The case for Arsenal’s title challenge and an EFL roundup: Football Weekly Extra

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Hello and welcome to the Guardian Football Weekly.

Do we have League Arsenal win at Brentford to cut Liverpool's lead at the top to six points?

Another solid performance.

They were fine without Saka and came from behind at the becoming less of a fortress G-Tech.

We'll do a Premier League preview and some transfer window all at the same time.

Liverpool Manchester United looks compelling, not because anyone thinks the result is in doubt, but just how much can Arnold's slot fan the flames of the United binfire?

Don't worry, like every media outlet, we're compelled to discuss the futures of Marcus Rashford and Trent Alexander Arnold.

Back to binfires, Spurs still have no defenders and take on Newcastle who are absolutely flying.

While after Leicester away, Man City have somehow managed to get an easier fixture this weekend at home to West Ham.

Also today, some EFL Josh Windas from the halfway line or more accurately the middle of his own half.

The end of Rooney, House Frank getting on at Coventry, ooh Gary Rowatt's good start at Oxford and a massive win for Sunderland over Shefford United.

Also today the Danny Ormo pickle that Barcelona find themselves in, some choral music and an invitation for the pod to improve diplomatic ties with China, obviously.

All that plus your questions and that's today's Guardian Football Weekly.

On the panel today, Barry Glenn Denning, welcome.

Hi Max.

From Not the Top 20 podcast, Ali Maxwell.

Hello.

Good morning.

And from the Racing Post, Mark Langdon.

Hi, Mark.

Hi, Max.

Obviously, quite a lot of Mark Langdon Christmas dinner questions.

We'll get to them later.

Let's start at the G-Tech.

Brentford won, Arsenal three.

I mean, I think it's fair to say, Mark, that you know, saying Liverpool have won the league is a little premature because Arsenal are good.

This was a good win against the side with a very good home record.

They did it without Bacayo Saka, and they look pretty comfortable doing it.

Yeah, yeah, I don't think it's all over at all.

If Liverpool can build up in the first half of the season this lead on Arsenal, I don't think that we just assume that Liverpool carry on, you know, winning virtually every game from now until the end of the campaign.

And if they do slip up, and maybe if there is an injury to a Van Dijk or Salah, then things could change pretty quickly, I think, on that front.

And Arsenal just need to be in a position where they get to a points tally that kind of puts them in the right kind of area.

And to do that, you have to win these type of away games.

And it was a really sticky first sort of 25, 30 minutes for them.

But once they equalised, they really went through the gears.

And I thought they were quite comfortable, really, by the end of it.

And it was a very good away performance, given that Brentford, I think, can be awkward opponents.

Just say, though, that I think their home record is slightly inflated by their schedule.

It's been a really weird schedule for Brentford.

They've played most of the best teams away, most of the worst teams at home, so it kind of plays out that they've got this stronger home record.

But it's still a really important and good win for Arsenal.

Barry, you like fine margins, of course, and there were some fine margins to appreciate.

Just before Arsenal equalised with Darren Ray almost spilling that into his own net.

Perhaps a key minute in the match.

A weird moment in the game when I think it was Keen Lewis Potter

shot

and David Rea spilled the shot.

It looked like it was going to go over the line, so that's that's a boo-boo on his part.

But his recovery was astonishing, I thought.

The manner in which he stretched to prevent the ball going over the line.

I think one more rotation would have done it.

Arsenal would have been 2-0 down, and

Raya would have made a bit of a trump of himself in front of the fans of the club he left to go to Arsenal for him.

So they'd have loved that, I suppose.

A rare mistake from him, but a brilliant recovery.

So hats off to him for that.

Much was made before this game of the bug that was sweeping through the Arsenal camp.

So Havertz couldn't play as a result of that.

I'm not sure if that's why Rice was on the bench or he was just rested.

And then there's a suggestion that some of the players who were on the pitch might have been affected as well.

I suppose Arsenal deserve credit for, I would say, a fairly routine win.

But the manner in which they closed up shop after they went 3-1 ahead and just the game pretty much just fizzled out into nothing.

There was four goals in this game, but I thought it was quite a boring watch, if I'm honest.

But Arsenal fans, they'll be happy.

Three points in the bag on to Brighton away, which that could be another tricky one.

Yeah, the window is open, Ali.

And so, you know, Jesus scored his sixth goal in the last four.

That's as many in his previous 48.

Arsenal have been linked to Mbumo and Matthias Kunya, neither of whom are sort of classic, you know, out and out number nines, which is obviously the clamour

is for them.

What do you think they do?

Well, just on Gabriel Jesus, I was interested to know what happened in the mind of those people who still want to make Jesus saves gags, particularly around Christmas time when Gabriel Jesus does anything.

What do you do on the 1st of January when he's already had a couple of big moments over the festive period do you sort of reach for your phone to tweet and then go like ah that's probably been done that hasn't it um i with arsenal i think we just know now based on every

premier league club that buying ready-to-go goal scoring number nines who also do all the other stuff that top managers want them to do much of which has nothing to do with goal scoring but it's more about physicality running channels linking play pressing etc is really difficult and as arsenal know because they sometimes seem to get priced out of these types, quite expensive.

So I'm always a bit sympathetic with the we just need a better striker thing, because I think it's difficult to get one that's guaranteed to be someone that comes in straight away and makes them an excellent team.

That is the obvious position on the pitch that you look at, because defensively they are almost impeccable.

Set piecewise, they are incredible.

There's probably an extra midfielder to be found if you were really picking holes in the team.

You know, we talk about we will probably come on to talk about the Danny Olmo situation.

I think he's a fascinating player for any of the big six teams to be looking at if he is indeed available.

Because for me, he's the sort of player that does a bit of everything in terms of the modern game in midfield and in attack.

And, you know, if he's available for a cut price and he's clearly been in such good form for an extended period of time, I think he's a sort of January signing that actually could make a big impact to any of the teams towards the top of the league.

Yeah, we'll get on to Danny Moe in a bit.

Worth mentioning Buenari Airy as well, Mark, who made his first Premier League start at the same ground.

