Ep 128: Miquita Oliver

Hello, it's Ed Gamble here from the Off Menu Podcast.

Hello, it's James A.

Caster here from the Off Menu Podcast.

And before the episode starts, we'd like to talk to you about All Our Relations, a non-profit co-founded by your friend of mine, comedian Jen Brister, and Georgia Takax.

Yes, All Our Relations was originally started to support 15 families in Gaza when the genocide started, but now supports 21 families and funds several mutual aid projects, including two seven-day food kitchens and two mobile food parcel delivery schemes, as well, feeding hundreds of families in Gaza every single day.

They've created an absolutely amazing thing.

And we feel like, you know, it's the off-menu podcast.

We talk about food and we are very lucky to eat wonderful food and have access to absolutely brilliant food all of the time.

And I think we need to talk about people who have access to no food, James.

Absolutely.

So if people would like to donate, please go to allourrelations.co.uk or look at the links in Jen Brister's bio on Instagram.

Every penny raised goes to supporting people in Gaza.

Thank you so much and enjoy the episode.

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Welcome to the Off-Menu podcast.

Taking the Cocoa Pops of Conversation, pouring over the cold milk of humor, and oh God.

I thought, is it nearly there?

Is it the bring this one?

Turn in the milk chocolatey with no, I was about to know I was about to say, I should have said turn the milk chocolatey, but then I was like, oh, no.

I was about to say, you're here, listen to the snap, crackle, and pop.

Imagine if I'd said that.

Much better to just pull out of it halfway through, I think.

There's more rice krispies, isn't it?

The snap, crackle, and

the conversation.

So, like, I guess you went to the house.

I should have said taking the rice krispies of conversation, pouring over the cold milk of humor, and listening to the snap, crackle, and pop of the podcast or something.

I hadn't even thought that bit through.

So, I mean, a lot of podcast hosts would do another take, but that's not happening today, unfortunately.

I think it's really funny to have it like that.

I think give the listeners the reality of it, which is, you know, which is a man just going, oh, God.

I love it.

And also, just another peek behind the curtain.

We have just had to do another intro for another episode.

So I struggle to come up with those anyway.

But two in a row.

And the last one was quite good.

So two in a row is an absolute nightmare.

We'll leave this one to the listener to finish.

You can tweet.

Hit off menu official.

But it's taking the cocoa pots of conversation.

Conversation, pour it over the cold milk of cuma.

And then you got to finish it.

And then, oh God, is where I've got to.

You, the listener, can finish it.

Tweet it at the Great Benito.

Say, hey there, Mr.

Benito, I've got an intro for you, O, and then you have to put the full intro.

Yeah.

Just got off-menu podcast where we are in a dream restaurant and we invite a guest in and they choose their favorite ever start and main course dessert, side dish and drink, not in that order.

And this week, I guess, is

Makita.

Makita Oliver.

Makita Oliver, wonderful presenter, broadcaster, writer, all of those things.

She's brilliant.

A lot of people may remember her from Pop World.

She's very much part of the fabric of our TV growing up, James.

Absolutely.

Big deal for us having Makita Oliver on the podcast.

Even bigger a deal because we've had her mother.

Andy Oliver, the wonderful chef in TV presenter, and loads more, on the pod.

We have.

We know Andy's menu.

We talked a bit about Makita in that episode as well and

their show, What's for Dinner Mummy?

What's for Dinner Mummy?

Yes.

And it's actually, James, it's our second parent-child crossover pod.

In as many weeks.

We've had the Spalls, and now we've had the Olivers.

So I'm looking forward to hearing what Makita picks.

Of course, she's from a great food dynasty from Andy Oliver.

Andy runs a Caribbean restaurant called Bedadley.

So, you know, I'm looking forward to hearing what gets selected.

What delicious things we can hear from Makita.

It's actually our third parent-child episode, Ed, should point out, not the second.

Yes.

A lot of people don't know this, but Joel Dommit is Mike Skinner's son.

I never would have thunk it.

Yeah, I can see it now you've said it, actually.

Yeah, it's obvious.

It is obvious now you've said that.

That makes a lot of sense.

If you listen to Joel's links on the Mask Singer, some of them have got that quality of the streets.

Yeah, yeah, you can tell.

He's growing up in that environment.

I do want to get Joel back on just to plug the love trap.

Oh, man.

If you haven't seen the love trap, you've got to watch it.

Or at least watch the opening montage of the first episode that tells you all the rules of what the show is.

And

if you don't laugh at that, you're dead inside.

I'll tell you what they do when they knock someone out of the dating thing.

They drop them through a trapdoor.

Yeah.

But we're not here to talk about the love trap.

We are here to chat to the wonderful Makita Oliver.

Makita herself presents a wine podcast called Wine Times, which is the Times Wine Club podcast with Will Lyons, who's a wonderful wine expert.

And I was on the first ever episode of that, James, so I'd heartily recommend going to check that out if you enjoy fun chats and nice wine.

But we will be dropping Makita through the fucking floor if she says a secret ingredient, James.

Yes, every week we have a secret ingredient that we've deemed to be unpalatable.

And if the guest chooses it, we kick him out the dream restaurant.

And this week, cheeky little callback to andy oliver's episode because she mentioned something so we we might be being a bit naughty here so maybe mikita will choose it this week the secret ingredient is a chicken chicken's ass

a chicken's ass

now i think we're talking about the parsons nose which i actually quite like i always gravitate to the ass but uh if makita picks the chicken ass trap doors open through she goes yep sorry mikita and you know it will be out of order of us if it happens because we know that her mother loves the chicken's arse and her her grandmother loves the chicken's ass yeah well let's find out this is the off menu menu of mikita mikita oliver

welcome mikita to the dream restaurant thank you thank you so much

Welcome Makita Oliver to the dream restaurant.

We've been expecting you for some time.

This is James the Genie.

Makita, you let us know beforehand you weren't quite sure what goes on in this podcast.

So I like to explain up top that James is a genie waiter and he can bring you whatever you want from wherever in the world and from any time.

Oh, because I heard him say genie on my mum's episode and I was like, what is he on about?

I get it now.

I know it.

Okay, so you bring the magic, as it were.

Yep, always.

Okay.

No one's really clear on what Ed brings.

No, that's true.

Structure?

I think structure and quite often for some guests, I have to explain to them what James is doing and what he means.

I'm basically here to translate.

He's basically like a little pet alien.

Right, that you have to sort of describe and explain to people.

Yes, exactly.

Exactly.

I mean, I know James's work, so.

Yeah, I feel like you might be on the right wavelength, Mikita.

I think you will understand him.

I see James as a rogue individual.

Yes, that's fair.

What of my work have you seen?

Well,

one time,

have you ever supported Simon Amstor?

No, I've been on bills with him.

Maybe a bill with him.

I went to see something that he was doing and you were doing it as well.

And I was like, this guy's funny.

But it was a while ago, and you weren't famous yet.

Yeah, if you thought he was funny, that wouldn't have been James.

That's

probably the wrong person there.

I would have been telling the audience they weren't good enough for me and then storming off.

Yeah, but that's funny shit.

Yeah, very funny.

Doing that.

That's funny.

What did you think of your mum's episode?

You said you listened to it.

Did you think she made good choices?

Listen, we don't enjoy the same food.

Really?

No, no, no.

Actually, to be fair, something on my menu is exactly the same, but we don't actually enjoy the same food because

she's so chefy, I like everything really plain.

I feel that she just, it's always a bit too rich, few too many ingredients.

I'm like, can't we just have a gravy?

I like plain food.

But

I think it's the Scottish in me.

So you feel like the Scottish is winning out in this battle of food cultures?

Because I grew up with her and not my dad so it's like i was yearning for mints and tatties and she was just taking it to different levels it's terrible having a chef as a parent for me isn't as like wonderful as people would think because i'd rather start i'd rather my mum was someone who owned a calf that i'd be into that but then do you think you might be like wanting more extravagant things if your mum owned a calf and you're getting given calf food all the time i love calf food i would say it's probably one of my greatest restaurants because i just love that you can get hot dinners breakfasts, and then like puddings.

