My Friend Mary Orton: Wednesday, April 17th, 2024

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Good morning, Millennials.

Welcome back to the toast.

I am in studio at home with my friend Mary Orton.

She's a foreign name wonder now.

I think that we have to probably

at the start here address the elephant in the room that Claudia and I are mortal enemies.

Right.

And for anyone who is just

starting to learn about this saga today,

it is because I had the audacity to befriend Jackie.

And understandably, that is unacceptable to her.

If I were your sister, I too would not allow you to have friends.

But

I think if we're all being honest with each other, we know that Claudia would beat the shit out of me in a street fight right like i would have no shot so i don't know i could see a scrappy mary orton coming through well well my question is um can you digitally alter my voice and blur my face for this for this it's an anonymous

anonymity this is dangerous work yeah yeah and then otherwise i was thinking we could brainstorm like for the title you could do something like um

like mary orton is absolutely not the co-host of of this podcast.

Just to like throw, you know, something so

throw her off.

I'll tell her, like, Mary Orton canceled.

I did a solo pod.

Like, it's kind of boring.

You don't want to listen.

Maybe like a listener could story it and just be like, at girl with no job, like, don't listen today.

It sucked.

Yeah.

Also, Mary Orton was not the co-host.

That would be helpful, I'm thinking.

No, my friend Mary Orton is the title of today's episode because that is just your name now.

I can't say it

another way.

And I know you have your husband's last name too.

yes scudalari

thankfully thankfully it's pronounced scudalari scudalari because otherwise i would be mary scudalari and actually mary funny enough then you mean my friend mary scudalari right that did not occur to me until i got a dm from a follower who was like oh now i understand why you didn't change your handle and i was like what that's such a random thing to message somebody and then and then she like expanded upon that and and said like because your first and last name rhyme and i was like no but your first name's Mary Orton my first name is Mary Orton all one word last name Scudolari thank God got it but what do you go by mostly Mary Orton yeah yeah I mean like professionally I still do yeah and then

and then in like personal life mom mode I'm like Mary Scudalari same as me we have so much in common Claudia

Well, I'm so excited that you're here because the genesis of our friendship and also like us discovering each other on the internet.

I feel like we kind of come from different spheres of the internet.

So I'm so excited for the toasters to get to know Mary Orton, even though the toasters who already know you are so excited that you're here.

Oh my gosh.

And I'm excited for the Ortonites to listen to the toast.

Hi guys.

Well, I have to say, I, and I told you this, I...

like discovered the podcast about 18 months ago and I wish I could remember who like somebody must have posted it to their stories.

I don't remember who because I would like to find them and kiss them on the mouth because they like I am so obsessed with the podcast I listen every day.

I should probably play it cool like like oh the toaster podcast like

I'm pretty busy and important so like I don't listen, but it's about two brothers, right?

But no, I love the podcast so much and I like

I'm living every toaster's dream right now co-hosting with you.

And so I have to, I think I have hair all over me.

I have to thank you.

Like you bring so much joy.

This podcast is such a bright light.

And I've told you that before, but I really mean it.

It sounds like a throwaway comment, but I just, it's such a like wonderful thing to pop on every day and know that you guys are bringing like energy and fun and happiness.

And I just love it so much.

So thank you.

Thank you so much.

That's what Claudia and I like to think that we do and believe that we do.

But then when we get that positive reinforcement, especially from people that we know, like it.

it means a lot and we're gonna keep on trekking.

Oh my gosh.

Well, no, when you when you texted me and asked me to co-host, first of all, it was on April Fool's.

So I was like, oh, oh, that's where we are.

You have a lot of April Fool's trauma.

I have a lot of April Fool's trauma.

So I immediately was like, oh, that's where we are in our friendship.

We're

playing mean April Fool's jokes on each other.

You're going to be like, Mary, you want to co-host?

And I'm going to be like, of course.

And you're going to be like, ha, gotcha.

I would never ask you.

But then when you said it wasn't an April Fool's joke, I was like, oh.

So she's either texting the wrong person or she's being held at gunpoint.

Was it my mom, by the way?

It doesn't matter.

I'm honored to be here.

I'm so excited to have you.

You are, actually, I was thinking this morning, you're the first guest co-host that we've had on in a while.

That's like a first-timer.

Because everyone else that I have this week has been on the show

in one way or another, maybe not co-hosting, but as a guest or guested with Claudia.

And this is like a Mary Orton first-time experience.

And is everybody else a podcaster?

So I'm

Josh.

Yeah.

Shannon.

Yeah.

Lauren Elizabeth, former podcaster.

Okay.

Stasi podcaster.

So I'm the loser in the middle.

Well, it makes sense.

It's going to be like, hi, Monday, Tuesday, and then it's going to.

And then Thursday, Friday.

No, Wednesday's like always pretty good news.

But it begs the question.

Like, the influencer to podcaster pipeline is a direct flight.

Okay.

So why have you never considered podcasting?

Because also your content is very talky.

Like we hear from you.

Yeah, I don't know.

I've never, I mean, I think like as someone who creates content, what you guys do is so hard.

I don't think the people like civilian non-content creators understand how hard it is, how the lay people,

I don't know if they understand how hard it is to do what you do and do this every day and talk and have interesting things to say every single day.

I mean, you guys have, if there's anybody watching for the first time.

An Ortonite.

An Ortonite

who is not a regular toast listener, like you must come back next week when Claudia is back and see Original Recipe Jackson Claude because it is amazing.

Actually, because I am such a regular listener, when my daughter was born,

I'm pretty sure she came out of the womb and looked at me and was like, who the hell are you?

Like, where's Jackson Claude?

Like, because she's heard your voice so many times in utero.

So that was very disappointing for her.

Oh, yeah.

So you found out who her parents were.

Yeah.

You're a content creator and a mama of three.

Busy bee.

Yes.

Yes.

And we are right on the heels of teething hell.

I have not slept in two weeks.

Oh, damn.

How many teeth?

So she's got the bottom two.

My kids have been slow teethers.

So she's nine months and she's just getting the top two.

That's what's like ready to break through and it has been hell for her.

I mean she's been poor thing has been in so much pain which is very different than my first two kids.

Like my first kid was what we call a trick baby.

She like never had teething issues.

She slept really well.

She ate really well all the things.

So you think all babies are like that?

So yeah.

So she tricked us into having more children and

we fell for it and now we have three and and really like all three of my kids have been so so good and easy and healthy and whatever.

So no major complaints, but this was the first like real challenging teething experience where we were like

like are we sure there aren't more drugs we can give this child?

Yeah.

It's just so bad, but

but I'm here.

You're here and I'm so excited that you're here.

And it's so crazy that you also like are nine months postpartum.

Yeah.

How's that going?

It's going going well it's um it's going well the

i i feel like the older two are my oldest is four and then middle liza just um turned three and they're in a sweet spot where they're like besties and can play independently with each other and so that's really nice yeah we had one single week when Liza, our middle, was potty trained.

We potty trained her the week before I had my third.

So we had one gorgeous, immaculate week with no diapers.

And then we were right back into it.

So

it's been a journey.

As you well know.

How close are your first two in age?

18 months.

Oh, wow.

Yeah.

What are our 18 months?

Oh, they are.

Yeah, exactly.

Oh, my gosh.

Okay.

So you know the whole like

two and diaper thing.

It's just.

Yeah.

I can't imagine like no diapers.

Yeah.

But you'll like, you know, in a, in a few months, you'll see it too where like Harry and Charlie will be besties and they'll be like doing legos together and you and zach will sit back and be like wait we can just supervise yeah we don't have to get in the pen yes no i'm that's going to be a major milestone yes that's been really very exciting for us yeah well i'm excited for you i'm so excited that you're here and now can you tell me about the genesis of mary orton because we we went to lunch yeah we lunched ladies who lunch

And I feel like we were talking about the beginning of your career, but you're kind of like an OG.

