Arsenal’s teenage kicks and seventh heaven for Forest – Football Weekly

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Hello and welcome to the Guardian Football Weekly.

City stunned again.

Arsenal give us hope of a title race before they inevitably drop points when we least expect it.

Miles Lewis Skelly serves up an ice-cold dish of revenge in the Gunners 5-1 win.

Liverpool's charge continues apace, this time beating a team that is actually good with a minimum of fuss.

Collapse of the weekend goes to Brighton as Nottingham Forest swing from a 5-0 defeat to a 7-0 victory at the city ground.

Everton score the fourth fastest goal in Premier League history with the purest form in the get-it-laun genre.

Tottenham do unspursy things, a win, a clean sheet, and a new signing, but normal service resumes at Old Trafford.

Manchester United aren't very good, are they, Barry?

We'll round up the rest of the weekend's football, have a little bit of transfer chats, have your questions, and that's today's Guardian Football Weekly.

On the panel today, Barry Glendening, good morning.

Hi, Robin.

Dan Bardell, how are you doing?

Hello.

Okay, bar the football, yes.

It's an issue for the pod, but

in huge contrast.

Good morning, Filippo Clare.

Etresseleur, Philippe O'Clare.

Very, very, very good morning to you, Robin.

We'll find out in just a couple of seconds.

Philippe, you were there.

Arsenal 5, Manchester City 1.

I mean, you're still glowing, I must say, on the Zoom call today.

Just we'll sit back.

Go ahead.

Off you go.

Well,

my cheeks are actually hurting that this big smile has been on my face since yesterday afternoon.

I can't say I was expecting that.

I I can't say any of us was expecting that.

But yes, it's certainly the kind of win that puts a lot of old demons back in their box.

It was not as perhaps one-sided as you would think when you see

the final scoreline, because to be honest, until, it's very strange actually, until Manchester City equalized through Haaland, I thought, hmm, this could go either way.

But after Haaland scored his goal, one-all then, it was all Arsenal.

And the last 35 minutes of that game, I played in an absolutely extraordinary atmosphere, I have to say, and a very funny atmosphere, too.

It was completely one-way traffic.

And you had a team that suddenly thought had been stung into acting and not just reacting, and another which totally collapsed.

And I wonder if what we should be talking about is Arsenal or Manchester City, because I have to say that from the stance, and I'm sure it was the same when you were looking

on your TV screen, the way that Manchester City played this last half hour was shocking.

And actually, I will use this word, shameful.

And it's funny, I was talking to a French friend this morning about it who watched the game, and he said, you know what?

It's exactly what happened against PSG in the Champions League.

Once they were under the Kosh, Manchester City, the body language of the players was appalling.

Nobody seemed to want the ball.

Nobody seemed to do what to do with it.

They were standing there statuesque.

And it was therefore, I mean, I wouldn't say easy, yeah, but it was actually easy for Arsenal to look absolutely magnificent.

And they were magnificent with quite a batch of really superb performances.

And what will have pleased, I think, most people is that two of the very best performances were the cameo by Ethan Waneri, which was just scintillating.

More touches of the ball in a few minutes than Herling Holland in the whole game.

Looking so, I mean, almost dude Bellingham-esque in his mastery of the ball.

This kind of, you know, this impression that he gives of how he has this aura, and then scoring what is going to become, has already become his trademark goal, which good luck

to stop that, guys.

And young Louis Miles Kelly, who certainly is now, I mean, people will probably be quite happy to have a giant portrait of Louis Miles Kelly.

in that pose, please.

Just outside the end of it.

It was absolutely magnificent.

And to have two young, very young players, teenagers, doing so well against a team that really was synonymous with suffering for Arsenal fans for a long time.

And to see two boys who have been with Arsenal for so long making it through the academy to be added to Bukayosaka, and let's not forget him, Memil Smith Row, even if he's gone, that says that, that...

you know, it tells you that the club is in a very, very good place when it comes to that, producing young players of really terrific talent and knowing how to nurture them.

So well done, Permeto Zaka.

So, no,

it was quite extraordinary.

It was extremely enjoyable.

I do apologize for rubbing more salt, but to be honest, doing the Poznan in the stands was great.

The songs that cannot be repeated were great because they were totally off-the-cuff.

And it's this weird phenomenon you have, which happens when a crowd is at one with its team, and then suddenly somebody starts singing something very silly or very funny and quite rude, and everybody starts singing it as well.

And it's a completely unplanned, off-the-cuff moment.

And it's beautiful.

And then you had the celebration, and you had all the rest.

It was absolutely, oh, it was just a joy, a joy to be there if you were an Arsenal supporter.

And I'd love to know what genuine neutrals, as you are, and Dan is, and Barry is, did think of it.

Because, yeah, I mean, for us, it was pure joy, but for Manchester City, to be honest,

what next?

Real Madrid?

Good luck, guys.

Well, I saw a stat saying that Manchester City didn't actually have a shot after Erling Haaland equalised, which is absolutely, I mean, it's almost unbelievable.

But, Barry, you said, and Mark said, and also Lars said on the previous pod, they got through in the Champions League, but they're not quite fixed yet.

And I think they proved that, didn't they?

It's still remarkable what we're seeing, though, isn't it?

Yeah, Lars was convinced Arsenal would win this game really easily.

And I wasn't,

I I didn't necessarily agree with them, and I thought they might even lose.

To answer Philippe's question, I thoroughly enjoyed this game.

I found

the Gabrielle screaming in Erling Halland's face very funny.

I found the Miles Lewis Skelly goal celebration, the magistrate of Pose, obviously ripping the piss out of Erling Hall.

I thought that was hilarious.

Stadium DJ playing humble by Kendrick Lamar afterwards.

It's just

chef's kiss.

And it's great to see that needle developing between these two clubs.

Now, obviously, if it comes to getting your medals out and comparing and contrasting, City are still miles ahead.

But yesterday was undeniably Arsenal's day.

And

I think City were kind of lucky they didn't lose by a lot more because Arsenal got that gifted that early opener.

Then they missed a couple of good chances.

And they sort of let the game drift for an hour.

And it looked like it might get away from them.

The city had chances of their own.

And then

Haaland scored the goal.

