234: Friendship Failures..

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Are you ready?

I'm ready, Morris.

I'm not ready.

I don't know why I'm ready.

I feel like I'm more nervous than you.

Maybe I should be nervous, but I found out about this an hour ago.

Yeah, I loved what you said.

You were like, I don't have time to be nervous.

Because I'm just here.

I need to embrace that more.

Helping out a friend, you know.

See, you are friendship goals.

Not a friendship failure like the stories we have today.

I'm an OG.

An OG.

Yeah, let me guys.

Let me give you the spiel, guys.

Hi, my name is Morgan.

Welcome back to another episode of Two Hot Takes.

You're not going to know the girl next to me.

She's never been on an episode.

So let's give them the breakdown.

This is Miss Sarah Nelson.

Sarah and I have been friends since for sure freshman year of high school.

Yeah, decades.

It's been.

Is that decades?

Don't scare me.

That's disgusting.

Just say we were partying in cornfields when we were very young.

The Jersey party?

Jersey party.

That was like a rock pit.

No, yeah.

And our moms are picking us up and we're hiding in cars.

It was bad.

We dated a set of twins.

We each dated one of the twins.

That's like what really bonded us over that shared

trauma.

We've been roommates.

We have.

Oh my gosh.

Our moms are like dropping us off at each other's houses.

It was so cute.

We go way back.

Give everyone your elevator pitch.

Like, what is your vibe?

Who is Sarah?

Who's Who's Sarah?

Who is Sarah?

Just moved to New York.

Uh,

I am actually roommates with one of our old roommates.

Yep.

Uh, me, Alejandra, Lauren, and Morgan.

We're best friends in college, and I'm actually trying to find myself again.

So, I love it.

Let me know in the comments, please.

Where should Sarah go to find herself?

Give me my next uh chapter.

I know, originally from Duluth, has lived in the cities, in Minneapolis, lived in the UK for a while,

Sweden.

I forgot about Sweden.

And now New York for the past nine months, finding herself.

Yeah.

Moving through new relationships.

And giving every country a little treat.

Oh.

Yeah.

Okay.

I don't know about that.

Giving every country a treat.

Every country a treat.

Everyone a show.

Giving everyone a show?

I don't know about that.

Sure hope not.

Oh my God.

Okay.

I'm scared for what we're going to encounter today.

A lot of them I haven't read.

Okay.

I'm going off titles because I was like, my original guest canceled on me.

And so

Sarah saved the day, truly.

I flew to New York for work and I was like, I can't come here and not record an episode now.

So I think it's going to be really good.

We tried to think of the opposite of the word goal.

And there's not like a really, there's not really a word that exists for that.

So it's kind of like the opposite of friendship goals.

So maybe we'll call it friendship failures or fraudulent friends or are they being a good friend?

Fraud.

I like the word fraud.

White collar crime is something that really fascinates me.

That's a good one, too.

Well, you're crushing it.

We turn on the camera, you start crushing it.

We had no idea what to say before this.

I know.

Also, you guys, this is like one of the first times you've seen my legs so clearly.

What is this?

And look at my little shoes.

I'm actually wearing like shoes today, but okay.

Oregon's feet are like this small.

They're so tiny.

I'm like, like,

why is the rest of me so big?

No, you're itty-bitty.

We call you phone size.

I did get told that a lot in high school, which is such a very inappropriate time to be told that.

I was there.

Okay, are you ready?

Yes.

Okay, let's dive in.

Before we get into this week's stories, this episode of Two Out Takes is presented by State Farm.

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If it weren't for my friends, this podcast would probably not exist.

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Trying to

feel if I should ease you into it or just bam.

No, you know, bam.

Okay.

So this first one is coming from our very own Too Hot Takes subreddit.

We've got our own page these days.

It's titled, I just found out that my best friend has been telling all of our friends that my boyfriend tried to cheat on me, dot, dot, dot, with her.

Throw away because some of my friends follow my main and are also listeners of Too Hot Takes.

Drama, let's go.

Stir in the pot.

Ellen, 22 female, and I, 21 female, met through an internship three years ago and instantly became best friends.

About a year ago, I started crushing on George, 24 male, who interns at the same company, but in a different department.

Ellen and another one of our coworkers set us up last fall and we really hit it off.

We've fallen in love and we often talk about a future together.

This is where things get messy.

From early in our relationship, pretty much as soon as we went from dating to being official, Ellen has been colder to me.

She's never made it a secret that she doesn't particularly like George, though she's never said anything direct about it.

The only issue she ever raised was when we first got together and he got really sick.

I was studying for the MCAT at the time, and I was only about a month out from my main test day.

when he had a pretty bad flare-up of a chronic illness.

Because he knew that Ellen and I were so close, he called her to ask her if she thought he should tell me he was sick or if it would be better to keep it from me so he didn't take away from my studies.

Ellen didn't like this at all.

She told me she thought it was incredibly inappropriate that he tried to contact her like that and he shouldn't have called her about something so personal.

I thought her reaction was a little over the top.

but I talked to George about it and he apologized to her and never called her again.

But she didn't let it go.

A few weeks later at a party, she made a comment about how I was always choosing George over my friends.

My roommate was going to be out of town the next week, so she said she should say her goodbyes since I would probably just spend the whole week at home with George.

She tried to play it off as a joke, but I was really surprised that she felt that way.

I never wanted to be the kind of girl who turns her back on her friends when she gets into a relationship.

And I had been trying really hard to balance my time with my boyfriend and with my friends, but it seems she felt neglected.

So I started putting more effort into our friendship.

Over the next few weeks, I tried to make plans with her at least five or six times.

Every time she came up with some excuse to not see me, even once canceling at the last minute and citing a meeting she forgot about at 10 a.m.

on a Sunday morning.

I was hurt.

I knew our friendship was dying, and every time I tried to revive it, she rejected me.

Finally, I decided the ball was in her court.

If she wanted to be friends, I was open to it, but I was sick of being rejected.

And she would have to be the one to reach out to me.

She never did.

Meanwhile, things were deteriorating at work.

We'd been assigned to the same project for the year, which required working very closely together.

As our friendship fell apart, she started ignoring me at work, being rude and short, and making my share of our task very difficult for me.

I felt she was constantly breathing down my neck and waiting to catch me in a mistake.

I figured she was gossiping about me behind my back, but at this point, I was so exhausted from dealing with her that I couldn't be bothered about it.

She would say whatever she wanted to say, and I would just be nice and patient with her and count down the days until our internship ended.

Until today, I had lunch with one of our other coworkers and my good friend, Kay, 22 male, and he told me everything.

Apparently, Ellen has been telling all of our coworkers and friends that George has been trying to cheat on me with her,

telling her that he calls her in the middle of the night, sends her inappropriate texts, and when I hosted a party after I wrote the MCAT, he spent the whole night eyeing her.

I know that none of this is true.

I love George, and I know that he loves me.

And even as Kay was telling me all of this, I knew that Ellen was lying.

It seemed that Kay didn't believe it either.

He was just telling me what he had heard.

But the thought that she's she's been going around accusing George of infidelity makes me sick.

I went straight to George's house and told him everything.

I told him I didn't think for even a second that it was true and that the real betrayal is how Ellen made all of this up and spread it around.

I was crushed to know that not only did Ellen say all of this, but she said it to all of my friends for months and not one of them came to me about it.

George helped me to get past the hurt stage, and now all I feel is rage.

Tomorrow, I'm going to call my supervisor and ask if I can work from home until the end of my contract so that I never have to see Ellen's face again.

I feel so betrayed, and I just hate her so much right now.

Am I overreacting?

Should I be taking the high road and just keep working with Ellen as if I don't know?

I feel betrayed by my other friends too, because Kay thinks they all knew that she was sane, and not one of them told me.

Should I cut them off off the same way I planned to cut off Ellen?

Oof,

this huge noodle.

This is drama.

And some of these friends potentially listen.

I mean,

she has every right to feel uncomfortable, but I feel like if there was any validity behind it, they probably would have told her.

Like, hey, I think your boyfriend might be trying to get with your friend.

Or I've heard these rumors.

I feel like it probably is one of those situations.

Yeah.

I feel like even for Ellen, the one that's making all of this up, if this were me and you and your boyfriend reached out to me and was like trying to,

I don't know, hang out or anything, I would go to you first and foremost and be like,

hey, Sarah,

why is your boyfriend reaching out to me?

