"We ❤️ Our Customers" (w/ Demi Lovato)

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Look, man.

Oh, I see.

My eye.

Oh, my.

Bowen, look over there.

Wow, is that culture?

Yes.

Goodness.

Wow.

Las culturistas.

Ding-dong.

Las culturistas calling.

What do you think is in the air right now?

Fall.

Fall.

Spooky season for sure.

I haven't been spooked at all.

Can I say that's not been a part of it.

I think we're about to get spooked, though.

We're about to go to New Orleans for our friend Joel Kimbooster's bachelor party.

Did you know it's New Orleans gay Halloween weekend?

I think someone knew.

Someone in the group knew.

Otherwise, they wouldn't have picked New Orleans for that week.

I think this is all very intentional.

Certainly not on our part.

So we're just along for the ride.

It's targeted.

It's targeted.

But here's the thing about gay weekend vacation.

It just so happens to

I face this in Pete Town too, because it's like the thing about New Orleans and also P-Town is, well, maybe more New Orleans than P-Town, but they talk about the food in New Orleans.

And so I'm really going to want to center your gumbo, your

beignets.

Beignets.

Your Andouille.

And more.

And more.

You know what I mean?

Food.

And then at the same time, it's like a gay Halloween weekend.

You know what I'm saying?

It's like, you don't want to necessarily be full of the Bula Bass

when you're trying to shake that ace.

Well, I want that's really good.

Was it?

I want a Bula

to get me in the bass.

You want to

in your base.

Well, Bula in Bula in my base.

He got that Bula bass.

Oh my God.

Ratatouille would love this song.

But I have to say that he wouldn't because that's not his name.

That's not his name.

It's Remy.

which

do you remember finding that out holy

that was when you knew that that movie was for adults it wasn't a pixar movie for kids that it was to go firing on other cylinders well that the that the title is a peasant vegetable dish and not the cute little mouse yeah

like that was when they pixar went this one this one's a thinker and it's not

and and yeah we're gonna we're gonna trick the kids into the theater with these little mice and the posters him, you know, surrounded by a knives against a door.

I don't remember that ever happening in the movie.

Then it becomes a whole treatise on art and the joy of cooking and romance in Paris.

So Ratatouille doesn't have any, I would say, Cajun New Orleans food in it.

Can I tell you something?

I've never seen it.

Are you serious?

I don't really want.

Can I come out of this?

Are you serious?

I don't really watch.

I don't watch the Disney movies.

I don't watch the Disney movies.

I'm serious.

I don't.

They're not a part of my culture that I consume.

I don't do that.

I don't do the Disney films.

You know, I don't.

What is this?

I don't.

I don't watch the movies.

I like to go on the rides.

It's a common misconception.

What was the last Disney movie you saw?

We'll get this.

In today's episode of the the podcast we have demi lovato on famous disney star turned very very remy from ratatouille narrative used to be a disney star is now for gay adults

very remy narrative But in this episode, which you're about to hear, this is really just a little appetizer if we're going with the Remy meal metaphor, which we are.

And what is Remy for gay adults?

For me,

when I go to Epcot, Remy's for gay adults.

Sure, it's this gay adult.

And we should just also clear up, Boula Base is a French stew, and it's not Cajun.

We also must, we're going to get reamed by the cooks out there.

Oh, no.

Reamed by the cooks.

I don't hate that sound of it.

I don't hate the sound of it.

Sing you this weekend, you fucking fags.

I would love a chef to fuck me.

Oh, I would love a chef to fuck me.

You know, have I ever been fucked by a chef?

No.

Let me think about that.

While I am, I was going to say, Demi Lovato mentions the movie Soul in this episode, the Disney movie Soul.

That maybe was the last like Disney one.

No, I did see that.

And I remember leaving being like, eh.

Okay.

Well, that came out during COVID.

So you left the room.

You left the room that you watched it in.

No, I mean, I watched it.

I remember I watched it in my LA apartment and I was just like, eh, this one wasn't really it for me.

I kind of need like, I kind of need either one of two things, like a lot of music or a big gay villain who dies in in like an overdrawn way i've talked about this on the show if you don't give me either one of those things it's like not the disney movie for me but it is the disney movie for demi lovada what she says in the episode and i'm so happy for her for that reason and the new album you know i'm very happy for the new album for for her and for myself i'm happy for everybody i'm i really am i think this is a moment We're not playing here.

I think this is a moment for the culture where if we do right by this album, we're not being like paid to say this.

Like if we do right by this album as a culture, as a community, we will be okay.

I genuinely believe that.

And let me tell you something.

They try to pay us to say things and we always say no.

Actually, T, besides the ads that we, besides the ads that we pay.

Besides the ads that we're paid to say.

By the way,

they try to tell us.

And sometimes they do.

And it works in the ads.

But first of all, any ad you get for for like the military or for some quote-unquote agency in this fucking country of ours is not something that we ever put on the show.

And we actually do have a connection every week and we do like bring it up to the fucking top brass and really take this off.

Oh, yeah.

If you ever get like an ad for the Air Force on this podcast, please let us know.

Wait a minute.

We will fly right in, as it were.

Yeah, I wanted to say something, but what do you want to say?

Nothing.

Well, I'll tell you later.

Oh.

Oh, see?

See what?

We're not being authentic.

No, no, this is between this is between Beau and Matt.

This is between me and Matt.

Oh, yeah, we're having a big demi era, that's for sure.

Well, I'm saying, if we do right by this album, it's not that deep,

out this Friday, October 24th,

you will really, really be happy.

I think we will be dancing during spooky season.

There will be something to really bring the community together on Halloween.

No matter what the community is, no matter how you...

Listen to me.

My lips, your lips take me to the chorus.

I kiss for fun.

It's fun to kiss.

To kiss.

Lyrics.

Lyrics, music and lyrics.

A movie starring Hugh Grant and Drew Barrymore.

Also, the things that this album excels at.

Music and lyrics.

I really think you'll enjoy.

Well, it's actually so crucial that an album excel at both music and lyrics.

It's actually Rilla Culture number nine.

It's actually

so crucial.

Crucial

albums excel at both music and lyrics.

I would say this one does it in spades.

Oh, yeah.

Any other updates?

I think we are really loving this.

We've done this a couple of times in the past, right?

I think for the Cape Bland Chat episode, we did a little 30-minute chunk up top of just my sister and I to keep things up to date.

And I really dig this.

I really like this.

Well, I basically like, I was really excited today because

it's a very fall day and I sort of got to dress in this new fall way because I don't know if you know by looking at me, but I clearly went to the Red Hook Flea.

You know what I mean?

They sell Zip Up Masoni vests at the Red Hook Flea.

Look at this.

Can you just get into it?

You look amazing.

I saw it and Melissa was like, I think you need that.

And I was like, I don't know.

Now take me to the chorus.

You look like you're about to

be a really handsome three-character, three-episode arc on succession, if that show is still on.

Thank you so much.

I do feel a little bit like what Jeremy Strong

would wear outside of the boardroom in that show.

Yes.

Yes.

Jeremy Strong's style icon, by the way, he looked amazing this weekend at the

Manny Gala.

So did you, but I didn't even really know what that event was.

And it was like a fashion event.

Yes, they were trying to make it sort of like a West Coast version of another famous museum gala.

The man gala.

Yes, but I don't want to compare to that.

And I know I'm not really.

I do.

I want to compare.

Okay.

But truly,

what a fun night.

And

some looks returned.

Nikki Campbell had a fun, snurky thing to say about my outfit, and it felt like a dream come true.

Nikki Campbell is constantly saying I'm in the wrong color.

And what I want to say to him is that color is

subjective.

Oh, so here, I'm sorry, but he recently said something was good that was bad.

And I'm like, see, it's subjective.

Nikki Campbell is really helping me get back to that place that I took for granted during the fashion police era, where I'm like, I disagree with this opinion, and that's okay.

And this actually applies to every kind of thing in life, hopefully.

I'm actually going to bravely say what I thought was bad that he thought was good.

And a lot of people are talking about it.

And I do think it's culture.

And I do think it's gay culture.

And so

I respect the parties involved for creating gay culture with this and i do think it's smart for the movie but what alexander scarsgaard just wore to the um it was like a white almost halter top and like black leather pants with yeah he looked hot but that that top didn't that top didn't look right on him i disagree but see you disagree

i thought he looked amazing I did look incredible.

Maybe I'm wrong.

Cause then actually I did look at, then I looked at again, like two days later, and I was like, okay, I mean, it is working.

Like, I am a little horny.

Yeah.

I definitely had a chub, but I was like, is that Alexander Skarsgård, especially him being so fluid?

Or is that the look?

And I don't think it's the look.

I think, I think he was very sexy in spite of the look.

Interesting.

See, that's like, that's where I come in on it.

Let me, let me pull this girl up.

Pull it up again because I'm in discussion.

I just don't know about the way that the top looks.

Are you looking at it?

I don't know.

It's, it's, yeah, it's giving, it's giving like Donald Karen.

I think the darts, I think the dart, it's not a dart, but it's like, I think the way that there's a stitching

along, up and down is.

God, he is such a hot.

Okay, you know what?

I forget I said no.

He looks amazing.

He does look amazing.

What do you mean?

Could do no wrong.

I mean, he's, is he number one?

God, you go on Google images of Alexander Skarsgård and it's really a treat.

It's actually really culture number four.

You go on Google.

Google images.

It's really a treat.

And I know, I'm sure of a gem of a human being as well.

Good enough for Jack McBrayer.

Good enough for me.

For us.

Well, they're like iconic besties.

I know.

Jack McBrayer.

Come on the pod.

Fred Runner for Best Vibes, hands down.

Oh, yes.

That man is a vibe.

He's really good.

He's really fun.

I really enjoy him.

I must, I just have to say that.

Oh, can we just shout out?

Alex, really.

I'm sorry.

While you were doing that, I was still feeling the freesan about Alexander Skarsgard.

And I had a thought run through my head, which was I should make him my phone background, but I think that's a bridge too far.

Why is that?

Because I'm like a grown man.

Well, look at him.

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Oh, okay, so a couple of things.

First of all,

congratulations on another amazing banner week on the Today Show with Jenna.

Oh, thank you.

You were fabulous as always.

A lot of hot, hot, hot employees on on the staff crushing on my friend Matt Rogers.

Really?

Didn't you?

You guys had a whole thing where like...

Oh, oh, oh, no, she, she was saying that her, one of her mom friends was like, I like Matt Rogers, so I have a crush on Matt Rogers.

I thought it was this, I thought it was someone on staff.

Okay, they would know this was a professional.

It was like her former assistant was texting her current assistant.

I wish Matt Rogers was straight, which is such a kind thing to say when you're a straight woman.

No, I really do.

I take that as a compliment.

But then she was saying that she was around a bunch of mom friends who were saying they like me on the show.

I mean, like, I love going and doing the show.

I just don't think they're going to want to pay anyone to do that job.

I know.

That's my thing is everyone's like, when is it going to be official?

I'm like, I'm not thinking of it like that.

Yeah, I think there are a lot of factors surrounding this that are out of our control in this area.

