hopefully the child embraces and wants to be that, whatever he or she chooses, and then you nudge them along in that direction.

Don't hey,

this is what you want to do.

And my son, very early on, he said, Dad,

this ain't me, this ain't what I want.

I got a question, John.

Yes, a question for you.

Now that we're talking about that, that's it's a great topic to talk about.

When you think about fathers like Joe Jackson, fathers like Tiger Woods pops, yes,

Serena and Venus dad, Beyonce's father, Yes.

Fathers that actually understood early on, this is what you guys need to do to be able to reach success.

You talk about prodigies, though.

You talk about what's...

But, but, you got to understand, as fathers, you never know that these prodigies are going to be what they turned out to be.

You think

dad understood that she would be one of the greatest of all time?

I mean, she's singing in the choir, you young.

Joe Jackson, you have talented, you have sons that are talented.

you have to put them through the through the work to actually get to that pinnacle that you envision so is that not almost like the same thing they they seeing something that they weren't able to accomplish and they feel that their their child the kids should be able to be able to live up live out their dream but if you go back and think about it go back and listen to the parent

the kid was excited to get up the next day to go do it again.

Okay.

They never had to force the child to go do it.

Right.

They never like, come on, Tiger, you got to get get up.

Tiger was four or five years old.

He already had his bag.

He was ready to go.

Beyonce, they never had to drag Beyonce into rehearsals or say, you need to practice.

She was ready to go.

Mike, he's with the Jackson 5.

You saw, hey, we got a group, nice little group.

Hey, and I'm sure, but,

you know, a lot of times, you know, it's hard.

Tiger had a very strained relationship with his father because of things that transpired in the household with his mom.

We know Mike had a very troubled relationship with his father.

He ended up firing his dad as soon as he left the group, I think in 79, fired his dad.

All of them ended up firing their dad as their manager.

So we understand,

but as a child, you don't understand that, Ocho.

You don't.

You don't understand that he, your parent, mom, or dad is trying to push you in a direction because they see something in you that you don't see yourself.

Yeah.

But

the child has to want it because if he or she begrudgingly do it.

Yeah.

Listen, when they get old enough, when they get old enough to make their own decisions, all the work that you put in, it's going to go to waste because the child is going to turn.

Now, you know what?

This ain't what I do.

That ain't what I want.

We've seen them.

Man, I just, man, I ain't even want to play no more football.

I ain't even want to play no more basketball.

And that's, and here's the thing.

I saw somebody, and he says, he says two things, motivation.

and discipline.

When you're not motivated, are you disciplined enough to go do what you need to do?

Yeah.

Motivation.

Oh, yeah, Ocho.

We're motivated.

Oh, boy, boy, boy, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, there's a certain level.

When the motivation is not there, because you're not going to be motivated every single day, every single time.

But will you be disciplined?

Understanding and realizing what it takes to get to where you ultimately want to go.

Two more examples.

What's that?

And what he did with the ball.

Yes.

And Amon Ross St.

Brown's father as well.

Hey,

magic.

great creed, magic.

Yeah.

But he said, he'd say, hey, the boys, hey, they wanted to be at the gym.

Yes.

It is easy when someone is motivated and they're disciplined.

That's the easiest person because you look at the greats.

Michael Jordan is extremely talented.

But look at the motivation.

Look at the discipline that he had.

Look at LeBron.

Look at Akobe.

You look at the greats of the greats.

Yes.

Not only are they extremely talented, they're extremely driven individuals.

I'm talking about obsessed.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Serena

was obsessed.

That's when you get

when 20, 30, 40 years from now, when we're talking about some of the best, the best female tennis player, that's why she's always going to be mentioned because she was obsessed with it.

Yes, she's ultimately talented.

To be able to,

for her to be able to move around the court like she could with that, with that powerful forehand.

Yeah.

Federer, He's like he's on clouds, like

he's ballet.

He's rising the copper with

a racket.

But

we wish the best.

We wish the best for all these guys.

But some of these, sadly, is going to come to an end.

Some of these guys are not going to get,

what do we call it, Ocho?

Practice squad opportunities.

Some of these guys, it's the end of the road.

Ocho, but we got a new angle from the play yesterday in which Shadur threw a punch and was ended up being ejected.

Shiloh, I keep saying Shadur.

Shiloh, Bill Zach Davidson grabs the face mask of Shiloh after the whistle.

So are we going to show that?

We can't.

Oh, it's the NFL, yeah.

But what happened was after the play, he ends up grabbing

Shiloh's face mask.

Yeah.

And it looks like, you know, hey, you know how it is, Ocho.

Yeah.

I'm trying to get his hands off.

And so, hey, he won't let it go.

So I take, I take a swipe of him.

I see you.

