E1043 - Vanderpump Is Back, Ryan Serhant Talks Owning Manhattan, RHOSLC, RHOP, Spotify Wrapped & Psychics

Sundays, Sundays, Sundays. You can't beat Sundays because you know your pets will love them.
I mean, if Jeff and Steve could talk, they would talk about Sundays all day long.

What you feed your dog matters for their quality of life. You want to make sure that your dogs are around as long as possible, so make sure you're feeding them high-quality foods.

Sundays was founded by veterinarian and mom, Dr. Tori Waxman, who was tired of seeing so-called premium dog foods filled with fillers and synthetics.

So she designed Sundays, air-dried, real food made in a human-grade kitchen using the same ingredients and care that you would use to cook for yourself and your family.

Every bite of Sundays is clean and made from real meat, fruits, and veggies with no kibble. This means no weird ingredients you can't pronounce and no fillers.

Compared to Kibble or other brands out there, Sundays invests 50 times more in its ingredients and ensures premium quality because your dog deserves food made with care, not in the interest of cost cutting.

I mean, I think it tastes great. I've never personally eaten it, but Jeff and Steve gobblet it up.
So you know they're going to love it.

And the best part is, you know, they're going to have softer fur, better poops, and just overall better quality of life with Sundays. Get your dogs the gift of healthy eating this holiday season.

Make the switch to Sundays. Go right now to Sundaysfordogs.com/slash V-I-A-L-L and get 50% off.
That's five, zero percent off your first order. Or you can use code VIALL at checkout.

That's 50% off your first order at Sundaysfordogs.com/slash V-I-A-L-L. Sundaysfordogs.com/slash V-I-A-L-L.
Or use code VIALL at checkout. That first year in a home comes with excitement and stress.

When homeowners face a home system or appliance breakdown, repairs or replacements could run into the thousands.

American Home Shield can help remove the worry by protecting your wallet from unexpected expenses. If AHS can't repair your covered item, they'll replace it no matter the age.

It's one of the smartest ways to create peace of mind as a new homeowner. Visit ahs.com slash vial files for 20% off any plan today in C Promo details.
That's ahs.com slash vial files for 20% off.

See ahs.com slash contracts for details, including fees, limitations, and exclusions.

What's going on, everybody? Welcome back to another exciting episode of the Vile Files Reality Recap Edition. I'm your host, Nick, joined by the household, my enlightened.
No, enlightened.

My enlightened.

Why do I always freeze? I always freeze. I think it's because you love her so much.
I love her so much. There's so much pressure on her.
There's no words that can be so much. There are no words.

Yes.

The lights of heaven shine down on my brain when Natalie just image enters into my head. Sadly, she is not with us today.

Our dear baby River is under the weather, and she is playing mom at the moment she might pop up into the studio but she is with with our child uh helping her out so she unfortunately won't be joining the intro but we have good news she will be in this episode because we have a great guest for you a very exciting guest ryan serhan you know him of reality tv fame he's promoting the new season of owning manhattan season two is out on netflix on friday and he is with us to talk about all things real estate in manhattan a really fascinating guy really well accomplished guy And I don't know if you're interested in real estate, which I think everyone is to some degree.

We have a really fascinating, fun conversation with him. We pre-recorded this interview, so Natalie was with us.

So if you are a friend, fear not that the dear Natalie Joy will be in this episode, even though she's not with us right now. Steve is sitting in her chair,

keeping it nice and warm. Potato potato.
Steve, Natalie, you know? Hi, Steve. Swap a co-host for a co-host.
Yeah. The Spotify rap is out.

Our favorite time of year where we get to find out who are our most loyal household members. We appreciate all the people who are posting us on their Spotify rap.
Please share those. We love you guys.

We couldn't obviously have this show with any of you listeners. We truly appreciate and love you.

Whether you listen to us because you love being a part of the household or you listen to us because you hate listening to us. Looking, you know,

listen, you know, you really got something good when people tune, you know, just listen to try to like talk their shit. And we welcome all.
You know, we are inclusive in this show, you know?

Haters, fans, trolls, lovers, we love you. Fighters.
You know who you are if you're listening. Yeah.
You know? Talk to you. Nick, what was your top artist in your Spotify rap?

I haven't looked, but I can, I, there, I have a podcast I listen to. I've listened to every episode of this podcast since I found it.
It's called, I think I've talked about this before.

The Packers one? It's a Packer podcast. John Van Dierdink.
John Van Vierdink? I don't know. You know who you are, John.
You listen to it every day.

John Van

Ho's John Van Dierdink. Anyways, it's so soothing.

Well, first of all, I love the Packers, right? And I love the way he breaks down the Packers. It's his voice.

I'll listen to episodes twice. I find it very relaxing.
I listen to it at 1.2 speed. And there is something about his voice that I find just like soothing.
It's wonderful.

It brings joy. I just love this man.

If you want to be really vulnerable with the listeners, you could check your Spotify rapped right now. It's just a bunch of Packer podcasts, guys.
No, the music. What do you mean?

Do you listen to music? Yeah. Have you ever heard of that? I'm curious to know what

it's a lot of, I can tell you it's a lot of background room jazz. Let's hear it.
That's nice.

Right now, we're playing a lot of background Christmas jazz at the house. That's really nice.
Do you guys listen to, is that like me being old? Like old?

No, not at all.

I wake up every morning to jazz playing. I love jazz.

In the background, when you're cooking dinner and there's like a fire going, little Miles Davis Blue, little Duke Ellington, little Stan Gatz on the record. You know what I did this morning? Yeah.

What did you do this morning? I shoveled. I made an ice skating rink, and then I ice skated for five minutes.
Wow.

Well, I actually started it yesterday. There's a light layer of snow on the lake.
The ice is already frozen, super frozen, which is shocking for early December, but it's been super cold here.

And yeah, I made a nice little air skinny rink. And then I sprayed some hot water on it to make it nice and smooth yesterday.

But then there was a light layer of snow this morning, so I had to go out and shovel again. Okay.

I took river ice skating

for

this yesterday. I have a question.
How do you spray hot water on it? Like, is it like a boiling process or does the hose spray hot water?

We have hot water coming out of the hose from the house and I ran the hose down to the lake. So did you teach River how to ice skate skate before you taught her how to roller skate?

This is the first time we skated together. Yeah, wow, cute! That is so that's really cute.
That's a really sweet moment to distract us from you being scared to share your top artist on Spotify rap.

I know, I could, I just told you who it is. I know, I don't have a very diverse, um, I don't have a very diverse uh

list. I'm sending you guys,

I can tell you what mine was.

I'm sending you the

wiggles.

Let's go.

My Spotify rapped this year was completely fucked.

What's weird, though, is that all of my top listened to artists and songs were kids' music, but then my

age, I guess they give you like an age range now, was 75. Mine was 62.
Mine was 21. Wow.
You know what?

Something's wrong. Mine was 62.

Is that a worst reflection of Leia and Mary or Sierra? Probably Probably me because I was like, my music. What is your music? Tate McRae, Gracie Abrams, like I give 21-year-old.
Yeah. No.

Actually, Jenny is on mine. Yeah.
Extra Large is one of my most listened songs. Hell yeah.

To be fair, my top five was like Haley Williams, Dochi, Lady Gaga, Addison Ray, and Joan Jett and the Black Artists.

Simon and Garfunkel was in my mix. Seaman and Garfunkel? Wow.

That's a good mix. That's great.
You can always have some Simon and Garfunkel on.

Felia is our favorite song in the collection. Spotify said to me, tastes like yours can't be defined, but let's try anyway.
How do you go to the Spotify rap? You go to Spotify.

Just go on to Spotify and then you hit the first thing there. Yeah.

It is? Oh, wrapped. I like glow.
Yeah. Okay, let's see what mix is.

You're being really vulnerable and brave. Vulnerable and main.
What am I saying? Finally being your stories, your top songs of 2025. Yes.
Yes. My top album is Wicked Soundtrack.

You Should Probably Leave by Chris Stapleton.

Oh, okay. Think I'm In Love With You by Chris Stapleton.

We went through a period of time of listening to a lot of Chris Stapleton welcome. Sounds like it.

Yeah. Oh, this is You and Me.
It's a workout song. You and me and you.
And by disclosure.

Okay. Then number four is Parachute by Chris Stapleton, Tennessee, Whiskey by Chris Stapleton.

Okay. Cold by Chris Stapleton.
White Horse by Chris Stapleton.

Huge Chris Stapleton guy. In the end, if you don't listen to jazz, it sounds like you're going to be in the top 2% of listeners of Chris Stapleton.
You're going to get a Chris Stapleton video.

You're going to get a video.

Yeah. You're going to get a Chris Dapleton video.

I got a Tate McRae one. I got a Lady Gaga one.
I got the Wiggles.

They were literally like, thank you for listening.

Wiggles.

Hot potato, hot potato.

That was my number two most listened to. My top podcast was the Hacks companion podcast.

Yes.

Wait, that's so funny. Actually, my number one song is extra large.
Let's go. What did that say about me? My number one song was the song called I Want You Fever by this band Mama.
That's really fun.

Did you guys watch my video? Allison did. Oh, wow.
Look. It's river ice skating.
This is awesome.

Wait, but she's so tiny and the onesie.

Like the cow onesie and the polka dot? It's like the little polka dot onesie, but she's just so little.

Wait, can I air out a grievance for a second? Please, we love a grievance. The whole team went to see a psychic, and I wasn't invited.
Okay, not the whole team. It's giving Brittany Baben.

I was also not invited. I said, I didn't want to go.

Justin was invited, but politely declined. You guys want to be here in the office? I went, Zach went.

Are we not a part of the office? Trayvon went. Whose idea was this? Zach.
Why do you guys want to see a psychic?

He was just like, do you want to go see a psychic and I was like you know what hell yeah who's getting promoted who's getting fired

hey that's but I want to between the psychic um so what happened this I'm getting apparently getting laid okay yeah so that's huge news

I don't I don't know but I think she isn't that inevitable what well it was the well I was also trying to do bits with the psychic and she was not having it like she was she was you know were you trying to rein on her craft

no i was just like a real joke about it. Here's the thing.
We did it with everyone else in the room, which I thought would be really funny. And then we started getting into it.

And then I was like, wait. Well, the psychic told me that I should keep my cards a little closer to my chest.
And then I looked down and I was like, so not like this.

And then she didn't like that very much.

The psychic basically was reading my tarot cards and then was just saying I need to be a bit more discerning about like people like in the world of my life and stuff.

I was like, yeah, maybe like hold your cards a bit closer to your chest and don't let people see all your cards. And then I looked down and I I was like, oh, so not like this.

Thinking that she would be like,

nope, she wasn't, she wasn't there for humor. She was not there for humor.
She was predicting the future. I mean, she really has to be zoned in.
Yeah.

And then I pulled, she pulled the devil card and she was like, you're going to have sex. And I was like, with the devil?

And she was like, no, no, no, no. Could be fun.
But like, what's the timeline on that? I, because I'm like, of course, you're going to get laid at some point. At some point in my life.

But it seemed like it was in the now. I suppose that the devil's like, you know, fluid.
But then also,

I was, for me, the devil, I was like,

the devil for sure goes both ways. But also, it's funny because Zach's romance, in Zach's romance reading,

she was like, oh, yeah, like girl, girl, girl with Zach. And then for me, she was like, person.

And I was like, okay. I love the idea of that plot twist.
That plot twist.

But also, I was like, do you think she was just trying to be progressive and was like unsure how you identified or what you were into? And she was like, I'm just just gonna go person.

She saw the haircut and the hat and was like, I don't want to

guess, I don't want to guess, I want to tip.

Um, like you see someone with Mary's haircut, or like a woman you think is pregnant, just don't assume

you got all my

tool rules on the ground clogged left and right. She was also like, Don't overthink things, and I was like, Well, after a psychic reading, what do you think I'm gonna

do?

Anyway, that was my experience with a psychic. Well, what was the biggest

who walked away with like a fuck? Like a whoa.

Yeah.

I mean, I feel, I don't want to share anyone else's psychic reading. Okay.
Like. Is this like a HIPAA law? Yeah, I don't know.

You guys were all there together. We were all there together.
Who got like the biggest reaction or who like walked away being like, oh shit, I've got some things to think about.

This was a group doctor appointment.

Did anyone get a like,

your career is really going to take off? Or the CC? All of our career ones were actually pretty good. Great.
Okay, that's a good sign. Yeah.

Is anybody going through a breakup or going to find the love of their lives? Oh, apparently I'm going to. Oh, you're getting laid and finding the love of your life.

Finding the love of my life, and then that freaked me out. Mary,

I need you to have nothing else in your life other than this job. Okay.
You're not allowed to fall in love right now.

That's crazy.

Copy, I'll stay at work.

Oh, my God. I wish.

I wonder if the psychic predicted like the top baby names.

Nice transition. How did I know that that's what you were going to say? Next.
Hoping you're going to say, like, how do you feel about like Liam or Olivia?

Because the top 10 baby names of 2024 have been dropped.

Why 2024? We're like two years behind. No, it says, oh, it does say, well, it's 2025.
Okay. Because the top 10 baby names of 2025 says top 10 baby names of 2024 on the website.

Is it? What is this from?

We're so far away. This is from.
Okay, so the top 10 baby names of 2024, because, you know, we're wrapping 2025, so we haven't counted the data. Yes.

All the babies haven't been born in 2025. How could we possibly? Spotify's just ahead of the game.
Well, Nick, this is when Louie and River were both born. So it's our

kids. Let's piss off a bunch of parents.

Number one, Liam.

Nah.

No. I think that's a nice name.
Liam. Liam's cute.
Every Liam I know is like very kind.

Do you think this has anything to do with the boy band? Potentially.

I guess the directioners are. Didn't Liam pass? Growing up.
Liam Payne. Liam Payne.
Maybe people were naming after him. Maybe it was like an honor Liam.

Olivia is the number one girl name, and that is a one directional name. I feel like Olivia has been popular for a while now.
I will say it's a hot girl name. It's a hot girl name.

Yeah, like you don't really see a lot of ugly active Olivians.

I've never met an ugly Olivia. All right, boys, we got Liam, Noah, Oliver.
Oliver's cute. Theodore.
Huh? Theodore. Theo.
Theo. Teddy.
Teddy. Teddy.
Teddy was a good nickname. James Henry Mateo.

Elijah. Elijah was the name that I wanted my name to be when I was a kid.

That was my go-to fake name. Oh, really? Elijah.
I thought it was sexy. And biblical.
Yeah. Sexy and nice.
Elijah is cute. Lucas and William rounds out number 10 for the boys.
Olivia Emma.

Also a hawk girl name. Amelia.
I like Amelia. My niece's name is Amelia.
Shout out, Amelia. Charlotte,

not for me. Mia, Sophia, Isabella.
That's been popular for a while. Evelyn, Ava, and Sophia with an F.
Sophia with an F. Yes, yes.

Evelyn, Sophia got

two nods in the top 10 with different spellings. Oh, yeah.
I think Sophia with an F is kind of chic. Sophia with an F and Sophia with a P-H-I-A were both in the top 10.
They did.