It was like he'd flicked a switch in the Arsenal dugout, and they just ran amok after that.

Ecluin Rice, who I'm predisposed to dislike because of his treachery, was outstanding yesterday, I thought.

He's not, you know,

he blows hot and cold, I think, for Arsenal.

But he was brilliant yesterday.

The two kids are obviously sort of the story of Arsenal's season, and I was really pleased to see Kai Havertz get his goal after that awful miss in the first half.

So, yeah, I really enjoyed this.

And I think we all like seeing Manchester City suffer.

The only thing I'd say is, while Arsenal fans are obviously delighted and every right to be, Lots of teams have beaten City this season and they've collapsed against lots of teams this season.

So it's not, you know,

it's not like they've toppled this winning machine they you know a lot of other teams have done it too that is very true although dan i think that the big thing is as we've all mentioned philippe and barry there they were given so much ammunition these arsenal fans you know the stay humble the who the f a you to miles lewis skelly it all just came firing back at them i mean as a as a fan that is just it's just too delicious isn't it to be able to do that yeah it felt like there was a lot of like separate stories going on on during that game, but the fall-off from Manchester City, I say it every time I come on, I've given up with saying that they'll turn the corner now because it doesn't look like they will.

They can't run backwards, and they don't seem very good at running forwards nowadays either.

Everything's so slow and ponderous in the build-up and or Tayga in goal.

I felt like he just gave up towards the end, couldn't be bothered to dive anymore.

And I just think at Manchester City, there's too many problems going on at the moment.

Goalkeeper being one of them, there's the inconsistency of selection.

Seems to be a different goalkeeper in goal every week pep seems to be persisting with mattez nunes at right back which i don't understand at all because he isn't a right back i know everyone likes their their right backs to step into midfield nowadays and and that's obviously what nunes would be good at but rico lewis is good at that and you kind of felt when kyle walker was kind of cast aside just before he left and now he's gone that rico lewis would come in and make that play as his own he just sits on on the bench every week and Manchester City have conceded more goals than Manchester United this season now and we all know how low Manchester United are languishing so there's just so much wrong with City but away from them Arsenal so much right with them I can't really expand much more greatly on on what Barry and Philippe have said that they were just sensational yesterday and really took advantage of of Manchester City's deficiencies I was quite annoyed because I made a note about Miles Lewis Skelly about Ashley Cole shades of Ashley Cole reminds me of when he came through and then Gary Neville said it on the commentary which annoyed me so now it looks like I've copied him in my notes but I assure everyone that I wrote that down first, it was just wonderful to watch a homegrown Academy prospect coming into what is a really, really good Arsenal side.

I think probably over the last 10-15 years, you've had glimpses of Academy players, but they've been coming into struggling sides.

You've now got Saka, who is the main man, obviously not playing at the moment, is an absolutely incredible footballer, an incredible person.

And just seeing Miles Lewis Skelly, the way he handles himself,

I think he's probably a certainty to be in the next England squad.

I don't even know what level he's played at in England, whether he's even played for the under-21s.

It wouldn't surprise me if he hasn't because his breakthrough seems like it's been so quickly.

But right now, it feels like he is the best English left back in the Premier League.

So when Thomas Tuchel names his first squad, at the moment, I think he's going to be there.

I think you might be right.

You know, we're not blessed with a lot of left backs unless Thomas Tuchel tried to persuade Kieran Tripper out of retirement in...

you know, an ode to Gareth Southgate.

I'm not sure that's going to happen, though.

Philly, just before we move on from Arsenal, it just must be a a bit maddening as a fan.

You see what they're capable of, and yet they are probably going to fall short again this season.

Well, you know, the problem is that there's a team called Liverpool, which is probably the best team in Europe at the moment.

And so best team, Europe, best team, best club side in the world.

So, yes, and also there will be the memory of some points which, you know, actually against Liverpool and against Manchester City, because a lot of this needle comes to that 2-2 when John Stone scored in the 98th minute of 97

and the ball thrown at Gabrielle at the back, and

Erling Harland talking to Louis Marscheri and saying that he didn't know who the hell he was, and things like that.

But yeah, it is frustrating.

But on the other hand,

with the number of injuries which the club has known at the beginning of the season, I mean, when you lose Martin Odegaard for a long time, when you lose Bukaiosaka, arguably your two most creative and dangerous players for long periods of time, and you're still there.

And I don't know.

I mean, Liverpool, the extra game they've got against Everton, does look a little bit different now than it did when.

It does, doesn't it, Barry?

So it should be, that should be an interesting one.

But yeah, there is some frustration, but I have to say, it's one of those moments when you just bask.

And

basking is really great because it doesn't happen very often to any fan of any team.

I'll just add one thing to Dan, when you said you wondered if Manchester City had turned a corner and I immediately thought of a scene in Mulholland Drive, the David Lydge film, where one of the characters turns around the corner and when he turns around the corner what he discovers is even more horrible than what he was seeing before.

So yes maybe they have turned the corner as well.

Dan, are Arsenal still is in your minds?

Yeah I think there's no doubt about it.

Liverpool haven't really entered a sticky period in the season yet and even Manchester City the great teams of the last few years they've still had sticky periods within the season where they've gone a couple of games without winning.

Liverpool at the moment feel like they're just going to ride out every storm.

But I'm pretty sure as the fixtures build up and the season goes on, that at some point that they will lose a game, that they will have a little bit of difficulty.

Arsenal have just got to stay switched on and stay around it and make sure that they're in as good a position as they can be if that does happen.

But I still think, look, if Arsenal don't win the league again, I'm one of those people who, it sounds stupid, I don't base everything around trophies.

I know ultimately trophies are the most important thing, but how Arsenal are now compared to how they've been over the last 10 years, having a team that's won, having a club that's won everyone kind of pulling in the same direction, it's a big thing, and that provides special moments as well.

And yesterday was a special moment, but there's been plenty of other special moments in this journey that Arsenal are on.

And even again, if they don't win the league this season or don't win anything this season, I am convinced that they're not too far away from winning something and that it will come.

And maybe not doing it again will just form part of that longer-term journey.

But at some point, they will win something.

because, Barry, I mean, we'll talk about Liverpool later, but they are setting the pace, and it seems like they do have room for a slip-up, don't they?

