SISTER TALK - OVERCOMING TRAUMA AND TRAGEDY & FINDING HAPPINESS AGAIN

So, I cannot even believe we are kicking off season five of Cat on the Loose this week. Oh my goodness, four years have gone by.
What a journey it has been.

If you are new to Cat on the Loose, welcome, welcome, welcome. I welcome you with open arms.
This is a no-judgment zone.

All our episodes are 100% organic, meaning they're never scripted and they're never edited. We never know what we're going to say.
We never know exactly what's going to happen.

It's an open conversation about relationships, about dating. Yes, sometimes about sex, but it's about life.
We are evolving. We are learning together.
I am not an expert.

Cat on the loose started four years ago after I left a very complicated, very abusive marriage to an alcoholic.

And I was starting my life over, and I literally did not know how I was going to pick up the pieces and rebuild. And I was like basically just venting.
And I didn't know how to find my voice again.

I didn't know what I was going to do. And I was really just talking, talking, talking.
And I realized everybody out there had a story they wanted to share.

Everybody out there has something going on at any given moment. And as I was growing an audience, I realized I hit a nerve and I was like, you know what? I'm going to keep going and going and going.

And what once was a tiny, tiny pet project is now such a beautiful, beautiful worldwide community. And I am so proud of it.
So if you're new here, welcome.

We drop new episodes every Wednesdays on all platforms of You and Dry Podcasts. And if you know Cat on the Loose, welcome back.
And we are going to start the season.

with such an important, important, important topic that affects so many people everywhere in the world, mental health.

And although I always like to say, because it's so important, I am not an expert in any topic. This is a topic that I can speak about because it has happened to me time and time and time again.

And my guest today

is someone that also has been highly affected by tragedy. My sister, both of us, we have been hit by so much tragedy in our lives.

It's incredible that we've managed to pick up the pieces, survive, rebuild, and recover. So we are not experts, but we are living proof that yes, you can do it.

And we are also

living proof that it is so important

to talk about it before it gets out of control. And for her, it is so difficult to talk about it because she's the exact opposite of me.
She's a very private person.

Her work is nowhere near the public eye, such as mine is, but she was a very, very brave, very, very brave soul to say, you know what, I'm going to come and I'm going to talk about it.

So if you're suffering from any kind of heartbreak, tragedy, any kind of pain right now, this episode is for you. And if you know anyone who is,

have them listen to this episode. There is always light at the end of the tunnel.
And it is so, so important to speak up. It's so, so important to ask for help before it gets out of control.

Because so many people suffer in silence before they get help. And this is why many times it ends in tragedy, tragedy, such as it happens to people who are very close to us.

So, here it is: a very, very special episode of Cat on the Loose to kick off season five. And remember, I love you guys so much.

And we have 24/7 open lines of communication because this podcast is for all of us. So, if you have anything you want to say, contribute, give us suggestions for future episodes, your opinion,

please, please, please send it over via WhatsApp, 1-305-332-033.

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Yes, no kidding. This is how I started Cat on the Lose four years ago.

And now it's one of the top relationships podcasts in the world. So, what are you waiting for?

Oh my God, first Cat on the Lose of the season, season five. And I could not start with a more special guest.
And I know you're so private. I can't even believe you're here.
My little sister.

I know this is like a really big push for you to do this, right? It's huge. You're really out of your comfort zone.
Thank you very much.

So I have to say I'm very, very grateful. Wow, thank you.
This means the world to me. This is very, very special.

Of course, of course. And I was saying before we got started that in my introduction that I wanted to do a really special episode because I know the beginning of the year,

a lot of people are talking about, you know, goals and dreams and starting over and aspirations. And they feel stuck.
They don't know how to move on with life. They don't know how to move forward.

And I wanted to start by our conversation when you came visit me on Thanksgiving. For those who don't know, you're in Florida, right? And I'm in California.

So for Thanksgiving, you came over with your adorable, adorable, very precautious, crazy intelligent little son, my nephew, who is now 13, right? Matthias. Yes, yes.
And we had such an amazing time.

And I remember we were standing in the kitchen and I said to you, we come from a really difficult background. We don't come from this great family.
I think we come from a very discombobulated family.

You agree with me, right?

Yeah.

And we are seven years apart. And I know we have very different experiences because I left.
I didn't live at home for a really long time and you were still living at home.

So I know you spend much more time with our mom than I did.

We have different experiences, but for a long period of time, we were both around them.

But anyway, the bottom line is we don't come from like this lovy-dovey, sweet, amazing, perfect, supportive family. And now that both our parents are gone, it's really just the two of us and

Matteo. And we are both not married.
We're going to get there. We're going to explain what happened.
But going back to the kitchen, I remember looking and saying, you know,

I don't know if I call it spell, but I use the word spell jokingly. I said, I think it's up to us

to break the spell of everything bad that happened to our families and create a better future for ourselves and for your kid.

Right. Yes, 100%.

And I think.

Yeah. And I think that's the hardest part for a lot of people, right? How do you do that? How do you break away from

tragedy? And this is what I want to touch on because I know it's very difficult. Because I know you're very private.
You don't even do social media.

I do a lot of social media because that's how I promote my work. And a lot of people look at our social media and they see the success and the life we build and everything.

And they think everything is easy, right? They see like

they don't see our battles. But you and I,

I don't know why, but we've been through a hell of a lot of tragedy in our lives.

Yes, very much.

It's tough.

Do you want to talk about it? Do you want to start? Of course. No, of course.

I can be open and whatever you want to talk about.

Yeah, I think it's important

because

just the background to get where I want to get.

So like I said, I think we grew up in a very complicated household. For me, I think your experience, and I remember you said that you think for you, it was more our mom.

For me, I think my dad resented me because, of course, he didn't want to marry my mom when she got pregnant, but whatever. I think

they were always very heavy drinkers.

And when I was a kid, I didn't even notice that.

