Heartbreak for Wales, joy for Poland, Georgia and Ukraine – Football Weekly

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Hello and welcome to the Guardian Football Weekly.

Poor Wales, poor Dan James, a penalty shootout defeat against Poland after a nervy, energy sapping, attritional 120 minutes.

Wales went close in normal time.

Ben Davis just offside.

Wojciech Chesny saving from Kiefer Moore, but it is Lewandowski and the Poles who can now head to Germany.

They'll be joined by Georgia qualifying for a major tournament for the first time after a penalty win over Greece and Ukraine.

Coming back from behind to beat Iceland, incredible achievement for a country still at war.

And then to England, a fun and interesting friendly against Belgium.

Rice holding, Mainu in the eighth with Bellingham looked good.

Foden floated and Tony and Bowen impressed.

But for mischances and a couple of big mistakes, it should have been a win.

It's an international break, and Paul Watson's been to San Marino.

We've got a clarification on what day it is for Robbie Earnshaw.

Your questions, and that's today's Guardian Football Weekly.

On the panel today, Barry Glendenning, welcome.

Hi, Max.

Hello, Paul Watson.

Hi, Max.

And hello, Jonathan Wilson.

Mardo, hey, Dang.

I'm very good, thanks.

Joining us for part one, Ben Fisher, welcome.

Hi, Max.

You were at the Cardiff City Stadium to see Wales lose in their first ever penalty shootout to Poland.

How was it?

Yeah,

quite the agonising evening, really, all round.

Obviously, understandably,

extremely flat afterwards.

See, Dan James sees his penalty save.

It wasn't a great penalty.

And yeah, it kind of seemed too good to be true that Danny Ward, a goalkeeper who hadn't played for...

hasn't played for his club Leicester in I think 381 days would would be the hero as lovely as that that would have been and

yeah, obviously, Wales lose out in the cruelest of circumstances.

It wasn't a great game.

And I mean, it was bound for penalties, kind of from the moment that I think Poland took aim from kickoff.

There wasn't loads of chances.

But Wales probably feeled that they maybe had the better ones in the game.

Probably feel touch unlucky waking up this morning, but you know, that's penalties, right?

That's play-offs.

And

yeah a horrible way uh to lose it and obviously now um yeah they won't be going to the euros the noise i mean because the noise was great and we've said it before but the atmosphere is great you've experienced it a lot of times i don't know maybe you get used to it if you if you go there a lot but but just the difference between that and how flat it was after dan james missed that penalty was just even through the telly you could just really sense it Yeah, and the atmosphere was amazing before the game.

And even before the penalties, they played the anthem over the speakers again.

It felt sort of the fourth or fifth time of the evening.

That kind of seemed to rouse everybody.

But yeah, it was.

And it was weird when

James missed the penalty and Poland's players all rushed towards Chesney in the Poland goal.

It almost felt like everybody was looking around each other almost for like a get-out clause as if the ref had got it wrong or if the numbers hadn't quite added up.

you know surely this can't be right you know in in obviously very recent history whales have come out on the right side of these games.

They only kind of really know what it's like to reach finals, you know, through these playoffs in Cardiff, where everything seems to have gone so right broadly

in, well, recent, I wasn't say recent months, but recent years, really.

So, yeah, it was quite weird, as you say, Max, to see the stadium sort of semi-deserted

at that moment or in the minutes afterwards.

There was a lap of kind of appreciation or whatever you want to call it after.

But yeah, many, many fans are obviously already gone then.

And yeah, a horrible evening.

I think Dan James was one of the last down the tunnel, and obviously being consoled by

Rob Page and numerous sort of backroom staff, but obviously, yeah, nothing that you could say to him to make him feel any better.

A lap of sadness, Bass.

There's a video that's quite easy to find on YouTube, which was I think it was taken about three years ago, where it's Dan James's birthday,

and he arrives home, and his girlfriend

has bought him a puppy, a cockapoo,

which is sitting on a sort of chaise long at the end of the room Dan James walks into underneath some balloons that spell out happy birthday.

And James walks into the room and he sees this puppy and he's immediately really emotionally overcome and very tentatively approaches the puppy and kind of looking to his girlfriend as if to say, is it okay if I pick it up?

And watching him walk from the center circle to the penalty spot last night reminded me of that video.

He looked just as overcome and nervous.

And I didn't have a good feeling when he put the ball on the spot.

And so it came to pass

his penalty was saved.

So I hope when he got home, the dog at least

bit him.

Well, I mean, he's just had his second child, Paul, and that's someone with two children.

He was probably just exhausted, right?

He's probably just glad to be out of the house.

Absolutely shattered.

yeah.

Just the fact he could even get up to the penalty spot at all is a miracle with two kids.

It's a horrible thing.

I felt like the feeling of doom started to come over the game as soon as extra time started.

Partly because I think Poland had posed like zero threat, really.

I don't know if they had a single shot on target.

It didn't feel like they had five shots on target, they were the penalties.

And so,

my feeling when I when I'm about to watch a team in a penalty shootout, I want them to definitely be the team that wouldn't have won in normal time.

And so my feeling for Wales was this doom of like they had shaded it.

They definitely were the only team that came vaguely close to scoring.

So yeah, it was a horrible feeling of inevitability about it, I felt.

It was just really miserable to watch it on their behalf.

I mean, the game, Wilson, was, like I said, just attritional, wasn't it?

It was just...

Oh, don't lose this.

Wales had, what, a couple of chances.

Poland had won an extra time.

Yeah, there's Keith Amuerheader header that Chesney made a really good say from.

It was obviously the offside goal, which

was tight, but I think, yeah, it was offside.

Not that anybody watching on Violet play knew for 20 odd minutes to put a replay on.

So, yeah, I think,

yeah, I know exactly what Paul means.

There's a sense that, yeah, Poland's probably going to win this.

Wales have had a couple of opportunities and haven't taken them.

That's just the way these things go.

A couple of points.

I think it was Niger Ladley put on Twitter saying, the commentator saying that Wales will...

they didn't lose it.

I mean, they obviously did lose it last night, but they had chances in qualification, right?