That's my kind of menu.

So do you like the decor of a calf?

Because obviously we're creating your dream restaurant.

Do you want it to have the look of a calf?

Yeah, absolutely.

There was a calf called the Shepherdess on Old Street on the corner and it was like sort of green and white tiled.

So, you know, really good old school calf.

It almost looks like a pie and mash shop.

So I'd like a calf to look like a calf.

but not like one of those dirty ones where you think the kitchen is actually disgusting.

Just like, you know, those ones.

Like an old school calf.

yeah like i used to like school dinners as well i'm into that plain you want the plastic calf chairs yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah i mean they had to be in a calf in a comfortable chair that would be completely wrong wouldn't it i think it's such a horrible waste that you grew up with a chef parent and you like plain stuff.

I'm so jealous that you got to grow up with Andy.

What a wonderful chef.

And you're just there going, I want mints and tatties.

It's absolutely disgraceful, Mikita.

I know.

I know.

She hates it.

She absolutely hates it.

But I have to say, in my childhood, my mum did, you know, adhere to my tastes more because there was less cheffing to be done.

There was more cooking for the child to be done.

She would make a banging meatloaf, great meatloaf.

She kept it quite clean, not too spicy or anything.

Good mushroom gravy.

My mum makes the most amazing gravy when she just keeps it simple.

Am I really cussing my mum out?

No, no, not at all.

Is that so?

So do you really hope for the meatloaf and gravy when you ask the question, what's for dinner, mummy?

Oh, yeah.

What's for dinner, dinner, mummy?

God, you really

shattle over what's for dinner, mummy and what mom said this.

I was like, how have they turned into this weird, creepy thing?

Well, because it sounds creepy.

It does sound quite creepy.

Is it the mummy, your mum?

I agree.

And that's why I was like, let's not call it this.

And she was like, no, I like it.

Ed was a very little, is a precocious little boy when it came to food.

So I imagine Ed, when he was little, would have loved Andy Oliver as his mum.

Like maybe the two of you were switched at birth, maybe?

Yeah, because I bet your mum made great pies and sort of shepherd's pie.

I love shepherd's pie.

She does.

Yeah, she does make a really good shepherd's pie, actually.

Bangers and mash.

See what I'm talking about?

I know your life and I want it.

And you can have this.

Yeah, fucking deal.

I would also like to say that I enjoy my mum's food very much as well.

But I'd happily maybe come over every other night to ask what's for dinner mummy at the Oliver's house.

Do you know what?

I really should say the same.

I would also like to say I really like my mum's food.

I just I like it simple.

I like it plain.

It's an interesting thing to say up top in a food podcast that you like plain food.

So now we're staring down the barrel of a very long episode.

I'm still quite specific about certain things.

It's not just any old plain food.

It's got to be colours are really important to me.

Yes.

I need source with most things I eat.

You know, don't worry.

This is going to be Tego these days.

I'm going to say.

We're not worried.

But, you know, this is the only menu where, right at the top, I can comfortably say this is the worst menu we've ever had.

We normally start by asking you about water and stuff, but I don't want to preempt your dessert.

Oh, my God.

Have I still got time to jazz it off a bit?

No, it wouldn't be the truth.

I have to say.

Follow your heart.

In that case, we start with still or sparkling water.

I'm guessing because you're

a planer.

Such a boring bitch, you probably don't like sparkling water.

Imagine if I'd phrased it like that.

Yeah, imagine because you're such a boring bitch.

You'd go for

Edgy's podcast, go for it.

Yes,

I'm going to have a glass of still water, James.

I am.

Why do you prefer that over the sparkling?

We have a lot of Swedish family and they love sparkling water, and mum and I have just always liked really, really cold still water.

I don't like sparkling water.

It always tastes a bit iffy, like it wasn't meant to be fizzy.

Yeah.

I don't really trust it.

You think sparkling water was like a mistake, like a sort of freak science happening?

I drink a lot of water and it doesn't feel like it does the same things.

It just feels like it's off, fizzy water.

I always thought in my 30s, when I grew up, I'd be someone who has like one of those green, but just someone that was like, I've got a bottle of sparkling water on me.

But I never became that person.

On you?

You wanted to be someone so posh that you had a sparkling bottle of water on you at all times.

Yeah, like in my gym bag.

I was like 12 thinking out what it would be like to be an adult.

Yes, right.

That's what I thought it would be like.

Yeah.

Is there a particular brand of still water that you prefer or do you just want it out the tap?

No, I hate tap water.

Yeah, what I've got, James, is a Brit and water filter from Argos for a tenor, which is the best tenor I ever spent.

And you just refill it all day and you've just always got nice filtered water.

And it does taste better.

It does.

You know, you're meant to drink three liters of water a day, right that's a lot of water so it might as well be the good stuff how much do you think you get through james on your eggs not enough daily not enough i know that my colleague ed gamble has like a proper massive flask that has it measured down the side of like how much you've got yeah i think you brought that to the podcast i did with you when you came on my podcast yeah which was about wine but you still brought that water so it's quite quite commitment yeah well you've got to stay hydrated right you've got to stay hydrated um i i actually very rarely use this now i think this only has this has 200 bit liters measured on there i'd say sometimes i hit my water and sometimes i don't and i really feel it i run out of energy halfway through the day if i'm not drinking enough water get one of those brittle water filters because it's just in your fridge so you're just always like oh nice cold filtered glass of water bits you want to drink it more like you know what i can't stand people that drink the wrong drinks out of the wrong cups go on like go on on a reel like coca-cola out of a mug oh yeah i completely get that why would you do that right it just reminds me of like the end of a bad party.

It doesn't taste right.

It doesn't taste right.

I don't water in a mug.

I'm kind of into water in a mug.

I don't mind water in a mug.

I get it.

Okay, let's run a bunch of things by you, see how you feel about them.

Milkshake in a shot glass?

Yes.

You would like that?

Yeah, because that's just a quick shot of milkshake.

A milkshake's there's always too much, isn't there?

Soup in a martini glass.

Cazvatio, yes.

Oh, that's interesting.

But not hot soup.

No.

Vessels are important to me.

Vessels and colours are important to you so far.

We've got that.

Does that make me more interesting yet?

No, I'm just really hoping that we're just trying to get anything to make you interesting.

Anything out of this?

Fucking hell.

Would you like mountain dew out of one of those little plastic kind of balls that you put washing detergent in before you put it in the washing machine?

Maybe.

Obviously not.

Before you finish that sentence, James, no.

Let me stop you there.

No fucking way.

It's clean.

It's not had washing detergent in it yet.

Yeah, but it's the visual connotations, isn't it?

It's like this used to have soap in it.

But just to end my vessel chat, see, this is my tea, right?

And I don't think I could live without this thing.

No, it's like a little flask.

Yeah.

A metal flask with a blue finish on the outside.

But it's the soup one, and I drink tea out of it.

Ah, so but that's going against your rules.

We got ourselves a hypocrite.

A bullshitting hypocrite.

No, it's because

I just know better than them and I want that much tea.

Right, that's fair enough.

You want a soup's worth of tea?

Yeah.

What kind of tea is that?

Oh, oh, now I'm going to sound right, jazzy.

It's a fresh hibiscus.

I don't know whether you can see it's very red.

It is very red.

My friend Phoebe gave me these hibiscus flowers.

I've actually got it together to start drinking it as tea every day.

Amazing.

I look after myself, guys.

Just a bit.

And these shitties things, they're fucked up.

They keep everything so hot.

Like, I used to go to Leeds to last year to film this show.

Sorry, this year.

Beginning of this year, Channel 4 moved to Leeds.

So I had to go there once a week and I would fill this.

When I woke up in Leeds the next day, it was still boiling hot.

What?

And I was like, that's design.

You sure someone hadn't just filled it up while you were asleep for you?

No, I don't have staff filling up my team while I sleep.

Yeah, if it was a really nice hotel, they might have done that.

It wasn't.

No.

Pop and obsorp.

Pop lobs or bread, Makita Oliver.

Pop-adums or bread.

Oh my god.

Pop-adoms.