I see you, buddy.

You can't, huh?

You can't.

You in the wide open.

Yeah, and not even about being in wide.

It's joint practice.

I understand a little scuffle.

End game, preseason.

No matter where you're at.

You in the trenches, you know,

you're in the middle of the, you can't.

You just can't do it.

You got to suck that one up.

You got to suck that one up and pick a time to get him before the whistle blows.

Pick a time to get him before the whistle blows within the scheme of what y'all got going on.

You can't, you can't do it.

There's really, there's, there's really no discourse.

There's no dialogue that needs to go on about it.

You can't do that.

You're right.

You're right.

When you're right, you ain't wrong.

And in this situation, you're absolutely right.

And I know, I know

our instinct is to get him back.

Not to get, but to get him back right now, Ocho.

It ain't good enough to get him back at a later date in time.

I got to get you back right now because you got me.

So since you got me, I got to to get you.

You got four quarters.

You got four quarters.

You know, I mean,

hey, listen, it's football, man.

You, you know, you know how it is out there.

You, you know how it is.

Oh, I know.

I had to deal with people trying to kill me for four quarters for a decade

straight.

Every week.

Hey, and I got, I done got people, man, man, such and such,

man, such and such dirty.

What happened?

happened man i was

oh joe you know how it is

used to cut people

did i yeah see i i i ain't do that i ain't do that i ain't i ain't do that i ain't i don't i don't i don't like i don't like for some i don't like going

below the knees um i did i'm just me as small as i was as frill as i was i never wanted to cut people for the simple fact i don't want to be responsible for you losing your career or

did you think about my career when you did that cheap ish?

You did?

Were you thinking about my family when you did that?

Were you thinking about my grandma?

Were you thinking about my brother and sister, my kids, when you did what you did?

I got you.

Oh, now you want me to think.

Now you want me to have a heart.

Right.

I'm sorry.

I don't.

But I would have teammates that man, it's such and such dirty.

I said, who?

Man, such number such and such.

I'm like, what did he do?

Man, I joke after the woods.

Oh, he got.

I said, okay, let's get it.

Let's get him.

him.

Oh, them were some good days, boy.

Oh, man.

Oh, good days, boy.

Oh, oh, you got to get guy.

You're not going to get us.

In fact, we're not going to do anything about it.

Oh, Joe, four of the five offensive linemen that were blocking for Shadur Sanders yesterday were waived by the Browns today.

D'Artagnan Tinsley, Bucky Williams, J.Veon Cohen, Sebastian Gutierrez, Guterres, or Gutierrez.

One of them.

I went to high school with a young lady named Christy Guterres.

So Gutierrez, some people say Gutierrez, and some people say

she went by Gutierrez because she was Nicaraguan.

Each trip brings its own kind of energy and your coverage should match it.

Insure My Trip lets you compare travel insurance plans to fit your VK vibes.

Whether you're chasing waterfalls or chasing Wi-Fi, no favorites, no fluff, just real reviews, expert help, and smart tech that makes it easy.

From adventure sports to missed connections, we've got your back.

And if things go sideways, our licensed agents are just a call away.

Before and after your trip.

Your trip, your coverage.

Visit insuremytrip.com and travel smarter, insuremytrip.com.

The U.S.

Open is here.

And on my podcast, Good Game with Sarah Spain, I'm breaking down the players from rising stars to legends chasing history, the predictions, will we see a first-time winner?

And the pressure.

Billie Jean King says pressure is a privilege, you know.

Plus the stories and events off the court.

And of course, the honey deuces, the signature cocktail of the U.S.

Open.

The U.S.

Open has gotten to be a very fancy, wonderfully experiential sporting event.

I mean, listen, their whole aim is to be accessible and inclusive for all tennis fans, whether you play tennis or not.

Tennis is full of compelling stories of late.

Have you heard about icon Venus Williams' recent wild card bids or the young Canadian Victoria Mvoco making a name for herself?

How about Naomi Osaka getting back to form?

To hear this and more, listen to Good Game with Sarah Spain, an iHeart women's sports production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Presented by Capital One, founding partner of iHeartWomen's Sports.

It's time to head back to school and forward to your future with Carrington College.

For over 55 years, we've helped train the next generation of healthcare professionals.

Apply now to get hands-on training from teachers with real-world experience.

And as few as nine months, you could start making a difference in healthcare.

Classes start soon in Pleasant Hills, San Leandro, and San Jose.

Visit Carrington.edu to see what's next for you.

Visit Carrington.edu slash SCI for information on program outcomes.

This fall, let your home smell as good as it looks.

Pura's app-controlled diffusers bring you premium scents from brands like Nest New York, Capri Blue, and Anthropology.

