What now for Manchester United after another new low? – Football Weekly podcast

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Hello and welcome to the Guardian Football Weekly.

Is this the end for Eric Ten Haag?

Manchester United losing at home doesn't really feel like big news anymore, but they were torn apart in the first half against Spurs.

Tottenham of course missed enough chances to make their fans fear the worst but even Angie's men couldn't pass up this opportunity.

A couple of great games on Saturday Arsenal being pegged back by James Van Bast and Justin before finally Arsenal got past Mads Hermanson in the Leicester goal and then Cole Palmer's extraordinary four goals against Brighton and their highest of high lines.

No rodery, no win for Man City, Liverpool top after victory at Wolves.

Ipswich get a deserved point at home to Villa.

And there's a crucial first win for Sean Deish.

Brentford leave it later than usual to take the lead against West Ham before being pegged back.

And Nuno is sad about penalties not given and given at the city ground.

All that plus Jens Lehman and his chainsaw.

Your questions and that's today's Guardian Football Weekly.

On the panel today, Barry Glendenning, good morning.

Hi Max.

Hello Lucy Ward.

Hi Max.

And a warm welcome to Jonathan Wilson.

Morning, how are you doing?

I'm very well.

Hemel says, have we now officially moved from Ladzits Spurs to Ladzitz United?

Mikkel says, not an actual question.

I just want five minutes of non-stop Wilson hammering United.

And Harry says, genuinely, how bad does that have to get for Manchester United before they sack Eric Ten Hag?

The board look intent on backing him no matter what.

There's always a debate.

with every football match, one team good, one team bad.

But this did Wilson feel significant for Ten Hag, especially after that midweek draw with 20, you know, when Christian Erickson came out and said the opposition wanted it more and we were sort of waiting for a reaction.

I mean, it did feel bad but it also felt really predictable.

I mean it's not like we haven't seen this before from United.

So there's a United sporting mate of mine he messed me last night well he messed me at half time is that the worst 45 minutes we've seen on a 10 hog

and I was like well there was when you were final down to Brentford there was when you let in six and a half at Anfield there was the entirety of the gaming's palace last season this is just how United are and if they weren't called Manchester United if they didn't play at Old Trafford if they didn't wear the red shirt or the white shorts you just think they're an average mid-table side.

I mean, they were,

they were, I mean, that first half was truly dreadful.

And so the two things that strike me about United at the minute, and specifically United under Ten Haag, is A, they concede goals you don't see any other team conceding.

Goals that just look weird.

Goals that happen, you sort of have to sort of play them back in your head and think, how on earth did that come about?

No other team in the Premier League, I'd suggest even in the championship, lets opposition players just run 50 or 60 yards unchallenged.

That's a basic structural problem.

And it happened twice.

The first two Tottenham goals both came from somebody running.

I know Van der Bend's fast, but he's not.

He's not Billy Wiz.

I mean,

he's almost Billy Wiz.

It's just, you know, the idea that nobody can.

I don't know where Kobi Menu even was.

You couldn't see him on the picture.

Then Ugate,

who I'm afraid has fitted in all too well.

He looks very much at home at United.

Just sort of just drifting to the left of the picture as Van der Went's running straight through the middle.

So that's a.

Something goes wrong habitually structurally.

But now I was at the Palace game last weekend, where they actually played pretty well the first hour.

There should have been two or three in love after an hour.

Then Ten Hague made a substitutions.

And Glasner also made substitutions.

So it was partly that Glassdoor's substitutions improved Palace, but Ten Hague substitutions made United worse.

And I felt it was the same yesterday, that United hadn't got back into it, but they'd sort of stabilised.

And at 2-0 down, they were just starting to to apply a bit of pressure.

I thought Tottenham were actually pretty poor second half yesterday.

And you sort of thought, yeah, if they get one here, Tottenham of a sort of team who could buckle here, United could get away with this.

And then Ten Hog makes his two substitutions.

He brings on Hoyland and Erickson after 73 minutes.

And immediately Tottenham stabilised.

They get a corner and they score.

And they're 3-0 up and the game's over.

So Ten Hag's substitutions are making them worse at the minute.

So it's very hard to see any defence for him.

And as I say, the whole thing is incredibly predictable.

It's not like this has just happened.

This was happening last season as well.

And the FA Cup final seems to have just sort of

removed any sense of perspective or memory from everybody involved.

But you've got to remember in that cup run, while they played very well in the final, they were awful.

You know, they conceded a three-goal lead against Coventry, a two-goal lead against Newport.

They got battered by Liverpool and somebody won that game 4-3.

It was an incredibly fortunate cup win.

And also, it's 2024.

It's not

1990.

Like, a Cup win shouldn't be keeping you in a job.

So it just smacks of weakness that they didn't follow through and get rid of him and put in their own person because they're going to have to do that sooner rather than later.

And you suspect probably this October national break after they've lost to Porto and Villa.

I think that's the five minutes that Oscar Ross Bond wanted at Wilson.

I mean, it is interesting, isn't it, Lucy, that he is still there.

I don't necessarily, we don't need to be another set of people just yelling for someone to be sacked.

But it is the the fact that it's not a surprise that there's no discernible plan.

And I know Tottenham were good in that first half,

but still.

Yeah,

it's interesting whether they don't have anybody lined up or anybody in mind.

I mean, who's out there, but he's not going to make them a lot better than they are now.

And I think that fact shows that he probably shouldn't be there.

But the same issues.

Like Jonathan says, the attackers want to attack quickly.

The defenders want to defend in their box.

And in between, there's like a huge gap.

But it's quite interesting in this game is that Son was out, wasn't he?

And each player who has criticised the calendar and how many games that they play has been shot down in flames.

First, Rodri, now Son.

So you never moan about the calendar because you just, you know, that's there's like some sort of curse on it.

I've no, I've noticed.

Alison missed out last week as well, didn't he?

After he'd criticised the calendar, so

do you think FIFA's agents going around shooting him in the knee to kind of

the agenda?

Is real.

Yeah.

I wonder, Barry, I mean, Moonlight Hanger asks an interesting question, which is slightly different to this, which is, will there ever come a point where people who followed football throughout the 90s but don't support Manchester United will cease to be fascinated and thrilled by the old Trafford Perma crisis?

Did a previous vintage have something similar with Liverpool?

It's before my time.

I don't remember this kind of this joy.

Maybe there just wasn't as much football content, but this joy that Liverpool were hopeless for so many years.

But, like, it does exist.

You can't help but enjoy it.

Yeah,

I don't really care whether Eric Tenhag gets sacked or not, because

part of me would like to see him kept on because just to see how much gas is in the explosion.

But it was interesting yesterday.

You had the obligatory camera cut to the Braillesford Hive mind sitting in the expensive seats in the stand, these expensively assembled group of high-performance gurus and marginal gains boffins who are each desperately attempting to outdo each other in the looking gravely concerned states.