And I think that's probably one of the reasons why I ended up marrying an alcoholic, because it took me forever and ever and ever to even realize that alcohol abuse was a problem.

I don't even know if you noticed that. Like our parents were always drinking, always abusing alcohol.

Yeah, I remember our mother more than our father. Yeah.
But, you know, but yeah,

they both,

you know,

were heavy drinkers. Yeah,

I do remember that. Yeah, and I never even said that, but yeah, it's true.
Our mom was always a heavy drinker and she ended up being, she was like, I I think what people call a closet alcoholic.

Like she would drink and hide the alcohol. And she always hoped that people didn't notice that she was drinking.
And it kept getting worse and worse and worse as life went by. And

obviously it ended up being one of the causes of what killed her. Right.
But I think when I ended up marrying an alcoholic that ended up like abusing me and they were always, my parents were around.

That's one of the reasons that nobody said anything, because for them it was like normal behavior, drinking heavily, you know?

Yeah.

I never know. I mean, growing up, I never, I didn't think it was a thing.
I didn't think it was, yeah, I never saw that as a problem, you know.

And I don't know. I don't know if looking back, if it's part, a little bit part of,

I wouldn't say the Brazilian culture, but just maybe a little bit of the environment, you know, and the fam.

I don't know what it was, but I don't remember ever thinking, oh, my parents are heavy drinkers. You know, that's just maybe something you think about it much, much later in life.

That's such a good point. I know, and like you said, Brazilian culture.
Yeah, I know Brazilians drink a lot, but then...

Like I said, because I've been here most of my life and then you ended up being here most of your life. Yeah.

You moved, you moved here when you were like a teenager yeah like i said when i met anthony i was in my 20s and he was a heavy drinker when i met him he wasn't a full-blown alcoholic yet but i think because of the background of our parents When I saw him drinking, drinking, drinking and saying, oh, that's how I relax after work.

That's how I relax after work. Yeah.
I was so conditioned to see my parents do it all the time. I didn't see it as a problem.

I thought, oh, that's what people do. So I'm not even sure if it's a cultural thing, to be honest, because I'm not.
Yeah, no, I'm not saying that it. I'm just saying, like, growing up,

it was just all around. Yeah.
It was just kind of all around us. This is what, that's what I'm trying to say.
You know what I mean?

So looking back, I'm like, it was just, I just felt like it was all around.

us, our family, you know, the gatherings and

I

never

separated, oh, this is okay because this is a

family gathering. Oh, they're drinking during the week.
You know what I mean? Like, it was just all kind of all blended together.

I also think there's a lot of more awareness nowadays as far as alcohol goes. And so I just feel like it's something that I've come to realize that much, much later in life.

Yeah, I wonder if it's our maturity. So

this is the question, right? Because I get this question all the time. I think we obviously we turn out to be incredibly normal, nice, kind humans,

considering the environment we grew up in. Because a lot of people, and this, I guess this is the point that I wanted to touch in, because it's the beginning of the year.

And I know a lot of people get discouraged, right? Oh, how?

Because a lot of people blame their backgrounds. Oh, I come from a shitty family.
I come from shitty parents. I don't have any support.

But I think you and I are living proof that regardless of what life throws at you, if you decide you're going to build a good life for yourself, you can make a decision and create your own path.

I'm not really sure how we did it because life threw all this hell and high water at us, not just coming from this bad parenting because both our parents, our father, maybe he was not a full-blown alcoholic, but he was the biggest narcissist that I ever met in my life.

He was really good at making money, but like if he made a million dollars, he would spend a million and one. He never really thought about leaving a legacy behind.

He never really thought about, oh, let me worry about the future of these girls.

Let me worry about leaving them something. Let me worry about doing like a savings account, little like normal things that parents worry about leaving for their kids.

He would literally spend everything on himself and women and parties and shit. So it was some other kind of dysfunction coming from him.

Right.

And I don't know how you and I at some point

decided that you know despite all of that we were gonna live normal lives and be honest hardworking people and just be different from them

right

i yeah i don't know where i don't know what the turning point was but i do you know

There have been things in my life that, you know, also

being, for me, being a mom,

you know, I remember when I had Mateo, my, you know, my son, I remember

thinking that I never wanted to be the mother.

I wanted to be a completely different mother than our mother was.

Yeah, and you want to know why.

I wanted to be a very, very different mother. And you're saying, you know, this generational,

I don't like to use the word curse, but, you know,

that passed from generation. And

I was like, it ends with me. Yeah.
It ends with me. Yeah.
No, that's you. Use the word curse, but you're right.
I don't know what word I used when you were here at Thanksgiving, but I said similar.

When you were here, I was like, we have to break the spell. Like, you know, we have to.

Let the generation,

I guess. I don't know.
Yeah. There's so many words, but I remember when I had...
Natal, I wish I said, it ends with me. You know, I'm going to be, you know, you met him, you see how he's disciplined.

Yeah.

He's an angel. He's

incredible. He's incredible.
He's an incredible child. Yeah.
And every single day I tell him how I love him. Yeah.

You know, I believe in discipline with kindness and love.

You know, I've done that with him since he was a child. Yeah.

And with me, at least my experience growing up, was on a completely different

polar opposite to that. You know, So,

yeah. So I think the first thing for me was becoming a mom that I was like, okay, this ends right here.
You know, we didn't have that.

And remember, that's another thing that you mentioned to me when you were here, which I completely agree with you. It's interesting that our parents never said to us, I love you.
Never. My father,

I don't ever, ever, until he died, I don't ever remember him saying to me, I love you. Not once in my life.

My mom, towards the very end of her life, when she got closer to me, and I think she started apologizing and saying things, I think she said maybe a few times.

But I agree with you, it wasn't common for them to say, I love you. And I agree with you.
I never heard. Yeah.