But do we trust Arsenal to take advantage?

Because there's not a lot of evidence for that.

I don't trust them, and they've provided plenty of evidence, you know, to back my lack of trust.

I don't understand why they can't play like they played

in the last 35 minutes yesterday more often.

And they seem to just

be too

deferential yesterday for the first hour, even though they were leading for most of it.

And then it's like they suddenly realised, hold on, there's nothing to be afraid of here.

We're better than these guys.

And then they set about their business and scored four goals, won very, very comfortably in the end.

But

they've got Leicester next in the league.

They're not going to lose that.

They're also, once they get their League Cup semi-final out of the way, they're off on their winter break to Dubai.

And Michel Arteta will, you know, have some steak cut for him by Salt Bay

and

salt sprinkled down the forearm.

They really hit their stride after that break last year, if I remember correctly.

So who's to say the same won't happen again?

Leicester next up.

I don't think

I can't see Arsenal slipping up there, but I would like if their game against Liverpool was a bit sooner.

It's in mid-May.

It might be too late by then.

It might not even matter who wins it at that stage.

So, yeah, if that game was coming up in the next month or so, that that would make things interesting.

And as Philippe says, Liverpool's game in hand against Everton is is a whole different ball game now, uh, compared to what it would have been s three weeks ago.

Do you think they'll have to get a new pickpocket now?

As well, they had that pickpocket, didn't they?

Was that in Debalwood or is it in the summer, wasn't it, when they had the pickpocket where they had to get a new one?

Yes, they brought in a load of Dickensian street urchins.

But yesterday just looked like a really special occasion for Arsenal fans where the team, the fans, were sort of communing as one.

And

the Emirates has a poor reputation in terms of atmosphere.

But yesterday just seemed like a real it seemed like a real fun place to be for Arsenal fans.

So on to the opening Premier League game of the weekend: Nottingham Forest 7, Brighton 0, a hat-trick for Chris Wood, a hat-trick of assists for Anthony Elanga, and a good old-fashioned collapse.

Barry, strange game because actually, even on the Match of the Day commentary, Steve Wilson was saying, you know, Brighton aren't playing too badly here.

And then

they just made absolutely no concessions, did they?

And I mean, Forest ran absolute riot, especially towards the end of the game.

I wouldn't necessarily agree with Steve Wilson, I have to say.

Dreadful.

I thought Fabian Herzler's decision to play one not quite match fit midfielder was a weird one.

Jack Inshelwood, that didn't work.

He was left hopelessly exposed, trying to protect the Brighton back four.

Yeah, Forrest were absolutely outstanding, and what a way to bounce back from their humiliation at Bournemouth last weekend.

Anthony Lange was brilliant, Morgan Gibbs White was brilliant, Chris Wood was brilliant.

The defence was bolstered by the introduction of Murato coming back in to help out Milenkovich and Murillo, who had a rare shocker last weekend.

And just everything worked.

You know, I've picked a handful of players there, but I can't think of a single forest player who didn't play well.

But yeah, I suppose Helanga was the standout performer.

Fabian Herzner after the game, he just looked genuinely shocked at what had happened.

His team um i don't think he's in danger of losing his job but uh it was a shocking performance from them and

things aren't really going that great for brighton at the minute i'd be interested to know what tony bloom makes of it all but uh their owner but i i don't think he'd be anywhere near pressing the panic button yeah john says why are many people amazed Brighton had 64% possession.

We had to kick off eight bloody times.

And yes, I was there.

So the free accounts for a lot of it.

Philippe, do you want to give Nottingham Forest a bit more praise?

Yes I think I

should.

I think we should.

Remind me who did Anthony Elanga used to play for?

Anyway

the one thing I think one of the things which was really impressive about Nottingham Forest that we have We've decided, it seems, that, okay, they're a team which are superbly organized by Nuno who knows how to do this kind of thing.

They're lethal on the counter attack.

But I think they showed far, far more than just that ability to absorb pressure and being aggressive in midfield and quick transitions, the usual thing with Chris Wood, you know, basically batting for old style number nines.

And don't we love that, by the way?

But they were also in phases when they have possession of the ball.

I thought they were more imaginative, more trenchant than they have been in the past.

I think they're growing, basically.

They must be, I mean, the confidence must be sky high in that team.

And you actually do wonder as well that if Liverpool was not so far ahead, could they even do like a Leicester?

Because they're quite similar in some ways, because they come, it's a team that everybody thought would be candidate for relegation, coming from a lower division and so on and so forth.

No superstars, but actually some very, very fine players who are basically playing at 100% of the capacities with a manager who knows exactly what he's doing, what he wants from his team, and with ferocious home support.

But it's not going to happen.

But my goodness, no, I thought they were mightily impressive.

And in a way, perhaps that they haven't been impressive

so far this season, in the way they have played.

As to Brighton,

it's quite paradoxical that they're having a funny season where things are not quite working, working okay, but not great.

But this follows their biggest recruitment, I think, of all time.

They spent an absolute fortune in new players.

They spent well over 100 million net on new players.

And now against Forrest, they registered their heaviest defeat in 67 years, which is quite a record.

And they don't seem to have done that jump forward that you would have expected from such an ambitious recruitment.

But, you know, maybe just a little period of turbulence rather than a crisis.

Two wins in the last 12 for Brighton.

A lot of of draws in there.

It is interesting, isn't it, how we view Brighton, Dan, because I think probably expectations have risen because of the last few seasons.

So it's just an interesting one, isn't it?

Like, where do we place them in the division?

Yeah, this is quite reminiscent of last season and maybe the not the season before that, but the season before that, where Brighton get off to a good start and everyone talks about how well they've done, everyone raves about the manager and then they do kind of fall away.

I feel like this is what happened last season under Deserve.

Obviously, last season they were battling having European football and Premier League and trying to manage that.

But as Philippe says, off the back of the recruitment drive and how much money that they've spent, you look at them, you look at the array of attacking players they've got and you think, you know, that's a team that's going to score lots of goals.

But they've just gone to Forest and not scored.

I was alarmed by the team selection when I saw it before the game.