They started this qualification with some pretty poor results, if I remember correctly.

And they sort of were good enough to actually get to automatically.

Yeah, they failed to beat Armenia home or away.

They lost it home 4-2.

That was the one that will haunt them.

That was a really bad performance, and that was last summer.

That kind of teed them up then for, I don't know, they kind of had to really, I don't know, kind of win win it and claw it back from there.

They never really did.

You know,

Pep Page was saying how going into the game, yesterday, there were seven games unbeaten, but a couple of those weren't exactly games.

You know, I think one of those was home to South Korea and they're friendly, so you know, you kind of have to take it with a bit of a pinch of salt.

Obviously, they did beat Croatia, but

yeah, they'll feel, they'll be kicking themselves because that Armenia game definitely would be the one that,

you know, in hindsight, you win that.

They could have qualified automatically.

They didn't need to go through this route.

I do think

it was a bit weird last night because it felt like if they've done it and obviously, you know, if they prevail on penalties, it's

three straight Euros, page has sort of led them to, you know, successive tournaments.

And yet, you know, by losing a penalty shootout, he's now kind of this...

this big villain and there's obviously questions about his future again.

I mean, maybe that's just football and that's just how it is.

I mean, it feels it's always that with Southgate in England, right?

Everybody just kind of

endlessly wants him gone, it feels like.

So maybe that's just how it is.

But I do feel a little bit like I don't think it was a disgrace for Wales to be in the playoffs with a team they had.

It's not a vintage team.

We know, you know, said so many times, you know, this isn't the sort of the Bale era anymore.

It's not really the Ramsey era anymore.

He hasn't played at all in the last couple of games.

So

it's a young team.

it's a different team, and yeah, I don't think losing to Poland on penalties is a sort of huge disgrace, but I think there will be questions asked, and it will be interesting to see where it goes from here.

And it won't mean anything to Wales fans now.

And it's worth saying, um, I couldn't ask Ellis for a voice note because it's too sad, but he did say he did say losing on penalties like a proper team, but there are reasons to be positive.

Like, as Ben said, they're a young team

that like they are a good team, right?

They have good players, if no standout superstars and 48 teams qualify for the world cup next time so like they they should make it they should i'm not sure whether page is the man to take them forward or not uh

and i think there are a lot of uh people

who have more emotionally vested in wales than i am that feel the same way i mean ellis and i constantly disagreed about um Chris Coleman.

Ellis thought he was a brilliant manager.

I thought he was awful.

But that my opinion, was tainted by his disastrous reign at Sunderland, and it's probably unfair to judge a manager on that because it's such a badly run club.

And I also appreciate Coleman when he took over the job.

It was in awful, awful circumstances for him.

I get the same kind of vibe as I did about Coleman from Paige, but I'm not sure.

Who would be better?

Do they want a Welsh manager?

But they'd certainly have some very good players.

Not brilliant players, they obviously don't have a Garris Bale figure, but there's some very good players in that team, and a lot of them are very young.

What I'm saying, Paul,

like it's good that Lewandowski gets what will probably be his final major tournament.

I mean, he,

as Barry suggested in the last pod, Poland go to every tournament and don't do much, but at least he'll be there again.

He can be there to not do much.

Well,

yes, it is always nice to see players like that

have a run at a big event

before they're gone.

They have got a really tough group.

That is going to be a very tough group.

Obviously, they'll just be happy to be there now, having squeezed through.

But Netherlands, Austria, and France.

And this is with Austria, who usually Austria would be the one that you think, well, they're not too great, but they just beat Turkey 6-1.

Although this could always be Turkey's...

best attempt at not being dark horses.

They're probably sick of it.

What do we have to do to not be dark horses?

But no, Austria looked really good.

Presume Tony Tony Polster scored at least four of those.

Tony Polster.

But, you know, Austria really are looking like a decent side.

You know, beaten Germany,

Slovakia,

scored the fastest goal in history, of course, and just thrashed Turkey.

So, yeah, that is going to be a really tough group.

And I think

it's a real test for Lewandowski.

Can he inspire them through that group?

That would be a pretty amazing legacy if he manages it.

I should point out, Max, by the way,

a lot of people with a lot of consonants in their surnames have pulled me up on my

dismissal of Poland.

They have been to a World Cup semifinal.

I think it was in 1974.

I was one.

I don't remember it.

Yeah.

And 82.

82 they came.

So you're in 82.

Yeah.

So Phil says, not a question, but Barry might be interested to learn.

Poland had a brilliant team when he was born.

Dumped England out of the World Cup.

Finished in the top four in 74.

Grob says, can I be first to point out that Poland have reached two World Cup semifinals in Barry's lifetime?

Although he would have been in a cop for one of of them, third in 82.

You know, Wilson, add some history to this if you can.

Oh, I mean, I was, I was, it's one of those things I heard Barry say, I was like, oh god, what's he done?

Like, why is he saying that?

The 82 team was really good.

I mean, that was the Bonik team.

So they were in the group with Italy and Cameroon and Peru.

That was a group with loads of draws, and then suddenly they smashed Peru, I think 5-1 in their final game.

And then,

who was the second-phase group?

Boniak got got a hat-trick against Belgium was it a 3-0 win

and then they they lost to to Italy in the in the other semi-final it was obviously the the France West Germany semi as the famous one that year but

Italy beat them two nil I think two lossy goals so yeah it was it was a

um I mean the 74 team you had Lato I mean I'm not feeling like I got this one horribly wrong no I was I was about to say listen we're all doing our jobs here Barry said something slightly silly Wilson comes on to correct it with historical truth.

That's fine.

But, you know, I think third twice is quite good for a country inside of Poland.

Also, they provided one of a linesman in 86

who went.

What was he called?

He went on to be called the head of the Polish FA.

He gave me his business card, which was a photograph of him before the 86 final, shaking hands with Maradona.

I can't give his name now.

His son's involved in football as well.

Okay.

Anyway.

I mean, I feel like I've enough information now, but yes, Paul.

I feel like provided a linesman is maybe more confirming Barry's point than going against it.

I mean, provided a linesman, you'll never sing that, isn't it?