No, because I don't like mixing cuisines, and that won't go with the rest of my meal.

Does it have to go with the rest of my meal?

No, it's actually your dream meal, whatever you want.

Then I'd have that really nice, nutty, warm, brown bread that comes in like really quite nice restaurants with their like homemade butter.

That's always good.

Nutty brown bread.

Yeah, you know, that's like really lovely, crispy on the outside, and then sort of soft, and you get it in hunks.

Maybe this was just a growing up in west london thing but that's like how bread came at restaurants yeah hunks of bread and the butter is homemade butter if it's fancy enough can you tell when you're looking at it that it's homemade

no way but you can taste it oh god yeah you know like have you ever had homemade butter I think so.

These restaurants.

I guess so.

Yeah, you've been to restaurants.

I've been some places.

I guess all butter's homemade in a way.

It just depends what you

think of as a home.

Well, quite.

I don't think they had cows in the back, but there was...

Do you know what home made in the restaurant means actually?

Whipped themselves.

Yeah, it's not made in the factory.

How do you make butter?

You just like shake some milk for ages.

That's an Andy.

That's my mum has that answer.

I don't know.

And it's unbelievable that you don't.

Surely you pick up some things as you're growing up with Andy.

Yeah, yeah.

Like I can cook, and it's because of my mum.

I'm good.

Like,

timing is everything, and instinct, and trusting your gut, and all that.

And also, she taught me to cook visually with colour.

And vessels.

And vessels.

You drop two mice into a bowl of cream.

And one of those mice just drowned.

But the other one kept on paddling and churned that cream into butter and then walked out.

What?

Is the question, do you eat the cream?

That's how butter's made.

What you on about, mate?

Not mice.

That is disgusting.

In the film Catch Me If You Can, Christopher Walker tells that story and it's inspiring to...

I mean, it got a different different reaction when he told it to what I just got just now.

No!

No, but you're right, he does tell that weird story because I like that film.

But I always thought it was a metaphor about something else.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, working hard and stuff and like, yeah, like, you know, that mouse just kept on paddling until it churned.

Keep paddling.

Churned up.

You make butter by sticking it up your ass.

What?

Who says that?

Christopher Walker.

He says that he was in the war and he escaped with the butter, with the milk up his ass.

And when it came out, it was butter.

Your father kept this butter up his ass.

I kept the butter up my ass.

You have seen the film then?

I think so.

Well, Ed is now, quote, in pulp fiction.

Ed is cross-pollinated it.

Ed's gone over into pulp fiction when he delivers the watch.

It's incredible that Christopher Walker has two butter stories

in two different films.

That's what threw me.

Well,

should point out that in pulp fiction, it's a watch that he keeps up his ass.

It isn't a stick of butter.

He doesn't go to the little boy and delivers him a stick of butter.

He goes, This butter's your birthright.

Your dad was going to be damned.

I mean, Christopher Walker is possibly the most impersonated actor of all time, and neither me or James can do a good one.

I think we're doing pretty well.

No, no, no, no, no.

Because when someone gets Christopher Walken right,

it's good.

Yeah, it's really good.

That wasn't what just happened.

I'm a ass.

The infections are good.

Yeah, it goes up.

It definitely goes up.

So your butter, just to be clear, you want it churned by Mount Mice and kept up Christopher Walker's ass.

Is that what you said?

Homemade.

Correct.

Correct.

It's the only way I take it.

Yeah.

Your starter.

What we thinking here?

Plain, I'm guessing.

Okay, so it wasn't going to be just a really good salad.

Oh, my God.

Because,

hang on.

Don't leave me yet, guys.

Leaves are really important to me.

It's not just like any old shit and I wouldn't ever eat iceberg lettuce.

I really like green, verdant leaves.

And they would have to be things like radicchio, parsley, dandelion greens, watercress, sorrel.

It's a very beautiful salad, but on the side would be our family oysters.

And unfortunately, that was my mum's starter.

But they are just so life-changing.

And it's such a joy to share them with people.

You did mum's episode quite a while ago, and you both went, Yeah, yeah, yeah, we'll definitely do that.

I'm getting the ingredients now.

Has anyone had these oysters since my mum's episode?

No, we were lying.

Yeah,

you were lying.

Your mother's a very nice lady and I didn't want to hurt her feelings, but

I can't remember a single word she said.

Well,

that's good that I'm repeating her starter then.

But it is just oysters with hot sauce, shallot vinegar, and then the pistol resistance, short of champagne.

And it is just, it runs through you and it's just like, do,

and you're ready to party, eat, chat.

It's a right old livener before a meal.

And I think if you still haven't haven't done it, we're getting close to Christmas now.

Get your shit together.

It will change your Christmas.

Well, I'll say it again.

I'm going to try it.

Yeah, I'm going to get all the stuff.

I'm going to try that.

And we'll have another member of your family on in a year, and we still won't have done it.

If you don't want your life to be more exciting, that's fine, but don't you?

No, I do.

I do genuinely want to try it, but it's just very rare that I organise myself in such a way that I've got oysters and champagne knocking about the house.

A very good point.

Yeah.

Christmas?

Christmas, maybe.

Yeah,

we can probably sort it out.

This is Ed's first Christmas as a married man.

Yes.

Oh, well, that's a cause for celebration.

That is a sexy thing to do with the wife.

Yeah.

Thank you.

Okay.

Oysters, they're like ever dizziacs.

And then there's champagne in them.

I mean, it's a great time.

It really is a great time.

But you've also set this at Christmas where you talk about visiting family members.

And I don't think...

With the rest of my family, I should announce something as a sexy thing to do with my wife.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So guys,

I've gathered you all here this Christmas,

my extended family, to watch me do something sexy with my new wife.

Well, you know.

No.

Keep it between you two on Christmas date night.

Yes.

Now, wife, are you ready to do something sexy?

I learnt something from the Oliver family.

Yeah.

She'd be like, this sounds great.

What are we doing?

Yeah, because you know, they have only just got married, but they've been together for a very, very long time.

Oh, so you got to keep it spicy.

So I think any tips, any tips like that are welcome at this point, Ed, is that right?

Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely.

Absolutely.

You can get bored of just normal oysters with no champagne in them.

Sometimes you've got to add champagne to the oyster.

Exactly.

Well, quine.

Yeah.

Fizz it up a bit.

Did we ask your mum?

I can't remember if we asked Adiona if

this was called like porn star oysters or something like that.

Because that's what the cocktail's called, isn't it?

It's not called porn star oysters, no.

Isn't that a horrible name for a cocktail?

Yeah.

Yeah.

It's also disgusting, a porn star martini.

Yeah.

So it's all just, I'm just not into any of that.

Also ordering in the bar.

Can I get a

place?

Yeah.

Is there any dressing on this salad?

Or is it just a leaf?

I would never have an undressed salad.

Well, you didn't mention a dressing.

So, you know.

Yeah.

It would be one of my Swedish family's dressings, which, again, quite simple.

Yeah.

But it's like shallots, mustard, lemon, vinegar.

Really good, really good olive oil.

I'm into very good produce.

You know, in Master Chef, when they always say that very irritating line, when someone makes something like plain, they always say, oh yeah, there's nowhere for her to hide.

And that is true with food that I like.

You can't really...

I don't know that because I'm into it being quite plain though, so I don't really know.

No, but I get what you mean.

You want the quality of the ingredients to be as high as possible.

So you get really good stuff.

You can taste the quality in it.

Then you don't need all the extra stuff.

Yeah, I said that and then I was like, no, but I love a calf sausage, which is the...

That's the opposite, yeah.

Opposite.

There's loads of places to hide.

Yeah.

You can hide in a calf sausage.

You can hide.

There's so many places to hide.

There are so many disgusting things to hide from.

But I do love a calf sausage.

But so does my mum.

There you go.

You got her there.

Do you want a sexy tip for a calf sausage?

Yeah.

Dip it in champagne.

It's a sexy thing to do with your family at Christmas.

Okay.

Well, we all thought that was going somewhere way worse.

I thought, oh dear, this is going to have to be our first official apology to a guest

after he says says this.

No, I don't, I wouldn't want to mix the worlds.

