MFM Presents…The Knife

Speaker 1 This is exactly right.

Speaker 1 This podcast is sponsored by PayPal.

Speaker 3 Okay, let's talk holiday shopping.

Speaker 1 From now through December 8th, you can get 20% cash back when you pay in four with PayPal. No fees, no interest.

Speaker 3 This limited time offer is perfect for the Black Friday and Cyber Monday deals you've been eyeing. Save the offer in the app now.

Speaker 1 So, whether you're buying tickets to an improv show or a whodunit board game, PayPal helps you make the most of your money this holiday.

Speaker 3 Expires December 8th. See PayPal.com slash promo terms subject to approval.

Speaker 1 Learn more at paypal.com slash payin4, PayPal Inc., NMLS 910-457.

Speaker 4 Goodbye. Goodbye.

Speaker 5 Master distiller Jimmy Russell knew Wild Turkey Bourbon got it right the first time. Kentucky born with 100 years of know-how.

Speaker 5 Our pre-prohibition style bourbons are aged longer and never watered down. So you know it's right too.

Speaker 5 For whatever you do with it, Wild Turkey 101 Bourbon makes an old fashioned or bold fashion for bold nights out or at home.

Speaker 5 Wild Turkey Bourbon, aged longer, never watered down to create one bold flavor. Copyright 2025 of Party America, New York, New York, never compromised, strike responsibly.

Speaker 6 At CVS, it matters that we're not just in your community, but that we're part of it. It matters that we're there for you when you need us, day or night.

Speaker 6 And we want everyone to feel welcomed and rewarded. It matters that CVS is here to fill your prescriptions and here to fill your craving for a tasty and yeah, healthy snack.

Speaker 6 At CVS, we're proud to serve your community because we believe where you get your medicine matters. So visit us at cvs.com or just come by our store.
We can't wait to meet you.

Speaker 6 Store hours vary by location.

Speaker 4 Hello!

Speaker 3 Big news, everybody. The premiere episode of our new show, The Knife, a True Crime Podcast, is out now.

Speaker 1 If you love love deep dives, empathetic storytelling, and the cases that stay with you long after the episode ends, this will be the true crime podcast for you.

Speaker 3 That's right. And now you're about to get an exclusive listen to their premiere episode.

Speaker 1 Hosts Hannah Smith and Patia Eaton take you inside the gripping story of Darun Henry, whose routine morning run took a sudden and terrifying turn, altering the course of her life.

Speaker 3 So sit back and enjoy the first episode of The Knife, the newest member of our exactly right family.

Speaker 1 And don't forget, once you listen to this episode and you love it, head over to the knives feed in your podcast app to check out the next episode. Trust us, you won't want to stop at just one.

Speaker 3 And while you're there, don't forget to follow, rate, and review. It really helps.

Speaker 4 Goodbye.

Speaker 7 This story contains adult content and language. Listener discretion is advised.

Speaker 8 So there was a silent moment. between us where we were both trying to process what just happened.

Speaker 9 After you punched him?

Speaker 8 Yeah, like just a still moment where I was like, oh my God, I just punch a human in the face.

Speaker 7 Welcome to the Knife. I'm Patia Eaton.

Speaker 4 I'm Hannah Smith.

Speaker 7 And this week, we speak with a woman named Darun Henry. She is a a personal trainer, influencer, and mother of two who lives in Toronto, Canada.

Speaker 4 In September of 2021, Darun had just moved into a new home with her kids and then husband. It was a nice, safe, family-friendly area of Toronto.

Speaker 4 And then on September 15th, she went for a jog at 11 a.m. in a park near her home and experienced something terrifying.

Speaker 4 We speak with Darun about her experience and the lasting impact of what happened to her, including a video of the incident that went viral.

Speaker 4 We will be back with you after the interview to give you some updates on Darun's story, which is still ongoing today. As a note, this conversation with Darun happened on October 14th, 2024.

Speaker 7 Let's get into the interview.

Speaker 4 Let's start off with you telling us a little bit about yourself and your background.

Speaker 8 I'm Darun Henry. I am an online fitness coach.
I'm a mother of two beautiful girls who are 13 and 7, and I'm just a very passionate entrepreneur. I had a very hard upbringing.
I was born in Iraq.

Speaker 8 I'm Kurdish. So

Speaker 8 I...

Speaker 8 uh not to like go too deep but i lost my brother my brother was killed by a landmine when i was five so um and then i was like a refugee until we came to canada at the age of seven or eight. So in 96.

Speaker 8 And so a lot of my conditioning was limiting beliefs. I was very insecure because I didn't do too well in school.
I never got like my university degree. I got pregnant at a young age.

Speaker 8 And so when I had my spiritual awakening and I was on my own personal development journey and I discovered who I am and how powerful I am and how limitless I am, I wanted to help women like discover that part of themselves, regardless of what you've been through, that you can become the best version of yourself.

Speaker 8 And so like, that's where my passion lies right now. Right

Speaker 8 before the attack, I would say I was at the peak of my career. I was just the happiest version of myself.

Speaker 4 In September of 2021, Darun and her family had just moved moved into a new home in Brampton, a city in the Greater Toronto area.

Speaker 4 Darune was delighted to find out that she was in walking distance to Massey Park, which is a small park that sits in the middle of a heavily trafficked area, but still feels remote due to the density of the trees.

Speaker 4 So she started to do her daily workouts at Massey Park.

Speaker 8 So it's September 15th, 2021. So school had just started.
Yeah, like I had taken the kids to school that day and I went for my jog around like 9.30.

Speaker 8 Being in the forest, I would often like do walking meditations. I'd connect with God.
So on that day, it was different because I needed more content.

Speaker 8 So that was the only day I had taken my tripod because I do believe that having my tripod kind of saves me in a way that day.

Speaker 8 I believe I got there around 9.50-ish.