Yeah.

I want to say influencer, but I feel like when you started, started, that wasn't the term.

It was more like blogger, fashion blogger, girly.

Yes.

Yes.

I definitely started

in the blogosphere.

And I always say like starting a blog was the most out of character thing I've ever done.

Like what I do now is like,

I would have never, ever, ever imagined.

I was working for an investment bank.

And I remember a colleague of mine talking about

fashion blogs.

And I was like, what the hell is a fashion blog like and then i'm looking them up and i'm like who the hell are these women like putting pictures of themselves on the internet that's so embarrassing actually side note i was telling this story to someone recently at a lunch and there was a gen zier at the table and she was like wait what's embarrassing and i was like well like putting pictures of yourself on the internet is just like an objectively humiliating thing to do and she was like

Well, now that's Dave Rigue.

And I was like, oh my gosh, you're like 23 and you don't remember a time before selfies.

Yeah.

You don't remember a time when it was not normal to be like.

You just like take your pictures and put them in your photo.

Right, right, right.

And so anyway, so yeah, so I started

way back in like 2013, a blog and I was interested in kind of speaking to my demographic that I didn't feel was being spoken to, which was like young urban professional.

women who wanted to figure out how to infuse style into their working life.

And at the time,

I thought, okay, I'm fascinated by these fashion blogs.

I'm fascinated by the ways in which they're disrupting the landscape of fashion and retail marketing.

But I cannot put pictures of myself on the internet.

And I remember telling my husband and my best friend about this, and I was like, I'll just crop my head off.

If we're like, I'll just do mostly writing.

And then if I have to show anybody like clothes on me, I'll just crop my head off and they were they were looking at me like oh my god this is gonna like they're like they were watching a car crash yeah um so anyway so I started and that's what I did for the first nine months and somehow perhaps because like the blogosphere was in its infancy the blog did well and then no head headless

fully headless and anonymous

that being extremely cool though anonymous like who is this what was your blog called it it was it's been memorandum since um like 2014.

memorandum like Who is she?

Where is she?

It's giving gossip girl.

Well, except like not at all cool.

Like the sloppy crop of the point and shoot camera photos was a real tragedy.

But then I had the opportunity to work with one of my favorite brands and they were like, we'd love to work with you, but this whole like headless horseman thing is probably not

going to be.

Okay with us.

And so I had to put my face in photos and I don't think I slept for a month.

I was like so mortified.

Yeah, yeah but at least you were doing it from a place of success like you had it yeah it wasn't like you were really putting yourself out there to zero people yet like trying you know at least you had that platform a little bit where it's like yeah people care

maybe yeah so so that was kind of do you still feel that way like yeah i mean hammer shy yeah i think so like taking photos has never felt normal.

How do you feel?

Are you just so used to it and you feel?

No, like when I step out and I ask my husband to take pictures of me, like it is a deeply uncomfortable experience.

Right.

And I feel like I've, I don't do it as much right now because I don't step out so much right now.

But I feel like even when I was chewing, even in my heyday, like if we're going to dinner, like, I want you to take a few pics of me.

I'm dying inside the entire time.

If we didn't get the picture, I'm moving on from it.

Right.

It'll only ruin my night, but I'm not going to spend a long time like trying to take pictures in public.

Like, and you can see me cringing in the photos.

Oh, totally.

And I'm sure you have the same same

war stories from

the years with your husband taking photos of you.

Yeah.

And I remember I will never forget we were in, I think, Washington Square Park in New York, and my husband was taking

photos.

And I realized after we had been taking photos for a couple minutes that I had a piece of hair that had like flown up and was like this.

And I'm looking at the photos and I'm like, are you kidding me?

And I'm like reading him the riot act in public.

And I mean, I'm not like yelling at him, but I'm just like, are you kidding me?

No, I've had this thing in front of my face.

I've been standing here like an idiot.

And I'm like going off.

Like, are you even looking at the pictures?

Yeah.

Do you even give a job?

Is this, am I a joke to you?

And then

does my work mean nothing to you?

You're right.

And then I look up at his face as I like pause mid-rant.

And he's going like this.

And I was like, are you having a stroke?

And then I look to my right, and there's a girl standing there and was like, hi, I'm so sorry to interrupt.

I just wanted to say I follow you.

And I'm like, I love what you thought you were great.

And

now I'm feeling unsafe.

So I'm going to go now.

You know, like, she just, like, this poor thing, her face haunts me forever because of that moment.

So.

No, it's such a vulnerable moment when you're asking someone to take your picture and you're putting yourself out there.

And like, there just needs to be this like understood social contract that like, you're looking out for me.

Yes.

I'm feeling unsafe and vulnerable.

And whatever I say in those moments, I don't mean it.

Yes.

And yes, my husband is a true

PJOM extraordinaire and did not leave me after that.

Yeah.

The photo taking husbands are PJOMs.

Does he now know your angle?

Like, is he now a pro at it?

Now he's a pro.

Yeah.

Now he's a pro and it's like, boom, done.

And he always makes sure I don't have like a weird mohawk coming up from behind.

Oh, that's good.

So yeah.

So we've really, we've grown a lot together.

That's beautiful.

It really is.

That is really beautiful.

It's really special.

Okay, so you started as a fashion blogger and now you're a major content creator.

I actually found your

profile from like one of your many viral reels where you were showing ladies how to wear us properly wear a scarf around their neck.

there were two videos i think one like i saw your profile for the first time i scanned it i was like okay nice but i hadn't like hit the follow yet yeah and then the second one was the turtleneck video showing us how to actually wear a turtleneck yeah hold it in yes and i was like oh i need more tips like this in my life Oh, so since those videos, it's been very disappointing for you.

I wouldn't say so.

I've definitely, I definitely like tapped, like

shopped some tap to shop links.

oh wow definitely influence oh okay i like what i see oh

and then i feel like i started following you in the middle of your last pregnancy maybe and no idea you were pregnant and then you posted something that where it was like very you were talking about being pregnant i was like yeah oh i missed that

how nice and we were like pregnant similar yes timing

yeah i gave um yeah i gave birth to to gigi actually july 4th and then and then charlie was born august 14th yes okay i knew we were close yeah yeah

yeah

So that's been our friendship origin story.

Yes.

And then you're down in Florida a good amount.

So we got together a couple weeks ago.

We had lunch.

We're just simpatico.

Just simpatico until your sister kills me.

Right.

Right.

We fight to the death.

Yeah.

Well, Turdy, if you're listening, I still love you.

You know, you're my number one.

And no one will ever replace you, but my friend Mary Orton is, you know.

Never.

And seriously, anybody listening for the first time, like, like come back on Monday when Claudia is back.

Yay, yeah, yeah.

You'll see the real deal.

But now that's on me to convince them, you know, through this show that it's a show worth watching.

That's a lot of pressure, Jackie.

But you, I know you can rise to the challenge.

I'm taking a drink here and I'm so afraid of your listeners.

She's a real toaster.

She knows the drama.

Claudia's so good at this.

She pushes the camera.

She's pushing her mic away to take a sip of her ice.

I did make us iced coffees in, so here's the thing.

It's either going to be a noisy reusable glass or it's going to be a non-noisy single use cup pick your fighter yeah and you and you picked the um eco-conscious fighter today classic me classic jackie classic jacks being eco-conscious but i'm so i'm cracking off that you like know all of the ins and outs yes of the community drama no i am Yes, I am very much aware of these issues.

And I have never once, as a daily listener, i've never once noticed a click of a of a ice cube or a so like when you guys talk about it i'm like who are these people

giving these girls grief thank you mary orton we're talking for over an hour we get a sip of a cold beverage and do you not support women in hydration I don't support women in hydration, which is actually an amazing segue into the Fast Five stories today.