I think I quite like fancy and then plain, which you'll see as we continue on my venue.

The fancy bit was the oysters and the good salad.

You don't like mixing highbrow, lowbrow.

We do that here at home quite a lot.

We'll do a highbrow, lowbrow night where we get packet noodles, like ramen noodles, and then do a duck breast and have them together.

Oh, so you mix.

You know what I was about to say?

When you said, because I didn't know this about Ed, that they do highbrow, lowbrow nights.

And when he said we do that at home, sometimes we we do highbrow, lowbrow, I was about to really slam his relationship and everything about him.

And then he said the noodles and the duck breast.

I thought that sounds delicious.

Once again, I'm wrong about Ed's life.

It is pretty great.

Also, it seems like you really enjoy those highbrow, lowbrow nights.

I love highbrow, lowbrow night.

Yeah.

It's great.

Maybe I should chill the fuck out and start mixing.

Maybe next time you do the oysters, get the oysters high brown instead of champagne, fanta.

Strongbow, fanta.

Fanta or strongbow?

Strongbow is probably even more lowbrow to be fair, than Fanta.

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Dream main course.

From here on out, your menu's nothing like your mum's.

You're sticking up two fingers to your mum for this whole thing.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Thank you for raising me and feeding me so well, but she knows this about me.

So yeah, so we recently, for a job, did DNA tests.

God, have you done them?

No, no,

bit mind-blowing.

And um, I'm like 48%

Scottish, and my dad is, yeah, he's Scottish, but like he's rich, obviously, really fucking Scottish.

And it kind of brought a lot of clarity to this kind of food that I love because it is just mints and tatties.

Yeah, and I've always just gravitated towards that food.

So I feel a little less, I kind of understand myself more now.

I'm like, that's why I like all that stuff.

So I think I would have,

I'd literally just have mints,

and then best mashed potatoes around, and then greens.

Peas are really important to me.

I love peas more than any vegetable in the world.

And then loads of really good gravy.

And I'm done.

I'm happy.

What's your favorite meal?

James is so disappointed in me.

Is she like, wow.

I mean, it is incredible, Makita.

In this plate of food, I would need everything in its place.

Like, the meat has to be there, the potatoes have to be there.

I hate when people put gravy on potatoes.

It has to all be in its section.

God, I'm uptight.

And when I got to the Caribbean, I realized that they're quite like that.

They're very, they like sort of weird, shitty vegetables like I do, like peas and sweet corn.

And they like to have order and put the colour in one place.

So maybe it's just this is what the mix of Caribbean Scottish brings, Ed.

Mince and tatties.

Mince and tatties.

It feels more Scottish, that, really.

Yeah.

I'm not sure you you can claim the Caribbean is that it's all separated.

So wait, how funky do people usually get with their mane?

Oh, no, no, no, we're being unfair.

Everyone always picks mints and tatties.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Well, I had this book that my dad gave me when I was a kid called The Bruins.

And it was about a Scottish family.

And they would eat dinner every night.

And it was a colour book, and I was obsessed with it.

And the mints and tatties is what they ate.

And I just love the way it looked in the colour of it.

So maybe it's about me eating my childhood or something.

I'm not sure.

You said you wanted the best mash in the world.

Want me to make it?

Well, Mash King.

Are you Mash King?

James is the Mash King.

I'm the Mash King.

Are you actually?

I can make it for you.

Yeah.

Oh my god, that's so exciting.

Um,

no, honestly, I'm a real, but

what do you think is great mash?

So, back in the day, we'd uh boil a bunch of potatoes until they're like almost falling apart, put them in the massive pot, then our dumploads are like salt and pepper, cream,

handfuls of cheese, and then I'd mash it all for ages.

Yes, you've lost me.

Why are we adding cheese?

Tastes good.

Why not?

Because I like need it to be like clean and tasteless.

We wouldn't make it cheesy mash.

Right.

I wouldn't add so much cheese that you taste the cheese in it.

It just kind of merely adds.

Oh, that's weird.

It just adds to the kind of like.

So it's a seasoning.

Because cheese is this.

No, no, no.

I'm still like going pretty hardcore, but it's like it's so integrated in the flavour.

You wouldn't even eat it and go, this is cheesy mash.

It's just like so creamy, super creamy mash.

Yeah, it does sound pretty great.

My Irish auntie Tessa makes it really white with a lot of black pepper, but it tastes so creamy.

I think French mashed potato can be a little bit too buttery, sometimes a bit too yellow.

I like it white and whipped, like whipped potatoes.

I know what you mean, especially if you're having it with something like mince, you want that to, they sort of offset each other.

but i love that french stuff i think it's is it allegotte the stuff that's like half cheese half potato basically and it's like wallpaper paste thickness it's just like it's so good oh yes yes yes yes yes i can't even explain that texture right it's crazy oh my god what restaurant used to have that i think it was um balance used to have that in soho

I was there for very different reasons than other people.

I was there for the potatoes.

Eating mashed potato at four o'clock in the morning.

Well, everyone else wasn't hungry for some reason.

Yeah, well, everyone else didn't fancy any food.

I was like, the mashed potatoes here are really good.

I went on a,

in my late twenties, a bit depressed, not really working, and I decided to take myself on a tour in West London of all the greatest places to get mashed potato or spaghetti bolognese.

For Holland?

In one day?

No, no, no, like over a few months.

If I I wasn't doing much, James, and I was like, another afternoon off.

I will go test the spaghetti bolognese in that amazing Italian cafe in Holland Park or that place in Notting Hill or I'll go a bit posher today.

And so I did a tour of mashed potato and spaghetti bolognese and it was great, but I got really fat.

Well,

have you pitched this as a travel show?

The mashed potato and spaghetti bolognese odds?

No, but there is something in like finding the perfect version of a dish.

Definitely.

Yes.

That's a show.

When was this?

Let me get my timeline sorted now.

Is this pre- or post-pop world?

Post-pop world, yeah.

So, pop world, you've done pop world with Simon, and now

15 to 21.

15 to 21, you did that, yeah.

Were you 15 when you started that?

Yeah, oh my god, I know, a little bit illegal, you'd think, but no.

And then, um, T4

sort of 19 to 27.

So, this was like the year after, and I was a bit like, what am I going to do with my life?

And I was like, well, I could just find the best for gay bonnets in the area.

So, were you having a breakdown?

Yes.

Could have been worse.

You've been on TV for over a decade since since you were 15.

You could have just completely got off the rails, but instead you ate loads of spaghetti bolognese and mashed potatoes.

To be fair.

Thank you, James.

That's good.

I think there was also some real stuff as well, but that was my sort of daily vibe.

That was my afternoons.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Okay.

Well, I dread to think what the evenings held then.

In that case.

By the time eight o'clock ran around, it was like, oh, fuck.

Well,

you've lined your stomach already.

I was ready.

It wasn't a wonderful time, but I think I was looking for comfort.

And that is where I find it in potatoes and pasta.

And I think, yeah, your main course, there's a lot of comfort to be had there as well.

And I do, we're making, we're

making fun of mints and tatties.

It does sound delicious.

I love mints.

My mum sent me a picture because she was filming in Scotland the other day.

And actually, when they're, because I've never had mints and tatties, well, like haggis and tatties, I've never had that.

And she sent me a picture, and there's like loads of interesting, like, look at that, like, there's a lot of sauce going on.

Yeah, it's like a cream sauce, right?

Right?

That's to me, that's quite an interesting addition.

So, who knows what kind of sauce we'll have at this main course, but probably something creamy and mushroom-y.

Is there somewhere where you've had mince and tatties that is the best mince and tatties you've ever had, and that you want it for your dream meal?

Or is it just a general wherever it's from, it'll always be comforting, and you don't mind where it's from?

No, I remember when I first had it, I was like eight and my dad is squatting some weird house in like South London.

And when you're young and when you're a kid and from West London, South London, I thought I was in a different country, I think.

And I felt a bit scared and a bit like, where are we?

And then he made me mints and tatties and I felt really loved and safe.

Great.

And he really knows how to make mashed potato.

Oh, does he?