From Spice Pumpkin to Whitewoods, your fall favorites are just a tap away.

It's home fragrance that feels as elevated as it smells, and right now, it's the perfect time to stock up.

Visit Pura.com and bring home the best scents of the season.

So,

Kevin Stefansky clapped back this morning saying he's not trying to sabotage Shadur.

Another piece of info came out overnight.

If Stefansky wasn't trying to sabotage, why was undrafted rookie Greg Larvinian not in with Shadur?

what's it Gagne

Gage gage damn

they were all these names Gage has been with Shadur throughout the camps practicing even first preseason game he also trains uh with him outside of practice why yesterday was he not in with him look ocho I don't wanna

hey we beating a dead horse

yeah

Tyler Hundley was released Tyler Huntley was released yesterday ocho which begs the question what you are not okay

you know you're going to weigh tyler huntley so what good did that two-minute drive do do for him was it going to help him don't you think shadour would have benefited more from a two-minute drive than tyler huntley i'm just asking yeah if the guy if if one guy is going to be on your roster it seems like they're going to keep four quarterbacks ocho

doesn't it seem it would have been more beneficial for shadour to get the two-minute drill because that situation that he might find himself in during the regular season, if something were to happen to the quarterbacks in front of him, as opposed to Snoop Huntley?

Yes or no?

Yeah, absolutely.

Absolutely.

But one thing we don't know is we don't know how that

coach staff is thinking.

We don't know what's going through their mind.

We don't know what Coach Stefanski is thinking.

I'm not sure what they were trying to look at.

Maybe get one last look at Huntley before whatever decision you wanted to make.

But again,

I don't know what to say what else to say at this point um i don't i honestly i mean it's it's it is what it is obviously you want quarterback play and opportunity to be given to each and every person they saw fit they saw fit the way it is they're keeping four quarterbacks and that's where it is now

i mean that's that's where it is now i know one thing

I've watched a lot of football for a long time.

Watched a lot of quarterback play for a long time.

I played with some good ones, you know.

So, I mean, they made it, they made the decision.

Yep, this is the way they wanted to go.

So, I wish the Cleveland Browns nothing but luck in their quarterback situation.

Because

once the season starts real, week one, and them bullets flying all over the place for real, yeah, be a different ball game.

It's going to be a different ball game.

It is.

Look, I'm just a firm believer.

If you go back and study study Joe Flacco, since he's been away from the Ravens, expectations.

You see, when he came in for Deshaun, there was no expectations.

But what happened when he went somewhere and there was expectations?

How did he do?

Different ballgame, huh?

Yeah.

The pressures of having to play that position are a lot different.

Preseason is one thing.

You know, that's all shits and giggles, no disrespect.

It's all vanilla.

I don't think people understand how difficult that position is to play when you're being schemed.

Right.

When they know what's coming, when they're trying to confuse you, when they're trying to throw you off your pivot.

It's a different ballgame.

You got a lot of movement out there in front of you.

You got to make calls.

You got to make line adjustments.

You got to make, you got them

second-level backers.

Being able to pin, man, it's a different ballgame.

You know, now the Browns haven't been able to get that quarterback situation right in a very, very long time.

With that,

why I think, I mean, all of us, not just you and I, but the chat as well, and other people that are watching

everything unfold.

I mean, this is been a very long time since the Browns have been in discussion like this in the mainstream media in a very, very long time.

And maybe they got it right this time, maybe they didn't.

But if they didn't get it right, the search for quarterback number one will still go on after 35 tries of trying to get it.

For sure.

For sure.

And

that's the thing.

Once you win, there's an expectation to win.

So, you know, Joe Flacco coming out off the bench, there ain't no expectations because most times he have the backup, you're not expecting your backup to be able to carry you.

That's why he's a backup, or he'd be somewhere else starting.

He wins two or three games.

Now the level of expectation we have is risen.

Yeah.

And then we see the precipitous drop.

I know one thing.

I know one thing.

We're doing all this Browns talk and all that.

the browns are very very very very good and this is coming from a bangle fan like i'm i'm no fool the identity the identity for this team is their defense

their ward newsom miles garrett and the rest of them boys that's their identity that is who going to win game for them now what you need the quarterback to do who will be flacco is we need you to play Good football, ask what we do of you, and don't turn the ball over.

This is what Kurt Warner said, the guy that won a Super Bowl.

He's a two-time league MVP.

He's a Super Bowl MVP.

He said, I was really looking forward to the competition between Dylan Gabriel and Shador Sanders in the last preseason game.

I know it plays out like this sometimes, but what a bummer.

Didn't have the same opts, which is the opportunities to make plays.

DG played well again, but had some good opportunities to make plays.

SS didn't have those same ops, so it was hard to make too much of an assessment.

Wait, what is all?