And the thing is, you know that after days and weeks and months of chuntering on at each other through endless PowerPoint sessions, The alternative they're going to come up with is Gareth Southgate.

I mean, that is exactly what is going to happen at some point.

They're probably just going to Gareth Southgate's people once a week at the moment, just right with an increasingly large number written on a piece of paper, just handing it to, he's looking at it, shaking his head and handing it back.

And I find that funny because, you know, you've got Olmer Barada there, Braylesford, Jason Wilcox, Dan Ashworth, Christopher Vivelle or Vivelle, however you pronounce it, the very best of the best that have been assembled by Sir Jim Ratcliffe.

And they seem to be as clueless as anyone.

And who could possibly have predicted this?

So I look forward to Tin Hag.

I don't want to see anyone particularly losing a job, but it's different when it's a football manager because you get silly money and you're set for life.

It's not like you're going to be on the street.

begging for spare change but it will be southgate

i i i there's part of me that doesn't want it to be Southgate because I'm not sure, Barry, I could handle talking to you three times a week about your thoughts on Garrett Southgate.

I think I know what they are.

We appreciate his, whatever about his international pedigree, his club pedigree is second to none.

He relegated Middlesbrough, you know.

Quickly, Lucy, that red card, did you think that was slightly harsh on Fernandez?

Probably, but I think that

Postacoglu said afterwards that the red card was a result of how well Spurs were playing.

It was a frustration.

I I mean, he slipped, but it was that split-second decision from Fernandez that he was going to reach out quickly afterwards, and that was all frustration.

I think if they'd have been winning, he never would have done that.

So, probably slightly harsh, but this referee's call thing, and that's, you know, if it's a subjective decision, then the subjective decision has to go to the referee, and that's obviously what's going to happen mostly.

On Tottenham Wilson, I mean, perhaps I am biased, but to play like that in that first half without Sun,

with Benton Coor basically as your only kind of defensive midfielder, not really a defensive midfielder, with Madison playing deeper, meaning Kulasewski can be in the 10 is really, I mean, when it works as well, that's a big caveat,

it's great.

Yeah, I mean, if Son had been playing, not Tima Werna, for all I admire, Tim Overna's movement, his energy,

the way

he never seems to get down on himself, despite missing, you know, hatchering a great chances every game.

Every chance he gets.

If Son had played, that would have been 5-0 because there were two one-on-ones that you knew Werner wasn't going to score.

Yeah, I mean, like Madison playing deeper, I think.

See, he sort of dropped deeper at times last season, didn't he?

But this seems to be much more permanent positioning, and he seems to be thriving it.

So I think possibly it leaves him slightly soft-centred, but on the other hand, when they have a ball, they look great.

And I guess they, against United, they knew they'd have a ball and they knew that that central midfield area wasn't going to be, you know, thanks to the 10-hog doughnuts.

There's going to be plenty of space in there, and Madison could do what he wanted, as he did.

Spurs were brilliant, and I think that I did the game on Thursday night.

It took me about five hours to get there, and then Carabag was stuck in traffic.

So that's another story.

But the attitude from Posta Coglo on Thursday night was when they went down to 10, is

right, we're going to go for it because we'll probably need two to win this.

So let's go for two.

And because Carabag are not bad, I know they didn't particularly, you know, they got in front of goal and they didn't look, but they'd been stuck in traffic, blah, blah, blah.

But I quite like that, and I think that may have been, and we talk about turning points, but that when the players think that's what our manager wants us to do, and when we did it and it worked, and then they go and play like that at Old Trafford, it's sort of like that's a that's quite a positive thing for Spurs, I think.

And four and four for Brennan Johnson.

We talked about him, you know, coming off social media.

Chris says, I deleted my Instagram about three years ago.

How many Premier League goals should I have scored in the period since?

Four for him, but three and three for Solanke, and all very sort of lineker-like tap-in goals, which I think is a real positive, actually.

So, are you talking to me?

Yeah, I mean,

wow, I didn't realise this is this taxi driver.

What's that movie?

I don't know.

Are you talking to me?

Here we go.

What's going to happen?

Are you about to fly to Australia and chop my head off, or whatever happens?

Yes, I am talking to you, Barry, if you don't mind.

Yeah, that's all right.

I don't have a pump action shotgun hidden up my sleeve in case you worry.

Yeah, I was slightly worried about Dominic Solanke when Spurs paid massive dosh for him because he's sort of come in there really on the back of just one very good season and I thought the price tag might weigh heavily on him and then he I think he didn't score his first couple of games then he missed a couple of games through injury but he's hit his stride now and that looks like it's not going to be a problem.

And Brendan Johnson's been superb for Spurs coming in from the right, scoring, setting up chances.

I mean, he actually had a big smirk on his face before the ball even reached him yesterday.

The Mickey Van de Ven, you know, cross across across the face of goal.

He was smiling before he scored, which is a sign of a confident player, obviously.

I suppose he's he's stuck it to the haters,

but they'll no doubt think, oh, it was our toxic abuse of him that has spurred him into action which i'm sure isn't the case uh speaking of uh toxic abuse fair play to totten for calling out their own fans uh they sent a statement saying the club's aware of abhorrent homophobic chanting from sections of our away support at old traffic today this is simply unacceptable hugely offensive and no way to show support for the team the club will be working closely with the police and stewards to identify anyone instigating or joining in with the chanting we shall take the strongest possible action in accordance with our sanctions and banning policy we are justly proud of our superb and loyal support home in a way.

However, we all have a responsibility to act as ambassadors for Tottenham Hotspur and discrimination of any kind has no place at our club.

Across North London, Arsenal 4, Leicester 2.

I mean heartbreaking loosely for Leicester because it was so late

but it's hard to suggest that Arsenal didn't deserve the three points in this game.

Absolutely.

I think it just shows out how quickly football changes.

So Trossard's the villain when he gets sent off last week and then he scores two goals this week And that's, you know, that's why you've got to sort of stay somewhere in the middle, not get too high, not get too low.

But you look at the set pieces for Arsenal, we talk about them all the time, but I think it's set piece coach Jova, is it?

Or Jova?

I don't know how you pronounce it, but so key that they get that right.

And even when

I was sort of watching, I don't know what I was watching, Skye, I think it was, you sort of knew what was going to happen and you knew that Arsenal were going to score.

And then it was like, oh, they've got a corner.

It was going to happen at some point.

I think Martinelli back in form is good as well.

But James Justin, that equaliser, was absolutely incredible.

I mean, what a strike that is.

It's like he couldn't quite believe it himself.

But Arsenal just keep going.

I think somebody said Arsenal were boring.

Are Arsenal the boring ones now?

And it's just like, no, that he has just added so much to that.

You know, they can control out of possession now, which I think is so strong for them.

So that it looks ominous for Arsenal, I think.