Imagine the rivalries between the Sophias in grade school coming up in about a decade. That is so funny.
I would be, if I was a PH, I would be so jealous of the apps.

I was going to say, and also like hating the end of like, if I had an E instead of an A.

Well, none of these names are in

our bank for, well, if we're lucky enough to have more kids. So I was going to say, all of the boys' names are kind of giving like Jane Austen novel.

Yeah. Like we're kind of back to like very traditional names.
I like that. It sounds like a man.
Yeah. You know what I mean?

We're getting away from like Comet

and Cup.

True, we are we are veering away from the like Apple Tuesday. I'm gonna bring it back to like adjectives,

windshield wiper, yeah, from the adjectives and the verbs, Wednesday. Who was it? What was it? Was it Wednesday? Who, what's her name? Francesca Farago.
Francesca Farago. No, Edder.
It was her.

She named her daughter. Afternoon.
Her son was

afternoon. Afternoon.
But she didn't use that, so it's still a little bit. It's pretty, though.
Afternoon? I see the vision.

I kind of see the vision. Like a nickname after.

First of all, it's it's two syllables. And I say this as someone who's named Nicholas.
It's just a mouthful. Nicholas.

God.

Oh, my God. Nicholas.

When

afternoon?

That's three syllables. It's like a sentence.
Afternoon.

You need to clap.

You've got to clap. That's the only way I can count syllables.
I agree. I also do that.
Do you count with your fingers? Yeah, obviously. So do I.
And I still get it wrong. Yeah.

Wait, are we moving on? I'm pregnant, everyone. Okay.

Got this out of the bag now. Yes, I am having another boy, and I do not have a name.
I do.

Yes, I'm having another boy. Having another boy.
Boy, mom. I am going to be very much a boy mom.
So send me. Does that mean I'm destined to have your best wishes? I know I am.
I hope so.

That would be fun for us. I don't say that like a bad.
I hope that doesn't sound bad. I just have like one son.

Well, to be honest, I like, when I found out that i was having another boy like i'm i'm happy but there was a piece of me that was like i really wanted one of each yeah i mean obviously

when uh when uh liam pops out um you will love liam and we'll you'll never imagine liam we just named your baby i am not naming my son liam

anything but but like i don't know leo as a as a as a lady as a woman as a girl yes like i imagine like right like i feel outnumbered it's not even that it's i think it's more like I think for me, wanting to be a father, like, obviously the way I raise River, you know, like everything I enjoy, I want to share that with River and see if she enjoys it.

Great. And I hope we can share a lot of things.

But, like, as a guy, yeah, I want the opportunity to like raise a young boy, you know, and raise them the way I hope like young boys should be and young men and raise them to like, you know, be good men, you know, and I think, I feel like it's more a reflection of me.

I don't know. Maybe that's silly, you know, I don't know, but there's just something about like, I don't know, if you had a daughter, there's like, I see what you're saying.

There's like something like you'll, you'll be able to like Natalie and River. There's so many like woman moments they're going to be able to share that I just won't be a part of.

And that's totally okay, you know?

River and I have our own wonderful bond, but like, yeah, there is something about that that I will, if I don't have that opportunity, and that will be okay because I'll be lucky enough to have daughters, it will be something that I will always like wonder about, you know, like absolutely.

And that's fine. You know, you'll wonder about like what it would have been like to have a boy or a girl if you didn't have that opportunity.
Yeah.

No, I completely, I completely agree. I think, um,

yeah, again, I'm excited that I'm having another boy. I think Louis having a brother will be really nice.
Um, and I guess I am more of a boy mom, like when I really think about it.

But yeah, there is that like bond that mothers and daughters have like my mom is my best friend, like that you go through and you have where it's like, I still really would love to have a daughter one day where I'll get to like go through, yeah, certain things that only a mother and daughter can do.

Yeah, there's so much truth in like the stereotypes and like, you know,

little boys are like rambunctious and like wild and crazy and they get into shit. And like little girls are just like, just like so much more gentle than boys.

Like we were at Thanksgiving and Natalie's cousin has a boy almost right around Rivers age.

And just like the energy, a little boy and a little girl, it's just fascinating and funny just because, you know, it just plays into the like, oh my God, he's this crazy boy.

And Rivers is like gentle.

And then, but obviously when River gets older and she's a teenager, no doubt that will, she will butt heads with Natalie because that, oh, like that just always seems to happen.

But when River gets older, like the relationship that moms and daughters have in adulthood is always, not always.

I mean, obviously with family dynamics, it can get a little funky, but like there's often a bond that a mother and daughter will share later in life that is truly like, I think, special.

And that's really cool. And I'm excited for Nellie to be able to share that.
Yeah, me too. Well, congratulations, Leo.
Thank you. I am not naming him Liam.

Did you guys see the Mormon Wives reunion cast photos?

I know that they did, and they were not very happy about it. Well, the reunion was last night.
We were recording this before we got a chance to watch it.

So if anything, like crazy and wrecky wild that needs to break, we need to break down, we will get to that on

Tuesday of next week. But yeah, the cast photos were released, and it is kind of hilarious because the ladies are not too pleased.

It is fascinating because like Jesse called it out that like they take these photos like after the reunion.

They said after a 12-hour day of screaming and crying, we look horrible and disassociated every single time. Yeah, they're long ass

days.

Is it actually 12 hours? I don't know how long this shoot lasted. I mean, when I did

the first reunion, it was like, I don't know, it was probably closer to like

six or eight. That's still a really

to like be talking and being emotional. You also want a photo of your fresh glam.
Like I know they're getting touch-ups and stuff, but like it's not the same. I mean, it's a long fucking

women, it's emotional. They're on edge.
Like they're recording this reunion before they've seen this, before they've even seen the season. So they don't really know what's going to be played.

And they're like, it's very highly emotional. Was this filmed before Taylor went to

Bachelorette? Yeah. Okay.

The lighting is also just overhead. I think it was filmed like in September or something.
Listen, Ravo has it figured out at every reunion.

They do the full cast and the individual shoots before any talking happens. So I don't know why you would wait till after somebody's crying, reliving trauma from the last year.

And then you're like, you know what? Let's do a headshot. Put the lighting in the front and a little back lighting, not overhead.
I'm just sad that this happened before Fruity Pebbles gate. I know.

Well, this is what caused Fruity Pebbles. To be honest, yeah.
Yeah. And that's kind of what I'm excited to see.
What did Demi share that caused Jesse to be like, you know what? Fuck it. Grandpa Brett.

Do you think it'll be him

in it?

That's what she said. She said, something that you'll see in the reunion that Demi did is why she's done.
Like, has took the cap off and was like, here is why, what,

yeah, what grandpa Brett

drinking like dirty soda. That's what prevented us.

I cannot wait. Oh, my God.

And then did you see Dakota

posted a TikTok about him saying, when you realize you can date 30 girls without being on a TV show, diabolical. Is he just like, is he announcing his fuckboy era?

He's like, by the way,

I'm a slut.

I was going to say, I feel like

it's been leaked. Yeah.
Dakota didn't need to announce it himself. Is he going full villain? This is my take on Dakota.

I think that he needs to let Taylor have her moment of being the bachelorette and not make this experience about him every five seconds.

I mean, no one's a bigger Taylor Frankie Paul fan than me, but I do feel like this must be a difficult experience for him. It's his fault.

He lost her. Fair.
It's fair. I mean, who knows what happened in the relationship of Taylor Frankie Paul and Dakota? Well, we do know because it happens on the show.
It was

quite literally on DV. He literally.

Fuck me.

He literally, like, like...

What was his sex did with

her family friend? Her family friend.

You have a girl from season two that's exactly. And then cheated on her.
And then you have the girl

footage that apparently slept with Dakota.

Did he rage bait everyone?

He did hashtag, like, sorry for the rage bait or whatever. So it's like he knows he's just taking a punch and trying to get some engagement.
But were people disgusted or were they

like most people? I didn't read the comments, honestly, but I was like, oh, come on, dude. Yeah, I think most people were just kind of like, eye roll, like, we get it.
That's what I did.

I was just like,

and she's done filming Bachelorette, right? because I feel like she's she's

yeah well she's with her producers a lot but she she teased

maybe not done filming then but she teased a photo of her with her in her Crocs and a guy in cowboy boots so it's kind of like it feels like she's like at least narrowed down if they're not done filming yeah I don't think they're done I think she posted something recently What I'm most interested in though, because I did see a clip from the reunion of Stasi asking Taylor about Chase and like, was it a date?

And I'm like, this storyline isn't going anywhere. Yeah.
Could you imagine if we all get played and it ends up being like Chase is who she picks at the end? He comes like it's like a whole spin-off.

Like crazy. Yeah.
He comes on to the season of the bachelorette as like the ex-boyfriend.

I mean, it will be, I mean, it will be fascinating if Taylor ends up with someone and it like works out for a period of time. Will this person

be on Mormon wives? Right? They kind of have to, right?

Are these guys auditioning for dad talk? Yeah, because that would be weird if it's like, all right, right, well, we're together, but like while you film that show, I'll stay out of the way.

Yeah, it is crazy to think about. Like, I mean, you're, you know, the bachelor experience is wild, right, for anyone.

Like, and all these people coming on the show, the suitors, like, you know, obviously, I'm sure some are coming for the attention. Obviously, they're going on TV.

But, like, to be like, all right, so great, you're in love. You have now entered the messiest

universe of reality TV that, hey, you got to be a part of. And just so you know,

the boys,

they don't usually

Well, I think everybody who signed up for Taylor season knew it was going to be Taylor. So like they had to know that they were getting themselves into, no?

Or maybe they think they know, but they don't really know.

I don't think they fully have any idea of what their world will look like.

But it will certainly be fascinating how Taylor's person, assuming she ends up with someone, will be integrated into her life.

I mean, like already like that's one of the most fascinating follows of a bachelor couple you know what i'm saying like right because it's usually it's just like all right well you know are you guys gonna move like what are you guys gonna do like are you what it's all like the same like are you guys planning a wedding it's gonna be like so like what's in store for season well they've already recorded season four so i guess we'll have to wait for season five that's my that's my curiosity about the time always about the timeline of the show is like so is taylor gonna be it in a lot of season four

Because when

they filmed it a while back,

they finished,

I'm guessing they finished filming season four before Taylor filmed. Almost certainly, 100%.
Well, I hope they pick up cameras for the Fruity Pebbles drama. So do they?

They will definitely pick up cameras and incorporate, you know, Taylor Frankie Paul's bachelorette experience. You know, they have the, like, obviously, this is a big crossover.

This is like Hulu really investing in their universe. You have, like,

you know, Netflix and Hulu and Peacock. They're, they're, you know, they're, it's a streaming competition.

They're really trying to like find their talent, build their like universe, you know, and have these crossovers. You're seeing it more and more.

The integration with Dancing with the Stars is right, there's that too.

I want to see the period of time between like, I mean, I don't know if they'll be filming during it, but like, because isn't there like a three month, four month period where they've done, finished filming, she's picked her person and they have to like get together in secret or like hide in disguise, hide away, like that, that part of their relationship because what do they call them because if you think about it

the happy couple weekends happy couple weekends happy couple weekends that'd be great for for for oh that'd be great for mom talk

like do will we get behind the scenes of dancing with the stars between whitney and jen and jen yeah and then whitney getting roxy like is that all gonna be in the season because i i want to see all of it it better be i want to see her camera

better be that makes a lot of sense it's uh well we love these women you know what they should pick up cameras for also? I think that they should put Taylor Ann Green back on Southern Charm. Yeah.

Because

Taylor Ann Green and Sally are

feuding.

Feuding. Apparently on TikTok, somebody made a video about the two of them and Sally's behavior.
And a comment said it's giving Taylor energy.

So then Taylor shows up in the comments saying, totally, because I'm capable of manipulating a doctor into cheating on his wife.

Oh, and fully dating someone the entire time they were filming this past season while also trying to hook up with both Craig and Austin. Cute, Cute, watch what happens live.
I'm a girl's girl.

I would never do that to Paige. Yeah, it's totally giving Taylor energy.
Get the fuck out.

So everyone's like, oh my God. I mean, Taylor, I love the messiness, but like,

why aren't you still on the show? Get off the show.

Get on or get off. You know? Get out of the comments, get on the streets of Charleston.
Okay. We miss you.
We miss you, D.

You know, and listen, you know, the plight of the pretty blonde girl. You know, like, you all look the same.
You know,

us white guys, we all look the same. That's crazy.
You know, what are you going to do? I mean, it says one thing to be triggered by, like, you know, like being compared to another pretty blonde girl.

But Sally did see what Taylor wrote, and she responded in a story. Oh.
And she said, wild how strangers can confidently

state facts in quotations about situations they've never been in and people they don't actually know. Let me just say, the rumors circulating online about my personal life are completely false.

The only doctor I've been involved with was my ex-fiancé, and he was well out of his marriage when I met him. Secondly, I did not have a boyfriend while filming this season.

Thirdly, the person making these accusations needs to shut their mouth before I open mine. Art Sally.
Is she talking about Taylor when she says strangers? I imagine so.

Because they did a whole season together. So I think also in the comments.
Sounds like they really talked.

Are talking about Sally's behavior as well? Because I guess I didn't know this, but Sally was on The Bachelor. Yes.
So people said that her behavior is consistent. Yes, she showed for like two years.

She tried twice, she showed up for like a hot second on Colton's season, I think it was, and like left. It was a whole thing.
She like didn't even make it to the rose ceremony.

She's like, I can't do this. And then she's like, you know what? I'm going to try in Paradise again.
And then once again, was like, I can't do this. Oh, shit.
Which is shocking that

she entered in the Bravo universe, which was way messier and way toxic. And like, you know, you don't catch,

you don't catch like fucking heaters like this in bachelor nation

they're way too pr trained over there at abc oh everyone in bachelor nation is just so afraid of like ruffling any feathers like the way

well

the way bachelor people like read each other's reddit it's hilarious

based on sally's reaction to how craig was flirting with charlie she would not have done very well on the bachelor no no no well and let's not forget like sally talking about gaston taylor's man yes

like that was the whole thing where it was like why are you worried about my man's first of all but then also like wasn't throat choke guy um remember that he's on southern hospitality he dated somebody on southern hospitality and taylor as well so it's just like they share an ex i know they share at least an ex it's messy i'm happy for taylor being off the show because sally also you're happy that taylor's off yeah she like that's when you know it's a real human when they're like i don't want this show it's messy and it's good for my life and she's got her company reset and totally.

I will say, like, Taylor sent me a reset sweatshirt. Uh-huh.
I love it. It's, it's.
It's so cozy here. It's cozy.
It's great. Shout out Taylor's fit line.

But that's, I agree with you, Justin, but like, that's what I'm saying. Like, what we're go, and I say this with love, Taylor.
Go protect your heart, you know? Go, like, why?

You got triggered by like a fan saying you guys look alike? Like, what? Like, I think Sally triggers her because Sally came for her relationship.

right yeah but like this was a fan post like just i don't know like if this is triggering you and for you to like i don't know what the analogy is but like some fan like again just like compared them and then all of a sudden taylor was this like she's a lying cheating bitch

okay imagine if you're sally you wake up and you're just like huh

you would be triggered if someone compared you to your arch nemesis yeah catch me on the wrong day

Sally,

Taylor, I just, you're better than this. You're better than this.
You know?