To speak, speak, whatever.

We'll end it there.

But I also want to say,

really quickly, I have to commend the work

of Friend of the Pod, Brooke Ashley.

I have been wrapped in

her storytelling.

Oh my God.

When it comes to the Ocepho scandal of it all, I don't think we have to spend too much time on this,

but it is, it is real.

I am thinking about this situation a lot.

Very, very, very, very unfortunate for a lot lot of reasons.

If you don't know, one of the real houses of Potomac, Wendy Ocepho, and her husband, Eddie Oceffo,

are allegedly in this sort of insurance fraud scheme that

is just super unfortunate.

They apparently allegedly staged a burglary, reported these goods stolen.

They then returned these.

allegedly stolen goods to the retailer before the burglary allegedly took place.

And then Wendy was seen on social media with a piece of jewelry after the burglary.

Yeah, they were arrested.

I mean, they were arrested on multiple counts of felonies and other misdemeanors, but all relating to insurance fraud.

And this is the first, I guess, guest of our show that's been arrested for felony crimes.

I

really hope this is some kind of

mistake that can get cleared up, but also I don't think they go out of their way to make a full-blown

arrest, like especially one that's as public as this without there being something.

I will say the thing that makes me saddest about this is the children.

Well, yes, obviously, but also like

we saw them try a lot of ways to make money.

You know what I mean?

Like she came in with this full-blown, you know, identity as a professor, as someone who was very well educated, you know, famously four degrees.

You know, she also had a has

a career as a commentator, a political commentator.

She was trying to do a talk show.

She tried to do a home essentials line.

There's now the weed business.

Like these are people that we saw try

many different ways to make money.

And I don't know how successful those were or how

things look on the outset, but I just think it's really sad that people that are as smart as this or as accomplished as this and as that presented as such, you know, different types of people felt that they needed to do something like this and I really hope that

I'm just I'm rooting for their innocence and I think the whole thing is really sad because I I'm a dr.

Webby fan and

the final thing I want to say is I blame Giselle.

I blame Giselle.

I blame Giselle.

Oh, I absolutely blame Giselle and Robin.

I blame Giselle.

I blame Robin.

I blame Ashley.

I blame them all.

Oh, Ashley Darby remains one of the dumbest people to ever.

You posted that story of her being like, so I'm going to the White House correspondence dinner.

And it's not really a partisan thing.

It's like, I mean, kind of is.

Oh, according to who, Ashley?

According to her, I guess in that moment.

One of our great,

great minds.

I'm sorry.

I go for

I go for how stupid these, specifically these two people are.

And it is sad that like, whatever.

I also root for Wendy.

That's all.

That's all I'm going to say.

I root for Wendy.

I think this is so shocking and so unfortunate for

whatever happens, whatever the truth is.

I mean, none of it is right, but

there are so many things about this that are wrong.

But I just think, I just think, you know, on a human level, it's like, you never, it's just, it's, it's just a terrible system that we live in, right?

That like motivates this kind of thing.

That's all.

I just think, how the fuck did they think they were going to get away with it if that's what they were doing?

Amex doesn't play.

Insurance doesn't play.

No.

Like insurance will come after you.

Anything above what?

What, like $400, $500?

No, like the charge was

insurance fraud over $300.

Like anything above that?

Well, it was, so basically they claimed up to $450,000 in stolen goods because that was what their insurance policy like required they claim.

If, you know what I mean?

Like, so even that, just like barely getting over that little, you know, it's just all of it feels, all of it feels a little too dumb, dumb which is why i'm hoping it's a mystery there can be something else that comes out that clears them just because i'm so devastated for their very young children they have an adorable family yeah um

and you know i've always been i've always been a wendy fan but then you know who the knows we don't really we don't know these people i mean

Brian Moyland did a great breakdown on his housewives bulletin on vulture, just like the tears of lying that happens on housewives and I think just that just happened in real life but like this is the most serious I mean it goes from like simple misunderstandings to like

you know embellishing the truth all the way down to like criminal things right and um

late like the recent examples of this are perhaps this Wendy situation certainly the Katie Janella of it all on OC

and

you know classically Monica Garcia like

there's just the thing, but the thing at the root of all this is just not being able to reconcile like the real life versus what is being shown on TV, like the gilded exterior of what you want to show on a television show, which is different than social media where you can just control things.

You are handing over the edit to people that are not out there to make you look good.

Yeah, I mean, that's, I guess, like, I think that's what's the darkest about it is it's just like clearly like what was motivating them was like material stuff.

And

at first I was kind of like, well, at least this is a crime that doesn't harm anyone.

You know, like Jen Shaw's crimes like explicitly harmed people.

Like, so it's, and then I was thinking, yeah, but I mean, it harmed their kids.

I know.

That's, that's the thing that sucks is like

the only people this harms.

are your family.

I thought about her mother like, because she's got like, you know, like a tough relationship with her mom.

She was really hemming and hawing about leaving her job as a professor.

Her mother is a Nigerian immigrant.

Like, she even wrote a book about this experience.

Like, this is like a hardworking, like very smart woman who tried a lot of things.

And it almost made me feel like, oh, God.

And even Whitney Rose, like, opening up on Salt Lake about her business failing.

Like, I do think there's some, there's some layer that's being pulled back now about.

Because it did feel like about four or five years ago, there was like this housewives resurgence again.

you know what i mean like i felt like salt lake doing so well and being in the headlines and then like you know bravo con exploding the way it did like it felt like an industry again that was really motivating these entrepreneurial attempts by the women and one dark side of that is that a lot of that is gonna fail And so I think that it's honestly saving Whitney on the show because it felt like that cast was getting so crowded for her to come out and be like, Hey, I am going to be really honest about this.

Like, I did not succeed.

And she, and, and she was not shy at the time about being like, Justin lost his job.

I'm putting everything into this.

So, then, on by the same token, for her to now come in and be like, Hey, all that stuff I said, that was real.

I really did sink a lot of my stuff and it failed.

Yeah, is like making her

kind of, yeah, it gives her this really

new thing thing to play with.

I don't think we've seen a lot of this in the Housewives franchises.

I think she's.

There's no honesty about failure.

I know.

It's actually, it's very refreshing.

We've always rooted for Whitney here.

Love Whitney.

We love Whitney and especially loved her conversation with Britney.

Haunting.

Haunting.

But can we say we love Britney?

But Britney, like we are all Whitney in that moment shaking you being like, you absolutely cannot date this this man any further if your daughter is saying it's a hard line in the sand.

Like, you cannot.

And then the next episode she's like, we are back together.

Brittany, Brittany, if you're listening, we say this with just love.

I know you've been probably getting so much, you know,

caustic feedback from just the public.

And that is an awful sensation and that is completely disorienting, telling you how to be a parent.

We are not necessarily here to do that, but we're here to tell you in a situation like this where one thing is deleterious of the other, it seems like dating Jared is really harming in a potentially permanent way your relationship with your children.

That's all.

And it's going to be documented.

Yes, and that's even more painful.

Well, but you know what, though?

She's got to show up 54 below.

She's going the Luann route.

I love it, but genuinely so talented.

Not to say that Luann isn't.

Here's the thing about Luann, she's a star.

I have seen that show two times.

I don't know if I'd call her a vocal talent, but I would call her a star oh

an icon and i took down my post where it was um bravo mg posting about how luan was cast as the cowardly lion i took it down because it was taking jabs at her quote-unquote male voice and i was like okay i don't want to do that well i mean yeah i took but i mean like i like i like i don't want i don't want like to like public i don't know i like however she feels about that i don't want that to be you're being sensitive about a comment about someone's uh gender vocal timbre that could that yeah i mean that you're being sensitive but it's gendering gendering the timbre.

Luann has a man's voice as a well-trod.

And

I don't want to keep grooming a well-trod path.

So I,

anyway, but we're just saying we love Luann as well.

We're just saying.

One thing I'm saying about you is you're always grooming the path of the untrodden.

I'm grooming a new path.

You're always grooming.

That's what I always say about Bowen.

He is always grooming.

I see him out here grooming.

Yes, yes, yes.

Well, I've been getting, so I, remember when I told you about that allergy around my eye?

Yes.

How is it going?

You know what it is?

It's just that I can't use any like makeup or anything that's like scented, I guess.

I have to use all clean products.

I don't know when this happened.

Right now, I kind of like, I have to say, like, this is my office.

So I'm in my New York apartment and I'm really happy where I put my desk because the light is really.

I'm so satisfied to have good zoom lighting in here.

That's great.

And also, like, we used clean makeup this week for some stuff that we had to do and i'm like okay thank god i i'm not breaking out around my eyes because that is frustrating when something with your skin wears its ugly head it's i don't think so honey coated but also take the fragrances out of makeup period right why i don't i don't i never got that unless if hey if you if you love your fragrance scented makeup let us know why we would love to get some perspective on this what if i just started wearing white diamonds by elizabeth taylor here we go talk about Elizabeth Taylor and your new assumption.

Can I tell you why?

Okay, so just to briefly touch on this, if you don't like the song Elizabeth Taylor, two things.

It's fine.

I'm not going to get intense about it.

One, I just wouldn't want you around like my kids.

Like, I wouldn't trust you.

Like, I think you should go.

I think you're, I wouldn't, I don't trust you.

And two, you're not thinking of it as a Matt Rogers character.

Right.

Oh.

If you think of it as a me character, you're going to think Elizabeth Taylor is one of the great songs of the American, of the Global Songbook.

And if we had to make the list again, it would be in the top 50.

People don't understand

her mind on Elizabeth Taylor.

They're not understanding her mind.

Would you say that the way into the album in general is to think of her on this album as a Matt Rogers character?

Yeah.

It could help.

It could help.

No, but here's the thing.

Like people are, I think now the dust has kind of settled about it and people can start to talk about this album like human beings.

Fate of Ophelia, Elizabeth Taylor, Opalite, Father Figure, the first four tracks, that is unreal.

Like that's really good.

And then I have the same complaints about Eldest Daughter that everyone else does.

But then we're back with Ruin the Friendship.

And Ruin the Friendship is classic Taylor.

Classic Taylor.

I,

you know, I had a really crazy delayed moment with both Midnights.

And now in the last couple of days, evermore, you were always right.

I should never doubt you.

We might not be synchronized in our opinions, but

I will maybe meet you at some point.

We will intersect in them at some point.

Who's to say that I won't move past it?

Just to hear you guys finally get on board with like a song like Maroon, which is so

good.

I never said Maroon.

What song were you not feeling for Midnights?

Lavender Haze?

Yeah, for some reason, I never,

I wrote off Lavender Haze as like not one of her best openers on an album.

It's a Remy thing.

You just had to grow up.

Fuck you.

Wait, what does Remy mean?

It's a Remy Ratatouille.

I know, I know.

Used to be young and for kids.

Then one day he fucked.

I don't understand.