And like you said, you say it to your son all the time. And I think it's one of the things that is so important

to say i love you to someone you love all the time

all the time to make them feel loved and you never know when it's going to be the last time that that you see them right

right

i think that's like such a simple gesture

yes that costs nothing costs nothing right to let people know that you love them that you care about them

100 yes and and I, we both have had

a tremendous amount of loss in our lives.

So much, you know, that that's definitely something that's always with me, you know, to make the people important in your life feel important, know that they matter, know that they're loved, you know, it's just something I always carry that with me.

because

you know we did well i i don't know if your audience know but you know that we we lost both our parents. And, you know, it's just, yeah.
I lost my childhood friend. Yeah.

So in 2007, let's, yeah, so let's explain. Yeah.
So this is, yeah, we did have an absurd amount of tragedy.

In 2007, your best, best, best friend in the world, you guys grew up together ever since you were babies. She had a very sudden death.
She was in her 20s, which is crazy. And she died very suddenly.

That was very

tragic because of course she was a very young girl very full of life and you are younger you were how old were you girls 20 29 i think you were yeah 29 yeah yeah so that was crazy tragic yeah yeah then yes we did lose our father um a few years later right yeah we lost

we lost our father a few years later yeah um

then yeah we we did lose our our mom. I mean,

I lost Anthony literally one year after losing our mom.

I was still like, you know, mourning and figuring it out. And I lost.
And so I think it's a lot for anybody to process because loss is something very,

very, very, very heavy. Very, very.
It changes you. Yeah.

Yeah. Like you said, it changes you because it's like, oh my God, I'm first of all, it's like, we are really, literally, really alone.
Now we have to be adults here.

We don't have that support system anymore right

and then

you realize that you know you're not gonna see that person ever again so if you didn't say anything if you left anything behind unsaid

and I agree with you it changed me in the way for me I remember when when our mom died and when Anthony died a year later this is what changed me first I live my life like I'm very immediate in terms of what I want to do like if I want to do something I just really go for it you I know you're listening.

I know you're not

because you're more like a planner. It takes you longer.
I just pull the trigger.

Yeah.

It takes you forever. I'm like, I just go for it.
I want to, even if I don't know if all of my dreams are going to come true or not, I'm like, you know what? I'm going to give this a go.

I want to do everything. I want to conquer the world every day.

That's great. That's how it should be.

Because I'm like, okay, I don't know how much time I have, but I want to do everything that.

And there is another, obviously, my story is different than your story because the 14 years that I was married to Anthony,

and that's the that's another thing too that people don't know about me. They think, oh, she was married to a multi-millionaire, she didn't want to work.

But the truth is, he didn't let me work, he didn't let me do many of the things that I wanted to do. So now I'm like, I just want to go for it.
Fuck it. Yeah.

But yeah, when people start dying on you, you're like, okay,

life ends. So we might as well give everything a go, you know?

yeah yes i know yeah i'm i'm the you know as you know i'm the total opposite of that yeah i'm too conscious too afraid to oh my god i'm an overthinker i have anxiety i'm like i'm the total opposite so but

you know we tried our best to navigate and you know chase our dreams through but it's very i think it's big steps because

to touch on the last tragedy and and i think it's so important to talk about mental health and i know this is very difficult for you and this is why i have to say i'm so proud of you for being here and and because we have such a massive audience out there and i know this is very hard and i get and i do get emotional just a little over a year ago you had and and i have to say when i lost and i i lost our mom and by crazy coincidence of the universe i never ever ever used to go to brazil funny right because I just don't like going there because of all the violence and everything.

I happened to be in Brazil when she died. So I happened to see our mom dead in front of me.
So it just magnified my experience.

And then one year later, I lost Anthony and I thought, oh my God, I cannot imagine going through, I cannot imagine anybody going through a bigger trauma than what I went through.

But a little over a year, just

a a little over a year ago, right? You went through something a million times more difficult than that, if that's even possible.

Which is

your husband, the father of your son,

took his own life, committed suicide.

Yeah.

And you found him.

I did.

And I cannot imagine, I cannot imagine anybody going through that.

Yeah.

It's

it's like I said, it changes you to your core. Yeah.
You know?

And

there's just so

many levels to what happened. You know, it's just not,

you know, he was the father of my child, so I'm dealing with that. Yeah.

It's dealing with the fact that he didn't

have a heart attack. He didn't have a, it wasn't a car accident.
It was just something

that

it's just kind of hard.

It takes a really long time to wrap, you know, to wrap my,

I just remember trying to understand

how,

why,

you know, while dealing with

what I saw, you know?

And

so it was just, it was just really hard. I had to

really,

you know, I went through a lot of anger. I was very angry.
Oh my God, of course. How can you not, right? How can you not be? How can you not? It's impossible not to.

So I was really, really angry at him

for

doing that.

Because the truth is, you know, he took his life. He left you and

his son, a little boy, behind

alone, right? No, no note, no message, no justification.

He just left you guys behind. So, of course, the people that are left behind are, you know, the ones suffering.
Yeah. Right.
Yeah. You know, and it's just very hard to understand.

And you're just left with no answers. Yeah.

You know, and you have to be okay

with

not having those answers. Yeah.

You know, and it took me a really long time. You know, it took me a really, really long time to understand

why, well, how, well,

how can somebody do this? And why would somebody do this to a child?

and you're a father you can't do this and and it was just yeah but But then,

you know, I did some therapy. I actually

did a lot of research on suicide. And

it took me a while, but

I forgave him.

That's the best thing. I finally,

yeah, I think you have to, I really came to a place of forgiveness, of understanding. Yeah.
You know, that

he was sick. He was just in very, very, very, very deep pain.
Yeah.

But I had to get out of the anger to see

something to try to

understand,

you know. Yeah, for sure.

So it's just, it was really hard.

And of course, there's a ton of

regret

that I had also that's on the other side that that you have to deal with, you know. Um,

yeah, there's um a ton of regret, and and I think that's a part of the grief, you know. I feel like there's with all our losses, I have regrets with a lot of them.