I plot her. Or, or, but yeah, but then come back on the show.
No, she has her peace.

It does not sound like this. Does not sound like a peaceful person.
Listen. Sometimes all you need to do is leave a comment and not have it filmed on TV.
Exactly.

She isn't doing this for the money anymore. She just did that for the chaos.
She's controlling the narrative. Yeah.
Okay.

Okay.

Okay. Period.

i don't think anybody would have seen this comment if she hadn't commented no no literally no one like i mean it's just like the amount of times i said this all the time i mean i

not someone wanted to come on the podcast and respond to some internet drama and i was like i just don't think i was like you can come on and you know we'll get the clicks for it but like i i've never heard of this before and because someone went on to some podcast and you know it's not a a larger podcast and i was like you want to come on on and respond to something no one's heard about and then come on this show and like blast it out to the universe?

Like you're, you're going to, you're going to look messy, you know? And I don't think that's what you want to look like, you know?

But. No, you said sometimes the best form of response is no response at all.
Not sometimes.

Always. Always.

Always.

With the internet? Yeah, with the internet. You're just like, you know, it's just like only, you know, because when it's about you, it does feel like everyone's talking about you.

I, like, I get what that, what that feels like, but you just have, you can't be in this business and not have some kind of self-awareness about the, like, the sea that is the internet and the drama, you know, it's just like, and like, this too shall pass.

But like, to, to instigate it, like, I get why when people who are on reality TV are messy like this, because like it's part of the gig, right?

Like, it's, it's work, you know, it keeps the storyline going.

why taylor's doing it it makes no sense it's funny that you're saying that because talking about controlling your narrative uh johnny of bananas was on a podcast and he was asked about like lindsay hubbard and how he knew lindsay and um he said like he knew her back when she was a publicist after the calling off of the wedding with uh carl that they hooked up dated for like a little bit.

And then he said a couple months went by and the announcement came out that Lindsay was pregnant and that he like had a little little palpitations over it, thinking that he could possibly be the father.

Lindsay, talking about controlling your narrative, Lindsay pissed, posted a story about it with a screenshot of page six of the interview saying, Dear Johnny Bananas, in case you've never had the birds and the bees talk, you actually have to have sex to get pregnant.

And last I checked, we never hooked up. Get an all-red, get your relevancy from someone else.
And let me be clear: my baby is way too cute to be a bananas baby.

Oh, Oh, I love her. She's amazing.
I love activating. See, like, that makes sense.
And it, like, first of all, because, like, this guy's pretending to maybe be her baby daddy. Baby daddy.

Baby daddy, Johnny Bananas. Claiming

confused.

He's not a stranger on the internet. He is Johnny Bananas.
Is there a more pathetic thing to claim that you had sex with someone you didn't? I don't think so. I mean, it's definitely top.

It's pretty loser diabolic. Yeah.

Specifically if you're chopped, it's cooked. It's hung.

and and like on a like unprovoked on a podcast like you know what i mean like that it wasn't really like a question of like did you guys hook up did you date he just like offered that information

where it's like it in it implies that you had sex with lindsay you know like he touched a boob and he was like you know maybe

it's giving we went in a hot tub together

you know maybe he listened to our our clayton eckhart podcast and was like you know anything's possible

somebody uh sent me a dm about her and apparently she's getting sued by somebody else. She's been running this scam for a long time.
Yeah, like this. Yeah.

That's always been the narrative. It is a scam.

But it's like more people keep coming out. And somebody just sent me one recently.

They need to make like a each

docu series.

Yeah. Because I don't understand.
It goes wild. Or we can go back and listen to that episode with Clayton if you haven't.
Not on ours. It's a doozy.

All right. Well, we got Ryan Sirhan coming up next, talking about a man who controls his narrative.

He is killing the real estate game, and he is on the new season of owning Manhattan, which comes out on Friday on Netflix.

He is up next, and my wonderful, charming, delightful, smart, educated, brilliant, emotionally intelligent, and delightful wife also joins Ryan and I next.

That was great. I wish you were in the room.
Here is the best one yet. I just had to warm up, guys.
I just had to warm up. I got a little stage fries with her beauty.

Anyways, Ryan.

The holidays can get busy and overwhelming quickly, and thoughtful gifts that encourage slowing down and prioritizing self-care always stand out.

With Neutrophol, give the gift of stronger and faster-growing hair, an ideal gift for anyone who deserves a boost of confidence and science-backed support heading into the new year.

Neutrophil is the number one dermatologist-recommended hair growth supplement brand, trusted by over one and a half million people, seeing thicker, stronger, faster-growing hair with less shedding in just three to six months.

This holiday season, Neutrophil is the perfect perfect gift for anyone on your list.

Your mom or your aunt going through menopause, a friend who just had a baby and is experiencing postpartum hair shedding, your husband or father who relies on his baseball hat to cover it up, or yourself or anyone looking to support their overall hair health.

It's the perfect stocking stuffer. I can't tell you how much I love this product.
It's a product I will rave about forever. It's a product I'll take forever.

It's a product I'll recommend to anyone who asks me. I've taken everything that they offer.

I currently am taking the women's hair growth nutraceuticals and I truly am seeing visibly visibly thicker, stronger, less shedding, and my hair has never been healthier.

And I accredit it all to Neutrophil. So, see thicker, stronger, faster-growing hair with less shedding in just three to six months with Nutrofall for a limited time.

Neutrophil is offering our listeners $10 off your first month subscription and free shipping when you go to neutrophil.com and enter the promo code VIALL.

Find out why Nutrofall is the best-selling hair growth supplement brand at neutrophil.com, spelled N-U-T-R-A-F-O-L.com, promo code V-I-A-L-L. That's neutrophil.com, promo code V-I-A-L-L.

Well, it's holiday season, and you know, you probably will be entertaining. And when you are, be sure that your party is accompanied by Happy Thursday.

Indulge in your favorite guilty pleasures this holiday season with Happy Thursday spike refreshers. No fuzz, no fizz, no bubbles, just great vibes right at your fingertips.

Happy Thursday is a bubble-free non-carbonated spike refresher that's 4.4 ABV with vibrant fruit flavors. Guys, Happy Thursday is delicious.
I got several cans right here. They're delicious.

They taste great. They're non-carboned.
No one likes to burp, especially you ladies. I mean, like, let's be honest, like, it and the guys too.

You know, no one likes to, like, you're going to be eating this holiday season. There's going to be great food.
Don't fill up on the bubbles.

Get a refreshing drink with Happy Thursday Spike Refresher. Your friends and family will rave about it.
Make sure you're bringing Happy Thursdays to the party.

All their flavors are delicious, whether it's the strawberry, the pineapple star fruit, the raspberry dragon fruit, or the mango passion fruit. They're all delicious.

Sometimes I can't choose between the raspberry dragon fruit and the mango passion fruit for my favorites, but they're all really delicious. It really doesn't matter.

Make sure you are bringing Happy Thursday Spike Refresher to your party this holiday season. You won't regret it.
So if you are feeling thirsty this holiday season, have a happy Thursday.

To find out more and to find a happy Thursday near you, visit drinkhappythursday.com slash V-I-A-L-L. That's drinkhappythursday.com slash V-I-A-L-L.

Celebrate responsibly, non-carbonated, naturally flavored with other natural flavors. 21 Plus Contains alcohol 2025 molson core beverage company milwaukee wisconsin beer

money is tight for pretty much everyone these days and so be sure to check out chime chime is changing the way people bank chime isn't just another banking app they unlock smarter banking for everyday people with products like my pay giving you access to up to 500 of your paycheck anytime by giving you access up to 500 of your paycheck anytime and getting paid up to two days early with direct deposits some old banks still don't do this Forget overdraft fees, minimum balance fees, and monthly fees.

Chime turns everyday spending into real rewards and progress. So many key benefits of Chime they have bank.
Fee-free, plus overdraft coverage, you can count on.

It helps build credit history stress-free, earn up to 3.5% APY on savings. That's eight times higher than the traditional bank.
Rated five stars by USA Today for customer service.

And you get to talk to real humans 24-7. And now with the new Chime card, it's the new way to build credit.
No annual fees, no interest, no strings attached.

When you get qualified for direct deposits, you get 1.5 cash back on eligible QIIME card purchases.

I certainly know my younger self, me and my 20s, would have certainly benefited from all the key features at QIIME.

So again, if you are looking to save at all and improve your finances like everyone is, think of Chime. Chime is not just smarter banking.
It's the most rewarding way to bank.

Join the millions who are already banking fee-free today. It just takes a few minutes to sign up.
Head to chime.com slash V-I-A-L-L. That is chime.com slash V-I-A-L-L.

Ryan, welcome to the show. No, thank you.
Thanks for having me. Great to have you.
You talk about real estate a lot on this podcast. Not really.

Really? But everyone is interested in real estate. Yeah.
Do you find that? Do you find like you're one of the most interesting people at any event? Because you're like, everyone.

I find I talk about real estate most of my life. Most people I meet either live in a house or need one.
That's right. You know,

like, should I buy? Should I not buy? Am I wasting my money? Interest rates going down.

What should I do? My landlord said this, my microwave, this, that, the other. Exactly.

I'm also impressed by how many people just assume I know everything about all things real estate wherever I am in the world, as if it's all created equal. Well, there you go.

What don't you know about real estate?

My main markets are New York and Florida for like me as a salesperson. Like those are the markets I know like the back of my hand have done them for 17 years.
I run my own company now.

I started in 2020. We've been slowly expanding, expanding west.
And so I get to go and open these markets and then also learn about

what's the difference between, you know, Desert Mountain, downtown Scottsdale, and Paradise Valley. Yeah, I don't know, you know, you figure it out as you go.

Do you find a lot of people are migrating from New York to Florida these days? I think a lot of people migrate out of California and out of New York to Florida and to Texas and to Arizona.

Like there's states that are definitely commercialized to incentivize people to live there.

Like you have to to think about every state is a company with a CEO, the CEO, and sometimes a co-CEO, depending on the relationship between the governor and the individual mayors, especially in a place like New York City.

So Manhattan is a big, big center of revenue for the state.

And then do they treat their employees like they want them to be at the company or do they treat the employees like they don't want you to be at the company?

And then there's other companies like you don't all have to work for Apple. There's other companies to go to.
So then it's like a fight for employees. And I'm getting very Anne-Rand on this, But

speaking my language. Yeah, it's how we track, it's how we've moved the, you know, the company.

We just sort of like follow the marketplaces and make sure that we're in the places where people want to move from. And then there's life changes and all that.
What you're seeing a lot right now is

interest rate divorce.

where like there's been a locked-in effect for people that have you know really low interest rates from the past 12 years especially coming out of COVID where a lot of people refinance sub 3%

and then they've decided that they don't want to be together anymore but people People have nice houses, and so they're sleeping in separate bedrooms, just waiting for interest rates to come down.

And now that rates are starting to come down, I'm telling you, like you're going to see record numbers of divorce over the next 24 months.

Yeah, finally, because you're like, I can go lock in a better rate with the new guy. Now,

I don't want to give up this rate anymore. It's become a whole thing.
So, do you think you find that many, many of these people are just going through the marriage motions and not separating?

I think most people have a hard time understanding if they wake up to feel happy or if they wake up to feel important. And I think that's like a meta-level discussion to have across the board.

Couples specifically typically don't want change, right? They don't want to like, it's a pain in the ass. Like it's just brain damage.

And then when you have to think about what your monthly costs are going to be and your monthly payments, et cetera, and real estate is involved, it's all a part of the equation.

And sometimes the math just doesn't math and you'll sleep downstairs.

we were just talking before we started about

the new building in new york city that's like the tallest apartment is it the tallest one of yeah one of the tallest residents

yeah 432 park yeah 432 park and like i was told by a friend and maybe this is like an old wise tale that it was like empty and owned by a bunch of russian oligarchs yeah

there were

no you know you'd be surprised like new york city as a whole is 70 rental so like at the end of the day it's it's actually a little bit more than that.

It's predominantly just landlords and institutional companies that own a lot of rental apartments. And most people in New York rent at all price points.

It's pretty crazy because the cost of ownership is just so high.

And then most of those apartments, let's say 25% of the ones that are bought and sold, are bought and sold by New Yorkers.

5% of New York City is investors, oligarchs, which haven't just been around since the war, and

Asian investors flipping properties. That was much more prominent in the Obama days, right?

And coming out of 9-11, because the United States was just put on this massive, massive pedestal of recovery and people like deals. It's the same thing here.

The people that are buying up the Palisades and buying up Malibu are not like local locals who want to go through that again and know the pain.

It's billionaires in Australia and Japan who just are buying the deals. And you see that time and time again.

But I heard that like this building, now that it's like finished and people are moving in, it's kind of like starting to crumble. And like,

I heard it like maybe sway.

It definitely sway.

It definitely sways. It definitely sways.

All those buildings sway.

If you build a, you put a monolith a thousand feet in the air, embedded into the bedrock of an island as it gets windy, because the wind moves much, much faster as you kind of go up the tower, especially when it has these rigid angles.

You see, a lot of towers are built with, you know, irregular angles and they have these windbreak floors. So you'll look at a building and you'll say, it looks like no one lives there all the time.

But what it really is, is they're all darked out because they're not actually windows. It's space in the building that's somewhere between typically like 40 feet high.

So a four-story building high, roughly every 15 floors or so, that just allows the wind to pass through the building. So the building doesn't sway.

And then at the top, you'll have something like an 800 ton, it's called a tuned mass damper, which if you've looked at like a sailboat, the keel underneath that keeps the boat from flipping over, it's that put on the top of a tower.

And it's this massive pendulum that moves as the, as Earth moves to stop it from moving.

So that building, 432, has all of that, and it's fine, except the way they constructed the facade and the building, it's now starting to show cracks, and they just don't know.

Is it catastrophic or is it just

superficial? They don't really know yet. You said fine, like some people talk about their marriage.
Fine.

Yeah, it's fine. It's fine.
It's fine. Yes,

there's a major lawsuit between the people who live in the building and the original developers.

And we have a lot of clients who are in the building and we move them there, whether they're renting there or buying there. And some people are like, you know what?

I could live other places. I don't have to live in a building like this.
And so we're helping them.

And how much does one apartment in that building go for?

I mean, the couple that I was just talking to on in the car actually outside and trying to figure out what their next steps are because his wife won't go back in the building now just because it's just like she just can't like she just can't get a she can't think yeah you know knowing that something could potentially happen even though it's fine um uh i rented them that apartment it's a three bedroom for 65 000 a month we have a floor in the building on the market right now for 55 million dollars i mean half floor apartments in that building as you stack up are somewhere between 25 and 30 million bucks per half floor why are we renting for 65 000 a month like i feel like that person who can afford that could buy it or is it just more like like yeah they can always buy it but it's

opportunity costs on the capital so I could give somebody thirty million dollars to own this and then it's my problem or I could spend sixty five thousand bucks a month which is a lot less than thirty million dollars to live here if I'm only going to be here for the next year two years I don't know what's going to go on you know their primary residence oftentimes is in Florida to be like oh I lived in that building and if something happens someone else can fix it they don't have to worry about it yeah and you have you have optionality on your life it's definitely lighting money on fire but you'd be spending the money anyway.

