FETISHED WITH KAYLA YU

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Speaker 5 My guest today, Kayla Yu, has been an actress, an import model, the lead singer of rock band Nylon Pink, a travel journalist, and now she put out a super powerful book called Fetished: A Reckoning with Yellow Fever, Feminism, and Beauty.

Speaker 5 I hope you guys enjoy this super important conversation with Kayla, among other things, about how people have a tendency to stereotype women and putting us in boxes.

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Speaker 5 Sleeping Dove home. Kyla, welcome to Cat on the Loose.
Thanks so much for having me.

Speaker 5 I am so happy that you're here because, as I was saying, I was reading your book, and what a powerful, raw, and real read. So, first of all, congratulations.

Speaker 6 Thank you so much for reading it.

Speaker 5 Yes, no, I read it, and here's proof. I took a lot of notes.

Speaker 5 But you are very raw, and you really open up. And I know how tough that is because, as women, before we talk about your specific subject, fetished, I love the name, we get so judged,

Speaker 5 right? By everything we do. So, I can only imagine what it took for you to put everything out there.

Speaker 6 Yeah, I think it's because I've been sober 11 years. And then in that community, we're very open and honest about like the worst things that have happened to us.

Speaker 6 So I've spent years just like talking about these things to people who've done the same or worse.

Speaker 5 It's a big part of healing, right?

Speaker 6 Yes. It's like.
I believe in like taking your secrets and just saying them because it takes the power away.

Speaker 5 Same. That's kind of like what has been happening with me doing the podcast.
I get messages. People say, oh my God, you're so open.
You talk about it.

Speaker 5 I'm like, yes, because it's been so healing to me. And we learn so much as we go.

Speaker 6 And it's healing healing for other people to hear someone talking about it.

Speaker 5 Absolutely. So so many things I want to cover.
Like, as you can see, I took like a million notes because the subject is so rich. Let's try to pack it in as much as we can.

Speaker 5 Name of the book, very powerful, fetished.

Speaker 5 A reckoning with yellow fever feminism and beauty. How did you come up with the name? Like, what was your first thought?

Speaker 6 Well, it's funny because my original title was Yellow Fever Hustler.

Speaker 6 And then like my editor was telling people about the book, and they were like, Yellow fever, like malaria?

Speaker 6 Yeah, so we were like, Okay, we need to change that because not everybody knows what it means. And she came up with the title fetishized, so I love it.

Speaker 6 And then, once I heard it, I was like, Okay, just that one word. It's not a common word, so it really catches your attention.

Speaker 5 It does, and it's very powerful.

Speaker 5 But since you mentioned yellow fever and you talk about it in the book, for people that are listening to us and they don't understand what it is, can you give them like a

Speaker 5 simple explanation?

Speaker 6 yeah so somebody with the asian fetish is like a man usually non-asian who

Speaker 6 um

Speaker 6 really treats asian women as like objects and disposable expects them to be submissive um and very hypersexual and then i get in trouble a lot like i just posted a video about the asian fetish and all these guys got mad at me like how dare you but i'm like i didn't say a preference means you have a fetish

Speaker 6 just because you're married to an Asian woman doesn't mean you have a fetish.

Speaker 6 It's like the specific, do you treat women as lower than you?

Speaker 5 Yeah, no. And listen, I was looking at your videos on social media.
And this is what I say, because of course I get a lot of backlash as well.

Speaker 5 If somebody doesn't agree, they have two choices. They can go and read your book and educate themselves or, you know, trolls will be trolls.

Speaker 5 And I think you just got to do your thing at the end of the day.

Speaker 5 So let's start because there's so much.

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Speaker 5 You literally open the book with this word, which is very powerful

Speaker 5 as well. Asia, Asia file, Asia file.

Speaker 5 The term applies to a non-Asian person, particularly like you're saying, white man who has yellow fever, which you just explain what it is.

Speaker 5 They think all Asian chicks are hot, usually can tell the difference between, cannot tell the difference between a homely and acute one, just as long as she's Asian. And you are very clear now.

Speaker 5 You're not talking about, because I have friends as well. They're married to Asian girls and whatever.
preference, right? We are attracted to whatever we are attracted to.

Speaker 5 But you're talking to that specific guy that looks at Asian girls as

Speaker 6 like objects for them to use like tissues basically and do you think I mean I would guess that's a lot because of the stereotype they have with the Asian culture well it's because like when Western

Speaker 6 when Westerners first encountered Asian women it was usually through military colonialism so In those situations, they usually met prostitutes and they never met any regular Asian women.

Speaker 5 So then it was their first time meeting asian women they just associated that with all asian women which is like seems simplistic but it is what happened yeah that's the problem with stereotypes right i give you an example in my case that's why i think i related so much with you and the book you're asian i'm latin and i know i don't look latin because my dad was french but i was born in brazil i still have the accent although i've been here pretty much my entire life and the the stereotype that everybody has with latin women especially Brazilians, is they immediately associate the culture with sex.

Speaker 6 Oh, I didn't know that.

Speaker 5 Oh, my God. Yeah.
They think like all the beaches in Brazil are nude.

Speaker 5 So many guys that I would potentially date, they're like, where are you from, Brazil? Oh, wow. Brazilian chicks are so hot.