They had the referee from the last week of Parliament.

A martyniak.

That's true.

Right.

Quite a good one.

Anyway, Ben, look, we know you're on your sick bed.

So, look,

thanks for coming.

And

have a lovely day.

I feel better now.

I feel better for that influx.

Yeah, absolutely right.

It's medicine.

The pod is medicine.

Sleep well, Ben.

Cheers, Ben Fisher there.

In the other qualifiers, Georgia beat Greece on penalties.

Stephen says, 10 years of hurting counting for Greece and myself.

It never felt so sick watching us lose on penalties to Georgia.

Wilson, you had quite an ordeal trying to watch this game on

Fireplay.

They're just the worst people in the world.

I've cancelled my subscription already.

They're an absolute joke.

So, in theory, you can get it on your TV through Sky.

So I paid my $14.99, even though it says $11.99 on the TV screen.

It never pops up there.

So I'm having to watch it on my iPad.

And then they, they, 117 minutes in, they cut to adverts for like, I don't know, 90 seconds or so.

It comes back.

Oh, at least it's back for the penalties.

Oh, no, we're going off to do Wales now.

Just ignore the penalties completely.

So absolute shambles.

Yeah, just, and

I couldn't, because I couldn't get it on the TV.

I rang the helpline.

Oh, no, we've stopped at at six o'clock.

This is like five past six.

It's just,

I can't think of a more contemptuous treatment of football.

If you're going to buy the rights, treat it with some respect.

I think

what are you A for doing, giving it to this joke of a company?

I'm certainly all with Jürgen Klopp.

I think you should lamp that Danish lady.

I think as well, and

I only saw a highlights package.

I'm pretty sure they didn't even have a commentator on the Ireland game.

I think Ukraine, Iceland, they certainly didn't have a commentator.

Let me feel like you're just there in the ground.

That's the experience that they're going for.

And that George Agrees scheme was the 90 minutes, was rubbish, but the extra time was really good.

And then I thought I'd fallen asleep on the sofa.

I was watching it, and then suddenly Wales was on.

I was like, what happened?

Occasionally, you're watching a tennis match at Wimbledon, and you know, they all blend into each other, don't they?

And then it's just another one, and you realise you have fallen asleep on the sofa.

Um,

how we manage to see it aside, Paul, this is so big for Georgia, isn't it?

It's huge, it's absolutely huge.

And what it

also brings uh into sort of stark relief is

how important this nations league playoff pathway can be for nations like Georgia.

So that's what's allowed them to get here: this kind of second route in.

And it's just lovely, like seeing that station, seeing that stadium erupt and seeing what it means to them for the first time they've ever been in a major tournament.

And and the fact that in like 2015, so not you know, we're going back a decade, but they were they were really in dire straits.

They were about, I think, 150 in the world.

They were, you know, really didn't look like they were going anywhere fast.

And the way that they've managed to turn that around in a relatively short space of time is fantastic.

Yeah.

The thing about Georgia is

that they've really really worked hard

and use the Nations League for what it's supposed to be there for.

And they've pumped loads of money into their infrastructure at home.

They've got UAF grants to improve stadiums and whatnot.

They've built this great youth system.

And while I'm sure Football Association with delusions of adequacy like the Football Association of Ireland have, I think they would do very well to send someone over to Georgia and study what they've done and try and implement the same thing in Ireland because they're doing everything right and Ireland are doing everything wrong and they're going to the Euros and Ireland aren't within an ass's roar of qualifying for a competition.

So good that Kvara Shelia will be at the Euros along with his mates in a group with Portugal, the Czech Republic and Dark Horses for the Euros and Group F Turkey.

Also Ukraine beat Iceland 2-1.

I mean great for McCullough Mudrick to score the winner given the season he's had but just amazing for Ukraine to make it Wilson and and we said this when they lost that playoff to Wales for the World Cup and it does seem so trite to make this point but it's really hard to get to the top of the news agenda and that actually matters if you're a country at war and their story will be told at least three times in this tournament yeah absolutely I mean if you remember the last year was there was a controversy over their shirts because they'd they had a map of the of a country sort of in the weave of in the is that the the jacquard is that that what it's called and they included crimea which you know had been invaded in 2014 i think they also had a had a slogan on the collar

a pro-ukrainian slogan i can't remember what it was so i i'm sure there'll be you know similar gestures this time but yeah it's in some ways football is meaningless given what's going on in ukraine but in other ways it is a symbol of hope it is um a way of reminding the world what's what's what's going on and you know we've seen countless examples through history of countries going through terrible times where the football team has won something, and that is a moment of joy and hope for countries that don't have that.

And Mudrick, I think, to be fair to him, I think actually in the last couple of months, he's started to look like the player, not maybe not quite the player that Chelsea thought they were signing, but you can see the quality that's there.

I think he's starting to settle.

I thought the Newcastle game, particularly, I thought he, I mean, he took his goal really well in that game, but after he came off the bench in that game, he looked good.

So, I think Mudrick has shown signs the last couple of months of getting back towards the sort of levels that we were hoping for.

And yeah, that goal, was it a slight scuff?

I'm not sure, but

he takes it first time, gets yeah, exactly, gets the angle right.

He's put the ball in the right place ultimately.

So they're going to a group with Romania, Slovakia, and Belgium.

And that'll do for part one.

Part two, we will talk about Belgium and their draw with England at Wembley.

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Max here.

Barry's here too.

Hello.

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Welcome to part two of the Guardian Football Weekly.

We, Barry, got the silver medal in the Sports Journalist Association Awards podcast of the year,

losing out to

This is Everton, a BBC Sounds production.

I mean, I'm embarrassed and ashamed with silver.

That's not what we're here for.

We're gold or nothing.

I i didn't even know we'd entered if i'm honest well yeah it's one of those um journalism competitions you have to send in an entry so i'm basically blaming producer joel for our failure to win i'm as embarrassed as you are but i would like to congratulate the makers of uh that everton podcast and i hope that it will emerge they overspent and they'll be relegated to silver and we'll get the gold retrospectively

producer joel says, I only had the raw materials available to me, which is fair.