Like, this is really weird.

It feels like he's trying to hit on me.

Oh, no, it's, it's actually clear.

Like, he asked me if I wanted to come over.

Yes.

Like, I would go to you first.

And be like, look at the messages.

Look at him blowing me up.

He's calling me in the middle of the night.

This is, there's evidence behind it.

Yeah.

Her word of mouth is, it's just not, it's not landing.

Obviously, that's why people didn't go to her and tell her, hey, we think this is what's actually going on.

Yeah.

Why do you think she's doing this?

She's unwell.

She's not okay, probably.

I mean, she's probably a little attention seeking.

Yeah.

I would assume, but it's getting jealous.

She should.

Oh, for sure.

She should be going to her friend and being like, here's the evidence.

Or, I mean, just telling the guy to stop.

Well, then, if he's still calling you, block his number then.

Exactly.

Like, if your boyfriend was doing that to me, I would block his number and be like, this is insane.

Why is this happening?

It's not okay.

I also think it's so strange how she freaked out when he texted her to be like, hey, you know, do you think I should bother her with me being sick or do you think I should hold off?

And she's like, that was so inappropriate.

Justin texts my friends all the time.

Yes, all the time.

Hey, what should I get Morgan for this?

Like, help me arrange this surprise.

Because you all have a relationship together.

When you're with someone, your friends are also friends with them.

It's so strange.

Oh, this girl, she, but she also has every right to feel uncomfortable and be like, I don't even want to go through my internship.

I feel embarrassed.

But it's really this girl is the problem.

Ellen's the problem.

She's making her feel uncomfortable.

And you need to listen to yourself sometimes when people are making you feel that way.

Yeah.

Really hope the supervisor approves her not having to go in.

And I think if you do, then at that point, it's like, you don't have to be nice to her.

Quit being nice to her.

Quit going out of your way to be nice and patient.

She doesn't deserve it.

Be cordial.

You're working together.

You want to be professional.

You want a good recommendation.

But beyond that, don't kiss her ass anymore.

Yeah.

Like.

Fuck her.

Yeah.

And when someone makes you feel that way, you need to listen to yourself.

Absolutely.

You need to be like, okay, I need to get rid of this girl.

Yeah.

And clearly the relationship, I mean, is super solid between her and her boyfriend.

Yeah.

And so like she immediately was like, I know she's lying.

Like, come on.

I know she's lying.

Yeah.

So that's really good because the wrong person, like someone who didn't trust their partner as much or wasn't as like, I don't know, like self-confident.

would have maybe believed this person and then broken up with a really good guy.

But also, if your significant other was doing that to me, I'd be like, Morgan, look at how crazy this is.

Your boyfriend's like calling me in the middle of the night.

Like, look.

Yeah.

This is not okay.

You wouldn't just, I wouldn't go tell everybody at work, especially too.

It doesn't make you look good.

No.

Like, oh, my friend's boyfriend or my friend's fiance is talking to me all the time.

That doesn't make you look good.

No.

Because you're also not shutting it down then.

Yes, you're not.

Just walk him.

If it makes you uncomfortable, then do something about it and cut him off.

Like that would be the normal thing to do.

I know.

It's almost like she's trying to make herself look more appealing for some reason.

Like she wants me.

It's not working, honey.

It's not working.

We've all seen one of those girls, but yeah, she needs to protect herself, remove herself from the situation, get out of the internship, work from home.

This girl is not making her feel good about herself.

And sometimes that toxic person in your life.

can come in and make you feel that way.

You need to get rid of them.

Absolutely.

Top comment on this post, go to HR.

If she's claiming George is harassing her and he's not, that's a major issue.

I'm assuming he still works there too.

Someone responds though and goes, I think George needs to be the one to go to HR.

Because that is also like, that doesn't make him look good.

Could hurt him in a negative way career-wise.

So

how they're getting the company involved.

They want to get the company involved.

Let's not solve it between friends.

No,

it's higher-ups and HR.

Yeah.

This post was from July 17th, 2024, and we just got an update a year later.

Let's go.

Let's see how it ended.

One year later, I can't believe I'm still learning more about all the ways that Ellen tried to ruin my life.

I'll start with the good news first.

Our internship ended without much fanfare.

I didn't, as many comments suggested, contact HR or confront Ellen.

I did contact our direct supervisor and told him that our personal relationship had deteriorated and that it had caused some hostility on her part at work, given specific examples of issues in the workplace without getting into the weeds of the personal pettiness that was going on.

He was incredibly understanding and accommodating.

I worked from home the rest of the summer, received a glowing recommendation from him, and got hired at our company in my top choice department, fresh out of my internship, while I finished my degree and applied for medical school.

Let's go, girl.

I've been accepted to the top school in my country, and George and I plan on getting married once I finish my studies.

Our relationship is stronger than ever.

Ellen moved abroad, but stayed very well connected to the friend group that we had formed throughout our internship.

After what happened last year, I slowly began to distance myself from that group.

And as I did, I realized that I had outgrown a lot of them, anyways.

Once I began to see the cracks in the friendships I used to surround myself with, I couldn't unsee all the ways they could be unkind, immature, and toxic to themselves and to one another.

I held on to the few people that I knew had my back and came out of the internship with a handful of good, close friends rather than a big circle of people with shady tendencies.

One good friend from the internship, Alice, 22 female, had been close with Ellen about a year ago and has since told me a lot of the things Ellen said behind my back, partially corroborating Kay's story from last year and adding details to some of the craziest parts.

Apparently, to give herself more credibility, Ellen had been telling people that she'd been in touch with my roommate and a friend of 11 years, Anna.

Ellen said that Anna also didn't like George, and Anna had told her I spent way too much time with him, was neglecting all my friends, that he basically lives at our apartment.

And that I always had to do this when I get into a relationship.

She also told people that Anna thinks George is faking his chronic illness and that I'd been using it as an excuse to blow my friends off.

Once when George was at our apartment and had a flare-up, I'd had to cancel plans to stay with him, afraid that he might need me to take him to the hospital.

Ellen told everyone that Anna said he didn't seem sick and that I'd only canceled because I felt like staying home and hanging out with him.

When Alice told me all of this, I immediately confronted Anna and told her everything.

Although Ellen and Anna had been in touch on and off over the past years, I'd previously previously introduced them to one another.

Anna assured me she'd said none of the things Ellen accused her of and even combed back through all of the messages to see if there was anything she'd said that might have implied anything like that.

In going through Anna's messages with Ellen, we noticed a pattern.

It seemed like that anytime I told Ellen I wasn't available, she texted Anna to ask if I was with George.

This went back to almost the beginning of my relationship with him.

That's weird.

I think Ellen wanted you and is pissed that you started dating George.

That's a hot take.

I think, I think that's what's up here.

I think Ellen actually really, really like loved you, which is weird that then she would introduce and like help initiate George and OP's relationship.

But she's like, yeah, giving like possessive vibes.

Maybe it was like a work thing because they all worked together and she wanted to keep her in the work circle and introduce her to another guy.

It's really strange.

That's actually a really good point.

I want to know everyone's hypotheses.

But then, what's her obsession with her friend?

You know, why is it when she's with a guy, why did this start all of a sudden when she got a boyfriend and started dating someone?

And you're spending way too much time with your boyfriend.

It's like, why is that your concern?

You should be happy.

And if it progresses to marriage, you are going to spend that much time with them because you have to know.

What happens when you get a person?

Yeah.

Like,

you both are going to not

have the same amount of time for each other.

you're happy for your friend

It's so weird.

That's such a good point though.

I know I'm really curious and she even drifted from this girl and she's still obsessing about what she's doing who she's with are you with George?

It's like she drifted from you we all drift from friends, but this is another level.

I can't imagine like Lauren hanging out with her boyfriend and then like texting other people to be like, is she with her boyfriend?

Where is she?

She's way too much time.

She's spending way too much time with him.

She's She's obsessed with him.

Yeah.

I mean, bad friend.

That's

that's pretty bad.

And there are people that definitely make that shift, like friend-wise.

There's people that get a boyfriend, and you truly don't see them at all anymore.

Because usually you don't like it when it's toxic, though, and they've done bad things and they're actually texting other girls, texting their friends, and everyone kind of finds out that that's true.

Yeah.

And that's okay.

We should protect our friends, but this doesn't seem like that at all.