We have great stories.

We also have deer toasters and we're getting Mary Orton's advice.

So I have a feeling it's going to be a different brand of advice.

I don't know.

I don't know.

I'm excited.

I'm excited to hear what problems we have to face today.

It's very exciting.

We're going to help out our deer toasters and let's get into it.

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Okay, our first story today is a little bit, again, I feel like the leading story every day this week has been in one way or another, Taylor and Travis News.

However, today these stories are coming in separately.

Okay.

Because Taylor Swift, the Museum of the Tortured Poets Department Academy, which is her new album, which drops on Friday.

I don't know if you've realized that.

New Taylor album.

I didn't realize that.

I didn't realize that until yesterday.

Her Dead Poets Society album is dropping on Friday.

So she is in her pre-promo era.

And there's a bit of a tailored museum in LA that's presented by Spotify, where she's sharing lyrics and Easter eggs about the album, but they're also Easter eggs and...

hidden messages about her relationship with Joe Alwyn.

And this is in collaboration with her, so she's part of curating this.

Yes.

Like she gave like these, they're all like typed up on typewriters, like lyrics and motifs, I want to say.

And one strong motif that I've seen is like she is talking about this statue from the sixth century that was meant to be a gift.

It was like a statue of like fertility and womanhood.

And it never

was gifted and it kind of like decayed and rotted and decomposed.

Okay.

And like it's giving, you know, that was me in my relationship.

It's giving metaphor.

And I think what maybe she was saying is like, she was with Joe Alwin for six years, like no marriage, no kids.

Like I'm just like a woman decomposing over here.

Okay.

I actually had a dream last night that Taylor Swift had twins and she named them Olivia and Doreen.

And Doreen.

Doreen.

Is is does is there a Doreen in Taylor Swift folklore?

Doreen came from nowhere.

Olivia is at least like the name of her cat, Olivia Benson.

Olivia is just a gorgeous name.

It's a gorgeous name.

But then there was baby Doreen.

Yeah, I would have gone Olivia and

Jackie, Claudia, Cargo.

No,

those are some names off the top of my head that I would have chosen.

Usually I don't.

Share with Olivia?

Usually I don't share my dreams.

I'm not a dream sharer.

Like, can you find a more uninteresting topic?

But I like it.

It's germane to this story.

It is.

She had two baby twin twin girls with Travis.

Okay.

And we even got names, Olivia and Toreen.

Oh my gosh.

Can you imagine them having children?

I mean, yes.

So I am not a Taylor.

I'm not a Swifty,

but I, I,

and like you and I have talked about this.

I don't know when everybody hauled off and like listened to every deep track.

Yeah.

I said it was probably when you were having kids.

I feel like everyone was like passive fans up until the re-recordings.

I i want that's how i see it i feel like after reputation

and then like lover then like all these with the new albums there were so many easter eggs and then the vault tracks and people just like threw themselves down the rabbit hole but i also i feel the same way where it's like oh i've been a taylor swift fan for 15 years i love all of her music i actually know the words to all of her songs but i missed that i didn't get on that ride yeah yeah and that's where claudia like will call me a hater for that and i'm like i literally couldn't be more of a fan yeah no i have so much respect for Taylor and her fandom.

And I, I'm just, I'm, it's just like such a phenomenon to me.

I like want to study it.

Um, but I think the Easter egg thing is, it seems to me to be such like a dangerous thing because wouldn't that be exhausting to keep up?

Oh, it seems exhausting for her to like plant these things for people to keep up.

And then I would also be a little worried that people might misinterpret the eggs because it's not like a direct.

So what if people like got it wrong and everyone's like, Taylor said this?

And it's like, no, no, no, that's not what I was saying.

Like about the statue, even.

Yes, yes.

So that seems to me to be really just a lot to take on in perpetuity.

That you're always supposed to have like so many hidden meanings.

Yeah.

And I think

you want to just like walk into a room and say good morning.

Right.

No, it's coded.

And then people are like counting.

And that's, that I have to say is like, I have seen that on the interwebs of just people being like, okay,

she walked in and said good morning.

There are 17 letters in that phrase.

And 17 minus four is 13.

Like that.

It's giving QAnon.

It's giving QAnon.

You know what it reminds me of?

Did you ever read or watch the movie The Series of Unfortunate Events?

I know.

I know it.

I haven't seen it.

If you didn't read the books.

Okay, so there's like three kids.

They're all very gifted and they're like...

orphaned and they're going through turmoil.

And the oldest daughter like decodes stuff and like she'll see a letter and she's like count, like a written letter.

And she like pulls out like all the capitalizations and it's an anagram for like the secret that's what taylor swift is doing i'm sure she read those books too yes yeah count olaf it's giving count olaf yeah no that's and and by the way like quick side note i i know this has been discussed widely why must every children's show begin with like a dead mom or or just fully orphaned children why

it's a great question why are they always trying to kill us i don't i don't know i feel like people are aware of it especially disney especially disney always kill the mom People are aware of it, but they don't like question it.

Okay.

And I feel like it's shows that are at a certain age.

Like right now, like toddler shows, no, but like we were just watching the Lion King and the mom is irrelevant in The Lion King.

So that's a different problem.

Yeah, that's one of the dad

dad stories.

Spoiler alert.

Spoiler.

Sorry.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I just,

yeah, I feel like

even like the newer ones are doing that, like Frozen, of of course the ship yeah Moana No, but she still has to go out it's as if like the kids can't have mama dies right away right, but it's as if like the kids can't go on their like growth journey while under the foot of their parents, but it's like maybe we're not supposed to be going on our journey at 12 years old.

Yeah, has Harry wait Harry is how old?

Two.

He's okay.

So he he has not asked you about death yet.

No.

Okay.

When did your kids?

I think Coco,

like she's still, she's four and she still doesn't like totally know what it means.

She doesn't understand the finality of it.

Yeah.

So I shared this on my on my Instagram a couple weeks ago, but I was making her a grilled cheese for lunch and it was like a special treat and she was really excited.

And she said to me, mommy, I have not had grilled cheese in like 10 years.

And I said, wow, that's a really long time.

That's, you know, that's longer than you've been alive, sweetie.

And she turned green and said, was I dead?

It's a good question.

And I,

you know, like any good parent, just immediately distracted, immediately segued into something else so that I could avoid that difficult conversation with my child.

Yeah, because also I'm sure now like the movies that they're watching, there's, is that what you're saying?

Like you're watching those things where there's the, because even when we were watching Lion King, I skipped over that part because one, like not appropriate.

And two, we were just, we were just there for hakuna matada.

so i just like fast-forwarded two but it's definitely something that i've noticed and i'm like oh

we're not there yet yeah so she knows it's something dramatic but i don't think she understands the finality of it um so it's really it's been a fascinating time since she locked onto that and uh and it's also um it's also something that i think in like

you know, around Easter time when there's discussion about, you know, Jesus dying on the cross, that whole thing, they become really fixated on it because they're hearing about it in school, whatnot.

So it's...

It's been a wild ride in my house.

Yeah, that's...

Let's talk.

I feel like that's one of a couple of hard conversations as a parent.

Yeah, yeah.

So I am looking into military boarding school.

But I don't even remember when I learned about it or how I learned about it.

I don't even just kind of ease into it.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It's a lot.

It's a lot.

That is.

That we signed up for.

It is a lot.

Well, that's actually a great segue into part B of our first story, which was Taylor and Travis News.

And that's that Travis will be hosting Are You Smarter Than a Fifth Grader?

It is confirmed.

We had talked about it a few weeks ago.

He was in talks, but Amazon's Prime Video is doing a spin-off game show called Are You Smarter Than a Celebrity?

So it will have adult contestants answering sixth grade level questions with the help of some famous faces.