Speaker 8 I shot content, I took pictures for about 20-30 minutes. I was getting the right shots.
I had my jump rope with me that day, so I was jump roping. So,

Speaker 9 you know, when is the first moment that you thought like something is wrong?

Speaker 8 Yeah, so this was towards the end of my workout. So, it was around 11 a.m.
when I saw an elderly man who was maybe like 80 years old with a walker, And I saw him walking very slowly.

Speaker 8 And I actually noticed a random person. I noticed he was walking very slowly behind the elderly man, like almost as if he was just like with him, but you can tell they weren't together.

Speaker 8 I found him a little suspicious because he was dressed in all black, like black sweatpants, black sweater, a fitted hat, and he was wearing a mask. It was pretty warm day.

Speaker 8 It was, it was September 15th.

Speaker 8 I was wearing shorts, so it was kind of like unusual to see somebody dressed like in a hoodie and like sweatpants and just fully covered and also like wearing a COVID mask.

Speaker 8 Not a lot of people wore the masks outside in the parks. So I did.
I noticed him immediately as he was walking.

Speaker 8 I had his bike, but he wasn't on his bike. Like he wasn't riding his bike.
He was walking. They passed by, right? Like they left.
And I just continued doing what I was doing.

Speaker 8 And then at this point, I was stretching and looking at the sunshine, you know, shining through the leaves and just breathing.

Speaker 8 And just, yeah, I was stretching and I felt this like immense pain in my hamstrings.

Speaker 8 And like something told me to bend over, like to stretch my hamstrings. And when I bent over, I literally saw him through my legs.
So I jumped and

Speaker 8 I was off to the side of the walking path so that people can pass by me.

Speaker 8 And when I bent over, I saw him like through my legs, literally. He was like right behind me, maybe eight feet away.

Speaker 8 And I jumped. I turned around.
I wasn't scared though. I just thought he was on a walk because it was just so I didn't know there was someone there.
Yeah, yeah. I had no idea.

Speaker 9 I was wearing these headphones.

Speaker 8 So I couldn't hear anything.

Speaker 8 And when I turned around and he was right directly right behind me, my tripod was on, like it was on the ground.

Speaker 8 And I think that I don't think he was sure that like if it was recording or not. It wasn't recording, but he did notice my tripod.
And then when I turned around, I said, Oh, I'm so sorry.

Speaker 8 Like, I was just like, So sorry, I'm in your way, right? Even though there's a huge walking pathway, like you could go around me, like you, there's no reason you should be directly behind me.

Speaker 8 And so, like, that's when I realized, oh, like, he really was trying to get really close to me, but I like caught him before he got too close. And as soon as I said sorry to him, he was very strange.

Speaker 8 He was just like, didn't say anything. And then looks at my tripod and was like asking me if I did YouTube.
He's like, oh, do you do YouTube? And I was like, no.

Speaker 8 I was, I couldn't really hear him because he had his mask on. So then I was like, what? What are you saying? And then he was like, do you do YouTube? And then he took his mask off.

Speaker 8 So he put it down to below his chin. And he kept asking me if I did YouTube.
And I said, no, I don't do YouTube. He's like,

Speaker 8 are you a fitness instructor? I was like, yes, I'm a personal trainer.

Speaker 8 He's like, well, can I get your information like my Facebook or like my socials? And I was like, no, like I only work with women. And then I just kind of like looked at him like, walk away.

Speaker 8 go now and so like i was just getting annoyed of him like it was the conversation probably took like 30 seconds. And so I was waiting for him to walk off.

Speaker 8 And I was like, no, like I only work with women. You can't have my information.

Speaker 8 And so he got the point. And it was in that moment.
Like he didn't say anything more. He just put his mask back on.
And

Speaker 8 in this moment, I realized, oh my God,

Speaker 8 he's going to try and rape me because he looks around. He looked in my eyes.
And in that moment, I felt that realization, like that moment where you're like, I'm in danger.

Speaker 8 Like I'm something bad is going to happen to me right now. And like, I have to like fight.

Speaker 8 So I went into fight mode immediately because he looked around, he put his mask back on, and then he came to strangle me. So he came at me with his hands to strangle me.

Speaker 8 But before he could get to me, I crossed him. So I punched him with my right arm, my right fist.

Speaker 8 I punched him in his jaw. Like I just, I don't know.
I don't remember how hard it was. I mean, in that moment, I'm sure I punched him really, really hard.

Speaker 8 Not enough to knock him out, but he was shocked. So there was a silent moment between us where we were both trying to process what just happened.

Speaker 9 Like after you punched him?

Speaker 8 Yeah, like just a still moment where I was like, oh my God, I just punched a human, like in the face. Like I, I was taking boxing lessons, but I always had gloves on.

Speaker 8 I never punched a human before, like flesh and bone. So like there were so many thoughts running through my head, like, oh my God, he's going to kill me.

Speaker 8 I just punched a man in the face and he's going to kill me.

Speaker 9 So, because you say, like, and you did this motion, which people can't see on the podcast, but you're saying that he was coming at you with his hands out in a clear way that like he was going for your throat.

Speaker 8 Yeah, he was coming for my throat. Yeah.
Like that was hands down, the scariest moment of my life. Just.
I didn't even react. Like, I didn't even think.
I just reacted and I punched him.

Speaker 8 And I honestly believe that like like punching him in the face was the best thing I could have ever done because it completely threw him off and after I punched him I did freeze because I was like at the end of the day I'm 5'1 and he's really tall he's I don't know who he is what he's capable of I don't know if he has a weapon on him But then right after I punched him and we had that silent moment for maybe five seconds, you know, it aggravated him.

Speaker 8 So he came, he tried to take me down.

Speaker 8 And so I always mention that like my boxing lessons saved my life. I was able to fight him.
So I literally heard my coach, his name is Jerry, and I literally heard Jerry in my head.