He became the Premier League's youngest ever player when he was 15 in 181 days in September 2022.

And he could, you know, do he could be sacker for a bit, couldn't he?

Yeah, I mean, I think it's just, you just glossed over the fact that a 15-year-old was playing in a Premier League game.

I mean, that is like, that is absolutely mental to think that just imagine what you were doing at 15 and playing in.

I'd have been so spotty.

I'd have been so spotty and insecure.

Just wanted to hide, I imagine.

That's not so shit.

I'm going to be that part of it as well.

Yeah, but the fact that he was sort of trusted to play and it was only a cameo, I think, if I remember rightly, sort of back then.

But the fact that he's been so highly rated

by Arsenal, you know, for it, it feels like for years.

And it's been...

a lot of hype around him as he's been coming through the academy.

I think it is is only right that you have these sort of spaces and opportunities.

Otherwise,

where does he end up?

How does he develop?

So I thought

more in keeping with Arsenal's first 30 minutes, he kind of got better as the game went on and eventually won that duel with

Lewis Potter, wasn't it, that was playing as sort of left back.

So yeah, I mean, he's very talented player.

I thought Thomas Party in midfield was really strong for Arsenal as well.

I thought he was maybe the most important player in the game as Arsenal sort of grew in influence on it.

But yeah, clearly a big talent and trusted.

I know Sterling's been injured, but seems to be trusted more than Raheem Sterling anyway at the moment.

Mark mentioned the way that the fixtures have fallen for Brentford as being a benefit to their early points tally at home.

I think that Liverpool are fairly significantly better than Arsenal based on what we've seen so far this this season and clearly the likely winners of the league.

But if you were Arsenal or an Arsenal fan, you'd cling to the fact that similarly, when it comes to how the fixtures have fallen, they have played almost all of the top 10 teams away from home, and Liverpool have played almost all of the top 10 teams at home.

So, again, just in terms of that fixture list, that schedule, which does have quite a big impact, that's one of the few things that I'd be clinging to if I was an Arsenal fan when it comes to making up a six-point gap with Liverpool having a game in hand.

Right, Arsenal go to Brighton on Saturday.

Brentford go to Southampton in the Premier League this weekend.

Really, Liverpool-Manchester United Barry is

so interesting, but not because

anyone thinks that there'll be any other result than a Liverpool win, but it's more.

Someone tweeted us for the last point, going, Are there enough numbers to register the number of goals that Liverpool might score in this game?

Or could we expect the unexpected?

I don't expect the unexpected, but I will not be surprised if, should the unexpected unfold,

right, Liverpool have 23 points more than Manchester United at the halfway point of the season.

They're 13 places above them in the league table.

There is a quite obvious chasm, Grand Canyon in class

between the clubs on the pitch and off the pitch.

But

United were bobbins last season as well, well, but they knocked Liverpool out of the FA Cup.

They threw a stick in the spokes of their title run.

That I think began a run of seven games without a win.

And they pulled a huge performance out of nowhere, like nowhere, to beat Manchester City in the FA Cup final.

An FA Cup final they were incredibly lucky to be in because

they...

they probably shouldn't have got past Coventry in the semi-final.

So if they can do that last season, who's to say they can't do it again this season?

I don't expect it to happen, but it might.

If you were Ruben Amarin, Ali, how would you approach this game?

I'd be pretty worried.

I'd be pretty worried because it's a complete mess.

And particularly in the centre of the park, where Liverpool excel, and particularly at the back for Manchester United, where they look slow and unsure of themselves.

They're coming up against currently the best team in the world, the best attack in the world, slick, quick, incredible.

And, you know,

if you ask,

you know, should we expect the unexpected?

You know, for me, this is like asking, might

Fulham win at Anfield or Everton win at Anfield.

That's about where I see Manchester United at the moment.

I think you're doing Fulham a grave disservice there by comparing them to Manchester United.

Well, although, to be fair, Fulham had 10 men and just about held on for a point.

I mean, Liverpool had 10 men against Fulham, didn't they?

And, you know, Liverpool looked the better side in that one.

But I take your point, Barry.

Yes, that's rude to Fulham.

So basically, none of the individuals are playing particularly well, and the team as a unit is playing really poorly.

And they're playing, yeah, currently the best team in the world.

So I'd be

quaking, frankly.

But that's why I'm not a football manager.

I'm sure Mr.

Amarim has something up his sleeve and is probably feeling much more confident than the stats would suggest because managers tend to feel quite confident before before games.

I guess so.

I mean he can't play that Ericsson Casemiro midfield again, can he?

I think Fernando's back, isn't he, Mark?

Yeah, yeah.

No, I I don't think we'll we'll see that midfield again.

Well maybe Europa League game, but I don't think we'll see that again in the Premier League.

And he's not going to come out and say he made a complete mistake.

Maybe in the Masters maybe in the Masters six aside, we'll see Ericsson and Casemiro again.

That would be a welcome return.

i know people say there's too much football but if we bring back sort of the evening standard five aside

then um you know there's definitely room in the calendar uh for that uh but the fact he made the substitution after half an hour i don't think it really matters which player it was that got substituted he was admitting that he made a mistake the one sort of i think

maybe just piece of hope for united do you know they've got the second best defensive record away from home in the premier league this season they've only conceded they've only conceded 10 goals.

Tottenham have got the best defensive away record with nine goals conceded, and then Manchester United are second with 10 goals conceded.

So they don't actually, they don't score many goals, Manchester United, but they have managed to

be tight at the back at least defensively.

So a humiliation would feel unlikely despite the huge golf inquiry currently between the two teams.

The stats that Man Yu and Spurs have the two best way records defensively feels like a glitch in the matrix, doesn't it?

Given what is happening.

Just quickly, Mark, look, apparently, United want Victor Yokarez, who doesn't.

Apparently, they want Milos Kirkz from Bournemouth, who would cost about 60 million.

Rashford's got a new agent, apparently, or he says he might do to try and...

Yeah, I think he's denied that.

He has denied that.

He's denied that.

Okay.

And Xerxe might be wanted by Juve and a couple of others.

What movement do you expect at Old Trafford?