Mimi at Midnight.

no the production on lavender haste goes so hard anyway

it's we're having jake shane on the show next week and we did a full episode with jake way before life of a showgirl had come out

so we don't even talk about it it's a wonderful time capsule that's a fantastic episode this is a fantastic episode um anything else before we throw it over to our conversation with dummy well i love i did want to say speaking of the pop girls i loved you grinding on sabrina and i did just want to ask you like, for any BTS when you, when you and Sabrina were sort of rubbing your private parts on each other all day for comedy, like, how did you break through the awkwardness of that?

Was it ever awkward?

Are you guys texting a lot now?

Are we going to see Bowen Straight enact itself in real life?

You and Sabrina Carpenter would be an incredible power couple.

I actually think that.

Thank you.

Really?

What makes you sad?

You're like the Barry Kyogen of gay guys.

You're not.

You kind of are, actually.

You kind of are.

Interesting.

Like, I started off doing little smaller supporting roles.

And then, and then I, and then I really found like now you're at the Academy Gala getting a vibes, Oscar.

Congratulations on your vibes, Oscar.

Thanks.

That's what we're calling it.

You know, it was very Barry Kyogan of me was

Mr.

Alordi and I reconnecting on the flight back to New York.

That's really good.

And so that's that's very Barry.

No, and now I'm running.

I was running around my house, my apartment today, fully naked, and I did feel like Barry at the end of Saltburn, a movie that I might someday also come to really enjoy in the way that I do with Midnights.

I think Saltburn, like, looking back, I probably was too hard on that.

It's fun.

I can't wait for Wuthering Heights.

I can't wait for Wuthering Heights.

I want to say that, yes, even with Life of a Showgirl, even with

a lot of recent releases or not so recent releases, like, I think there is a latent period of like, wait for this to, wait for this to like congeal in the culture before like, I, I don't come out with like a rush to take anymore.

No, it's just stupid because, because honestly, like, everyone's so crazy when it first comes out.

Like, I also just, like, I said, like, I've said a million times, it's just not why music exists so that people can raise to have a take on it.

Even like the Swiftologist, who I've been watching a lot of, like, because that's where I'm at, I guess.

He's very smart.

He even waits.

Like, he does his

immediate reaction.

And then he, and it was he waited like

he waited two weeks for his showgirl

and his ultimately his opinion is that life of a showgirl is mid and but and i even think that might change i don't think it's mid i think there's i think there's one song i don't like canceled at all i i i just i don't like i don't like content about cancellation i don't like like i just don't like any i don't i don't like talking about i don't like the word canceled like i just don't think it's it's it's not forward thinking i think taylor might be aware that this is her album that she will leave behind as the one where it was like that was her at her most chronically online because the rest of the world was too like i there's something that i think is true about her earlier work that um is more timeless because it is not it was not as online because we weren't as a culture i think because the culture is bad we have bad reactions to work that is about the current moment and therefore people

have really strong reactions to it and i think this album i think this album will make sense in about a year which i think all of the like every

every like sticky piece of work does like at some you know you know after a certain latent period what were you gonna say i think it does make sense already because i actually think like i i think whether or not like you like the explanations because she has given a couple which you could argue like should you be able should you have to explain things people to get them but like the first verse of eldest daughter she was like no i'm intentionally speaking in a way that people speak online because it is like me trying to fit into something that I can't.

And then when the song progresses, by the time you get to the bridge, which is like actually a really beautiful bridge, it's actually a really good track five bridge when you stack them all up together.

That's actually me speaking the way I really speak because I'm not trying too hard.

So basically she's come out and said, if the first verse sounds like it's trying too hard, that's by design.

Now, people can have their their opinions on that, whatever.

But I do think it speaks to a larger thing about the album, which is she didn't write a million songs.

She probably wrote like these 12, maybe a few more.

And she said, you know what?

I'm going to fucking go for it.

And I'm going to be messy.

And I'm going to have people talking.

And certainly there are some things in here that like relate to her peers, Charlie.

You could argue Olivia with the father figure of it all.

I actually think in

the movie that she,

you had in theaters, like she pretty directly, not she doesn't outright confirm that it's about Olivia, but she was on both sides of this dynamic.

She says she's been on both sides of the dynamic and she also like goes out of her way to say, we interpolated father figure by George Michael and the song father figure.

And we were in communication with them the whole time because that's what you do when you interpolate something and it's great.

And that's the right thing to do, which to me is directly speaking to the concerns about the Olivia Rodrigo and why Taylor, Jack, and St.

Vincent have writing credit on a song like Deja Vu.

So to me, it's like, not only is she,

not only is that what this song is about, but she wants people to know,

which is a choice.

And like, you know, like that certainly that's going to be polarizing.

But I think that's the point of Life of a Showgirl is I think she wants it to be messy.

She said she welcomes the chaos everyone's takes online.

So like, I think she wanted wanted this to be like a chaotic, messy, like pop star showgirl era.

Whether or not you think it achieved that is up to everyone's individual opinion, but I think the album does make sense in that way.

I don't know what her intention is with performing these songs live because she has not done live.

I have no idea.

And she says she has no plans to, which I don't know if I believe, but I think this is, there's something interesting about just letting these live on the album on

the track and not have it like have any sort of

life beyond but what i think is her best music video maybe ever which is fatophilia i actually i and i think the song is really good and i just think i just think you're being disingenuous if you don't listen to the first four songs like i understand as the album goes on like people have their differing feelings i both agree disagree on certain levels but like She opens this album so strong.

I love the fate of Ophelia.

A lot of gaga songs, I'll even say, took me a few lessons to be like, oh, I get it.

But anyway, I

not on Mayhem, though.

I, I, I,

like, we, when we, because we did, we did our first listen of Mayhem together.

With Bobby.

Yeah, that was the best.

But that, that album, straight through first time, we were like, oh, this is.

This is one of her best.

Well, that's the album of the year

for sure.

But you know what other album I really like, which kind of came out in the midst of of all the life of a showgirl stuff, is Olivia Dean's album.

That is going to have a really big moment.

I think in all the vocal, in the vocal categories,

we'll do very well at the Grammys, I think.

Oh, I think Olivia Dean, like Man I Need deserves to be the song that takes over.

Like, I think that, oh, I want to see Olivia Dean nominated for Best New Artist.

I want to see Olivia Dean.

I would love to see that album get love.

I think Man I Need,

that could be a record of the year song of the year nomination.

Like a song like that, like, because she wasn't like she was some huge name, but I will say, I remember a few years ago, maybe it was two years ago at Coachella, I was walking by the Golbi tent during the day, and Olivia Dean was performing.

And I was like, We have to stop.

And she sang a song called The Hardest Thing, which I ended up streaming a ton.

And there was something really special about her.

So watching her get this moment, the music video for Man I Need is so, she's like so in her stardom.

It's like, it's like a little bit more of like an activated adele

she

will be on snl as the musical guest right the week after nominations are announced i think her team her label is probably expecting a very impactful showing in the nominations so that nominations voting or awards voting whatever is this is parlaying very nicely i might really want to go to that show what date is that november 15th okay Oh, I'm at BravoCon.

That's going to be a good one.

It's going to be a good one.

Wow.

We covered a lot of stuff.

We did a lot.

And so basically,

I just wanted to get on here with Bo because I feel like I know that we're doing a lot of guest episodes and I just wanted to touch bass because so much has been happening and I want you to hear our voices.

But we do have an amazing episode with Demi Lovato right now, who is amongst the,

you know, albums that we're really enjoying.

Also, shout out Lola Young.

And I hope she gets well because her album is fantastic too.

But yeah, this episode with Demi is a lot of fun.

Enjoy.

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She has the number one song on the Great Global Songbook.

Our 300 song.

We've ranked the 300 best songs ever.

What do we always say?

Our grandparents had somewhere over the rainbow.

Our grandchildren had a lot of people

cool for the summer.

It's a ruler culture summer.

It's a ruler culture at number one.

It might as well be number one.

She did place in the iconic 400 list of 400 most iconic people for our 400th episode anniversary.

She beat out Elmo.

She beat out Martha Stewart, I believe.

Yeah.

And I think she beat out Holland Taylor.

Just edged out Holland Taylor.

Just edged out Holland Technical.

And then Carrie Fisher was one of them.

It was Carrie Fisher 149, Demi Lovato 150.

Holland Taylor 151.

This is Hallowed Ground.

I wonder if, I don't, we're going to bring our guest in in a second because.

Her new album.

Oh, it's not that deep.

Like literally, it is deep to us, though, because I was telling telling our guests we had the link to the album in P-Town, and they just, they just told us they could see the streams of people listening to the links they sent out.

And they were like, you guys were running it up.

I was like, no, it's, it was serious.

I was ashamed at first.

And then I immediately was like, no, why would I be ashamed of this?

Because did you think they could see it?

Well, I was like, they could see it.

Oh, my God.

It's like, it's like when someone can look at your emails or texts, it's like vulnerable when someone can see the number of times you've played.

How much they're obsessed with what you've done probably hits different.

And honestly, it's so deserved.

We've been a fan like from the jump, and it's going to be a huge demi era.

So let's talk about it.

October 24th

in just a couple days.

Please welcome to the show.

Demi Woo!

Hello, hello, hello.

I'm so happy to be here.

We're so happy you're here.

Did you know of like the place you hold in our podcasts?

I do.

I have heard the clips and I've seen the support and it just makes me feel so loved.

And I was like, I have to show my love right back.

So here I am.

I'm so excited.

We're so happy.

Number one.

So that's like of all the songs.

I guess we did that when what was that?

Like 2020?

That was like 2021 was the Great Global Songbook.

I don't think any song is unsweetened cool for the summer at this point until your album.

Thank you.

You're so sweet.

Thank you.

The fact that you're releasing this album as like a fall fucking like dance

moment is so major because I feel like fall gets like neglected and overlooked as like, oh, yeah, like do all your moody shit in the fall, but you're giving us something hyped up.

We're still going out.

Yeah.

Just because it's fall doesn't mean we're not going out.

No, just put it out.

We still need to dance.

Yeah, there's a co-check.

Yeah.

I do feel like fast was more of a like a club song and then here all night is a little bit more emotional.

But um,

but but yeah, but here all night is emotional while it's like it's it's very much giving like dancing on my own.

And like you're saying something like

really emotional and painful, but then the music and like the whole like, I mean, like the whole aesthetic of it is like, fuck, but like, no, you're, you're dancing to this song about me like being fucking crashed out about my ass.

Yes.

You know, yes.

But like, that's like the duality.

And it is that deep sometimes.

It can be that deep for sure.

But I'm, I'm just like, the, the album title for me, it's not that deep.

It's all about like, I'm, I'm not taking myself too seriously as an artist anymore.

Like, I'm just having fun.

And I wanted a body of work that's really reflective of that.

And I feel like I really accomplished it with this album.

So when you're like sitting down to do a new record or when you feel like it's time, were you thinking at first, like, I really want to have fun with my next project?

Or were you like, let's just see what happens?

And it was fun.

Like, what came first, the chicken or the egg?

Well, originally, I'm such a fluid person that like, I have,

I've tried on different genres of music throughout my career.

And my last album was a rock album.

And so going into the, I, going into the next album, I was like, okay, I want to continue the rock stuff.