I'm presuming producer Joel's entry comprised of lots of our worthy but dull podcasts and none of my waspish, humorous asides or inaccurate comments about the history of Polish football.

Speaking of which, Mikol Iskiewicz was the linesman in the 1986 one.

There we are.

I've been sitting on the edge of my seat right now.

To Wembley, then England to Belgium 2.

Barney yelled at me on

Monday for finding the Brazil game boring.

But I thought that was boring, and I thought this pool wasn't boring.

I thought this was a really good game.

Yeah, it wasn't boring, and that was quite unsettling, wasn't it?

A friendly that wasn't dull.

But then people aren't happy with that either, particularly, are they?

I think

there's been a fair amount of people saying that, you know, certainly if you go on social media, which no one ever should, a lot of people bemoaning the performance, that we didn't put Belgium away, that we struggled to even get a draw with Belgium.

Personally, I enjoyed it, but I do see that

in combination, the Brazil and Belgium games do leave a few slightly worrying questions

for Southgate to answer.

I can see that.

Yeah, I was actually, I found it really positive.

Pete says,

a Barnesian take here.

In my eyes, that was a very useful, friendly.

Mainu looks at home.

Pickford got his howler out of the system.

Gomez proves the the value of having cover that midfield

Wilson of of

Maynu Rice and and Bellingham that was interesting we talked a lot about how we need a holding midfielder but I thought Rice was incredibly disciplined and proved that he can do the role as a six and actually Maynu and an eight looked really really classy yeah he he did my concern would be um that

I think Belgium found it slightly too easy to counter-attack and I think that would be a criticism on Saturday as well that the Brazil counter-attacked a bit too easily.

And I think that's why Southgate likes having the two holding players there to give you a bit of protection.

So, that's the reservation, but yeah, he looked really good on the ball,

scurried about, won the ball back.

You know, the penalty came from him not playing the easy pass, but from turning.

So, I think there's a huge amount to be positive about there.

I'm a bit uneasy about somebody making an England debut three months before the tournament, and suddenly he's the first choice.

But I sort of feel, I don't know,

maybe this isn't fair to blame Serpier for this, but there's been sort of a sense of drift about that midfield.

There's been sort of a, well, we know that Rice is going to play there, and we know that Bellingham is going to play there.

We just need to find the third one.

And there's sort of been this hope that eventually Calvin Phillips would stop playing.

And when he did, he'd go back to being the player he was over last year's.

And that's clearly just not the case.

And I think probably was never going to be the case.

I mean, I guess it's possible if he has a brilliant final two months of the season that he does force his way back in, but I think that's unlikely because I think he's just not going to start for West Ham at the minute.

I think Barney's idea of playing John Stones is a nice one, but you want to have tried it before now.

I think you look at somebody like Curtis Jones, he would seem to have the attributes to play there, but

he's played under a thousand minutes this season.

And again, we haven't tried it yet.

So it sort of feels like that's been a question for a while and we don't really have an answer.

And maybe, maybe it is that Maynew is the best available answer.

I mean, certainly look more comfortable there than Gallagher did on Saturday, albeit probably against less talented opposition.

I was surprised Jared Brantwood didn't get a run out over the two games.

I thought he probably should have started yesterday.

Kind of know what Lewis Dunk can do, and what Lewis Dunk can do is give away a goal in each of the two friendlies England played.

He could have come on when John Stones was injured, but he didn't get a run out.

Cole Palmer didn't get any minutes either.

But, you know, as far as I'm concerned, Garth South Korea can't do right for doing wrong.

But,

yeah, I enjoyed that game.

The one thing I thought, if that was a competitive fixture, that counter-attack Belgium had in injury time, Doku probably would have kept running for the corner flag and held the ball up and won a corner, and England wouldn't have got their opportunity to score the equaliser.

So,

you know, Belgium will have learned something there, I'd imagine.

Yeah, I mean, actually, I mean, you mentioned those points about Duncan, and

I was thinking that if Maguire had made those mistakes over these two games, he'd have been absolutely hammered for that.

Jack did say, has Branthwaite had an argument with the dinner lady or something?

But, you know, there are only a finite number of minutes, I guess, to play in these games.

I thought there were other positives, though.

I thought Jared Bowen looked really good, Paul.

And I thought Ivan Tony as well linked the play in a slightly different way to Kane, but looked more like for like than...

Watkins.

Yeah, I agree.

And I think one of the most worrying things from the Brazil game was the sense that without Kane, it was very hard to see, you know, it was very hard to see how we get around that dependence on Kane.

So for Tony to play like that,

I thought was a really big plus.

I think generally there were pluses to take from those performances.

And

I think the other thing people do is they tend to imagine that while England are showing these potential Achilles heels ahead of a big tournament, other nations are all just waltzing through looking completely, you know, impervious.

But actually, you know, France, if you watch France against Germany, they did not look good.

You know, they lost to Germany.

They've got 37-year-old Giroux having to score the winner against Chile.

France are not looking completely as you'd want them to look.

Spain drew with Brazil and lost to Colombia.

So I think

obviously there is this huge pressure on Southgate and England to deliver at this tournament.

And being one of the favourites means

you expect to see this team that is absolutely, you know, completely bulletproof.

But the truth is, no one is at the moment.

And I think England's got as good a chance as anyone else based on the other teams that I'm watching.

Perhaps not based on history, but we'll get there.

Yes, Wilson, sorry.

I was away last week and so I kind of came back to find there's this bizarre ongoing argument about the cross on the shirt.

But

is it well known what that Belgian kit is?

Did they used to is it Stunthorpe or Tintin?

It's one of the two, right?

It's Tintin, yeah.

It's Tintin, yeah.

Which I find remarkable, isn't it?

I kind of

all in favour.

I think England should have maybe a Sherlock Holmes kit.

So say Captain Pugwash, What's your Tintin?

Is Tintin Sherlock Holmes?

I mean,

Captain Pugwash is it?

Detective thing, I guess I mean rather than the cartoon thing necessarily.

I don't know, Danger Mouse.

Is that our equivalent?

Danger mouse.