And I like Barry, I think we've seen false nines, inverted fullbacks, but having a complete false midfield

is a new one for me.

How you expect to...

I'm sure that'll catch on.

how you can expect to win a game with one midfielder and five forward players?

I just didn't understand it at all and Forrest took pure advantage of that.

I don't know whether there's an element of too much rotation at Brighton.

Maybe they've almost got too many players and he's trying to fit them in and he's trying to work out what his best 11 is on the fly but I don't think we've we've just heard they haven't lost by that margin for for a long, long time.

So seeing that now off the back of what they've done, it must concern people at Brighton a little bit and I guess Forrest responded last week from getting absolutely pummelled it's up to Brighton now to respond next time they're in action that'll do for part one in part two we will do the rest of the Premier League starting at Old Trafford

Hi pod fans of America Max here Barry's here too hello football weekly is supported by the remarkable paper pro now if you're a regular listener to this show you'll have heard us talk before about the remarkable paper pro we already know that remarkable is the leader in the paper tablet category, digital notebooks that give you everything you love about paper, but with the power of modern technology.

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A proper football journalist, mate.

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Welcome to part two of the Guardian Football Weekly.

Manchester United 0, Crystal Palace 2.

Ruben Amarin didn't say after the game that this confirms their status as the worst Manchester United team of all time, as we might have hoped.

He went a bit Eric Ten Hag, actually.

He said the result is bad.

The performance was a little bit better than the last games.

We control the transitions quite well for Crystal Palace.

We're going to get shouted at if we don't start with Palace, I think.

Philippe Jean-Philippe Mateta,

your sort of namesake.

We'll start with him again.

He's having another great season, isn't he?

Yes, absolutely.

And a little bit unexpectedly, I don't know, by the way, the role which the Olympic Games played in this transformation.

Because you remember, he was absolutely, he was superb for the French, and he was really one of the pillars of Tiernani's team.

And

I think that most of us thought that he didn't quite have as,

it was not quite as full a package as what is shown.

You know, when you meet him, I've met him, and

I'm not small, I'm six foot one.

I felt like a little boy compared to him.

You know,

I felt like, I don't know, and he is absolutely huge.

And you think, well, okay, so this is somebody who uses his physical attributes and his finishing skills, and that's about it.

But no, it's much more than that.

His movement, in particular, I think, is much better than it used to be.

And he's also shown exactly Manchester United what they were missing.

This gaping hole that they've got in a position where Crystal Palace, well, they've got, in a way,

I do have a theory that we are seeing a return of the old-style number nines.

Because I was in this season in the Premier League, the clubs which have them are doing good, doing well.

And I think Chris Wood is one of them.

Jeophilik Matetta is another one.

And you could actually go around the teams, which actually are doing, you know,

Brian Bomo, when things are going well at Brentford, is absolutely magnificent as well.

And you could carry on.

And I wouldn't say Mateta is quite up where Mbermo is, because Mbermo is absolutely magnificent.

I should have said Roo Jimenez as well, but I hope we will have a word about the Mexican a bit later.

He's surprised, I think, most people who've been following him in French football by

he's grown,

he's improved considerably.

Was anyone surprised by this result at all?

I was doing a different game and I saw that Palace had won 2-0 at Old Trafford, something they've won at Old Trafford fairly frequently recently, Barry, and I just kind of did the old Alan Partridge shrug as I thought, yeah, that sounds about right.

Yeah, I wasn't surprised.

I can kind of see where Amerim's coming from about his team's performance.

I don't.

They've played a lot worse this season, put it that way.

And Palace defended very very well they had to weather a few united storms which they did reasonably comfortably and then uh ran out two nil winners i mean

palace have come a long way this season as well they lost five and drew three of their first eight games there was speculation over oliver glasgow's future some palace fans wanted him gone but he's turned things around very well

and in matetta as philippe says they they they have the player Manchester United are absolutely crying out for.

And Dad, I think the big talking point for this one was, well, Cobby Maynu did quite well as a number 10 in the Europa League.

So Ruben Amarim went, right, let's see how you do as a number nine or a false nine.

And I don't know what your thoughts are on this on Ruben Amarim.

He's kind of put a flamethrower to his relationship with Marcus Rashford.

That's probably a two-way thing.

But you put Cobby Maynu as a false nine.

Hoyland and Zerxe are on the bench there.

I mean, just wonder what the sort of relationships are going to be like with this coach and his players.

I think it's an absolute certainty that Manchester United invests in a big number nine in the summer.

I think he obviously doesn't.

If you're playing Cobby Maneures,

you don't have much trust in the two strikers that are sat on the bench.

I'm just wondering where Cobby Manu is going to play next week because he's gone from being a number six to being a number 10 to being a centre-forward.

Is he going to start again and be a centre-back next week or in goal?

I'm not sure.

He seems to be moving around the pitch so much at the moment.

I can't see the logic in doing that.

I'm not a football manager.

And Amarim, a bit like I've just said about Brighton, he kind of admitted when he came in that he was going to change the team, he was going to make lots of changes, try and find the right combination, try and find

the right team.

But

he's got problems in all areas.

He's now got a problem at centre-back because in the system he wants to play, you have to have a left footer.

at left centre-back and Luke Shaw, I think is coming up to fitness again now, but that Martinez injury didn't look too clever at all.

So it looks like that might be a season ender from what I've read and then if they don't have like the basic players to perform the functions within the system that the Amarim wants it's going to continue to be a struggle for Manchester United I just don't ever watch them and think that any of their players other than Bruno are particularly good enough Ahmad obviously has had a had a great spell as well but there's wholesale changes needed at that football club and I think he's obviously already decided that both those centre forwards aren't fit for purpose that they're not what he wants am I alone in thinking that both Reuben Amarim and Sir Jim Ratcliffe might both be thinking they've made a terrible mistake?

They're ineos mistakes, I think, already.

There's a huge rap sheet, isn't there?

But I again think any manager that comes in now is going to struggle.

I quite like that Amarim's kind of at least got a set way in which he wants to play.

When Ten Hag came in, he was basically saying, We can't do what I want my team to play like.

We can't play in that iax way.