They do need to bring bring in some players but psr in the summer um there were suggestions that united were fairly close um to um you know well basically weren't able to do more business because of psr so yocares

for what 100 million 80 million 90 million whatever he would cost feels like that would be um a step too far in this window at least um

i think they do need to bring in some players the uh but any player that they've brought in over the last few years hasn't lived up to it anyway.

So, central midfield would be the area that I think they've been lacking for some time now.

You mentioned Casemiro and Ericsson as two that would be on big wages and just really passengers in that team.

I feel sorry for Amarim and as much as they're playing every three days at the moment.

So, he's had no real opportunity to bed in what he wants to do because it's just

play, recover, play again.

And that's not ideal for a new manager coming in.

And I do think he's a good manager.

And

in January, if they were to go out of the FA Cup, they've got Arsenal in their way.

The calendar might ease up for them that actually he can just then start coaching the team the way that he wants.

And the solution isn't always to just go and buy a load of new players.

I think you have to trust the coach to be able to coach these players in the first place.

I'm looking forward to seeing the moisification of Reuben Amerim as Manchester United manager because he came in, you know, handsome, black hair,

you know, full, all smiles, very, very charming.

And I fully expect that in six months' time he'll be completely grey, gaunt,

constantly frowning

and real chippy at press conferences instead of, you know, welcoming all comers and

answering their questions with a bit of joy de vivre.

Yesterday, Ali, I was on the radio, and just before I came on air, a Liverpool fan rang in to Natalie Sawyer and Dean Saunders on Talk Sport, utterly furious with Trent Alexander Arnold, and called him a rat and a traitor

for even considering

moving to Real Madrid.

I just wondered if you were on the same page with that corner.

I mean, obviously, people don't ring phone-ins to say, I don't really mind.

Like,

a mild-mannered phone-in would be the dream for me, but it was quite funny to hear that at the time.

But it feels like it's about to happen.

It feels like a really good idea for Trenton Alexander Arnold.

Yes, what a situation we find ourselves in with transfer reporting that someone so much as being reported to be considering a transfer to the team that's won the most Champions Leagues in the history of football

is both known somehow, but also such a disgraceful suggestion.

Yeah, I'd really like Trent Alexander Arnold to stay at Liverpool because I think he could have one of those lovely one-club careers that seems to happen more when we were all younger, but then lots of things seems to happen more when we were all younger that probably didn't.

And we love a one-club man, don't we?

And he's such an incredible player.

He's, you know, he has been through, and I think come out the other side of quite a lot of criticism and scrutiny.

I think sometimes fairly and sometimes unfairly he was held up as the reasons for poor runs of Liverpool form.

And it's great to be able to see an excellent Liverpool side with Trent playing brilliantly again.

So, I mean, I'm not a huge fan of Real Madrid as a concept, as a club.

And so I personally

don't see some of the appeal that I think most footballers see in playing for Real Madrid and being, quote-unquote, a Galactico.

I guess the only other thing that springs to mind here is I've spoken on previous podcast tactics type pods that I've done, that Trent is probably the closest player to David Beckham, albeit he plays right back and Beckham played in a right midfield role.

We've discussed previously whether Beckham in the modern game might have been a right back because he was hardworking and he delivered amazing crosses from deep.

And it'd be quite nice to see Trent doing the sorts of things that Becks was doing in white over in Real Madrid.

But overall, it is a disgrace and he shouldn't even consider leaving Liverpool.

God, imagine if Beckham had been a right back.

What would happen to Gary Neville?

Super Sunday would be so different, wouldn't it?

Anyway,

Newcastle on a great run.

Spurs that have no defenders.

Eddie Howe's outthought Ange before.

Mike says, I'd like to hear Mark's take on Tottenham.

And well, Ange last January after losing to Newcastle, Liverpool, and Arsenal.

So look, he's confident that Spurs will beat Tamworth at least.

What's your current read on Tottenham?

Well, yeah, if they lose to Tamworth,

you might struggle to find the sort of Ange believers left.

Max has

like that.

That Japanese

might be looking at one.

But

inside the stadium, there's not been that many people calling for Ange to go.

There's a...

I think a kind of a belief actually that he's just a good guy and that

we're not going to call him out um even if things have got really bad i think the the issues lie way above uh postacoglou and have done for the best part of 25 years daniel levy's um been in charge it's coming up 25 it will be 25 years a quarter of a century um later on this year i don't have any problem with kind of the nfl the concerts the go-karting there was a squid games thing going um around the stadium uh was it last week or certainly recently that I didn't quite understand because I've never watched it.

But again, there were plenty of people excited.

Sorry, did they have snipers high in the stand shooting people in sort of boiler suits who were trying to run from one end of the pitch to the other?

Is that why Udogi went down, Barry?

I'm not sure.

Yeah, it might well have been that.

But there's a direct link between wage bill expenditure and success in football.

And Tottenham have tried to do it on the cheap for just too long now.

According to Deloitte sort of last figures for the 22-23 season, Spurs have got the lowest wages to revenue ratio in the Premier League, which is quite good in some respects.

And I'm sure Dame Levy's patting himself on the back.

But there's no fan who wants to be top or bottom, depending on how you kind of look at that, of that table.

You know, that in itself, I think, shows a lack of ambition.

They wanted Trossard, they wanted Neto, they wanted Louis Diaz, they got Danjuma, Solomon and Timo Werner instead to play on in sort of those left midfield positions.

Newcastle is a category A game this weekend, which means if you want to stand behind the goal, it's £88.50.

If you want to sit behind the goal, it's £98.50.

And if you want a half decent seat in sort of the sort of on the side, it's over £100.

So in terms of sort of ticket prices, if they're not the highest in Europe, they're certainly going to be right at the very sort of towards the top of that.

And there's no sign that they're kind of showing this ambition in terms of wage expenditure.

You know, I was there on Sunday, and you got Fraser Forster and Reggie on, and you know, players that shouldn't Tim O'Verner, players that I don't think should be playing for Tottenham.

Um, if you've got this kind of

you know

wage bill,

they've got this option in the wages to really go for it, Max.