Yeah.

Yeah, I think that's fine.

And England's kit was what was like raisin and sesame.

Was it?

What recipe has raisin and sesame?

What what on earth's going on there?

I mean, Belgium have a very limited number of famous people to to choose from, so it was probably tinting or urkule puirow

in which case they'd all have had to have you know that little wax and that's a wax moustaches

and a monocle

and a bowler hat well we we should have embraced that we should have gone markle b poirot that would have been great yeah really good what the england team dressed as old women yeah sort of a sort of i don't know like a lilac coloured twin set and a small shawl yeah doing a bit of knitting on the bench yeah yeah yeah really nice and belgium we're all in bowler hats, you know, and the carcinograph has to take it off before he heads the ball and put it back.

And you know,

they're each carrying a cane,

spats maybe would have made it difficult, but you know, yeah, that is true.

Um,

uh, oh, clearly, had that been the case, then Belgium wouldn't have messed it up at the end, that's when they'd have worked it all out.

Well, hang on, bit, would they?

I mean,

are you saying Primo beats Marple?

I'm not sure about that at all.

I think Marple may have beats a question.

Wow,

I don't.

But on what basis?

I think she's smarter.

I think she doesn't have the ego.

Power.

I think Poira's ego gets in the way too much.

You think he's a bluffer?

He's a bullshitter.

Everyone he's ever put away is innocent.

He has to do the grand dramatic gesture at the end, get everybody together.

Whereas Marple, she's constantly suggesting to policemen going, have you

thought about the bitten nails?

What does that tell you?

I mean, I literally watched Body in the Library last week.

That's why I'm using that example.

I think she's a much more constructive presence.

I don't know.

Poirot would be Poirot would be great at gathering them for extra time.

That's what it always feels like he does, isn't it?

He gathers everyone around.

He's like, you, you're taking a penalty.

If it goes to penalties, I'm backing Poirot.

But I think Marpe lasts for over 90 minutes.

And she's always knitting things together in the middle, isn't she?

Yeah.

It's a very good point.

Can I ask you, Wilson, about Phil Foden?

I mean,

sorry to go back to football, but I thought

he was really good in that second half.

And he floated.

I couldn't really work out.

He wasn't sticking to the left side, but it didn't matter.

It didn't seem to matter.

Whereas, you know, Bowen is sort of the SACA replacement.

But Foden had a freer role and it looked nice.

It did.

And I think that's a good thing.

I think the one danger with that, and I think you saw that that last sort of 10 minutes or so as England were desperately chasing the equaliser, was things did get quite congested in the middle.

And I guess that's when you need Chilwell to be getting forward and overlapping on the left.

And I wonder if that was the logic of playing, of starting off with Concert at right back, that

Chilwa can go forward, Concert tucks in, you then have effective back three, and

there's that sort of internal balance of Ferdinand comes in field, Chilwa goes outside him, and

Concert is paradoxically the person who from right back provides a balance for what's happening on the left wing.

So I think that probably was the logic.

I'm sort of fascinated by this new trend of centre-backs playing at full back and

why that's become the case.

I mean, if you think of the City Arsenal game on Sunday with Walker injured, the probability is all four fullbacks will be centre-backs.

And so I think it's interesting that Southgate is sort of on that already.

We tried it with Tamori on the other side back in November against, was it the North Macedonia game or the, I think it was, wasn't it, around the Malta game?

Why do you think that is?

Because in my mind,

the life of the fullback has changed so much that they're all nippy, short, nippy, like forward-running

players.

And now now centre-backs aren't that.

Well, this is what my column's gonna be on for Sunday.

So, hopefully, between now and then, I'll have worked out why it is.

I think it's

there's an increasing realization you need to find a way to counter the counters.

And the way we were doing that was through

deep-lying midfielders, but you might as well just do it with defenders.

There's less running involved with wingers increasingly cutting in, although you're looking for ways to provide extra width.

Having your defensive player in the fullback position is maybe the best way to count the opposition's best goal score.

If you think how many goal scores now come from wide,

there might be a sort of reactive element to that.

I don't know, I'm not convinced by any of this, but hopefully, before I file this on Friday, I will have found out.

I'd look forward to it.

You know,

I don't have many other interesting things said this game.

Look, Madison did what he was meant to do, right?

He came on, set up a goal.

That was good.

We haven't really talked about Jude Bellingham, Baz.

What did you make of it?

He obviously missed that big chance, but what did you make of his performance?

I didn't think it was one of his better performances, if I'm honest.

But, you know,

he scored the late equaliser.

Otherwise,

nothing he did particularly stood out for me, but he's nailed on to start.

He obviously should start.

He's on his day, probably England's best player.

Possibly Folden is the only one I'd say who's arguably more natural, gifted.

But, yeah, I think it was a sort of...

6-7 out of 10 for Jude Bellingham in that game.

OptaStat saying that Jordan Pickford's first mistake that has led to a goal in 60 England appearances.

It feels, Paul, like

there have been so many more than because he's got a chaos guy.

It feels weird that that's his first one.

It was a really funny one.

It looked like a computer game, didn't it?

As he just ran directly past the ball.

It did.

It really did, actually.

Yeah, it was just like a computer game goal in that you could almost see it as well.

You can almost see it in slow motion.

You became aware that this had happened sort of in real time as he did.

And you were like, oh,

that's a goal then.

It's a really odd goal in fact if i had to compare it to anything i saw over the week um i don't know if anyone's seen the amazing own goal that um that latvia scored oh yeah lichtenstein now this was a computer game goal in all ways in that it felt like someone had fallen asleep on their controller like latvia basically under zero pressure managed to pass the ball into their own goal and there's an element of that with pickford it was like oh he's just sort of malfunctioned in a weird way and you're right it feels like it happens more often than it actually does but i feel like with goalkeepers there's this problem where once they develop a reputation for something, it's really hard to get that out of your system.

And I never know if it's totally justified with a goalkeeper.

But if you feel like they're capable of that kind of moment of craziness, you never really settle with them.

You never feel totally comfortable.

And I do feel that with Pickford, however good he is, I always feel there's madness in him.