But as I started writing the rock album, I was like, I can't really, like, I'm running out of things to write about because I'm so happy right now.

There's only so many rock songs you can make, like happy rock songs that you can make.

Today was good.

Yeah.

And so then they all,

today was was amazing.

And that's like, that's exactly how I felt.

So I was like, I need to like switch directions.

Like it's not resonating with me.

I'm not angry anymore.

I'm not in this like a deeply emotional place anymore like I was when I made my last album.

And so I started trying on different sounds.

And I, what landed was when I got into the studio with my producer, Zone

and he had made this beat in the car in the Uber on the way to the studio and was like, yeah, I just played, I just made this track.

Do you want to hear it?

And I'm like, Yeah, turned out to be fire.

It was, it turned into a song called Frequency.

Oh my gosh.

You really went off on that.

Thank you.

That's the one.

I mean, you repeat all of them because the album hits so hard.

And then you just go back and start it again.

Us in P-Town.

Frequency is a standout.

Thank you.

You do that so well.

Thanks.

And that song set the tone for the rest of the project.

Frequency was first.

Frequency was was day one first.

I would say it was when the album really took flight.

And

when I, when we did frequency, I was like, oh, we're onto something and I want to chase this sound.

And it was new for me.

It's different.

It's so different than anything I've ever done before.

And

I'm just, I'm having so much fun with it.

I'm having so much fun in my life.

I'm in like such a great place.

And I wanted my album to be reflective of that.

And so I made a very fun dance pop album.

I mean, at this point, I think you've earned this

idea about you, which is like, Demi Lovato is like one of our great chameleons, like musically, right?

Like, but I feel like it maybe took a while for people to realize that because I feel like going from confident to tell me you love me was like, okay, we're like, we're really in this like nice, great bodied, like R ⁇ B sound.

And then you go into all the other and then holy fuck is like obviously a departure.

And then now to go into this genre, I feel like it must be a little overwhelming for you because you can do it all.

You can do so many things with your voice.

Like, what, like, the options are kind of overwhelming, I would say, right?

Like, it's good.

Like, like, what makes you think, like, oh, this is what I want to chase beyond the fact that, like, your producer sends you this track, which he produced in his car.

Don't produce and drive.

No, no, no, he was in an Uber.

He was at the wheel making that big.

He was at the wheel to make it more careful.

Even though Uber drivers are going to hear that sick track and be like, hey, what the fuck is that?

Oh, no, not even in the Ubers.

What tells you?

Like, what is that feeling that you have as a songwriter?

What inspires me at the time is what I chase.

And that's why I've fluctuated over the years with different genres, genre's

genres.

Genias.

Genias.

Get to know it.

But like, I really chase what's inspiring me in the moment.

And so

when I made my rock album, I was really influenced by rock music.

And

at the time when I made Sorry, Not Sorry and Tell Me You Love Me, I was really inspired by more RB music.

And this project, I was really inspired by the pop girlies.

And that's what I chased.

And I'm really happy with it.

Was that like a result of seeing

everyone else kind of having fun?

Because last year was such a crazy moment.

Like from the top to the bottom of the year, it just felt like everyone was having fun again.

Like,

which of your peers, like are you inspired by mostly or like when you're going into this album well first off i was really inspired by kesha for this album

i'm just i'm such a fan of hers but she's also like side note she's such an incredible human being like i just i fuck with her so much she's so great and she was actually the one that was like you should get in the studio with zone um because they did joyride together and um and amongst other songs but um that was the one that i was like wait this is fire and And so she was like, You should get in the studio with Zone.

So I did.

And that's what ended up, you know.

You were in the zone, as it were.

And I was in the zone.

Yeah.

Yeah.

When you're hearing a track like that, like he plays you this track.

I just think if I'm Demi Lovato, I'm like, how do I figure my voice into it?

Because you're so known for what you can do with your voice.

And I feel like when you hear a track like that,

is that that must, it must be a fun challenge.

And obviously you conquered it.

But I guess my question is, how do you figure your voice into something like that?

Because Because you hit the chorus and your voice is huge in the chorus and then your like your ad libs are sick, but I just can't imagine hearing that in the track when you first heard it.

Yeah, I didn't, I definitely didn't hear like a big vocal moment when I first heard the track.

I heard the talking verses and the sexiness, but then as we started making it, we were like, we should.

chase like a kind of Britney vibe in the pre-choruses.

And then, um, and then when it hit the chorus, I, I, one thing about me is when I'm in the studio, I'm like, where's my vocal moment?

Like, 100%.

I want to have fun on the track, but like, where's my vocal moment?

Because that's what people know me for.

And that's what I have fun singing.

So

that's, yeah, that's where.

100%.

We're going to take a break.

I think we have a positive THE T FINA.

Oh, yes.

Thank you.

We've flown in the T.

And that's the T.

And that's the T.

And that's the T.

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On eBay, every find has a story.

Like if you're looking for a vintage band tee.

Not just a tea, the band tee.

From the last show your favorite band ever played.

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Then your boyfriend started wearing it.

Which was cute.

Until he dumped you and took it with him.

Which was not so cute.

But he was.

I miss him.

Anyway, now you're on eBay.

And there it is.

Same tea from the same tour still living in your memory rent-free forever.

Yeah.

Screw you, Dave.

The things you love have a way of finding their way back to you.

Except Dave.

But eBay isn't just forgetting whatever your ex/slash XBFF stole back.

We miss you.

It's also for that rare championship foul ball that you caught, then heroically gave to the kid next to you.

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Things people love.

That's a good tagline.

No one can resist a rule of culture.

So here's one for the dating files.

Rule of culture number 72.

Chemistry isn't just vibes, it's values.

Because what's the point of matching with someone if you can't talk about the shows you binge, the books you dog ear, or all the hot takes you'll defend at brunch?

I mean, you definitely have friends who have met their partners on Bumble, and it makes sense.

It's not just about matching with someone, it's about finding finding someone who gets your references, your obsessions, your whole vibe.

With shared interests and prompts, you don't just see a profile, you get a glimpse of someone's personality, which makes it even easier to start conversations that actually lead somewhere.

Plus, with photo and ID verification, you can trust that the person you're talking to is real.

With that added peace of mind, it's so much easier to show up as your full self.

So, whether your rule of culture is the best first date, start with the shared hot take on Renaissance, or compatibility is having the same hometown bodega order, download Bumble and turn those connections into something bigger.

Download Bumble and start your love story.

Who decides what you can do?

Who gets to decide what you're capable of?

Your boss?

Your friends?

Some stranger on the internet?

No, no, and absolutely no.

You decide.

Only you.

Ford shares that belief.

It's like engineered into their vehicles.

An F-150 is all steel, sweat, and dreams.

Right?

Mm-hmm.

A Ford Bronco is built for adventure, but you've got to get behind the wheel.

Can you?

Yeah, you can.

But you have to first.

You have to.

And a Mustang, the Mustang that conquers curves.

You are more capable than you know.

Like, for example, I never thought I could parallel park.

I just thought it wasn't something that was going to happen for me in my life.

And not everyone gets to have every experience, you know?

But then, suddenly, I did a parallel park and I thought, wow, I'm going to apply to Harvard.

I didn't get in, but...

I did parallel park.

Sometimes you just need to push.

What is it that they say?

Whether you think you can or you think you can't, you're right.

Ready, set,

Ford.

Visit Ford.com to learn more.

What was working with our good friend, our sister

Leland.

Cred McLaughlin, one of our best these guys.

Love Leland.

The best.

He's so talented and he's so fun.

That's the thing about working with all of the songwriters on this project

was we had such a great time in the studio.

Every day was full of laughter.

And I think that, you know, translates onto the album.

Like, I mean, obviously you're not going to listen to a song and laugh, but you can tell that we had fun making it.

Yeah.

And

Leland opened up his studio to us.

And Laurel Vale with Laurel.

Laurel Vale.

Much goes down there.

Which I've actually, he's opened it up.

Many times.

Like I just did a fan play back there.

I knew I recognized him.

Yeah, I think they're at Leland's.

That way it's familiar.

He's been wanting to do that for such a long time.

He's like, I want want to have like listening parties here and like do the whole thing.

So I'm happy it happened.

Me too.

It's such a cute place, but he's so talented and

I love working with him.

He does bring such a spirit of fun, I think, because like he works on like all these different kinds of projects like in film and TV, especially with Drag Race, where it's just like.

He's not afraid to be like whimsical and it to have like, of course, it's like you're listening to it and it's like, this is serious.

But then like, I don't know, even the way that you deliver the verse in

that song and also kiss.

Like, you have to be stepping away from the mic sometimes being like, I'm giggling.

Like, it's, you I was going to say, kiss, you're giggling.

Like, we, you might not laugh at the songs, but I feel like you, you are engineering these moments where we're listening at home going like, whoa, that was great.

Like, ha ha.

I'm laughing because, like, I did not expect that.

Like, this.

It's such a simple lyric.

I kiss for fun.

It's fun to kiss.

It is, though.

And guess what?

It is not that deep.

No.

it's not that that deep.

It's not simple.

People that we run into out there.

And it's so, it was so fun to sing.

I was having the time of my life in the studio.

I feel like you're able to make something like this.

You're able to make a dancey poppy album like this in context to other albums where you have obviously gone deep.

And so therefore, but if you're staying in the depth, it's relative, right?

Like if you're staying in that, then it's not deep because it's just on one like dimension.

But if you're doing something fun, it actually makes the other stuff more meaningful in retrospect.

Right.

It makes this thing more meaningful.

Right.

Right.

Yeah.

You and I share and Bowen as well, but like our number ones are Kelly Clarkson.

Ah,

love Kelly Clarkson.

I feel like I was like, I wonder when we asked her the culture question, like, what was the culture that made you say culture was for you?

If it would be Kelly, I was going to say American Idol.

I was going to say American Idol.

So then consider this the question.

So American Idol, like, go, how did it affect you?

Like, what was it about it that made you?

American Idol made me dream.

Yeah.

It gave me a sense of hope and possibility that if Kelly Clarkson, this girl from Burleson, Texas, could make it on American Idol and have people voting for her every week, which I was one of them.

If she could make it, then I could.

And it gave me hope.

And I had so much fun watching the show.

She's so talented.

And

she was my first idol.

Yeah, I really think she was my first idol.

It meant something extra that you were also also in Texas then at the time.

So like, it's like, it's completely close to home where you're like, literally like, oh, if she can do it, I can do it.

Yes, exactly.

And it was people like, and you were learning about music.

as you were watching it at home.

Like they'd be like, this is like this week we're singing all songs from like Gladys Knight and the Pips and then like

you learn about this.

I learned about Gladys Knight through Kelly Clark's son on American Idol.

Card, I think it must be so hard to be on one of those singing competition shows where you have to learn a new song every week.

Yeah.

Like it must be so challenging, but she did that.

Like she really did that.

And I'm sure most of the songs that she sang, she already knew, or at least it felt that way.

Yeah.

And

I just think she's amazing.

Were you like writing your own songs?