I saw Wilson that some bookies were making them favourites now for the Premier League, which is quite interesting.

I don't know, we'll talk against Rodri's injury.

And

I guess you need the sort of relentlessness, right?

They deserve to win this game, but they could easily not have won it because it was the 97th minute or whatever it was.

But they did have that, you know, that desire to keep on going.

Yeah, I sort of feel with Arsenal that

we end up, suddenly I end up going through this thought process repeatedly of

clearly the better side, clearly they deserve to win that game,

as they should be the better side than a newly promoted team.

But they make quite hard work of it.

And that's always my doubt about them.

They get in a position where they're dominant in a game.

And it seems like a tiny wrinkle really can throw them off for half an hour, 20 minutes, half an hour.

And then it's like, yeah, have they got time to recover after that?

And on this occasion, they did.

And that's a very...

positive sign that they can get through the difficult period and they can come out the other side and they can apply a whole load of pressure.

But every now and again, they don't.

And it's those games when they don't do that when they cost them the title last season.

You know, the games against Fulham and West Ham, both of which, well, certainly the Fulham game, they went wander up.

They were comfortably on top.

If you think the previous season, the games at West Ham, the game at Anfield, comfortably on top, and then wobbled.

The game against Brentford last season, they were ahead.

They let in a stupid golden stroke at half-time.

And then it was similar to the Leicester game.

They did eventually get the win in that game, but they made hard work of it.

And I'm just not sure how often you can go to that emotional well before you find that there's nothing in the well so it's positive in the sense yes they did get through it but I'm not really sure why they keep putting themselves in that position of having to get through it but isn't this a sign that they did do it in the sense that compared that to last season as in this is a positive sign well yeah but there's this game is last well last couple of seasons when so you think of the the bournemouth game they won very late on yeah recently just after the world cup you think of the villa game

around about the same time as that Bournemouth game when they end up scoring twice in injury time to win that 4-2, but it wasn't a comfortable 4-2.

And this sort of simultaneously was a comfortable 4-2 and not a comfortable 4-2.

It just seemed to.

I just think teams that win titles have a lot of boring games.

They win 2-3-0 without anybody noticing.

And Arsenal just don't seem to have them.

They were, it could be argued, a little lucky on Saturday in as far as Riccardo Califiore should have been sent off when the score score was still 2-2.

And I think Jamie Vardley should probably have had a penalty.

Steve Cooper, after the game, had his customary moan

and

said, I don't want to make headlines around referees, and then proceeded to do exactly that.

But I think he had a bit of a point here.

Tip of the hat as well to Mads Hermanson in goal for Leicester.

He was sensational.

He made some incredible saves.

I mean, there were two point-blank saves that were ridiculous from him, weren't there?

Yeah, I mean, I think Steve Cooper thought that Vardy was fouled in the build-up to the opening goal.

I don't know if it was.

Oh, that was it.

Yes, so it wasn't a pair of.

No, that's okay.

And I think he might have a point with both.

And I know I had a rant about this yesterday on the radio, Barry, but for Bruno Notte to get booked for showing an imaginary card, I don't know why we care.

Does anybody care about imaginary card waving?

Can't rest just ignore that?

Like, there are bigger...

Like, that just seems such a disproportionate thing to get a yellow card for that, you know?

And for California not and the fact lucy that var can't intervene because it's a yellow card seems ridiculous like var is annoying it takes time but you just have situations where a yellow card cannot be looked at or vocario coming out of his box to the halfway line last week bouncing it can't be looked at because it's not a red card offense it just seems it just seems ridiculous yeah i mean i for sort of howard webb's point of view it's it's like the more that you well shall we start looking at that?

Shall we start looking at that?

And the thing that people complain about is how long it takes to look at everything.

But I think for certain things like that, there's a discretion where

you can go, well, actually, you know, for a yellow card for waving an imaginary yellow card, which is really annoying.

But I think that the issue is

how many yellow cards result in a ban.

I think that's the overriding issue as well.

If you can get yellow cards for waiving an imaginary yellow card, then it should be extended from five to eight or whatever it is that the first one time you get a ban.

But yeah, I agree with you.

I think you know, if VAR can look at, but then you know, you sort of go further into it, and then people say, Well, why can't you look at that?

And why, you know, and I think you then sort of start re-refereeing, which is just really annoying when you, you know, when I'm doing games and you can hear the VAR, not particularly this season, I think it's been better, but last season, this like re-refereing what's happened when it's, you know, I don't think that's entirely necessary.

Is that annoying having the VAR in your ear?

I mean, I don't know if it's useful, Lucy, but does that annoy when you're watching a few?

Just loads of northernmen shouting.

I suppose you're used to that.

It's like being in my house.

It's well, you only sort of hear, I only listen to them.

I mean, I have about 15 voices in my ear, but I only listen to them when something's going on.

I turn it up and see what they're saying.

But you can't hear what the referee's saying.

You can only hear what they're saying to the referee, if that makes sense.

So you can't sort of hear the referee swearing and carrying on.

Like, we know when they play it out to us, you can't hear that.

But yeah, it's quite interesting because

I did the West Ham Chelsea game last week and the

contact or the fleeting pulling of Somerville, and you heard him say it was fleeted.

So then we then repeated, which is what they want, I think.

They want us to repeat on air how the VAR has come.

I think that's better.

It's actually

worked better this season so far, I think.

Just on VAR, something occurred to me watching the United's first game yesterday.

There was a United appeal for a handball in the box, and play went on and it wasn't handball i think it hadn't even hit the hand it hit the chest the play go went on for sort 10 12 seconds afterwards and somebody then had a shot which went just wide

i don't understand where var stands on advantage if a referee plays an advantage you can you then go you know and a shot results can you then go back and give the penalty because that seems to be giving a team two bites at a cherry when they should should only have one

Yeah, that's an interesting point.

Also worth pointing out,

Arsenal fans are totally entitled to do so, noting a number of occasions where players did not get booked for kicking the ball away over the weekend.

And they will continue to do it.

And I do actually have quite a lot of sympathy for them.

It's only, you know, I quite like the idea that it's only Arsenal, but other players are doing it, you know, and we are never going to have continuity.

Did they have anything to say on the non-dismissal of Ricardo California?

I suspect not.

What about you?

I love what about you.

I did enjoy in the City Arsenal game, Declan Rice getting a yellow card for kicking the ball away, but doing it quite deliberately to waste time, knowing exactly what he was doing and knowing he was going to get a yellow card.

So the idea is a deterrent.

It's just not.

People are going to do it.

Declan as well, when Arsenal scored the third goal yesterday, he was very

in the middle of the celebrations and he grabbed the Adidas logo on his shirt rather than the crest and gave it a big piss.

So no doubt, considering the last time he did that was when he was wearing an Ireland shirt, I suspect he'll be off to Spurs of Man City before too long.