Speaker 5 They immediately think they're going to. take me out on the first date and bang me.
It's just like a stereotype. And it's so annoying.
Yeah, it's annoying.

Speaker 5 Because as women, we want to be obviously respected as individuals, but it's annoying that these men have these

Speaker 5 preconceived ideas in their head. And I felt as I was reading your book, it's kind of the same for Asian girls with a lot of men.
Yes, yeah.

Speaker 6 Definitely. Like sometimes you'll just be out there dating and a guy will be like, I love Asian women.
And then you're like, well, I want to feel that you like me as an individual.

Speaker 5 That's just this, yeah. Or do you just want to meet an Asian girl?

Speaker 6 Yeah, any Asian girl.

Speaker 5 It's like with blondes. I know it's not a culture, but maybe you get that a lot like I've met guys like I want to date a blonde

Speaker 6 yeah that's but you know what the difference is like they don't expect a specific behavior for a blonde. Maybe more fun, but it's not necessarily more sexually.

Speaker 5 Or maybe in a way, you know, like because of Mary Monroe and all that stuff, we also get stereotyped. Like how blondes are ditzy.
Yeah, yeah. They're kind of like bombshells.
They like more sex.

Speaker 5 They're more fun fun than brunettes you know it's just it's just another stereotype but it is annoying to me when i get it so i can only imagine and you talk a lot about your experiences and i want to dive into the deeper ones but before i want to mention something has nothing to do with your book but i as i was reading your book i i i remembered it just happened to me like about a month ago i live in beverage in the flats And one day I was walking my dog, daylight, like today, for example, the middle of the day on a Saturday, I was walking my dog with my friend, and there was an Asian girl, Brunette.

Speaker 5 She was doing a photo shoot on my street because it has pretty trees. Like in the middle of the day with a professional photographer, and she had these ropes around her.

Speaker 5 So, like, she got A for for balls.

Speaker 6 Okay.

Speaker 5 She had this massive bondage ropes, like, she was all tied up.

Speaker 6 Oh, my God.

Speaker 5 And the guy was, I'm not kidding you. And the guy was shooting her in the middle of the street.

Speaker 5 Beverly hills beverly i swear to god i have the videos on my phone i was like and so my my friend and i we were so curious so i stopped and i'm like what are you guys doing and she's like oh these these videos that i do of like asian bondage get millions of views on tick tock oh my god did you ever hear of that no but now i'm curious i'm gonna look that up i could see why it would get millions of views i know so she was literally doing that and apparently but i mean the reason i ask is because as you're talking about fetish and everything, it reminded me, like, apparently, there is a big

Speaker 6 bondage, Japanese bondage.

Speaker 5 So, they associate that with the culture. And I mean, no shame in her game.
She's making her money, but she's like, oh my God, I make so much money off of these videos.

Speaker 5 Not even having contact with men, just posting them online.

Speaker 6 Wow. Now I'm so curious.

Speaker 5 And I'm pretty crazy.

Speaker 6 But yes, that is like a kind. I don't know that much about that style of Japanese bondage, but it has some like connection to sado masochism, I think, and a little bit of torture, I think.

Speaker 6 I don't know.

Speaker 6 I don't know.

Speaker 5 But that was a little crazy to me. But I want to talk about your journey because as we were saying, you're insanely open in your book.

Speaker 5 And I want to dive right in the story of your photo shoot that you got sexually attacked.

Speaker 5 And I love the way you told the story. And you can tell us better than me, of course, because you're like, you were there and you literally didn't know what to do.

Speaker 6 Yeah. And I want to stress for other women, like it wasn't an attack like he

Speaker 6 had a knife and yelled at me. I was just like frozen, like, why am I in, you know, like, it's still an attack.

Speaker 5 Yes, yes, yes, yes. You know, because not all men

Speaker 6 under, they're like, well, you didn't like. scream and say no.
Right.

Speaker 5 You know, so tell us, like, bring us, but for people that my audience, they probably haven't seen the book yet because it's literally just out now.

Speaker 5 Can you bring me to that day? I'm sure it's really painful to you, but since you already wrote about it, can you help us like dive in in terms of what happened to you?

Speaker 6 Yeah, I mean, just a simplified version of it is that I was trying to be a pinup model. Yeah.

Speaker 6 Because I saw growing up this really beautiful Asian pinup model and there were no other Asian role models. So I was like, I want to be like her.

Speaker 6 And I followed her for years and I wanted to do Playboy. And I went to this guy at his office.
Well, first of all, I found the ad ad in the school newspaper. So you were very young.

Speaker 6 Yeah, I was like 19. Wow.
And then I found the ad in the newspaper. So you would assume it's okay.
Yeah.

Speaker 6 And then I went to meet him downtown San Diego somewhere at an office. And he showed me all these beautiful calendars.
And he's like, I produce these. Come over for a test shoot and I'll submit you.

Speaker 6 Like, let's do that. And then

Speaker 6 the day I showed up, it was not, not, it was at his apartment.

Speaker 6 And then once I got in, like, I was 19.

Speaker 5 He was like middle-aged.

Speaker 6 Wow. And I just,

Speaker 6 I can't even really tell you what happened because I'm so disassociated with it. Like later, the video from that session published and I watched it.
And I'm like, I don't even remember

Speaker 6 so much of the situation. All I know was I was a virgin.