I mean, listen.

I mean, Ocho, if you're a receiver, if you're a receiver, Ocho, and I'm a receiver, now when I'm in the game, we call it pass plays.

You in the game, they call it run plays.

How are they going to fairly judge you when you don't get the same opportunity that I got?

So

how do you judge Shadur when you didn't give him like, look, he missed some throws.

He had some protection.

Sometimes he's going to have to do a better job of getting rid of the football.

That's always been my biggest gripe with him is that he holds on to the ball too long and he's trying to make every single play.

And you cannot.

There's not ever been a quarterback that can make every single play.

Sometimes it's okay to throw the ball away.

Sometimes it's okay.

Instead of completing 70% of your passes and

70% with six, seven sacks don't do me no good.

I'd rather you complete 60% of your passes, 58% of your passes, and have three sacks

as opposed to completing 70% and having six or seven sacks.

So he's going to have to do a better job of untraining himself.

Throw that ball away.

And it's okay.

You don't have the foot speed to outrun people around the edges.

There are not very many defensive ends, if any, that you can beat to the edge.

Yeah.

So step up in the pocket.

They're not there.

A one, two, check it down or throw it away.

Go ahead, Ocho.

You wanted to say something.

No, no, no.

You're right.

You're right.

I mean, one of the things that he does have is he has good awareness.

He has good pocket presence based on what's around him at times.

Number time, you feel the pocket collapsing around you instead of floating back, just step up in it.

Step up in it.

And it was hard for him to actually step up because once those ends were coming around, the guard, the two guards, everyone was getting pushed in his face.

So it was hard to be able to step up and find a lane.

And they blitzing.

They blitz.

They brought pressure.

Yeah.

So the offensive line suddenly doesn't know how to hold up once your door Sanders starts playing, but Dylan Gabriel has all day to dance in the pocket.

Something isn't adding up.

Jeff Swartz.

I remember being a young offensive lineman fighting for a job.

My O-line coach came up to me and said, hey, Swartz, you need to block worse when Smith is playing quarterback, so he looks bad.

Totally normal conspiracy that happens all the time.

No, I don't, I don't, look, ain't nobody telling you to play bad.

Why am I going to play?

I've tried to make the team.

Yeah.

Me making it, first of all, Ocho, if I'm an offensive lineman,

the quarterback playing good isn't tied to me.

Cause if I get beat, no, we're not a package deal.

I'm playing good for myself because they're evaluating me.

When they cut that film on, they ain't really looking at the quarterback drop.

They're looking at me.

How did I say it?

Did i get beat inside was i supposed to was i was i not supposed to get beat inside did we hey did i molly like i'm supposed to did i combo block right did i pop like i was supposed to that's what they're judging me on so for me i the who how ocho caught the ball or did the titan run the right route or did the back do what he's supposed to do i'm worried about my responsibility that's what i'm concerned about right shannon's responsibility and then because everybody's getting evaluated we're not getting evaluated as a package deal.

Man, the quarterback played good.

Oh, so everybody, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, everybody's getting evaluated on their own individual plate.

So I know Jeff was trying to be funny.

Uh, uh,

look, I just think the guys that were in there, the offensive lineman, they weren't very good.

And so now you got the perfect storm, Ocho.

You got four or five offensive linemen that are very good, and you got a quarterback that holds on to the ball.

Now you got the perfect storm.

Now you got a category five and you got an earthquake going on at the same time.

A disaster is about to unfold.

Oh, yeah.

And that's what we saw yesterday.

Yeah.

Hey, man.

You do what you can with the cards that you're dealt, huh?

That's the way life is.

You do what you can with the cards you're dealt.

Whatever hand you got, you got to play it the best you can.

I agree.

Some hands are great.

Some hands not so great.

That's just life in general.

Dallas Cowboys head coach Brian Schottenheimer, Ocho, says he will meet with Micah Parsons after Micah was seen laying on the medical table behind the Dallas Cowboys bench during Friday night's final preseason game against the Falcons.

Without talking to Micah, I need to figure out what he was doing and

why he was

going.

Anyway, I don't know what actually rolls here.

So until I talk to him, I'm obviously I'm not going to talk about it to the media.

What exactly?

Because, okay, this is what Micah said, Ocho.

He tweeted.

I actually appreciate this.

The way the media shapes perception and narratives is wild.

If he didn't have anything to say, everyone would just have run with it.

I never disrespect the guys out there fighting for their lives.

I'm just...

In interesting clarity and fairness, Micah Parsons was not laying on the training table all night.

In fact, it was only a relatively short portion of the evening.

Well, you could have had him in uniform.

You pay him in money.

Yeah, that's true.

That's true.

Hey, two things can be true.

Yes.