Speaker 8 I heard him say, put power behind it. Like as I was punching, because that was something he'd often say to me, put power behind it.
And it's that repetition of punching over and over and over.

Speaker 8 And even,

Speaker 8 I don't know how it happened, but he was on the ground at one point. I kicked him really hard in his ribs.
I wish I had kicked him in his balls, but I kicked him in his ribs.

Speaker 8 There was a point where he was looking for something on the ground. So he was.

Speaker 8 searching for something on the ground.

Speaker 8 And in that moment, I thought, oh my God, he's looking looking for a rock like to knock me out right like that was my thought i was like he's looking for something to like knock me out and like that was the moment i remembered i had a voice because you know when you're fighting for your life and that

Speaker 8 you you don't remember that like i didn't remember i was in a public park. In that moment, I remembered like, you're in a public park.
There's people. somebody's gonna hear you.

Speaker 8 And so, I literally started screaming bloody murder. Um, I started screaming for help, like, as loud as I could.
And

Speaker 8 yeah, like that was

Speaker 8 something it's hard to relive,

Speaker 8 but

Speaker 8 yeah, like, I thought like if like that was my last resort, was just screaming for my life. Um,

Speaker 8 it was really,

Speaker 8 really scary. So,

Speaker 8 yeah. And then as soon as

Speaker 8 I started screaming for help, like his eyes bulged out. And yeah, and then he ran away.

Speaker 8 But when he ran away, he ran towards the right side of the forest.

Speaker 8 And then I think he got maybe 10, 20. steps in and he stopped and he ran the opposite direction.
And that's when I pulled out my phone and I started recording him because

Speaker 8 I needed evidence of him running away. I needed evidence

Speaker 8 of like what he looked like, what he was wearing. Like I just needed something to show the police.
I had no idea why he stopped and ran the opposite direction.

Speaker 8 But then I realized when he picked up his bike that it was the same person who had walked by me 10 minutes prior to and I realized that he had hid his bike

Speaker 8 and was watching me for about 10 minutes.

Speaker 1 This podcast is sponsored by PayPal.

Speaker 3 Okay, let's talk holiday shopping.

Speaker 1 From now through December 8th, you can get 20% cash back when you pay in four with PayPal. No fees, no interest.

Speaker 3 This limited time offer is perfect for the Black Friday and Cyber Monday deals you've been eyeing. Save the offer in the app now.

Speaker 1 So whether you're buying tickets to an improv show or a who Done It board game, PayPal helps you make the most of your money this holiday.

Speaker 3 Expires December 8th. See PayPal.com slash promo terms subject to approval.

Speaker 1 Learn more at paypal.com slash payin4, PayPal Inc., NMLS 910-457.

Speaker 4 Goodbye. Goodbye.

Speaker 1 Big news, Aldi is now on Uber Eats and you get 40% off in your first order with code New Aldi25.

Speaker 3 So whether your fridge is empty and you're too tired to shop or you just ran out of essential ingredients in the middle of meal prep, don't worry.

Speaker 1 Fill your fridge in just a few taps and get 40% off your first Aldi order on Uber Eats.

Speaker 3 Her order is over $30. You can save up to $25.
Ends December 31st. See app for details.
Goodbye. Don't miss Netflix's new series, The Beast in Me.

Speaker 1 It's a riveting psychological thriller from the team that brought you homeland.

Speaker 3 The Beast in Me follows acclaimed author Aggie Wiggs, played by Claire Daines, who has withdrawn from public life after the tragic death of her young son.

Speaker 1 She's unable to write and is a ghost of her former self. But Aggie finds an unlikely subject for a new book when the house next door is bought by Niall Jarvis, played by Matthew Reese.

Speaker 3 Niall is a famed real estate mogul who was once the prime suspect in his wife's disappearance.

Speaker 1 Horrified and fascinated by this man, Aggie finds herself compulsively hunting for the truth, chasing his demons while fleeing her own.

Speaker 3 It's a game of cat and mouse that sets them on a collision course with fatal consequences.

Speaker 1 The Beast and Me now playing only on Netflix.

Speaker 3 You will not want to miss this.

Speaker 4 Goodbye. Goodbye.

Speaker 4 After Darun was able to fight off this attacker, she somehow had the presence of mind to take out her phone and hit record, capturing him running into the woods.

Speaker 4 Then a man in the park who had heard her scream showed up and called the police. The following moments were a blur for Darun as multiple police officers and her husband arrived at the park.

Speaker 8 When I had somebody there, like I was able to just kind of like break out of that shell and I went into shock immediately. I just started wailing.
Like I couldn't help it.

Speaker 8 Like I just started screaming. There was a lot of police around and that police officer

Speaker 8 showed up within two minutes. He was there.
The search. started immediately.
They were looking for him because we gave a description. But yeah, he got away with it.

Speaker 8 Yeah. And then

Speaker 8 I somehow walked back home. My street was filled with police cars and my neighbors had no idea what happened.
There was just a lot of police in the area and they kind of gave me a minute.

Speaker 8 And when I got home, that's when like the shock just kept getting worse.

Speaker 8 When I was like realized, like realized what just happened.

Speaker 8 The first thing I did was like go to the bathroom and puke.

Speaker 8 I don't know how to describe it, but it felt like I puked like this evil, like it just came out of me and like it just, I puked and I was, I was messed up.

Speaker 8 I was really messed up because I kept thinking like, oh my God, what if I didn't turn around? Like, what if he had just knocked me out before? I had turned around.

Speaker 7 There's obviously this range of emotions that you're then experiencing directly following the attack. What do logistically the hours and the days following the attack look like?

Speaker 8 Yeah, that was a huge ordeal. When we get into the police, there's a lot to say because,

Speaker 8 you know, I essentially risked my life capturing that video because

Speaker 8 I should have been running to safety, but I

Speaker 8 took...