They've ordered 20 episodes of the show hosted by Travis.

Okay,

this is exciting.

I think he'll be so good at this, right?

I think so too.

And it's like, are you smarter than a sixth grader, Travis?

And well, well, that's kind of the interesting thing because

not whether or not he's smarter than a sixth grader, but if you are like a celebrity who might need to go on those shows for like press and whatever, being the host is kind of great because you're never in the hot seat, right?

Yeah.

Well, let's kind of like

get out of jail free card.

It sounds like it would be a fun concept.

It will depend what celebrities they have on, but I feel like he's really affable and he likes to have a good time.

But hosting, I feel like they think anyone can host.

Claudia and I always say this.

And it's like, it's not just something anyone can do.

Like it is a skill.

Yes.

And he has a podcast.

So he might actually be skilled and ready for this and not a bad choice by any means.

But just because you're a celebrity or an actor or a singer, like doesn't mean that you're a host.

Yes.

And like justice for the hosts.

Yes.

That's their trade.

Yes.

For the

communications majors out there.

Justice for them.

Yeah.

They're just being erased.

Or like broadcast journalists.

Yeah.

I especially agree with you when you talk about this with regards to like interviews on red carpets.

Right.

Like the questions are so bad.

Yeah.

It's never interesting.

So nobody really watches those shows anymore.

Yeah, but like there are people they go to school for that.

That's their.

Let's hire them.

Let's hire them.

Let's do those ones.

Yeah.

Not the celebrity who has nothing to say.

Not that I would be good at that either, but let's find the expert.

Let's find the trained professional.

And this also makes me think, when was the last time this show was airing?

Because it was, it started out, Are You Smarter Than a Fifth Grader?

Yes.

It was on Fox, and I don't know when it ended.

In 2007, is when it started.

Oh, wow.

Okay.

Yeah.

This does make me sort of nostalgic for like when I was, I don't know, I guess in high school maybe, when it was like the height of those, of like who wants to be a millionaire.

And I kind of missed those days where everybody watched something.

Now there are so many game shows and so many streamers and everyone has their own thing, but there's not like the big one.

Right.

Well, what I, what I, I was having this conversation with a friend who works for one of the big streamers and I was watching, I'm forgetting what show it was, but it was one where they had the audacity to be dropping it on a weekly basis.

And I was saying to her, I was like,

no,

I haven't seen that.

Like,

don't kill me.

I haven't seen that one.

It's okay.

You came at a good time because now discussion has ended.

Yeah.

Okay.

But I was, but I was saying, like, how dare you not drop everything at once so that I can binge it.

Right.

And she was talking to me about how it,

you know, the full season drop is so difficult from a PR perspective.

because

when everybody is watching on a weekly basis, then in the press, they have a better cadence for like knowing when it's appropriate to talk about each episode.

And so when it's dropped all at once, people are kind of like, well, what part of it do I talk about?

And I just miss those days when you would like go to school after everybody had watched last night's episode.

Yeah.

We're like, they missed the million-dollar question or whatever, you know, those kinds of, you know, bringing people together.

I agree.

And I understand from a PR perspective and they want to drag it out and get everyone excited.

But it's like, okay, so when you started the binge watching and you made us addicts, where was your PR concerns then?

Right.

You know,

that's the issue.

It's like, we were always getting episodes weekly and we weren't complaining, we need more now.

And it was actually kind of crazy when they put all seasons at once and it started this like behavior of people like staying in all weekend to watch a show, which is, when you think about it, so unhealthy, but so normalized right now.

But like, that wasn't what life was like when we were growing up, that you would just sit in your house and stare at your tv set for 48 hours and then go back to school right right right right yeah the streamers gave us they they made us addicts and now we have withdrawal yeah withdrawal yes but i think that that that's what they wanted they like want us to be addicted and breaking free from the cycle it's it's very upsetting it's all very upsetting Yeah, well, this is exciting news, not upsetting news.

I'm good at it.

Agreed.

Do you think Taylor will be a guest?

I don't think so.

But honestly, I feel like every time I call something about these two, like, oh, no, they wouldn't.

Like, they do.

I couldn't agree more.

Like, at the outset, I was so on board with, I think it was Claudia who was like, I promise you, these two people have never met.

And I was like, yes.

Yeah.

And then we were right.

It's like, there's no way she would go down to the field.

It's no way she would, he would go to her show.

There's no way, like, Coachella, if you told me they were going to Coachella, they were going to be in the pit and they were going to go to Neon Carnival and listen to James Kennedy DJ.

I would have said, like, no way.

So, and now when I see this, I'm like, oh, there's no way she would like infringe on like his gig.

But I don't think he sees relationships in the world like that.

I think he's like, come on, babe, it's fun.

Not like you're stepping on my toes and making me feel emasculated.

Yes, that

he certainly seems to be so supportive and so

confident and secure.

Yeah.

And like.

We both have our things and like genuinely excited for her.

Yeah.

Which must be so exciting.

Yeah.

For her.

Yes.

I totally agree.

So So I will, I'll check it out.

I'm happy for him.

Yeah.

On Amazon Prime, you said?

On Amazon Prime.

Our next story is a bit of sports news.

You know, we love sports, but

Caitlin Clark, who is the women's basketball player who's been breaking records, setting records, making headlines, has just been drafted to the WNBA.

And her salary has people in a tizzy.

Oh.

Yes.

So she was the first first draft for the WNBA and

she will be making, I need to pull up the here.

And she's going where to the she's going to the hold on

Indiana.

The Indiana

fever.

I love the Indiana fever.

Caitlin Clark.

is going to the Indiana fever.

Now

the conversation is about her salary because she is making in five years roughly like three

right under $400,000.

So when you break it out year by year, it's like $79,000, $80,000 per year to be the number one, the best in the WNBA.

And then you compare it to the men's basketball and

the first pick for men's Victor Webanyama got a $55 million contract.

And so people are upset about that,

which is upsetting when you think about it.

But the problem is I feel like everyone who's upset about it, like seriously wouldn't be caught dead watching the WNBA.

So like you're part of the problem.

Right.

I think that's, I think that's spot on.

I mean, it is a, it is a business.

Right.

Like they make so much money at the end of it.

Like you can't even compare.

And so to be upset, I saw like Hoda was talking about it on her show and she was upset that.

55 million compared to like 400,000, which is insane.

And like, you know, she's saying it's like a gender pay gap.

And of course it's it's gendered because people want to watch the men play and the women for whatever reason.

I don't watch either.

So this isn't, I don't contribute to this issue, I'm proud to say.

Right.

But it's a business.

Right.

Yeah.

I, yeah, I see both sides of the argument.

And I, I, but I also feel like, you know, the, the suggestion

with regard to the complaints about it, the suggestion is that the WNBA is making the same amount of, bringing in the same amount of revenue as the NBA and is just like sitting on all the cash and only giving Caitlin $5.

Which I don't

know.

But sorry.

No, I was going to say, like the issue is a smaller issue of the bigger issue, which is just the WNBA versus the NBA.

And like,

why is one organization like so massive and the other is not?

But that just comes down to like people being interested in something.

You like can't for like.

I can't make fetch happen.

I feel that way a little bit about what they're doing here with soccer.

And that's men.

So I'll go ahead and say it.

Like, I don't know how much money can you spend.

Can you get people to care about something

in the way that they care about sports?

Like, you can't even, you can't market for that.

Like, that's just an organic thing.

Right.

Well, maybe Caitlin will succeed in changing that and bringing more eyeballs and more revenue to the WNBA because, I mean, people have just been so captivated by her.

Yeah.

And she's so talented.

Yeah.

And she'll definitely get more viewers.

She'll definitely get endorsement deals and she'll make plenty of money.

Yes.