Maintenance costs are high, real estate taxes are high. The cost of living on earth has become incredibly high.
How's the real estate market in New York these days?

I was talking to a friend who lives there, and he said, like, prices haven't really changed over the past 10 years. Is that accurate? No, not accurate.

The average price point in New York City now is higher than it's ever been before. The cost of rent is higher than it's ever been before.
The median price is higher than it's ever.

Like, we have, so like owning Manhattan season two

for Netflix tracks in real time a brutal deal that gets done for $60 million.

And when we did the deal, this was earlier this year, it was the highest purchase price ever for a condo in lower Manhattan.

There's been like some 40s and some 50s, but $60 million for a resale condo is a lot of money for New York City. And those trades are happening now, like left and right and left and right.

What's the lowest price point you will bother with these days? Like personally.

Yeah.

The majority of my time is spent on building the company now.

And I come in on lots of different types of deals, but I would say like I typically stay in what we call our high net work division, which is Sir Han Signature, which is 10 million plus for the most part.

What does like two and a half mil get you in New York these days? A great agent who works for me.

And

it depends on like saying, like, if let's say we were in the market, let's say, you know,

it depends on where you want to be. You can get a great two-bedroom apartment, two-bedroom condo, good view, good building, checks a lot, a lot of boxes.

But like, it used to be, and I always thought it was crazy, like 10 years ago, I'd say, New York City for like good location, you know, it's where you kind of want to be uptown or downtown.

It's going to cost you about a million dollars a bedroom. It's now closer to two.
Wow.

It's like two million bucks a bedroom, plus minus.

And it's, yeah, it's sort of, it's slowly becoming the pied to terre capital of the world, I think, which means the majority of the owners of that 70%

or sorry, the 30%, right, of the owners will end up just being part-time residence holders. Crazy.
Who just want to have a place there because there's no better place than New York.

Yeah, it'd be great to pop in and out. Yeah.
Yeah.

But they also don't do it. Let's do the dream.
Let's do it. New York doesn't do like Airbnbs.
No, they're outlawed. Right.
Yeah. Yeah.
Why is that? Because of hotel tax, lobbies. Yeah.

Like the hotels in New York City make a lot of money and it's a lot of tax for the city. But if Jim can just rent his apartment for five nights and may or may not declare the income,

That person's now not staying in a hotel and paying all the taxes. And so let's just outlaw that.

You quickly became one of New York City's top brokers. How do you,

how'd you do that from your perspective? What a, what a, what a question. I, I, I don't know.
I think I'm just so much better than everybody else. Yes.
You know, at the end of the day.

At the end of the day, honestly, it

comes down to it. Exactly.
Um, I think I I work a lot. I work every day, all day.

And

I follow up consistently. I think follow-up is

what you have to be relentless with, you know, and stay on top of everyone.

And I really understood how to build brand early on in my career so that you create like a passive funnel of inbound lead flow so that people come to me more to buy and sell houses than I have to go to them.

And I think that, you know, more was never enough for me. And I was always just sort of crazy about it.
And I got super lucky, like Million Dollar Listing New York changed my life in 2012.

Yeah, right. And then Netflix changed my life last year in a totally different way.

And so, I've just always kind of like chased these big brand moments, and they become just massive, massive organic funnels, and it's hard to compete.

What has been the difference between moving to Netflix? Oh, man, like

million dollar listing gave me the opportunity to knock on a door and someone would open it, right? When I was like brand new to my career, because I was like 26, I guess, at the time.

And so if I was just a regular salesperson, there's 80,000 realtors in New York City. You know, it's just like mass competition.
There's not that many deals.

And so I would knock on a door and no one would answer, right? You just work with people you know.

Million dollar listing enabled me to knock on a door and someone would at least answer it so I could have the conversation. Didn't mean I would get the the deal, but at least they would talk.

And then that slowly just helped me open more and more and more doors. And I just squeezed that fruit as much as I possibly could for like for 10 years.

And we did three, three spin-off shows. And it was great, but it was still cable TV, right? It ran, you know, once a week, and then it syndicated around the world.
But then audiences changed.

Like, you know, people started cutting the cord, et cetera. And I don't know if people realize this, but the number one lead source for me or for most luxury goods isn't actually the buyer.

It's their kids, right? It's the kids at the dinner table or the kids that work as the assistant or the young person who's interning, who has like influence in conversation.

And so I always wanted to spin a an awareness flywheel of how can I hit mom, dad, and son? Or how can I hit mom, mom, and, you know, investment banker who's 26 because they're an analyst.

And so I always had Bravo, which was to the left. So that would hit one spouse.
I'd then do thought leadership. So that was the news, LinkedIn, right?

Just nothing goofy, but just talking seriously about the product.

And then I would have social to hit the youngest person who would have the most most influence and then i just spun that media flywheel all day long to try to create as much inbound lead flow as possible netflix replaced the bravo bucket like on crack and so yeah season one of owning manhattan came out january 28th of last year and within like four days you could just feel that it had like just a global awareness of the kind that like i'd never experienced.

Like we have people right now, like if we're in the city right now, they're outside our building in Soho, just like like waiting and at a global level in every language to 300 million people in one day.

It's this is the American real estate guy, or this is the New York real estate guy. So it's, it's a different level of exposure, I'll say.

Owning Manhattan drops December 5th. What can people look forward to this upcoming season? Murder.
Murder.

Correct. Yeah.
It is New York. Yep.
Yep. Yeah.

Love triangles,

lots of debauchery. Anything that you want to see in reality TV, the show, the show has it.

It has the, you know, we've, the largest transaction I've ever done on a TV show, and I've been doing real estate reality TV for 15 years. Can you tell us what it is? What's the number? It's that one.

It's the one for 60. Because we've done large transactions.
We actually, I was in a plane on the way to Miami, and they were filming it as I sold a place for $160. And then

we just couldn't get the sign-offs to be able to talk about that on TV. So that one

almost was there. What's a commission of a $60 million

look like? And I hope your security isn't here.

3%.

3%.

It depends on the deal. Sometimes it's 6%.
Sometimes it's its lowest 2%, but it's somewhere between 2% and 6%

unless you're in Florida or you're in Monaco, and it can be like 8% or 10%.

Yeah. Monaco is an insane place to do real estate, as is Miami, as is Palm Beach.
Wow. So, yeah, the season has,

I don't know, it really redefines the genre, I think, of like what it means to watch a reality TV show.

And I think as people watch it, I think the reason the first season did so well is it's just not, it's not what you think it is. Like it's, it's, it's just very, very different.

Like you're watching people go to work, but it's a deal show. We basically shot the whole thing in real time.
It's not bullshit. It never feels fake because it's not, unfortunately.

It's such an easy watch. It's like such a great show

that like it just has, it keeps your attention. You're like curious.
It's it's fun. Every everything that's filmed in New York, I think is also just like has this.
Yeah, the city's a character for me.

Exactly, exactly. And it's such a good show.
You also have a six-year-old. Yeah, it gets better.
It gets better as they get older.

But yeah, she's cute. Yeah, I remember two.
Two was okay.

Three was fine. Four is kind of cute.
Five, they're just like figuring out things. At six, it's like a real person, but just like a six-year-old version.
What is her personality like?

Is she more like you or more like your wife?

When she's happy, she's like me. When she's angry, she's like my wife for sure.
Yeah. Yeah, I'm American.
My wife is Greek. And so then she's got, you know, the best and worst of both worlds.

She's definitely a performer, though. No matter what we do or what we say to her, she like really enjoys being in front of a camera.

It was like the best gift I gave her was a little camera with like a light where she could just perform her own version of wicked for hours and hours and hours on end.

Does she make y'all watch it or is she like, I just yeah, we have to, we have to watch. And it puts a whole end.
Yeah, it's a whole thing. I would say she's,

yeah, we have to applaud, but she's, she's tough. Like, she, we had all, my little brother has three kids, and they all came over to the house not too long ago from Boston.

And, you know, she wanted them to do, I can't remember what it was, but Zena has like a photographic memory.

She remembers every word and every line from every song from like a two-hour movie she'll watch. It's really wild.

And when the cousins weren't playing ball, she's like, well, then I'm just not going to play with you if you're not going to do this right. You know, and she's six.
And I'm like,

that's right. Yeah.
Go get them. There is no room for imperfect in this house.

You know, go get a juice box. What do you think she'll be when she gets older? I have no idea.
She likes math and being on stage. So I don't know.
AI will just do her job anyway, for sure.

I don't really know. I don't know.
I don't know.

I think you're, and you see this too with like a two, maybe not yet with a two-year-old, but once they hit kindergarten and now first grade, like you just try to not be overbearing, but you also try to make sure she just experiences as much as possible and kind of finds her way.

Like, do you like piano? No. Do you like tennis? Kind of.
Okay, great. Do you want to, I have her in jujitsu right now.
Oh, fun. Does she like it?

She says she does, but she's not a killer. Like they, these other little kids will come up to her and just do like full-on takedowns and she just goes for the hug.

And I, and she keeps coming over for like water because I'll take her to that. And I like have to get her to focus and like sweep the leg.

Like that little dude, his parents aren't here because they don't love him.

you have to take him down like i teach her about you know nancy kerrigan the whole thing i'm just take him out go down and then she goes back in and she like tries to give kisses and hugs i'm like you'll never maybe maybe

martial arts isn't for you are you martial arts trained at all no which is why i want a kid that can be a badass

yeah how was it navigating owning manhattan and raising a kid she's on it this season she was not on season one her birth ivf that whole thing was a big part of million dollar listing back in the day um and then we kind of with netflix we just didn't know what to do so like my wife isn't is barely on the first season xena's not on it at all we just didn't really know what to expect but then zina kind of like felt left out and so we were able to negotiate with my wife to get her to be in there so my wife is it's a much bigger part of season two um and she's kind of like the rock for me because my life is in total chaos at all times.

And then Xena has her own little moment. She's very excited.
She was, she's talked about it every single day since we filmed it.

What's something about yourself that people don't usually get to see about you off camera? What's something people don't see about me off camera? I don't know. I think

I'm like a theater geek, introvert, you know, at the end of the day. I came to New York City to do theater.

I ran out of money and I was move home, live with my parents or bartend or wait tables or get my real estate license like everybody else does to pay my bills. And that's what I did.

And then Lehman Lehman Brothers filed for bankruptcy that day in 2008. And then I had no other option but to just help people rent apartments.

And, you know, if you're trying to act in New York City specifically, I think anywhere, but it's, it's a numbers game, right? You just want to be seen by as many people as possible.

And real estate's the same exact thing. Like you just want to meet as many clients as you possibly can.
And the best part about New York is no one's in cars unless they're in like a taxi.

If they're in a car, they typically don't live there.

And so you just get to go outside and you get to say, all right, I want to meet 10 new people today. I can do that.
It would be really hard to do that here in LA.

Like, I find LA to be far lonelier than New York City. Oh, yeah.
Right. It can be very isolating here compared to New York, where you are forced to coexist.
Yeah.

And I think it just brings out like the best in people. But yeah, I think people probably assume that I'm insane and out there all the time.

But you're known. I mean, I feel like you're kind of known for like your confidence and your drive.
Yeah. So like what, I mean, what does self-discipline look like for you on a tough day?

I think discipline is doing the things you don't want to do, right? But doing them anyway.

Like I'll tell young people who work for me all the time, I'm like, the difference between an amateur and a professional in any business is amateurs make decisions based on how they feel.

Professionals make decisions based on their commitments.

So if you're going to make a commitment to do something, you say you're going to be there by five o'clock, you get there by 4.59 or move back home with your parents. Like there's no excuses.

And the best part about 2025 and 2026 and 2027 is everyone has the same podium now. It has been completely democratized.
For the most part, everything now has moved more and more towards meritocracy.

Like it's no longer as much about who you are and where you're from and who your parents are and where you've come from. All that stuff helps.
But like if you're lucky enough to be healthy and

have sound mind, body, and soul, like you can create anything, whenever, as long as you're completely relentless in doing it. So it's just about pushing through the hard times.

And even if it's pouring rain and there's dark clouds, like you force yourself to choose sunshine, I know that no matter what, tomorrow happens anyway.

So like, what's the worst that's going to happen? I mean, I don't know. I think that's how I push through it as much as I possibly can.
What is something that you once valued that you don't anymore?

My wife would totally disagree, but I definitely, I think, once valued my privacy that I just don't. I don't care anymore.
Like I'm a total open book. I've written three.
They're great. But I am,

my life and my, like my income and the career that I've built now has almost kind of been built on the backs of being a total open book and not being completely private.

And like there's no nobility in sitting behind closed doors anymore. Like if anything, you get to move far further in both your professional and your personal life by putting everything on the table.

Right. And yeah, I think that would be my answer to that.
And your wife disagrees? Oh, for sure. 100%.

Yes. She is incredibly private, you know, as much as possible.
She only does the shows and things because

I do. I think she posts something on Instagram once or twice a year.
It's just, and I think it's also culturally very different. Yeah.
Right. I don't know, European, American.
I don't know.

You got into real estate right around the housing crisis in 2008? Yeah, that day. Yeah, that's crazy.
Always a lot of speculation if there's another bubble or things like that.

Being Being the expert that you are, what is your sense on the overall real estate market? And do we ever have to worry about something like 2008 happening again? Absolutely.

I mean, I think markets always come in cycles. Things go up, things go down.
I think the thing that gives me comfort, though, is that

every future crash from now on

will be a little more painful than the last one, but last a little less long, right?

Just like COVID, like the pandemics pre-COVID, whether it was like the flu of 1918, you know, or, you know, the bubonic plague where Isaac Newton had to shelter in place as well, and an apple fell on his head.

And that's how, you know,

he, you know, went through his inventions. Like, that's a real story.

Everything happens a little bit faster now because there's just, I think, 8 billion people and people don't want to sit around and people don't want to have market crashes and everyone wants to get back to it.

And there's so much capital out there to kind of like move back into place.

I think that there won't be a housing crash. If anything, we're in a housing recession right now.

We're on year three of the worst inventory we've had in 30 years, the highest rates we've had in multiple decades, an unaffordability crisis, the likes of which the United States hasn't ever really seen, in which case typically the government has to step in and create things like the $500,000 joint married filing jointly

tax that they created in the 90s that they just haven't touched in almost 30 years now. I think if there is a crisis, I don't think it's going to be a massive stock market crash.

I think you have a debt crisis for sure.

Like the amount of people that are caring buy now, pay later debt, right, on food, the amount of people who have cars they can't afford, houses they can't afford, student loans that they can't pay off, you know, will eventually get to the point where you're going to have to start, you know, writing off all of the consumer debt in some way, shape, or form.

And I think it's going to have a big repercussion, whether it comes between now and 2029. I don't know.

My mom worked in jewelry sales, like fine jewelry sales for my whole life.