Does he have a deal with Adidas?

I think so, yeah.

I think he's an Adidas athlete, isn't he?

That's why so maybe.

But well done, Arsenal.

Going well.

Tombo says, our city, the most expensive one-man team in history.

Kay says, forget points deductions, relegations fines, et cetera.

Should Man City just be forced to sell Rodri as punishment for the 115 charges?

Wilson, you wrote a piece about this game and the the Newcastle penalty and that city wouldn't have conceded it had Rodri been there.

I don't know how it seemed on Tally, but in the ground, it was sort of like, oh, hang on, Gordon's clean through.

How on earth has that happened?

It just came from nowhere.

It was a bit like the first Spurs call.

It's sort of like, that shouldn't happen at this level.

What's gone on to allow basically two straight passes, Jollenton to Binnegamarish,

and suddenly Gordon's free?

And it turned out Carl Walker was playing him on

way behind the defensive line.

I don't know how that had happened.

But also, just that space in front of the two centre-backs, which just isn't there when Roderay's there.

I don't even think it would occur to you to Newcastle to try and play the ball through that area if Rodri was there.

His presence, him just being there, means that people don't try and play through the middle like that.

I've been actually at the last three Newcastle City games, and all three have been really interesting games, but the previous two felt like a much higher level, a much higher quality.

This was very scrappy.

I think to an extent by design by Newcastle, I think they pressed really well and they caused City a lot of problems.

City goal sort of came out of nowhere.

I don't know if you saw, but Kieran Trippier had to change one of his boots, maybe in the first half.

So he's wearing odd boots.

One of them is sort of neon peach and one of them is sort of dusky grape.

And that seemed to sort of scramble his brain slightly.

And he kind of flew into this challenge on Jack Grealish.

He was just going too fast.

It was easy for Grealish to sort of skip by him.

And then Dan Byrne sort of, you know, looked like an eight foot two man as he is.

And so it was quite easy for Guadiol to sort of skip by him.

So that that goal was just a Newcastle era when they played really well until then.

And really apart from that, City didn't.

I mean, I know Nick Polk made a really good save from Bernardo Silver later on, but City didn't create much.

It was all very bitty.

Newcastle stopped them playing really well.

And you sort of think when Rodri's there, there's a calmness,

there's a composure to City, which without him is just missing.

And the midfield midfield three, they tried to,

you know, they had Gundawin playing as the most advanced player in the three, which I guess if De Berner's there, they don't do that.

Then they had Rico Lewis and Kovacic.

But they just didn't have that same.

Even though they all had more than 90% past completion, they just didn't have that control that they have when Rodri's there.

Psychologically, like we talked about Lucy, the fact that Arsenal, you know, they don't have this title.

So

you perhaps look at the way they play slightly differently and you give Ban City psychologically the benefit of the doubt that they know how to win and they'll just find a way.

But I wonder

how much effect psychologically it will have.

The fact that they did drop points last week when he went off injured, they've dropped points this week.

All the talk, you know, however much noise gets to the dressing room, they know that Rodri's not there anymore and they've dropped points again.

And they actually don't, they have quite a forgiving fixture list now.

But I wonder how much you think that might affect the squad.

Yeah, I mean, I think that Guardiola will solve the issue.

I mean, he actually copied Ange,

so you'll be pleased about that, Max, by playing sort of like two attacking eights, two attacking centre-midfielders,

you know, with Rico Lewis.

I quite like Rico Lewis, but he doesn't trust him physically, I think, against some of the

better teams.

But he will solve it.

It's just how many games it takes Guardiola to solve

him missing.

And I think that

what's missing is that they don't deal with when the ball changes hands when Rodri's not playing as well.

So they lose possession and he's not, he's usually there when they when they have it, he's you the one that can pass it.

So they're missing a passer and they're missing someone to sort of protect as well.

But then they look a little bit vulnerable.

And I think you're right, Max.

Quite a lot of what was happening Saturday, they just looked quite flat.

They didn't quite look like they believed.

However, it will be however many games it takes Guardiola to solve that.

they'll get going again.

So

I think the rest of the teams need to take advantage of that particular point.

yeah i mean in the premier league their next few games are fulham at home wolves away southampton at home

um

bournemouth away brighton away spurs at home okay so brighton away and spurs at home perhaps but like that feel feels like a nice set of fixtures to work out how to solve this barry a penalty or no penalty alan shearer i thought not

i thought it was um

as gary lineker explained on match of the day on saturday night if a goalkeeper rushes out and dives at your feet, you're under no obligation as a striker to jump over him.

So if you just make contact and go down,

it's pretty much a foul.

You will get a penalty.

And that's what happened there.

I think Anthony Gordon probably made the most of it.

He's entitled to do that.

But yeah, I think it was a penalty.

I was surprised you're thought otherwise, but

considering

he's a Newcastle fan.

Anthony Gordon is a really impressive young man, by the way, as well.

When he's interviewed, he always speaks well.

He sort of like really thinks through his answers very thoughtful.

And you sort of get the impression that he invests quite a lot of time in himself, and it's a lot because, obviously, he's self-employed.

I know he works for Newcastle, but they benefit from him if he's at his best.

And I don't think all young players do that.

I think quite a lot of them will get...

sort of carried away with the fact that they're pros and they've got the money and they can have the cars and then you they sort of relax a little bit But I think he just constantly analyses

himself and sort of does things that makes his game better.

You knew that he would score the penalty, you know.

I, I, even against a you know, a goalkeeper like Edison, you knew that he would score it simply because he had a complete process.

The whistle goes, he waits however many seconds, and then he takes it.

And he's obviously worked with someone because I think the stats show that the longer that you wait, the more likely you are to score the penalty, whatever.

So, I'm quite impressed with him.

Well, I think he said it was a process that was sort of drilled into him when he was on underage duty with England.

There must be a tipping point to the amount of time you wait.

Yeah, if like 20 minutes, if it's like 20 minutes, no, we're all stood there.

Two and a half days later.

Well, who was it last week had to wait like a minute or something?

The Southampton lads,

was it?

Cameron Archer, and you could just see the competence seeping out of his body.

I think a lot depends on who's in control of that situation.

If you, the taker, are delaying it, then it's great for you.

If you're having to wait because vars going on and there's discussions and there's

defenders getting in your face or whatever,

then that's a different situation.

You're not in control of it, so you're not carving yourself.

It's after the whistle, isn't it?

I think it's the amount of time after he blows his whistle and you're ready to take it, the longer it is, unless it sort of goes past three minutes.

But just on the penalty, the reason it looks a bit odd is because he hits his back leg.

So

whenever a foul is committed and it hits the back leg, the forelobs look slightly weird.

We're conditioned to see trips on the front leg.

But because that's on the back leg, it looks like he sort of goes down in a slightly odd way.

But clearly, there's contact on the back leg, and I'm not really sure what God's meant to do there.