Because like, I think what kind of gets not lost, but I feel like what people don't realize is that like you were writing your own CDs.

You were like selling them in your neighborhood when you were growing up.

I was, you know that?

Yeah.

A little bit of research to love culture.

Oh, that's so cute.

I love that.

It was in Child Star.

It was in your media.

You directed it.

You're right.

You're right.

Yes.

It was like so charming.

It was like the whole family talking about like, yeah, Demi would like sell her CD for $10.

I would.

I'd go around the neighborhood and I'd sell my CDs in order to like

pay for vocal lessons, but also pay for the beauty pageants I was in because those were not cheap.

Right.

And

God, but I worked really, I've been working hard for a really long time, even as a kid.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I think that's why it's so great to see you having so much fun with this and doing something that's clearly like, I don't know, I bet you can look back to when you started out on Disney Channel or whatever.

And you, if you sometimes

wish I could like reach back to my younger self and it's like, check out this thing you did from now.

You're like, oh, I'm having fun in the future.

Yeah.

Like, thank God.

Yeah.

I mean, I think that it's a combination of things.

I think it's the place where I'm at in my life today.

It's also the team I have around me.

The team that I have,

like, it never feels like work.

Like, i did probably 11 interviews today

and it didn't feel like work because in between interviews i'm joking and i'm laughing with my team who's so supportive and and they're fans of the work that i'm creating so it like it just feels it just feels so fulfilling and um

yeah

i was gonna ask and i texted him this morning i was like do you think it's okay if i asked emi like about like what it's like working with you like like brandon creed yeah um i was like because i've gotten to know him through like just like hanging out with Ari or like hanging out with Charlie or something.

Like he's just like, I think he is,

and like whether or not I asked him because I was like, I don't know if you feel okay being like a discussion point, but I feel like he like

is obviously getting his shine as a manager, but I feel like he's doing something really special and focused with all of his clients.

And I feel like I want to ask like what your relationship is with him because it feels like you guys are like unlocking something together that is so authentic, but.

joyful, but cool, but like all of these things.

And still you.

And still you.

I think what's so great about working with Brandon is not only is he such an incredible manager, he's killing it right now.

Look at his roster.

I mean, like every day he's posting something new from one of his artists.

And I'm like, yes, that's my manager.

Go.

And, um,

but also working with him is, he's given me so much insight.

And like, um, he's so brilliant.

And so,

you know, he has led me in the right directions and he's set me up with the right people who have helped me create such an incredible rollout rollout for this project that feels different more different than anything i've ever created yeah and um i really have him to credit for that yeah the album cover was something i wasn't expecting because it's you like right a little bit distant surrounded and i'm just thinking about like how it's a perfect album cover because it's like the center is like unmistakably you but there is a community there yeah you know what i mean like Can you talk about the album art?

Yes.

So the album art, it was shot by Daniel Sachin.

And it was actually, we shot it on the day that I shot the fast music video.

Sick.

Oh, by the way, love.

Thank you.

Do you think so galvanized through the destruction?

Thank you.

Well, we wanted to capture that on the album cover too.

Yeah.

So there's all this chaos around me.

And it's no secret that I live this very public life.

I'm on display 24-7.

And, you know, I'm naked on the album cover holding a dry cleaning bag.

And so

it's showing me in a very vulnerable state, but like unfazed by the chaos.

And

something also that's really nice is that there's the We Heart Our Customers on the dry cleaning bag.

It's like that's an ode to my fans.

This album is for my fans.

We heart our customers.

We heart our Levotics.

We heart our customers title of it.

And then lastly, if there's one thing about me, if there is a photo, I will lock the fuck in.

And that is what I do.

You do.

We're locking in.

I locked in on that.

Are we smiling or serving?

The fans are in the middle.

Are we smiling or serving?

We're always serving.

Do you ask yourself that in the beginning of the day for you?

Like, sometimes I wonder, like, you know, how early does it start?

It depends on how early the photographs are being taken.

If there is a picture outside of my bedroom when I first wake up in the morning, I will serve.

Yes.

It doesn't matter.

You know what?

I think it's like glamor not.

Yeah, glamor or not.

A little known fact that I was so gagged by when I was in high school was I was obsessed with desperate housewives.

And that's your little sister.

Yes, Madison.

What?

Little Solise.

Oh, my God.

Jackie's

daughter.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Juanita Solise.

Yes.

That is amazing.

It's a fact that should be known in culture, I think.

Like, that's like Demi's sister.

Yes.

Yes.

Oh, my God.

Madison.

Yeah.

So cute.

This is

Showbiz royalty, this family.

Damn.

Yeah, it's true.

So, like, when you were growing up and like you see her on a huge show, were you protective or were you supportive as like a mixture of both?

I think at the time, I wish I had been a little bit more protective, to be honest, because that role was, I think, really challenging for her at such a young age.

And I think I had been distracted by my own stuff going on, unfortunately.

And so I live with some regret in that aspect.

But also, there's only so much you can do as a 15, 16, 17-year-old.

Right.

You're not a, you're not like a hardened veteran of the business.

You're like starting out in your own.

I was starting out too, and my family and I were new to this industry.

And we just happened to both get opportunities that were really big for the both of us at the same time, which happened to move us all out to LA.

And

yeah, I think I do have a little bit of regret because I think it was a difficult role for her.

You know, there was a lot of scrutiny in the show about her body.

Yes.

And I hate that.

But I think, you know, she's so strong and she's so amazing that she turned out so great.

And,

you know, I'm so proud of her.

She did incredible work on that show.

Yeah, she was very, very memorable on it.

We all remember like the customers that Gabby and Juanita would get into.

Yeah, she was extremely talented.

Like she's very galvanized in the scene.

And they were very good together.

Yeah, they were.

You bought the relationship.

Eva.

But I feel like it's the saying where I hope you don't carry that regret too heavily because it's like, it's like, it's like the airplane mask role.

It's like you have to take care of yourself before you take care of yourself.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I think I have like an interesting perspective on it today.

Like we talked about it in my child star documentary.

And she opened up and was vulnerable with me then.

And I think that in that moment, that's when I realized the effect that the show had on her.

And

and so,

but I'm, I've always been protective over her.

Um, she's my baby sister and she always will be.

Yeah.

I mean, just to speak on the documentary of it all, like, not even, not even just child star, but I feel like the fact that you have

gone through all of this

just development on yourself is so amazing because you, you are one of the only pop girlies who like, is honest.

You're willing to go there.

Like you, you've done the work of like self-examining and not a lot of people do that publicly.

And like, I like, whenever people document like my struggles, I'm like, oh, wait, this is, this is a little too much.

Not even that it, it doesn't even compare to you, but I'm just like, this is a weird feeling.

And I feel like the fact that you've been so brave in doing those things is like, is incredible.

That's why people root for you.

Thank you.

Honestly, I had a decision that had to be made when I had gone to treatment for the first time.

I had this very public outburst.

And when I was 18,

which I talk about in some of my documentaries, but God, there's so many.

They're all amazing.

I always love watching the public.

We watch the first one together.

Yes.

But it's because of this very thing.

It's because there is no bullshit with you.

Right.

And in that moment, my manager at the time asked me,

do you want to be public with what you're going through?

Or do you want to sweep it under the rug and not talk about it?

Which you have a right to both.

You don't have, you don't owe anybody anything.

But I was like, I didn't have a role model at 13

that was speaking up about eating disorders.

And I was like, I need to be that role model for someone else.

Like it was this responsibility that I was willing to take on because I wish that I could have had that growing up.

Like there were older actresses that had come out and talked about, talked about having an eating disorder, but nobody that I could relate to at 13.

Especially at the time when the beauty standards were, you know,

very, very dangerous.

And

so I wanted to be that for other people.

And that's kind of the catalyst for why I've been open about all of my struggles is in that moment when I made that decision, it set the tone for the rest of my life of like, you know, I want to help people.

And the best way that I know how is sharing my personal experience with them.

Yeah.

I feel like especially also too, when you talk earlier about like, I sat down and like, I couldn't even write angry or sad songs if I tried.

Like, this is the way I'm feeling.

I'm feeling happy.

You can even hear in your voice like just the way you choose which notes it's like incredibly emotional and like also very characterized like you can't lie in your music it feels like and the one of my favorite songs is in my head on the new album i can do like everything i want just melodically my husband wrote that song well

yes he did brilliant like

because it's like it's it's this incredibly like honest thing and also the way you've chosen the melody.

I could do anything on that.

Like it's almost like you're like like arguing or someone or like kind of like rationalizing and it's in the melody line in a way that feels so honest.

So and then when on tell me you love me, which is I think my favorite album of yours besides this one, like the way you choose when to be powerful, when to descend, when to like

have like a moment that trails off, it's just, it's all really rooted and I can tell, like you listening to like like the best singers, the most honest, emotional singers.

And so

I think you didn't really have a choice, but to be honest, because

it's in your art.

I grew up singing to very soulful singers.

I grew up singing to Aretha and Whitney and Christina and Kelly.

And they all had soul in their voice.

And that's what drew me in as a child was like, oh, there's like depth there.

And I don't even think I was conscious of it, but there was just something that

made me feel what they were singing about so deeply that I was like, that's just what I want to, like, that's the kind of vocalist I want to be.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Do you have like an unsung hero American Idol contestant?

Like someone from way back that you're like, oh, this person was somewhat like, cause Kelly obviously famously.

Yeah.

But like, I always look back and like, it's so crazy what'll just jump out of my mind from that age when you remember everything.

But like Trinice from season two,

Kimberly Locke from season two.

Like, oh my God, Kimberly Locke.

Remember, Eighth World Wonder?

I was that bop?

Yeah.

No.

Oh, my, she released a single after it, and it actually is a bop.

We performed it at our culture awards two years ago.

Oh, my God.

Amazing.

The year after we did cool for the summer at our culture awards.

Yeah, exactly.

That's the point.

Okay, but what were you going to say?

Kimberly Locke.

I wasn't like, it was really season one that did it for me.

After season one, I was like, okay, it's now I'm doing it.

No, I was still young.

I still watched, but it just just didn't have the chokehold on me that Kelly's season had.

But there were incredible vocalists on all of those seasons, and there still are.

Yeah, no, that's the thing is like you check back in, and now there's so many of them, we take it for granted.

But like

America's Got Talent has incredible people that come through the voice, obviously, sometimes I put on the voice and I'm like, these, I can't believe this is even a live vocal in this blind audition.

You know who has one of the best vocalists or one of the best vocals from American Idol period?

It's Adam Lambert.

Oh, period.

He's not an unsung hero.

He's a hero.

But like, his voice is just insane.

Yeah.

He is one that he's also one of the most expressive.

And he never even shied away from being camp.

I remember one time he came feeling good in a white suit and he like descended the stairs.

And he was so like, he wasn't like out gay at the time because it was still weird at the time in the public, but he was announcing himself so much.

And I remember the next day I went into school and some girls were talking about American Idol.

And I kind of like, you know, shuffled over.

And a couple of them were like, Yeah, my mom didn't want to vote for him anymore after that performance.