So yeah, I didn't even really fucking think about that.

Yeah, I think it is, it was like the first meal I had from him.

And I was like, this is fucking great.

Because it was nothing like the stuff mum made.

So So it's kind of it's like comforting, warm, it makes you feel welcome.

I'm getting on board with this mints and tatties thing.

Oh,

thanks.

If you're into mints, go to the quality chop house.

I've never been.

Oh, it's one of my favorite restaurants in London, and they do do a dish, which they don't do it as regularly as they used to, but it's it's mints on toast, and it is just the best mints you'll ever taste on on a really nice bit of uh, I think it's sourdough or something like toast and a bit of like watercress with it.

It's it's phenomenal.

See, this is what I'm i'm talking about like meat bit of green carb that's my kind of restaurant quality chop house

yeah i've never been to this chop house place where is it it's in clerk and well oh no farrington yeah farrington yeah and it's opposite the eagle isn't it which was like that the first ever gastro pub which is bloody brilliant food but a bit too rich for me bit too many flavors for me yeah you're walking past that quality chop house was one of the i think the first place i went back to after the big lockdown when restaurants were open you could eat outside and i sat outside there with my friend paul and we had the biggest meal of all time and the first thing i ate there i was so excited to have restaurant food again i genuinely got goosebumps fair enough that's how excited i was it was so good who the hell's paul

paul sweeney okay yes who the hell great great story ed who the hell is paul yeah

paul sweeney is a dear friend and my nan james is barber does james get a bit um territorial with you yes But it's someone I haven't heard of, yeah.

Quite a lot of times.

You have heard of him?

Yeah, well, this is okay.

But initially, when Ed was saying that, I was like, I can't even think who this could be.

What is he on about?

So do you think you know every single one of Ed's friends and would be quite perturbed not to recognise a name?

Yeah, at Ed's wedding, I was satisfied that no one there was a surprise to me.

I knew them all.

I knew who they were.

That was fine.

That was the main agenda of your wedding, right?

James has got to know them.

We basically, when we sat down to do the guest list, we were like, the last thing we want on this day is to spook james yeah yes so there's a lot of people actually that we didn't invite because we were worried that james might freak out yeah good

i'm glad good i'm glad they didn't get invited paul could only come for the evening unfortunately because uh

oh that's nice you invited your barber to your wedding yeah lovely he's also a friend i would say friend before barber yeah yeah

i've not just invited him a barber to my wedding i wasn't running out of ideas so much that the guy cutting my hair.

I was like, well, you're busy next Thursday.

Your dream side dish.

Well, because you've already got the potatoes and stuff.

So I think you can throw in whatever you like, you know.

Also, your kind of like tendency towards plain stuff almost doesn't lend itself to science at all because that's overcomplicating things, isn't it?

No, because I love cauliflower cheese.

I'm just thinking, is that a bit rich with the meat?

Most people would say no, not at all.

Not even remotely.

That we formally enter their head.

The cauliflower cheese can make the meal too rich.

Yeah.

Yeah, but it's not a bird.

It's mints.

I'm imagining this meal being eaten in a prison.

I don't know why.

Yeah, we'll have some cauliflower cheese just to take it out of the prison setting and back into the cap.

This would genuinely be my last meal in prison.

Yeah.

And your first?

And you know what?

They wouldn't even need to nip out and do any shopping if you asked for this.

I'm right.

Go and ask Mikita what her last meal is.

Oh, she's just said, we've got it all in.

We've got it all in the kitchen.

It was already on the menu.

Don't you have to change today's menu?

That's what we were already going to serve.

That's on the menu.

Just give her a bit of dinner for her last meal.

Oh, goal.

So when we come onto my pudding, it's...

God, I was not too prisony.

I can't wait.

That's the only time that's ever been said on the channel.

Southwest is going to be rice pudding or something.

Yeah.

No, don't preempt it.

Let's not preempt it.

How can you not love a classic English pudding?

And is it my fault that they want to give love and comfort to prisoners?

That's true.

Look, let's drill down into this.

How well do you think you could do in prison, Makiya?

I'm really scared of prison and I don't think I can last more than an hour.

We got ourselves a wimp.

We got ourselves a wimp here, Ed.

Was this

question posed to my mother?

No, we didn't get around to that.

It's actually not been posed to anyone before.

No one else has chosen prison food.

I don't think I could handle prison for more than an hour, 20 minutes.

What would your plan be?

Say you're going to prison, right?

For whatever reason, and you're on your way there now, and it's like for 10 years or something.

Thanks.

You've got to come up with a plan.

Yeah.

What's your plan to survive in prison?

To be

invaluable.

So I'd like work in the kitchen because I'd love the food.

So I'd work with the food.

I'd work in the laundry room.

I'd try and be a real doer because I am a real doer, which is why when I wasn't really working for the first time in my life, it went took myself on a spaghetti bolognese tour because I don't really know how to just sit still.

And when I'm not doing, I get into a weird headspace, and I would try and bring that doer to prison to survive.

That's good.

I like that answer.

That is good.

Yeah.

Oh, thank God, because that was quite the question.

Have you ever been in a cell?

I went to Dover Castle on a school trip, and you get to go in the cells there.

No, Ed.

I mean, like, thrown in a cell for bad behavior.

Not on a screen.

I was very naughty on the trip.

Yeah, but not not in a modern cell, no.

I wouldn't like to.

I'm scared of prison as well.

I like prison films and I like dramas in prison.

Do you?

See, I really don't.

That's how much I don't like prison.

I don't even really like to look at it.

Did you see that thing?

Oh, you definitely didn't.

Time, the Sean Bean, Stephen Graham drama that was on recently.

It does sound wonderful.

It is wonderful, but if you're scared of prison, that will absolutely shit you up.

There's a bit in it where

there's someone who they think is a grass, and what they do,

wait till you you hear this.

They boil up the kettle with loads of water in it and dump loads of sugar in it.

So it's like boiling sugar water and then throw it on someone.

It's absolutely horrifying.

Because then it sticks to you, doesn't it?

Yeah.

Yeah.

I would beat up Stephen Graham.

You would, or you could.

Both.

Yeah, but I don't know why you would.

He's like, actually, a really lovely guy.

Made fun of Ramesh on Jonathan Ross.

That's so sweet.

Is that because you just want to protect your friend?

Yes.

I think Stephen Graham could probably keep the shit out of you.

Well, we'll see.

Lovely guy, but like been through some stuff.

James, what's your plan for prison?

Okay, I would want to get through it without being hurt, but

I mean, nah, I probably would just sugarwater everybody.

Then you become a massive point of, you know, attack.

People come for you in prison and there's nowhere to go.

No, people would be like, he's mad.

Don't go near him.

Don't mess with him.

Don't go with a sugar water guy because you'd be the only sugar water guy to throw it on people and then chug the rest.

Yeah, and then drink it, loving it.

Look, look, look.

That's true.

My auntie did say that to me once.

If you ever feel in danger, act crazy.

That's what you're supposed to do, right?

In prison, you're supposed to go up to the biggest guy there as soon as you get in there and knock him out, right?

I do a similar thing.

I'm not very violent.

I'd go up to the biggest guy there and I'd be like, anything you need, just come and ask me.

Yeah.

You come ask for me.

Yeah, anything you need, I'll look after you.

You'd be all right.

I'll look after after you, mate.

I'm Ed, by the way.

Yeah.

Lovely to meet you.

I'm new here.

Cauliflower cheese is a side dish.

Lovely.

I was going to say, please, can we leave this meal alone now?

Because I'm not even happy about adding the cauliflower cheese.

Like, it's getting too busy.

You're not happy about that.

You don't want it.

You don't have to carry it.

Can you do your dream meal?

I don't want anyone to have their dream meal and not feel happy about it.

Okay, do you know what?

Then, if I'm having cauliflower cheese, then I have to have carrots because I need that orange to deal with all the white and brown.

Interesting.

This is very interesting.

Cauliflower cheese is getting too busy now i i i don't know why because i had prison initially and now i'm imagining you as the you know the old lady character in postman pat no mrs goggles

i'd imagine i'm imagining you eating like a little old lady puppet that sounds great no because i love dinners or meals in cartoons that are in English towns.