I don't think it's even the case he's left his leg dangling.

Because to kind of jump high enough to get your back leg over, well, you have to get, what, two and a half feet up, something like that?

I don't think that's easy to do at all.

So I just think, I don't know why there's even a discussion.

I just think it's a penalty.

Okay, I'm sorry to have brought it up.

No, no, no.

Other people have been discussing it as well.

It would have been odd if he hadn't, but

that's okay.

That'll do for part one.

Part two, I'll begin at Stanford Bridge.

HiPod fans of America, Max here.

Barry's here, too.

Hello.

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a proper football journalist man exactly too much technology draws us in and shuts the world out this paper tablet doesn't.

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Welcome to part two of the Guardian Football Weekly, Chelsea 4, Brighton 2.

Gav says, should Cole Palmer have amortised those goals across the season?

I mean, Barry, he was absolutely ridiculous in this game.

Four goals in 20 minutes.

An amazing free kick.

The fourth, the finish was brilliant.

He is just a delight of a footballer.

Yeah, it's like everything around him slows down.

He's got some sort of superpower.

Currently watching the boys, that superhero

series.

And yeah, I think if Cole Palmer was in it, that would be his power.

He can slow everything down and he's operating at his own speed.

Just the variety of goals, the free kick was wonderful.

Even the one where he hit the post, that was brilliant.

The way he

ran into space and hit that shot.

He

seems a very...

I was wondering, like, I was discussing with someone,

how did Pep let him go?

But I don't think he'd be able to play like this in a Pep team and that

for him to be playing like this, he has to go somewhere else where Pep isn't micromanaging his every step and movement.

So,

you know, maybe it's not a blot on Pep's copybook that he sold him to Chelsea, because I think if he was playing for City, he would not be playing like this because he wouldn't be given the freedom to play like this.

But

he will be offering up plenty of thanks to Fabian Hertzler's high line, which

Chelsea really exploited to the max.

So, So, yeah, but yeah, a wonderful performance by him.

I think the main thing about Cole Palmer is that nothing touches him.

So, pressure doesn't affect him in his brain.

So, you know, all these players who come into teams and they're young and they come into teams, they're all brilliant.

They're all

right at the top of

the best players that could be in that particular age group.

But it's when you sort of weighted down with, what if I don't play well?

What if I misplace a pass?

What if this you know and he does not have any of that running through his brain he doesn't have any you can tell he plays as if that somebody's just got a ball out on the on the local pitch and he's and he's sort of showing what he can do and because of that he actually plays without any pressure and and I think that's one of the reasons why like you say Barry that it looks like everything slows down is because he's just he just doesn't seem that bothered that he's actually on a pitch just to be clear Lucy are you saying he's thick no I'm not saying he's thick What I'm saying is he is able to absolutely cut out that because he has sheer enjoyment of playing football.

But he's quite lucky that the pressure doesn't get to him because there's not many players that can play without anything touching them pressure-wise.

Yeah, I think you're right.

And I think it's interesting you asked that, Barry, because you could, you know, in his interview.

I didn't mean it in a derogatory way.

I hastened to add.

No, he's a genius.

Tell you.

But actually, I think he does, like, when, because he talks about Anthony Gordon and the process and him thinking about it, I think Cole Palmer, it's different.

But he does, when he's asked questions, he does think about the answer.

But I get the sense that he's not really bothered about any, like, not, and, and, and again, not in a, in a, in a, um derogatory way, just, he's just so totally relaxed about existence.

You know, it's like a zen, he's just in this zen world where he's like, he's like a bottle of whatever it is he's having, you know.

Because even like the off-field stuff, the media stuff, and all that could affect you if you're really young, right?

Like, all of these things happening at the the same time and it's interesting ask about bird camp and and he went

uh

yeah it was that sort of you know and he wasn't embarrassed the fact that he he sort of had a little bit of a giggle like oh god i should know who he is and then he was just oh i think i've seen him yeah he's good like you say uh max he absolutely i think he's just zen i think that's what but that is just the the the combination of that and the skills that he's got as a as a footballer and like i say that a lot of footballers have but not many can sort of perform because

the pressure just gets to them.

And you're so right as well that I wrote it down that there's such a cliche about this footballer who looks like he's literally just playing on the park, but it really, really seems to fit with him.

And then the next question, Wilson, is obviously about where he fits with England, right?

And because,

you know, can you give if you give him that freedom, then, I mean, you know, it's a debate that we had in the summer about, you know, playing everybody.

It seems like, is he the best one now?

Like Lineker said he the he's the best one but you've got so many good players in that sort of position

well he can it's it's it's good for england and i guess good for him he can play through the middle or on the right you know with equal happiness but you've got sacrifice bellingham in those positions and that

england have never or certainly not in my lifetime ever had that depth of quality and then the other thing occurred to me yes what I would say about Gordon and the penalty England's got so many great penalty takers like I'd back England to beat anybody in a penalty penalty share at the minute.

If the game was purely penalties, in England, they're lining up Kane, Gordon, Palmer, Ivan Tony,

Saka.

That's an odd thing to feel as somebody, who is not, if not an England fan, at least England fan adjacent.

Barry mentioned the high line, Wilson.

I mean, it is very interesting.

Brian are playing Tottenham next Sunday, by the way, which would be utterly ridiculous.

Everyone will be on the halfway line.

I'm at that one.

And I'm assuming it's just going to be a line of 20 players on the halfway line yeah but but it seems very different to do it with van der ven in your back for and to do it with adam webster and lewis dunk who sort of feel like the two most aircraft carrier like turning circle centre backs in the premier league yeah i mean that's that's true but i also i i sort of think

the pace of the defender to recover is only part of it and it's actually the less important bit that's the less important bit that's that's how you get out of jail but the issue is not to get into jail in the first place and that's to do with how how well you press.

And something went wrong with Brighton's press.

I think it's the issue on Saturday, rather than necessarily that

the line was too high for the quality of the press, rather than the line being too high in and of itself.

Yeah, I understand that.

But I did think that Chelsea...

even though their players had time to play those passes, right?

Which is the issue because there's not someone on them, they weren't like particularly clever passes.

They were just like, I'll dink it over the top because I know Brighton's line is so high.

So you don't need that much time to just hook one over the top.

I don't think they were genius through balls.

Or am I being unfair?

Well I think if it were that easy teams would do that to all sides who play a high line.

Yeah pushing up to five yards off off halfway or even halfway is not uncommon in the modern game but teams seem to find it quite hard to to play those passes.

Now whether that's to do with goalkeeper positioning that other goalkeepers sweep higher up, whether it is to do with recovery pace if you've got a yeah say a Kyle Walker in there you can recover I'm not sure, but I think it's to do with getting pressure on the ball before

the pass is played.

That then makes even a dink over the top quite hard, because you've still got to know roughly where you're dinking it to.