You know, like they, and I'm not saying it has to be stupid levels, but they, you know, when you look at Arsenal having Kai Havertz and Jesu signing them from Man City and, you know, from Chelsea, Tottenham are buying players from Udanace and Emperley and Everton and Bournemouth and Nottingham Forest.

You remember, even a few years ago, they could have had Grealish

and tried to just hardball Aston Villa into this situation where in the event in the end Aston Villa were able to say no even though they were in the championship at the time to Tottenham and then he goes to Man City for a hundred million so this has been going on for way too long there was a talk about Whiteheart Lane maybe Tottenham didn't have that option to really go for it but the promise was that once the new stadium was there they'd be able to compete

they're not competing with the very best teams and you know you can go back even when harry Kane was up front, you have this generational sort of privileged position of getting an elite world-class centre-forward for free.

And they thought the best option was to not have a backup for him.

He played 60 games a season and Tottenham thought that they could get by with just Harry Kane.

They'd then reach semi-finals and finals and Kane was absolutely knackered going into them games because he played every week.

So there's a real lack of ambition right at the top.

So even if Ange goes, I don't expect kind of any miracle to suddenly happen in terms of replacement.

And they go into this game against Newcastle with Amanda Staveley, who was previously part of sort of that the Newcastle takeover,

being strongly linked with sort of getting involved at Tottenham.

So I don't know if it's sort of be careful what you wish for,

but something needs to change, I think, at the top.

Would that be

some kind of

nation

I mean, who's Amanda Staveley talking, you know, working for now?

Do we know?

We don't know.

We're not entirely sure.

Um, and she's been quite coy on the links to Tottenham, but says that she would like to get back involved in the Premier League.

Um, there's been quite a lot of US NFL owners that have been linked with

Spurs

as well.

So, I mean, who knows?

But

most of the fans, you can't speak for all fans because everybody feels sort of differently about it, but most just want to see a change at the top because they just see it now as a lack of ambition, you know, first in the queue for the furlough money, season ticket prices just ridiculously high, taking away the seniors' concessions.

You know, there's a lot of things at the club that people are not happy with, and Angie's a long way down that list, even though things are not going well on the pitch.

In the corresponding fixture in September, it was sort of textbook spurs performance insofar as they completely dominated a newcastle side that weren't playing anywhere near as well as they are at the moment and still contrived to lose 2-1

uh with newcastle winning through goals on the counter by taking advantage of tottenham's high line so i think

Tottenham could get Haydn this weekend.

Oh, I do too.

Yeah.

Given Newcastle's excellent form, I couldn't agree more.

All right, that'll do for part one.

Part two.

We'll round up the Premier League preview and do some EFL as well.

HiPod fans of America.

Max here.

Barry's here too.

Hello.

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A proper football journalist, mate.

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Welcome to part two of the Guardian Football Weekly.

So, Ali, Man City following up Leicester away with West Ham at home.

I mean, that is the dream, isn't it?

For a team completely out of form?

It should be.

I thought that many times during their extended poor run.

And

I guess the hope for them is that the win last time out

kind of washes away some of the just awkwardness in their play, the lack of certainty,

the almost unprecedented lack of certainty and

lack of execution in both boxes.

They come up against a West Ham team that just lost 5-0 at home with a manager that seemingly is kind of on his last legs at West Ham and they should win.

I didn't see much in their win against, who was the Damish?

Leicester

to suggest that they're in any way, you know, distance themselves from this funk they were in.

Leicester played quite well and

were, you know, with better finishing,

probably should have got something.

So I wouldn't be a bit surprised if west ham uh did a number on them bowing being out's a big one though isn't it for west ham i mean yeah he carries that counter-attacking threat that ability to run in behind that titty have really struggled to contain and so um

yeah i do wonder where west ham's goals are going to come from now bowing's out as well you're saying phil crook can't run in behind mark i'm saying it's not his main strength but

i love him anyhow mical antonio says he's grateful to be alive after uh breaking his leg in a car accident.

He was discharged from hospital on Tuesday, more than three weeks after undergoing surgery following the crash.

He said, every year, around this time, I'm asked what I'm grateful for every year.

I've struggled to find the right words, but this year I know exactly what I'm grateful for being alive.

I've spent so many years taking life for granted.

I made plans for the next day, the next year, always assuming tomorrow was guaranteed.

I've seen close friends pass away, witnessed others face near-death experiences, and even then I didn't fully grasp just how precious life is.

So it's a healthy dose of perspective.

From the other fixtures, Barry, anything that takes your eye?

Arsenal go to Brighton, who on their day could easily, not easily, but could beat Arsenal.

But Brighton could really do with a win here to jumpstart what had looked like a promising season, but has gone very flat.

They haven't won in seven.

They've drawn five, lost two.

They're not playing as well as they can.

So Arsenal will be hoping to meet that Brighton, one presumes.

But if Brighton can get their act together, they could be a very, very stern test for Arsenal.

But on Monday, long time to wait, but it's the Nuno Derby Wolves against Nottingham Forest.

Forrest flying at the moment.

Yeah, it is a remarkable turnaround from just being part of that relegation discussion.

Even the start of this season, I think there would have been some that fancied Forrest to be around the bottom three.

Instead, they're top three and pushing for Champions League.

He's done a remarkable job.

They've got a team that is very familiar with each other.

They don't make that many changes.

But it's almost not the same formation, but it's very similar, isn't it?

To the way the Wolves had their success really strong defensively.

quick and slick on the counter-attack and where they're Jimenez up front leading the line you've got a similar enough striker really in Chris Wood doing it for Forrest.

So hopefully, I'm sure Nuno will get a decent enough reception from the Wolves fans.

He did

a brilliant job and took them into Europe.

But obviously Wolves need the points for their own reasons.

No Kunya

for them, which will be a blow.

Still seems like a weird fever dream that Nuno was Wolves manager in the championship with Diogo Jotta and Ruben Neves in that team.

You're right.

Matas Kunya, by the way, two-game ban for ripping off someone's glasses.

Is that enough?

I don't know.