Speaker 8 an extra 10-15 seconds just to get him on camera. Yeah, when I was very disappointed when they told me that they couldn't do anything with that evidence.

Speaker 8 Like, I had this fantasy that, like, they were going to put it on the news that night and show the clip of him running through the woods. And my neighborhood's going to be a safer place.

Speaker 8 Maybe like somebody can recognize him. And like, I was so disappointed and so shocked when the police were like, no, like, we can't do anything with that evidence.

Speaker 7 What was their reason when they said we can't do anything? Why?

Speaker 8 Well, because it's alleged. They can't prove what he did.
They just have a video of a guy running through the woods and it's an alleged attack. And

Speaker 8 yeah, like they just don't do that. So

Speaker 8 I was like, okay, well, what are you going to do? Like. There's a guy out there attacking women at 11 a.m.

Speaker 8 He is 1 million percent gonna do it again and they're like yeah we we're gonna put it up on our website and then i was angry i was like what website are you talking about like i live in this neighborhood i don't know about your website i doubt anyone here knows that you have a website or that anyone goes on there daily to check they questioned me for about half an hour and i was like yeah i was just messed up right like they gave me maybe

Speaker 8 10 minutes to myself. And like during that 10 minutes, I was puking.
Then we were talking and I was angry. I was so angry.
I was like, what do you mean you're not going to do anything?

Speaker 8 What do you mean you're, you're just going to put it on a website? Like, what good is that? And they literally told me like, like, the best thing you could do is just not go back into the woods.

Speaker 8 And I was like, are you, I was like, are you fucking kidding me? Like, what am I a caged up animal? I can't even go for a walk in my neighborhood in the park where I I take my kids every day.

Speaker 8 Like I walk my kids to the park.

Speaker 7 Well, also, this is our advice to women on how to stay safe. Don't leave your house.
Yeah,

Speaker 8 exactly.

Speaker 4 According to Darun, the police said they would post the report on their website to alert the neighborhood, but she didn't feel that this was good enough.

Speaker 4 After all, she lived in the neighborhood and she'd never heard of the website. Daroon has a significant following on social media.

Speaker 4 And so the next day, when the police report still wasn't up online, Darun decided to post the video that she recorded in the park of her attacker. This is the first part of that video.

Speaker 4 Darun screams as a blurry figure darts through the woods.

Speaker 4 Help me!

Speaker 4 Help me! This guy tries to attack me!

Speaker 4 I have you on video, you piece of f!

Speaker 4 I just punched him in the f ⁇ ing face! Yeah, you piece of f.

Speaker 4 The video then cuts from the park to Daroon sitting on her front porch the following day, speaking directly to her followers.

Speaker 4 I wasn't scared at all.

Speaker 4 I wasn't scared. I'm crying because fucking took my sanctuary from me.

Speaker 8 It went viral within hours. And at one point, it was at 30,000 views.
And it was at 300,000 views. And it was at 500,000 views.
And it was just like a snowball effect.

Speaker 8 And it just kept getting bigger and bigger. And that was extremely hard to navigate through as I'm trying to like collect myself.
I was getting messages. from all over the world.

Speaker 8 Like it went viral in India. It went viral in Europe.
It went viral in South America. For some people, it was like entertainment.

Speaker 8 I experienced a lot of victim blaming, but I have to say, I did also feel like the support of the world behind me. And

Speaker 8 they ended up posting the police report after it went viral. But I also felt like the system really failed me because

Speaker 8 if they had just taken me seriously, if they had publicized my report, then the second attack wouldn't have happened, which was just six days after mine.

Speaker 4 Do you know what happened with that attack?

Speaker 8 And how did you learn about that attack? I found out about the second attack through a follower. Somebody sent me the report.
What happened was literally the same exact scenario. He attacked her.

Speaker 8 on a Tuesday. It was around the same exact time, like 11 a.m.

Speaker 8 It was in another nearby park. He was on a bike.
Same thing. He was dressed in sweats, but he had escalated it to

Speaker 8 he had taken a knife, so a box cutter to this next attack.

Speaker 4 After the second attack, Darun was asked to come into the police station and look through a series of photographs to identify the attacker.

Speaker 8 He was like the second last picture. So I had to like go through all those pictures.

Speaker 8 But as soon as his picture came up and I looked at his eyes, this energy rushed over me and like every cell in my body screamed and was like, that's him.

Speaker 8 Like I knew it was him because of his eyes, because I can never forget that look he gave me right before he came to strangle me. And, you know, even though it was a picture, I felt those emotions.

Speaker 8 And then after they made me go through that, they were like, well, we have a disturbing question to ask you. I was like, what? And they were like, did he steal anything from you?

Speaker 8 Like, does he, are you missing anything? And I was like, no, no, I'm not missing anything.

Speaker 8 But when they told me, like, they found him, he had a backpack on him and he had a bunch of women's items in there. And they told me that he goes out there looking for the opportunity to attack.

Speaker 8 And then that he is also a trophy keeper. So then he keeps something from his victims.

Speaker 8 And when they said that to me, I realized that when I thought he was looking for a rock to knock me out, he wasn't actually looking for a rock. He was looking to steal something to keep as a trophy.

Speaker 10 19-year-old Paula Youssef of Brampton was charged this week with assault, assault with a weapon, and assault causing bodily harm in connection to two alleged incidents, Henry's and another that happened six days later, that incident taking place at nearby Jayfield Park.

Speaker 4 Law enforcement was able to identify and charge Paul Youssef. We don't have any information about the other victim as she was a minor at the time.
Paul Youssef was arrested on September 28th, 2021.

Speaker 4 Darun now had a name for her attacker, and while she waited to see what would happen to him, she tried to continue living her life.