Or it might be to do with Mareska's preparation.

Those runs were pre-planned.

Nobody had to look up to work out where to go.

If I get it, I'm dinking it into that space, and I know that Cole Palmer's running on.

I know that Nicholas Jackson's running on.

I think the height of the line is only this because the press wasn't quite good enough in Brighton.

I don't know, Lucy, if six games is enough time to start looking at the league table but you know Chelsea are fourth.

They're on a good run aren't they?

Has your view of them changed pretty dramatically?

I feel it has with me.

Yeah I think that what's happened is Maresk has been allowed to,

with discussion with the powers that be, the group of players that he wants to work with.

So you know I keep talking about all the time that the training ground, if you've got nearly 40 players, it's a problem for many reasons, just because these players are around the training ground and

they can cause issues.

But I think that during this transfer window, he's basically said, right, these are the 20-odd players that you're working with.

And then all of a sudden, then you get a bit of consistency.

So his selections have probably only really changed.

I know what his first 11 is if they're all fit for Chelsea.

I don't think we could say that last season.

And I think that sort of consistency has helped him.

He's helped the players.

Because they're good players.

You know,

nobody was ever saying that they weren't good players.

It was just they had about 10 different project players, which, you know, normally teams would only have maybe a couple of project players that may or may not make it.

But the fact that Jackson plays now well with Cole Palmer, that Cole Palmer's, the way that he interacts with Madweke is brilliant.

You know, the only issue is right back.

So we're still talking about the depth of the squad.

Rhys James struggles, which is such a shame.

Obviously, Gusto is his choice at right back.

I think Fafana and Colwell do brilliantly together at centre-back.

So, all of a sudden, you know, Caicedo's playing well.

Enzo Fernandez, you know, sort of in the right position.

But I quite like Lavier.

I think Lavier and Caicedo could work close together.

So, I think, I basically just think that he's got a core of players now that he works with that they now see that what he does with them tactically works.

So, they buy in.

There's no sort of,

you know, things on the outside of that affecting it.

And he has shown himself to be a really adaptable coach.

So he changes depending on the opposition.

The numbers that he has in the press depend on who he's playing against.

The numbers he has to try and get the ball from the goalkeeper up the pitch changes depending on who he's playing against.

And when the players see that that works, I just think that

it's sort of moving really in the right direction.

Liverpool are top, Barry.

A question about Liverpool, and I think you can do the same with Villa.

It's actually, I'm looking at who they've played so far and you know Arnold you can only beat who's in front of you but away to Ipswich home to Brentford

away to Man United home to Forest home to Bournemouth home to West Ham away to Wolves actually

five wins in a defeat is sort of the least you'd expect for Liverpool from those games or is that very unfair on Arnold Slott and his excellent start they are top of the Premier League They are top of the Premier League.

I think the defeat at the hands of Nottingham Forest took everyone by surprise, including Ernest Lott.

As you say, you can only beat the team that's sent out to play you.

And some of their defeats have been, or some of their wins have been very impressive.

I would say this wasn't one of them.

And I think Wolves made life very easy for them on Saturday evening, insofar as they were chasing the game.

But you wouldn't know to look at them they were chasing the game because they were sort of playing the same way in the last 10 minutes of the game at 2-1 down as they had been you know in the first half just

this this is how we're doing things and there was no urgency about them I think they didn't have a shot in the final 15 minutes and just seemed weirdly cautious as if it was some sort of exercising damage limitation.

I mean, you might as well lose 4-1 as 2-1.

But, you know, if you're having a go in the last 10 minutes,

or maybe I'm just being a proper football man in a dinosaur that, you know, stick one of the centre-forwards up front or, you know, just show some urgency.

And we didn't see any urgency from Wilson.

You'd hope they stuck one of the centre-forwards up front, but I mean, I'm not sure.

Or sorry, centre up front.

That does show a startling lack of ambition to hold your centre forwards back until late on.

Wilson, your thoughts of Liverpool so far.

I agree with Barry.

They weren't sensational in this game.

They did enough.

Yeah, I mean, that's pretty much been it.

I think there's been good signs, but you have to bear in mind the limitations of the opposition.

So I think what's been impressive from Slot is how...

So, for instance, that game against Ipswich on the opening day, the change he made at halftime clearly made them better.

So that's a positive sign.

But yeah,

you're right.

15 points in those six games is kind of par.

Maybe it's slightly under par.

So, yeah, the test will come.

Ipswich 2, Villa 2, Lucy.

Craig says, if Ipswich draw all their remaining games, will it be enough to keep them up?

It probably would.

Yeah, how many have they drawn?

The last four, is that?

And a really good comeback from them.

Because, you know, if you take the lead and then you go behind to a good team to get yourselves back up.

And the equaliser goal was brilliant from Liam DeLatt.

Yeah,

as well.

I think they played well, Ipswich, and, you know, they sort of let themselves down with the defending for both goals.

But it's quite interesting because Ipswich, there's certain clubs that stockpile Academy players and have done over the last sort of 10 years or so, like Chelsea, like Man City.

And there's usually loads there, or traditionally, has

been.

But they still managed to find a way through these players.

So, Solanke, Cole Palmer, DeLap is one of them.

Amari Hutchinson, Morgan Rogers, who was at City and is at Villa.

Ian Mattson, I think, is at Villa, Lewis Hall.

So, these have all been at Chelsea or Man City and they obviously have a really sort of good,

they have a good sort of grounding at the Academy, but there's that many players that they don't make it to the first team, but it's like they have some sort of resilience that they think, no, I'm going to, I've had, you know, good coaching, but I'm going to sort of make it.

And I just, that, just, when I watched that yesterday, I thought, I'm going to make it, there's loads here that have popped up from, and there was Jack Clark, I can't fail to mention, obviously, Calvin Phillips.

I don't want to disappoint my fans.

No, well, I was going to say, Lucy, for the

first time we get to talk to you about Calvin Phillips, who's actually played a football match.

Yeah, this is sort of miraculous.

How do you think he did?

Yeah,

I think, I mean, I was quite worried for him at the start of the season because there's just like loads of attention sort of on how disastrous last season was.

But I obviously think that he trusts him to play, so that's good.

I think Sam Moss is a good player in there.

Jack Clark's another leads lad on that left-hand side.

So, you know, these players sort of show that resilience to sort of come through a good academy, but not get into the first team and then sort of find their way back.

Just from watching that game, that's what I thought.

Imagine Diego Carlos, um, you know, sticking his hand up for slow-turning centre-backs while we're on them.

The Webster dunk Dan Bird with that step over.

I mean, he sort of took him about half an hour to turn around, didn't he?

Uh, does Wilson know?

Uh, first Ipswich player to score a brace in the Premier League since who?

Marcus Stewart, you got one of the names

Darren Bent.

No, Marcus Bent.

So, between you,

Marcus Stewart and Darren Bent, you've got it.