Dan says, since you stopped mentioning Sheffield Wednesday on EFL pods, they've been doing all right.

So just wondering if you could do us a favour and skip over Josh Windas' wonder goal.

Yes, Ali, against Derby, it was absolutely brilliant, wasn't it?

So good, so good.

Windas with one of the great from his own half goals that I can remember and lots comparing it to Yebeckham's, Yarooney's, etc.

Just sort of latching on to a clearance.

And one of those where the first touch is,

it's not great.

It's a difficult bit of control, but he just sort of knocks it in front of him.

And in speeding towards the ball to latch onto it, he realises he's going to have a go.

And there's still...

obviously so much to do from there but the the weight of it the trajectory of it um just dropping in perfectly over a goalkeeper who up until the very last second, still thinks he might be able to get there, which makes it visually even better.

The only thing

I kind of felt like, unless the crowd effects were being dampened on the clip I saw, it kind of felt like Hillsbrugger should have gone more nuts for what was presumably one of the best goals they've seen, certainly since Adam Reach stopped playing for them and scoring worldies every couple of months.

He ran to Barry Bannon in the stands.

So I like the idea that maybe

Bannon had pointed out that the goalkeeper was was regularly off his line, on the break.

I don't know.

Absolutely incredible strike execution and for it to be a Windas as well, because people remember his dad, Dean, so fondly as a player and scorer of another iconic EFL goal in a playoff final at Wembley for Hull against Bristol City back in the day.

Yeah, and afterwards, Windas said, you know, the guy was saying, I can't remember what.

I think it was a radio station of some sort, said, you know, some strike.

He went, yeah, you've just got to be good, haven't you really, to do that?

It's got a good technique.

I've been practicing for quite a long time and kicking balls since I was three, so yeah, just got to be good at it.

Um, Baz, huge win for Sunderland over Sheffield United last night.

Some game, wasn't it?

Yeah, it was a really good game, and a massive win for Sunderland, who on a day that uh Leeds and Burnley were both held.

Uh, so for them to beat Sheffield United, a little bit below them, West Brom battered Preston and Borough beat Hull.

So uh, it's it

makes things even more interesting at the top of the championship.

Sunderland, just a very good team full of exciting young players.

Ele Mienda scored last night.

His first goal in quite some time.

I think he'd been shipping a bit of criticism from Sunderland fans, which is a bit harsh considering he's only 19.

But there you go.

Things might have been different if Kiefer Moore had scored the penalty he won when Luke O'Nein, who would go on to score a bit of a comedy-owned goal.

But Moore just looked so nervous when he was waiting to take the penalty.

You kind of knew, yeah, he's not going to score.

He really did.

Yet, he was made to wait quite a long time, and you could just see the confidence drain out of his body.

It was not a good penalty, was it?

No, no.

So, yeah, massive, massive win for Sunderland.

It's a shame they lost against Stoke in the previous game because Stoke aren't very good for now, at least.

But yeah, huge win.

Yeah, I mean, you mentioned Leeds, you know, they scored really late on.

They got a penalty against Blackburner.

Willie Nontosov hugged the ref while appealing for the penalty.

He was like, that's got to be a penalty.

The ref was right next to him.

He's like hugging him.

And the ref went, oh, go on then.

But Blackburn equalised later.

Ali, look, you've watched.

you know, every game in the championship this season, I presume.

You've got Leeds on 52 points, Burnley on 49, Chevy United 49, and Sunderland 47.

So you feel it's two from those.

From everything you've seen, who's your money on?

I think leads are the best team every time I watch them.

To me anyway, and sometimes it feels like their fans don't agree and hold them to even higher standards.

But to me, every time I watch them, they look,

first and foremost, so incredibly strong defensively.

And that's not the sexiest thing in the world.

But for a team that attacks in the numbers that they do with really attacking fullbacks, three attacking midfielder slash wingers behind a striker, and normally one of the centre midfielders breaking forward as well that team should be quite vulnerable on the break and they're just not at all and the

the defenders that they have from uh Rodon and Strauk at the centre backs but also Ampadu now that he's fit Tanaka who's been probably the best signing in the championship this season that the Japanese midfielder they are so unbelievably strong in all senses on the pitch

and they have the quality at the top of the pitch the speed and the combination play so I'd be really surprised if they didn't finish in the top two.

I think that they should, you know, barring disaster, finish first.

And then it's really difficult with the other sides.

You know, Burnley have this absolutely unbelievable defensive record, just nine goals conceded in 25 games.

In terms of goals conceded per game, that is a better record than Chelsea's Premier League record defence under Mourinho.

So that's where they're at at the moment.

James Trafford in goal is,

I was going to say say, papering over some cracks.

They're an excellent defence, and he's making them look even better with some excellent performances.

And Cheff United, probably just leaking a little bit because they had to kind of patch together a squad over the summer, which was heavy on quality in the starting 11, but not heavy on depth.

And I think, you know, winless over the Christmas period, maybe starting to see that if you take out their starting centre midfielders, Sousa and Arblaster, you lose Harry Souter, who's been a rock at the back to injury.

And all of a sudden, you probably find it hard to maintain the same levels.

And then there's Sunderland, who I thought might might drop away from the pack but with that win last night have have shown that they're absolutely not doing that and as Barry says that they are also really really good side so it's definitely in my eyes two from those four I had high hopes for Burrough even after a slow start to the season but there's just something that just holds them back whether it's something tactical or psychological I'm still not 100% sure but I'm pretty confident they'll finish in the top six.

So there's, in my eyes, two from four and then probably one playoff spot available for any number of teams, including Sheffield Wednesday.

Plymouth Argyle at bottom 19 points.

Wayne Rooney parted company about a minute after we stopped recording the last pod.

I just wonder what you make of his tenure there, Ali, and if you know if this is the end of his opportunity, you know, his opportunities as a manager, or if there was something else there, and he's because he's so desperate to be good at this, isn't he?

That sounds so patronising, but you know what I mean.

That kind of reflects how I see it as well.

He really seems genuinely desperate to be a good manager.

Unfortunately, he's in his results so far, particularly in the last candidate year with Birmingham and with Plymouth Argyle, he's seems to be lacking some pretty important qualities of a football manager,

specifically setting up a defense.