And yet, I don't know, as you say, it's probably not borne out by the stats, which is really interesting.

I think also because he apologizes for so long, like in so many different ways, that I felt like he was still apologising like 25 minutes later, either to himself or to just someone else, or just you know, sort of being slightly Jordan Pickford's chaos man that he is.

Um, Belgium Wilson are they're they're not a bad side.

It was nice to see Jan Vertongen.

I was like, huh, that can't be Jan Vatongen, he must be 55 now.

You know, Lukaku, it's a score buckets of goals.

That cross was beautiful.

Tiedemann is a useful player.

Do you what do you think their chances are at the Euros?

I think I think better than I thought they were this time last week, or better than I thought they were after the island game at the weekend.

They had their Golden Generation, it didn't quite produce the silverware they hoped it would.

And this is now

the rebuild afterwards, which possibly is slightly overdue.

Trossar as well.

That cross from Lukaku was, you know,

he's such a weird player, Lukaku.

I don't know.

We were talking about Lautana Martinez and how he never plays well when I watch him.

Lukaku is the opposite.

Every time I see Lukaku, he's brilliant.

And I'm then sort of always baffled when I look back at him 10 games later and he hasn't scored and the crowd are booing him and he's been sent off.

And how?

He's got an amazing touch and he's huge and he's quick and he scores goals.

So I think he's the sort of player who, when he's on it, he can pretty much win any game, but he's just not necessarily on it that often.

Yeah.

He did the same cross Everton fans pointed out, I think in 2015 for what was Kone's first name?

Aruna?

Aruna Kone,

almost identical outside of the left foot cross.

Yeah, absolutely brilliant.

Although, as Baz suggested, Lewis Dunk could probably have done slightly better by just kicking it out of play.

Dunk's just been out of form for two or three months now, hasn't he?

He's sort of, as Brighton's form has declined, so his form has declined.

And I wonder if

these games are about information, is the information about Dunk that he's actually probably not one of the best four centre-backs in England and therefore,

yeah, six months ago he would have been, but now he's maybe not, and therefore, he shouldn't go.

And actually, the commentator I was watching the game on you know made a good point that Lukaku gave him a real run around when Roma beat Brighton, and so

he did it again.

So, let's hope we don't play Belgium.

They're not on our group, are they?

No, I don't think so.

Sorry, just before we get off to England, we should give a tip of the hat to uh Declan Rice,

who was handed the captaincy on the landmark occasion of his 53rd international tour?

Well done, Declan.

All right, that'll do for part two.

Part three, we'll begin with Northern Ireland's win in Scotland.

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Welcome to part three of the Guardian Football Weekly.

AC Spinner says, it's a good thing for Scots that Scotland games games aren't on free-to-air TV.

Yeah, Barcelona

was messaging me saying,

all hope has gone already.

Scotland, so they were beaten by the Netherlands, played well.

They were beaten Barry by Northern Ireland and didn't play well.

No,

they've lost.

They're without a win in seven now, drawn two, lost five.

It's not great going into a tournament, is it?

Even though it doesn't really matter.

Conor Bradley scored a wonderful goal to continue his

sort of breakthrough season, a wonderful curling shot into the top corner after a bit of a howler by Nathan Patterson who gave the ball away cheaply.

And Scotland had chances.

Liam Cooper shouldered a John McGinn free kick wide.

I think it went off his shoulder his back.

Bailey Peacock Farrell tipped the

Ferguson header over the bar and towards the end Kieran Tierney lumped one forward and Lawrence Shanklin had it sort of had an empty goal to head into and put it wide so they could have got a draw or possibly won it but they didn't and it is a concern for them going to the tournament but they just have to put it behind them I suppose on the flip side it's a great result for Northern Ireland right it's a decent result for Northern Ireland I mean we get sick for not giving them enough coverage and it is fair stick we would probably give them more coverage if I'd been born 200 miles up the road or if Ellis James was from Belfast yeah yeah yeah but the other reason we don't talk about them much is because they don't really give us much reason to talk about them I mean in their Euro qualifiers they finished second from bottom in a six team group containing Denmark Slovenia Finland Kazakhstan and San Marino not the most frightening group in the world they got beaten home in a way by Kazakhstan they lost seven out of ten and their only result of note was a win over Denmark at uh windsor park when Denmark had already qualified.

So

that's kind of the reason we don't talk about Northern Ireland because they don't give us much reason to sit up and take notice.

But they do have a very young side.

They've got Conor Bradley, obviously, Shea Charles, Southampton,

who's a very good player.

Is he the guy that was at City?

Yes, yeah.

He's now at Southampton.

They're starting 11 yesterday.

No one was, I think, 29 was the oldest.

Nobody

six players aged 22 or younger.

So

their team, it's largely championship players, apart from Bradley.

And then Bailey Peacock Farrell is on loan in Denmark, I think, from Burnley.

And

Isaac Price is a young fellow who's at standard liaison.

So

they've got plenty to build on.

I suppose that's the best thing.

And they won this game.

That's the best thing you can say about Northern Ireland at the moment.

Meanwhile, the calves of Shakiri Baz saw off the Republic, One goal to hill.

Yeah,

a free kick

into the bottom corner.

Ireland were okay in this game.

They lost.

The focus now turns off field.

There's a AGM of the FAI or some sort of meeting today in which this CEO, Jonathan Hill, is expected to get fired.

He's been sort of embroiled in this financial scandal because he took holiday pay that he wasn't entitled to gave it back and then gave two very unconvincing appearances in front of what you would call a government select committee um in which

you know if it was an honest it may well have been an honest mistake i think that was his claim but he

he just appeared very shifty yeah so it looks like he's going to get the bullet today which means ireland won't have a see the fai won't have a ceo they won't have a manager gus poye's name is in the frame, he's available now.

For CEO, this is exciting.

No, no, for manager, he's available now, obviously, because Greece got knocked out by Georgia.

A lot of people think John O'Shea might just get it because he's already there and it's convenient, but it's very rudderless and

depressing.

The government, the erotus hearing, I've become mildly obsessed by these, mainly because Irish football seems to have them about every three months.