Speaker 6 So there's no way I would want this disgusting guy to my first. I was in a relationship with a boyfriend.

Speaker 5 And you thought, just to explain it, you thought you were showing up for a photo shoot session. And it happens to millions of women out there.

Speaker 6 Yeah.

Speaker 5 You think, and especially here in Hollywood, right? So I think this is such an important conversation.

Speaker 5 And if you girls are listening out there, and if you're young and you think about modeling, like watch out, right?

Speaker 6 I say always bring a photo. Yes.
Always bring a picture.

Speaker 6 And do your due diligence, right but basically you're there you're thinking i'm gonna get these fabulous photos and he starts talking to you about doing porn no he didn't even start talking he just started like slowly doing more and more and then i was like what the fuck you were afraid yeah yeah nobody knew where where i was i didn't tell anybody where i was um

Speaker 6 and yeah i just had never been in such a situation before and i didn't know how to get out of here i didn't know yeah i didn't know you were probably thinking like he's gonna hurt me or something so you guys had sex no no we whatever he did yeah we did other things besides sex yeah because the thing was

Speaker 6 here's where it was weird because then i was like i told him i was a virgin and i'm never given a blowjob so he didn't he backed off on those things

Speaker 6 so it was weird because i felt like intimidated and scared but yet he wasn't

Speaker 6 like forcefully aggressive so it was a very confusing situation yeah but he did a video of you.

Speaker 5 Yes. Yeah.

Speaker 5 And then he published the video. Yes.
And how was, how did you feel once the video came out?

Speaker 6 Well, it's crazy because like I so disassociated from that situation. Like after that assault happened,

Speaker 6 I just

Speaker 6 did, I didn't tell my boyfriend. I didn't tell anyone in the entire world and I just forgot about it.
Like I didn't forget about it, but I like

Speaker 6 made myself forget about it. But if you were to use common sense, you would say this video is going to be published.
That's like his purpose, right?

Speaker 6 So I think I forgot about it for like a year. And then

Speaker 6 my friend, my very good friend called me and he was like, I saw you in this video. Wow.
And then I knew from that moment, I was like, oh.

Speaker 5 And if and then

Speaker 5 you were like, you were thinking, I'm going to be judged.

Speaker 6 I think the first thing I thought was this was assault, but I don't know how to explain that it is.

Speaker 6 Because at that time, nobody would have understood. I think now after me too, and we like understand coercion and like now we know it's clearly that, but like back then, nobody would have understood.

Speaker 5 But I think even to this day, I agree. There are certain movements, there are certain things that happen that make women more believable.
But I do feel that even to this day,

Speaker 5 no matter what happens, like, there is always going to be that person that will be like, what do you mean? What do you mean? You didn't want to do that.

Speaker 6 Like, and like, why were you there? Yes.

Speaker 5 Like, if you say the word assault, they're like, assault? You didn't look like you're being assaulted in the video. Somehow, they always spin it on the woman.
Always, yeah.

Speaker 5 You know, like, obviously, we have a super crazy famous example in the world, like, that I think it's a mistake that so many young women make, like Kim Kardashian when she did her sex video with a boyfriend.

Speaker 5 And once the video came out,

Speaker 5 I, if you remember about it, nobody was saying, hey, what an asshole. How, how can you do it? Everybody was like talking about her.
She's a whore. The video is out.
How can they do it?

Speaker 5 So somehow I always feel that in the situations, it's always on the woman.

Speaker 6 Like what I'm loving so much right now is Pamela Anderson's rebirth.

Speaker 6 Because when her sex tape came out, which it was, it was a personal video with her boyfriend that they made in love. Yeah.
And like, you should be allowed to do that with your husband.

Speaker 6 That was her husband. It got stolen from their house.
And they published it. And when she tried to file a lawsuit, they said, but you're naked on Playboy.
Why, why is this a problem?

Speaker 5 Which is like, like, oh, you're naked on Playboy, which is a job. Yeah.
I don't deserve any privacy.

Speaker 6 Exactly. Yeah.

Speaker 5 It's, it's just crazy to me.

Speaker 6 Ruined her career. She was like on top of her career when that first and then

Speaker 6 she's been gone for decades. And I love that we're coming back.

Speaker 5 Oh, yeah, talk about like, and now that she's in love with Leonardo.

Speaker 6 Oh, I love single.

Speaker 5 That's like such a sweet love spot.

Speaker 5 But back to yours.

Speaker 5 So you're navigating, this happens to you when you're very young and you're dealing with all these stereotypes and you're navigating the entertainment industry because you're doing photo shoots, you're doing a lot of different jobs, right?

Speaker 5 How, and you're also very raw about

Speaker 5 the drug use, you're coping with all of that. So you went through some really tough waters just navigating the industry.

Speaker 6 Yeah, I think that like the drug use really happened after the assault.

Speaker 6 It happened to be like during that time the rave culture was really, really big. And I just started with ecstasy and then I got into K and then I got into pills and then I got into cocaine.

Speaker 6 But I think all of that. was a coping mechanism because on the drugs, I felt good.
I felt whole. I mean, until it wore off.
But when you're high, you feel powerful. You feel like you're not damaged.

Speaker 6 You feel worthy. So I

Speaker 6 really

Speaker 6 needed that feeling because I didn't have it.