And I was like, Wow, how far we've come

that like so many artists can express themselves like however they want because he was on the biggest show in the world at that time with that crazy expressive voice, so emotional.

And he also was himself

and made it really far from the get-go.

Exactly.

He always himself didn't win.

And I wonder, would he have won

five years ago today?

Who knows?

Yeah.

Like, maybe.

Yeah, maybe.

He was that brilliant no his voice is just it's unbelievable yeah yeah i was asking about the well i brought up the cds earlier because there was a moment in child star that like really gave me pause where you know you were talking about uh playing these songs that you'd written for execs and they were like

not what we're into and that kind of was let's put you up with these producers and songwriters which you know you you did with the plum like you succeeded in that regard of like working with others as a collaborator great Great skill to have, but that it chipped away like this confidence.

This confidence that I had went out the window for a period of time.

And even today, sometimes I'll go into the studio and I'm like,

is this a good idea?

Or like, and I rely on my co-writers a lot to say, like, you know, do we need to fix this lyric or is it good?

And, and they give me their opinions, which is why I love co-writing.

Like, I love the collaboration of like

having the input of other people and, and having their brilliant ideas come to the surface, because I really think if you want to create the best body of work that you possibly can, like it's good to have feedback.

And, but when I was 15, I went and played my

demo, basically, for my manager at the time.

And

it was really unfortunate because he,

he, he, he wasn't mean about it.

It just, there wasn't like a positive reception on what I was writing.

It was like, oh, okay,

but let's get you in the studio.

And I was like, oh, I've, I used to be the type of artist that would sing and like play my guitar and sing until six in the morning.

Like my dad would be getting up, getting ready for work and would be like, Demi, go to bed, stop singing.

And I would just be in my room and I'd be like, you know, a little manic, but no, you were like, you were devised.

You were, you were creating it.

Exactly.

And

I stopped doing it at that age and I started second guessing myself.

And I think it's something that has, because that happened at such a young age, it's still embedded in me a little bit.

Like there is some self-doubt when it comes to my songwriting.

Not my vocals.

I know I'm that bitch with my vocals.

But like, you know, with the songwriting, it was, it definitely put self-doubt in my head, which was kind of sad.

That is devastating to hear because it is something that like,

I don't know, I, we, we relate to this on like a performance, like comedy level obviously

and like it's just this thing that like and like if you've read the artist's way like she talks all about like those first people who like snuff out that thing in you

are devastating and it's it's gonna take you a long time to get over it but i feel like i bring this up too because Brett Leland was telling us like, oh, Demi comes into the studio and she's a fucking beast.

And like, she knows what she wants.

She knows how to like construct a song.

She knows how to songwrite.

Yes.

And like, I hope that in making this album, you've kind kind of like healed that.

I was going to say that this album was really healing for that part of myself because there were days when I was in the studio and I came up with the hook or I came up with this and this, the concept of the song.

And like, I really do have a vision and I had a vision with this album.

But there were also days where I'd come into the studio and be like, I have no idea what to write about today.

Let's just wing it.

And we come up with something great.

And like frequency, that wasn't like a concept that I came into the studio with of like, we need to write a song about this.

It was just the, I matched the vibes of the track with the lyrics and

we came up with something great.

So yeah, I think it has been healing for me as like recognizing my worth as a songwriter

has shown through on this project.

Love it.

What about live?

Are we hitting the road?

You don't have to reveal, but you could.

There's nothing set in stone right this second, but there's definitely plans.

We were talking earlier.

We were listening to it for the millionth time and people that were hearing it for the first time were like, When is it going on tour?

It's like one of those.

Thanks.

It does feel a lot like

I remember we saw we saw the sweat tour at Madison Square Garden, and it felt like the place was gonna flip over.

And I was like, Music like this, that's like this type of sound and that type of space, like you just can't recreate it anywhere.

Yeah, like, especially when you can attach an amazing hook to it, like you have.

And thank you, it's gonna be really sick live.

I haven't toured in three three years, so it's time.

And I definitely want to.

I miss seeing the reactions of my fans

on their faces when I play their favorite songs and the emotions that they,

you know, convey when they're sitting in the, when they're standing in the audience and

I sing skyscraper and the tears flowing down their faces.

Like I really do miss that connection.

Yeah.

You know,

so many hits.

Do you have one?

Do you have one where you're like, okay, this one, here we go.

And then by the end, you're like, yeah, that one.

It used to be give your heart a break.

When I got back on stage, I started playing it again for the first time.

I would say like a couple years ago.

I hadn't played it in so long because I was just like, I'm tired of this song.

Sure, you're allowed.

But, and, and you're allowed to change your live show and, and play songs that you want to and take out songs that you don't.

But I,

when I performed that for the first time in

years,

the reaction was so great that I was like, wait, I love this.

Yeah.

You forget what it felt like.

Yes.

Cause, cause then the element of like surprise and nostalgia kicks in and you're like, oh my God, I remember all the words to it.

It's formative.

It brings you back to a time when we, when you were like, you know.

And it's a crowd favorite.

So like, I love seeing their reaction too.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I mean, what do you think you're channeling while you sing?

Let's just talk about like the vocals.

Like, do you, do you feel something like pass through you?

I love it when like,

and it doesn't have to be true, but I love it when certain singers and vocalists are like, oh no, I'm like, I'm connecting with something high or low or whatever, or I'm like playing a character.

Like, is there, is there anything qualitatively true about this?

When I'm in my flow stage,

absolutely.

There's something that comes over me and

comes up with ad-libs and new high notes that I didn't think about before when I recorded the album that like I can't explain.

But a lot of times I get into my head when I'm performing because I am such a perfectionist.

So, like, if I'm out of my head, absolutely.

But when I'm in my head, I'm not channeling.

So hard.

It's so hard.

Because I was going to say, like, is there a way to translate that to like the songwriting experience, which it sounds like there was.

Like, you were like in these flow states in the studio coming up with the hooks.

Yeah.

It's just a thing you can't force, which is kind of the sucky thing.

But like, the, like, the flow state is like the number one like thing that human beings chase the most across all cultures.

It's like this feeling of like losing track of time.

It reminds me of the movie Soul.

Oh, yeah.

You know, like, that's what I chase with music.

And the second that it stops feeling like the movie Soul,

I have to put a pause on it.

You know what I mean?

I have to reconnect with the music.

Yeah.

That is an amazing movie, though, that is about that exact thing.

Yeah, I love that movie.

Just about how music just kind of like is this like, is like the, the way that like our lives kind of like get constructed or like like they frame our lives in a certain way you know it's it's the most incredible thing that human beings are capable of doing and sharing i think is music like the way that you can just like not to be ernest mcgee over here but like it's true like the way that i mean it really can change things it transcends lyrics or language it transcends language like you don't i could be listening to a song that's in a different language but i can it'll make me weep if it's the right chords and the right emotion behind it.

You know what I'm saying?

And it's, it's so beautiful how universal it is.

You have this moment on Let You Go, which is the synth after at the end of the chorus.

Yes.

And I'm just like,

again, we were vibing in P-Town.

Like, I'm on the deck.

Like, I have my shades not on those.

I have, remember those Oaklies?

I was kind of feeling my like demi juge.

And then just that synth, I was like, that is

really special.

It's good.

Who found that?

Like, or just,

yeah, that's zone.

Zone.

Zone is brilliant.

Do you ever come in like singing things and hearing things that you know aren't movable?

Absolutely.

Sometimes I'll, I have my, my voice notes on my phone are just like, there's got to be a thousand of them.

And sometimes it's just like, din and

in.

And then like that'll turn into a synth or it'll turn into a song.

Like I'm not sure what it, but like sometimes I'll just come up with something like that and it'll be on a voice note in my phone.

It just felt so intentional, that part of the song.

It feels like, it feels like one of those lines that you rem that you really remember.

It feels very classic.

Good.

You know what I mean?

That makes me happy.

And there is something a little bit retro about the way that synth sounds too.

That sort of airiness.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

Did you say you had listening parties at, you've already had some of the fan experiences?

Yes.

I've had two fan playbacks.

How were they?

God, it was so much fun.

It was so fun to see my fans.

Like, they got up and danced, danced, you know, and

kiss on here all night on fast.

And then they really like took in the other songs and watching them take it in was,

you know, it was

really impactful for me because I made these songs from such a vulnerable place and here they are connecting with them and it's resonating with them.

Like it makes it all worth it being that vulnerable in front of, you know, all these people.

Like it just makes it worth it.

And, um,

and yeah,

seeing their emotional reaction to it was, was awesome, but also like seeing them have so much fun was also amazing.

Like, I wonder like who it's more rewarding for.

Like, not that it's like, that it is more rewarding for one particular group, but it's like.

It's just as rewarding for you and Zone and Leland and everyone who's worked on this album to see how people, like, this is your first test audience, really.

It's the first time you're seeing people respond to it.

Yes.

And it is telling you a lot of information for you.

Yes.

You know what I mean?

Yeah.

And so it's valuable for you.

It's valuable for them.

It's valuable for me because I get to see like, what are the fan favorites?

What are the ones that they're going to go crazy for at the show that I need to do something a little extra for?

And, or is there a song that I want to put out as a single because it's in demand with the fans?

You know what I mean?

It's like that information is very valuable to me as an artist.

I not to be like the tell me you love me is stay on here, but

that album is, again, up until now, my favorite.

You and JC Williams in the video for Tell Me You Love Me.

Oh my gosh,

you were acting down and you forget your background in that.

Like, thank you.

Camera acting, like, you really

couldn't have like more presence in it than you do.

Is that something that interests you?

Because I'm like so insecure as an actress.

Really?

You couldn't tell because you were really great and dropped in.

Thank you.

I feel like

I took a break for so long from acting that I'm like scared to get back into it.

And I've had offers and I have acted.

I did an independent film called Toe last year or yeah, last year.

And then it came out at Tribeca Film Festival this year.

And

it was, it was fun.

It was like, I dipped my toes.

It was a small role.

I dipped my toes back into acting and I had a lot of fun with it.

And it was something that I think I want to do, but like, I just have to like, I don't know.

I feel like I need to do acting lessons or something.

It's the perfectionist thing again.

Yes.

Yeah.

Are you, what's your sign?

I'm a Leo.

Okay.

Yeah.

Or Leo's perfectionist.

I know not about it.

I don't know about them as perfectionists.

I was going to say it's like, it feels like a Leo or like a Virgo, Jason, or Leo thing.

Okay.

Do Virgo in your chart somewhere.

I feel like this is just.

Maybe.

I did my chart one time and then forgot it.

No problem.

Mine's easy to remember.

Well, we're Pisces, Scorpio, which is like easy for us to remember because they're so cool.

I know I'm a double Leo.

Okay, so that's a lot of Leo.

That's a lot of Leo.

I got a lion on my hand to show for it.

That's really beautiful.

Thank you.

Do you have a lot of tattoos?

I do.

Yeah.

What's the mystery side?

I do.

I do.

I do.

I feel like I went so hard on tattoos at such a young age that I'm like, I wish I had been more selective with my tattoos, but there are ones that I really love.