And

I think you're slightly underplaying how farcical the whole thing is.

Yeah, I am.

Well, I've seen other ones

relating to matters that have nothing to do with football.

So, his claim was that in an email to a junior member of staff, he'd sort of said, yes, you've got days in lieu, you can, or you've got holiday pay, you can take cash for that instead.

For days of holiday, you haven't taken.

And then, jokingly, he'd said, maybe you can sort out the same thing for me.

But then his way of showing this was to offer an email in which every single thing on the email had been redacted, including the Facebook address, the Twitter address, the email address.

The only things that were on there were the badge and the little Twitter symbol.

That was it.

The rest was just blacked out.

Well, the FAI were, you know, they knew this hearing was coming and

they waited to the very, very last minute to submit this trench of thousands and thousands and thousands of documents, many of which were completely redacted and it's just their general shiftiness that and it's you know it's ingrained into them they just can't do things honestly it may well have been a genuine error and if they could have just gone look sorry it was a a mess or it was a mistake an accident of giving the money back grand no problem and obviously they're accountable to the government because they're reliant on the government for funding because

john delaney spaffed so much of their money during his regime that they're completely broke.

I totally see why you find it funny because it is funny, but I find it quite depressing.

All I'm saying is, I would rather watch an oroctus hearing to Irish football than Irish.

The Irish Independent are reporting that the government has suspended funding in the region of half a million euros until the FAI are compliant over the CEO repayments, with a spokesperson for the Minister for Sport and Physical Education, Thomas Burns, stating Sport Island are actively engaging with the FAI in relation to this, and we understand that the FAI have recently written to Sport Island to confirm their intention to achieve compliance.

Unless, of course, they redacted all those words in the letter.

By the way, Wilson, if if you found this eroctous hearing

eroctous, by the way, for is the Irish word sort of government, parliament.

If you found this one entertaining, I would urge you to

find the one that Delaney appeared in front of because that was just dynamite.

I've been watching them for a while.

I'm a big fan of these.

Paul, you went to San Marino

for one of their games against St.

Kitts and Nevis.

This was Builders, their first chance to win a game in what, 20 years?

It was indeed.

Yes, it was indeed.

A few listeners might know, I run a podcast, co-host podcast called The Sweeper at Sweeper Pod.

And we focus on the weird and wonderful of football, the sort of obscure teams.

And one of those is Samarino.

We are a bit obsessed with Samarino.

So they haven't won in 20 years.

Their last win was against Liechtenstein in 2004.

It's now gone to 138 games without a win.

Six of those are draws.

So

the excitement in our little community of obscure football lovers was that Samarino might have a chance to win.

They were actually Bookie's favourites going into this game.

They're two friendlies against St.

Kitts and nevis and obviously most of the reason why sanrino lose is because they have a very tiny player pool you know that there's a lot of good reasons but they also play against european nations so they're very unlikely to beat the likes of denmark or you know that's not going to happen but when you pair them off against another continental team there was suddenly this possibility actually who knows who knows whether consistence at concac stacks up against uefa you know how do they compare so coming into this game against st kits and nevis they were bookie's favorites to win which is a complete rarity.

So I felt I kind of had to get out there and see if they could make history.

And for about 20 minutes, it all went very well.

San Marino had this weird position of running the game.

They were dominating possession and they got a penalty, quite a soft penalty.

Filippo Barardi absolutely lashed it in.

Amazing pair.

Didn't look like the penalty of a man.

who had just become second top scorer for his nation with three goals.

So

that's the level at which San Mario Marianese strikers are at.

He's on a hot street.

He's on a hot street.

They all look very good for a bit.

And there's barely any San Marianese people come to these games.

There's a few hundred gathered together.

Most of them are school kids who basically get frog marched there and told you're going to watch this game.

But what they do have is an ultras group.

I say this fairly lightly.

There's about 25 foreigners, mostly Italians and a couple of Germans, who turn up to every single San Marino game and call themselves the Brigata Majuna Gioya, so never any joy brigade.

And they actually founded after the win against Liechtenstein, so they have literally never seen this team win.

And this tiny group of about, I think it was about 12 of them on the day, were going absolutely mad and it all looked great.

And then it collapsed spectacularly.

And the reason for that is basically because a few months ago, both San Marino goalkeepers quit within 48 hours of each other.

So the older one, Aldo Simoncini, was always likely to retire.

He was about 37.

He's seen some things, that guy.

Amongst other things, he set an incredible record that him and his twin brother both scored an own goal in the same international match.

And I don't think that will ever be beaten.

So

he retired.

So look, enough's enough.

But then his deputy, who's only 28, also retired, presumably thinking, God, I don't want to take this on.

Like, they used to alternate games.

And I think he must have thought, I'm not picking the ball out of the net week in, week out.

so they were left with this new goalkeeper Eduardo Colombo's Juventus youth goalkeeper back in the day he's only 24 and he just had a bit of a nightmare he um gave they gave away two soft goals one before halftime one after halftime both really were just just awful goals to give away uh and that was it once you see samarino go need three goals to win you know they need three to win you think yeah we're fairly safe to say this isn't going to happen today and it and it didn't they lost 3-1 and to be fair to st kitts and Nivers as well, like a lot of really talented European-based players

getting a chance to play, whereas they don't usually,

they did look really decent.

So then they also had a second friendly coming up, and they drew that 0-0.

And Sam Marino really were sort of banging on the door of this one.

But I had left San Marino four days earlier, so a little bit of me was thinking, if they win this one, I'm going to take that quite personally.

Do you think San Marino would have done better if they had Marple or Poirot in goal instead of Colombo?

very good

their manner their manager did start to look like you he he was looking like poirot a little bit on the side he look had this haggard like disbelieving look and i think if he could have murdered a couple of his players and got away with it he probably would have done american virgin islands played the british virgin islands thanks to dell saying are we surprised that in the battle of the virgins neither side could score

10-year-olds playgrounds very good calling people virgins it went to penalties didn't it paul it did indeed.

And what I love most about this game, so

this is a World Cup qualifier in CONCACAF.