No, I feel like OP is being a good, reliable narrator.

It doesn't seem like she was that type of girl.

No.

And even mentioned, like, I tried to ask her to hang out five or six times.

She kept denying me.

10 a.m.

meeting on a Sunday.

For being so in love with her.

Why is she turning her down so much?

I don't know.

I would like to know.

Something's up.

Coming out the other side of all of this.

I've been trying really hard to reflect and learn from this situation.

Was I a perfect friend to Ellen?

Definitely not.

I think there were certainly times at the beginning when I was first dating George and studying for the MCAT that I was distant with her.

Maybe I should have tried harder to patch up our friendship in those early days by confronting her directly, or maybe I should have been more in tune to how she was feeling and addressed it sooner.

Despite everything, I do miss her a lot and wish things had turned out differently.

But I don't think she was fair to me either.

If I had withdrawn a little bit into my relationship in its early stages, she should have given me some grace and confronted me directly when she had a problem rather than going behind my back.

She She absolutely should not have tried to drag my name through the mud, made things difficult at work, or worst of all, tried to destroy George's and Anna's reputations and relationships.

I recently heard that Ellen is moving back to the city and tried to get a job at the company where we interned, but she was rejected by every single department she applied to.

Am I a bad person for feeling a little vindicated?

Thanks to everyone for your comments last year.

I really needed that support.

But now I'm just looking for any lessons to be learned.

Could I have done anything differently?

No.

What can I take away from this and try to be a better friend in the future?

Wow.

Self-aware.

Yeah, there's a lot of people that were rubbed the wrong way by this girl, though.

You know what I mean?

Can't get a job in any department.

Every single person turns you down, thing, girl.

Even George.

No, I'm kidding.

But clearly, there were clearly some toxic energy that people were picking up on.

Yeah.

You can tell who's a mean girl pretty quickly.

Oh, 100%.

Like who puts out that energy and is just not going to be friendly and nice and just stirs the pot and creates drama.

We've all met them, but we also always end up drifting away from them.

You do

you're not attracted to energy like that.

No, we had one in college.

Oh, yeah,

she tried to get me kicked off our spring break trip.

Oh, yeah, remember that, girl?

Yeah, I do.

That was insane.

She's long gone, though.

See, and it's kind of checks out.

I

know.

That was drama.

For what?

Literally no reason.

For what?

That's how that kind of girl works, though.

They'll create something, plant it in a friend group and try to explode the whole thing.

And we are like, we're not going to be here for it.

Which, oddly, if you look at the common denominator in my relationship, my friendship that blew up, like I was dating a guy at the time that she had introduced me to.

She didn't really like it.

tried to make it seem like they were way closer than they actually were and like texted him behind my back on that spring break trip and told him, Oh, yeah, Morgan's cheating on you.

Meanwhile, like, I'm in bed eating a hot pocket.

We're literally sharing a hot dog in bed together.

We had literally,

oh, yeah, we did.

And you're like sitting there crying, and I'm like, holding you, and I'm like, because then he started ignoring me, yeah, because she, like, that's what that kind of girl does.

What is up with that?

Shockingly, we haven't talked to her in a decade, honestly.

Yeah, and I feel way better about it.

I think people like that do, like, you kind of sow what you reap in that sense.

Like, if you're not going to be a good friend, a nice person, you're going to end up very closed off at the end of the day.

And you have a big heart.

I try.

You do.

You have a big heart.

And I was worried about you for a second.

Well, just because I saw it, you know, I wasn't as close with her.

So I saw it outside looking in and I was like, we need to get worse for this girl.

Save Morgan.

Save Morgan.

Eat a hot dog.

Let's just go on the beach.

You know,

it's so crazy.

I like, I'm just so appreciative of like the good friends I've had, especially like friends like you.

Like, I remember, I think it was my 21st birthday.

Everyone else was like busy or unavailable.

And like, you were just coming off of like dealing with a major health thing.

And you still showed up.

Like, you brought a bunch of presents over.

You went to like lunch with me and my dad, I think at Crave.

I love Jerry.

And just like, what's up, Jerry?

Really showed up.

So it's like, having the people like that in your life.

look at this had a crisis today Sarah shows up yeah actually I found out about this like an hour ago I was running errands in the city and she's like I need you and I was like all right let me brush my teeth and here we are

okay and moving on to story number two no less

your team adjective used to describe an individual whose spirit is unyielding unconstrained one who navigates life on their own terms effortlessly they do not always show up on time but when they arrive, you notice an individual confident in their contradictions.

They know the rules but behave as if they do not exist.

Mutine, the new fragrance by Mew Mew, defined by you.

Mutine, adjective, used to describe an individual whose spirit is unyielding, unconstrained.

One who navigates life on their own terms, effortlessly.

They do not always show up on time, but when they arrive, you notice an individual confident in their contradictions

they know the rules but behave as if they do not exist

new teen the new fragrance by memu defined by you coming from r slash am i overreacting it's five hours old am i overreacting 36 female found out my husband 36 male was texting his female friend throughout my labor and delivery.

Saw our phone bill, and husband was texting his female friend throughout my labor and delivery in the hospital, including at 1 a.m.

in the morning, later during pushing, and five minutes after our child was born.

I don't even know this friend.

Female friend from childhood, yes, they dated briefly, but I've never met her.

They reconnected a few months ago, and my husband won't let me meet her, although he's adamant that the connection is only platonic.

I'm still pissed that this woman took mental space from my husband that I feel belong to me, our baby, and our family during one of the most important times in our life.

More context.

He has cheated on me before with someone else almost two years before he reconnected with this friend.

We did therapy, rebuilding, reconciliation.

Yes, I'm uncomfortable with this friendship overall.

Not that he has a female friend, but with the behaviors and attitudes that come with this friendship, given our history.

He's periodically trying to meet her one-on-one, and I am vocal in my displeasure over the idea.

Yes, I've told him several times this whole thing feels off to me.

No, he doesn't plan to change anything or seem to understand or care how much this hurts me and why.

He says,

At least he's being honest and communicating with me about the above, but he keeps his phone locked and has no plans to introduce me to her.

But there is nothing to worry about, he says.

But texting with her while I'm in the hospital giving birth, really,

is there any chance that this is okay and I'm overreacting?

Nope, not overreacting.

I don't think so.

Nope, nope, no, not at all.

I'm like hot.

And he can't meet her either.

And then, like, the one-on-one thing, that's not.

Also, I was going to say earlier, why is she going through the phone bill?

Now I know why.

Now I know why.

Now I know why you're going.

Also, like, oh, I forget that's a thing.

You can literally see that.

I have never,

ever really looked at like detailed phone bills and like who called when and where and like texts and whatever.

I think you have to request it.

Is that a thing?

Do you have to request it?

Everything.

Mine's all online nowadays.

You don't get a paper thing in the mail, but you probably can go look into it.

I love how she was like, who is he texting when I was giving birth to a child?

But that is.

That's like sad, though.

That's super sad.

Super sad she has to do that.

Yes.

And it's gone to that point in their relationship.

Poor thing.

What do you do?

I mean, honestly, you have to listen to how you feel.

And if you're uncomfortable with the relationship that your husband has with someone else, you need to verbalize that and say, no, this is the boundaries that I have for me.

Yeah.

You need to respect that.

I'm the number one female in your life.

Therefore,

you're not allowed to have this type of communication.

And if you are going to do that, I need to meet this girl.

That you need to like sit this girl in front of you and like pick up on the vibes.

You want to see them with each other, how they interact.

I mean,

right?

Absolutely.

If Justin had a friend that he wouldn't let me meet, I'd be so weirded out by that.

Like, everyone's intended to have their own friends.

Like, you don't need to be friends as a couple all the time.

But when I literally can't meet her, that would be weird, especially given all the history of him previously cheating and them dating.

And why did they reconnect?

Like, what was the reason to reconnect?

It's not like they have a lot in common.

Yeah.

He's married now, baby.

Why are they reconnecting?

It's not like his childhood best friend that he's just always been in his life.

Even if it was, you would meet this girl.

Exactly.

I definitely think he's, it's fishy.

I think he's cheating.

Sweetheart, you're not overreacting.

You just not.

And the fact that she questions that she is, like, this is divorce worthy for a lot of people.

This is.

This is a boundary.

I would say absolutely not.

And you meet her.

If she's so close with you, then she's going to be close with me.