I don't have the players amarim at least you know he's trying to implement his system it's not working but at least he's like trying to implement the system and showing that he has some kind of beliefs whereas ten hag just kind of reneed on everything he believed in i felt but in yos so far i'm i'm not convinced by anything that that they've done at all well it's it's it's no big surprise in my opinion but i don't think amaroim's a bad manager i just think i suspect ratcliffe is not happy with some of the things he's come out and said and probably isn't happy with the manner in which he's cast Rashford out into the villa wilderness

sending him out on loan to a better team who are in the Champions League and have a better manager with certainly with more pedigree.

So yeah, I suspect Ratcliffe might be thinking, what have we done here?

And vice versa.

Indeed.

But Dan, we should mention that, Marcus Rashford on loan to Villa.

Do you have high hopes?

Yeah, I think

from a Villa perspective,

I'm happy with it.

I think he's become a little bit of a scapegoat at Manchester United.

I'm not going to say that he's been perfectly behaved all the way through because he obviously hasn't.

There's obviously been things that have happened off the pitch, but just in terms of what Manchester United are on the pitch, it did feel like he was becoming a little bit of a scapegoat.

I do feel that homegrown players are held to a different standard sometimes when things are going badly.

And Rashford wasn't alone in putting in anonymous performances in the Manchester United shirt that that's been happening now for years.

I guess he's just been there for the whole duration that that's been happening.

But from a Villa perspective, I'm happy to get him in.

I think Villa needs something fresh up front.

He's obviously on his day a high-level player.

Barry just mentioned Unai Emery and Unai Emery has made pretty much every player at Aston Villa better since he's been there.

So with a bit of love and I think maybe having a set position might help.

Although if I look at Villa's team, I can't actually think where he's going to play

at the moment.

But he's 27.

He'll have desires of getting back in the England squad.

I I think it's pretty low risk from a Villa perspective.

Yes, they're paying up a high proportion of his wages, but if it doesn't work, he goes back to Manchester United.

But I'm confident, I've got high hopes he'll be a good fit for Villa in the way we play.

Yeah, if I can just go back to Manchester United for one second, what's happening now could also have

really, really impactful consequences in the near future.

I mean, Manchester United's power is based on its commercial attractiveness to loads of people on the planet, right?

This is how they make most of their money.

Their only hope of qualifying for the Champions League is to win the Europa League.

So they will have,

if that happened, they'd be okay.

Given how they're playing, this is certainly not a given.

But it looks as if they're not going to be in any European competition next season unless they win the Europa League.

That's already something really concerning.

They've got some big problems when it comes to the finances and PSR as well, which which explains in part what the situation with Marcus Rashford, the fact that they sold homegrown players like Scott McTominay, when, to be honest, maybe they could have been useful in the current predicament.

And there's got to be a point when people start to wake up and say,

why are we partnering a club paying so much money for a club that actually does nothing but

is actually going from crisis to crisis?

You know, 10 Hag, for all is reneging on his principles, still won two trophies and qualified them for the Champions League.

They're nowhere near that level.

And they think, okay, they do need to buy players to change that.

But to buy the players, they must first sell.

And the problem is that many of their players are unsellable because they're on too high wages and they won't get the amount of money that they spent on them to start with anyway.

So I'm thinking that when we talk about the difficulties that Manchester United have on the pitch and that we can see from week to week, we have to think as well of what is going to happen at some point.

It's bound to happen off the pitch as well and have an impact on the financial stature of this club, which is still one of the biggest clubs in the world.

If you look at the Deloitte money list, they're still there.

But for how long is my question?

A quick mention for Anthony, who got man of the match on his real Betis debut.

Early days.

But might just be added to the very long list that's growing of players thriving after leaving Manchester United.

Is that one more man of the match than he got at Manchester United?

I mean,

it was barely in a match, was it?

Manchester United.

That's true.

Bournemouth-Nil, Liverpool, two.

Barry, it doesn't really tell the whole story, does it?

This result, but ultimately, another Liverpool win.

Yeah, I thought Bournemouth played well in this game and were maybe a little bit unlucky.

They went into it unbeaten in 11.

Liverpool went in unbeaten in 18.

I think Alexis McAllister was quite lucky not to be sent off.

Agreed.

I think Bournemouth were quite lucky not to get a penalty when Trent Alexander Arnold handled

Uttara cross into the box quite blatantly, I thought, and wasn't given.

And Bourmet had several good chances, but this was always going to be and always likely to be a stern test for Liverpool.

So it proved.

And once again, they passed.

Allison had to make some very good saves.

So

I'd say Liverpool went home thinking they'd probably dodged a few bullets in this one.

It could have dropped points on another day.

Very easily.

Could have lost on another day.

I watched 90 minutes of this game back yesterday, and Bournemouth started that game really with some vigour and some pace.

And Liverpool were quite fortunate not to go behind.

They kind of survived

an iffy start.

I felt the game hinged on that Clivert missed chance

at 1-0.

Everything Cliver has hit in recent weeks has gone in.

And then probably one of the most simplest chances he's had all season.

He's managed to put it wide.

I think the game did hinge on that.

If Bournemouth had equalised, you do think maybe Liverpool might have sat back a little bit, and Bournemouth might have just played the way that they play and gone out.

Liverpool and maybe gone on to win the game.

But Liverpool just keep winning.

They keep keeping clean sheets.

The attackers keep scoring.

And when I was

watching the game back yesterday, I felt that I mean this in the most respectful way possible.

What they're doing is quite basic.

The defenders defend by and large.

The goalkeeper keeps the ball out out of the net the midfield do a bit of both in terms of going forward and defending and all the goals basically come from the attacking players whoever's in that front three have jackpo score scored a lot of goals obviously darwin scored a couple when he when he came on a few weeks ago salah does what salah does but it's the attack that are scoring the goals every week and that's 21 now for salah i think it is this season and the second goal is just just a joke it's so nonchalant the way he just does that stuff off the cuff he's just a sensational footballer, one of the best the Premier League has ever seen.

So when I say Liverpool are basic, I mean that very, very respectfully, but they're very good at being basic, and that's why they're top of the league.

I think that's essentially what Jonathan Wilson said in his piece, actually.

Sort of efficient, not very flamboyant, and they're just getting the job done.

I mean, Philippe, it just seems like this is one of the most serene title charges ever.