There I have regrets with our mother, you know, it's like I wish I had told her about it. I think you need to, you know,

and it's a part of healing too. Yeah, that takes time.
You kind of have to let it go because this is something I never talked about on the podcast or to anybody. And the reason why

we are talking about is because mental health is such an important topic. And it goes to show, you know, people kill themselves every single day because there is something really bad going on.

And many times relatives don't notice. Our mom killed herself.

We never talked about it. People ask me, how did your mother die? And I'm like, oh, you know, I don't want to talk about it.
But the truth of the matter is, she didn't want to live anymore, right?

She was so stressful, stressed out about

money and finances. And she kept worrying about the future and the future and the future.
What's going to happen to me? What's going to happen to me? What's going to happen to me? It consumed her.

That's all she thought about day and night, night and day, day and night, night and day.

That she wanted to die. She literally wanted to die.

She committed suicide.

She knew she needed a certain specific medication.

She knew she couldn't drink. She knew if she stopped taking that medication, she was going to die.
So she did the two things she couldn't do.

She stopped taking the medication and she drank and, yeah, and it killed.

And it's heartbreaking, same thing. But

I think, I don't know how I did it, but like you said, I come to terms that

there is nothing we can do to save someone like that when they make that decision you know no i'm and

after the fact yes because i kept thinking how you know

everybody that was really hard too because

i think it's important people are aware of this you know when something like that happens every single person came to me and said

You didn't know? Yeah. You didn't know the depressed? And I'm like, oh, well, yes, I did.
And I just, you know what I mean? I'm like, no, I didn't know. I didn't know.

You know, so it's just, it's really hard. Of course, I wish

I had

maybe, I knew he was stressed. I knew he had high anxiety, high stress, but I didn't know, you know, that this was going on, that he was depressed.

No, the fact

you never know a person is going to get to that point, right? No, right. And I just, just,

so my, of course, I have regrets thinking, I, I should, maybe I should have known, maybe I should have paid attention. I should have told him, let's talk, let me be there for you.

Let me do the, you know, but I didn't see it. I didn't see it.
I didn't, you know,

it's something that

I, of course, if I ever come across something like that again, God forbid, I would be more aware. But I also realize that there's only so much we can do.

yeah you know no you can never blame yourself because like i said it's like with our mom i used to talk to our mom twice a day every single day

did i think she was killing herself while she was talking to me right like she would hang up the phone and go in her closet and get a bottle of booze and drink and like she would literally get in her car and say i'm on my way to the doctor to take this medication she literally needed this medication to stay alive but she was tossing the medication in the trash and not going to the doctor.

How can anybody know these things? You know, you can't blame yourself. I think.
No,

like you said, when this happens to someone,

like you said, don't ask the person if you want to help, don't ask the person, how did you know that or not? Because you're just passing on blame. You didn't see it.
Yes. It doesn't help.

But it came to me and you didn't see it. You didn't see it? You didn't know.
Yeah.

Like, did you see it? You didn't see any signs. I'm like, come on.
Yeah, please. Yeah.
Come on. I mean, even if I did, you know, because I also

remember talking to a therapist and I was like,

she told me, she said, maybe you could, you, if you had known, sometimes you can postpone it. But if the person is very determined, you can only postpone it.
You're not going to avoid it. Yeah.

You know what I mean? You're not going to prevent ever from happening. That has to come from them.
Yeah. It has to come from them yeah so

i mean one million percent i'm not a therapist or anything but yeah it took it took me a long time to not blame myself and

forgive him and and get past the anger and just

you know um

and see him in a good light again because he was a wonderful man. Yeah.
You know, that's just,

you know, he was a really, he was a great dad. He was a wonderful man.

He really was.

But for a while, I was very angry.

Oh, my God. I'm sure.
You know, he left us in a really bad situation and I was really angry.

Yeah, but I have to tell you that this is my take on it because the tragedy happened to us, like I said, in different ways.

Because our mom killed herself. Anthony, in many ways, he wanted to die.
He wanted to die. He wanted to die so badly, he got his wishes and he died in the worst possible way.

That's a whole other story for another episode. But the fact of the matter is, once he died, same thing.
I found myself with absolutely nothing, nothing. My life was devastated.

And when that happens, we have two choices. And this is what we're talking about, breaking the curse or whatever word you want to use.
You have two choices.

You can stay down there on the ground, like, I'm fucked. I'm falling.

That's it.

Or you can say, you know, I'm going to pick up the pieces and rebuild my life and make life wonderful again.

And in your case, you have the most wonderful reason in the world, which is the most incredible, amazing, adorable 13-year-old little boy.

So I think we have to show it to him that life can be really, really, really great

and break

this horrible spell, curse, whatever you want to say, of whatever came. Trauma.
Yeah.

Whatever came behind us.

And I think anybody out there listening, if you are like us, because I think most people are like us, most people do not come from wonderful, wonderful families, unfortunately.

Like most people do come from

broken families.

Don't let that destroy you. You know, find ways to

keep moving on. You know, find ways to rebuild.

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i think that's the best best best way to to get over trauma

and get over something horrible like all these things that that happened to us i don't know if you agree with me yes of course i i and and i got a lot of eye rolls when because when that when that happened

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I remember the next day waking up

or

getting out of bed. I don't think I slept for like six months, but I just remember the next day I got out of bed and I said,

I just, you know, you're living this. I was like, wow.

My life

is over. My life is over, you know? And then I was like, wait a minute, what am I saying? What am I saying?

I have a choice. Right now, I have a choice.
I can choose to

be happy

and

heal, be happy, be the best mother I can be. Yeah.

Or I can sink, be depressed. and not be not be able to be there for my child that needs me to the max more than ever ever.
Yes, you have to rise to the challenge. Yeah.
Yeah.