We're married.

And if she doesn't want to be, I think that's also a red flag.

Like, if you're a guy out there and you've got girlfriends and you have a girlfriend, a fiancé, wife, whatever, they should also be interested in your partner.

And vice versa.

That goes for everyone.

Like, otherwise it's weird.

Yeah.

Like, 100%.

I mean, my guy every time they get a girlfriend, I'm like, I can't wait to meet her.

Let's go to happy hour.

You're like pumped for them.

You're excited.

Exactly.

You want everyone to have some love, but

you want to be able to be a part of that, too, if they're such a big deal in your life.

I know.

My one of my really good guy friends from college, Ryan Altman, just got engaged somewhat recently.

And like, I met her at Tanner's wedding.

Oh, gosh.

Another one of my guy friends.

Yeah.

Oh my gosh.

And like getting to know their fiancés and wife and soon-to-be wife, like that has been so fun.

It's like you get another girlfriend, you get a built-in girlfriend, and you know she's going to be good because your guyfriend already loves her.

Yeah.

So, and they're like excited to introduce you to that.

That should be a thing.

This is super weird.

I think I would be really documenting things and consulting with a lawyer, getting your ducks in a row.

As sad as that is, because it's like you literally just had a baby.

Create a strong boundary, come up with that and stick to it and say, You need to do X, Y, and Z in order for me to be okay with this.

If you don't do that, then sorry, I'm not comfortable in my relationship anymore.

The second you're starting to go through your phone bill and look at who your husband's texting when you're going to deliver your baby.

I mean, you're in a spot where you're not very secure, but that's not your fault, really.

I mean, he cheated on you already.

Yeah, I think hard, hard boundary of I'm meeting her, or we really really don't have a future.

Like that's where I would be at.

So this was five hours ago.

Five hours old.

Top comment, I wouldn't be concerned about the texting, but about the fact that he doesn't want you to meet her.

That sends alarm bells ringing.

I'm all for individual friendships, but you at least meet occasionally for a meal or something if they regularly hang out.

OP, a writer, does respond.

That's what I'm saying.

I'm going to see if there's any other comments from OP.

Yeah.

I feel bad for her though.

And you're going through a lot, you just had a baby, your hormones are everywhere, your emotions are everywhere, and then you think your husband's being sketchy.

Like, that's kind of the worst case scenario.

I'm not really seeing anything else that's

like something to write home about.

The hot takes community hasn't seen it yet.

Five hours old.

They're not there yet.

OP is a part of the four-year club, has been on Reddit for four years.

A lot of people are like, hey, what's up with your other posts?

Apparently, there's

some other kinky posts that OP has throughout their history.

OP did also share this post to our slash ask men advice to get guys takes and be like, hey, like, what's up with this?

A lot of guys are like, the fact you're not allowed to meet her is very suspicious.

Next one, if I had a platonic friendship with a woman, I'd be thrilled for her to meet my wife.

So it's off.

It is off.

Next one goes, it's not okay.

The fact he has prayer history of cheating only makes it more suspicious.

Add in the fact you're not allowed to meet her.

Oof.

Oof.

Oof is right.

Oh, poor thing.

I know.

Honestly, I feel for you, girl.

We've all been there.

We certainly have.

We've all been there.

It's the worst feeling.

And she just had a kid.

You know, I know.

We're here for for you, girl.

I know.

I found out something it was so wild.

I don't remember what it was, but like

the twins that we dated, he was cheating on me, and he would have the girl climb in through the window.

So, like, his mom

was that your twin?

That was my twin.

Okay, I'm like, why is this ringing a bell?

There was like leaves on the windowsill.

I was like, That's what you found out.

Yes,

on the windowsill.

Well, and you asked me, You're like, Did you see anyone?

And I was like, No,

keep in mind, these twins like used to share a bedroom and we would sleep all in a bedroom together.

Like we were roommates before we were roommates.

It was.

Stop.

It was honestly the weirdest situation ever.

Especially when they went to college.

Oh gosh, a worse.

And still had the twin beds in a dorm.

Why did we date them for so long?

We were not okay.

No girl.

We've all been there.

We've all been there.

Take our advice and get out earlier than later.

I think I got out first, then you stayed in.

And I was like,

no, I think I got out first.

Because then he started dating that other girl girl in like Ashland, Wisconsin.

Oh, yeah.

And I drove up and I took back the TV I bought him.

Oh, that was so funny.

I like

the phone I bought him at the brick wall.

Oh, that was funny.

She drove to Ashland, Wisconsin, showed up, took all of her shit.

It was so funny.

And I'm like sitting there and I'm like, I think I told you about her too.

I know, because it started to get really weird.

And then I was driving there for a weekend and he called me and he's like, don't come.

He's like, I fucked up again.

And I'm like, oh my God.

Here we go again.

No, I just had to get like five restraining orders later online, too.

So it's really bad for us.

What are you thinking?

Hey, it gets better.

It does.

You know what?

That was like a decade and a half ago.

We're doing way better now.

We're thriving.

I mean, you're doing better.

I don't know if I am.

You're finding yourself.

So you're finding yourself.

Yeah.

If anyone is in New York and has a good hot single friend for Sarah, you know, just saying.

Just saying.

Put it out there.

Hide them.

She's on the prowl.

Hide them.

Okay, moving on to this next one.

This is another one from R slash Am I Overreacting, seven hours old this time, titled, Am I Overreacting?

My 28 female, boyfriend, 35 male, told me I need to maintain my body because he's a high value man.

I recently moved into my boyfriend's apartment about two weeks ago, and since then, I've been seeing a darker side of his personality.

He has started telling me what clothes to wear, how I should style my hair, and he discourages me from going out on my own.

He's also been pushing me to cut off some of my friends.

Last night, he told me that I should stop eating dinner altogether because, in his words, quote, I'm a high-value man, so I can be picky with women.

For context, he earns a decent salary, but he's far from being rich or a millionaire.

Nothing about my weight or physique has changed since we met.

I've always had an athletic build, just about 15 pounds over the ideal BMI, and he constantly used to call me sexy and beautiful.

The shift feels sudden and confusing.

He invited me to move in rent-free.

I work and pay all of my own bills, so I don't depend on him financially.

I've been with him for eight months, and this side of him didn't show up until I moved in.

I feel conflicted and just need to hear other perspectives.

I stop eating dinner.

Stop eating.

Actually, you should stop eating.

Put the fork down.

I had like 30 chicken nuggets for dinner last night.

That sounds incredible.

I have not eaten much today.

I've been like sleeping all day after a red eye to hear.

Yeah.

So the only thing I've eaten is like a plantain bag of chips from Spotify here.

I'd love a chicken nugget.

That's an insecure man, though.

That's a him problem.

She's not doing anything wrong.

So insecure.

Someone told me to put the fork down.

I'll pick up two.

I think I'd hurt.

Yeah.

Just a little poke with that fork.

Start eating in bed, actually.

Ice cream.

Yep.

Crumble cookies.

That's shit everywhere.

Ben and Jerry.

Honestly, though, do whatever you want.

Like, that's horrible.

No man should ever make you feel that way.

And any guy that's calling himself a high-value man, like, that's kind of.

That's a huge ick.

I'm a high-value man.

What is a high-value man?

What does that mean?

What does that mean?

Yeah.

Have you ever heard?

Like, I've heard it before, but like, what does it mean?

Like, who would that be?

Like, I can't even think of one, actually.

Like, maybe Matthew McConaughey, obviously.

That's a good one.

That's a good one.

Is she dating Matthew McConaughey?

It doesn't seem like it.

Because he's, yeah, he's how long happily married.

He would never do that to her.

Okay, Google does not give me much.

There's like 20 traits of a high-value man from love quest coaching,

which seems very, I don't know, it seems a little scammy.

He commits commits to himself and others.

He loves putting forth effort for a woman.

He makes plans and follows through.

He calls and doesn't rely solely on text.

He is a great conversationalist.

He dresses and grooms himself impeccably.

He smiles a lot and is positive.

He doesn't chase.

He attracts.

He understands a woman of value can choose.

His car and home are tidy.

He's fun.

This one feels too positive for what?

No, yeah.

He knows how to seduce a woman.

But like, that's what Google says.

When you say that about yourself, it's like he's, he means something else.

We're not sure what that means actually when you talk about yourself that way.