March 2002.

You actually fancied it switched for this game, Barry, because of what Villa have on the horizon.

Yeah, I thought Villa might take their eye off the ball, and I think maybe they did to an extent.

But

I don't think either team will be particularly disappointed with the points in this game.

I think it was quite even.

And,

yeah, I wouldn't say Villa were bad.

Just, yeah, it was a draw.

And probably

neither team will be particularly gutted that it was a draw.

And, you know, Villa do have this big game against Bayern Munich coming up, manu at the weekend, and then we're into the international break.

So, yeah, I thought they might take their eye off the ball, but they didn't.

To Goodison, Wilson, Everton 2, Crystal Palace 1.

I mean, they really needed this.

And at half-time, you thought they're not going to get this.

Credit Dwight McNeil and Sean Dice for turning it around.

Yeah, I mean, it turns out going behind makes things easier for Everton taking the lead.

They're better at coming back than holding on to a lead.

The first goal, well, actually, both goals from Draw McNeil, but certainly the first one's absolutely brilliant finish.

But I don't know, I sort of

don't think Everton have played that badly this season.

I sort of felt that the squad's obviously thin, it's not great, but I sort of always thought they would get out of it.

Um, when they're not out of it yet, I guess.

But the point is, I suppose is when you've had a start like that, it means you're always under pressure, that it's always tense in a way that you, as a fan, you wouldn't want.

It means there's no real hope, but all you can do is try and survive.

But now

the takeover appears to be about to happen.

They've got a nice new stay and move into

things are looking up.

Oliver Glasner-Lucy said,

suggested that people got carried away with the end of last season.

Obviously, they don't have Michael Elise.

It's interesting about expectations, right?

It's his fault for being really good last year.

He He should have been shite and just kept them up by a point.

And now everyone will be a bit sort of calmer about what's happening at Patreon.

Yeah, I think so.

In part, I think it's about sort of the heightened expectations.

But they had 10 players left and seven arrived, and quite a few of those arrived on the last day.

And I just think just getting to play his way, it's like he's teaching them again as he came in and did it very quickly.

Obviously, losing Elise...

was

a problem in terms of the tens the way that he likes to play.

I think that Adam Wharton, again, like a young player, moved down to London.

I mean, I watched him at Blackburn.

He didn't play that many games for Blackburn before he got the move to Palace.

So big move, lots of minutes in his legs.

I think it's quite stressful on a sort of young, physically on a young body, and he's only 20.

And so, you know, everybody's saying, oh,

he's not in form.

He's not playing badly.

He's just not playing as well as he did last season.

So I think all these little bits, Decore being injured, that has an effect.

So Elise missing.

And they're just lacking that intensity.

But I I don't really think there's too much.

I'm doing them actually on Saturday, so sort of see a little bit better in the next few days when I'm looking at them properly.

But I do think that they've shipped goals where they probably wouldn't have done last season.

Losing Anderson's a problem.

Gehee was used to playing with him.

He's gone.

So there's all sorts of little bits that I think have accumulated to cause problems for Palace.

And 1-0, I mean, perhaps they should have had a penalty when James Tarkovsky, putting his hand up for slow-turning defenders, uh slid through uh sort of bowled out Mateta, didn't he?

It sort of took him into the box and it's quite a firm challenge.

Warren says, Is it okay to read while watching Palace and sent me a photo of somebody reading?

That was really unkind.

Have you seen it?

He's really mean to that guy.

It's obviously half-time, and he said to look at his phone, he was reading a book.

I thought I agree.

I was gonna say that this it appears to be either pre-match or half-time, and he is reading Bad Blood: Secrets and Lies in a Silicon Valley Startup by John Carrirew.

And

it gets 4.7

as a rating from 31,000 ratings.

Do you want to hear a bit more about the book, Barry, or not?

It doesn't sound like a book I would read, but go on.

The gripping story of Elizabeth Holmes and Theranos, one of the biggest corporate frauds in history, the tale of ambition and hubris, set amid the bold promises of Silicon Valley, rigorously reported by the prize-winning journalist.

Chilling reads like a thriller.

Is she the woman who recently got sent to prison for quite a long time?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Okay.

I'm all in favour of people reading books of football, but I think they should be forced to read books of football history.

I see.

Any suggestion?

Yeah.

Actually, I've got 13, yes.

I must have told this story before, but when my dad,

before the FA Cup quarterfinal between Cambridge and Crystal Palace in 1990, he didn't have a ticket, so he rang up the the club on the day, and they went, oh, yeah, yeah, we'll get you in.

And they sat him in the press box next to Trevor Brooking.

But my dad always took a book, and he was reading Plato's Republic at the time.

So somewhere I have a copy of Plato's Republic, which just says, dear Max, all the best, Trevor Brooking, inside.

Anyway, that'll do for part two.

Part three will begin at Brentford.

HiPod fans of America, Max here.

Barry's here, too.

Hello.

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The remarkable paper pro move.

Remarkable, a brand name and an adjective, man.

Yeah, it's their most portable paper tablet yet.

It holds all your notes, to-dos, and documents, but it's smaller than a paperback and an incredible 0.26 inches thin, so it slips easily into a bag or jacket pocket.

Perfect for working professionals whose jobs take them out of the office, like maybe a football journalist, Barry.

Although not like you.

A proper football journalist, mate.

Exactly.

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Welcome to part three of the Guardian Football Weekly.

Brentford won, West Ham won.

I mean, it is hilarious, Barry.

When Bumo scored that goal, I was like, this is ridiculous.

Yeah, absolutely.

So that's the third goal they've scored in consecutive games inside a minute.

And they've only taken one point from those three games.

I think this goal was more or less the same as last week's goal.

A Mark Hughes-esque swivel and volley on the turn.

And

after the ball was head his way by

Fabio Carvello.

And yeah, you would think they would go on to win at least one of those games, but they haven't managed to do so.

Not a great performance from West Ham again, but at least they got a point.

I thought Julian Lopategi's decision to remove Mohamed Kudis at halftime was a bit odd because he's one West Ham player who's been you know shown to have a bit about him this season but uh

a fairly uninspiring encounter apart from the fact that oh yes Brentford have managed to do it again but it's you know a kickoff is a set play yeah so given you know where the ball's going to be to start with you know where your players are going to be People should treat it like you treat a free kick.

You have your set routine that's not just sort of lumping the corner and try and win a throw in.

You know, get men in the box quickly, yeah.

And that's what they do, and it works.

So, I don't understand why other teams now there's so much focus on set plays.

I don't understand why other teams don't do similar things.

I used to wonder, but like, even before this run of Brentford early goals, that why don't teams like start with incredible intensity and try and catch the opposition cold?

And I think if more teams did that,

it would result in them scoring goals.

But it doesn't seem to happen.

Yeah, Bournemouth have got one.