But it just like speaks to this bigger issue of the WNBA versus the NBA, which is

a big issue before Caitlin Clark came on the scene.

Yeah, yeah.

I had an uncle who's now passed who loved watching the WNBA because he was an avid like basketball player himself.

And watching the women was more like the way that women...

you know, in in the NBA, women's basketball players play is more akin to like a normal person playing versus in the NBA the men are doing so many like tricks and superhuman type things

so maybe Caitlin will just bring a lot of people and

you know solve the problem yeah that would be great but like I'm sorry you guys have to watch like everyone who's angry about it like are you watching the WMA yeah otherwise what is there to say but I'm sure you caught the NBA finals and you can name like 10 NBA players yeah so again I don't watch either not my problem

I'm not a part of the problem.

I am neither the problem nor the solution.

An objective.

And of course, like it's messed up.

Like this girl's at the peak of talent.

Yeah.

Yeah.

But she's in the wrong industry then if she was the year to make millions.

Yeah.

And I feel like, and I wonder, I can't remember if Claudia and I had this exact conversation, but there are jobs, not necessarily sports.

The only sport I can think of where women's is a lot better than men's is gymnastics.

Love gymnastics.

And also I was thinking of volleyball.

Is there men's volleyball?

Yes, there is.

See?

For sure.

But it's all about the women.

Yes.

But I also feel that way.

Like there are industries and jobs where like women make so much more than their male counterparts, like modeling.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So we've got our things.

We've got our things too.

So I don't know what to tell you guys.

Like stream WMBA or else like

keep it shut.

Like it is what it is.

But I'm happy for her.

I'm happy.

I hope she does great things.

I hope people do stream WNBA.

And one day she gets a $55 million contract.

I'm going to manifest it.

For her.

I will join you.

Our next story.

Rebecca Minkoff has been shooting for the Real Housewives of New York City.

So

do you watch any Real Housewives of New York City?

I don't watch the new.

So I'm with you.

So I watch no reality TV.

which is obviously a character flaw.

I don't

know how, like, I don't know how to get into it now.

Yeah.

Because I'm so far gone.

Like, what, like, which franchise do I choose?

Do I just start at season one and I just have to like catch up on 22 seasons of each each franchise?

Um, but this is the reboot, right?

Yes.

So if you were to start something, actually starting Roni reboot, you could watch last season and this is the new one.

The issue is, is that that's not the greatest.

Okay.

Because the original seasons, like that's where legends were made.

Now they're trying to recreate the magic.

I don't think anybody who watched Roni reboot first season is like, this is the best thing ever.

I think it had its moments and people like resonated with some of the cast members, but it's not the magic of Ramona and Luann and Sonia.

Okay.

I have to say that everything I know about reality TV, I know from this show.

Okay.

And so we'll be aligned.

And yeah, so we'll be aligned, but also the way that I have like internalized.

your and Claudia's opinions on reality stars that I've I've never watched.

I was at the grocery store like at the height of the Sandoval stuff, and there was a tabloid with Tom Sandoval's face.

It's like, Tom Sandoval, blah, blah, blah.

And I'm standing there with my husband, and we were like getting donuts or something with the girls on a weekend day.

And I was like, oh, Tom Sandoval.

I hate that guy.

And Rich was like, who is that?

And why do you hate him?

And I was like, I have no idea.

Jackson Claude.

Told you too.

And them's the rules.

Them's the rules.

Well, on that one, that wasn't even a hot take of ours.

I know.

That was like the universe.

Now our hot take.

raining on that guy yeah the take that's warm now is give sandoval grace okay okay which

sorry let me give an asterisk give sandoval grace if he is going to continue to be on the reality show that we are watching with people who will not speak to him it's not good for the sake of the reality show therefore we should give him some grace so we can move forward that's that's the take now yes and i that that i'm sure that's a very good take and just like the take that to you know maybe stop like dehumanizing him and

publicly like flogging him is probably, yeah.

Yeah.

So wait, so for this reboot, how did the first season do?

I think.

Because wasn't there a discussion about whether it was going to continue?

Yeah.

I think it was decent.

It wasn't amazing, but definitely not like terrible and abysmal that they are going to pull the plug.

Okay.

Jenna Lyons was on the first season.

And she's not coming back for the second season.

She's officially not coming back.

Yes.

So Rebecca Minkoff is now rumored to be be filming for the show as well.

Unclear if she'll be the full cast member, friend of, but I wouldn't be surprised if she's full.

And this is, they're getting, you know, another fashion heavyweight to replace the other one because I think people were really excited about Jenna Lyons when the first season premiered of New Roni.

That was the only recognizable name.

And I think they want that clout still.

So this is a really great.

substitution.

Yes.

And she, I don't know her personality-wise, but definitely we like to watch interesting women, and I think she has the makings of very interesting women.

She's very, very talented, and I've met her a couple times, and she's very nice, humble.

Oh, my gosh.

Yeah, she met Rebecca Minkoff turdy.

Yeah.

But she's very, she's very nice.

And like, I would put her in the same bucket as Jenna Lyons is kind of serious.

And

this seems sort of

like out of the typical of what I, what one might expect her to do.

So that makes it exciting and interesting and she will lend that yeah that fashion and I feel like for for a New York-based real housewives you've got to have like a fashion player in there right yeah you know I agree with that yeah and

for the interest of people like she could bring in new viewers and they kind of they could always use more viewers yeah yeah so I think having like that name will be very exciting for people it even happens on Beverly Hill sometimes like when they cast Denise Richards and it was like oh my god we know her and it's even sometimes the most recognizable housewife isn't the best housewife.

In fact, usually it's not because they have a lot to lose.

But it definitely throws an interesting factor into the mix.

Yeah.

So I'm here for it.

Me too.

Are you ready for our next story, which is a bit of legal news that we had discussed over the years that now

the wheels of justice have turned out and this is what we got.

So if you remember, two Anna DeArmas fans were suing Universal Studios for false advertising because they went to rent the movie yesterday on Amazon Prime and Anna DeArmas was in the trailer and they watched the whole movie only to find out that she had been cut.

And they said that was false advertising.

And so they sued.

So the two men who rented yesterday on Amazon Prime only to discover that Ana DeArmas was not in the final cut of the film have settled their false advertising lawsuit.

They sued Universal in 2022, alleging that they were each cheated out of $3.99.

A federal judge initially sided with them, finding that movie trailers are not immune from false advertising claims, but various setbacks followed, leaving the men on the hook for $126,000 in Universal legal fees.

On Friday, they accepted a settlement that will resolve the case.

The terms were not disclosed, and neither side responded to a request for comment.

However, from the evidence of the court filings, nobody was happy with the outcome.

Universal believes it was forced to spend two years and hundreds of thousands of dollars defending a patently frivolous lawsuit.

Meanwhile, the plaintiff's class action lawyers, who initially believed the claim was worth millions, ended up believing that California's courts are rigged in favor of the Hollywood studios.

399 cents,

which was the purchase price of the film.

Yeah.

Oh, dear God.

I mean, it is like

sets an interesting precedent.

I feel like so often you watch a movie trailer and there's like a funny line in it and then you watch the movie and the line is actually not in it.

Now I don't feel like so offended that I need to sue,

but maybe we should be keeping our trailers honest.

Universal Trailer.

totally they took the position that movie trailers are works of art and therefore they should be protected by the First Amendment.

They warned that if they were merely treated as advertising, viewers could sue every time they thought a movie didn't live up to the trailer.

Yes, so I mean,

in my opinion, it is totally wild that they included her in the trailer and she's not in the film.

Like, that's

objectively wild, right?

Yeah, but I think it's...

But do we sue over that?

No, we don't.

We don't sue.

Oh, God.

I think that

it was before she was a big actress.

So she filmed some stuff.