Like, if you're Argyle, and they, you know, we should say they almost certainly have a bottom three budget.

They almost certainly have a a bottom three, five squad in terms of quality and depth.

So, you know, staying up would be an achievement.

And up until recently, they were not in the relegation zone and close to safety, now four points off it.

But defensively, they're one of the worst teams I've ever seen at this level.

And

that was the same with his Birmingham side, who...

conceded two goals a game over his 15 games.

Away from home, they are certainly the joint worst team I've ever seen at this level with a rotherh united side who also failed to to to win a game basically away from home for for a couple of years 13 away games two points uh 11 defeats only three goals scored in 13 away from home and it was the same at birmingham as well so here's a manager that unfortunately twice in a row now has come in has given some decent quotes around changing the style of play and playing attractive attacking football, which has only been visible in flashes, but certainly not consistently.

And when it comes to actually setting a foundation to allow his team to play nice attacking football, has completely failed both defensively and on the road.

And it just makes it too difficult to stay up.

I did watch Rotherham's first away win in two years because it was obviously at Cambridge with a 90th minute deflected shot that rolled into the back of the net.

How's Frank Lampard settling in at Cov?

Mixed start, I'd say.

He got a couple of wins early on.

The Christmas period hasn't been too kind to them.

He's missing a couple of attacking players.

He instantly got a huge return out of Efren Mason Clark, who was one of their summer signings from Peterborough.

And then Mason Clark picked up an injury as missed the last two games.

So, I mean,

jury's still out, I think it's fair to say.

And Rob Edwards at Lou, they lost again, didn't they?

It sort of seems, yeah, it seems extraordinary, you know, for how sort of how, I don't know how close they were in the end, but it felt like they were close to staying in the Premier League.

Maybe they went down by 50 points but this drop is is surprising to me at least yes um i'm surprised that he's still the luton manager as we record the this thursday morning because it was a another defeat uh this time at home which is even more alarm bells ringing because it's it's at home where they've picked up almost all of their points this season with 10 defeats out of 12 on the road this is not what should happen when you're a relegated premier league team with parachute payments even with the understanding that luton aren't a typical team that's come down from the Premier League with parachute payments in terms of splashing the cash and signing players on big wages.

They are a shambles, I'm afraid, and particularly defensively.

And in possession,

it's pretty agricultural, just swing in as many crosses as we can, get the ball forward to two strikers, to sometimes three, who are pretty dangerous in Adebayo and Morris.

It's really unimpressive.

They've lost three games in a row.

One of the stranger things that I've seen in the last week or so during three game weeks in the EFL was Edwards doing his post-match interview in the tunnel near the away dressing room yesterday, where the Norwich team were playing Believe by Cher in celebrating their win.

And the lyrics to that song aren't great for a manager who's seemingly on the cusp of being sacked.

And I can't quite believe that the club put that out because it is really, really quite embarrassing at a time where things aren't great do you believe in life after love yeah yeah no okay i can feel something inside me saying i really don't think you're strong enough no

right i see i mean i didn't know by that time i'm just going do do do i'm just in the moment i'm lost i'm just dancing like crazy at the disco alley um anyway league one i know that uh the one advantage of uh losing at home to reading is that if you try and find the highlights there are so many cambridge reading courses that it's actually very hard to get to them and you can you can avoid them uh but i did see them but look more importantly give us if you can ali eight just a quick minute on league one and league two how it's all standing for for those listeners who don't pay any attention to it that makes me chuckle because as someone who is regularly googling things like uh leeds results or uh chef united results in in my research there are a couple of clubs like cambridge results where you just get university stuff wimbledon results where you just get tennis stuff and cheltenham results where you get horse racing so there's a few clubs that really wind wind me up because of what their name is also associated with uh what was it league one and league two in a in a minute yes please brilliant good yeah fantastic i mean league one more at not the top 20 of course yeah uh league one we've got wickham birmingham and wrexham um within two points of each other at the top and then huddersfield five back from that uh certainly again because huddersfield are in good form to be fair i'd say two from four in that front Definitely two playoff spots still up for grabs and quite a few teams going for them.

Leighton Orient have flown up the table from, what, 20th, 21st to 8th in the space of about a month.

Four wins in a row, playing absolutely brilliant.

Richie Wellens, a manager that I rate very, very highly.

Relegation scrap is pretty ugly, as you well know, Max, with Burton, Cambridge, Shrewsbury, and Crawley.

They've been in the bottom four

as a quad for most of the season and have quite a lot of work to do to get out of it.

But a few clubs, Bristol Rovers, Northampton, and surprisingly, Peterborough, kind of looking over their shoulder.

League two is all about Walsall, who are a great reminder of

they're just the best thing about covering the lower leagues.

A team like Walsall who are not bankrolled by American superstar celebrities.

They've just got it right in terms of appointing a young manager in Matt Sadler, giving him time and patience, building him a squad in his image with great energy, a bit of Nelson experience as well.

They've got a loany from Stoke called Nathan Lowe, who has been the player of League Two so far this season.

And they are 12 points clear at the top of League Two with a game in hand and seemingly winning every which way, brilliant defensively, able to score goals from open play and set pieces.

And just, yeah, probably for me, the story of the whole EFL so far this season.

And just, I love everything about it.

In Walsall's come from behind win against Notts County,

their defender Evan Weir

pulled off a quite astonishing goal-line clearance with a totally intentional back heel, which is well worth seeking out if you can be bothered.

And I'd also like to say, Ali, I think your sidekick George would be very upset you didn't mention Oxford United's

third consecutive win under Gary Rowe at Millwall, his former club.

Well, maybe there's value in holding some of that good stuff back for people who want to come and listen to Not the Top 20 because, yeah, there's plenty of stories, aren't there?

I mean, Mark Robbins is in at Stoke, and that is absolutely fascinating.