Where's the Jeopardy going to come?

Is it going to come?

The Jeopardy, if there is Jeopardy, will come with the end of this incredible

lucky phase where they haven't had a single injury.

Liverpool are the one team competing for the title this season who have not had to deal with serious injuries to absolute key players.

They might have missed one game, might miss two games and so forth.

But A, they've got a terrific squad.

Which, by the way, was not absolutely obvious when we saw them not buying anybody last summer and master stroke.

But if they do have problems like a long suspension or an injury or something like that, I don't wish it on them.

But

very often the luck goes with the champions and luck with injuries is an essential part of it.

And I think that they're doing absolutely the most, the most of it.

I mean, they have, I don't think, I mean, Joe Gomez and Federico Quesa were not even in the squad traveling because there was no need for them.

to travel there.

But and the other thing is that I think that even if Clovert had scored that goal or if a penalty had been given and scored, the one thing that this team exudes is serenity

and that whatever is thrown at them, they don't overreact.

They have a very mature way of getting their game back together and then go back into the game and ultimately win it.

There is this feeling of

it's almost like fate,

fate accompli,

that they are going to prevail in the end, whatever the circumstances they have to deal with.

And that is probably the most

impressive thing of the many impressive things that Arnold Slott has done is to convey and communicate this calm that he has to

his players.

And especially, we've said that again, but we've said that before, but let's say it again, you know, with three of his biggest players.

war in the last few months of their contracts.

That's pretty amazing.

Very unusual, that, isn't it?

Usually there'd be, you know, all sorts going on, you know, behind the scenes and briefing of press and all that stuff.

It seems to be, yeah, final year of contract.

Alexander Arnold, Van Dijk, and Mo Sala are kind of playing their best football.

It's yeah, ridiculous.

Brentford 0, Spurs 2.

It's ruined our fun, hasn't it, Barry Ange, Posta Coglu chat.

It's going to be a little minimum.

But just what they needed,

needed a boring sort of 2-0 win, and they got it.

And it's a very good win, actually, because Brentford are very good at home.

Yeah I mean we've sort of established I hadn't noticed at the time and Laris pointed out when they that a lot of the fact that their home record was so good is because they were playing pretty bang average teams at home and they hadn't hosted any of the big boys.

I be honest I thought they'd probably win this game and they weren't terrible in it.

I thought they played quite well but it was a very

unspursy performance from Spurs.

And they defended diligently.

They got to two goals.

It was a good team effort.

They're still obviously missing a load of players through injury at one stage.

Was it Mikey Moore, Bergval, and Archie Gray on the pitch all at the same time?

But, yeah, just a kind of a routine-ish win that is just what Spurs needed.

And I'd say Ange Postakoglu was mightily relieved because they went into this game on the back of four Premier League defeats on the bounce.

And if they'd lost here, they'd definitely be in the relegation chat for that last place.

We think is the only one up for grabs at the minute.

Not that anyone wants to grab it, but, you know.

Producer Joel pointing out, goalkeepers in either half refusing to wear a cap despite the blinding sun.

This really fascinates me.

Is this like the brolly thing that football managers now can't use a brolly?

Goalkeepers just seem to just flat out refuse to wear a cap in the sun because it's kind of i don't know is it frowned upon is it not very cool i don't think it's that i think it just doesn't help i think no some shades then the brentford keeper asked for one to be brought to him and put it on and then immediately discarded it i i

you know even i occasionally wear a baseball hat and even if it's the sun's in my eyes it doesn't help keep the sun out of your eyes you know i think it was more vowder martin's reluctance to use his hands

rather than not having a cap.

I think Spurs, I don't particularly write Flecken, to be honest, but I do think Brentford having a different goalkeeper did play a part in that game.

Yes, I thought he completely made up Papisar's mind up for him as well with the second goal, with how he's rushing out.

So, yeah,

I don't think the cap was the biggest problem for the goalkeeper on the day.

Yeah, and a very, very bizarre first goal, wasn't it?

Coming off Janard's pack.

Yeah, very, very odd.

Did you see the uh xg stats for this game robin because they are quite extraordinary are they grim are they grim they're they're they're pretty grim um brentford 2.29 expected goals which is very very high indeed

and tottenham 0.75

so obviously

It was a bit of a one-off.

It was very unspursy, I have to say.

Talking about caps, this reminds me of when I hear about goalkeepers and caps, I always think of

Martin Yoll at the time that Robinson was in goal for Tottenham and Tottenham

were having this prime with a glare.

And Robinson

was asked, well, why didn't you, Mr.

Yull, why didn't you ask your keeper to put a cap on?

He said, we couldn't find one which was big enough.

Oh, I love that.

That's very catty, isn't it?

I'd imagine Paul Robinson would wear sort of a flat cap rather than a baseball hat he's very yorkshire isn't he yeah an array of hats a cowboy hat a stetson well you know we want to see this um philippe briefly we had a correspondence um max uh from melbourne asking about kevin danso um because spurs have uh

have signed him what can they expect They can expect a very committed, solid, more or less injury-free, only had one

serious-ish injury in his career, but that was a long, long time ago.

Very quick, very brave, not perhaps the most refined and elegant of defenders, let's put it that way, but somebody who will bring some solidity, I would imagine, in physicality to the back line.

I know there have been some, people have been talking about the fact that he missed a medical, was in this, in the summer, and he was supposed to, and the medical, you know, found a slight defect with his heart.

But in fact, this is not something due to a condition that is in any way dangerous.

Let's be absolutely clear about that.

So, there's been quite a lot of rubbish being said about that.

He's actually, yeah, he's a very strong, very fit, very quick,

good in the air, and so forth and so on.

Perhaps not, you know, he's not a William Saliba or Rio Ferdinand.

That's the way I would put it.

The important thing is, does he have good hamstrings?

I think

that's the thing we need to look at.

That'll do for part two.

In part three, we'll we'll do the rest of the Premier League.

HiPod fans of America.

Max here.

Barry's here, too.

Hello.

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Welcome back to part three of the Guardian of Football Weekly.

Price, he says, Are Everton actually out of the relegation battle and therefore into the lower levels of mid-table mediocrity?