And then when they made the trailer for Prime, she was a bigger actress.

So they put her in it.

I don't even.

And like when you search, like if I want to go watch all Anna DeArmas movies, you search her.

And then she came up and yesterday, because technically she's in the movie and she probably got paid for it, but she didn't make the Final Cut, but she's a part of the movie.

Okay.

I see both sides.

I totally see both sides because I think it's a very annoying thing to do.

And yet it is such a frivolous lawsuit, right yeah also the movie is bad so they should have been sued for that for the waste of time and to you and that like to universal's point if

you know you're allowed to sue every time it's false advertising it looked good but it wasn't yeah it looked good but it was trash um yeah that that establishes some dangerous precedent yeah

very interesting and also like I wonder how like Anna feels.

Yeah.

She probably is pissed that they include her in the

included her in the in the trailer.

Where is Anna to Armas?

I don't know.

Has she done anything since the

Marilyn Monroe?

I don't know.

I feel like she was everywhere.

And then all of a sudden, remember when she was dating Ben Affleck?

I really would have bet money on them

and been wrong.

Huh.

Nothing since Blonde.

Okay.

She's taking time off.

She deserves it.

Yeah.

After that big trailer gig and then the trailer gig.

Yeah.

Yeah, She's probably like, I want to lay low for a second.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

These people are like smearing my good name.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's that's crazy.

It's crazy on all sides.

Yeah.

Well, so I'm glad they settled.

Glad they settled.

Speaking of content that is living up to the hype, today's episode is brought to you by Mary and George, our new favorite show on stars.

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Yeah.

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Our fifth and final story.

Is it a sports story?

It is.

This is my favorite sports podcast.

It is not a sports story, even though this should be a boxing match between Kelly Clarkson and her ex, Brandon Blackstock.

So more lawsuits between Kelly and her former mans.

He hit back at her in a new lawsuit after the $2.6 million ruling that we shared.

a few weeks ago.

On Monday, he responded to her latest lawsuit in which she claimed he should pay her more than $2.6 million

that the California Labor Commissioner ruled that he owed her for illegally acting like an unlicensed talent agent since 2007 when she entered into an oral agreement with his family's company.

Per the documents obtained by page six, he denied each and every allegation made by Kelly and argued the filing should be dismissed because the labor commissioner's ruling was made in November 2023.

Since Kelly failed to file a notice of appeal within 10 days from when the decision was made, I'm choked up because he's coming from my girl, ma'am.

Yeah.

From his sweetheart.

From when the the decision was made in order to request more than the $2.6 million that was ruled upon, he and his attorney needs to claim it is outside the proper jurisdiction to file a separate lawsuit now, according to the docs.

Geez, this man.

Take the L, bro.

Take the L.

And it's like, I feel like sometimes maybe somebody's name is Spirit and they don't deserve it and they're going to fight tooth and nail to clear it up.

But this is Kelly.

Like, I just don't see a world in which she is the villain of this story and how you could ever change people's minds about that yeah no you're never gonna do it it's impossible she's kelly clarkson yeah she is beloved beloved

it's so funny that her power and she's so powerful it comes from love like it doesn't come from like fear or like she's just this big almighty person it's like she has wormed her way into our hearts yeah and you can't fight that right

so she's trying to file this now and he's responding to.

Yeah, saying that like this is a garbage suit because she said he owes $2.6 million because he was like acting as her agent.

Like yikes.

Yikes.

So she wants to sort of claw back the commissions that were earned under false pretenses.

Yeah.

Yikes.

That is,

I mean, knowing nothing about the specifics of this case, I also am just like, oh, but wouldn't you want to be done?

Yeah.

On both sides, like I just want to be.

I agree with that, but I feel like from what I've seen, he's not letting stuff go too.

Like, he's trying to get houses and this and that.

So, she's just like, oh, well, you want to go there?

I'm going here.

He tried to get their prenup thrown out.

Oh, that would have been nice for him.

Yeah.

You know, like this man.

Can't blame a guy.

Can't blame a guy for trying.

Right.

I feel like for him, he needs to let it go.

Like, he needs to.

Does he, what does he do?

Do we know what he does?

So I think that he was like, working as a talent agent.

His dad is a big agent, I think.

He was like Reba's husband, actually.

An agent?

Okay.

I don't know.

He's in the industry.

Actually, the husband, Brandon, was

Blade Shelton's agent for a time, but then when things went south with him and Kelly, Blade Shelton dropped him.

Got it.

And so was he acting as like a fake agent for all of these people?

Because that's the basis of his lawsuit, right?

I don't know if he was not, in fact, a licensed agent.

Great question.

I don't know if he was fake for them or just like he was hand, like him and Kelly never had a contract.

So he was just like being the husband, like, oh, I'll negotiate this for you babe okay okay it's like oh well no

oh yikes messy so messy and

yeah and does she have any she has a new album coming out or just she her album came out in the spring so almost a year ago okay but it good i'm so i'm just a year behind you're just one year behind but you're never too late because her music is timeless and eternal so true and if and i and even the older albums to me like are her greatest works like piece by piece album yeah

I mean, we could go all the way back, you know, all I ever wanted.

It's just, it all ages like a fine wine.

Yeah.

But how can she sing, since you've been gone, if you won't go the fuck away?

If you won't be gone.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's a great question.

Yeah.

So just him again.

What can you do?

Classic Brandon Blackstock.

Classic.

Poor Kelly.

I know.

Justice for Kelly.

It's like, and she has just so much great things going on for her, and you can just feel feel this is just like an anchor, like tethered to her ankle, like bringing it to her.

But that's what brings me back to the idea that like from, if, I mean, from her.

Just let him have 1.6 mil.

Yeah.

But he's already taken so much, Jackie.

Here I am knowing nothing about the specifics.

And I'm just immediately on board with Kelly and feel that she's been

maligned.

Maligned, yeah.

I agree.

Okay.

I stand with Kelly.

To no surprise to no one.

Yeah.

Ugh.

Are you ready for Dear Toasters?

Mary Orton, it's your time.

Jackie, I'm so excited for Deer Toasters.

And as someone who was born in the late 1900s, I do feel like I've seen some shit, you know?

Yeah.

I've seen some shit and I have some advice to give.

I agree.

I'm excited to hear your advice.

So Dear Toasters is our weekly advice segment.

You can submit to deartoasters at gmail.com.

You can submit on our website if you want to be more anonymous.

And we will give you advice as best as we can.

Can I ask you, have you ever, this is one of my favorite segments that you guys do, and have you ever had, I love it when you give advice and then you say,

play this episode for your boyfriend and let him listen to what we have to say.

And so I'm wondering, have you ever heard from the other party?

No, because if we had, we would update everyone.

Like anytime there's any sort of update, we share it.

So I just like to think when there's no update, it's like you took our advice.

It works swimmingly.

No news is good news.

And you're off enjoying this beautiful life.

Okay.

Okay.

I was hoping maybe you've gotten like an angry DM from a

spouse.

Oh, you know what?

A disgruntled boyfriend being like, no, no.

Well, here's what she left out.

We have.

We got a message maybe from our website.

Oh my gosh, I would need to go find it.

It was absurd.

Oh, no.

It was like he was clearly so like crazy.

Okay.

He didn't like our advice.

Okay.

This this is see this is what i was thinking yeah i'm gonna find it after the show for you and you guys aren't missing out on anything but it was just from a nut and i hope that our advice to her was to leave him because the email was seriously unhinged oh yeah yeah yikes okay first up your toasters hi jackson turdy lou crusted out mary orton long time listener first time writer here's the gist when i met my husband and I had these huge fake boobs.

We fell in love and decided we wanted to have kids.

So I ended up getting a second boob job to drastically decrease the size since I knew that during pregnancy and breastfeeding your boobs getting even bigger.