There are a few teams that have got set specific kickoffs the way that they work it.

Not all of them,

but it is key.

Like Jonathan said,

that is so important because it is a set piece.

You can get bodies up the pitch as soon as you can.

But Bournemouth do do and do get in front of goal quite quickly.

Well, he got a very early goal against Arsenal last season, didn't they?

But also,

in, I think it was the last but one international break.

So, I mean back back before the years like back in march didn't austria and germany both score within eight seconds of kickoff yes that might be right yes and that seems so long ago now but yes you are right i'm just i'm looking out for what austin mcphhee has planned uh as you know the world's number one set piece coach i i think there should be specialist kickoff coaches i think

it's a great job it's very specific you kind of

You basically, unless you're conceding lots of goals, which is not your fault, you're not really involved.

You do two things a game.

Well, one thing a game, you only kick off once, don't you?

Ideally.

Yeah.

I thought for a second it'd be really good because you could just be there for the start of the game and then, you know, worst case, stay for the start of the second half and then bugger off.

But actually, yeah, you do have to stay, don't you, just in case you concede another goal.

Forrest 0 Fulham 1.

Jim says, should Forrest invest in a referee consultant to help them understand some of the decisions in their games?

I mean, Nuno went a bit Steve Cooper, didn't he?

In this game, Barry, in that he'd said, I don't want to talk about referees.

And if you begin a sentence with, I don't want to talk about referees, you know what they're going to talk about afterwards.

Yeah,

so let's go through them.

There was where Joachim Anderson booted Tyowani

in the penalty area, sort of caught the underside of his foot as they were contesting the ball.

That wasn't given.

I think it tends generally not to be given in England, maybe abroad.

It would be.

I think if you really connect, but I'm saying correct decision.

Yeah, I would agree.

Pereira, well, he got a shove in the back, and while also having his Achilles raked by Murillo, that was given, that was correct, but it was only given after Varra intervened, I think.

Raul Jimenez scored that penalty.

50th Premier League goal for him and good seeing back in the goals.

Yeah, there was a Calvin Bassey foul on Elanga, not given.

That's what I've written down.

I can't remember what the foul was.

He sort of slid round.

And I do have some sympathy with Nuno, and maybe it's just because it's been really slowed down.

That he sort of

it would take you out, like if you were a langer, that would take you out, right?

And whether there was enough in the challenge, that sort of feels quite important that if you're in the box and someone takes you out, that it's not a penalty.

But and the other was uh, Tete bundled over by Marilla, and I some yeah, it was a hat-trick of

Marillo

efforts.

Um, I don't think that should have been given, and it wasn't.

So, but other opinions, including Nuno's, are available.

Yeah, 50 Premier League goals for Rau Jimenez.

And I think one of those rare stories that everybody on earth is happy about.

So well done to him.

Southampton played Bournemouth tonight.

This story is, I mean, actually, I mean, it's sort of funny and terrifying and not funny at the same time about Jens Lehmann, the former Arsenal Germany goalkeeper, has been fined 135,000 euros, £113,000 by a court in his hometown of Starnberg for damaging his neighbour's garage with a chainsaw.

Lehman was accused by the public prosecutor of sawing off a roof beam in the garage and was initially fined 420,000 euros over the incident which happened in July 2022.

I'm not aware if they're now friends.

I'd just be so awkward every time you were putting the bins out.

Well, the really weird thing is that when he replaced Oliver Kahn for Germany, he was seen as the calm one.

Imagine what Oliver Kahn would do.

Come in with a flamethrower and take out your conservatory.

See, I'm wondering,

is the fine you incur for sawing one of your neighbours' garage roof beams off with a chainsaw, is it commensurate sort of with your wealth?

So, like, in the UK, if you get caught speeding, the fine you incur, if you're really rich, you're going to have to pay a whacking great fine.

Is that right?

I didn't know that.

But if you're sort of not particularly, if you're on average income, the fine is much lower.

so maybe the offence wasn't as bonkers as it seemed and there seemed to be a tariff for it as well didn't there there was a tariff for it so it must happen quite a lot I want people to know this is a crime that happens a lot chainsaws taken to beams

like yeah yeah right that that's where's that on the tariff of I just think at some point in some point during the motion of me going to get my chainsaw which I obviously don't own anyway buying a chainsaw getting the chainsaw turning the chainsaw on going next door and breaking to the garage I reckon I'd have calmed down.

I just think I'd be like, what the earth happened to me?

You know,

and that's why you never won a World Cup.

You're absolutely right.

I don't have that killer instinct.

Do I?

Actually, Labour never won a World Cup, did he?

He lost in the semi-final, but yeah, but the point remains.

The point does remain.

I have fewer cats for Germany.

Charlie says, what's happening at Cambridge?

How many more games will Gary Monk get?

Says Jim.

Yes.

If you remember, I patronised Luton fans last year by suggesting it'd be funny if they didn't get any points then i patronized chumpton fans by thinking it'd be funny if they didn't score any goals now i find myself seven games in and cambridge have one point which does not seem enough if it

keeps going at this rate i think we'll get six or seven points this season which doesn't seem enough to challenge the playoff places would be my guess um and uh manuel says finally hi love the podcast then says some compliments about me but says i don't know if i can trust him anymore after finding out that he's a lime bike cyclist Does he cycle through red lights and zebra crossings when people are walking?

Does he wear headphones and no helmet so he can't hear what's happening around him when he's in his bike?

Does he then dump his bike in the middle of the pavement so no one can get past?

Please tell me that Barry isn't a lime cyclist as well.

Thanks, Manuel.

No, I'm pretty good on the roads.

I'll say, you know, I'll go across a red light once all the pedestrians have walked.

If that is a crime, I mean, it is, but well,

get me that high tariff.

I got arrested in not arrested, I got stopped by the police in 1996, I think, for breaking a red light on a bike.

It was 2am.

There was literally

no...

Not a single vehicle on the streets apart from a police car I hadn't noticed was right behind me.

And

basically what happened was

I'd got into college to go to the library.

The data team was short and I got waylaid.

We won the game.

We had a few beers to celebrate.

I was wobbling back the three minutes to the flat I stayed, I lived in, and I had a carry bag of books in one hand.

I'd had sort of six or seven pints.

I was wobbling along on this bike that really wasn't fit for purpose.

And yeah, I got pulled off.

So you were over the limit as well as

breaking the red light.

I think you should have been prosecuted and put in prison.

How student-y can you be?

I mean, literally, it's a little plastic bag of all your books.

You're going to get cancelled, Wilson.

You're going to get cancelled now, that's it.

All right, well, that'll do for today.

Thanks, everybody.

Thanks, Barry.

Thank you.

Thank you, Lucy.

Thank you.

Thank you, Wilson.

Cheers, thank you.

Put more weekly is produced by Silas Gray.

Our executive producer is Phil Maynard.

This is The Guardian.