Speaker 5 You're numbing the pain. Yeah.
And that went on for a really long time. For decades, yeah.
Oh my God, that's absolutely crazy. And you also open up.
That's another thing that I was like, wow.

Speaker 5 You decide to do eye surgery. Can you tell us about that?

Speaker 6 Yeah, it's actually a very common surgery amongst Asians because it's like something that a mom might have a girl do in Asia in like high school. Like almost her eyes.
So,

Speaker 6 you know, there's this. So the surgery was invented by a white doctor who was stationed in South Korea, I believe.
And it was to make the Asian women prostitutes' eyes more attractive to military.

Speaker 6 Oh my God. Yeah.
Not everybody knows that surgery. That's crazy, right? But in general society, we all think bigger eyes is more attractive.

Speaker 6 It's just like animals, you know, bigger eyes are more attractive. That's just the general belief out there in the world.

Speaker 6 And then Asians are, from a very young age, racist people will make fun of their eyes or they'll like do this gesture or whatever.

Speaker 6 So I think we have this kind of insecurity. And then

Speaker 6 I just felt it would make me, you know, my face look more,

Speaker 6 it would just make me more beautiful, beautiful, really. Oh, my.

Speaker 5 But well, looking back, do you regret it?

Speaker 6 Here's the thing that's really complicated. Because I wish I could be like, oh, I wish I never got any surgery.
But we do live in a society where we are rewarded for our looks, right? Yes.

Speaker 6 Like no matter how much we want to escape the patriarchy, we live in the patriarchy.

Speaker 6 And it feels good, you know, as a woman to have a fresh coat of lipstick and like get your high heels on.

Speaker 6 I don't regret this surgery. Like I

Speaker 6 was happy with that surgery. I got implants.
I'm very happy with them, you know.

Speaker 6 But if I lived in a different society where we weren't celebrating these things and pressuring women to look a certain way, then we wouldn't all feel the need to cut ourselves up to the matter.

Speaker 5 I just would hope, because obviously I think it's, it's like an absurd idea, right?

Speaker 6 That's like if you really think about it.

Speaker 5 Because it's such a, yeah, if you really think about it, because it's such a particular feature of Asian cultures, right? So when I think about it, I think it's like adorable.

Speaker 5 Like, oh, you have like these eyes like that. It's so cute.
Only they have it.

Speaker 5 So for me, when I read your book, I'm like, wow, I can't imagine like a woman thinking that she has to change one of the most

Speaker 5 precious and personal characteristics of her culture. So it was a little heartbreaking to me.

Speaker 5 to read it because I cannot imagine like a young girl feeling that she needs to do that, you know, in order to fit in any universe for that matter, you know?

Speaker 6 Well, it's crazy. It just came up recently.
I just wrote this article for Teen Vogue. I don't know if you watched Love Island, but there was a...
Bits and pieces.

Speaker 6 So there was a Love Island contestant who got kicked off the show for saying.

Speaker 5 Oh, yeah, I know that. Yeah.
So she. What did she say again?

Speaker 6 So she said the C word for Asians. Yeah, I remember.
So basically, she said.

Speaker 5 But she didn't know. She claimed that.

Speaker 6 She claimed it's possible she didn't know because I, after writing that article so many people told me they didn't know so i i get that but like she but what she said was problematic because i'm not gonna use the word but she basically said oh my eyes are looking too asian i'm gonna get botox to fix them so what she was saying was yeah but even without the word the comment is

Speaker 5 yeah so unnecessary to say the least right yeah yeah so um

Speaker 6 it's basically she was saying i need surgery to fit my eyes. So of course it's triggering to me who I've had surgery to fix that, you know.

Speaker 5 That is, yeah. And I, yeah, you didn't have to fix it.
Maybe you had the surgery because you wanted to feel better.

Speaker 5 But I don't want any Asian woman in the world to feel they have to fix anything because one of the things you talk so much about the book and towards the end of the book that I loved, it's like, we need to be accepted for what we are.

Speaker 5 And I think it's our job as communicators to keep breaking the stereotypes i do that all the time like i said being a latin woman and i get this if i had a dollar for every time somebody tells me you don't look latin you don't look latin you don't look latin you don't you should color your hair brown you should colour your hair brown because latin girls have only brown hair If I had a dollar each time somebody tells me that I would be a gazillionaire by now.

Speaker 5 So I try to break the stereotypes because I think Latin women come in every size, color, shape, form there is. And I think same with Asian girls.

Speaker 5 They come in so many different styles and types and shapes and forms. And I think we need to start, like, you know, cut it out, like putting women in these boxes that you think they belong.

Speaker 6 Yes. I get that a lot too.
Like, when with the blonde hair, they're like, oh, you want to be white. And then I'm like, well, what does it mean if I dye my hair silver?

Speaker 6 Does that mean I want to be whole?

Speaker 6 What if I dye it blue? What does that mean?

Speaker 5 You have the right to dye your hair, whichever color makes you happy and makes you look in the mirror and say, you know what? I love it.

Speaker 6 As As long as you love it, but it's always men. Yeah,

Speaker 6 it's not women saying, well,

Speaker 5 unfortunately, I agree, but unfortunately, you do have those women, and it always breaks my heart that are not supportive of other women, and they have something nasty to say.

Speaker 5 And

Speaker 5 that's like the biggest pet peeve in my life.