But I know one thing, Jerry is going to drag this thing all the way out, boy.

They play September 4th, if I'm not mistaken.

Is that

Thursday?

A week from Thursday.

Hold on.

That's next week, Thursday.

No?

Yes, a week from Thursday.

I'm excited.

I'm excited.

I'm excited.

If Mike is not out there, I don't think they stand the channel defensively.

No.

They still got three.

If I'm not mistaken, they still got 26 over there in Philly, right?

Yes.

I mean, Philly, they still got, they still got AJ.

They still got that offensive line, too.

So I don't know what type of pressure you think you're going to get without Micah.

I mean, I'd like to.

With Lane and Mile Lotta.

Now, Dixon, Dixon might be out.

Right.

So, I mean, one thing.

Even with even with Dixon out, but come on now, huh?

Come on now.

We talk about the reigning Super Bowl champs.

I understand what they're up against.

Man, come on.

Now, if anything, it's going to be a game because the Dallas Cowboys offense and their new additions are going to be exciting.

I'm ready to see George.

If they can hold up.

Huh?

If they could hold up against the Eagles Front.

Let me tell you something.

Let me tell you something.

They're going to hold up.

It's week one.

You ain't going to have no choice.

You ain't going to have no choice.

Boy number four finna get that ball dealt, boy.

You hear me?

He finna throw that thing to 13.

He finna throw that thing to 88.

But them boys are going to get busy.

Okay.

And I'm not even a Cowboys fan.

I'm a fan of certain individuals and players.

You know, I want to see Dak do well.

You know who I really care about?

You want to know who I really care about doing well?

I want to see George Pickens play.

I want to see George Pickens lock in for 16, 17, 18 goddamn weeks.

That's what I want to see.

Shit.

Yeah, we talk about it.

Hey, chat.

Chad.

Who's your favorite team?

Huh?

Chat, can y'all hear me?

Hello.

Chad, who's your team?

Who are you looking forward to?

Who are you looking forward to watching week one?

No?

Can you hear me?

Shit.

Goddamn, goddamn Cowboys.

Jerry don't want to pay Micah.

I got something to look forward to.

I got forward to looking to look forward to George Pickens.

George Pickens.

But Micah needs to understand.

Oh, Joe.

Yeah, what happened?

Talk to me.

It'll be the same situation if you're under contract you're holding in you're not holding out you're holding in because you're there yeah and you'd be standing on the sideline and you're laying down michael what do you what you think people are gonna say okay okay well you already you already you already first of all all the eyes are on you first of all you're on the cowboys that's first and foremost second of all

you're on the training table.

And I understand.

Even if you just laid down for a quick second,

They're going to make it something.

So

I want you to understand

this is going to be a story until you get signed,

until you're in uniform.

So even if they don't give you a contract, everything you do is being monitored.

It's like, well, Michael don't care.

Micah doesn't care.

Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

That is one thing we're not going to let fly.

We're not going to blame Micah.

I'm not talking about you.

I'm just saying in general, just that narrative about micah not caring because he's laying down well hell the goddamn owner don't care the owner the owner don't care because the owner doesn't play huh you so let me ask you a question let's just say that was uh tj watt and he was holding out and he's laying down on the training table behind the bench you don't think they will say anything about that let's just say for the sake of argument that's jamar chase And the bingo's offense are up and he's laying down behind the trainer table.

You don't think they're going to say anything about that?

Yeah.

I understand what you're saying.

That's all I'm saying.

Michael needs to understand, okay, he's a superstar player,

and when and you lay, you laying down.

Look,

I got you, I got you.

It's just what's the word we like to use?

The optics, optics, yeah, yeah.

I'd be laying down too if my own talked about me the way he talked about him.

So, hey, either

the question is, is he gonna miss

one,

what is it, $1.2 million of paycheck?

that's the question

is he is he willing to risk 1.2 million dollars of paycheck that he needs to get huh he's there he's there

if he doesn't play well you think they're gonna pay him if he don't play my back hurt i'm in i'm here well i'm here you said i'm under contract right okay i'm under contract you know what i have an injury i have injury but i'm here didn't you say didn't you say you don't want to pay me because it's a chance yeah i missed some games last year well how about what i'm still here

but well the question is does he want to go take it to a grievance because the cowboys are gonna say we don't got mri's and we got everything and the doctor says everything's everything checks out so now you're gonna tie it up

it's a it's a dirty game huh it is hey it's a dirty game the fact that it the fact that it's even gotten to this point with one of the players not just one of the better players we talked about one of the top three of this position the fact that it's even gotten to this point if it was any other team michael would have had his money i think it would have been in training camp.

He would have played in a preseason game or two.

But Jerry has other ways of doing things when it comes to business.