And she always talked about how like romanticizing and storytelling about jewelry pieces was like the biggest thing you could do to sell.

You, I feel like, are also a really big storyteller. Yeah.
And what do you feel like makes a great story like to sell? The outcome, right? Yeah.

So you start every great story with the end.

And I mean, think about like a personal relationship, right? The story of the relationship, if it's a great one, always starts with where we're going to get to.

And now we get to go enjoy that journey knowing it. Sometimes stories have bad endings, right? Like Romeo and Juliet is a bad ending.
The building filling with cracks. Yeah, yeah.

Right. Everyone goes and finds great new homes.

But I think we try to tell, we tell stories all day long about property, about neighborhoods. We invent neighborhoods.
We invent buildings. We invent skylines.

And you always start the story with where we're going to get to. So what's the outcome we're working towards? And then we reverse engineer the outcome as best we possibly can.

Now, is that something you teach like when you hire someone new? Is that something you kind of want like you embed in them to do in their own career?

Yeah, everyone who works with me goes through something called SellIt.com, which is a sales training business we have. It's B2B and direct-to-consumer sales training.
It's a pretty big company.

And then we educate everybody on a lot of different things, one of which is, you know, how to articulate and how to talk.

you know sometimes people just don't talk in complete sentences anymore they use um like maybe or buts and six of

exactly yeah right it's like we're it's a problem but we work with people to really understand you know how to have empathy how to have energy and how to have enthusiasm like those are the three e's that we'll test for when interviewing people and it there's an easy trick to do it where you'll ask somebody like you know tell me about the greatest day of your life and if they're like the day my baby was born and the story's over,

you might have a hard time really empathizing with the enthusiasm that a client has about a property they like, right?

And you can also test for that by asking somebody to tell me about the worst day of your life.

And you're not asking them to just start sobbing, but if they can be an open book with you, if they can be vulnerable and talk about something that's happened in their personal life or whatever they're going to say, you know that they can meet clients with their worst days too.

I think we just try to hire, and all the agents we have at Surhant, like we just try to hire incredibly full human beings who can just, because real estate at the end of the day is a human experience, right?

People are, even if it's just for investment, you know, you're buying to sell, buying to live, and you have to do it with a person until they figure out how a house can sell itself to another house.

Once that happens, then we're all fucked. I don't have your client list in front of me, but do you work with mainly like business entrepreneurs or celebrities or a mix of both?

New York is far less celeb-heavy than the West Coast.

And a lot of the celebrities that we work with, I'd say, are somewhat of a pain because they have to make group decisions instead of singular decisions.

Like working with somebody in private equity or a hedge fund or a banker, like they're difficult in their own right, but they make decisions for themselves.

When you start working with people who are relatively well-known,

they have a team and then it's the man and it's the the other person, and then it's this person, and then the banker. And you're like, do you actually make your own data? How do you order food?

It's a process. I mean, our client base is

anyone and anyone on the planet that buys and sells real estate.

I'd say my personal client base gears far more finance and tech and tech in some way, shape, or form, just based on the markets that I've grown up in.

Well, this has been fun. We have a game for you.

Your team put a fun game together. It's a silly game.
It's a fun game. But yeah, tons of fun talking about real estate.
I feel like

you must be the most interesting man at every little get-together. It is fun to like pick, yeah, pick your brain.
And like, yeah, it's interesting.

You know, I used to be an accountant, you know, back in the day. I was like, what do you do? I was like, I was an accountant.
He's like, oh, cool. All right.
Moving on.

Bye.

It's called Spin It Like Sir Han. Oh.
We know you're good at selling. Okay.
Oh, shit. Great.

So the team whipped up a couple of nightmare real estate situations. Okay.
And you have 30 seconds. No, no.
Give or take.

We don't time you. To

sell this piece of real estate to our audience. Okay, great.

Make it a dream listing. Okay, property number one.
Yes. Fifth floor walk-up.
Yep. No elevator.
Yep. And the AC unit hasn't worked since Toby Keith was number one on the charts.
Okay. That's it.

For $2.5 million.

For $2.5 million. Yeah.
Okay. So what I would say is,

this is a diamond in the rough.

I know it looks like it's a lot of flights, and I know it might be difficult to think about not having working AC, which you can always repair, but it's on a block that is probably the most picturesque block in town.

And

eventually, a developer is going to reach out to buy this building and the four buildings next to it to create an assemblage.

And when they do that, the only way the math is going to work is if they pay you double what you're buying it for.

So whether you rent it out or you get new AC, it doesn't really matter because if you buy it for two and a half today,

within the next couple of years, you're going to double your money and it's just like buying gold. And you'll be skinny because you're going up so many flights of stairs.

Skinny or just huge, like glutes. Or, yeah, yeah, awesome, awesome glutes.
Not only have you sold it, you created the urgency. It's like, where do I like? Now I'm lying, like, we need it.

Like, I don't care about no AC, it's cold outside, anyways. Yeah, of course.

Everyone's got to have the walk-up experience in New York, though, right? Third, fourth floor walk-ups, like that just just it is a

New York

dream. Property number two, it's going for five mil.

And a historic brownstone with seven confirmed ghost sightings. Seven confirmed ghost sightings? Yeah.

I mean, that's probably the easiest sell of all time.

That's that's less than a million dollars a ghost is kind of how I would look at it, more than anything. I think that what I'm looking at there is the provenance of the house.

Most homes, probably the majority of homes, don't have the luxury of having confirmed ghost sightings, right? They're just normal homes built by regular builders and no one actually cares about them.

This house comes with incredible, incredible history with past owners who have come through decade after decade, century after century, that when you buy this, you'll be able to eventually probably sell it off to a museum or sell tickets.

as the amusement that it actually is.

So if I'm buying this place, even if I'm scared of ghosts, I'm turning it into an amusement and I'm selling daytime tickets and I'll make way more money than if I ever even Airbnb'd it.

I think it's a great investment opportunity. So good.
Random question. Have you ever sold a property that there was once a murder at? Oh, yeah.
Is that how you spin it? Well, you know what?

So what's a little murder?

It's a little story. History.

Listen, New York City actually, you know, it's very different.

One of the things I didn't realize between New York and California is I didn't know that in California, you had to declare if there had been a death on the property. Yeah.
Yeah.

You don't have to do that in New York? No, because everyone's died.

What are you talking about? California is like, it's like a hundred years old. People have been in New York City since like the gangs of New York, right? So yeah, I guess it's not the dynamic part.

I think it would be the murder part. Every build.
Yeah, no, you don't have to. It's buyer beware.
Buyer does their own due diligence.

And this came up like specifically in the apartment at the new museum building on Mercer when Bertie Madoff's son hung himself.

And they were selling that property afterwards and I had a buyer who was interested in it because it was a Soho loft. It was like $8 million.

And I was like, wait a minute, I feel like I recognize like these beams and then had to figure out, well, do I tell the buyer? I think I have to.

But then talking to the seller, it's like, well, no, you don't have to. It's up to the buyer.
But I'm like, but it's my, I think the dog leash, like, I feel like I have to mention.

So I did, and he pulled out because he was like, I don't, I don't want to live in this apartment. The next person just bought it because it just didn't matter.
And I think just renovated it.

But it's, yeah, in New York. No, in New York,

you never have to discuss it. That's crazy.
Damn. Last one.
It's going for 50 million.

It's a modern home in the Hamptons.

But when the buyer steps into the backyard, there's a snake nest in the pool. Yep.
And it is neighboring to surf lodge. These are not hard.
I thought you were going to give me like hard ones.

That sounds like a setting you up for success. That sounds like a Tuesday for me.
You're talking about. first of all, snakes are awesome.
You get that guy.

Who's that influencer with the snake tattoos? Oh, Rob from

Island.

Rob, get that guy to show up. Influencer activation.
Yeah, influencer activation. 100%.

You get a bunch of those guys. There's that other young guy that like jumps.
He jumps in those videos and grabs rattlesnakes. Robert Irwin would be there.
100%. You get all of them to come through.

I think you make a reality TV show out of it, right? That's like $50 million and snake bit, something like that.

And the winner gets a week at Surf Lodge and gets to be with the DJ and go through that whole thing. There is no $50 million property that abuts Surf Lodge, though.
But yeah.

I just, you know, it's like loud music. Someone wants to sleep.
And it's like DJ music, house music. Yeah, they have curfew, though, at Surf Lodge now.

Like, they have to cut it and then everyone just goes back to different people's houses because it's just so loud. But that place still, to this day, is wildly rambunctious.

Ryan Cernhan, everybody, owning Manhattan comes out December 5th on Netflix. Watching it.
So much fun. Thank you so much.
This was so much fun.

Guys, we've talked about Quince so much, and we're going to keep talking about it because we love them. And now is the time you really need to be thinking of Quince.
The seasons are changing.

It's getting colder. You're doing holiday shopping.
You're probably upgrading your winter wardrobe. Well, you got to check out Quince.

They have everything from the classic staples that you are wearing every day to some great, unique pieces like their Mongolian cashmere sweater.

We've talked so much about their Mongolian cashmere sweater. It's great.
It's so comfortable. It looks stylish and it's just cozy wherever.

So if you're lounging around inside or you're going out on a hot date, even in the cool winter, that Mongolian cashmere sweater is a must-have for him in your life.

Finding the right winter coat is easy with Quince. They've got plenty of options and the prices that actually make sense.
The down jacket that Nally and I got from Quince is absolutely amazing.

I just got done wearing it. I was shoveling snow.
It looked fashionable. I stayed warm.
It was fantastic. Everything that Quince has is high quality with amazing prices and ethically sourced.

We love that about Quince. They also have great luggage, expandable carry-on suitcases, ultra-light with a super sturdy polycarbonated shell.

They truly have everything you need to upgrade your and your family's wardrobe this holiday season. So head to quince.com right now before they're sold out.

I mean, I don't know if they're, you know, going to sell out. I mean, they probably have great inventory, but truly, you can't beat their prices.
Head to Quince right now.

Get your wardrobe sorted and your gift list handled with Quince. Don't wait.
Go to quince.com slash V-I-A-L-L for free shipping on your orders in 365-day returns. Now available in Canada too.

That's Quince, Q-U-I-N-C-E.com slash V-I-A-L-L. Free shipping in 365-day returns.
That's quince.com slash V-I-A-L-L.

I remember when I just found out I was pregnant with River, I was like, what do I do? Everyone's telling you to change your skincare routine and only use certain products.

And I turned to ClearStem and I never looked back. Clearstem is the first clinically clinically tested skincare line made with zero poor clogging ingredients.
That's their Clear Poor Promise.

No more choosing between acne care that dries you out and anti-aging products that clog your pores.

The first acne brand that connects internal and external skincare through supplements and topicals with no poor clogging ingredients ever. Most anti-aging products break you out.

Most anti-acne products age you. Now there's ClearStim.
And these are products that I've like shown my facelist before and they're like, oh my gosh, I love these ingredients.

These are products that I swear by and take every single day. Their Clarity Serum is top tier.
Their Clarity Serum is a product that I will not stop repurchasing.

It's something that I have put in so many of my family members' stockings because it's just a one-skin fits all type of product and I love it.

So stop putting a band-aid on your skin issues and get to the root cause with ClearStim. Discover the ClearStim difference because ClearSkin changes everything.

Go to clearstem.com/slash V-I-A-L-L and use code V-I-A-L-L at checkout for 15% off your first order. That's C-L-E-A-R-S-T-E-M dot com slash V-I-A-L-L, code V-I-A-L-L for 15% off.

Our favorite part of the holidays is spending time with our family from baking cookies, decorating the house, and walking around the neighborhood.

Everyone seems to be in the holiday spirit, and there's nothing that gets us in the spirit more than a Starbucks holiday beverage.

Now that we have River, I'm really trying to create memories and traditions that she will carry on throughout her life.

And something that I'm really loving doing, we did it last year, and obviously we're going to do it again this year, but it's going to Starbucks, getting a holiday drink, and then driving through the neighborhoods and like looking at all the Christmas lights on all the houses and seeing all the houses decorated and like the blow-ups in everyone's front yard and like sipping on our warm, hot

holiday drink. Also back in my sales days when I worked from home, I'd always go to a Starbucks and work because I wanted to get out of the house.

And definitely during the holiday season, I get my peppermint mocha.

And you just kind of see people coming in like different, you kind of feel the holiday energy with people coming in during Christmas time. It was always just really enjoyable.

I really had to get out of the house when I was stuck at home working.

Well, the peppermint mocha is a Starbucks signature espresso combined with steamed milk, mocha sauce, and peppermint flavored syrup. It's topped with whipped cream and dark chocolate curls.

What more could you ask for? Delicious.

That's honestly how I learned to drink coffee. This was my first Starbucks coffee.
Peppermint mocha. Yeah.
We used to, when I worked there, we would put Ristretto shots in it.

And we would like maud it a bit. Well, it was a white chocolate mocha.
And then during the holiday season, I transferred over to the peppermint.

There's no better feeling than when the cups turn red at Starbucks. I know.
That is so true. Another favorite of mine is the Caram Brulee Latte.
That one is

so good. Yeah.
That's my favorite. The Caramel Brulee is Starbucks' signature espresso.
It's topped with whipped cream and caramel brulee topping.

Rediscover the little moments of joy that make the holidays brighter at Starbucks.

Step into the warmth of the season with a visit to Starbucks, where every sip makes the holidays feel a little bit more special. Well, don't forget, together is the best place to be.

Connect over your holiday favorites at Starbucks. Oh, Ryan makes me feel poor.

Literally, Diva. Wow.
Literally, Diva. I'll never own a home.
Yeah.

At least not a nice condo. And I hope that's not true.
Listen, Leia, I'm trying to do my part. I'm trying to do my part.
Thanks, Nick. I really appreciate it.
I appreciate you.

He's doing this all for me. Slim Dan, Slim Dan made him my top 100.
And I texted you. I said, I made you your top 100.

It was like, no, it was my number eight song. I don't listen to that.
Mozart Artists. Mozart in my mind.
No, of the songs. And it was Mozart in my mind, which I love that song.

And I was like, I made you at least $2.

Thank you. Yeah.

Now I can buy nothing. Yeah.
You're welcome. Savings.
I don't think anything costs $2. I bought chapstick yesterday and it was $3.50.
Ugh. Chapstick's $3.50.

I was going to say, how much is a pack of gum? How much is Vaseline?

Are you guys using chapstick? Vaseline's a brand now. Petroleum jelly is the only way to go.
It's really bad for you. Petroleum jelly is bad for you? Yeah.
No. Really? Like for plastics?

I'll send you some some articles like vaseline over like a chapstick maybe i'm wrong no there are some i mean it depends on like who you're asking i mean yeah like listen i'm sure we'll get a million responses from uh people's opinions about petroleum jelly but i think like compared to like regular chapstick

i just remember like when i was buying like diaper rash stuff like i didn't get decetin or vaseline Desetin is definitely different than Vaseline. Desetin has a lot of shit in it.

Petroleum jelly has been used for years to help with skin moisturizing and healing. However, some types could contain carcinogenic ingredients.
Some types. Well, sure.