Speaker 5 When I hear, especially podcasters, like there's some super successful podcasters, they, I, I listen to their, their episodes trashing certain celebrities, certain women that they never met.

Speaker 5 And I'm like, why in the hell are you doing that? You know, like it's hard enough being a woman in general because we get judged all the time, right?

Speaker 6 Yes. Like I felt like the Katy Perry backlash recently was so unnecessary.
I agree. Yeah, it was crazy how hard they went at her for like.
existing, you know, because she didn't do anything terrible.

Speaker 5 No, I know, I know. And I think, well, I always mention, for example, Megan Kelly.

Speaker 5 I think she's a bitch on wheels. She has one of the top podcasts.
And I'm saying here on camera because I say it on social media all the time. She has one of the top podcasts in the world.

Speaker 5 And she, like, J-Lo is a whore. Wait, what? Yeah, like, J-Lo is like a, well, glorified stripper because she dances so sexy.

Speaker 5 And she's always trashing famous women that she never met in her life that are just doing their work. Like let JLo do their thing because she's fantastic, what she does.

Speaker 5 And when I hear about her podcast, I'm like, you have this platform with millions of listeners and you are using it to criticize what other women are doing.

Speaker 6 Why in the world are you doing that?

Speaker 5 You know?

Speaker 6 Yeah, it's like unnecessary.

Speaker 5 But you know what?

Speaker 6 It probably is getting her views from negative people. So like you sell your soul a little bit.

Speaker 5 Sell your soul to the devil. I know, you know, my opinion on that.

Speaker 5 I'm going to tell you, I think people like that, if you go, if you put a hidden camera in their inner privacy, they're the most unhappy people in the world because I don't think happy people, happy women, go out there hurting women.

Speaker 6 Yeah, just happy people in general aren't hurting people. Right.

Speaker 5 I totally like we support each other and we grow together. That's how I see it.
But I want to ask you about another surgery that you did. I was like,

Speaker 5 holy cow, I would not have the courage to do that for like $100 million.

Speaker 5 You had, how do you call it? Like you had your labia cut off.

Speaker 6 Yeah, I guess it's called a labia plastic.

Speaker 6 I'm not sure. And you're so open about it.

Speaker 5 Why did you do that?

Speaker 6 I think that was really important because after that video came.

Speaker 5 Chronic spontaneous urticaria or chronic hives with no known cause. It's so unpredictable.

Speaker 6 It's like playing pinball.

Speaker 5 Itchy red bumps start on my arm, then my back,

Speaker 5 sometimes my legs. Hives come out of nowhere

Speaker 5 and it comes and goes. But I just found out about a treatment option at treatmyhives.com.
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Speaker 6 It like kind of

Speaker 6 causes body dysmorphia in me.

Speaker 6 And I had never looked at myself there before. You were not looking at your virginity.
So why was I looking?

Speaker 5 And I think you got traumatized by the experience with the dude, which I'm going to call it an assault because I think it was an assault.

Speaker 5 And you were like,

Speaker 6 that was my first sexual experience. Wow.
So my boyfriend at the time could tell you that because I was a virgin. I wasn't doing anything with my boyfriend that I was with for six months.

Speaker 6 So why would I

Speaker 6 do it with this disgust? Yeah.

Speaker 5 And did you, you, you ended up telling a boyfriend?

Speaker 6 Oh, years later, but I didn't tell him about it. He found out about it because it was on

Speaker 6 the judged you.

Speaker 5 Yes, he did. Yeah.
And that made me so mad.

Speaker 6 Yeah.

Speaker 6 He's a kind guy, actually.

Speaker 6 But it's just like people can't wrap their head around it sometimes if it's not an aggressive assault.

Speaker 5 Well, this is when you tell the story, like I forgot what question he asked you, like, you know, what do you mean, right? It was assault because you're there in the video.

Speaker 5 I would hope, especially somebody that is so close to you as a boyfriend,

Speaker 5 if you tell them something, that all that matters is how you felt. Exactly.
It's your truth.

Speaker 6 Yeah.

Speaker 5 Not what you see on camera, not what you see out there.

Speaker 5 I would hope that that person cares about how you felt.

Speaker 6 Yeah, he should have said nothing.

Speaker 5 Or say, come here, baby. Do you want to open up? Can I do anything arguing?

Speaker 5 Guys, you know, hello, right? If a woman opens up, because it's so tough to go through that and be able to talk about it.

Speaker 6 But he didn't approach me to, I didn't reveal it to him. He was like, Oh, I know you've done like this for money, like like sexual acts.
And I was like, What are you talking about?

Speaker 6 He's like, I know about this video out there. And I was like, It was not

Speaker 6 what you think. And then, yeah, he just wasn't in the place to accept it.
You deserve better.

Speaker 5 But let's tell me about the labioplasty.

Speaker 6 Plus, I think it's called labioplasty.

Speaker 5 Labioplasty. Yeah.
So you, yeah, you, you probably, you were having probably body dysmorphia issues.

Speaker 6 Yeah. So, I mean, here's the thing I get to in the book.
The thing with Asian women's vaginas, it's like a very

Speaker 6 trouble. Like it's, there's so much mythology about it.
Like growing up, like boys would insult you by calling it slanted. Like, you know, back in history,

Speaker 6 people actually rumored and said that Asian women's vaginas were fundamentally different. They were slanted.
Oh my God.