Well, it's starting to get like, I don't know, it's starting to get a little interesting.

Like, he locks down the next date before the current one ends.

When having cocktails, he gets her water.

He shows the right amount of PDA.

I don't know.

That's just called like a green flag, but you don't call yourself a green flag.

Like someone else could maybe like compliment you and say, oh, you're a green flag, Morgan.

But

that obviously stuck with her when he said that.

Because it's such a catching phrase.

It's almost like being like, I'm an alpha.

I'm not a beta.

I'm dying.

I'm soaking.

I'm so prompt.

There is something here.

What is a high-value men's salary?

The mark of a true high-value man is the ability to generate a six-figure income consistently for at least three years in a row.

You cannot be a high-value man without money.

And there is a low-value man.

So I don't know.

This is a big,

big thing.

I just feel like when you say it about yourself, though, it just gives you the, I mean, obviously he gave her the, she went straight to Reddit and was like, guys,

please give me a little bit more.

This was bad, right?

It's bad.

Yeah.

It's bad.

I also think it's really, really concerning that this side of him didn't show until she moved in yeah it's progressing and it's like once he kind of had her like really locked up then he's like okay i'm gonna i'm gonna let the mask slip a little bit i'll start controlling you a little bit we'll see what i can get away with yeah because he's he's like testing her yeah it's different when he like shows up harder the more intimate you are the you know longer you're dating things like that the more you fall in love with someone but it looks like he's just becoming more controlling and it's kind of

I think it's a little bit insecure to label yourself like that.

I think so.

It seems like you're almost like compensating in a way.

It's good to respect yourself and be like, I have good qualities.

I feel like I could show up for someone like this.

But then you just do it.

You don't have to tell them you're doing it.

Very, very true.

You just are.

You just do it.

You don't need to state.

Yeah.

It's like, um,

just reminds me of like, if you see people in the comments, they're like, I'm leaving.

And it's like, this is not an airport.

You don't need to announce your departure.

Yeah.

And it's kind of that same thing.

It's like, if you are those things, like demonstrate it.

Like, the proof is in the pudding.

Actions speak louder than words.

You saying you're a high-value man.

What does that mean?

What does that mean?

What?

I don't know.

It's not like a household term.

It's not at all.

It's a.

It's a red flag term.

It's a huge red flag.

I usually have a red flag.

I should have brought it from LA.

Spotify.

We have a flag in here.

I know.

This is not my set.

Also, you guys.

I think we're on Amy Poehler's set today.

Hey, Amy.

What's up, girl?

Hey.

You can come join me sometime too.

Yeah.

So top comment on this one, not overreacting.

Get out of there.

He is a manipulator who is just masking his real intentions.

The more you become dependent on him, the more he will let the mask slip.

He was love-bombing you before.

Now that you've moved in, he feels he can start to be a bit more demanding.

His next step in progress is isolating you from your friends.

He would probably also eventually encourage you to become financially dependent as well.

Like you only need to work part-time since you don't have to pay rent so that you would be unable to leave.

Feeling entitled to control what you eat and how you dress and who you see is an extremely bad sign.

And I forgot about the who you see.

This person in the comments has definitely dated a man like this.

Oh, very like hearing this story with some triggers and experience.

And it's like, oh my God, my alarm bells are ringing for you.

Yeah.

And I kind of skipped over that line too.

Like, he's also pushing me to cut off some of my friends.

Why?

That's such an abuser tactic.

Oh.

Like, they're a bad influence on you.

Mama.

Because then that person's like more isolated and doesn't have anywhere to turn.

And they're probably trying to cut off the best influence they have, actually.

Yeah.

The person that would be like red flag.

The person.

Get out.

Yes.

Whoever's in those comments, basically.

Yeah.

The person that literally like threatens them and their control and their image the most.

Yeah.

Ooh.

Oh, honey.

Oh, this comment does go on to say, you hear this kind of thing happening with some couples where one person drops the act and becomes more harsh and demanding after they get married.

Two, knowing that their partner will feel like they've invested too much or feel too much social pressure to do something about it.

It is good that he let the mask slip too early while you are still financially independent.

Oh, yeah.

And also, anyone using that high-value manosphere nonsense is also a red flag.

You were on it, Sarah.

Yeah.

I'm gonna see if there's any comments from OP.

Nothing yet.

So true, though.

It's probably going to progress.

At least she is financially stable.

She has her own stuff.

He's moving her in though.

You can't.

Yeah.

You got to move out.

You got to break up.

We'll need an update.

I mean,

I personally, like hearing all the things like cutting off from friends, control, all these red flags, I personally wouldn't give him another chance.

But I'm curious if, like, I don't know, is there a way to work through this?

Is there a way to like set a boundary and be like, hey, I don't appreciate you telling me what I can and can't eat?

That's a boundary for me.

Like, I don't see a way to work forward through this.

I'm curious if anyone does.

I mean, it's how you feel, right?

If he's telling her that and that's how it makes her feel, she needs to listen to herself.

It doesn't make her feel good.

That's not what a partner is supposed to be doing.

No.

And that's not how they're supposed to be showing up for you at all.

No.

Moving along.

Moving along to this next one.

But we've gotten no comments or updates from OP.

I would really, really like an update, OP, especially making sure you are safe and got out okay.

Because again, this one's only seven hours old.

Yeah.

Seven hours old.

Okay.

Up next.

Okay.

I want to give you a choice on this next one.

Okay.

Okay.

Option one.

Am I the asshole for wanting a divorce after my husband gaslit me into believing him flirting with a coworker was okay because I was just hormonal?

Or am I the asshole for going behind my wife's back and telling her pregnant sister that she's being cheated on?

Second one.

Second one?

Yeah.

Okay.

Yeah.

I need to know more.

Yeah.

I've been married to my wife for three years.

I'm 27 and she's 26.

My sister-in-law is 30 and my piece of shit brother-in-law is 31.

I've always had a close relationship with my sister-in-law.

We are friends.

Also had a decent connection between my brother-in-law.

Not that close, but we often talk and get along.

My wife and her sister didn't get along as much as you would expect from siblings.

It wasn't just normal sibling rivalry, but constant fights and arguments.

Anyways, three weeks ago, when I was having dinner with my friends, I saw my brother-in-law with another woman.

They were just eating.

I didn't think much of it.

I wanted to go and greet him, but I kept talking to my friends.

After a while, I saw that he gave a light kiss to this woman.

I was so shocked.

I decided to not confront him.

And when I got back to my home, I told my wife everything.

I told her that her sister is getting cheated on, and we need to tell her.

My wife said we should talk to my brother-in-law instead of telling her sister, and we should not break their marriage because her sister is pregnant.

I was like, what the fuck?

So, what if she's pregnant?

Her husband is a cheat.

I tried to convince my wife multiple times that we should tell her sister the truth.

I told her that I know you guys don't get along, but she's still your sister and this isn't right.

But she asked me to stay out of it.

Not no.

I tried my best to convince my wife, but she either ignored me or said we shouldn't break their marriage.

I had enough of her, and yesterday I told her that I'm coming clean to my sister-in-law.

She and I have a great bond, and I can't and won't betray her.

My wife said, if I tell her the truth, she will not talk to me.

I replied, I won't talk to you either if you don't want to do what's right.

Today, I told my sister-in-law the truth.

I went to her place and told her everything.

She was doubtful and she asked me to leave.

After a few hours, my sister-in-law called me and she was crying and said what I said was the truth and she shouldn't have doubted me and kicked me out.

She said she's leaving him.

I asked her, Where would you go?

Do you have money?

She said she does, but not that much.

I wired her a bit and said she should call me if she needs help.

And she thanked me.

And she said, She will only use the money I sent if it's necessary.

Otherwise, she will return it.

My brother-in-law called my wife, and well, my wife lashed on to me and said, I ruined her family and her sister's life.

I said, I thought the moment we got married, your family is mine and my family is yours.

Anyways, why the fuck are you defending that piece of shit so much?

What about your sister?

She didn't reply to me, and she's not talking to me either.

I tried to talk to her and convince her that it was the right thing to do, but she wouldn't talk to me.

So I said, fine, stay angry.

And if you want a divorce, then go ahead.

I think I have nuked my marriage.

Do not know if I did what was truly right.

Am I the asshole?

Wow.

I mean, loyalty obviously leads for this person, which there's something to respect about that.

It's a big deal to do obviously what this person did,

but in good ways and in bad.