Petroleum is a naturally occurring liquid found underground that is refined into the wide range of products, transportation fuels like gasoline and diesel, heating oil, asphalt, and raw materials for plastic and chemicals.

And that's like the root word of

jelly. Yeah.
Yeah.

Well, it's also like, listen, we're all filled with microplastics and terrible things. At least your lips are supple.

I'm not using petroleum jelly, but like I definitely had a microwave

mac and cheese last night. Leia.

Whatever. Vanderpump season 12, not season one, part two.

Kicked off.

I dabbled in it. The rest of the cast really dove into it.
We also have Potomac and Salt Lake to get into. I really, we'll get into Vanderpump, obviously.

But to preface Potomac, this really, this was like a... A sad episode to watch for Wendy.
And it really made me think, you know, love the artist, not the, love the art, not the artist, you know

because like as a housewife she just seems like one of the good ones but the whole time I'm like oh god fraud I know she's giving like great advice and like don't lie and then it's like mom talking about how she's spending her money was so charming it was great um anyways Vanderpump so who do we have the cast do we have the cast photos we have the you know we do also if anyone wants to hear a rapid recap if they didn't Natalie's obviously not here I'm gonna do my best okay so here's what happened in varenprobe rules we know that it's our time these are still the best days of our lives because vpr is back baby basically what's happening is there's a new game of sur verse and they're still hooking up they're still being trashy like we know in love but this time some of them might be gay guys and one of the new guys is this guy chris who thinks he looks like robert de niro his dream is to be flynn rider in the live action tangled then there's natalie who has an old guy ex named paolo who also works at sur and she got into a fight with him during her night off that caused drama.

She thinks if she got laid, she would be happier. So none of anything that's happened is her fault.

And Paulo was dating the assistant manager, Demi, until the day before he hooked up with Natalie the first time. And Demi is kind of like the Peter, but she's like more sleigh about it.

But her and Natalie are fine about this. And then there's Marcus, who seems very chaotic and insane and is dating this girl Kimberly.

They're best friends with Venus, who is not in a thrupple with them. And Kim doesn't want Natalie to be friends with Marcus, and he doesn't know who to defend.
So now Kim and Marcus are fighting.

We've also got Marcus's best friend, Shane, who is sober from alcohol, but addicted to succubus women. Oh, also, Natalie is a singer from Florida, and she's convinced she's going to be famous.

Marcus got in trouble for drinking on the job while training the new guys because Sir is in sir vival mode.

And we end the episode with the classic Lisa Vanderpum talking to everyone, being like, you got to get your shit together, guys. So,

flop or not. The classic, you can't work here anymore, but you can still be on my TV show.

You know what? Actually, not. You're not.
I'm not saying that this was a flop. No, it wasn't.
Are we feeling good about its potential? I am. Yes.
I actually am.

I'm like, it gave first season energy with just like these people very badly wanting to be on this show, but like also wanting to be aspiring actors, models, and like working surf shift.

Like I'm like, that's what I want to see. I want to see the drama that goes on in the back alley.

I want to see you guys dating and hooking up and auditioning and crying about like nonsensical things because that's what made Vanderpump so good until they started making money and trying to like make it seem like they were still doing sur shifts when I'm like, you're not.

Yeah, they all seem poor. You know what's really fascinating about this iteration of Vanderpump is now more than ever in the year of our Lord 2025.

Reality TV stars and influencers have a real shot at,

you know, quote-unquote making it and doing your more traditional work in Hollywood like whether it's acting and singing and performing it's a real possibility now in 2012 14 whatever when Vanderpump started the the crossover was virtually impossible but now

you're basically like our matriarch of Vander Pump Ariana Maddox she's hosting Love Island she she's acting on a show on Peacock a doctor show a doctor show I don't know I don't know if it's a huge role or not but like she's got you know she's guest star she was Roxy on

Broadway. I mean, she's, she's, her star continues to rise.
You have Whitney now being Roxy on Chicago.

Like, you're seeing more and more, you know, that the success of Dancing with the Stars is obviously proof that like, you know, the internet celebrities, they drive viewers.

Like, that's, yeah, that's where the real power is these days.

So, if some of these people actually have talent, you know, it's actually a lot more possible now for this group of cast members who have dreams of making it in Hollywood than it did back in 2012.

So that's kind of fascinating. If this show becomes successful, you might actually see some of these people have some real opportunities.
So that's kind of interesting.

We did get some interesting discussions from our Vanderpump cast. One is like, true, it's like you are happier when you get laid.
Yeah.

Yeah. That's what the psychic told me.
When I was like super single, like in my post-bachelor before Nally days, if you think I'm a grumpy guy now,

I mean, every other day, I was always like, What's the point? Literally, yeah, it was like that. Yeah, I can't argue with that.

You know, everything that, you know, it's just like

maybe Taylor's not getting laid. Maybe that's what it is.
Maybe Gaston is like, is he out of town?

Is he out of town? Maybe Gaston is to be told. We're back to Southern Charm.

Sorry. I don't know.

I still feel like I could get activated, though.

Sure. I'm not saying you can't be grumpy when you're hungry.

You've had friends who are single forever and then they meet someone and then overnight they're like enjoyable to be around.

They're like, you know what? Let's just not sweat the small stuff. Hey guys, you know, life is actually beautiful.
Yeah.

Did anyone realize how like blue the sky was?

You know that thing of like, if I win the lottery, I won't say anything, but there will be signs.

If I get laid,

I won't say anything, but there will be signs.

That's really funny. I will say, Mary, you'd have the demeanor of someone who has a pretty active sex life.
I do. You do, Mary.
Yeah, you're a very positive person. Oh, my God.
Thank you.

If we're basing off, does this person get laid based off of their general demeanor? Thanks for saying I have a slutty demeanor. That was the first time I've seen you rendered speechless.

Yeah. She's like, I have the demeanor of someone who fucks no

you know what yeah i'm i'm taking that and i'm holding that and i'm bringing that into the future with she's holding space for that one holding space for that one i i bet if if if there was a way to do a study i don't think there is a scientific uh census if you're like an active internet troll and you're constantly just like trying to create mess and you're just criticizing people and you know

finding things to bitch about and just finding reasons to hate people, you're definitely not getting laid. Almost like you are not happy with, you can't possibly be content with your life.

You're 100% right. Cause there is a point in time when I feel like I could follow the timelines of people's relationships and things.

I just found out Sienna, Sienna Miller's having another baby and I didn't even know she had a first one, let alone that, like who she's married to.

And it was just kind of one of those things where it's like, wow.

When you've got too much stuff going on in your own life, you don't have time to be focused on what other people are doing. Yeah.
Imagine

your new partner comes home. You're on Cloud Nine.

Your new partner brings you flowers. They're like, I've been thinking about you all day.
You're going to be like, hold on. Sorry.

I have to roast this person in the comments before, you know, like no one does that. Yeah.

I was just about to hit send on this hate comment. Give me a second.
Yeah, just one second. Hold on.
I'm on a bunch of people. The most miserable people in the world are the ones.

You can't possibly be happy and content with your life if you're out there like hating on people constantly.

And like, if you, if you are getting good sex, like it's it does make you happier, it literally releases like things in your body that make you go, you know what? It could be worse.

Life's worth living.

Yeah, okay, but back to Vanderbilt. Do we think that Natalie, as the person that really just wants to have sex, can just be friends with Marcus? No.
Or

you know, Nick, what Nick's gonna say. The girl who just wants to get laid.
Do you think his girlfriend is overreacting or no? No. I don't think his girlfriend is overreacting.

i do think generally men and women can have friendships do i think marcus and natalie no fall into that category i don't think so either you know in relation to each other no of course men and women can be friends i have a lot of women friends i had a lot more women friends when i was a single guy and i still have women friends to this day but those friendships have drastically changed if you are prioritizing your relationship the way that you should you don't have time to have coffee dates with your friends of the opposite sex, especially if they're like good-looking people that you would like, put it this way, it's as if

if you and this friend got stranded on an island or stuck in an elevator for a period of time. Stuck in an elevator or stranded on an island? You know, too, you know, it's like

two Tom Hanks movies that happened in, actually.

And he and he fucked both of them. He fucked Wilson.
And I don't know who the other person was. Parker Bosey, but he broke up with her for May Grind with this haircut.

She wasn't you got male. Hold up.
She wasn't you got male. Wow.

No, but you know what I'm saying? Like you ever like fantasize if you were like stuck with like someone that you were attracted to and you know, it's like, well, I mean, we're here.

The only person I'm stuck in an elevator with was your wife.

And?

If you're curious about what your friend looks like naked, you're not friends. Oh, for sure.
If you would look at a nude of this friend. Oh, no.
You're not friends. Yeah.
Being in a long-term care.

I don't want to look at anyone's.

I see everybody as an asexual Barbie Kendall. Yeah.
You have no sexual parts to me. Here's the wrench in this situation.
Do you think Kim can get Marcus to not talk to Natalie if they work together?

I think Kim and Marcus are going to break up like 15 times throughout this season. Obviously.

And I also have an opinion on the sense that I'm like, I don't think Kim's overreacting about the whole situation.

Do I think her reaction to what happened at the Belmont that night wasn't a complete overreaction? I'm like, they're all friends. They all work together.
You guys are also just starting a show.

In what world are you going to tell your boyfriend who works with this person that needs to work to communicate with them to do their job, that they can't speak to them?

I think that that's actually kind of crazy. Well,

they're not allowing to speak. Well, she's like saying like, you guys aren't friends.
You're not friends. But I'm like, they're in a work environment that they have to interact with each other.

So I'm like, how are you going to say that like they can't be friendly with each other? You guys are all out for drinks after work. They're friendly and professional and cordial.

And, like, hey, this is

demanding quality time with a friend. Right, but that's what I'm saying.
They're saying that they're friendly at work or whatever. And she's like, you guys aren't friends.
But I'm like,

and even then, they went on and watched what happens live. One of the big things was that they said that Natalie texted Marcus a good morning text.
And then she went on, they were both sitting next to

each other. And she said that that's not true.
And that, and Marcus kind of like, was like, well, no, like she sent me a text in the morning.

And it was just like, that's completely different than what you guys were saying that Natalie did. Anything short of, am I on the schedule today? Good morning, exclamation point.

Am I on the schedule today? You know what I mean? Like, that's what I'm saying. It's like the way that it's being elevated, Natalie's saying that she never once sent him a good morning.

Greatly matters. Sure, but I'm like, if was it just good morning or what came after good morning? Was it all lowercase good morning?

All friendship texts of the opposite sex need to be sent and delivered between the hours of 9 a.m. and 9 p.m.

Anything before 9 a.m. or after 9 p.m.?

Questionable.

But Marcus also, they were on Watch What Happens live last night, and they were asked about their relationship.

They said they have no sexual tension, that they never hooked up, and that he considers her like a sister, and that they have a brother-sister relationship.

Kim was also in the audience, so they're still together post-season, obviously.

But I don't know, they're denying that there was ever any tension or anything between the two of them.

So I'm kind of like, if they're both saying it, is it everybody else making it more dramatic than it is? Probably. It's reality TV.
You know what I mean?

Like, so that's where I'm just like, I don't think she's doing anything. I don't, I'm, I'm kind of team Natalie on this one where I'm like, I don't think she's doing anything wrong.

I understand that she's a hot screen that's messy.

I think she has the intention of maybe doing something wrong.

But I also don't think at this moment you can, you can say she's doing anything wrong.

She's giving like, me? Am I the villain?

Did I?

Wait, I just sent an innocent text. I mean, like,

friendly. Like, oh my God, I I can't help that he wants to thank me.
That's what I'm saying.

But she also had like three guys throughout this whole episode that were like, that she's into or that she's dating or whatever. And she's not, and Marcus wasn't one of them.

How do we feel about Chris Hahn, formerly of Perfect Match? To me, what kind of ruins it is the fact that they have like reality stars on it already. Like Chris and his cousin were on Netflix shows.

Well, they were on dated and related, right? And then Chris was on Perfect Match. Like, he's a big star already.
That's what I'm like,

them to a big star.

But like, he's established. Like, this is a show of people that are supposed to be nobodies.

Well, it's also just like his whole thing of just being like i want to be a famous actor i want to be robert de niro i was just like

yeah sorry mary go ahead oh that was it it was just like him his whole thing of just like wanting to be a famous actor and being like i kind of look like robert de niro i'm like you're it's just very obvious what he's trying to do on the show and i'm like i kind of want you to be friends with these people yeah he's kind of dripping with like reality tv desperation which it kind of works But I was just going to say, I kind of appreciate it because I'm like, hey, be transparent.

Like, most of these people signed up on this show because they want whatever's gonna happen next. And they're not looking for love.

Exactly. Like, and they're not signing up on a dating show being like, oh my god, I can't, I have to get married blindly.
Like, I didn't know that love is blind.

Like, you know, where I'm like, it's Vanderpump rules. You're all aspiring, want to be actors, singers, performers that work a waiter job.

I think with him, I think I'll enjoy him more once he connects with the rest of the group because he's new too. So it's like, I think that's my only thing with him right now.

You can talk as the outlier.

I think he got a job at Sir. For the show.
For the show. Yeah.
He's Lala. Yeah.
Lala got a job at the show.

She's never had a job before outside of modeling and then gets a hostess job and ends up on Vanderpump Rules. But Venus's hair is giving,

isn't that the painting Venus? Coming out of the. Yes, Birth of Venus.
Thank you. I was like, I was like, if it's not, then it's a perfect show name.
Who's our Jax? Birth of Venus.

Who's our Jax, Marcus? Marcus, for sure.

Marcus is like a mixture of Jax and Tom Schwartz because it's kind of like he's like, who's the hot, the hot guy, quote unquote, Shane? Yeah.

It was like Shane is supposed to be like the Brad Pitt of the show, like the hot male model. And then Marcus is like, yeah, you know, like, I do like catalogs.
So Shane's

are Tom Schwartz? No, Tom Schwartz is Marcus. No, Marcus and

Kim are

Kate. Jax.
Yeah, Jax and Kim. You know what? They're their own.
I don't think it's a true one-to-one.

Well, because I was going to say, Shane kind of does give the Tom Schwartz because he comes in with a notable laugh. He's the hot model guy that gets all of the girls.

It's like if Tom Schwartz went on the show single, this is what most likely it would have been like. I do think they're all, to your point, Nick, they are all very different.
Yeah. Like,

it does feel like a different show. There's like a little bit of a formula, though, with like the formula.
Like Kim and Marcus are like the Stasi and Jacks fighting

for

the couple. Yeah.
That ties everybody together. I think Jason's the hottest.

Interesting. Well, you have interesting taste in men, Justin.

I think he's hot.

Oh, he's Shane's roommate. He's the cousin.
Cousin. Okay.

He's got sticky eyebrows. The eyebrows.

He loves strong eyebrows. He's got the eyebrows on him.

All right, well, we'll see how this season unfolds, and we'll certainly get some cast members on to learn a little bit more about them as the season plays out. All right, Potomac.

Like I said, Wendy, I don't know. It was

sad.