He knows how to construct it to make sure that the noise and the chirping continue to stay around that franchise in general.

I'm going to let you know I'm going to pay you when they get ready.

You're not going to, you're not, you're not, you're not deboing, you're not bullying nothing.

I don't care who you are.

Yeah.

Jerry said when he sat down with Stephen A.

Smith, I've been around, I've been in business for a long time.

I've heard Jerry prove a point now.

Listen, I've heard hooping and hollering from players that were disgruntled about contracting their money for a long time.

That ain't finna move me.

I'm not moving for that.

I pay you when I get ready.

You're not going to bully Jerry.

I've been watching the Netflix special.

Oh, how was it?

It was good.

It offers a lot of insight.

It's what people, look,

Jerry wanted more credit.

Jimmy was getting too much of it.

Jerry wanted some of it.

And Jimmy's like, nah.

And it came to a head

that the man fired a coach that had won two championships

because he wanted credit.

And he wasn't getting enough of it.

What did he want?

Jimmy just says.

Well, the way Jimmy explained it is like, and Jerry said,

I mean, Jerry out of his own mouth, you run the football.

I'm going to run the business side of it.

Right.

But the business side is not nearly as enticing as the football side.

Because don't nobody care about the market and who's selling all the stuff and all the stuff that's up in.

They care about that football team.

Yes, sir.

And Jimmy put it together.

And it started, you know,

Jerry wanted credit for the Herschel Walker trade.

People say it was Jimmy.

Jimmy says, I can show you in my contract where I was in the draft and I was inside of trades.

Jerry says, no, that didn't happen, blah, blah, blah.

It was just, but if you watching it, you could see it building.

Even not knowing the backs, not obviously, we know this 20, this is 30 years ago, Ocho.

Right.

Knowing what we know now.

But even if you didn't know anything, if you just watch it, you're like, oh, yeah, this thing's going to come to a head.

It's going to come to a head, absolutely.

Right.

And the final, when you know, Jerry walked through, they had just won the Super Bowl, and the coaches were drinking.

And Jerry walked through and held his glass up, and all the other coaches held that glass up.

Jimmy did this.

Wait, they showed that?

No, they told a story.

Oh, man.

Then Jerry seethed it.

Because, see, Jerry wanted to be a part of it.

And see, that's the thing.

See, that's why we tell people everybody rings are not the same.

And everybody in an organization might get the ring, but unless you one of them got one of the one of them guys,

the 53, them coaches,

it's different.

Right, right, right, right.

And so Jerry wanted to be a part of that.

But Jimmy, like, bro,

you not putting in 100 hours a week.

Right.

You get to go home every night and sleep next to your wife.

A lot of these guys don't.

You watched your kids grow up.

A lot of these got kids, they gonna miss, they're gonna blink, and the kids done graduated, and you wasn't there for a lot of these special occasions.

So

Jimmy, Jerry wanted to be a part of it.

Jimmy resented the fact

that just because you own the team, you want to be a part of it.

You can be a part of this.

But you could see it.

You could see it coming.

You could see it coming.

You could see it coming.

Both of them are very, very prideful men.

There's no question.

Jerry, he's the ultimate businessman.

He could sit.

There ain't a whole lot he can't sell.

Right.

Not a whole lot he can't sell.

And he could sway a lot of people to get on his side.

But

the way Jimmy had that team clicking on all cylinders,

they might have won three, four.

In a row.

Yeah.

Dang.

But

yeah, Micah,

I don't think Micah truly understands who he is, what the Cowboys are,

and everything.

Everything is bigger in Texas.

Hey, Micah just want to play football, huh?

Mike ain't worried about that.

Mike ain't worried about that motherfucker staring that helmet.

Micah came in there.

Okay, I got drafted.

I'm here.

I'm playing for the Cowboys.

I understand that.

I understand what it comes with to an extent.

But I don't care nothing about that.

As you can see, I want to play football.

I've done something that not very many people have come into this league and done after college.

I would like to be compensated for what I'm not gonna, not what I've already done, but what I'm gonna continue to do in the foreseeable future.

Yeah, you have an owner who came out and said some of the most outlandish things to say about a player that is actively under contract.

I mean, that

I'm still, I'm still baffled.

Three more years.

I'm appalled.

Jerry, say, you want to dance with me, or do you want, or do you want to swim in shark-infested waters for the next three years?

You got to dance with me.

Hey,

at one point, if I'm not mistaken,

being a Cowboy player in general was coveted.

Being a coach of the Dallas Cowboys was coveted.

When they won.

Not no more.

That's when they were treated like rock stars.

That's when they was like Hollywood.

They was all on the covers.

Emmett and Troy and Michael and Time and all those.

They were winning.

They were winning.