My most recent one was, this says, I love you more.

It's my mom's handwriting.

Oh my God, my mom and I say the same thing.

How cute.

Yeah, I love you too.

It's so funny.

My mom and I will be on the phone and like we'll go to hang up and right before someone hangs up she'll go i love you more and then hangs up it's like we have to say goodbye

we have the acronym l-u-l-u and i say l-m-m love oh my god and it's almost like a conversation can't really be over unless that's been typed yes you know what i mean you gotta

yes

we're so close my mom and i i'm so close with my mom um she's such an angel so yeah i got that tattooed and that was my most recent one because i feel like your husband your husband is tatted oh he is tatted the fuck out.

So that's fine.

It's like, it's not like you have to.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

You're talking to someone.

No, it's just like,

had I had a little bit, I wish I had thought more about it rather than getting all these impulsive tattoos that I did.

You know, do you have any, well, maybe you won't want to share this, but are there any tattoos that like, whenever you look at it, you're like, oh, it's a person?

Um,

I have one.

You're like, oh my God, that's never going to not remind me.

I know.

I have one that's like that.

And it is what what it is.

It is what it is.

Honestly, it's almost kind of nice because I remember, I only have three small ones, but in preparing to get them, and probably you too, it's kind of like, okay, you're going to look at this forever.

Like, are you going to regret it?

It's weird.

Like, even the ones you regret, you think warmly about the time that you got.

Yeah, like it was still a cool story behind the tattoo that I got, but do I wish I didn't get a matching tattoo with someone?

Yes.

You have to be sure about matching tattoos.

It's for little culture number 20.

No, I think you're not going to be able to do it.

You have to be sure about about matching tattoos.

I think you don't do it.

I think it's like cursed.

Yeah.

The idea of matching tattoos being turned into.

Yes.

I don't like matching tattoos.

It's just like, I don't know.

Because it bites you to someone.

It's almost like a contract.

No, it's just like,

I just feel like every time I've, like, I've gotten two matching tattoos and it just didn't end up well.

So like rule of, and then I've had like ex-boyfriends get my name on them and that didn't work out.

And so I just feel like rule of thumb, like, it's just not a good idea okay yeah yeah i think yeah i think make it a law we've been talking about getting a matching one right i think we're just saying we shouldn't i don't know maybe you do like a variation like like

me and matthew scott if me and matthew scott my best my best friend yes friend yeah um who you guys know and adore

um If we were to get a matching tattoo, like we've talked about getting like a little bat or something for halloween like if he got a bat i would get a pumpkin yeah you know what i'm saying like something a little like a variation where it's not like so

yeah exactly

but he really is your ride or die i feel like he's he's been in every era every era yeah we are so close i'm obsessed with him i don't know what i would do without him he's my heart and soul

You need that person too.

Like, it's just like that you can be truly honest with.

Yes.

Like, like, we need to step away from a second.

Like even in a small community of people that I do trust, like you need your person.

He is my person that like before Jordan and I got together, I would call in the middle of the night and be like, hey, I'm lonely.

And like, you don't have to say anything back, but I just need to express like how sad I am right now.

And he would be there for me in the middle of the night and be like, let's talk about it.

And like, that's the kind of friendship that everyone needs.

I think you are so incredibly lucky to even have that thing because there, it's not that I don't even love my sister but it's like I'm like I'm not gonna bother Matt with this like we've all had these lonely moments at night where I'm like yeah well you can I know I know but it's like

careful what you wish for girl I'm wishing oh oh my sister

but it's like that's a that's a really hard thing to find he's just mad because I used to call him years ago when I used to wait tables and I would I would get off my shift and we'd have a couple drinks after work and I'd call him to call me an uber because I wouldn't download it on my phone I didn't think it could download so whenever he thinks of me and the concept of calling late at night, he's like, Oh, he needs an Uber home.

He needs a new Uber.

That was a decade ago, and I'm much more together now.

We've all grown up.

We're past it.

I have a lot of amazing friends in my life, but I have this core group of best friends.

Yeah.

And

I mean, I could list them off, but they're just like, they're, I had so many bridesmaids in my wedding because I have so many close, close, close best friends.

Yeah.

And that support is just like what gets me through life.

Like, I just, I love my friends so much.

That wedding was fucking chic.

Thank you.

Thank you so much.

Oh, my God.

Didn't you look so handsome?

Yeah.

You got a good one.

I do.

And look at how you like emanate.

Oh, thank you.

When you talk about him, well, you've always had one of the best smiles.

I'll never forget when I first saw you.

My first thought was like, oh, my God, that girl's smile is incredible.

I used to be really insecure about my smile.

I used to joke that it eats my face because it's so big and it like just like takes over.

No, it's like, it's such a, it's like you really carry the light when you smile.

You really do.

I've learned to appreciate my smile.

Yeah.

Because there were times where I wasn't smiling and that was sad.

And now I'm like, you know, I'm serving too.

So it's hard because it's like, do you tell me about a master?

That's what I was talking about, but I appreciate that too.

Of course.

Yeah, I mean,

that's, I guess, what's so great about like the phase of your career that you're in and what other people, like other people that we've all watched for now going on like 20 years.

And because we're like a little bit older than you, but still like, that was like our generation of like, you know, person we watched on TV and then transitioned into this new stage of the career.

And I think like we do, like, as fans of yours, share like a knowledge of everything you've been through.

And that's why it's like to see you having fun is like a huge gift because I always remember that girl I first saw smiling.

And so, like,

it's just great to see you smile again about your husband and about this project.

Yeah.

Because when I think of you, I think of a huge like smile that comes out.

Thank you.

Thank you, Russell.

That's so sweet.

Thank you so much.

We love you.

Love you too.

This is a Levotic podcast.

This is been a Levotic.

Wait, how do you feel about Levotic?

Because Ariat is a record Areganator is not something she decided.

I didn't decide Levotic.

Well, of course.

And I was like, where did that come from?

It was kind of confusing to me.

I was like, are you an addict or are you like...

An alcoholic.

Yeah, like, I don't, I don't.

It's some sort of a.

But I've embraced it and I've learned to love it.

Yeah.

But at first, I was like, huh?

Because it was also the beginning of like fan stan names.

Yeah, kind of, right?

When everyone came up with it, I was like, I think I was like,

I was in treatment and they were like yeah your fans are calling you levotics now and i was like wait are they reading me are they reading you

like a stand name and i and i was assigned button and i was like i'll take it whatever you remember kelly is a celebrity

no

it was terrible what so so this is how you know that like i was in deep because one day like

on the Kelly Clarkson message boards.

Yes, I was a little gay child.

Hi.

Hi, my name is Matt.

But they were like, we're celebrities.

This is the celebrity group.

And even me at the time, who would have done anything?

I was just like, I don't like this.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

But Levotic, we can make peace with.

I mean, is there really a good fan base?

The Navy is really chic.

The Navy is monsters.

Monsters.

That's good.

Yeah, little monsters.

You should put it to a vote.

You should, for now, they're called Levotics, but like everybody, like, well, I don't know.

I think, like, you guys, I'm going to give you options and then you guys come up with a vote on the right one.

You know what I mean?

I don't know.

I think it would make a lot of people upset.

Yeah, but like, listen, we adjusted to the name Levatic years ago.

We did.

That's what everyone reveals and no one wanted to do it.

Like, what do you mean?

No one said anything?

We could have been called the,

I don't know, what's a navy thing?

The force.

The force.

The force.

We keep adding, we keep adding.

I'm like going too hard on military names.

Sorry, everybody.

You don't have to be Marines to like this album.

You can be lobotics.

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No one can resist a rule of culture.

So here's one for the dating files.

Rule of culture number 72.

Chemistry isn't just vibes, it's values.

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Who decides what you can do?

Who gets to decide what you're capable of?

Your boss, your friends, some stranger on the internet?

No, no, and absolutely no.

You decide, only you.

Ford shares that belief.

It's like engineered into their vehicles.

An F-150 is all steel, sweat, and dreams.

Right?

Mm-hmm.

A Ford Bronco is built for adventure, but you've got to get behind the wheel.

Can you?

Yeah, you can, but you have to first.

You have to.

And a Mustang, the Mustang that conquers curves.

You are more capable than you know.

Like, for example, I never thought I could parallel park.

I just thought it wasn't something that was going to happen for me in my life.

And not everyone gets to have every experience, you know?

But then, suddenly, I did a parallel park and I thought, wow I'm gonna apply to Harvard I didn't get in but I did parallel park sometimes you just need to push what is it that they say whether you think you can or you think you can't you're right ready set forward visit ford.com to learn more

Okay, well, I think it might be time for you.

Speaking of tea,

and you're going to need it because we're going to transition into I don't think so, honey.

This is our 60 second segment on this podcast where we take something in culture that bugs us that bothers us and more and we absolutely let it rip I have something it's the season and I'm starting to see something pop up again and I want to put it to bed right now okay you have your phone on here so I think you should time I'll time you okay so this is well you say you say the key yeah this is Matt Rogers I don't think so honey his time starts now I don't think so honey anyone making fun of me for pumpkin spice okay you're 10 years late on this read okay basic girls drink pumpkin spice thing happened already now you sound basic.

I am still here.

I'm still queer.

I'm still the one.

I've always been a pumpkin spice person.

And yes, I do get it in a frap.

And I know that makes it more basic, but I don't think so, honey.

Your comments penetrating me.

Rubber glue, babe.

I don't think so, honey.

Anyone telling me anything about pumpkin spice, whether it comes in the form of coffee, whether it comes in the form of muffin, it honestly is the best flavor.

Come for me.

Apple cinnamon beats it.

Apple cinnamon beats it.

Blueberry, get lost.

I'm sorry, but this chokehold that blueberry flavor has on, you know, culture.

No, it is about pumpkin spice.

And I think we fucked up by making it seasonal.

It should be all year round.

Then it would be a mainstay.

And we wouldn't have this nightmare of every season.

Oh, here come the basic pumpkin spice girlies again.

Yeah, here I am.

And I don't think so, honey.

And that's one message.

Oh, my God.

That was so good.

How do I follow that?

You do it in your own day.

Oh, my God.

I'm intimidated now.

Don't be.

Don't be.

But do you know what?

Are you a pumpkin spice person?

Yes.

Come on.

Come on.

Something that has only been able, the only thing that's been able to save SNL writers some nights when we write on Tuesdays.

A fucking pumpkin spice rappuccino.

Yeah, come on.

It makes you happy.

The endorphins are soaring when you're drinking one of those.

Yes.

And the donuts are.

It's delicious.

It's delicious.

So good.

Everybody cut it out.

And I just, it's like, you know, we just got our little nip of fall and already like people taking to their stories.

Like, it's the first time anyone's ever said this.

No.

I'm like, I've, I'm true to this.

How quickly we forget.

You're not new to this.

You're true to this.

No, I've been out here out and proud.

And I'm sorry, but I still stand.

Okay, you ready?

I am ready.

Okay, this is Bon Yang's.

I don't think so, honey.

His time starts now.

I don't think so, honey.