I mean, it's just tough.

I feel horrible for this person because obviously had big emotions behind this.

And

like, how would she feel if this person was cheating on her?

Wouldn't she want someone to tell you?

I mean, I think she's just looking out for her sister because she's pregnant.

I know, but like, at the same time, I don't know, like, even with pregnancy, like, it was kind of giving the vibe to me that, like, even after the baby was here, that she still, like, wasn't going to say anything.

Cause she's like, I don't want to break up the marriage.

Like, we can't break up the marriage.

We can't ruin her marriage.

And it's like, what marriage?

He doesn't care about the marriage.

He's kissing other girls in public restaurants.

That's sad.

And that's obviously progressed you would think i mean you would think you start behind closed doors and then you go out in public but yeah it was meant to be that he obviously saw him doing it very brazen actually when you think about it and the coincidence to like end up at that restaurant and like i didn't go up and say hi right away and good thing he didn't because they probably would have left he never would have saw the kiss I respect it though.

Honestly,

I probably would do it.

Tell.

Yeah.

I would too i just don't think i can help myself and then also what family dynamic if you just feel like you're keeping secrets from each other all the time there's no family bond there then like there's no family loyalty like your family is supposed to have your back yeah and it it's so interesting to me that like the wife kind of has the brother-in-law's back more

and like the brother-in-law called her and was like your husband blah blah blah it's like why do you feel comfortable enough to call

her i'm like then here's where my head goes down the rabbit hole.

And I'm like, they've hooked up.

I'm like, they've hooked up.

I'm like, they have to, right?

Like, why is she defending him so hard?

They're cheating too.

She's hooked up with him.

I'm spiraling.

Family orgy.

I'm spiraling.

I mean, I honestly.

Did you say family orgy?

Family orgy?

Oh my gosh.

I mean, that's tough, though.

I just can't help myself.

I feel any friend or anyone I've had that their significant other was cheating, I always tell them.

Yeah.

I always, I can't hold back.

I mean, when marriage is involved, someone's pregnant, it's tough, but I tell.

I just, I can't help it.

I'm the same way.

I, I, like, have a really big, like,

justice, like thing.

Yes.

It's like, it's like, I just, like, really.

value justice.

Yeah.

And I think that's why like I get so upset with a lot of these stories where I'm just like, the injustice of it all.

Do the right thing.

Well, and I also realized something about myself with like true crime podcasts.

Yeah.

And having another podcast now, like, doing true crime.

Yeah.

The reason I'm so interested in it is because I want to see justice get served.

Yes.

I didn't realize like what it was that drew me to true crime, but it's like it is that justice factor of it.

Yes, absolutely.

So I get it.

I mean, we've had plenty of friends that have had, I mean, we've our boyfriends have cheated on us, and not Justin, we like Justin.

Justin's a good one.

But we always told each other.

I know.

We always told each other.

And it's kind of like, I just,

I mean, and when it's a marriage,

they really should know.

She should, especially pregnant, because if he

gets something, like if he gets an STD and then is still sleeping with her while she's pregnant,

that is not good for the baby.

No.

We talked about it on a past episode and like a bunch of nurses chimed in and like we're like, oh my God, the baby can get this, this, and this.

And I'm like, oh my God, that's such a good point.

Like, she needs to know.

Yes.

Because even more so, because she's pregnant.

I love how they just hop on the internet.

They're like, I feel like I nuked my marriage.

Like, what does the internet think?

I mean, it's just so crazy.

It's like, don't you want to like ensure your sister's good?

And I get like you fought with her.

You haven't been as close, but like, to prioritize this brother-in-law and you're picking brother-in-law over your husband.

And not even wanting to know more.

If he came to me and said that, I'd be like, okay, we need to do some investigating and figure out if this, you know, if it's serious or how far along, you know, if it's just like a one-time meetup peck.

I mean, it doesn't justify it either way, but I would do so much investigating.

I'd have like a notebook on it and be like, we need to know every detail and then we're going to go to her.

I'm so curious what the wife found.

Because initially when she didn't believe him and like kicked him out and then called him back and was like, you were right.

I wonder what she found.

It's a phone bill, those phone bills.

Top comment on this one: not the asshole.

Your wife's stance regarding cheating is worrisome.

Also, why did the piece of shit call your wife?

A normal reaction would have been to confront you directly.

Next comment: Down: I wonder if his wife knew about it and kept it a secret because her sister is pregnant and that's why her brother-in-law called her instead of OP.

That's a good point.

Other comment: Methinks the wife is protesting too much.

She either knows about it or is one of the side pieces.

I'm clocking it, y'all.

I'm

or is one of the side pieces.

Why?

Why else act like this?

Why are you going to pick his side?

And just like immediately shut it down, too.

Be like, nope.

No, it's fine.

Nope.

Let him cheat.

Can't say a word.

Let him keep having sex with other people.

That's not my situation.

Break up the family.

Because that means she's also breaking up with him, too.

Yeah, she wants to keep her person close, maybe.

Yeah.

I mean,

if that's what you're doing, you probably would.

Uh-huh.

OP does respond to some of the comments.

Someone goes, sounds like your wife supports cheaters and that should be worrying to you, not the asshole.

OP goes, I thought about it and I am concerned about it, but I somewhat think she just wanted me to not tell her because my sister-in-law is pregnant and it will cause more stress.

That's just what I think.

But the truth is, if I hide it and support my wife, I'm in the wrong.

If I tell her the truth after she gives birth, then I'm still in the wrong.

Someone goes, not the asshole.

If I were you, I would sleep with one eye open.

Your wife has no moral standards.

And OP goes, I truly have been thinking about this, that she just might be dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, like 10 dots.

But I love and trust my wife.

And I was thinking she wanted me to not tell her because my sister-in-law is pregnant.

And women knows how stressful pregnancy and after pregnancy is.

And she might have thought that she needs support from her husband.

I don't know.

Nothing makes sense to me anymore.

There was nothing for me to suspect her of cheating on me.

He's going there.

He's going there.

He's going there.

I would too.

Well,

we get an update.

We get an update.

It's been a few days since I told my wife's sister that her husband is a cheat.

Just to clarify to all the weirdos, no, I am not in love with my sister-in-law.

I don't have any inappropriate relation or or feelings for her.

I respect her, and she's my family.

In any case, yesterday, I asked my wife why she is pissed and wanted me to not reveal the truth to her sister.

I know you guys hate each other, but you guys are siblings.

My wife said, it's not our place to interfere.

I asked, are you okay with your sister being cheated on?

She said she isn't, but it will and has ruined their marriage because of my stupidity.

She's pregnant, and the child needs his father, and so does the wife.

I was so shocked when she said this.

Like, what the fuck?

I asked her, if I were to cheat on you, would you forgive me?

She said, yes.

I also asked her, if she ever cheats on me, would she hide it from me?

She also said yes to that.

Wow.

Wow.

So, I mean,

that would tell me everything I need to know.

I would be like, you're kidding me.

She probably has then, basically.

Yeah.

Who just says that?

Who says that?

Yeah.

I would lie to you.

Yeah, I'd hide it.

And that's your wife.

You can't trust her at all.

What is going on with this woman?

I'm like, did she get a concussion?

Like, what is, yeah, what is going on?

Oh my God.

Oh, that's scary.

This is really scary.

She has.

She absolutely, there's no doubt in my mind.

Something's up.

I was so shocked.

I asked her if she knows what she's saying.

She said, yes.

And she's confident.

Just because you had sex with someone else doesn't mean everyone else has to suffer and break the family.

I had no words to say.

I told her that I also sent my sister-in-law money.

She started screaming at me and said I shouldn't have helped her despite knowing she doesn't like her sister.

I said, if that's what she thinks, then it's better if we just divorce.

She got angry and screamed, fine, and started packing her bag.

I tried my best to stop her from leaving.

I told her that I love her and I just did what I felt was right.

Nobody has to suffer betrayal like this.

She said it wasn't the right time.

I asked her, so when should we tell her the truth?

After she gives birth?

Because it will worsen her PPD or years after she gives birth.

She will still just blame us.

She said we should have kept quiet and left it alone.

I tried so hard to stop her, but she didn't listen to me and left.

I tried to contact her and her parents, her friends, but they don't know where she is.

And instead, she started interrogating me and saying I am her husband and I should have taken care of her and I should know where she is.