They're still a big, they're still a big brand, but all those guys are not getting on no cover, no magazine, like it, like it used to be.

And this was before the internet, right?

But they're gonna have to make a decision.

Well, look,

they got a week from Thursday, they play.

Let's see what Jerry can do.

Jerry says, We've got a deal.

Jerry says, We got a deal.

Jerry,

they got his deal.

That's what Jerry says.

They don't have the deal that Micah Parsons and David Mulligetta have agreed to.

Jerry said, I don't matter.

Jerry say, hey, there's three people involved here.

And you know who the lead?

There's me, there's Micah, there's me, and the least important is the agent.

Hey.

But you got to be careful, man.

You got to be careful as a player.

You got to be careful as a player thinking that

is your friend because this is what they do to you.

They show you, they show you your true colors now.

Right.

Yeah, they pull it.

They pull us off right now while you're valuable.

You are a value to me, which is why I'm treating you like this.

Now, while you think you're a value, I don't really want to pay you your worth,

but I'm going to trick you and try to shake your hand so I can undermine the agent who knows the tricks and it who knows the tricks I'm trying to pull off.

Ain't no fool, man.

Ain't no fool.

Language.

I just need, Micah just needs to understand.

Hey, bro, you don't want to stand.

And I know, getting, hey, standing on that sideline, now you see why all them coaches walk messed up.

That's standing three hours, man.

That thing have your back tight.

Hey, just go grab your, hey, just go grab your seat on the bench and just sit there and watch it on the jumbotron.

They probably have something to say about that, but hey.

Hey,

I'm out here supporting my teammates.

I got a question.

Yes.

Dallas Cowboys, Philadelphia Eagles, week one, Thursday night.

Who you got winning?

I think it's going to be the most watched Thursday night football game in NFL history.

I'm going to take the Eagles.

Okay.

You sure?

You sure about that?

Yep.

Yep.

I want the Eagles.

I want the Eagles to win 45 to 7.

God damn.

Because I want Michael to get his money.

You remember back in 93 when they started the season 0 and 2 oh and 2 that's the only way emmy got his money money okay okay okay okay okay i want micah to get his money i want i want jayla hurst to throw for 300 i want saquan to run for a buck fifty i want those two wide receivers to go over 100.

damn and i want the time of possession to be something like

60 minutes in game something like 38 39 minutes to 20 21.

Dude, because I want Michael to get his money.

Oh.

He's been a model citizen.

He's done everything.

He's done everything the right way.

Right.

Now you want to hold up the man's money.

Oh, man.

That's, that's, that's, that's,

I could, I could.

So we have a deal.

And my, and my, he keeps saying, in my mind, we have a deal.

A deal, a contract is a meeting between the minds.

Micah doesn't believe you guys have a deal.

That's why they have paper.

So let me ask you a question.

Could they, could they do this?

So in Jerry's mind,

this ain't worth nothing.

In FL binding, that's why they have contracts.

That's why they had to go to writing it down on paper.

Because a contract in its general form was a meeting of the minds.

Two people had agreed, and their word, your word, was your bond.

And then what happened?

All of a sudden, that ain't what I said.

That ain't what I meant.

And so, you know what?

Write it down.

So, in Jerry's mind, in Michael minds, and Micah mind, they don't have a contract.

Right.

So it has to be a meeting of the minds for the contract to be binding.

So.

Oh, Jerry, boy.

Jerry tried to pull a fast one, boy.

Oh, yeah, for sure.

He's a smooth talker.

Oh, yeah.

Oh, yeah.

Oh, Joe, it took 22 years, but Jerry Jones had finally admitted he let his ego play a role in the end of the Dallas Cowboy glory days.

Jones and former coach Jimmy Johnson ended their relationship after consecutive Super Bowl wins in 1992, 93.

Neither man had accepted responsibility for the demise of the relationship.

But Jerry said, I lost my tolerance for a lot of things.

I probably should have had a little bit more tolerance for Jimmy Johnson.

Seriously.

Those are some big words coming from a man that once said 500 coaches could have won those Super Bowls with this team.

Since Barris Switzer, Jerry has hired five coaches who have delivered just two playoff wins.

See, the difference is, you see what he said?

Yeah.

Five coaches, 500 coaches could have won the Super Bowl with that team.

Right.

How many of those 500 coaches could have built that team?

Because that's what Jerry did.

See, you could have a lot of people that can live in a house, Ocho, but how many people can build the house that he or she lives in?

See, that's what Jerry forgot.

See,

that's what Jerry forgot.

500 coaches could coach this team.

Yes.

But how many of them

can build the team?

I'm sure there are a lot of coaches could have coached the Eagles.

How many of them could do what Howie Roseman did and build it?

See, you find very few coaches

that can...

that can coach and build.