We didn't have a song of the summer when Fast by Demi Lovada was right fucking there.

You in the eye line.

How dare you?

She's giving you incredible incredible visuals, vocals, and completely serving cunt while chaos is around her.

Explosions and more.

You were being fed a feast that was nutritious, ethically main, gorgeously performed, and still you're like pushing your plate away going, I don't know, we didn't get served dinner tonight.

30 seconds.

You were given something so premium.

And now that it's the fall, and now that this album, it's not that deep, is coming out, this is your second chance at redeeming your little mind and understanding that you've been given something incredible.

Stream it now, October 24th, or whenever this comes out, do it today.

I'm telling you, you won't regret it.

It's got banger after banger, and it ends in one perfect ballad that ties the whole album sonically together.

And we are so lucky to have Demi Lovato here on our podcast.

That's one minute.

Yes.

That was amazing.

And also, that was mine.

What?

No!

No, no, no.

I'm not doing it.

Do your version.

Do your version.

Okay, are you ready?

Yes, okay.

Yes, this is Demi Lovato's, I don't think so, honey, our time starts now.

I don't think so, honey.

There's no song of the summer.

What are you talking about?

Not only did I release fast, thank you very much, but there's so many incredible songs that came out this summer with all the pop girlies having their moments.

I mean, you've got Adela,

who I stand so hard.

You've got Gaga, you've got Sabrina, you've got Tate McRae, you've got Kesha, you've got Kim Petras, you've got Pink Pantheres, you've got

all of these incredible, incredible artists.

And that's just like the tip of the iceberg.

I could keep going about how incredible these pop girlies are and so inspiring to me.

But what do you, I think there's, you get stuck on, everyone has brain rot now and they can't think past the 30-second TikTok mark, which I totally relate.

I love TikTok too.

Five seconds.

But there was songs of the summer.

And if you are looking for one, just stream fast.

Yes!

I don't think so, honey.

That is Demi Lovato tearing it up.

So mine is the other pop girlies.

I was going to say, like, oh my God, not you lifting up all these girlies.

Like, that's so special and beautiful.

Well, they deserve their shine.

Yes.

Also, you know what?

Like.

Fast incredible, like, man-child incredible, like, no one really talked about no broke boys as the song of the summer.

I want to cut it.

And you, even, like, when people online make those lists of, like, here's everything it could have been.

And it's like this, this list, it's like, no, Brook Boys isn't even on any of that.

I'm like, did it come out too soon?

Because it came out.

Yeah.

It technically came out on Tinashi's album last year, which maybe people are like, but there's no cutoff.

There's no cutoff.

There's no cutoff.

There's no cutoff.

Cool for the Summer came back 10 years later with a vengeance.

Yeah, here we go.

I was playing the sped up version two.

I was thinking about it.

Yes, and people loved it.

So like, there's no time limit on this stuff.

No.

You have had like one.

Are you like aware that Sorry, Not Sorry is the best drag race lip sync of all time?

Like Like no comments.

I'm aware.

I'm fully aware.

I gagged.

Yeah, just like the way that they were tearing themselves apart.

It was so fucking good.

Yeah, and then they ended up being the top two.

Right, but it's like they're not able to do that unless you supply the vocal.

Thank you.

You're motivating them to fucking do that.

I still go back and watch that performance.

As you should know.

I mean, let's just say this.

A lot of my friends are looking forward to my drag performance of Here All Night based on what I did in Peace House.

Yes.

Because it is like,

I'm in this like little stage where it's like, what was I doing?

I was like running and going, and then like letting it kick you back around.

One of these days,

I'll get into some look that references or does not reference, who knows?

But like, yeah, no, that song is like, it's built into the track.

And I'm like, I was looking at, so Brett played it for us.

We were working on our award show and he's producing songs for it.

He was like, I can play you the single that I think is going to be the single.

It wasn't decided yet, but I can play it for you guys once.

We're like, sure.

Do it.

And so listening to it, I was just like, you really gave the queen something to chew on here.

Thank you.

There's so much like movement in it and energy into it and like stings that it's fun to perform.

Yes.

It's so fun to sing.

Like, I can't wait to perform that one live.

Yeah.

Oh, now I'm excited about that because you have not performed it live yet.

No.

It's fresh out.

See, it's weird because like we've had the album now for several weeks.

So already I'm like off book on a lot.

Oh, God.

We know the words.

It's it's it's been in the routine.

I love that.

Thank you.

Kiss is gonna be a monster.

I'm so excited about Kiss.

That has to be a single, right?

Well,

we'll wait and find out.

I never know because like sometimes it's like at least it used to be in the old days.

Maybe you

agree as being one of the girls.

Like it felt like if you put out two singles that were really up tempo, the third one like had to give more of like introspective ballad moment, especially when you're you and can serve that.

thank you it's i guess you don't feel i'm gonna tell y'all the next single when we're off the air okay good and i want to hear your thoughts behind it it could be so many things thank you so excited yeah i think

i think i have my my

next single planned but there's also a moment for what the fans really want and we're trying to like figure out what that looks like yeah so we'll see it's good that you're not being rigid about it then yeah

yeah i'm really not.

Have you has that ever happened in the past?

Like, um, where one song, because I have to tell you, I put on my story the other day, just tell me, you love me.

I was like, this album, like, revisit it just because I was revisiting it.

And the number of people that responded being like, daddy issues.

Oh my God.

Yeah.

That song has its grips in people, even all these years later.

Like, have the fans' response ever fully dictated a single choice?

Yes.

Yes.

It has happened.

Yes.

I would say,

like, give your heart a break.

Really?

It was really that one too.

Like, I didn't actually want to release that as a single.

I was like, it's a cute pop song, but like, I don't know that I want to go and promote Give Your Heart a Break as like my single.

You have to do it all the time.

You have to do it all the time.

And I was like, I don't know that I feel super strongly about this, but the fan reaction was really great.

And so we were like, let's try it.

And it ended up being my first like big radio song wow so um really glad that i went with that one

sometimes it's worth it to listen to i guess what a lot of people who are ostensibly gonna be the people listening aren't saying yeah but daddy is though i mean

no one's ever wailed no one's ever wailed on the word therapy yeah

that vowel is insane to me i have to go back and listen to it I haven't heard it in so long.

You'll be proud of yourself.

Thank you.

It really was.

It's like, you don't expect it to go there either.

And so when it does, you're kind of like, it's that thing we said earlier of like, I'm laughing because I didn't expect that to be the hit, but also like, yeah, real.

Real.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Thank you.

We all have them.

We got him.

This has been a spectacular episode.

It's over.

It's over.

You tend to have to go at six, and now we're at six.

We're keeping you.

Because you're going to watch what happens live, right?

I am.

That's going to be fun.

We haven't even talked to Lake City.

We have to.

Okay, stay for 10.

Okay, okay.

Quick thoughts.

Quick thoughts.

Hopes and dreams going into into the scene.

We haven't tonight as of this recording, this new season will be air.

Have been out.

Well, have been out, but we have not seen them yet.

What do you, what do you, what do you think?

What's your vibe on the ladies?

I

love all of them.

Yes.

I have my opinions about all of them.

Of course.

Do you keep them close to the chest?

I keep them close to my chest.

I don't want to be mean.

But like, we have opinions.

You know,

they're, you know, pretty.

Yes.

But

I will say that I met Meredith Marks at the Paper Magazine party.

Yes.

She was so fab.

Yeah, she is.

Gorgeous.

She's a friend of mine.

Gorgeous.

Yeah.

Love her.

Yeah.

And I'm meeting Angie Kay tonight, which I'm

so excited to be.

You have to tell Angie that you were with us today.

I will.

Because

actually,

her first Watch What Happens Live phone was on with her.

Oh, okay.

And it was a really special moment because she was so nervous.

And I was just there to like,

just kind of like calm her down.

And like, I think we've formed like a lifelong connection.

She's still telling me she's like I'm so happy you were my first time she's gonna be so excited it's you I'm so excited I feel like I hope she's wearing her sunglasses yes yes I think it's a high probability

that she'll be wearing something amazing incredible yeah it's tough to be both an Angie stan and a Meredith stan because you know you're like these are but those are two the reason those two work as like rivals is because they're just equally beloved and you are just kind of like they're both iconic but I feel like no matter who's fighting, like I have a different favorite every week.

Sure, sure.

You know what I'm saying?

Like, it changes.

Yeah.

You know what I mean?

And they're, and they're all fighting with each other.

I mean, it's like five episodes in a row.

I'll be like, I'm Whitney Rose.

I'm writing so hard for Whitney Rose.

And then there'll be a sixth episode like, Whitney Rose, take a seat.

And then the next episode will be like, Whitney Rose, lover.

Love her.

You'll see now that you've, because we've met them a few times because we're around the same stuff, like often with the Bravo and everything.

Yes, they're amazing.

Once you meet them, it becomes incredibly hard to form like a critical opinion of them.

You're like, that's my friend.

Yes.

Like, now I feel like I'm going to have this connection to them.

And I can't say my opinions that I may have had when I first watched the show.

You know what I'm saying?

So, yeah.

I'm, that's why I don't want to like say any of my opinions that I had because I don't, you know what I mean?

Also, I'm sure Andy's going to ask you about them tonight.

He will.

I don't know what you're doing.

I think they also understand that they're like, they're, they're being put on the spot and like, we don't hold it against them.

Like, I've said things in the past about certain housewives who have since been like, oh, totally, it's fine.

Like, I get it.

We're on a TV show.

You know what I mean?

So that's good.

It's all good.

I mean, it was like the start of a beautiful relationship we now have with Lisa Rina.

Oh, because one time we were on Watch What Happens Live and they were asking about Rina and I was just like, oh, I wish she wouldn't do this, this, this.

And she got in the DMs and she was like, hey, I didn't like that comment.

And I was like, Lisa, I only made it because I feel like I know you parasocially.

And I apologize.

I was like, you are right.

I was out of line, et cetera.

She came to our cultural awards, crushed.

Now we're friends.

She's been on the show.

Oh, that's amazing.

That's great.

So it had a happy ending.

Okay, good.

Thank you for staying these extra few minutes.

Just to get out salt.

Yes, yes, yes, yes.

You need to get Meredith to send you Brooke Smarks.

Oh, my God.

I need a tracksuit.

I need a tracksuit.

I met Brooks, too.

He was so sweet.

Yeah, he's great.

But that tracksuit is comfy.

And for my gay guys out there, it like lifts and it like gives you like, it's really, it looks good in your ass.

Just saying.

Brooke Smarks knows something.

I guess that'll be my last thought on the dining room.

We love you.

Congratulations.

Love you too.

Thank you for having me.

This was so fun.

We end every episode with a song.

The song of the summer.

I wanna go fast.

I wanna go hard.

I wanna go anywhere, anywhere you are.

And if you want to hear that song much better, stream it album.

Emma Single.

Go forth.

Bye.

Bye.

Yay!

Lost Culturistas is a production by Will Farrell's Big Money Players and I Heart Radio Podcasts.

Created and hosted by Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang.

Executive produced by Anna Hosnier and produced by Becca Ramos.

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