Speaker 6 People really believed that at a time. Like this is probably, you know, hundreds of years, 100 years ago.
But

Speaker 6 nowadays, men still say, oh, they're tight, they're tight or whatever, which has never been proven to be true or whatever, but they still say that for whatever reason.

Speaker 6 So there's like some expectation of their,

Speaker 6 your vagina to be like different in some way.

Speaker 6 And I just felt like

Speaker 6 the first time.

Speaker 6 Well, it's interesting because in the video, you can't like technically see anything because I

Speaker 6 had not shaved because I wasn't

Speaker 6 showing anyone anything or I didn't even know you were supposed to do that. You know, I was that young and this was a different, this is before everyone got, I guess, Brazilian wax.

Speaker 6 The Brazilian wax didn't exist back then.

Speaker 5 And by the way, I have no idea. I always say that I don't know why it's called Brazilian wax because most Brazilian women do not wax everything.

Speaker 6 Oh, really?

Speaker 5 I know. I swear to God.
Like, many, many, many years ago, when I heard the expression Brazilian waxing, I was like, why is it called? Because, see what it's another stereotype.

Speaker 5 But if you look at Brazilian girls, they wax, but they always leave some hair because it's just the culture.

Speaker 5 You rarely meet a Brazilian girl that does a Brazilian. So I have no idea where the name came from, by the way.

Speaker 6 Sounds strange.

Speaker 5 Right? Talking about stereotypes.

Speaker 6 Yeah.

Speaker 6 I guess for me,

Speaker 6 I associated just my female sexual parts like attracting all this like negative attention from men. Oh my God.
So I felt like I needed to fix it. Like I need to fix myself.

Speaker 6 And

Speaker 6 yeah, I just,

Speaker 6 I went to a doctor and I didn't even shop around or anything. And yeah,

Speaker 6 it was, yeah, it was an exact thing.

Speaker 5 Oh my God. Now looking back, do you regret it?

Speaker 6 I don't know if I regret it, but I don't think I needed it. Right.

Speaker 5 I'm sure you did not. Yeah.

Speaker 6 It was not

Speaker 6 necessary. I don't think there was like no real reason for it.

Speaker 5 Yeah, no, for sure. Now,

Speaker 5 maybe there is some Asian woman out there listening to us right now, and they're thinking,

Speaker 5 you obviously the book is fetished. You explain what that is.
And there are a lot of men out there that look at Asian girls like this. sexual object.

Speaker 5 So I'm thinking maybe a lot of girls out there are wondering, oh, so if a guy approaches me, is there any way that I can find out? Yes. Is he interested in? All the time.

Speaker 6 I literally, if I'm dating a non-Asian guy, I have to ask, what was your ex-girlfriend? Oh, really? It is a thing.

Speaker 5 And if he says, was Asian,

Speaker 6 what was your girlfriend before that? What was a girlfriend? And then, yeah.

Speaker 5 So you try to figure out if there's a, but what if he tells you, it's just the kind of woman I'm attracted to? It's not a fetish.

Speaker 5 I don't agree with you. It's, you know, is there a way to figure out the difference?

Speaker 6 I don't want to judge a guy for having a preference,

Speaker 6 but I

Speaker 6 would want to feel special. And if I was the third Asian woman, I'm just not going to feel special.
You know what I mean?

Speaker 6 Even if his preference is totally not fetishy, and maybe he really respects Asian women and treats them really nicely,

Speaker 6 I would still rather just be the first, you know, like not part of a trend.

Speaker 5 So maybe, do you think a good thermometer for Asian women in general, like if they're dating a guy, to ask

Speaker 5 like what is your dating pattern?

Speaker 6 I think all Asian girls do ask that. They do.
Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 6 I think that is something that's on the back of the mind of every Asian woman. Oh my God.
When meeting a new guy.

Speaker 5 Yeah, I get. No, I totally get it.
Cause I mean, I don't think any woman wants to start dating or be in any kind of relationship with a guy if his ulterior motive is like this

Speaker 6 or even

Speaker 6 idea sexual idea in their head if you dated a guy and all his girlfriends looked exactly the same like you like just exactly

Speaker 5 like oh this is a little insane because i know yes it is a question that because i have had like i said i had an ex-boyfriend and at the time i was so freaking stupid a few years ago when i met him he he got out of a long marriage and he was like I know I want to date a blonde.

Speaker 5 And I felt flattered. And then months into it, I was like, he doesn't want to date me.

Speaker 5 He's like fishing around bumbo, total like midlife crisis, big asshole. He was just like one at attention from blondes.
So, you know, then I realized something. So nowadays, yeah, I agree with you.

Speaker 5 If I meet a guy and he's like, I love blondes, or I love Latins, I love Brazilians. I'm the same.
I'm kind of like, okay. You know, if your pattern is to date only Brazilian women,

Speaker 5 I'd like the same thing exactly what you said. I don't want to be a part of a package.

Speaker 6 Yes. Yeah.

Speaker 5 You know, because also likely a guy that does that, they're just going to go through that woman after the other, after the other, after the other, right?

Speaker 5 It's more like to fulfill something in their head.

Speaker 6 Because I feel like if you're truly going for a personality, the women are going to look incredibly different because you're looking for what's on the inside, not what's on the outside.