So, right there and then, the next day, and I know it takes a lot.

I understand that. But, and I feel like everything that I went through my entire life prepared me for that very, very moment.
Yeah. You know, to

just, I was like, wow, okay.

Right here, right, right here is the moment that I

have to make this choice. You know, yeah.

I can either start seeing some positive,

some positive

things.

I can see some happiness. I can be happy.
I can try to find something peaceful, or I can just be completely depressed. I know.
And

you're doing amazing. I have to say, when all the things that happened to me happened to me,

obviously, you know, many days I thought, okay, that's it. That's the end of me.
I did end up in the hospital. A few times, a few times I thought, okay, I'm going to die.
That's it, right?

And I remember I had so many toxic people around me, the famous champagne friends, right? You know, the assholes that are around you when you have champagne and then when you need help.

Oh, yeah. And they run around like they had friends.
Exactly. Yeah.
I remember one. I don't want to deal with the tragedy.
Exactly.

I didn't want to deal with the bad times. No, of course not.
I remember one of my best friends in the world.

I used to, I don't know if you remember, but my apartment in Miami was at the 56th floor of the four seasons when Anthony died.

And this friend, one of my best friends, she came and she was like, oh my God, Catherine, I cannot believe you're not jumping off of the balcony.

Because I had lost everything, all my assets, all my bank accounts. I was completely broke.
I didn't have anything and Anthony was dead. And then I never saw that person again.

And that day I remember thinking, you know what? I don't feel like jumping off of this balcony. I think I'm going to start rebuilding my life.

Yeah.

But I know my personality, I'm more resilient. I have just have a,

to use the word that my mom used, mean Portuguese. I don't even know what word would be in English.
I'm very distinct. I'm fearless.
I'm not afraid of anything. And I know you're not.

I know you're not. I know you're more like guarded.
So I know when all these things happened to me, I was like, fuck it. I'm just going to go for it and try everything again.

And I'm going to die trying. And that's my style, but I don't have a kid, right? I'm like, it's just me.

It's easier because if I fail in everything, like, you know, even if I end up homeless on the beach, like the people that stole everything from me, I'm not kidding.

They literally called me and said, I'm not going to name names because they threatened to sue me, but they literally called me and said, you're going to do everything we tell you to do or you're going to end up homeless on the beach.

And I remember saying, Even if I do end up homeless on the beach, it's just me, whatever. I'm gonna figure it out.
I know with you, the stakes are so much higher because you have a freaking kid.

When you have a kid, you're like, I want to give my kid the best life.

So, I remember last year when I got the call, when our stepdad called me and said that this happened to you, he was like, You know, this tragedy happened to Ty.

Like, I don't want to say your husband's name, said like, he shot himself in the head. I was at the gas station, and I backed up my car.

I was like, I, it's the first time in my life I had a car accident. I backed up my car into a tree.
I was like,

and I stopped there, and I immediately thought, oh my God, you know, I was so worried about you because I honestly was not sure how you were going to react.

Because it's one,

I cannot imagine anybody going through this tragedy. And I have to say, you really, really rose up to

the challenge and

to life. And

it's impossible to describe in words. It's absolutely impossible to describe

to anybody.

Yeah, I think.

And like I said,

to me,

it was,

you know, that feeling of,

and, you know, I'm not religious. We were raised, even though we went to Catholic school entire lives.
We're not religious or anything like that. But something just came over me and said, have faith.

Just have faith. Yeah.
Because

the universe is going to provide.

Somehow

it's going to be fine. Because that's what I thought.
I was like,

I had no income. I was going to school.

know, he,

we didn't have savings. We didn't, you know, and

I was left with, you know, we were left to nothing. So I was like, okay, I'm going through this trauma.
I have this image in my head that I can't sleep. I can't eat.

I have a child that is heartbroken. Yeah.
Heartbroken.

And,

you know, I was just, I just thought to myself, I was like, you know, if I just, if I just have faith,

just have faith. And

things are going to start coming to you, you know. It took a long time and it was just extremely painful, but

that's just what I

believed in, you know, just

keep having faith one day at a time. Yes.

You just nailed it.

Just so you got to be strong. And these moments are the moments that

just make you stronger, you know, And every day is a choice. And

every time I say that to someone, when they're having a bad day or they're depressed, oh my God, I'm like, you have a choice. You have a choice.

You can either think or you can lift yourself up. You can either be depressed or you can be happy.

People get mad at me when I say that, but I'm like, just give it a try. Yeah.

I think

the only silver lining of going through all these things that you and I have been through is like you said, we get so resilient and we get so much stronger.

We find out what we are made of. Like you said, the small, the tiny problems of everyday life don't rattle us.
Yeah.

Like, like you said, if you tell me, I see people making drama about tiny, tiny things and I laugh about it.

And now like I'm four years, I'm six years away from Anthony's death and everything. And I'm still rebuilding.
Of course, I'm I'm far from being where I want to be, but I'm in a very happy place.

I live in the place that I love. I do what I love.

I live in peace. I live in peace.
And you are slowly, every day, I think you get stronger and stronger and stronger and you're rebuilding your life.

But it's like you said, you know, people have a choice. Every single day when you wake up, you need to ask yourself and look in the mirror.
You know, you're not going to live forever.

Whatever tragedies that

you're going through, maybe it's something horrible like us maybe it is you're dealing with death like like we've been dealing with maybe it's something else yeah you need to make a decision are you gonna let that destroy your life or are you gonna overcome that

and move on and find find you have to find happiness somehow right right

i and i just think also you know there's just

So much out there nowadays, so many resources and so many.

And I'm not saying people that are depressed, that it's it's like that and you're like just be happy and people are happy i understand i understand i know look what happened with leo uh you know i could say his name but you know look what happened with him and yeah i understand depression i think

i i i i saw with my own eyes what depression can do i understand that

but there's a million resources out there. There's just so much.
You know, there's if it is spirituality, there's doctors, there's medicine, there's community, there's just so much out there.