I even visited my brother-in-law to confirm my suspicions, but I didn't see her or her belongings anywhere.

Wow.

Wow.

So he had the same thought.

That's insane.

I mean,

I'm just shocked.

Like, what is going on with this family?

He has good intuition, obviously, but like,

I'm just shocked that this is the first conversation he had with his wife that makes him realize, wow, she's...

She has different moral values than me.

Like, yeah, I would just lie to you.

I'd cheat on you, not tell you.

Not a big sense of integrity.

Is that the first combo they had about this, though?

I mean, I'm very curious.

Drop the red flag, shall we say?

That is quite the red flag.

Oh, my God.

Oh.

OP does end the update.

Now I'm at my parents, and my sister-in-law is in our home.

Maybe I was being petty, but I hate that my wife gave up on me and left without a second thought.

I don't know whether she's cheating or cheated, or she would truly cheat on me and her own blood sister with a family relative over feuds.

One thing is for sure, though, I cannot trust my wife anymore.

She hurt me.

Yeah, listen to yourself.

Seriously, you cannot trust her.

If my husband was like, you know, would you lie to me if you cheated on me?

I'd probably say, I would never cheat on you.

I would never cheat on you.

Not just, yeah, I would lie to you.

That's the craziest thing.

There's been, yeah.

And what about it?

Yeah, I would lie.

For sure, I would.

I feel like even people that cheat lie about cheating.

Yes.

Like, you know what I mean?

Like,

if a cheater was having that same conversation, a normal cheater would be like, no, I'd never, I'd, no, babe.

Like, I wouldn't cheat.

Like, yeah.

I, I've, if something happened, of course I'd tell you.

I would never lie to you.

Like, I would never lie.

They would just gaslight you and say, no, I would never cheat on you.

I'm like, yeah, I would tell you as they're like cheating on you, probably.

Not that I'm hoping for gaslighting here, but I mean, we're just going down a rabbit hole right now.

But also, I'm so surprised that she didn't, given that she, like, clearly is so emotionally disconnected anyways.

She's just saying whatever.

Oh.

Oh, my God.

Dang.

This is crazy.

This is some crazy family drama.

I know.

It also sounds like their relationship is kind of rocky with how they're like communicating and like, I want a divorce.

Well, fine, you can have it.

And then it's like they're throwing divorce around.

Yeah.

She's storming out.

It's like they're throwing up the D-word.

Throwing

the D-word.

So this is.

This family was probably meant to break apart.

I don't know if this was the most secure family unit we've come across.

This is crazy dysfunctional.

We do get one last update.

Let's hear it.

Latest update came one month after the last update.

So the original post was from

November 3rd, 2023.

And the last update we have, a lot of updates this episode.

Wow, guys.

Do we like when you guys get a lot of updates or do you like getting more stories?

Like, would you rather have more?

I'm like, so invested.

Same.

I'm loving that update.

I love an update.

But like, I know some people are like, no, get through more stories.

So I'm checking your pulse.

Check your pulse.

Tell me what you guys like in the comments.

So the last update we have, December 26th, day after Christmas.

I've made a couple posts prior to this one, and I know nobody wants to go through all of that, but I never thought celebrating Christmas with my sister-in-law would cause this much drama.

So I'll drop a too-long didn't read.

I found out that my brother-in-law was cheating on my sister-in-law, my soon-to-be ex-wife's sister.

When I told my then-wife, she told me to stay quiet.

I didn't.

I went ahead and I told my sister-in-law.

My wife's reasoning was that we shouldn't interfere in their marriage as it doesn't concern us.

I was angry and she said she would defend cheating.

When I asked her if she would forgive me if I cheated, she said she would because it's just sex.

After a huge fight, she left and disappeared for a week.

When she came back, I told her that I am filing and we are currently going through the divorce process.

Oh, where did she go for that?

Disappeared?

What does that mean?

Nobody knew where she went.

Sketchy.

Gone for a week.

That's weird.

For me and my soon-to-be ex and going through legal proceedings, and we are going to get divorced 100 because i can't trust someone who defends cheaters especially someone who defends a cheater who cheats on her own sister yeah their sister relationship was

but still it's wrong for me and for my sister-in-law my sister-in-law is going through divorce process as well and she's aggressively seeking child support and alimony okay good

so on christmas i invited my sister-in-law to celebrate with me I had already been supporting her financially and we got closer and became friends because we both were betrayed by our partners.

We would talk, we would vent, and get so angry, so much at both of us.

They're getting a little

too close.

Supporting financials?

Like, what does that mean?

You're, yeah,

that's kind of crossing an interesting line.

I see where this is going.

Family orgy, I told you.

You might have called it.

I told you.

My sister-in-law and I celebrated Christmas with children from both of our family, like nephew and nieces, and even their friends joined us for a while.

And we kind of went overboard and showered them with gifts.

My soon-to-be-ex got to know about it.

And she told everyone in my family and her family that it's us that were cheating.

And now I'm trying to get married to her sister, which is why I am divorcing her.

This twisted motherfucker.

Most of our families didn't believe her, except some of hers and mine.

They said, I am a cheat, and I shouldn't be celebrating with my sister-in-law because she's my ex-sister-in-law ex-sister-in-law, because I'm divorcing my wife, and I should be spending time with my wife instead of divorcing her.

She did not wrong me.

I tried to tell them that her defending cheaters is so stupid, and I and my ex-sister-in-law are friends, and we celebrated with children, and she herself is pregnant, and I was just supporting her, and she also supports me, because we are going through so much.

But they kept saying that I should take my wife back and do good by her, and spending time with my soon-to-be ex-sister-in-law is not good, and we are and we're cheating.

So, am I the asshole for celebrating Christmas with her and children from our family?

They didn't stay for a long time, but after they left, me and my sister-in-law did spend a long time together.

But it was just us drinking and talking about the future and what we should do about our partners.

We just vent to each other.

Hmm, wow,

that was a heater.

This is just fishy all around, it just stinks of trout,

Just stinks of it.

Fishy.

It's just fishy.

Oh, this.

I'm.

I got to give this one a noodle.

I don't know.

Give it a beat.

Yeah.

I mean,

it's all weird.

Everything about it.

I mean, this is a very dramatic family.

This should be like a lifetime movie.

It should be.

It's giving.

very traditional and conservative.

Like maybe divorce isn't really a thing.

Yeah.

With how they're like, make it right.

Take your wife back.

Fix it.

It's, that's what I'm envisioning.

It's, it's feeling really conservative.

But didn't she leave for a weekend?

Disappear?

I know.

Is she the one?

And what's the excuse for that?

I don't know.

Yeah, she never contacted me after she left and her family didn't know where she was.

Like still, like, that was.

the last comment on one of the updates.

That's really weird.

Where was she?

I would be like, yeah, I'm going to leave.

Like, this is weird.

That, to me, I'm like, she was probably with her affair partner at a resort for a week.

For sure.

She's a little bit of a child.

Doesn't that sound nice?

Yeah, it sounds nice.

I've never been to a sandals.

No, but we should go.

I'm down.

We should go.

I went to a breathless.

We used to go to a Panama City Beach together.

We could run it back.

Multiple times.

We could run it back.

Oh.

Not even as much drama in Panama City Beach.

No, way less.

I don't know.

I guess, you know, it's going to be what it's going to be.

I do think it's, it's,

it's nice of OP to be helping sister-in-law so much, but I do think it's a little weird that he's supporting her financially.

Yeah.

Granted, you know, if she's eight months pregnant, she probably can't go out to get a job.

Maybe husband has cut her off.

She was a stay-at-home wife, soon to be stay-at-home mom.

And so she's trying to get child support and Alamoni, but like legal stuff takes a while.

This all happened very fast.

Oh my God, spiraling.

Really fast.

I mean, she's still pregnant during this.

Yeah.

Exactly.

Wow.

I know.

So the last update we have, eight months old.

We've gotten nothing since then.

Okay.

So OP, if you're out there, I'd love an update.

Baby has definitely been born by this point.

Yeah.

Like it had to have been.

Yeah.

Even if she was like right pregnant when the first story came out.

Whose house is this kid staying at?

Did they get together?

Yeah.

What happened to the wife?

Is the wife with the old brother-in-law split custody some couples do do swaps like that yeah i know but if it's like your child and your niece it's like you're my child but you're also my niece and that's also your aunt but it's also your mom we went to um we went to school with someone i was like really good friends with him for a while and his parents did a swap like that They like both, both boys played on the same hockey team.