Speaker 5 No, and you just said the keyword personality because you can be the same culture.

Speaker 5 You can be like 10 Asian girls, but each one of them is going to have a totally different personality, lifestyle, likes, dislikes. And that should be a lot more important than

Speaker 6 yeah, it's sad because like some

Speaker 6 people, and I'm sure it happens with women to just have an idea of what they want, but they don't really want the person, which is messy and complicated and like amazing.

Speaker 6 And like, you know, they don't want the multifaceted. They just want like something easy and like

Speaker 6 packageable.

Speaker 5 Yeah, totally agree. So you, you, you were working in entertainment industry for a long time, right? You were working as a pin up.
You did a lot of modeling jobs.

Speaker 5 You were part of a musical group. You did a lot of stuff.
You ended up in one of the Fast and Furious. movies, Tokyo Drift.

Speaker 5 You talk a little bit about that in terms of not seeing a lot of great roles for Asian women.

Speaker 5 Like you say,

Speaker 5 we were always background. And then finally you got a I think was a day player yeah it was still a small role yeah

Speaker 6 it was so exciting because like every other time I was getting offered prostitute or massage barley girl so I was like I'm still a sexy girl but at least I'm not a prostitute something else and you mentioned Lucy Lou which is a symbol and nowadays of course we have Michelle Yeo I mean so many now like right now there's but I still don't think it's so many yes yeah like it's so many

Speaker 5 people compared to people yeah like for people that love movies like me because i'm also an actor michelle yeo won an oscar in 2023 she was the first asian woman to win an oscar and i was so happy i had tears in my eyes because as a minority i agree with you i want to see more minorities represented in every industry and certainly in the entertainment industry but do you feel it has been a shift lately there is more opportunity yeah well i'm no longer in the entertainment industry but i feel like what i see in media, it's

Speaker 6 a lot still has to happen. But like there's so like with K-pop, it's crazy that there's like Korean music being played on the radio and like non-Asians are listening to Korean music.
That's crazy.

Speaker 6 And then the number one show on Netflix is Squid Game and then Beef. this other show did really well.

Speaker 6 So I think there's a lot of opportunity for Asian women not to just play prostitutes and massage parlor girls. So

Speaker 6 yeah, I think it's grown a lot. We have to keep pushing for more.

Speaker 5 I love that.

Speaker 5 And that's like a big part of the end of your book that I think it's so, so special that you say, you know, we have to keep pushing for more representation and not just roles that stereotype.

Speaker 5 Same thing in the Latin culture.

Speaker 5 Because I have an accent, I'm kind of like the Sofia Vergaro, which I think is the one of the few or the only one that became insanely successful with her accent but for so long for so long people try to change her and tell her she was never going to be successful really oh yeah she was a model and then she's like i'm gonna be an actor and people made fun of her they're like go to a go to a voice voice lessons you got to get rid of the accent and when you hear her tell the story she's like i went through hell and high water trying to get rid of my accent and then i was like no fuck this shit i'm gonna do what I do with my accent.

Speaker 6 That's amazing.

Speaker 5 Exactly. So I think people like us, we need to keep pushing for that and putting these conversations out there so the entertainment industry opens more and more doors

Speaker 6 for people like us. We need to get more minorities in director positions and producer positions.

Speaker 5 1 million percent. But how, what was the game changer for you to get out of the drugs?

Speaker 5 to start loving yourself, to turn your life around, to be in a peaceful place like you are today, that you are actually capable of writing this incredible book.

Speaker 6 Well, it took like a decade or more to all that healing. But I think the first thing that happened was that I was just really miserable.
And I was like, I have to figure out, like, it was obvious.

Speaker 6 The drugs are starting to get worse. So I was like starting to miss shows and not show up to things.
So I think the first step was getting sober.

Speaker 6 And after I got sober for a couple of years, then like getting therapy and reading books and kind of just learning to mostly just have, because I have such a critical voice in my head, just to kind of change that into a kinder, more accepting voice.

Speaker 6 So that's still a work in progress.

Speaker 5 So, but you, you decided to go, because it's very tough getting out of drugs and getting sober. It's a really tough journey.
Did you just decide to, you did everything on your own?

Speaker 5 Like, I'm going to get clean. I'm going to change my life around.

Speaker 6 Well, no, it's funny. I did.
I'm in the sober community. So I had a lot of help with like

Speaker 6 sponsors and

Speaker 6 yeah. So that really helped.

Speaker 6 helped but um it took me a while like when i first decided to get sober i think it took me two years because i would get sober and then relapse again and get sober and then for some reason just one day it clicked but i had been trying for a while which happens to a lot of people yeah because like you said it's not because i i think especially because of social media People see the end result, right?

Speaker 5 They see you beautiful there, the book published amazingly.

Speaker 5 They don't see the back end, like the tough, tough, tough journey to get to this place that's why i think it's so important to put all the stories out there because maybe somebody listening is going through the same thing and i know a lot of young girls in the industry go through the same type of trauma, get in the wrong hands like you did.

Speaker 5 And it's just so tough to keep your head in the right place.

Speaker 6 It's literally, and the entertainment industry is filled with predators because they know these very young women are showing up from off the bus from Ohio or something.

Speaker 6 They have no experience in the world. And this decades older man, he is an experienced groomer to like get what he wants.
And girls really have to be careful.