And

you know, and

people have, and I said, I had a friend that one day, a couple of weeks ago, telling me something about, you know, a breakup or something like that. And she was crying on the phone.

And then she said to me, she's like, oh, why am I even saying this to you? Because

you've been through so much. You don't want to this is so, this is probably so stupid to you.

And I'm like, no, I understand.

You know what I mean? Like, your monster is not any smaller than my monster. You know what I mean? People have their little monsters that they have to deal with, you know, and I get it.

It's like, it doesn't mean just because I've been through something so incredibly traumatic, it doesn't mean that I don't understand people's issues, you know. I just think,

you know, there's just a lot.

I think we, you have to put it in perspective. That's what I think for us.
Like, I agree. I've been through many breakups after Anthony died, but it puts my pain in perspective.

Like if I, if I try to have a new relationship with someone and it doesn't work out, I'm like, okay, it's too bad, you know? Yeah. But it's a tiny, tiny, tiny, tiny issue.

Obviously, it's not the end of the world. I think you have to put life in perspective and you have to choose your battles.

But like you were saying before, I want to touch on this because it's the most important thing. And I keep saying that to you as well, because I know your level of stress is so high.

People need to remember how important mental health is. You have to worry about your mental health so it doesn't get out of control.

Unfortunately, in our mom's case, it got way out of control unfortunately in anthony's case the man that i was married to it didn't matter how many millions of dollars he had in the bank it got out of control he decided to die unfortunately in your son's father in your husband that he he got out of control he he killed himself so many people every single day today i don't even know if you know in the news the husband of a very famous actress here in LA, 47 years old, just committed suicide.

No, yeah, the husband of Aubrey Plaza. So it happens every day, every day, any given day, people do this.
Yeah.

So I think you need, people need to remember: like, if you feel your stress level going up, I don't care how much, I know you have bills to pay. We all do.
I know life is very expensive.

I know all this shit, but you have to stop. And you gotta, like, like you said, bring in back the monster and bring it back under control.

And like, and same, you were saying there are a million resources. What are the resources? Go Go for a walk, exercise, breathe, drink tea, talk to a friend.

If you have a relative, like, I don't know, there's a million, but but try to

take a nap,

take a day off, because you have to keep controlling your mental health because this is the most important thing in the world. And it's unfortunately, it's not talked about enough.

And I think that's the main reason why

telling our story and putting this episode out there was so important to me because i know so many people out there are suffering alone and suffering in silence and i want them to know that they're not alone you know no 100 they're not and you know if if people that are hurting or suffering enough they would just reach out to someone and say

You know, I do think about that a lot. Like, I really wish he would have come to me and said, I'm hurting.
I'm hurting. Like, this is not a joke.
I'm thinking about this, this, and that.

I'm thinking about taking my own life.

I mean, I think, you know, of course, it's kind of hard to,

you know,

to know exactly what I would have said or how I would have handled it, but, but, but try.

You know, I think I would have said, okay, we're going to get you some help. We're going to, we're going to work this out because

this is important.

you got a child right there we need you you're important yeah you know um

so

there's just so much

so much you can do and that's what that's what i i

hope people realize you know of course there's many levels of depression there's angry i i know i suffer from really bad anxiety. It's something that I deal with it every day.

But I've learned, you know, with no medicine, no, nothing. I have learned, I, I, I, on my own, I, I did research.
I, I was like, I don't want to feel this way.

I don't want to feel this way, you know, but there's got to be a better way.

I think anxiety is always going to be part of who I am, but I have learned so many ways to cope with it and bring it down and make it better. And

I just hope people, you know,

look for help. Yeah, help.
For sure, for me. Thank you so much.
Yeah.

I had anxiety, not as much as you do. I also had a lot of anxiety as well, especially right after our mom and Anthony died.
And same, I didn't have any money. I was so freaking broke.

I was like, what the fuck? I didn't work. I barely worked for 14 years.
I was really scared. I'm going to tell you, no kidding.
And I'm not a doctor.

I'm not a specialist by any means, but I'm telling you, one of the things that saved my life, I adopted a dog, right? I rescued Phoenix.

He saved me because he made me go out the door every single day.

Yeah, and I'm not kidding you. And I tell you that, just going for the walks every day

does wonders, does wonders. Because you start putting all those Zender fiends in your brain before it.
I know it sounds so stupid because I believe in my heart. You died.
I did that a lot.

And believe me, when we died,

I would put AirPods,

meditation music,

healing meditation, and I would go for walks.

I would walk for like a couple miles and then three miles and then four miles. But that, yes, that's so important.
It helps. It's so important.
You know, it's just healing and anxiety and depression.

it helps everything it does it really does and i i really believe i've i've interviewed dozens and dozens and dozens of experts of all areas on canon de laws the past four years.

And I'm telling you, I believe the United States is a heavily medicated country. Like, if you go to a doctor right now and you say, I'm depressed, my mother died, they prescribe anything you want.

They prescribe immediately. They ask me every time I go to the doctor, they're like, Do you want something to sleep? Do you want an antidepressant? Do you want this?

And I'm like, No, I don't personally, I don't like drugs in my system. I live a super naughty lifestyle.

And I believe the best medicine is, like I said, go for a walk, sunshine, air, fresh air, because mentally it starts clearing your head.

And I'm not saying it would prevent somebody from killing themselves. That's not what I'm saying.

But maybe if you do it, it compounds, you know, it starts making you feel better and better and better and better.

So if you're super stressed, or like you said, in your case, you're suffering from severe anxiety.

If you do it every little, every day, a little more more and more more like after a month you're feeling like a brand new person and i highly encourage people to do it if you can adopt the dog you know why i say the dog because you know sometimes people that are really depressed they're like oh i'm not gonna go out today but the dog forces you they're like i can tell you with those puppy eyes like come on mommy come on i remember in my darkest days my darkest days

phoenix forced me to go out the door and then when i'm out there i'm like thank you, Phoenix. I'm so glad we did.
Sometimes it's unconditional love, you know? Animals are so important.