I just saw that the judge denied wendy and her husband to be tried separately man i wonder what that means that's a question for emily baker if they go

and i think that's like yeah like yeah so like they're getting like tried as like um like like a team i think they asked or petitioned or whatever to like be tried separately but i whatever it means the judge denied it interesting where do you know if teresa and joe were tried separately i have no clue yeah

well they got different is she facing like real jail time yeah probably right yeah oh yeah i think it's like three years, no, probably more.

I mean, whether she, what she gets sentenced for, I mean, if she's found guilty, but yeah, right, if it's all those counts, which was a lot was like 16 or something.

Anyway, I assume we have a rapid recap, Mary. Yeah, we do.
So, if you missed the last two episodes of Rehas Was the Potomac, here's your rapid recap. At Pride, Kay was mad that Monique didn't care.

Stacy went out with Chris Samuels, and Monique was like, Yeah, I hated that guy. He treated me like a piece of meat.
Who cares?

But then, apparently, Kay found out that Stacy snitched and told Chris Samuels that that monique said that so who knows however also cookie who hates stacy and monique was the one that told chris and like whatever so stacy thinks she's cool and safe with tia but then tia thinks she's lying about not knowing chris samuels that well also wendy is like well what the about me and also angel is still mad about the catfish comment but mainly she's mad at wendy now and she thinks the interactions were that she had with Wendy were merciless in nature, whatever that means.

And Giselle has an event for a reason to be shady, but Robin doesn't come because she's mad at Bravo or something. And the girls are like, you won't support your girl?

Also, Tia popped off on Stacy for lying about her dinner plans and they're not friends anymore. So they're not safe spaces.

And Kay doubles down on Stacey by bringing up the alleged Chris Samuels conversation.

Then the girls call Chris and he doesn't know what the fuck anyone is talking about, but they still think Stacy's lying.

After all that, Angel and Wendy get into it and Wendy is like, this beef is one-sided. Angel thinks she's being gaslit by Wendy.

Finally, they kick Stacy out of the party and everyone gets together to bond over trashing Stacy. And later, Stacy and Monique finally chat with the girls about the phone call.

Stacy denies texting Chris and calling Chris, but Chris did text her. Wendy then thinks it was either Kay and Cookie, Angel, Giselle, or Stacy that called Chris Samuels.

Monique ends the conversation with a warning to Stacy that Chris Samuels is a messy bitch and she should be careful. Oh, I'm Team Stacey.
Yeah, I was going to say the same thing.

I was like, it's nice to see like the women kind of being like, all right, it's too much. Like, we're over it.
The joke is tired.

And then Giselle having that group of women over to, like, just trash Stacey. Like, you guys have nothing better to do? Literally.

Do you remember this is how we found out that Monique was returning to Potomac because she was seen at Pride? No. The cameras?

Like, those were the photos that started circulating, and everybody's like, Monique. And I love that Monique is just like, I don't really give a fuck.

Like, I'm already having a nightmare co-parenting with this man. This man did not treat me well.
So you just be careful. Like, she doesn't, she's not here to like bash on other women.

And I love that she's like, I've grown. I've taken time to myself.
I don't need to like sit here and be involved in this messy shit with her.

Which I think is good considering why she like removed from the show. Right.
Because she's coming back being herself, not activated. Yeah.

I mean, all I know about Monique outside of the season is the scene with Candace and the hair,

which is awesome. But we don't see, we don't condone, obviously, don't do that.
But to see Monique this season, I'm like, she's awesome. Like, she is, I'm like, I want to be like Monique.

Like, she rocks. So I'm team Monique in most cases.
Why do you think they all hate Stacy? Because Stacy's the Britney Bateman. She's just, like, kind of on her own plane and easy to make fun of.

I love the Britney Batemans.

Who brought Stacy in last season? Do you remember? Was it Karen? Like, I feel like she was brought in and then probably like left out on her own.

I will say, though, at the end, that was like, that was a warning. Oh, yeah.
You know, when she was like, I... I divorced him for a reason.
Most of the reasons people don't know about.

And I'm, you know, is it like, like, he did some shit. Monique made it seem like she was forced to divorce this guy because of something he did.

She made it seem like it wasn't like some, like, you know, we just fell out of love and it just didn't work out. Like, he, like, yeah, like, he's a messy bitch.

But I also feel like Stacey was like been there, done, then, it's, it was over and done with. It also wasn't.
Yeah, Stacey's also back with Timu. Yeah.
His name's not Timu.

Like, I gotta say, though, trying to save your marriage and being a housewife is a banana's like you can't do both. Johnny bananas.

How do you try to do illegals? You either have a functional relationship or you have boundaries when it comes to filming periods of what you will and won't talk about, or it's just, it's a mess.

If you're not on the same page getting on a reality TV show, it's the same thing. Like,

I can't remember who came on and said that, but like. Having skeletons in your closet, knowing that you've done illegal things, like it's like Caroline Stanbury.

Yeah, if you think that all of that is not going to come

to the front of everything, then like you're crazy. The fact of the matter is, if you're having marital issues, you're going to see it play out.
So, and people are going to pick up on it.

So, even if you're trying to pretend, a lot of people call it in a lot of relationships end on housewives because it's like people are seeing it before the person that's in the relationship even sees it.

I can't say I agree with Stacey when she was like doing her like in the moment and talking about

her and Timo getting back together and how like he's not living there. And that like she's like, we just told her we got divorced.

And like at first it's like her reasoning kind of makes sense but at the same time it's just like wait like these are her this is mom and dad to their daughter and why wouldn't you want to like i mean i guess it to me that just really says that they're clearly on the fence like if you know you're getting back together you would you would celebrate that with your kids right like the fact that you're reluctant to that you're being cagey with your own child I'll defend Stacey to like some point, especially with the girls coming together.

I'm not criticizing. It's just

ahead i i was about to what i was going to say is that like kind of what wendy said when she was trying to figure out who told chris samuels where it was like but stacy has lied in the past

has lied now and she will lie again in the future so i'm kind of like it kind of also feels like having a rough season last season that it's like making sense to bring the ex in but now there's no like commitment but it's also like you guys can't talk to me about TJ or who I'm dating because now I'm with my husband, but like we might not actually be together.

Like they might not actually end up getting back together by the end of the season. But still she rises.
But still she rises. I also think we're going to see a bit of Stacy having a villain era.

I love it. Because it's already coming through with the finger and the cookie was out of place, but she was literally.
Oh my God.

And when she was like talking to Kay and she was like, oh, you're at a two now. This is awesome.
Oh, I bring this out of you. I'm so glad.
Like, I was just like, okay, wait a second.

We're about to see that as Stacey.

Talk about drama. Talk about stones.
I thought that Ashley's conversation with her mom was very endearing and sweet.

Talking about what we were talking about earlier in the episode about like mothers and their relationships with their daughters, honestly, I think I was like thinking about that scene I was watching yesterday when I was speaking about it.

But because, yeah, she just like

you can see that real, real bond there. It really endeared me to Ashley.

It kind of made me think about what you were talking about last week, too, or maybe it was two weeks ago, but about being in a relationship and how sad it is for some people not having the support of their partner.

And that was like Ashley's gripe with her mom's partner:

she's watching her mom break her back, working till end of days to have a partner that doesn't support her. And I think that that was really interesting seeing that coming from a daughter to a mother

and her being like, please, like, just think about that. Like, this person isn't, isn't good for you.
Yeah, because it's like you just, you just want to like help your mom.

Like, you just want like the best for her. Yeah.

You know, and going back to Wendy, when she was talking about her relationship with her dad and she was talking with her mom and she was, you know, her and her sister sat down talking about like she doesn't know what like a mother-father relationship looks like.

I mean, this is like a big leap, but like given Wendy's current, you know, allegations, do you feel like something like that, at least, you know, assuming this is an authentic conversation with her sister, like it's a real world problem, like people having like broken relationships with parents and like the impact that has on your life and the way that makes you like chase certain types of validation and do things maybe out of character.

I mean, and I'm not trying to give her an excuse. It's not like, oh, if you don't have a relationship with your dad, you're going to commit fraud.
Obviously, that's not the correlation.

But like, it's, I don't know, there's something about this episode when we get to see with Wendy and like knowing her allegations, it just really made you wonder how, how this person who seems to have such a good grasp on

her life and a healthy outlook on things did this allegedly terrible thing, you know, where you're just

sloppy criminal behavior.

I don't know. It's just like,

it was really bananas. I think it's just you're trying so hard to be a housewife, be this person, be this perfect couple, and then for TV.

And then you also kind of combine that with the family dynamic and just how important that is because of, you know, the family dynamic that you came up with and like trying to make that perfect.

And I think it's,

to your point, Nick, I think it's really just about like that strive and drive for perfection that you can kind of just make decisions maybe you wouldn't normally make in order to achieve that because you you you feel so deeply that you need it.

Yeah, well, she talked about like wanting to have her dad be proud of her and like her accomplishments and things like that.

And yeah, does that like we've talked about this before, like the pressures of living up to the expectations of a housewife, like you kind of alluded to, Mary.

And then couple that with like feeling this need to prove something and suggest that the reason why your parent abandoned you is because you didn't feel good enough, which I imagine psychologically is a pretty common, you know, feeling people feel.

So it makes me sad. I hope she beats it.
This episode alone made me want Wendita beat it. I do too.
It's not looking good though. Yeah, I know.
All right. Well,

the season's getting good. Well, we have one more show to get into before we call it a day, and that is Salt Lake City.

Well, this episode made me slightly feel bad about saying I was in my Bronwyn

villain era. That you're in your Bronwyn villain era? That he thinks Bronwyn is a villain in this era.
Yeah. For me, Brawen is in her villain era.
She's entering in it. But then I was like, maybe not.

Maybe I spoke too soon. But then also I was thinking, maybe I was right.

She got the wrong housewife. Ooh.

Hey, listen, to each story. Are you going to do what I think you're going to do?

I felt a bit validated when Brawen admitted that she does very much care what people think, which was kind of the point I was trying to make on Tuesday's episode of Reality Recap, which is like she, she needs this more than she should.

And I feel like it's turning Brawen into someone she's not.

I think we also, with that moment of getting that validation from her mom, I think she's wanted that her entire life ever since she met like quote unquote messed up by getting pregnant, premarital, whatever, like a teenage pregnancy.

Then I'm like, I think that we're seeing like actual healing happening as well, because sometimes when it's like hearing that from the one person that you've always wanted to, most people never get that.

And she got that moment of like hearing from her mom that like, you've done a good job raising your kid. I'm proud of you.
So I'm like, now, now I'm like, what's next for Bronwyn?

Yeah, I mean, it really is a very endearing conversation with Bronwyn and her mom. See, I think we need that for Muzzy too, because the last past couple of conversations, I've been like,

all right, that was rough. Okay, Bob.
Yeah.

You know, I'm actually like thinking about right now is that maybe this is why Bronwyn doesn't like Britney so much because she's seeing a lot of herself in Britney's daughter. Seeing a lot of herself

in her

daughter.

Because last episode, last week's episode was all about Britney and her daughter trying to heal their relationship in therapy. Right.

Now we have Bronwyn trying to heal her relationship with her mom. And it's I could see more of it like Browen projecting

her opinions of like, obviously, I imagine Browen's relationship with her daughter is very special and sacred.

And she obviously invested a lot of herself to be the mother that she was to her daughter. And to see Brittany appear,

you know, drop the ball, as Brittany kind of acknowledged when she was on our show and going deeper.

I feel like, I just feel like brown judges brittany a lot where she you know she's like we're not the we're not the same i was i didn't do what you did you know and i could see that being frustrated if she didn't get validation from her mother to almost kind of be more critical of people that she doesn't think like stepped up because clearly browin like made a lot of sacrifices for her daughter i mean to be a mother a single mother at such a young age like literally couldn't imagine what that's like.

I mean, like, you know,

Natalie and I are like, we really help each other out, and we are very lucky to have so much support and help with childcare, whether it's grandparents, like, you know, to be a single mother and then have your own mother not feel like you have their support

at the age in which Browen was must have been incredibly difficult.

And so to see Brittany act as selfish as she did in those years where she kind of like chose men over her kids, I can see why Browen has a point of view that's critical of Brittany.

You kind of can see it too.

I forget which episode it was, but when Heather was talking about her daughter's going, like her youngest daughter going to college and like the reaction that Bronwyn kind of had to that of just being like,

you know, you could see her projecting a little bit onto Heather too, not saying either of them were wrong about Bronwyn being like, well, why would you want your daughter to leave?

Like, I just want Gwen to stay here. And I think it's just.
That was last week's episode where she was talking because we saw this talking about moving. You saw that with Gwen.

She's talking about a previous episode. In the previous episode, they kind of got into it a little bit.

And it was, it's interesting to kind of like see the full context of like all of these relationships.

This is very, like, if last season was about marriages, kind of, this season is very much about like mothers and daughters. Yeah.

All right, well, let's get to Mary's rapid recap, and then I will still argue my Browen, my, my Browen villain point.

If you missed the most recent episode of the Royal House Wise of Salt Lake City, here's your rapid recap.

Bronwyn apparently doesn't want to open her marriage anymore because she wore a blow-up suit to pick up Todd at the airport again. Also, she's officially in America now.
She wasn't before.

We just didn't really think it was like going to be that important and blah blah point, so we didn't mention it. But yeah, she's throwing a Betsy Ross theme party because it's housewives.

Whitney doesn't know how to separate work from play because her business failed when Justin got involved.

Let this be a lesson to every single woman on reality television: keep your girl boss business to your damn selves.

Okay, and other news: Heather got an air fryer and her daughter is going to college at the University of Tampa, Miami. Godspeed, prayers to you and your dry child.

I don't know how much setting is going to happen there.

Yeah.

Then at the aforementioned Betsy Ross Party for Bronwyn's American Citizenship that is just now happening in the year of 2025, the girls don George Washington wigs finally and argue over a colonial themed ambiance while spilling tea, much like they did in Boston all of those years ago.

Brittany revealed she had a 4.2 GPA and was salutatorium in high school.

Also, she broke up with Jared again because someone, Whitney, leaked that she was flirting with one of the boatswains from the the below deck crossover.

Angie is mad that Lisa bought a horse and Whitney chose the nuclear option to spearhead her. Meredith is an alcoholic and a pill popper by saying to Meredith, alcoholic, pill popper.

Then Meredith retaliated by giving the girls goodie bags with drug tests and caviar for all of the women to take.

And a relevant note is that Heather did bring a flask to the event that all the girls were hitting the entire time.

Also, Heather felt gaslit by Meredith because Meredith said she was lying about what she did on the plane. And this is a trigger for Heather because of her Mormon roots.

The episode ended with a without resolution for any of the drama but much like the Constitution itself, all the women declared amendments for the drama that they will not ratify.

The First Amendment, according to Meredith Marks, stop the reactive abuse. That was wild.

That was bananas. I've said bananas so many times this episode.

It was Johnny bananas.

Reactive abuse. Like out of nowhere.
It was like she was like in a different argument and then all of a sudden like showed up to this one.

That was awesome. I love Meredith Marks.
Leia, watch your mouth about what you're going to say about her.