Fast forward to a couple kids later, I decided I want a mommy makeover.

I had a tummy tuck, a lift, and new implants.

I went back to big implants because I thought that's what I wanted.

It was a long recovery and afterwards my husband said I should be done.

We have kids now and it's nerve-wracking for him the thought of something going wrong while under the knife.

I agreed at the time but now it's two years since and I hate my boobs.

They are so big and cartoonish and I'm just not the 21 year old girl with big boobs that I used to be.

I'm scared to bring this up to him.

I made my bed, so should I just lay in it?

It's not causing any physical pain, but with my style changing, I just feel like big boobs don't go with my aesthetic.

I'm trying to achieve.

Any advice?

Love ya.

Bye.

Wow, this is layered.

I have so many different thoughts.

I have so many thoughts.

So she's had it already done three times.

Three times.

Damn.

Is that

normal to have like them made smaller in anticipation of having children?

Um, yes.

I think, well, like, do a lot of people do that?

I don't think a lot of people do that.

I've heard of people

like

making them smaller, like, after children, and then wishing that they waited because they wind up having more kids and then your boobs get bigger again okay but to go big and then small and then kids and then big that's a lot of surgeries and I feel like I'm looking forward to the day where I get my one but I'm also a little bit like nervous about it but you just like casually what if I just got a boob job today is you know make me think differently about it yeah

Well, I think in general, your body, if you like for your life, and if you want smaller boobs, like you should get them.

And I understand completely where your husband's coming from.

Like it is nerve-wracking and surgeries are a big deal, but you can't like live the rest of your life feeling uncomfortable and just not happy because of that.

And you've been through it three times already.

But what I want to say, and this isn't helpful to you since you're already in this position, but just like to other people is like, these are really big changes to be making on a whim.

Yes.

I feel as though you should want it for years before you do it.

That's what I was just going to say.

I was going to say, I think you have to ask yourself two questions.

Number one, and like be honest with yourself is there any part of you that thinks you're always just wanting what you what you don't have

because i so not to be a male apologist here but i do understand his concern that this is major surgery right um so you don't want to keep doing this so i would ask like okay are you sure it's it's what you want or it's or are you perhaps just thinking i want what i don't have yeah and if you want that now and maybe in five years you'll want them big again like maybe you should just go medium and then the second question that I would ask is if the most recent time you did it was just two years ago

how long have you wanted the change and just make sure it's been like many months many years I'm sorry I would say many years

I would sit on a cosmetic decision for years it's not gonna have to bother me for years I have to be so sure about it not just like trend I know trends change and yeah you might want something now and I feel like when people do stuff when they're younger that's always what they say like I just wish I waited.

So my advice to everyone is like to wait on these things.

My advice to you, I also would say to wait because you might change your mind again.

But I understand like why you want to go small, but now I'm worried that you won't want to stay small.

Now I'm worried about that.

That's what I'm worried about.

So just give yourself some time to make sure that it's absolutely what you want so that it can be the last time that you have.

You live with these baby boosters so long that you absolutely hate them.

And then by the time you change them, you would never go back.

Do you know how, because like, yeah, I would say like, so that you make sure that it's the last, it's the last time that you do it.

But do you still have to have them redone every

10 years or something or whatever?

Yeah, they say like every 10 years, but I wonder if that's like without an implant.

Like if you don't have an implant and it's just like you're taking your implant or maybe you're getting a smaller one.

I think if there's anything in there, you have to do every

decade or something.

Okay.

So you could wait for the 10 year and then go small.

Yeah.

I like that.

Yeah, that's a good, that's a good option if you have to do it anyway.

I have never had any plastic surgery of any kind, but funny story, I got an email from someone, this is now many years ago, and she lives in South Carolina, and she said, hey, I don't know if you know this, but there is a plastic surgery practice here who's using your images on their website.

And

is there a higher compliment?

No, no, no, no.

It was specifically for their breast reduction page that that's where they felt my images were needed.

So they said that

first of all, how dare you?

Second of all, I immediately emailed them and was like, yeah, so go ahead and remove those images.

Wait, so what were they saying that you were a client?

No, so they weren't using my name.

They had just, they needed like a background image at the top of the landing page of like a

smiling woman.

Of like a smiling woman.

You are kind of like a textbook smiling woman.

Well, yeah, so they found,

I'm assuming they just like Googled, you know, smiling woman and I popped up and they just even though you were headless for so long.

Even though I was headless for so long.

Yeah.

So that was.

You've never done like any modeling where you like have like, you're not part of like a stock image database.

Absolutely not.

But this has happened to me twice.

So once with this, this plastic surgery practice was using my images that they had just like.

ripped from my website.

And then the second time that this happened

was there was this big building development in Midtown Manhattan.

and they needed you know on on like the billboards that they put to cover the sort of ground level of all the construction and they have renderings on those billboards of like what what the building will look like and they've got like fake people walking through lobbies and whatever and they took a picture of me and walking down the street and they cut out my figure and put it like bigger than life-size Jackie.

Okay, so this is where kind of the face of the building.

No, this was like, so there's like an eight-foot version of of me walking in Midtown Manhattan.

So like for the two years that it was up there and I was, you know, trying to get it taken down, but then I was just like, oh, whatever.

I would constantly have friends who would be like selfieing in front of the Mary Orton on Fifth Avenue.

So hysterical.

And humiliating.

No, not.

I feel like if you look at Mary Orton's content, like, yeah, if I was building a building and I wanted like a glamorous woman to be the face of it, like that's your like vibe.

that's what you exude it was like it was like me in a in a like a gray pantsuit or something walking it was just very I was it was very it was giving stock image it's giving smiling women like

everyone wants you to sell their products do you have a picture of it um I this was like 2014, so it would probably take me a minute

to dig it up.

Yeah, oh, definitely.

This is like seven phones ago.

Like, even though that's illegal and, you know, you have to protect your image, I would also like subconsciously like be very flattered.

I I was just humiliated.

That was the primary feeling that I felt for those for those two years.

Every day.

You should have said, I want a free apartment.

I should have.

I really should have.

That's fair.

It was a commercial building, so they would have had to

own it.

Orton HQ.

Orton headquarters.

I like that.

Yeah.

Missed opportunity on my part.

Yeah.

Well,

so yeah, wait on the boob job is all to say.

Just make sure.

Yeah, that's a lot of, that's, it's hard on your body.

So this we want this to be the final one until 10 years but i like our idea of waiting the 10 years like and even though yeah you're uncomfortable for eight years like then you won't want to go back you can be sure of that yeah thanks next question hi jackson mary orton new mama here and looking for some advice obviously this is years in the future if it ever even presents itself but here's the situation i have been deeply insecure about my nose since as early as fifth grade and would cry that i couldn't afford a nose job i have since grown up gotten married to my dream man and still haven't gotten a nose job i got the guy and wedding pictures have come and gone, so getting a nose job now just isn't at the top of my list, even though if the opportunity presented itself, I would definitely get one.

So eight months ago, I gave birth to the most perfect angel girl and immediately I knew she got my nose.

Obviously, as a mom looking at my daughter, she's perfection.

I hate that I even noticed she has my most hated feature on myself, but on her, stunning.

While I will always tell her that if she came to me crying one day that she hates her nose, I will understand that all too well.

Should I be the mom that keeps reminding her that she's perfect the way she is or allow her to get a nose job when she's old enough because I don't want her to look at at herself in the mirror the way that I do to myself.

Thank you for your time and advice.

Love a mama who wants her girl to have the world.

Oh,

okay.

So first of all, I will say there is no way you know that she has your nose.

Yeah.

Like the changes that my, you know, when when Coco, for example, was born for the first year of her life, we were like, she's rich as clone.

I was like, I had nothing to do with this baby.

And then now she's like my, my twin.