It's a very Postman Pat.

So just like classic things that are eaten every day for tea around the country.

So I bet me and Mrs.

What's her name?

Goggins.

Goggins would have a fucking right laugh.

It's like same menu.

So hold on.

You said you like meals from cartoons in little English towns.

Are there other examples of this?

Yeah, like Janet and Alan Alberg books.

There was always like a pie on the side with steam coming out of it.

And then if they ever were like...

Outside, there were always like really lovely green round lettuces.

Just like love a lettuce, but also I really love a picture of one.

You know, my favorite Janet and Ellen Elberg book is Burglar Bill, and at the end, Burglar Bill goes to prison and has sugar water thrown on him.

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There's the part of me that everyone sees.

I'm Howie Mandel, the comedian.

Apparently, I know what funny is.

Funny bought me a house, but I also know what isn't funny, OCD.

I've lived with...

OCD my entire life and people throw the term around like it's no big deal.

But OCD is severe, often debilitating.

It's a mental health condition that involves unrelented, unwanted thoughts that can make you question your character, your beliefs, even your safety.

General therapy can help with some things, but for OCD, it can actually make things worse.

That's why I want to tell you about No C D.

No CD is the world's largest treatment provider for OCD and is covered by insurance for over 155 million Americans.

Their licensed therapists specialize in ERP, the most effective treatment for OCD.

If you think you might be struggling with OCD, go to NOCD.com to book a free 15-minute call.

They are here to help.

The dream drink.

Oh, I love red wine.

I love red wine.

Me and Ed on the wine podcast, that was my first one.

So I was still learning to like only taste, not swallow.

Yeah, it's hard.

It is really difficult.

But now what happens is I finish and record, come home and I'm like, oh, let's have some wine.

I've just been tasting it for hours.

But yeah, I like, I would love to say I've learnt loads.

I think I have, but I just can't verbalize it.

But I feel like I'm learning every time we do it.

So what I have learned is that I like a very dark, full-body chestnutty wine, which is, as my lovely co-presenter has told me, a Sira.

So I love a Sirah.

And I'd love a big old glass of red wine with that Mince and Tatties meal.

I really love doing your wine podcast.

The spitting is very hard.

Dribbling down my chin.

And then even if you're spitting, you're still getting a bit of wine in there.

I was still like, I'm quite, I'm quite, I couldn't drive.

I find the spitting gross.

I'd refuse.

It's disgusting.

This is how you do it.

You get a spittoon and you have to speak.

No, disgusting.

And there's no way to elegantly do it.

I've been trying for weeks to, how do I do my spit?

And it's just not happening.

But James, people who are actually testing wines do have to spit.

So like I know someone who works at the Wine Society, he's a wine buyer.

So he might be up at 10 in the morning and have to taste 40 wines.

You're not going to...

Yeah, you can't be pissed.

You can't drink them.

I would swallow them all.

No, you wouldn't.

Yes, I would.

You'd be a dead man.

40 wines.

I would swallow them all.

Do you like wine then?

No.

No.

Not really.

You do.

And Ed, you do.

Yes, and so does James.

We've shared many a lovely bottle of wine over the years.

We have had nice.

I don't drink it very often.

In fact, I really only drink it when I'm around people like Ed who know what the good stuff is.

And then I'll just have a nice bottle of wine chosen by someone who knows more about wine than I do.

That's pretty much the only times I'll have it.

So what, twice a week?

Yeah, yeah.

I'm over every night.

He's calling me going, Ed, I need you to come over, man.

I need you to come be my wine cover.

I need it.

I need it.

Tell me what the good one is.

And that makes it less prison-y, prisony that you're not going to get a glass of Sirah.

That's true.

How big a glass are we talking?

Are we talking a big glass that's only filled up a little bit in like a wash wine?

Headphones have come off.

I can only assume going to get a glass.

But if she just doesn't come back, that'll be funny.

That's the

finally tipped a guest over the edge.

How big a glass?

Favourite wine glass.

Really nice and big.

Massive.

Absolutely massive.

Can you hold that next to your face, please?

Because the perspective at the minute looks like it's the size of...

I mean, that is the size of your face.

It's the size of my head.

Your face, but not your head.

It's the size of your face, but not your head, I'd say.

No, I would have it to about

halfway.

I don't like to full a glass, but that's why the glass is so big.

Half your face of wine.

So that's a big glass, anyway, and you're filling it half up.

That is still quite, I'd say, that's probably more than 250.

Okay, sorry.

There.

To the package.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

No, that's a good sign.

That's a bit polite, isn't it?

It's a bit more polite.

Well, you know how I feel about a vessel?

Yeah.

I like this because it's big.

You could do the rolling that Will's taught me.

Swirling around, yeah.

Put your nose in there.

And it feels just like a decadent thing, which kind of perks up a Tuesday evening.

Yeah.

And I noticed, you know, you bought it here and it's completely clean.

Of course it's clean.

Well, you might have bought it here and it was like you clearly had it last night and not washed it up yet, you know.

I did have a glass in this last night.

But I, God, I'm becoming so uptight with vessels that I've started to feel like every glass of wine has to be from a different glass.

Oh, so okay, this vessel thing is fucking out of control.

Yeah.

Also, just using the term vessels all the time just shows how obsessed you are with it.

So you will have a glass of wine in that and then if you choose to have a second glass of wine, you will want to change glasses.

Yeah.

Even if it's from the same bottle.

Yeah, it's more about like, I don't, the glass then feels a bit grubby.

Right.

Do you think it's because it feels like you're having your first glass again?

Maybe.

Get that first hit.

Yeah.

Maybe.

No, it's not because of that.

It's because

you think it's dirty.

dirty you think you made it dirty with the same wine i do it was all in a bottle together a minute ago you put some of it in that clean glass and drank it and now you don't want to put any more in there because then it's dirty no because then there's some up the sides from where you've drank it so it just it looks stained right but like you know it probably stops you from having more than three glasses because i can't keep you changing glasses but then you wash them all up that you wash them up yeah if i say it on this i'd probably drink a bottle you know what i mean so it probably tempers the evening we can try and put that positive spin on it where did this start well that's only in about the last sort of four years i think that's more since my parents have had establishments okay so every time you get a drink you get a new glass and we've spent a lot of time working in their establishments filming in their establishments so i kind of got to be used to service

rather than just having a drink at home.

Oh, so now when you're alone at home having a drink, you see yourself as your own waiter.

As my own bar back, yeah.

Yeah, okay, yeah.

That's interesting.

So basically, so if you have more than a few glasses of wine, someone would walk into your house and go, oh, I didn't know you had people over last night, Mikita.

Just like loads of empty glasses everywhere.

Yeah, I am constantly washing glasses.

What do you think about this that I noticed about myself this week?

And I think this will absolutely revolt you.

I go to bed with a glass of water

on my bedside, might have a few sips of it during the night wake up in the morning finish the glass then will often then top that glass up with more water and and and and have a glass of water in the morning so it's been there all night long with this water in it oh oh oh oh i finished it in the morning and then with the same glass i have a glass of water no way see this

that's a glass of water there you're holding like like like it's simba yeah and if it gets even a little bit i'd probably change this like the glass of water i have all day working from home i probably change this about four times a day wow and have a new glass each time Listen to this, Mickey.

Now and again, I'll have like a bottle of water next to my bed, like just of tap water.

And sometimes I'll get into bed if I'm a bit pissed or whatever.

I'll be like, oh, fuck, I need water in the middle of the night and I'll drink it.

I don't even know how long that's been there for.

Maybe fucking hour.

Maybe even like a week.

Sweating, sweating in that plastic.

Does that even feel like a good thing when it hits the back of your throat?

Feels like end of party water.

I don't mind that.

What are you drinking that water out of?

I noticed that.

That's a wine glass.

Oh.

Well, this is a cider glass.

Oh, that's all kinds of fucked up.

A big cider glass and I'm drinking water out of it.

How about this, Makita?