Someone who's done probably the best job of any efl manager over the last decade with coventry joining a club that is basically now known for being a graveyard for good managers um but but rowitt's gone in at oxford three wins in a row has got them five points clear of relegation a lot of question marks asked when they sacked des buckingham it seemed very harsh um based on what he had done for the club and the fact he was a boyhood fan with a you know real connection to the fan base and then rowitt comes in safe pair of hands for the level and uh rattles off three wins in a row.

So I think that everyone's pretty happy now.

All right, that'll do for part two.

Part three, we'll wake Mark up and we'll do the Danny Olmo conundrum.

HiPod fans of America, Max here.

Barry's here too.

Hello.

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Welcome to part three of the Guardian Football Weekly.

Steven says, Dear Max and Barry, can you please ring up Dr.

Sid Lowe and ask him what's going on with Danny Olmo?

It seems that Barca failed to register him and that he's now a free agent.

I'm curious to know whether Olmo will walk and whether Sid thinks that this will further damage Barca's prestige in the sense that players will become more and more reluctant to sign for them.

Happy New Year to everyone at Guardian Towers.

Thank you, Stephen.

Mark, you've offered to step into the mighty shoes of Sid Lowe to give us the SP on this.

I mean, yeah, I mean, this is classic Daniel Levy, this, isn't it?

Not able to get Sid to bring me in.

Yeah,

I was actually meant to be going out with Sid

with Graham Hunter after the Real Madrid AC Milan game and we promised there was promise of some ham and all sorts but they got held up because

the match reports took longer and me and a friend just had to disappear.

Were you ghosted by Sid Lowe?

Now you know what it's like to WhatsApp him.

Yeah

exactly.

But yes back to Daniel Mo.

So spoke earlier on about Tottenham and the way that they treat their wage bill and are very careful

with their expenditure.

At the other end of that, you've got Barcelona

a couple of years ago pulled every lever they had imaginable to fit in all the players that they'd signed.

They haven't managed to sort of rectify that situation fully, but that hasn't stopped them continuing to sign players, including Danielmo, who

was one of the stars of Spain's Euro 2024 success, came through initially at Barcelona, ended up playing in Croatia, and he's come back to his boyhood club via Leipzig.

But Barcelona couldn't afford him under financial fair play.

They used an emergency appeal to sign him in the summer, which gave them...

leeway until the end of December and January to register him properly with La Liga.

They haven't done enough in those months to get themselves into a financial position where they're able to afford Danny Olmo, which inferior has left them in a shocking position where

in Olmo's contract, Barcelona are on the hook to pay all of the transfer fee to RB Leipzig.

all of Danny Olmo's contract and he's able to leave for free if they if they don't register him.

Danny Olmo as a Barcelona fan doesn't want that to happen.

But as it stands, Barcelona cannot register Olmo.

It's got to the stage where Laporta, the president, is coming under increasing attack, and there are people sort of, you know,

votes in no confidence and potentially looking at sort of bringing in a new president or at least having a vote on who should be

the new president.

But yeah, as it stands, they can't sign Danny Olmo, who will be left with two options to sit on the sidelines until the summer or to go on loan Barcelona have tried a number of things including selling VIP boxes at Camp Nu

for the next 20 years as another way of kicking their financial pain further down and sort of kicking that cam further down at the road they've already sold sort of media rights and various other bits of the club, just anything that they can.

At some stage, they might have to to look at sort of a really hard decision in terms of they've got a lot of talented players and that maybe one or two of them need to go and yet i was looking at spanish newspapers um yesterday and barcelona have still been linked with any number of players including nico williams um and yeah there's just this obsession um with with signing players yeah frankie de jong is one of those that earns a lot of money that maybe isn't needed when you've got hedry and and Gavi and

a lot of talented midfielders.

They can't get him

off the wage bill.

Nobody will come in for him.

He doesn't really want to leave.

He quite likes living in Barcelona and sort of playing occasionally for them.

So they are in a real pickle.

Nobody really knows where it's kind of going to end up.

I mean, at some, yeah, at some stage, like Barcelona are heading for just financial destruction.

And that might be not for a decade.

Sure.

that's what I wanted to ask.

Well, a couple of things.

One is, does it make a difference what Ormo does as to whether they have Barcelona have to pay that money?

I mean, like, they're gonna have to pay that money anyway, regardless whether he goes on loan somewhere or he sits on the reserves, whatever, right?

That's those two things are set.

There's no link between what he does and the money they need to pay.

No, no, so I mean, Barcelona

I mean, I think in theory, Barcelona can afford the transfer fee, but they can't afford it kind of on paper in terms of sort of financial fair play.

So um, it's not a case of them sort of um being unable to pay Leipzig, it's that they're going to have to sort of pay this money, and he's an important player.

Um, but this goes back to the point: like, did Barcelona need him in the first place?

He is a very good player, but I've already mentioned all the midfielders they've got.

You've got Yamao on one wing and Rafinha on the other, um, and Lewandowski up front.

So, um, at a time when you maybe need to cut back, um, yeah, it wasn't the wisest of signings, but he is a Barcelona boy.

He had done so well in the Euros.

They didn't get Nico Williams.

They just can't help themselves at times from just buying good players, which is not a bad thing.

No, but my other question is, you know, you say they are facing financial ruin.

Do you think that, because there is just part of me that thinks it's Barcelona, you know, they'll find a way.

Or is this, you know, this is sort of

they will go out of business type?

It's hard to say because I agree that Barcelona and Barcelona and so they'll always find these new levers to pull new bits of the club to sell off

you know do more tours do do more of everything and and just sort of raise the funds that way but when you've already spent money that's sort of supposed to be coming into the club in sort of the next ten years, I mean, that's not a good sign.

I mean, maybe sort of, you know, the bottom falls out of football and actually it's it's a sort of shrewd thing and that the media rights won't be worth as much in a decade's time.

But I find that hard to believe.

And also from like the VIP boxes, I mean, that is, you know, that kind of hospitality area

is a good source of income.

And if you're prepared to sell them for the next 20 years now,

presumably that's going to be a huge discount to anybody that buys them.

And so the problem will just come for, I suppose Laporta will say, well, that'll be the next president's issue.

And I just want to win now.

But he's coming under increasing fire at the moment and would do well, I think, to sort of ride it out.