Speaker 8 I didn't sleep for maybe two weeks. I just couldn't.
Although he wasn't successful, I went through a lot of the after effects.

Speaker 9 You know, it's interesting to use this word successful.

Speaker 9 And I know what you mean by it, because he wasn't able to, you know, do what he planned to do, which when you were in that moment was very clear to you.

Speaker 4 Looking in his eyes, you knew what he wanted to do.

Speaker 9 It's still just like he still attacked you.

Speaker 9 You know, you still had to go through that experience.

Speaker 8 He wasn't successful, but he was successful in breaking me and,

Speaker 8 you know, making me feel

Speaker 8 violated. I still feel very violated.
For the first two weeks before he was caught, I went through this intense like PTSD where I felt like he was in my kitchen every night.

Speaker 8 Like I couldn't even go downstairs to like get a glass of water because I felt like he was just there.

Speaker 8 There were many times where I would just be sitting on my front porch and like a man would walk by and I thought that man was going to come attack me and I would just run back into my home.

Speaker 8 The PTSD was so intense that I literally jumped one day and like almost freaked out on an elderly man at the beach.

Speaker 4 Something that's important to note, in Canada, you are not allowed to carry a weapon or any tool that is specifically for the purpose of self-defense, which would include pepper spray.

Speaker 4 It was difficult for Daroon to feel safe out in the world, even during the day. After all, she'd been attacked in a public park at 11 a.m.

Speaker 4 She feared something like this would happen again, knowing her only recourse, if it ever did happen, would be to fight.

Speaker 8 One of the triggers I have is that,

Speaker 8 like, when a man is walking towards me and making eye contact,

Speaker 8 I get triggered. Or if there's somebody behind me, I will get triggered and it will bring back that moment and I'll go into like defense mode.

Speaker 8 Like, I didn't want to be touched, like, even by my husband. Like, he couldn't even tap me on the shoulder without me jumping.

Speaker 8 I dressed in baggy clothes for weeks. Like my body was, I felt so violated.
There's a lot that victims go through that is not talked about.

Speaker 7 Have you learned anything else about him throughout this process? Like what does he do for work?

Speaker 8 Oh, yeah. Like when we discovered who he was and

Speaker 8 it went public,

Speaker 8 I saw a few comments like, oh, I went to high school with this guy. So I went and I like did, did my own research.

Speaker 8 I found out that he's iraqi which is crazy because i'm iraqi i found out that he's my own people and that was very disturbing and that was one thing i found out about him um a lot of the girls i spoke to from his high school i think i spoke to like two or three of them all told me he was a creep and that like he

Speaker 8 didn't handle rejection very well.

Speaker 4 Darun waited in anticipation to see what would happen to her attacker, Paul Youssef. The waiting, she said, was uncomfortable, but it was also not a new feeling for her.

Speaker 4 This experience flooded her with memories from a different incident that happened when she was a child.

Speaker 8 This is also not my first predator. When I was 11, I was groomed by my teacher, my drama teacher.
Like every kid wanted to be around him, like, because he was cool. And he was, you know, like, if Mr.

Speaker 8 Tolenko liked you, like, you're cool. And

Speaker 8 I didn't know he was grooming me until he made it so obvious. And he was like, well, I have a question for you.
Do you have pubic hair?

Speaker 8 I was like, whoa.

Speaker 8 And I was going through puberty. And like, I don't even talk about that stuff with my own parents.
So, like, for you to ask me as a teacher, I legitimately ran home that day. I think I answered him.

Speaker 8 I have no idea what my reaction was. I just was like, what the fuck, dude? And I ran out of there.
Like I went home and then I just avoided him for the remainder of the year. You know,

Speaker 8 I noticed he always had like a favorite student that was always a female who was always in grade six.

Speaker 8 And the reason he targeted grade six students, and this is just all my theory, was because the year, like that was the last year of elementary. And then you go to middle school.

Speaker 8 And so you can kind of get away with doing whatever. And then they were off to the next school, which is exactly what happened with me.

Speaker 8 I just moved on and I went to the next school and I forgot about it.

Speaker 4 Darun was clear that although her sixth grade teacher, Greg Tolenko, had not physically abused her, his actions were harmful.

Speaker 4 He was a teacher, someone in a trusted position of authority, and he'd used that power to manipulate her.

Speaker 4 At the time, Darun didn't know the term grooming, but she does now, and that is exactly what Greg Tolenko was doing.

Speaker 4 Darun listened to her instincts and distanced herself from Tolenko, never telling anyone what happened. That is, until two years later, when she learned that she was not Tolenko's only target.

Speaker 8 And then two years later, it came up that

Speaker 8 like the after the year I left, there was like five girls that he was, you know, grooming and had invited back to his house and shown them porn on his computer. He had shown them his

Speaker 8 privates. And like he took it so far with those girls, you know, they, I guess, thought it was a joke.
They didn't realize what was happening.

Speaker 8 And they told me, like, we were on the bus going to school. Like, they were in grade seven, I was in grade eight.
And they were telling me all these stories.

Speaker 8 And I was like, you guys, like, we have to come forward. And it was my idea to come forward because I have a younger sister and he used to call her little Darun.

Speaker 8 And I just knew that, like, she was his next target. So I really did it for my sister.
And yeah, at a young age, I had to get questioned. I felt like I was getting interrogated by the police.

Speaker 8 There was like victim blaming involved at that time as well with the new teachers in grade eight. Like I remember getting treated differently because of coming forward.
And so,

Speaker 8 yeah, this is, this cuts deep because I still have trauma from the age of 11, 12, 13.

Speaker 4 Darun was in middle school, a time wrought with difficulties and insecurities for most of us. But still, she decided to speak out and lead the charge in bringing Greg Tolenko's actions to light.