Sometimes I'll go down to the bottle bank in the car park and I'll stick my arm in there and I'll rummage around until I find a bottle and then I'll pull it out and then I'll just drink the dregs of whatever was in there.

That's fine.

That's looking after the planet.

How about this Makita?

Sometimes if I'm thirsty, I just get a straw and I drink straight out of a puddle.

Okay.

No.

How do you feel about that?

Genuinely making me feel sick.

How do you feel about this, Mikita?

Sometimes I'll hide in like a really posh person's bathroom and I'll wait until they've gone to the toilet and they're using the B-Day and then as soon as they turn the B-Day on I just dart my head in between their butt and the B-day and I lap out of the B-day water.

Yeah, that's totally fine.

That's totally fine.

I think that mirrors your existence.

I think the way we consume water mirrors our lifestyles.

Mikita, how about this?

Sometimes, if I'm really thirsty when I'm out and about, I just pay a stranger to spit in my mouth.

How do you feel about that?

Yeah,

I think that all these sound like they make sense to who you are and where you're coming from.

So I'll drink out of my clean glass and you guys just fuck around with all your dirty stuff.

Your dessert.

It's pretty simple.

Apple crumble, cold single cream.

The crumble has to be hot and I like it to have sultanas in it, and it have quite a lot of sauce.

And I like the crumble to not be too crumbly.

I'd almost like it to be a bit more like dough-like.

And then cold cream, but I would say probably a jug of cream to myself.

I don't like running out of cream.

I like a lot of cream, and it has to be really cold.

And I prefer single.

Maybe this much cream?

No, two of these.

Two wine glasses.

Two face wine glasses full of cream.

Big time.

And are you using all of that?

Yeah, I'd like it to be a bowl of cream with the crumble in the middle.

but it was really a bowl of cream with an addition.

Right.

Personally, that's too much cream, I'd say.

No, no, no, no, no.

Because I hate when it gets dry, and it doesn't take many mouthfuls to run out of cream.

If you're talking about cream that you get in a restaurant, you get enough for like three mouthfuls.

Well, yeah, okay, I understand that.

I asked for an extra jug often.

Really?

When out.

I would never have single cream with crumble anyway.

Would you have custard?

Ice cream.

Ice cream on crumble.

No?

No.

I need it to be gentler than that.

Like a Midsummer Murders dessert.

You know, what would they eat in the village hall?

The fuck is wrong with you?

I mean, this is.

That is actually it.

That's it.

It's like, what would they eat in like the village where Miss Marfa is?

And that's how I plan my meals.

It's mad.

How has this happened?

This is in direct relation to having a fancy chef mum.

Yeah, but your mum runs a Caribbean, your mum runs a Caribbean restaurant.

Exactly.

And I'm sick of that chicken.

It's beautiful.

It's beautiful.

But I've eaten it my whole life.

Her food is incredible, but it really is.

And it makes people happy.

And what she does with the sort of alchemy of her cooking, I think it's extraordinary.

But when it comes to what I want to eat, I just want to eat pie and crumble and cream and gravy.

I'll say that I would go custard first choice, then ice cream, then double cream, then single cream, then squirty squirty cream bottom.

If we're talking about apple crumble.

Creme frache.

Where are you putting creme frache?

Oh, I put creme frache above double cream.

Wow.

I'd say the same, probably.

I don't really like double cream, so it's too intense, obviously.

Of course, yeah.

From the woman who said that she finds sparkling water too intense, that's not a surprise.

Can I just say, in every other area of my life, I'm funky as hell.

I can dance,

I can talk to people.

But when it comes to my food taste, yeah, I'm a boring bitch.

No, no one who is funky as hell has ever said, I'm funky as hell.

No.

I've never had to profess it in such retaliation before, but I was like, I should probably let them know that I am actually a cool motherfucker.

Yeah.

It's just what I like to eat.

So you've got that amount of cream.

Are you like having it like you take a spoonful of crumble?

And then you put the cream on each spoonful.

Yes, I do do that, actually.

I do do that.

So there's the bowl of cream, the apple crumble, and then spoon, and then, yeah, a little jerk.

yeah so every mouthful's got a bit yeah yeah that's not that that's a bit new i've only been doing that in the last few years yeah you know what for me saves this dessert because that apple crumble is nice anyway i wouldn't have it with a single cream but the sultanas and the apple crumble really make it for me yeah i think that's essential in an apple crumble i definitely want that and not always there no not always there i think it takes it out of the school dinner frame but then if you're talking about puddings in general like god i used to love school dinners puddings like i love just like cake and custard from school dinners And I love that sometimes it was chocolate cake with chocolate custard.

Yeah, that was good, but I imagine that your schools have better school dinners than me I went to some pretty shitty schools.

No, my

that sounds like my schools

Okay, yeah, I actually had a pat lunch

My mum would do me pat lunch, but when I was older I worked in a school as a classroom assistant and I would sometimes have the because you'd be on lunch duty with the kids and you'd have to have dinner with them because they were autistic kids.

so you had to like uh if you were assigned a certain kid for the day you had to go to uh have school dinners with him and uh so it's like the first time in my life i was having school dinners was like when i was like in my mid-20s working in that school and i would find myself not verbalizing it or saying it to any of the other teachers but like thinking I really hope it's chocolate cake and chocolate custard thing.

Yeah.

I'd be quite excited about it.

You get into the rhythm of like, oh God, I wonder what it is today.

Yeah.

I do love that.

And I think that's because i never had so you know some families are like wednesdays brangers and mash fridays fish and chips my mum was never like that and i i really like structure and order no

and when you're eating the apple crumble every time you take a spoonful do you have to then go and get a clean spoon for the next one good question

no yeah but that's in your head now

i'm just thinking Can I give myself a bowl?

I'll go have four teaspoons.

Yeah, that's quite good.

Four big spoons.

That would be beautiful.

That would be beautiful.

And then every bite's your first bite i think that is what it's about it's like that first hit of something and it's like trying to recreate that but you can't really no i think he's got you there that's going to be in your head now mikita if you start doing that at that point will you acknowledge that you've got a problem

yes and only then yes i will so do we like my meal at all now well I'll read it back to you.

Okay.

And let's see how we all feel about this.

Yeah.

Okay.

We'll see how you feel about it, Mikita.

Most of all, that's the most important thing.

You're the one eating it.

It's your dream meal.

Okay.

Water.

You want still Brita filtered water.

Poplars or bread?

Nutty brown bread with butter.

Starter.

A really good salad with raticchio, parsley, watercress with the Oliver family oysters.

Main course.

Mints and tatties with creamy, mushroomy sauce.

Oh, yeah.

Side dish of cauliflower cheese and carrots.

Although, from what I gather, you can take or leave that.

You'd rather it wasn't there.

It's more important about the peas.

You want the peas to be with the main course as well.

Yeah.

Yes.

Drink, big glass of syrup, red wine.

Yeah.

Dessert, hot apple crumble with sultanas and a jug or two jugs of cold single cream.

Yeah.

Yes.

What a party.

It's not a party, though, is it, Mikita?

It's awake if it's a party.

Do you know what it is?

It's tea.

Look, I do quite like the sound of this.

I think I can imagine if it's cold outside.

you know as it is at the moment exciting like food that loves you from within and also i just love the i love the idea that there's probably in this country five million other people having the same dinner as me.

I just love that.

I love that we have like our five or ten things that just in this country you just would have for dinner like bangs of mouse spaghetti bolets, shepherd's pie, fish pie, just like the classics.

So when you're eating a meal like that you like to think about all the other people eating it.

I think I was brought up in a single parent household with not much structure.

So I liked telly and comfort food.

I like things that made me feel connected to the country around me, not the world.

This is actually quite Britain-specific.

And that's why I always liked tea stenders because I loved that it was on at eight o'clock and I knew that everyone would sit down at eight and watch it with their tea.

Did you like it when you would like, you know, present pop world, same time every morning?

T4?

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

There was definitely no coincidence that the first job I had sort of marked the weekend.

T4 really cemented it as like you are part of everyone's weekend.

To this day, people still say, like, you know, you would watch you growing up.

I think there was a part of me that loved that sort of inserting myself into the structure of the country and the rhythm of the country.