Producer Joel notes that Laminyamar could still be playing by the end of that 20-year VIP

experience.

But I would just say, just to reiterate what Ali was saying earlier on, like Olmo, if he is available on loan, becomes the most interesting player in the market.

He would suit just about anybody and because of his versatility and I'm looking at Manchester City thinking like if they need a boost to sort of you know keep them sort of going and honest for the next five six months then I couldn't think of anybody better really to sort of just liven up that attack which is one of the issues that City have faced in recent months.

A few emails to finish with.

Michael says, hello Max and friends.

What a delight to hear two of my favourite things in this life, choral music and gentle football banter, combine on your recent episode.

I've put together some suggestions below to help Barry on his new music journey.

I can't remember the context of why we were discussing choral music, do you?

I had turned on the radio and

heard some choral music and was quite enchanted by it.

Ah, that's right.

He's given you some recommendations.

Let's start with O.G.

Mozart.

His requiem is a towering groundbreaking achievement, setting the standard for composers to follow.

I see Barry is starting to take notes.

Think the Hungarian national team of the 50s.

If you want something more transcendental, try Allegri's Miserere, a single piece for chamber choir.

The soprano's high C is pure individual genius.

Think Bergkamp's goal for Argentina in 98 against the Netherlands.

For full immersion, try Brahm's complete choral works, a four-hour marathon.

Covers everything from church music to German drinking songs.

Much like following your team during a title-winning season, full of highs and lows, twists and turns, but nevertheless enthralling.

If you fancy hearing some choral work in the flesh in London, I'll recommend the Covent Garden Chorus, which I sing in.

Find us on Instagram.

Hope this helps the big man find some Zen moments in 2025.

Thanks all, Michael.

So thank you, Michael.

Greatly appreciated.

Thank you, Michael.

Sholto says, Dear Max Barry and Football Weekly podcasters, while on a recent study trip to China, I was hoping to catch up on what sounded like a fantastic weekend of football.

So I tried tuning into the Football Weekly podcast, only to find the Great Firewall of China had blocked the podcast feed and the Guardian's website.

You can imagine my disappointment as an Australian to miss out on what was sure to be Football Weekly's eulogy for our boy Ange after a 5-0 drubbing of the saints.

The experience made me think that in this time of firewalls, tariffs, and geopolitical tensions, a Guardian proxy into China would be an incredibly valuable resource and opportunity for a diplomatic antidote.

could be something that would not only help Chinese football fans immensely, but also contribute to international relations in only the way Football Weekly can.

You never know, it may even open up opportunities for a Guardian Football Weekly Sino tour.

To which end, I can thoroughly recommend that Barry try the spicy dumpling soup hot pot at Chendu Tianfu International Airport, the benefits of which I only truly discovered 12 hours into the flight back to Sydney.

Anyway, once again, a great thank you from down under.

Kind regards, Mr.

Sholto Maud.

So there we go, Barry.

Do you think we could

ease relations across the great East-West divide in the the world?

I

can't imagine anyone who would do it better, really.

We are a study of diplomacy.

Yeah.

Okay.

Well, we'll consider it.

We just need to be careful who we consort with

in China after what happened to Prince Andrew in recent weeks.

Yes.

I mean, we don't we don't really he doesn't really set the standard for what we're trying to achieve, I would suggest.

Yes, that is true.

Chris says, happy new year, Max Barry and the gang i was very excited to see mark langdon on today's podcast since i've been thinking about his trip to korea while i'm interested in the purpose of his trip i'm significantly more interested in hearing about his culinary experience did he try kim chi

I did try it, Max.

It's absolutely rank.

It was the first thing I ate when I got to Korea.

I was sort of forced into it when I went to dinner about an hour and a half after landing.

But the Koreans eat it for breakfast, lunch and dinner, which I find very offensive.

I mean, if you're going to eat it, at least um you know leave it for dinner um there were some interesting um sort of items that appeared on on the on my dinner plate um the fish eggs um i'd ordered steamed egg which is a bit like scrambled egg and and perfectly acceptable um food um to eat but it there was just these fish eggs that appeared in the middle of it um that looked I mean, I'd say it looked a bit like a penis, I would say, and something that you might eat

and sort of eye on a celebrity.

While walking past one street vendor, there was probably the worst smell I've ever come across.

Asked my friend who'd lived in Korea for 10 years, he laughed and said, oh, that's the silkworms,

which he said is the worst thing he's ever eaten as well.

I avoided those.

But I'm just, I'm glad you've asked me some food questions because

Chinese politics and classical music, definitely not in my wheelhouse.

I mean, I know more about Max Allegri than Gregorio Allegri, that's for sure.

Oh, well, at least you got back.

You got back for a wholesome Christmas dinner.

You know, a full plate of as many meats.

Yeah, triple meat.

Triple meat.

Triple meat.

Good stuff.

Okay, come on then.

Hit us.

What were they?

Turkey, beef and ham.

Amazing.

Is that not normal?

That feels pretty standard, man.

No, I think, I don't, I don't think you need all three.

I would say.

You know, I'd generally go for one.

But anyway, you know, each, I presume no vegetables, just turkey, turkey, beef, pigs in blankets, sausage meat, Yorkshire pudding, roast potatoes.

I did that, I did, um, I went to the trendy Devonshire pub on New Year's Eve, and their buttered carrots are

probably the most acceptable piece of veg that I've ever eaten.

I'm not sure how unhealthy they are, um, but uh, very, very good carrots.

Um, yeah, you don't hear me say that too often.

Great pint of Guinness in the trendy Devonshire pub, although it's very expensive as well.

Guinness and carrots.

Stick to the toucan.

Stick to the toucan.

Love the toucan.

Mark's perfectly acceptable foods to eat would be a great live show feature, so we'll work on that.

And that'll do for today's pod.

Thanks, everybody.

Thank you, Barry.

Thanks, Max.

Thanks, Ali.

Thank you, Max.

Cheers, Mark.

Thank you, Max.

Football Weekly is produced by Joel Grove.

Our executive producer is Phil Maynard.

This is The Guardian.