So important. I 100% agree.
I just, yeah, are these,

like you just said, is this going to prevent somebody from committing suicide? I don't know. But maybe if you take tiny, tiny, tiny little steps,

you know.

But if it's adopting a pet, if it's going for a walk, with a friend, or,

you know, going out in nature,

also for me was practicing gratitude. Oh my God.

For me, it was gratitude,

faith, love.

I was like, I got to give my, I got to have love.

Every day I'm like, I know it might sound so stupid. I'll touch my heart.
I'm like, okay,

I'm alive. I'm grateful.
I got to be here for my child. I, you know,

faith, I would just do this

little talk with with myself every morning, you know, and it's just, I would say, all the things I'm grateful for, because no matter how bad you think your life is, there's always something.

Oh my God, yes. There's always something.
One million percent. Always.

And even if it's like, oh, I'm, I'm today, I'm grateful for this beautiful weather, or I'm grateful for, it could be something outside your environment, but

there's always something to be grateful for. And gratitude is just,

it pulls you out of

any darkness. Yeah.
I believe that with all my heart. I could not agree with you more.
I agree. It's a game changer.

It's a game changer. Same.
It changed my life when I decided. And it's funny, right? Because I used to be married to a millionaire.

And, you know, I had this crazy lifestyle, travel the world, stay in fancy hotels, la la la la la. And I was miserable because, of course, I was being abused like shit.
I couldn't do anything.

Nowadays, my life is a million times more simple, but I do everything I love and I am so grateful for every little thing I have.

Like you said, the most simple things, I walk out the door with Phoenix and I'm like, it's such a sunny day. I'm super grateful.
I know. Like

zero dollars.

I spend zero dollars. I find gratitude and positivity, you know, in the smallest little things.
And it doesn't matter how, I could be,

I have my sad days. I have,

I still have bad memories. I still,

I get triggered sometimes. I get

worried. I have concerns.
I have stress.

I'm constantly working. I'm, you know what I mean?

Same.

I'm a single mom. Yes.
You know, same. Yeah.
Single mom with minimum support system.

Minimum support system. So,

but I'm always like, there's always, always things to be grateful for. There's always something positive in my life.
So the days that I'm just not feeling 100%,

I'm like, oh, wait a minute. I have to

go through a gratitude list. I have to do a little gratitude list.
And somehow. You got to push forward.
You got to push forward because

if you believe that you can rebuild something amazing,

that if you come, like you said, you come from a place of love and you believe,

you have to believe.

That you have to come from a mindset that you believe you can build again.

And that's already like a huge step forward. If you have to believe, you have to wake up in the morning and say, I believe.
Obviously, you're doing amazing.

You're much like in the beginning stages of your healing. I am more advanced stages of my healing.
We are like different journeys.

But if anybody out there listening, whatever stages of your healing that you are, don't give up. Don't fall.
You can be having

the worst fucking day.

You have to keep pushing ahead and believing.

Because look, if you stop, like it's that famous phrase, I don't know if you ever heard, you're going through hell. So you're not going to stop in hell, right?

You got to keep going until you get out of hell, right?

I mean, that's the best. That's the best message I can.

And I also think, you know,

I don't know if I'm ever going to be done healing, you know? I feel it like

healing is

an ongoing journey. Yes.
You know,

I feel like

I'm never going to stop. healing.
You know, I'm always going to try to find ways to be happy and heal for my and get better, you know? Oh, for sure.

I have things that I need to work on and I'm always, you know, like healing. I really feel healing is a journey.

Never stop.

I don't think I'm ever going to be like, I'm healed. I'm good.
No, I'm not. But you know, the beauty, I think that's the beauty of being an adult is like we are ever evolving, right?

And how to be better and learning. Like just doing this podcast have been such a healing journey for me and a growing journey for me.

I'm not the same Catherine that I was four years ago, the shit I used to put up with, the woman that I was. And we grow and we become better and better and better versions of ourselves.

And I agree, we learn until the day that we're not here anymore. And I think that's what life is all about.

And I am very proud of you because, you know, a lot of people would not be this strong at this point in the game. And you are raising an incredible, incredible human being.

I know you're going to find a prince. I know he's out there looking for you.
And it's just like smooth sailing from now on. And

I really, really hope our stories inspire people out there who are going through tough times.

Because, like I said, we are living proof that, you know, no matter what background you come from, and I promise you, we do not come from a background.

We could do like a five-hour episode shit show just about our family. yeah i think in the and and

um

yeah i don't think i have uh i think you know only you really know but the you know the things that i've been through in my childhood you know what i was that i was telling you some of it no no listen and you know what cracks me up nobody like the our relatives that are like still alive right nobody ever helped for nobody ever did for us nobody supported us when our father died and our mother Nobody gives a fuck.

Now, because of social media, they see me like in Beverly Hills, whatever. No, no, no.
They probably think I'm a gazillionaire again. I don't know what they think.

They send hearts and love and they make comments on social media like, oh my God, it's amazing to see you girls. Like now they want to be a part of our lives again.

Yeah. And I think because it just makes me laugh.
So a different country, you know, it's kind of like,

I don't know, but it's like whatever you know i don't have any yeah i think i i think every single person

everybody has childhood trauma for sure everybody yeah you know some have extreme ones some have middle you know i feel like we had quite a bit

of childhood and then you know some people have minor ones but

everybody does yeah

But I'll tell you guys,

I'll tell you guys one thing.

And I think you agree with me. No matter who it is, if it's your relative, your cousin, your father, your mother, whoever it is, if it's your friend, I don't care who it is.

If it's somebody toxic in your life, you need to leave them behind and move forward without them in order to heal. 100%.