He also asked, What's the best thing you've done in 10.18 seconds?

I think we'll leave that there.

4-0, they beat Leicester.

I loved the thought of John Bruin just slamming down his laptop, saying football's been completed.

Jordan Pickford getting it launched and then Decoure.

This was magnificent, wasn't it, Barry?

Yeah, brilliant.

And, you know, when you're a team as bad as Leicester are and you're down among the dead men, to not be concentrating at the kickoff is just shameful, I think.

But Garner takes the kickoff back to to pick for gets it launched.

Decourage sweeps through and buries the ball in 10 seconds.

So Everton, Leicester are pretty almost beaten before the game is even started.

Leicester or Everton, second and third, brilliant passes from Tarkowski first, and then Garner.

Beto with two finishes.

You wouldn't beto on him scoring either, but he finished both with a plom.

And he's a player who was only picked because David Moyes had nobody else.

But he's, you know, that's going to have boosted his confidence, no end.

Will it make a difference now?

Will Everton try and sign a striker today?

Maybe they don't need one if Betto's finally got his act together.

And just my abiding memory of this game, I think, will be

Yannick Vestergaard and Vout Fast just...

sprinting back towards their own goal in a mad panic while yet another Everton player just just zooms between them and

bears down on the Leicester penalty area.

So we've already said this

game in hand Liverpool have has taken on a whole new complexion with the arrival of David Moyes at Everton.

Three wins in a row.

Absolutely brilliant for them.

We should mention the others in the list.

So that's the fourth fastest goal in Premier League history.

Shane Long, Philip Billing and Ledley King are the only players with faster goals.

So what incredible company to be in, Abdelai DeCore.

I mean,

David Moyes now has as many wins just over a fortnight as Sean Dysch managed in the whole season.

I mean, has he done anything in particular, Dan, would you say?

Or is this kind of a vibes thing?

Really, really difficult question.

I mean, they looked pretty free-flowing the weekend.

I haven't seen them look free-flowing for a long time.

I think he's probably just injected some confidence into the players.

He's a good manager, David Moyes.

I've always thought he was a good manager.

And you know him going back to Everton I thought at the time that's the best appointment they could make at this time because they won't they won't go down and just watch it and joy play and last time I was on with Philippe he was waxing lyrical about NJ

watching him it almost feels like Everton had that kind of player when Moise was there last time they'd always have that that really good attacking attacking wide player and watching him play and he was kind of getting lost in the way Everton were playing because he's such an effective such a such a talented player Moise has kind of took the shackles off him he's able to get more involved in the game.

And as Barry says, if you're coming in and you're getting better scoring too, you're obviously doing something very, very well at the moment.

And his record since he's coming, he deserves a lot of credit for that because it actually kind of been easy to come in and actually inject some confidence into those players.

But shy of that,

I don't know.

I wish I did know.

Everton is a team that also feeds a lot of its own crowd.

And the crowd at Goodison is a crowd of people who really know their football and have some certain expectations.

And let's not forget it's a club that has been put in an absolutely appalling situation by the former owners.

You know, the whole 777 saga coming on the back of some disastrous recruitment decisions over the past few years.

Now you've got somebody serious who is in charge, by the way.

I mean, the freaking group, I don't very much like multiple club ownership, as you might know, but in that lot, they're actually a very serious group of people.

That's one thing.

And when you get that, you talk about the vibes, but I think those vibes do matter an awful lot around the club.

Suddenly, they're out of this awful situation where you wondered if they were going to be able to pay the wage bills of the players, let alone finish the stadium.

Now, that's it, the sale has been completed.

I think it's really important to stress that.

A lot of the problems happened also because at Everton, happened because of what was happening off the pitch.

Those problems have been solved.

Then you bring back a man who is synonymous with Everton Football Club in many ways, some of its more recent history, was very successful, is absolutely adored there, has a real

communion feeling with the crowd.

And you put all that together and think, yes, vibes are important.

As you said, the shackles are off, but the shackles are also off perhaps because people's minds are not necessarily on the next disaster which is going to hit them.

And that makes a big difference to Everton Football Club.

They're nine points clear now of the relegation zone.

I think we can mark them as safe.

Wolves 2, Aston Villa 0.

Another poor result following a Champions League fixture.

Dan, I mean, I'll let you rant, but this was a deserved win for Wolves.

Oh,

100%.

Villa just cannot play at Molyneux.

I don't know what it is.

I was saying before we came on that the only year I can remember Villa winning in recent times was the COVID year when there was no crowd in there.

And I think Wolves treat it like a derby game it's not the derby game but it is a derby game and every time Villa turn up there and they don't seem to treat it like a derby game there's obviously a worrying pattern emerging now with with the Champions League results I didn't think that was a thing but now I look at it you know it keeps happening so it it must be a thing but Villa were rotten in the first half really really horrible and that's the main difference between Villa this season and Villa last season is that they're just capable of putting in an absolute stinking half of football sometimes even two halves of football.

And that wasn't the case last season at all.

And I think Villa were better in the second half, played well in the second half, possibly should have scored, haven't scored against a team that have conceded 52 goals this season, which is a little bit worrying.

But

maybe I'm biased.

I don't know.

I'm more interested to hear what Philippe and Barry and yourself think about this.

But that goal that's disallowed, I think the linesman has put his flag up for an offside that's not there with Marlon.

And then it feels like Var so desperate to keep the decision and not embarrass anyone that they're just looking for something to disallow it for.

Rogers hasn't stopped Somedo getting out to McGinn at all in the build-up to that to that goal.

And my feeling is we've been robbed of a legitimate goal.

Yes, Wolves deserved to win, yes, Villa were rubbish, but the game changes if that goes to 1-1, in my opinion.

I don't know what the g what you lot think about that VAR decision there.

I don't really know why it was disallowed.

I watched this game, I've re-watched the alleged infringement and I'm not quite sure why it was disallowed, but I don't think Villa deserved anything from this game.

Whatever the rights and wrongs of that decision, if Goncalo Guedes had had his shooting boots on, they'd have been out of sight by half-time.

Wolves, and I thought it was a good performance from them.

Someone actually

mailed me to, I was doing the minute-by-minute report.