Speaker 4 Darun's younger sister was going into sixth grade the next year, and she did not want her to have the same experiences with Tolenko.

Speaker 4 As a result of Darun and others speaking out, in 2001, Greg Tolenko was arrested and charged with sexual assault, invitation to sexual touching, sexual interference, and criminal harassment.

Speaker 4 He had been teaching at Cedar Drive Public School for 12 years at that point.

Speaker 8 I was very afraid of like coming out because as a child, you think that like you did something wrong for the teacher to ask me a question like that, like, what did, what did you do for him to ask you that?

Speaker 8 Right. Like that was how my mind worked.
At the end of the day, I feel like my voice.

Speaker 8 is there like this time around like I fought so hard because of little Darun because like little Darun never got justice.

Speaker 8 Like, I was just like, Yeah, I'm just like a witness in all this, but really, I was a victim and I was groomed and my innocence was stolen.

Speaker 8 But I was okay with like not getting the justice as long as he was in trouble. And as long as like

Speaker 8 there was other victims to help me prove that this guy was shouldn't be a teacher, shouldn't even be around kids.

Speaker 4 I asked Darun what she meant when she said she never got justice as a child. And what came to light was that she felt she missed out on the process.

Speaker 4 She wasn't considered a main victim in the case, which she understands. But as a result, her story wasn't part of the case and she did not attend any of the hearings.
She didn't get to see it.

Speaker 4 She was just left to process what had happened to her alone. As a result of this, even years later, she explained that she still has questions and she never really got closure.

Speaker 4 And when she was attacked on September 15th, 2021 in Massey Park, suddenly this incident from middle school came back into her mind.

Speaker 8 I actually thought about Mr. Tolenco on my walk back home.
Like it happened immediately, like after the attack and I was walking back home. I thought of him and I remembered that experience.

Speaker 8 It It just came up and I was just so angry about

Speaker 8 the world. Like I'm just, I was just so angry.
It just, it just came up, I guess. It was just like that

Speaker 8 locked trauma that was still in there. It all came up.

Speaker 4 Darun spoke up in middle school and again, as an adult after she was attacked in Massey Park, her motivation to warn others, to advocate for victims, and perhaps to make a big deal about something that is a big deal.

Speaker 4 Sometimes, though, you can do all the right things and still be let down.

Speaker 4 When I first spoke with Daroon in the fall of 2024, she told me that she was still waiting to know the results of Paul Youssef's case. I decided to see what I could find out.

Speaker 4 So I called the Peel Regional Police and then they directed me to the Davis Courthouse in Brampton.

Speaker 4 We don't directly talk about this in the interview, but what happened was I was emailed the case documents the day before we recorded this interview with Daroon.

Speaker 4 I found out that the sentencing hearing had already happened. It happened in May of 2024.
Paul Youssef was sentenced to four months of conditional sentence, house arrest, and two years probation.

Speaker 4 I didn't want to spring this information on Darun during the recording, so I sent her an email the night before the interview with the case information.

Speaker 4 She later told me that while she is glad to have this information, it was also very difficult to receive and it opened up a whole new set of worries for her.

Speaker 8 I have been waiting for three years. Nobody has updated me on anything.

Speaker 8 He only got four months of house arrest. He also lives in our neighborhood.
So

Speaker 8 he lives within five kilometers of us. So that's the other scary part:

Speaker 8 yeah, like he's, he's free now.

Speaker 8 And I had no idea.

Speaker 9 Yeah. I mean, I think it's pretty like ridiculous that they didn't update you on all of that.

Speaker 4 Even just to keep you informed, I feel like that should have happened.

Speaker 8 I can't believe it. I legitimately had a mental breakdown last night when I saw your message.
I was like, what? That is impossible. Like, how could, how could they not tell me?

Speaker 8 I

Speaker 9 wasn't able to get a hold of anyone to ask them these questions, but it started, you know, it was so shocking to me when I heard that because he attacked two people.

Speaker 9 Clearly, he was past you, hid his bike, was watching you. And maybe it goes back to this idea of, was he quote unquote successful?

Speaker 9 And if he, you know, because he wasn't, then he gets a lesser sentence. But it really brings up this question of justice because how is that justice?

Speaker 8 yeah it's not

Speaker 8 it's a nightmare yeah like it's it's almost as if like you have to end up like dead in the woods for them to actually care

Speaker 8 or like do anything and and that's truly how i feel like oh you got attacked well

Speaker 8 shit happens every day darune like move on right like that's that's how i took it like well you're lucky enough you could fight and fight right like

Speaker 8 you're lucky you got away. Like, it's all luck.
It's like a game of luck. Like, I just kind of want to reiterate my message to women.
Um,

Speaker 8 and it's that you have a voice, right? And like that you're powerful and that

Speaker 8 you're stronger than you believe to be. And that you can also punch a man in the face and

Speaker 8 survive and that it's okay to freeze. I think that was one thing that, like, I felt like a lot of victims came forward and kept saying, like, I wish I had your strength.
I wish I had done something.

Speaker 8 But, like, I want to remind women that I also froze in that moment, like, right after I punched him. And, like, that it's a very natural reaction to have.
But the more prepared you are. Right.

Speaker 8 Like, I just feel like I was prepared. And that, you know, at the end of the day,

Speaker 8 I feel like, you know, I was very successful, quote unquote, in getting him captured and,

Speaker 8 you know, all that stuff, because it rarely goes that far, right?

Speaker 1 This podcast is sponsored by PayPal.

Speaker 3 Okay, let's talk holiday shopping.

Speaker 1 From now through December 8th, you can get 20% cash back when you pay in four with PayPal. No fees, no interest.

Speaker 3 This limited time offer is perfect for the Black Friday and Cyber Monday deals you've been eyeing. Save the offer in the app now.

Speaker 1 So whether you're buying tickets to an improv show or a whodunit board game, PayPal helps you make the most of your money this holiday.