She looks exactly like I did as a little girl.

So they change so much.

There's no way you are looking at an eight-month nose.

I mean, you may feel like there are some similarities, but you never know.

You never know.

But operating under the premise that she does.

But let's say she does.

I would say

two things.

Number one,

make sure, try to make sure that you never say something disparaging about your nose in front of her.

Because

I have a friend who had this situation with her mom and

her mom would always talk about how she hated her ankles and was like, oh, I have thick ankles.

I hate my ankles, blah, blah, blah.

And so that like instill, and it's not like she was telling the daughter, like, your ankles are thick and hideous.

Yeah.

But she was saying disparaging things about her own.

And the daughter has eyeballs and was like, oh, okay.

So I guess I should be.

you know, ashamed of mine.

So, so try not to do that.

Yeah.

Like a project at all, which is, it's hard because it's such a big part of like how you think of yourself and like just how you are.

Yeah, but if she does come to the conclusion that she doesn't like her nose, like let it not be a seed that you planted in some way.

Exactly.

Exactly.

And so I think it would be obvious to think, well, I'm never going to say anything to her about her nose, but also make sure you're not saying things about your nose in front of her.

And then the second thing I would say is.

If it does get to that point where she feels the way that you felt,

tell her this story that you're telling us.

Be like, I also hated it and then I had you and I loved it and now it doesn't bother me and now I feel like it's this special thing that we have and whatever.

And then let her make her decision.

That's what I would say.

It sounds like it still bothers her though.

Yeah.

The mom.

That's true.

That's true.

So maybe I would just like let her grow up, see what happens.

I mean, a lot of girls do get their nose done kind of young and like it's no big deal.

Maybe do a mother-daughter nose job one day if you both come to the same conclusion.

But like I would try and like zoom out on it and like even zoom out on her face.

Like

put it to the like back of your mind as best as you can.

Like it's not an issue for today.

And even if someone has like a good nose, everyone has insecurities.

Everyone has things that like they can't wait to fix when they're older or things that like.

they think everybody's looking at them for.

And it might not be their nose, but everybody has those things.

So it's

it's just a part of life to like be self-conscious about something um you could fix it if you want to

and or don't if you don't want to but i would just like take the pressure off the situation a little bit like even if she has your nose and it's a bad nose like okay yeah okay we're gonna be okay yeah And then let her, and then let her make her decision.

And even if you, you know, even if this mom still hates her nose or, you know, doesn't love it, she's clearly found some acceptance and comfort in the connection with the with the daughter who potentially has it so I would tell her that when she's old enough to make her own decision and like how bad can a nose be like it's not a great but like there are some people who have like famously bad noses who like never change them and like still it's not like they're hugely greatest

could be her greatest strength hugely successful people

she could become a

Yeah, I think it's just not as big of a deal as you're making it up to be because you're already worried about something that's like so far down the line.

It's like clear that it consumes your thoughts.

But if you can, like, release yourself from it for the time being because it's okay.

Yes.

It's just a nose.

And they can be changed if need be.

Yes.

And at the end of the day, like you do not know that she

has your nose.

You really don't.

I promise.

Yeah.

Okay, third and final dear toasters.

So far we've been aligned.

Maybe this one will drive Mary and I apart.

I love my husband.

Yeah, I love my husband, but sometimes his jokes just aren't funny.

We've had a few family gatherings recently, and at each one, he makes the joke that I'm pregnant to his parents.

He thinks it's funny, but his parents look so excited only to be crushed a minute later when they find out it's a joke.

I told him to stop and that it's not funny at all, but he insists that they, that him and his family have that type of relationship where it's normal to joke around.

They do not have any grandkids and always let us know where they're waiting, so this feels truly cruel.

This isn't a funny joke, right?

Am I a wet blanket or reasonably annoyed?

Well, this is an easy one.

Reasonably annoyed.

period.

Period.

I hate when people like make unfunny jokes and they're like, I just like to joke around.

I'm like, well, where's the joke, bro?

Like, I'm sorry, telling someone that you're, first of all, pregnancy is never something to be joked about.

That's like what every like adult person understands at this point, especially when it's a sensitive subject.

There aren't kids.

Who knows what's going on?

Like, that's just never something that you joke about.

Period.

So for that reason, he's wrong on all counts.

But like, say it was a joke about something else.

Like, it's got to be funny to be a joke.

Right.

And I, I have to say, I,

I know so many people who have made these jokes.

And I know your husband, like there is no malintent.

Like this, he really does not appreciate.

And usually, you know, these jokes come from people who have

never,

you know, lost a baby or struggled to conceive or whatever.

And so you just got to tell him that.

You have to tell him, like, first of all, it's not funny.

Like, you're talking about my body.

Like, it's weird.

It's just weird.

And, like, on its face makes me uncomfortable.

And that should be enough for him, you know?

Right.

Right.

To like not keep pushing the joke, but also.

And it's also mean to his parents who keep getting their hopes up.

Like, that's not a joke to tell someone something untrue and

like then say, oh, kidding.

Like, okay.

Yeah.

Like, you're, yeah.

And for whenever the day does come that you are pregnant, it's the boy who cried wolf.

It's like, okay, you and your jokes.

Goodbye.

This needs to be like shut down.

Shut down and maybe you just need to explain that to him like like you know i don't know if you guys have tried or not tried or where you're at or if you even plan to have children but you know maybe he needs to be told like it's just not something that you joke about like this is just not something you joke about but also if you need a reason like what if we do have trouble yeah or whatever or what if you know other people in your family have trouble and it's just it's a sensitive thing that's not a joke and it's but he's probably like you you know, we joke like this in my family all the time, but clearly by his parents' reaction, they don't.

And it's like, maybe he's been making these jokes and nobody knows how to tell him.

Like, we don't like your jokes.

And that's a wife's job to say, we don't like your jokes.

Yeah.

We're not going to take them anymore.

Yeah.

Yeah.

This, this, got to put a lid on that one.

Yeah.

Yikes.

Yikes.

But at least that's case closed.

We can agree there.

And I will say, like, I, I do think

because I, I mean, we've all seen people make these jokes and it's often like innocently meant.

Yeah.

He's not a, we're not saying he's a bad guy.

No, he just doesn't funny.

You just have to be clear to him that this is not funny.

Yeah, not funny.

Period.

Okay, well, that's your toasters, and that's our show with Mary Orton.

Jackie, thank you so much for having me.

Thank you for coming here.

I'm so excited that we got to host together in studio together.

The start of a beautiful friendship.

I got to meet Brew.

It's just a perfect day.

Isn't Brew?

Look at him.

He's sitting on the remote podcasting chair.

He's just off camera, and

he's just a gift.

He brought a gift to us all.

He has his blanket up there.

Let me take a picture of him, and I'll post it so you guys can see.

He's sleeping soundly, perhaps because we didn't talk enough about sports.

Perhaps.

Or we didn't talk enough about Brew.

True.

Which would lull anyone to sleep.

Yeah.

Well, I hope you enjoyed this episode.

I will be back tomorrow with a remote episode with Lauren Elizabeth.

Very exciting.

Mary Orton, where can everyone follow you and keep up with you?

Where can they become Ortonites officially?

Oh my gosh.

On Instagram, Mary at Mary Orton.

I also have the TikTok.

Okay.

Mary.Orton, but I

very

seldom am posting there.

So it's Instagram for me.

Instagram for you.

Works for me.

She's a Reels queen, by the way.

I feel like I didn't even hype that up enough.

Like content.

creator, really content that you need in your life that you didn't even realize that you needed.

Just like tips for women, funny content, motherhood stuff, great style tips.

You have fantastic style and original style, which we love.

Thank you.

We love that.

We love originality.

So check out Mary Orton.

We love you very much, and we'll see you tomorrow.

Love ya.

Bye.