Someone mailed me to say, Vitor Pereira is an absolute, and I checked, he's right, dead ringer for Eli Wallock's character in The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly.

I don't know if you've seen it, but absolute ringer.

It's worth doing.

I mean, Dan, full empathy and sympathy for the disallowed goal.

And like Barry, I still don't have any clue as to why it was disallowed.

When there have been, as well, this infuriating thing, there have been goals being disallowed,

being allowed

to stand this season where there were far, far more blatant interferences with play.

I mean, far, far more blatant, like players almost in the line of vision of the keeper, you know, like two yards in front of them.

It's just ridiculous.

And on this subject, I think that one of the big problems is the fact that, as you say, you do get, and it's not good to feel that, you do get the feeling that

the system as it works today is also a kind of protection system for referees And

it shouldn't be like that.

And it brings a really unpleasant atmosphere around it, which leads to people doing some very, very silly and very bad things, actually, threatening referees and things like that.

I'm absolutely appalling stuff.

I'm wondering, when are we going to come to that point when,

for example, the VAR people,

why don't we ask neutral international referees to do it?

Why do we have to to have people coming from the same pool, same nationality,

analyzing what's happening

on the pitch with one of their mates with the whistle?

Why is it that we think it's perfectly okay to have international referees in Champions League games, where the standard of refereeing, by the way, is much, much higher, or international competitions.

And why for our national leagues don't we think, well, actually, you know what?

Might be worth to actually actually bring people from outside,

especially for the VAR thing, which is a technical, purely, almost purely technical judgment.

I don't know, it's just something

I've always been surprised that the question was not even put on the table.

It's just not sure it's something that we do on our little island, is it bringing people from the outside to referee our game?

Making our jobs in the best league in the world, absolutely disgraceful.

In a nice bit of symmetry, actually,

going into this this game, Wolves and Aston Villa were separated by 21 miles of road and 21 points in the league table.

It was an important win for Wolves, of course, but they're still just two points.

Sorry, I thought that was a really interesting stat, but no one seemed to agree with me.

Did you say it was 21 points before the game?

Yeah, yeah.

Yes, it's gone now, isn't it?

18 points now, washi.

Well, we didn't have a podcast before.

Well, I didn't realise it on Thursday.

Well what would be what would be interesting if the same principle applied for example to Newcastle United and Fulham?

How many points would be the difference in the two ball?

Oh dear.

Let's quickly whip through the other Premier League games.

Newcastle 1, Fulham 2 and Philippe you wanted to mention Raul Jimenez.

This was a great win for Fulham, a big turnaround victory.

Oh yes,

I think they're a team that everybody wishes them well anyway.

I wish them well for many reasons.

First of all, they're close to home.

Then they've got quite a few former gunners in their ranks, but they've got also Raul Jimenez, probably from

my absolute favorite players in the Premier League before he had this horrific injury.

And to see him coming back as he has,

and to show the bravery that he had to show against Fabian Cher and Dan Burn.

Well, not exactly two of the most,

how do we say, sweet-tempered defenders you can come across.

And to see the bravery of that man and the fact that he's back among the goals, reminding us of what an absolutely extraordinary center-forward he could have been.

Maybe I'm just a single member of his fan club, but the round he made, as I remember from his heyday, was an absolute joy of a number nine who could do absolutely everything and was also supremely elegant, a very rare quality amongst the people who have this position.

And to see him come back and scoring the goals and again, showing such bravery and courage is just i think it's just wonderful i absolutely love the guy to beat as i think you might have guessed

yeah we got we got that vibe i think we can all we can all get behind that um ipswich one southampton two um so southampton move to within a victory of uh avoiding the dreaded derby record but ouch barry this was not a good result for ipswich that we were sort of pinning our hopes on them to be the the sort of outlier and not have another season where the promoted teams get all get relegated.

This is a big blow to that.

Very much echoes of looting about them

looting last season.

And I was hoping if they do go down, they don't.

There aren't echoes of looting this season about the next season.

But sorry, I digress.

Terrible result for Ipswich.

I did not see this coming at all because I think Southampton are definitely among the worst three teams I have ever seen in the Premier League or in the top flight in all the years I've been watching football.

This was a terrible performance from them.

I suppose

Southampton, you know, they're going to get the odd good result here.

And they did show signs of life in that game against Manchester United

that they went on to lose.

But I suspect it will be too little, too late for them.

A quick stat for you, Liam DeLap.

Obviously, scored in that guy and tagging his tally to nine Premier League goals for the season.

He's now beaten his dad's best ever Premier League goal tally in the season in 99-2000.

Rory DeLap got eight goals for Derber.

Yeah, but how far can he throw a ball?

Not as far as his dad, and that's what everyone cares about.

Can he throw a ball over a pub?

Yeah, that's that's a feature we need.

His dad slapping him down, saying, Listen, son, I had my own towel and everything at Stoke City.

Chelsea Flay West Have United tonight.

We'll cover that on Thursday pod if it's particularly noteworthy.

A quick any other business.

Oscar has written to us, says, Hello, and congratulations to the expanding Rushton clan.

For the sake of my reputation, I would like it placed on record that the Alsatian Oscar, the one from Alsace, wanging on about natural wine on Thursday's pod is not the same Oscar as me, the one who shamelessly self-promoted his detective novel last year.

As it happens, the sequel's just come out.

It's called Hell's Hound.

There's still an ego-driven minor character called Wilson, along with a series of West Ham-based deductions and a couple who fall for each other over their mutual love of Bacayo Saka.

Also, people drink wine, but it's normal wine.

Much love, love, Oscar Jensen.

Barry, that is Jonathan Wilson's levels of shameless self-promotion.

Yeah, when he talked about Oscar the Alsatian,

I had an image of a dog in my head.

I was no idea what the hell was going on.

But yes, good luck with the book.

Oscar the non-Alsatian.

A non-dog.

Episodes on Thursday and Friday this week to cover the League Cup semi-finals.

Until then, my thanks to Barry.

Thank you so much, Barry.

Thanks, Robin.

Thank you, Philippe.

Thank you, Robin.

And thank you, Dan.

Thank you very much.

Football Weekly is produced by Joel Grove, and our executive producer is Daniel Stevens.

This is The Guardian.