Speaker 3 Expires December 8th. See PayPal.com/slash promo terms subject to approval.

Speaker 1 Learn more at paypal.com/slash payin4, PayPal Inc., NMLS 910-457.

Speaker 4 Goodbye. Goodbye.

Speaker 1 Big news: Aldi is now on Uber Eats, and you get 40% off on your first order with code New Aldi25.

Speaker 3 So whether your fridge is empty and you're too tired to shop, or you just ran out of essential ingredients in the middle of meal prep, don't worry.

Speaker 1 Fill your fridge in just a few taps and get 40% off your first Aldi order on Uber Eats.

Speaker 3 For orders over $30, you can save up to $25. Ends December 31st.
See app for details. Goodbye.
Don't miss Netflix's new series, The Beast in Me.

Speaker 1 It's a riveting psychological thriller from the team that brought you homeland.

Speaker 3 The Beast in Me follows acclaimed author, Aggie Wiggs, played by Claire Danes, who has withdrawn from public life after the tragic death of her young son.

Speaker 1 She's unable to write and is a ghost of her former self. But Aggie finds an unlikely subject for a new book when the house next door is bought by Niall Jarvis, played by Matthew Rees.

Speaker 3 Niall is a famed real estate mogul who was once the prime suspect in his wife's disappearance.

Speaker 1 Horrified and fascinated by this man, Aggie finds herself compulsively hunting for the truth, chasing his demons while fleeing her own.

Speaker 3 It's a game of cat and mouse mouse that sets them on a collision course with fatal consequences.

Speaker 1 The Beast and Me now playing only on Netflix.

Speaker 3 You will not want to miss this.

Speaker 4 Goodbye. Goodbye.

Speaker 7 Wow. That was an incredible interview.
I'm so, I feel so lucky she shared her story with us.

Speaker 4 Me too. Yeah, it was really powerful.
And I'm so glad that she spoke with us.

Speaker 7 Going into these interviews, we have to do some level of prep. And in this case, you discovered that Paul Youssef had already actually had his court proceedings.

Speaker 7 So do you want to talk a little bit about how you navigated that going into the interview with Darun?

Speaker 4 Yeah. It's not something I think I would have known how to do or felt comfortable doing before we started working in podcasting because basically I couldn't find any information about it online.

Speaker 4 Neither could Darun, which is why she believed that the case was still open. And so I called the police station where the article I did find where he was arrested.

Speaker 4 And then they told me the courthouse, which was like in a different county. So then I called the courthouse and got a hold of them.
And then I was able to get the court documents.

Speaker 4 And I was really surprised to learn that the case was closed, that his sentencing hearing had already happened like six months before.

Speaker 4 And I don't know exactly why, why he got a four-month conditional sentence and two years probation.

Speaker 4 But the most shocking thing to me was that Darun had not been updated and had not been able to find this information.

Speaker 7 And lived so close to him.

Speaker 4 Lives like a few miles away and had no idea.

Speaker 7 Such a nightmare.

Speaker 4 Okay, so this takes place in Canada, which is different than the U.S. And I'm not as familiar with the laws there.

Speaker 4 It was difficult, honestly, even getting the court paperwork, much more difficult than I found in the U.S. when I've sought out records.
So I reached out to a few different reporters.

Speaker 4 Essentially, I didn't get a clear answer on this, on what the process is and also why

Speaker 4 a victim wouldn't be informed. But you might have some information about this.

Speaker 7 Yeah, well, after we talked about this and came to this sort of realization that we weren't even clear on what Darun's rights were as a victim of someone who physically assaulted her, probably with the intent to sexually assault her.

Speaker 7 You know, it was really alarming. And so I went ahead and contacted a victim advocacy group called the Canadian Resource Center for Victims of Crime.

Speaker 7 And I spoke with the representative there and she had some really interesting information. Essentially, in Canada, there exists the Canadian Victims Bill of Rights.

Speaker 7 And Darun had a lot more rights than I think were exercised. And probably that's because she didn't even know that she had those rights.
And it also goes back to, well, she's the victim of a crime.

Speaker 7 And so is the onus on the victim to go say, okay, what are my rights?

Speaker 7 Or is it on law enforcement to say, okay, here's your rights or connect you to someone who can make you aware so that you can stay safe throughout this ordeal.

Speaker 7 And basically, she has what's called a right to information, which is about the status of the investigation, the alleged offense, the location of proceedings, available services, right to protection, right to participation, which is conveying their views when decisions are made by authorities.

Speaker 4 Well, this is why I was shocked because so many cases we've covered before, victims will get a chance to offer a victim impact statement at a sentencing hearing, which can influence a sentence on someone, right?

Speaker 4 If a judge hears that this was incredibly emotionally traumatic or whatever, that could be informative in sentencing.

Speaker 4 Well, if the victim is not informed about the sentencing hearing, they have no chance to offer a victim impact statement.

Speaker 7 Right. And I think, you know, Druin put it so well in the interview when she was talking about how, you know, this person attacked her in broad daylight, in broad daylight.
I think it was 11.30 a.m.

Speaker 7 She was like, of course he was going to do this again. And she was right.

Speaker 4 And was keeping trophies. Was keeping trophies.

Speaker 7 Like he was not someone who was just going to be

Speaker 7 kind of come to the realization that he shouldn't be doing this. He's dangerous.
And so it was really scary, I'm sure, for her to learn that he actually lives quite close.

Speaker 7 And she had no idea what the status was of the case. No one told her.
And she, it turns out, did have a right to that information.

Speaker 7 Now, when I spoke to the representative from this advocacy advocacy group, they said that it's not exactly clear whose job it is to say, here are your rights, but that if you are a victim of a crime in Canada, especially a violent crime, you should be able to ask law enforcement, what are some resources I can have access to?