I'm going to wrap up my Brawen point, which is like, you know, so when they were, you know, killing the beef or throwing the tea in the river or whatever the

beef. Killing the beef.
They were

killing the cat. Spilling the tea.
Whatever they were doing. Spilling the tea.

And Heather brought up the Todd farting thing. Yes.
And Brawen was like, shut the fuck up, bitch. Throw that

tea.

And then Broadwin was like, she's like, families and kids are off limits, which I agree with. Like, I think all, like, again, like, channeling our, Heather de Brow.

Again, Heather DeBrux is a perfect example of doesn't need this shit. Does it for fun.

Heather de Brow might not be my favorite housewife to watch, but as a person and a peer, I have mad respect for Heather DeBrux.

Like the way that she is able to navigate this very messy universe with the class that she pretty much does, and then able to maintain her marriage and her family in a way that never seems to really be sacrificed by this show.

I have mad respect for someone who's been able to do that, right?

And what I like about Brawen is she really seems to be like, like season one, kind of different than in the best possible way from a lot of the housewives, where she can, like, again, she knows her own limits.

But what I don't get, it's like, fine, if that's your, if that's your boundary, then why are you, why are you filming scenes with Todd platforming a rumor?

Why are you doing that?

You know what I'm saying? It's a big contradiction to these scenes that she's doing talking about opening up her marriage.

And I don't know how serious it is, but she willingly will bring up her own marriage. And yeah, she has the right to do that compared to, say, if Lisa or Meredith does it, but why do it, period?

That's the part I don't get. And again, I've heard nothing but great things about like Todd and Bradwyn as humans outside of the show from a lot of people.

And I would love to have dinner with Bradwin and Todd.

And I'm just like, I don't get why in season two, and maybe it is because she worries about what the fans think and she's reading the comments and she's sucked into this very intense addicting world.

And that kind of makes me sad if she... You know, maybe she's playing us all.
Maybe she's in full control of what she's doing and her narrative and her choices.

But it makes me sad that she is responding to whether it's the other housewives platforming rumors or the fans and their expectations of the housewives of like what they think of them, how they think they should act, whether they think they're authentic enough or not.

You know, I don't think Heather operates, like Heather DeBrow, I don't think she operates based off of what fans say about her. It makes me sad that it's Brawitt

is giving that she is kind of doing that. And I think if you start doing that, then

you become a villain in your own story. It's like, it's an, you know, I don't know.

Do you think that Heather Dubrow is able to do that because she's been on the show for so many seasons and she's learned to do that? I wonder if like Bronwyn, she's only been on one season so far.

And so like, perhaps she could correct that and like. get used to it and of course

from now of course i mean she didn't commit a capital crime

i'm just like i'm just kind of like why why why you know like you know is is todd off limits is he not off limits?

Or like, is, is, is Todd just a supportive husband that like is like down to like be there when you do this show? Or is he like part of your storyline?

And is your marriage truly like in, you know, in question? Or, you know, like,

God bless Brawlin if she is trying to thread the needle and in full control. And like, this is all just, she knows what she's doing and her marriage is fine and yada, yada, yada.

But that's the part I don't get. Well, I kind of have a hot take on a different relationship, and that was Whitney and Justin's sit-down.
That was awesome. That was also wild.

I kind of felt like I felt like I understood where like Lisa and Mary and other people in the past have come from because I've always felt like Whitney defends herself all the time.

I think this was the first time that I kind of felt like I watched Whitney like put herself in the victim situation because all the women always have an issue with her victimizing herself.

And I'm like, I think it was kind of, I don't know, I didn't love the fact that you had to sit down with your husband to blame him for the failure of your business where as if you had no say in what was going to happen and because he finally supported you as if he hasn't supported you in the past that like now that this business didn't work out that it's like his fault yeah it was a tough

go ahead

i think it's it's interesting to to watch her kind of put on completely project again just like all of the failures of this business onto their relationship yeah and the way not their like personal like marriage and stuff but that's obviously part of it and i think my read of that scene was a lot of her just being like, the mistake was us getting into business together in our relationship.

Does that make sense? Of kind of like blending the two, but it's also your fault.

But then she also said in the beginning, like that she was excited to work together because they started working together in the beginning and they worked so well together.

So it's like, it feels like because it failed, because she trusted Justin's instinct or whatever.

But I'm like, at the end of the day, you also said that same day that you signed that deal, you met the people to put your product in Sephora, in Ulta.

So I'm like, there seems like there was time to make a decision and we just went with something, but I think to put that blame fully on Justin, when Justin's lost his job based off of being on this show, like he's, he's lost a lot staying by your side and committing to things.

And he hasn't sat there and put you on camera being like, well, you know, I lost my job. I don't.
And even then she was bitching at him for not having a job that she caused him to lose. Yeah.

And then he's like, okay, well, I'm doing the best I can. And once she starts, once he got a job, she was like, well, how are we going to take care of the kid?

Like, like you know what I mean it's just like it's always somebody else's fault where I'm like just take some of the responsibility because it just it kind of just felt like we're watching you explain why wild rose beauty didn't work out and then it's but it's not my fault it's it's all based off of Justin and his scenes when it's always a husband and wife talking about what seems to be like real personal shit, it always blows my mind because I'm always like, I always just know how the sausage is made.

And I'm just trying to figure out like how that conversation started where it's like, all right. And then do they they pre does like, does Whitney and Justin have a conversation off camera?

I assume they do to like kind of like preface what they're going to talk about. Or does he sit down and like be like, hey, we're just going to talk about like, you know, the business failing.

And then all of a sudden they sit down, the cameras are rolling. And she's like, yeah, it's all your fault.
Well, and then she also like extremely denied the idea of her being an MLM.

And then it was like this entire conversation was as if it was presented like an MLM. Yeah, okay.
This is where I was confused.

I think I got lost in the sauce of this convo because they were saying MLM. And I was like, are we talking about what I think we're talking about?

Are you openly admitting that you like made a multi-level marketing business? Like you create a pyramid scheme?

But like the whole thing was the denying of the rumors and like people making up stuff about the business. And it was just TikToks.
It wasn't actual rumors, whereas Lisa's were like lawsuits.

It's hard to do. But then you have Whitney being like, no.
Yeah, it's an MLM. It was an MLM and like we just should have gotten out of the MLM business part of it sooner.

And I'm like, well, why did you start it as an MLM? Oh, and then she also said that it was a part of justin's business so i'm like does justin have a

video of mlms like that that was the only other option of him supporting your business versus getting a meeting with sephora or ulta i've just never like every time people start talking about mlms it's like a lot of businesses get accused of it because they are yeah but why would you admit that It reminds me of that scene of the office with Michael Scott, and he's like, no, you get two more people and like draws in

than Jim does the triangle.

He's like, no, it's a pyramid scheme. Like, why are you admitting on camera that your business was a pyramid scheme? I don't understand.
And I love Whitney Down. I love Whitney Down.

I'm just like, girl, keep that to yourself. Can we talk about how hot Angie looked in her outfit?

Mary, I thought. Mary with her little beret over the wig.
I thought Angie was

the best dress. I thought Heather's outfit looked great, but Heather was giving like...

Hamilton. If women wore slacks in the 1700s, I would crush this outfit.

Heather and Touloune? Heather looked like a modern-day politician. Yeah, she was giving George Washington and Angie was like, girl, if I was like,

you know, if I had a log cabin back in the 1700s, I would,

I would.

You would chop you in. You would be chopping wood.
I would be chopping wood.

Angie looked hot.

Angie is

hot. Well, yes, I've just, but in this particular, maybe I have a thing for

you.

Something about the Revolutionary War era. Yeah.

It was really funny that Bronze dress reveal.

The Constitution dress. I was like, I mean, very, very, very unbrand.
Yeah. Lisa and Meredith not dressing up at all, but then still having to wear the wigs.
Oh, no. I'm over it.
Dress for the theme.

Mary bringing her own wig and laughing at herself, being like, I look so stupid.

Listen, I am not a fashion Nova. So, you know,

I can fuck the wig. I can fuck the rest of the stuff.
I gotta be a fucking fashion. But

what the fuck was Meredith wearing? Hey, watch your mouth.

Was this a Brooks Marks special? Because it looked like a fancy trash bag.

Well, when she put that wig on, it was serving down colonial style boots. Period.
It was almost like it was blow. It was almost like, is she dressing in a costume? I don't know.

Watch the reactive abuse.

Reactive abuse.

Her giving them

drug tests

in Meredith Marks bags with Meredith Marks caviar in it. I love them and pulling out the caviar first, and it was like, okay, cool, what else is in it? And it was like, huh? This and this.

So it is definitely Meredith's fault for just not owning her mistake and just the way she, I mean, it's the lawyer in her, she'll never admit, she'll always deny, she'll always deflect.

It's quite impressive. Possible deniability.

But for Whitney, and like ultimately had, you know, Meredith kind of made her bed, but for Whitney, and she did this, it started last episode, but the way she's just like, I know three people who are alcoholics, and you must be.

You're right. Like, the way she like therapized Meredith and then diagnosed her to have a drinking problem, like, again,

assuming we believe Heather and Mary and Brittany and what happened, it sounds like Meredith was absolutely a bully on that plane and was mean and got activated and was angry and had a bad day.

And like, it would, it wouldn't shock me to learn that maybe Meredith Marks. in her earlier years was a bit of a mean girl.
Like, that wouldn't shock me. It's not the end of the world.

Like, maybe we've all been had our moments where it's like, yeah, I was kind of a little,

I wasn't like my most pleasant, you know, I wasn't getting laid. I wasn't getting laid and I was kind of a bad.

That doesn't mean you're an alcoholic. Like

I'm trying to come out and just

intense. That was crazy for Whitney to do that.
That was bananas.

Bananasa Barlow there where it was just like drink every time I was given in.

But then it's also like what you're talking about with the deflecting, like the victim, or it's just like she's then saying, well, it's because this is a trigger for me.

You're bold enough to call somebody something like, and we're not even saying like, you have a drinking problem. You called her a straight-up alcoholic pill popper.
Yeah.

She pulls out the thing, and I love that Meredith, where I'm like, I get Meredith deflects, whatever. But Meredith was just like, I think anyone who's accused me needs to take the test.

And it's just like, and while Whitney's like already putting it away, and she's like, I'm fine. It's just, it's just alcohol.
And it's just like, why are you accusing somebody?

If you're not willing to do the test, then like, why are you accusing someone? Here is, I have, I have a few things to defend Meredith Marks in this case in my statement. All right.

Number one, Whitney, you're referencing your father. You're victimizing yourself.
In what way is...

Because I remember the season with your dad. In what way is Meredith similar to your dad at all? You can doth not equate these two people.
Okay, second off, Heather.

You're talking about how Meredith, like, I mean, yeah, is she low-key lying? Sure, whatever. But don't say that she's gaslighting you because you feel traumatized because you were Mormon.

I'm sick of it. I am sick of Whitney and Heather just being like, we have trauma from being Mormon, and therefore anytime anyone kind of lies to us, it is a little bit sassy.

It triggers us into our Mormon ruse. I'm like, look at the Mormon wives.
They're fine. Okay, third.
Still practicing. Let a girl live.

And that's my defense. I think you twisted a lot of that out of context.
Nope.

I think Heather Gay was saying that she was gaslit when Meredith started changing the story and saying she didn't just call her a liar. So that's where she brought up gaslight.
I don't know.

And also, Meredith threw the first jab of pills, crazy pills, before Whitney did. So Whitney was responding.
This is the thing. Okay, but then Whitney went alcoholic, pill popper.

And then it also started last episode where she was diagnosing Meredith.

Well, yeah, see, this is the whole thing, and this is part of the reason I love these women and I love this show, and it's unmatched. But it's like, Meredith is just lying.
Like, they're all

no, no, I'm saying they're like making this whole thing into something it's not where it's like, she does, it's concerning that she doesn't remember. It's like, no, you don't even remember.

Like, this became something it didn't need to, where it was just like, it's like, it became this whole thing where she's like an alcoholic pill popper. And it's like, no, she's a liar.

She remembers everything. She's just lying about it.
But Meredith's number one deflection is calling everybody else a liar, so no one can call her one first.

Also, at the same time, yes, maybe she did lie about that, but also Meredith Martin, she've never lied about that. And to be fair, she did apologize to Brittany.
Maybe she didn't like go step

time, you would apologize to Brittany, but she was sorry she made her feel. She said, we're going to move on and we're going to be cordial.
So I'm like, so why are all of you hyped up?

I'm glad Brittany just stayed silent. She was like, I already, this isn't my battle to take, but fight for me.

Yeah, she's like,

Brittany would have chimed in and said something. She would have made it like that.
We talked yesterday.

Brittany would have 100% would have made it one. You know, she was just sitting there, like, clenching her fist, being like, just don't do it.
Don't say it. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

She's just singing frozen in her head the whole time. Oki's so happy that this is all about her.
Yes, they're all defending her.

That's why she's silent because she finally doesn't have to say what about

her.

She is a valedictorian 4.2 GPA. Let your fans fight your battles.
Salad Victorian.

Wait. Oh, okay.
I'm sorry. All I know is Angie.
Angie looks smoking hot. That was my voice.
Angie looks smoking hot and Bronhan's the only one who knows anything about America. Oh my my god

did you guys know those questions now i crushed no no i knew most of them actually i would say hi but by the way this is the classic example of like americans not knowing anything about american history and

brawl and she like she just took the testing yeah well but i never had to take one well

yes you did u.s history

it really won't sit well in my heart if we don't talk about the horses the horses oh

renting and owning a horse renting and owning owning a horse and Lisa being like, I'm going to get a second horse. And then Angie going, what are you going to do with the second horse?

And then Lisa going, that's none of your business. She goes, oh, interesting.
What are you going to do with this other horse? What are you going to do with the first horse?

That's nobody's business.

Whatever, like the rivalry between Lisa and Angie that's going on right now, I have to say it's one of the most entertaining things because it's never getting too serious. It's never like too deep.

No. But it's like, it's every episode there's something going on between the two of them being

said back and forth. And then today,

Angie is seen in an Arby's ad captioned, I'll do fries when they're this good at Arby's. Cause remember her whole thing about throwing shade at Lisa about Wendy's.

I do franchises, not fries. And now Angie is up against Lisa.

I love this.

Literally.

I don't think I've had either one of their fries. Which one's better? Arby's, for sure.

Arby's has curly fries. I could speak to

her. They have curly fries, and I feel like I just don't like Wendy.
I'm not a curly fry guy. That's crazy.
I do love Wendy's. Do you remember when I ruined your fries, your Wendy's fries?

I fuck with Wendy's. They have good frosties.
I did actually have Wendy's for Thursday, and that fucked up my stomach for the next two days. So, yeah, no.
I love Wendy's.

Well, that will do it for today's episode. Thank you to our guest, Ryan Sirhan and all.
Thank you to all you have listened, all the Spotify raps.

Appreciate all you posting those and supporting our show. We love you.
Natalie, we'll be back next week. We appreciate you all.
Well, see you later. Bye-bye.

Hey, guys, if you love what you listen to, make sure you hit that subscribe button below. Thanks for listening.
We'll see you next time.