You just have,

I left so many people behind that were horrific, horrific vampires to me. Like the closest, closest people to me.

when my mother died and i realized what horrible horrible they were stealing from me they were sucking me dry they were sucking my energy my life my money i literally had to cut ties and leave them behind in order for me to heal and move forward you have to literally not care who they are And you have to cut ties to save yourself.

I think. Yeah,

the lesson I just learned. Right.

You have to. You have to.
I to tell you that I have I lost two

very very very close friends one of my best friends I lost because of this tragedy that I went through um

she you know uh

I

I was always there for her. We knew each other for 15 years.
I was there for her

everything. And then when I'm the first time, I'm like,

I need this. I I need you.
I need you, you know,

it has appeared. Oh, yeah.
And I'm like, wow, okay. I need to, I need to be better.

I need to be better. Yeah.
You know, that's the thing. We need to be better.

I need to be better and not

have toxic people around me because

we, you know, no making excuses.

Get rid of it. It's the perfect time of the year to just,

you know. Yeah, exactly.
You have to leave it behind. You have to, yeah, leave it behind.
Yeah, leave it behind, cut ties. It's all about quality.
I learned this in my life.

I know because when I was a gazillionaire, I thought, oh my God, I have hundreds of friends. They were a bunch of, they were a bunch of mochers.

You know, they were champagne friends. I realized I had to cut ties with so many people.
It's really about quality.

And like you said, the word love, people that love you unconditionally, that are going to stand by you, that are, that want the best for you when you are drinking champagne, when you are having a great time, and when you are going through tragedy.

Yeah, that's it. And cut to everybody else and just ignore the noise.
That's

the thing that you have to do. Also, you know, you go to something like that and

that's when you learn who your friends are. Oh my God, yes.
Wow, this friend, wow, this is a good friend. Yeah.

The friend there and you're like, oh, okay, I'm glad this person is gone because totally, you know, it's painful, and it is painful.

Because when somebody's your friend for like 20 years, 25 years, they frequent your homes, you give them vacations, you know, they sleep on your couch, you do things with them,

and when you need them the most, they turn their back on you. It's very, very painful.
You're like, Oh, now I'm not good enough. It's another lot for me because of that.
It's a model loss, yeah.

But you know what?

Yes, I think you need to go through these losses in order to you have you just have to because as long as you have toxic people around i think that's one of the toughest lessons but as long as we have toxic relationships around you cannot fully heal you just can't no no you know yeah i agree

it's important to get rid of it then

and just begin healing one little thing at a time yeah one thing

but it's so important and it's it's not easy it's not an easy journey healing is not easy but we have to go through it. Well,

anybody can do it. If you and I could do it after all this crap,

people can do it. We are in a great position.
We're just going to want to. Yeah.
We are in a great place. I think that's how we

wanted to. I think that's the thing.
You know, we went through a lot, but we're like, no, we want it. We want to be better.
We want to get better. We want to heal.
Yes. So

it's important. I think for me, I tell you one thing, right?

I don't know how long I'm i'm gonna live but i i remember i i say that to myself all the time like every week i don't want to end up like my parents

yeah i i know it's hard but i say

i do not want to end up like

dying sad or broke or depressed or a drunk i want to break this curse like you said or spell like I said I want to make something I want to leave a beautiful mark in the world with my something I want to leave something beautiful behind.

I don't know if it's the, if my podcast episodes touch somebody's heart, if it's anything that I do, you know, adopting, rescuing dogs, or telling stories, I want to leave something positive behind.

Of course. I want to break the cycle, you know, and I think that keeps me going.
And I think you're doing the same. And like you said, you want to create a better life for your son.
So

figure out what keeps you going and go after your dreams.

Yeah, I think, you know, I thought about it. I was like, why my purpose? And I think it's just really raising and just a really, really

emotional, intelligent, kind,

good human. He is.
He's that's my priority.

You know,

you're very lucky because he's one of the most adorable special boys. Yeah.
He's so advanced.

His mom. I'm like,

no, but like seriously

he talks and he's like are you really 13 you're not like 18 is like crazy how intelligent and advanced he is it's like just such an honor being around him he's so great and thank you i'm very proud of you because i know it took a lot of you to do this podcast i was very nervous yeah i know speaking of new challenges we always talk about that right like you gotta be challenge yourself try out new things you know fight through anxiety go go for it.

This is a great example, you know, just go for it. And then once you do it, you're like, wow, I'm so proud of myself.
I can do new things.

Yes.

And I'll bring you back one day. No, yeah, I'll bring you back because I want to do another episode about dating.
Because today we didn't even have time. Dad, I have tons of time.

Yes, because I want to do an entire episode about dating.

We're going to need a few episodes.

Yes, for sure. I love you so much.
And I hope you love back soon.

and guys remember the message i think is like do everything with love and go after your dreams you can heal any trauma and please if you are suffering if you are under any kind of mental anguish seek help i am putting i am attaching

a link here to this this podcast episode where you can seek help. And there are many, many, many, many resources.

You can reach out to us directly we have 24 seven open lines of communication through whatsapp 1305 3320 338

and via email contact at cat on the loose

but please seek help talk to someone talk to someone don't keep it to yourself

if you don't have relatives like us Talk to a friend

or call the hotline.

Go through the link. Call us.
We will hook you up. You are never, ever alone, right?

You are not, never. There's always, there's always, always something that can be done.
Yes. I truly believe that.
Life is too precious. Life is too precious.
Life is too precious.

And every single person matter. Yes.
They really do. Yes.
I know.

My friend dad mattered a lot. Oh, yes.
One minute.

Yes.

I wish you were here so I could hug you. I know.
I know. Big hug.
I love you so much.

Me too. I can't wait until you guys are back here where you belong.
I know. I can't wait to see you.
I love you guys.

This was a very special Canonaloos kicking off season five with Ty, and I'll see you guys very soon. Be safe out there.

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