I say two Virgin Islands coming against each other, 70 kilometers apart.

And

the game isn't on anywhere.

There's no stream.

So what we're having to do is

it was it really?

If it was, I couldn't find it, but it probably is now just buffering.

I was going on the tweets of a Spanish journalist who was out there, and that was the only way we could get any information, except occasionally you could DM the FA themselves and get a message back.

So this was how we followed the other game, Turks and Caicos versus Anguilla.

You could message the Turks and Caicos Islands FA and they'd send you back a score update.

It was like going back 20 years.

But yeah, it was amazing, like really scrappy old pitch, scruffy football

going towards 0-0,

roosters running along the sideline.

There were like loads of roosters that just kept trying to invade the pitch.

It was everything that you want from like lower level international football.

And yeah, British Virgin Islands prevailed.

Chris Colombia's British Virgin Islands no less prevailed on penalties.

And it was funny because the US Virgin Islands did that thing where they bring on a goalkeeper for the penalties and then lost.

So

always a lesson to be learned there.

That producer John says, were any of the roosters running the line Polish?

Was his question?

I'm going to have to defer to Wilson on that one.

But yeah, it was amazing, amazing game.

And also worth a quick mention for Anguilla, who beat Turks and Caicos on penalties in their World Cup qualifier.

That is their first time ever reaching the second stage of World Cup qualification.

But they also hadn't won a match since 2010 in a competitive official match.

So really huge for these nations.

Yeah.

The Basque country played Uruguay in a friendly, which I missed.

Did you see that one?

Yeah, well, I didn't see the actual game.

I saw the build-up to it.

Obviously, Marcelo Bielsa, coaching Uruguay, coming back to Bill Bowes.

He's sort of a legend.

So yeah, amazing.

So Bass Country gets to play in set windows that the Spanish FA allow them to play, and they're not allowed to play any other time.

They hadn't played for four years, so quite a big sort of moment for them.

They have an incredible squad, you know, as you'd expect.

They have an incredible squad.

And if they were allowed into UEFA, I think there'd be a sort of mid-level UEFA side, like they would be able to compete.

But politically, that is never going to happen.

UEFA is very much a closed shop to

anything but like universally recognized independent nations.

So Gibraltar had to get sort of barge their way in through the court for arbitration court of arbitration for sport.

No one else is coming into UEFA now, I don't think.

So yeah, Basque Country have made moves towards trying to get into UEFA, I think.

There's certainly a a strand of people there who really want to get into UEFA, but it it isn't going to happen.

So these friendlies every now and again are basically a really nice outlook for them to sort of express that identity.

Can you play for the best country?

And I mean, obviously, Spain are playing at the same time most of the time, right?

But if you, if you, if you could, could Spain, could you play for both?

Yeah, you can play for both.

But as you say, the window often means that the two are playing at the same time.

So if you get a Spanish call, you're expected to take it.

And it would, you know, and obviously, if you're only getting a game every four years for the Basque Country, then however passionate you are about that, you probably aren't going to throw in your World Cup chances for that.

Anything else, Paul, on the, you know, on the doing the the rounds on the sweeper?

Alderney.

I've got to mention Alderney before we go.

Alderney have arguably the hardest run in the history of football.

They play in the Marati, so Channel Islands has a football competition, Jersey, Guernsey, and Alderney.

Every year there's a semi-final, which is Alderney against Jersey or Guernsey, and then the winner plays the other one of Jersey or Guernsey.

Alderney won it in 1920, but they have not won a single game in it since.

So they had 103 years of hurt going into this year.

It's now 104.

They did, to be fair, they ran Guernsey pretty close.

It was a dreadful day, like rain belting down, terrible pitch,

0-0 at halftime, and you just started to wonder.

And then, sure enough, Guernsey pulled away.

But yeah, they play this game every year, and every year Oldney come out and play, and every year they lose.

But it's an amazing atmosphere.

I was there in 2016, and I'd strongly recommend it for just that.

It's a hard, hard, hard team to sort of get out every year, have to find a team to come out and play, but it's amazing.

Bergerac with the late winner, and then he has to he plays boom to see who will who will play miss marble was bergerac a detective i don't know yes he was jersey yeah yeah he was he and he's from he's from jersey as well so it's a fair cool yeah i i was at the the final of marathi i can't remember when

eight years ago something like that uh in guernsey and there was a whole load of the tizier brothers involved i think it was was it like the 100th anniversary of the Guernsey FA or something.

I got invited to the dinner.

It was a

really good occasion, nice atmosphere.

I was invited on local radio afterwards.

It was a lot of fun.

Did you do a, was it, you know, were you the keynote speaker, Wilson, in this or not?

Not at the dinner, but like, I was on the radio for a long, long time.

I mean, people must have been terribly bored.

Not as long as Ben Fisher was on five live talking about conference.

No interview has ever felt longer.

Let's be real.

The extraordinary thing about that was they lost the connection and then rang him again.

Lucian says, not a question, but you may be interested to know.

This is on Robbie Earnshaw and whether today, you know, whether we know any day as any day.

And he says, not a question, but you may be interested to know that October the 17th, 1582, was the first Sunday of our modern era, following the adoption of the Gregorian calendar two days earlier, which erased 10 days from history.

Therefore, last Sunday was a Thursday if you kept the Julian calendar.

But we don't know if Robbie Earnshaw keeps that calendar or not.

But there we are.

Last Sunday was Thursday.

And so this Wednesday is

I don't know.

Friday.

It's Sunday.

Today is Sunday.

Today is Sunday.

Okay, well, that's great news for Robbie.

And Tony says, I'm assuming you were referring to our Foreign Deputy Prime Minister Grant Robertson today

on the subject of politicians who look like Barry.

This has now just descended into politicians who wear spectacles.

This is true.

Yeah, this is true.

Maybe we should,

you know, put a lid on it.

And that'll do for today.

Thank you, Jonathan.

Cheers, single.

Thanks, Paul.

Thank you.

Thanks, Baz.

Thank you.

Football Weekly is produced by Dole Grove.

Our executive producer is Danielle Stevens.

We'll be back tomorrow.

This is The Guardian.