And I know that it sounds like we've gone off on a tangent, but that is, I know that's what I'm looking for when I go to the cafe.

Yeah.

Or I make that kind of food at home or ask mum to make it for me.

I think you might have convinced me, you know.

Look, we've given you a hard time, but genuinely, I can't really pick any faults with oh, I would enjoy this meal.

Absolutely, I would enjoy it.

And there's been much worse menus on this podcast, including Simon Amstel's.

Because Simon hates food.

Yes, thank you.

This is what we thought.

This is what we suspected.

Makita, thank you so much for coming to the Dream Restaurant.

I think you've convinced us to the ways of mints and tatties.

Not James.

I'm one over.

I would eat that.

I've got bad news, Makita, for the end of the podcast.

You're going to prison.

Good luck.

This is the twist of this episode.

Yeah.

We've got the police wagon waiting for you outside.

I do one night in prison for this meal.

Cool.

Which prison?

Oh, uh,

God.

Probably one of the countryside ones.

Yeah, gotta be right.

Oh, yeah, for the view.

For the view.

Yeah.

Thank you very much, Mikita.

Thank you.

Thank you, Mikita.

It's been a pleasure.

Well, there we go.

I think she convinced us, James, menu-wise.

Sometimes it's nice to be won over and to have your mind changed, isn't it?

Yes, it is.

Thank you, James.

Would that be a lesson to everyone?

And thank you very much to Makita as well for coming on the podcast.

You were great.

Makita's podcast, Wine Times, is well worth a listen.

I myself have been on it, but lots of other guests have been on it as well, and loads more still to come.

So do go and check that out wherever you get your podcasts, James.

Thank you, Makita, for not saying the secret ingredient as well.

Chicken's ass.

Yes, no chicken's ass, not a chicken's ass in sight.

Mentioned the roast chicken at one point.

Mentioned

the chicken.

I thought.

Yeah, uh-oh, is she going around to the ass?

Is there going to be a little reach around?

But no.

I'm on tour, James.

Congrats.

In February.

I'm going all over the place.

I've got a new stand-up show called Electric.

I'm very much enjoying putting it together, having a lot of fun, and can't wait to show it to everyone.

Edgamble.co.uk for tickets.

I should be coming to a town relatively near you.

It's going to be great.

Ed's been telling me loads of little bits and and bobs from it.

And it sounds very funny.

Yeah, I'm a cop in it.

I'm an undercover cop.

What the f- What?

I'm an undercover cop in it, James.

But I don't mention it, unlike some undercover cops.

Yeah, so only you know.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

But I would never, ever, as an undercover cop, say on stage that I'm an undercover cop because then what the fuck is the point of that character?

Yeah, absolutely.

And if you did do that, I think audience members would be well within their rights to shout out, not a very good one then, and stuff like that at you every now and again, thinking that they're being very funny.

They would be well within their rights, and you would deserve it every time that happened.

I don't think they're being funny in that situation, James.

I would think that's very accurate.

Well done.

They're pointing out the line.

You spotted a major flaw there.

Yep.

And it would always be men.

over 50 are always the one who shout that out, aren't they?

They're always the one there.

It would always be a man over 50 would go, can't be a very good one then, mate.

And everyone laughs.

Well, no, actually.

No, it makes the gig very awkward right out the gate.

Okay, well, I'm definitely not going to mention that I'm an undercover cop then.

Yeah, don't mention it.

Too busy talking about bake-off and being sad.

That's the problem with my show.

I've heard a lot of stuff about being sad and doing bake-off.

Oh, no.

God bless you.

Oh, I did bake off.

I did bake-off and I was tired.

You know, that sort of thing.

That's what I'm going to do.

Yep,

they're the two types of routines.

We all know that.

Pretending to be an

undercover cop.

Or saying you were on bake-off and you were sad.

Yeah, exactly.

um no but my tour is on sale now and it's edgamble.co.uk for tickets so do do buy a ticket for god's sake it's my livelihood

it's got a cat to support what got a cat to support come on what about pig think about little pig um anything you want to plug james go on yes uh don't forget to tweet at off menu official with your intro for this week's podcast hey there mr benito i've got an intro for you oh and then whatever it was that ed said it was take the the cocoa pops of conversation pouring over the cold milk of humor, and oh God.

So, remove the old God and then finish it off.

I'm so tired.

He's so tired.

Look how tired he is.

I'm so tired.

He's tired.

He's hungover.

I got absolutely blasted last night.

I didn't eat dinner and then had two vodkas before we went out.

Yeah.

And then drank four pints when we were doing karaoke.

And now I'm absolutely obliterated.

Yes.

And I've got to go out for dinner tonight with someone who famously drinks.

Oh man.

I was fine for recording.

Look, we recorded two this morning.

We recorded this one with McKees and we recorded one that you would have heard last week, I think.

And that went fine because I hadn't eaten much.

Now then I went downstairs after we recorded it and I ate some bread and some cheese and some ham and then a big slice of a spooky spooky Colin cake.

Yeah.

Spooky Colin the Caterpillar.

Yeah.

And now I feel awful.

What's the difference when he's spooky?

Well, I don't know.

I just hate it.

Look at this guy.

He had a bone on it or something.

Who is this?

Imagine if you were like this every week.

Well, it wouldn't last, would it?

The podcast wouldn't last.

No, we wouldn't have got off the ground.

But it's fun to have it now, though.

It's a welcome change this week.

I quite like it.

Well, and we've got to, I mean, another little peek behind the curtain.

We've got to record some ads now.

Yeah, we've now got to record some ads.

So they'll be playing for months in advance.

So I'd imagine you'll be reminded of this moment in a few months when you hear an advert of me being sick.

Yeah, yeah, I mean, how depressed he sounds.

And like, being, oh, this is odd.

In this ad, James seems to be doing the majority of the admin and the actual important stuff ahead.

He's been just grumbling and moaning for now.

Oh, man.

Oh, well.

Well, it was a good episode, though.

It was a good episode.

And I think this has been a brilliant ending.

I'm very happy with this.

Very good stuff.

Okay, bye.

Bye.

Bye, everyone.

If you enjoyed this podcast, can I interest you in a totally different podcast that's not about food and doesn't have James A Caster or Ed Gamble, but I would say is quite fun.

No, thank you.

Oh, okay, not to worry.

If you change your mind at a later date, it's called Nobody Panic.

Right.

It's hosted by me, Tessa Coates, and my friend Stevie Martin.

Which is weirdly me.

And we tackle all kinds of how-tos from big things to small things.

How to stop saying sorry, how to poo, how to break up with someone, how to quit your job, how to relax, how to have a conversation, how to deal with unrequited love.

A smorgasbord of thing.

Absolutely.

We have a nice time.

People seem to like it.

If you like, you can come and see what all the fuss is about.

All that fuss.

What's it called?

Nobody panic.

You can find it on all of the podcast apps that you would imagine it would be on.

Please have a listen.

We get it.

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Oh, hi, James.

Have you heard the news?

Oh, yeah.

Go on.

You and I are modern boys because the Off Menu podcast is now on YouTube.

This is embarrassing.

Why is it embarrassing, man?

You love YouTube.

I love watching clips on YouTube.

Sure.

Now people can watch clips of Off Menu on YouTube and full episodes.

But it's embarrassing, man.

It's not embarrassing at all it's really cool we're on youtube with the great and good the coolest people in the world are on youtube me you logan paul who's logan paul the dad from succession at off menu podcast that's what benito's calling us now and we're on tick tock this is embarrassing man it's not embarrassing man we're cool we're like olivia rodrigo and ed people have been asking us battering us bothering us actually they want to watch the stephen graham super cut from the stephen graham episodes they can see all of his reactions to us, everything that he did.

Oh, Benito has bent to their whims and he's going to put it on YouTube.

He's going to do it.

Follow us at Off Menu Official on TikTok at Off Menu Podcast.

On YouTube, you can watch clips from the podcast.

And on YouTube, you can watch full video episodes.

People have been asking for it and you're finally getting it.

Full video episodes.

So you can see every single nuance on our little faces.