Jimmy built that from scratch.

he built it from scratch

now jerry started one but the thing was he wouldn't let jimmy he wouldn't let jimmy go on no on no meetings no advertising no marketing meetings he wouldn't let jimmy do that right

because that's not what jimmy was that's not what he had but

see it started rolling good all that credit everybody talk about jimmy jimmy's built one of the best teams jimmy jimmy he didn't hear enough jerry

he looks back he he looks, he looks at it.

They could have easily had a 10, 15-year run, just like the Patriots had a 20.

They could have got at least half that.

Because you got to realize, Emmett, Troy, and Mike was in their prime.

I think Mike was the oldest at 28.

Damn.

Will they ever get back to that type of prominence again and domination?

No.

No.

League is too balanced now.

Right.

And they don't get consistent enough play at the quarterback position.

And nobody's going to trade you a Charles.

You're not going to be able to get a time.

And nobody's going to trade you a Charles Haley level defensive player

in his prime.

Well, here you got one not too far off, man.

Based on what we have to work with in today's NFL, you got one you don't want to pay right now.

Yeah.

But think about it:

a difference maker:

Troy, Hall of Famer, Emmett, Hall of Famer, Michael, Hall of Famer, Larry Allen, Hall of Famer, Charles Haley, Hall of Famer, Deion Sanders, Hall of Famer.

That's six.

Darren Woodson is on the cusp.

So that's six guys.

So, how many Hall of Famers do you think they got on that team right now?

And the offensive line was dominant.

That boy was big, right?

Big Easy, Step, Gogan, Tuane, Newton.

Larry came later, but they were dominant.

Remember, I went to the Pro Bowl with Larry one year, man.

That Joker was strong.

Remember, they had them competitions?

Competition, yeah.

The racing and the man, Larry, Larry Allen must have benched 225, man, 20 million times.

Like, man, what the hell?

But

I saw this episode,

and

Jerry is telling the story after he fired Jimmy.

He comes home and he gets into bed and he lays next to his wife, Jean.

And say, she said, you just couldn't help yourself.

Say, you just can't let good be good.

You just couldn't, could you?

And as he's saying it,

he almost starts to wail up.

Because a lot of times, Ocho, when things are good, you think they're going to be like that forever.

And he realizes now just how hard it is.

Because see, when things come down, I mean, think about it.

He bought the team in 89.

And then by 93, he has back-to-back Super Bowls.

89, 90, 91, 92.

So his fourth year of buying the team, he's in the Super Bowl.

The fifth year, they got two Super Bowls in five years.

What you think is happening?

They think that's going to be easy.

Look at the team we got.

A quarterback is in his mid-20s, running back like 25.

Michael Irvin, like 28.

Ego.

You see what happens?

Now, he said he had something on his desk that if you don't care who gets the credit, you can conquer the world.

He said he had that on his desk for 20 years.

But see, the way he had it placed on his desk, it was facing out.

He never read it.

Everybody else that would come in there would read that.

Right.

But he should have had one that was facing him also.

Yeah.

Dog, that's crazy.

They were special.

You had, we played them.

I mean, we played them.

We played them in 92, the first year they won.

We took them right down to the wide.

They ended up scoring.

They beat us.

But

I mean, I think they scored late in the ballgame.

I think they scored like two minutes to go to beat us.

And then we played them again in 95 the year they won.

They were good.

They were really, really, really, really, really good.

And they were young and they were athletic and they were physical.

They were a physical team.

Jimmy, you hear Jimmy early on and say, hey, let the mind control the body.

Don't let the body control the mind.

I like that.

Hey, Jimmy, hey, Jimmy said, I'm pushing them farther than you can think you can go.

Jimmy says, hey, dude, had asthma.

He said, hey, have asthma on that field.

Don't you have asthma on this damn field?

Have asthma over there.

Damn, Jimmy.

The man can't help

where he having an asthma attack.

Hey, man, Jimmy didn't play.

Jimmy did not play.

But

I think Jerry looking at that and seeing it,

and the realization, like, damn,

we really had a chance to be the Patriots before the Patriots.

You don't think that Mr.

Crabb got tired of hearing Coach Belichick, Coach Belichick, Coach Belichick, Tom Brady, Tom Brady, Tom Brady?

Man,

let me keep on collecting these rings.

I'm the ring collector.

And all he cared about.

That's it.

That's it.

You know,

two different types of personalities, too.

Two different approaches to the game and how I'm going to conduct myself and not only owning the team, but allowing those below me to do their job.

Yeah,

I think the thing is, but Mr.

Krabb understood.

I think he learned from Jerry's mistakes.

I ain't finna mess this up.

Right.

I'm not finna mess this up.

This is an iHeart podcast.