Speaker 5 Yeah. So do you have any tips, let's say the

Speaker 5 younger audience out there is listening, anybody going through the same, anybody that is working here or wants to model or is modeling to avoid falling in the hands of predators like you?

Speaker 6 I think like you were saying, due diligence. I I mean, nowadays you could be on Instagram and some person might reach out.
Totally. Yeah.

Speaker 6 So that would be really difficult. I think what really helps is having an agent because they're going to screen all that.
But that's not, not everybody can find the agent immediately at first.

Speaker 6 So I would say the simplest thing is just to bring a friend with you on those early auditions that you're not sure about. Yeah.

Speaker 6 Like that would have saved everything for me if there was just somebody there if you are not alone.

Speaker 5 I think that's like the best advice.

Speaker 5 And once your video leaked, that's another thing. It's my opinion.
And I don't know if you agree. There is nothing you can do about it once the video is out there.

Speaker 5 I think it's so brave and it's the right thing to do. Just own it and tell your truth.
Like, because so many people go, oh my God, it's going to destroy my life. It's going to ruin my life.

Speaker 5 What if so-and-so-and-so find out? I think it's just better because I know it happens to so many people. Just put your truth out there.

Speaker 6 Yeah, because that's the unfortunate thing with the internet. Like, you can never entirely swipe anything.
Yeah.

Speaker 5 No, it's always going to be somewhere.

Speaker 5 And I think the case, like the dude you were dating, if somebody comes to you and says, I found that video, if they think anything less of you because of a video, because of a photo, because whatever it is that you did, probably they're not your person.

Speaker 6 Oh, definitely. And that video now is 27 years ago.

Speaker 6 It's like so long ago.

Speaker 5 Look, regardless, you know, because like I said, and I keep, I always bring up Kim Kardashian because, like I said, yeah, people still bring up her video.

Speaker 6 And I was like, yeah, it's like 20 years. Yes.
Yeah.

Speaker 5 But at the time, I remember everybody criticized her mother. They criticized her.
Like, oh my God, look at this.

Speaker 5 I'm like, I personally think they did the right thing because there was no way in the world they could hide that. Yeah.
It was too big. It was out there.
The whole world was going to see it.

Speaker 5 And I'm like, good for them. She owned to the mistake.
The guy was the asshole because what kind of a boyfriend does that, right?

Speaker 6 Yeah, yeah. I mean, always, that's the same thing with people.

Speaker 6 Yes. Like, I think her boyfriend was 10 years older and she didn't really want to shoot, but she wanted to, like, you know, you want to please your man.

Speaker 6 Yeah. And he's much older.
Yeah. Telling her what to do.
And then he puts this out here and she has no choice. You know, this is the personal.

Speaker 5 So many times, like you said, we are as women, we are with our partners. You want to please them in bed, especially when we're younger, right?

Speaker 5 Nowadays, if some guy told me, I'm going to film you, I'm like, no, get out of my bed.

Speaker 6 That would be a yeah.

Speaker 5 But when we're young, we have this tendency, like you said, when you were being assaulted, you're like, you were so afraid

Speaker 5 you give up control. But in the sex videos and all this crap,

Speaker 5 many times you're just doing what the guy, what you think is going to make your partner happy.

Speaker 6 Yeah. Yeah.
When you're with a partner.

Speaker 6 Yeah.

Speaker 5 But if it leaks, you know what?

Speaker 5 Own it.

Speaker 6 Yeah.

Speaker 5 It just makes you a stronger person.

Speaker 6 I mean, really, like, Kim Kardashian

Speaker 6 could care less about that. Like, she is probably the most powerful person in entertainment.

Speaker 5 I love it. But she's a great example, by the way, of how something that could have been, like, oh my God,

Speaker 5 is spin it around and become the best version of you, which I personally think is the best revenge. Yeah.
And that's obviously what you did.

Speaker 5 You became this fabulous, incredible, gorgeous woman, and now you are a published writer.

Speaker 6 Yeah.

Speaker 6 Who would have thought? Yeah.

Speaker 5 Well, I hope this is one of many that are going to come in the future. Very powerful story, fantastic read.
Congratulations. Thank you.

Speaker 5 Thank you for sharing because I think it's so important that women have the guts. to share their stories.

Speaker 5 So I hope if anybody out there right now going through any kind of trauma, any kind of pain, any kind of embarrassment, they feel empowered to move forward.

Speaker 5 And you're a perfect example that anybody can turn their life around yeah you just have to like believe in yourself and be be kind to yourself yeah congratulations beautiful work i'm so honored that you're here this is an incredible conversation guys be safe out there the book is fetished kyla is it on where is amazon yeah you can find it amazon barnes and noble but actually go support independent bookstores like small bookstores yeah

Speaker 5 so it's all over the place I'm putting the link here so you guys can see her beautiful work. Thank you so much, Blue Chew, for being our biggest sponsor on this episode.
I love you guys.

Speaker 5 If you guys don't know about Blue Chew, it's the only chewable tablet out there. Go get yours because it will be a game changer in bed.

Speaker 5 Girls, tell your guys, guys, go get it because every woman wants a man that takes Blue Chew in bed. Thank you, Kyla.
You're incredible. I really appreciate it.
Be safe out there. Love you.

Speaker 5 We'll be back soon. Thank you.