Speaker 7 And they should be able to point you in this direction of either an advocacy group or paperwork that outlines your rights for you.

Speaker 7 And it's unfortunate, but it sounds like you do have to do some self-advocating to get that information. But it does exist.

Speaker 7 So, you know, it's not ideal, but I think that it's an important takeaway for anyone who might find themselves in an unfortunate situation like this, because I think had Darun known, she would have absolutely exercised those rights.

Speaker 4 Yeah, absolutely. You know, it's a good practice to, if you find yourself in that situation, to ask that of law enforcement.
Who do I contact? What's the number? How often will I be updated? You know,

Speaker 4 ask all the questions. It's hard to also put that on a victim.
When hearing Durin's story, it's like the shock even. Right.

Speaker 4 After this attack, she's not, she doesn't have the presence of mind to do that, I'm sure.

Speaker 4 But even to be able to reach out after, you know, one of the things that I feel like I've learned from trying to track information down, calling courthouses, calling police stations is like, you know, Bureaucratic institutions are not just going to be like, here, let me help you and give you all this information.

Speaker 4 You just have to be like, okay, keep asking, keep asking. Okay, well, you should contact this department.
Cool. How do I do that? What would that website or that phone number be?

Speaker 4 You just have to ask a ton of questions, which it's unfortunate that's the case. But yeah, you have to be kind of a bulldog about it.

Speaker 7 I mean, you and I have been contacting courthouses and looking for court records and reaching out to law enforcement for a long time now, but still sometimes I have a really hard time figuring out how do I get to this person.

Speaker 7 Oh, you have to go through this other person. And, you know, pretty soon you're following up three times.

Speaker 7 And, you know, for us working in podcasting, obviously that's a less important email than a victim. But I think the same bureaucratic nightmare exists where you're like, okay, but who do I call?

Speaker 7 What is the number? And they're like, let me look into that.

Speaker 4 Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Well, that sounds like a really helpful organization. We should put that in the show notes.
Yeah.

Speaker 7 They're also,

Speaker 7 you know, there's no cost to utilizing their services.

Speaker 4 Oh, that's fantastic. Yeah.
Do they serve all of Canada?

Speaker 7 I think they serve all of Canada, but I know they serve Ontario. And they help people who have experienced violent crime.
They have a homicide support group.

Speaker 7 They really have a lot of resources that I didn't even know existed that are more specific. So the Canadian Resource Center for Victims of Crime, I'm just reading from what it says on their website.

Speaker 7 The CRCBC provides support research and education to survivors of serious crime and stakeholders in Canada. So reach out to them if you need victim advocacy.

Speaker 7 I think that it was so easy for me to reach them and hop on a call. I have no doubt that they would help point someone in the right direction.

Speaker 4 Love that.

Speaker 7 So if anyone is interested in reaching out to the Canadian Resource Center for Victims of Crime, you can go to their website, it's crcvc.ca,

Speaker 7 and there's a contact us link. And that is how I reached them.
And I heard back within a day. Amazing.
Yeah, amazing. That was a great interview.

Speaker 4 Fantastic.

Speaker 7 We'll be back next week. All right.
Looking forward to it.

Speaker 7 If you have a story for us, we would love to hear it. Our email is theknife at exactlyrightmedia.com, or you can follow us on Instagram at the Knife Podcast or Blue Sky at the Knife Podcast.

Speaker 4 This has been an exactly right production, hosted and produced by me, Hannah Smith, and me, Patia Eaton.

Speaker 7 Our producers are Tom Breifogel and Alexa Samorosi.

Speaker 4 This episode was mixed by Tom Breifogel.

Speaker 7 Our associate producer is Christina Chamberlain.

Speaker 4 Our theme music is by Birds in the Airport.

Speaker 7 Artwork by Vanessa Lilac.

Speaker 4 Executive produced by Karen Kilgariff, Georgia Hardstark, and Danielle Kramer.

Speaker 11 The courtroom isn't just about justice. It's about power and money and some truly bizarre loopholes.

Speaker 4 I'm Michael Foote.

Speaker 12 And I'm Melissa Malbrunch. And we've got a brand new show called Brief Recess, a Legal Podcast.

Speaker 11 Every week, we talk about wild tales from court, trials gone wrong, and cases and rulings that shape our world.

Speaker 11 Today, we're going to be talking about stolen antiquities, all the weird things Melissa found out in an estate sale, sale, the crazy conversations I had with a bouncer and J.K.

Speaker 5 Rowley.

Speaker 12 We make the complicated clear and the serious surprisingly fun.

Speaker 11 From the exactly right network, new episodes of Brief Recess drop every Thursday. Watch Brief Recess on YouTube.
Listen to Brief Recess on the iHeartRadio app.

Speaker 11 Apple Podcasts are wherever you get your podcasts.

Speaker 13 All right, good people, what's up? It's Questlove, and I'm really excited to announce that my podcast is back with new episodes, a new logo, and yes, even a new name.

Speaker 13 So welcome to QLS 2.0, the Quest Love Show. New conversations are on the way with some incredible guests like journalist turn filmmaker Cameron Crowe.

Speaker 14 It's like the Barry Gordy thing. You know, if you send me a letter and it's B-A-R-R-Y,

Speaker 14 you didn't take the time to know how my name was spelled and I can't take the time to know what you want from me.

Speaker 13 Listen to the Questlove Show on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Speaker 15 Johnny Knoxville here. Check out Crimeless, Hillbilly Heist, my new true crime podcast from Smartless Media, Campside Media, and Big Money Players.

Speaker 15 It's the true story of the almost perfect crime and the Nimrods who almost pulled it off.

Speaker 11 It was kind of like the perfect storm in a sewer. That was dumb.
Do not follow my example.

Speaker 15 Listen to Crimeless, Hillbilly Heist, on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.