And I don't know if this was a thing for like their team or if it's common, but like when they would go to hockey tournaments, like they would start swinging, I guess.

Was this in high school?

Yeah.

Do I know who they are?

I think so.

Oh, I can't wait to hear that.

And

their parents started swinging.

And like, I think they ended up liking the swap so much that their parents, like everyone got divorced and they recoupled.

And so in college, both, both of them ended up at the same college playing for the same hockey team.

And like they were cordial, but like you could tell it was like still like very weird.

Like, no, that wouldn't be awkward at all.

Yeah.

I know.

So, some people do do this.

That's juicy.

Okay.

I think I have one last one for you.

One last one to wrap up your time on two hot takes.

Let's do it.

You definitely have to, you have to come back, though.

I think so.

I think.

This internet shoves me off.

Be nice.

Okay, this last one coming from R/slash wedding drama.

I'm like teeing up.

I'm teeing up.

I've had some wedding drama.

It's been like very unexpected

from a culprit I did not think it was going to come from.

My dad.

Jerry?

Yeah.

He called me a bridezilla even secretly on Father Knows.

He would do that.

So there's some tea if you want to go over there.

It might have been on Patreon, Father Knows, though.

Yeah.

You might have to give Jerry a call after this.

You might have to.

My dad used to like call me when I lived in Europe and just call me to say hi.

He's just, he loves you.

I talked to him on the phone for like now.

I'm like, what's up, Jerry?

How are you?

He literally, a lot of listeners that come to live shows will meet him and he'll he'll give them his personal number.

Yeah, he'll call you too.

And so, like, we've got listeners out there that are now like kind of friends with my dad and text him and catch up all the time.

Like,

he's everyone's dad, though.

He really is.

He is.

He really is.

That's why we actually kind of started his own podcast.

Yeah.

Which you'll have to go on that with him too.

Maybe.

Well, next time you come out to LA.

Literally, I haven't seen Jerry in a decade and he's still calling me.

How are you, sweetheart?

Are you taking care of yourself?

That's bad.

We, yeah, but I always answer.

I know.

we need to get you out to la that's on the list i know that's on the list okay r/slash wedding drama four days old titled my future mother-in-law secretly sent out her own wedding invitations with a different dress code and start time

do you have any mother-in-law stuff

actually no she's good she was actually

look at that I know you really yeah you do good in the mother-in-law department yeah I really loved her she's actually great thank god this is honestly the weirdest thing i've ever had to deal with, and I still don't know how to process it.

I'm getting married in October.

My fiancé and I are paying for most of the wedding ourselves, but his parents generously offered to cover the rehearsal dinner and help with flowers.

His mom has always had strong opinions, but she's mostly polite until now.

A few days ago, one of his cousins messaged me on Instagram asking what she should actually wear to the wedding.

I was confused because we included the dress code semi-formal on the official invites months ago.

When I asked what she meant, she sent me a photo of a different invitation with our names on it.

Except the time was changed an hour earlier, the venue details were shortened, and the dress code said formal black tie.

At first, I thought it was a mistake or maybe some kind of outdated mock-up, but nope.

Turns out my future mother-in-law had taken it upon herself to create and send out her own version of our wedding invitation to her side of the family, as she later told us because she thought ours was too casual and would make her family feel underdressed.

I confronted my fiancé, and he was just as shocked as I was.

He had no idea she had done this.

When we called her, she didn't even try to deny it.

She said she was just protecting the family's image and didn't think we'd mind since she kept the same date and names.

I asked why she changed the time, and she casually said, Well, I thought your timeline was a bit rushed, and some of our relatives like to arrive early.

I was livid.

Not only is this incredibly disrespectful, but it's going to cause chaos on the day.

People are going to show up dressed up for a completely different event and early.

I explained as calmly as I could that this was not okay, and she got defensive, saying that I was overreacting and not being inclusive of her family's preferences.

Now I don't know what to do.

Do I send a second clarification invite to her her side to fix this mess?

Do I let it play out and deal with the awkwardness on the day?

My fiancé is fully on my side and wants to have a serious talk with her, but I'm nervous that any more confrontation is just going to make her double down and cause more drama.

I never imagined something like this would happen.

How do you even come back from something this passive-aggressive?

Is there a way to fix this without the whole thing turning into a total disaster?

Any advice would be appreciated.

I'm stressed and tired, and this feels like a problem i shouldn't even have to be dealing with right now

to be honest if my mother-in-law would have done that i probably would have just been like okay

like i probably would have just been like sounds good i don't know i mean

because it will cause drama if she's that assertive to go behind her back and

create a new invitation all that stuff i understand what she's saying though because a lot of it's word of mouth you'll send out an invitation and people will still ask you hey morgan were we supposed to wear to your wedding again cowway boots.

Cowway boots.

I have mine.

Hey.

But

people will still ask.

Yeah.

And so it's confusing when there's an invitation that says one thing and

everyone else is verbalizing something else.

For sure.

I,

oh, this is tough because it's like, I don't think you should have to send out another invitation because then like, what if mother-in-law sent out another invitation?

Like, where does it...

Where does it stop?

Yeah.

I feel like you should have your fiancé just call everyone on on that side.

Like you have your RCVP list.

You know who's coming.

Give them a call.

Send them a text and be like, hey, it's been brought to my attention that my mom sent out an additional invite.

That is not what is happening.

Please arrive at this time.

It is still semi-formal as our first invitation stated.

I think it's kind of his circus to control, given it's his mom.

Yeah.

And I feel like.

And you have to control it because it's so embarrassing if you show up overdressed somewhere or underdressed.

I mean, it's you're just yeah, it's awkward semi-formal versus black tie formal

is very different.

Very different.

That's like full tucks with a cumber cumber bund,

you know, that little cumber bund thing holds the little belly in.

Yeah, I mean, that's true, though.

It's very different.

It's so different.

And I also just think it could set a standard with the mom.

That's scary.

That's true, actually, though.

I mean, you kind of need to set your boundaries a little bit.

I think so.

I because you're in this.

I think it's so awkward doing it.

Yeah.

Like, if my mother-in-law did this and was like, actually, you guys, rehearsal dinner is here and you need to show up wearing this.

Like,

I know it would feel awkward trying to be like, Chris, Chris, no, what?

No, Chris.

Yeah.

But Chris has been great.

She's been so helpful with the wedding, accepting all my packages I shipped to Minnesota.

So

she's been great with all the help.

But I do get how it'd be awkward, but you probably should say something because first it's the wedding yeah next it's a baby shower then it's you know whatever else a birthday party so true for the kid or your husband or whoever like she's gonna keep oh what's that big word meddling yeah she's gonna keep meddling i mean yeah you have to set the standard right away and be like no this kind of we have to communicate about this if we're gonna be a family this has to go through all of us especially if all of us are involved and my family feel underdressed Like,

you're not respecting their preferences.

They're rushing.

So, what did Uncle Joe call you and say feel underdressed and rushed?

It's weird.

No, this is a her thing.

It is.

I tried to go look and see if OP has had any comments or anything of the sort.

I think OP got a little nervous that mother-in-law or someone might find it.

Unless my Reddit's just not working,

they deleted the post.

Yeah, post is deleted.

And this is a real Reddit account.

Seemingly, they have a verified email.

So they actually verified their email, which hey, fake accounts could do too.

But like a lot of people that make throwaways don't.

Yeah.

But top comment, your fiancé should be handling this because it's his mother and his side.

He can send a mass text.

that says you may have gotten a wedding invite.

I did not read this, you guys.

Just I'm in it today.

He can send a mass text that says you got a second wedding invite from my mom, which included incorrect details regarding our big day.

The start time of the event is X.

The dress code is X.

Please note that the venue will not be equipped for early arrivals.

Can't wait to see you all.

Next com.

Oh, OP did respond to that comment.

Absolutely.

That's exactly what we're planning.

Cool.

I just wanted to make sure we're handling it tactfully so it doesn't turn into more drama.

He'll send out a clear message to everyone so there's no confusion.

And I think that should settle things without escalating the situation.

Thanks for the suggestion.

I agree.

And you don't want to be like, oh, my mother-in-law, like, make it this big deal and never do anything about it.

And then there's going to be drama anyway.

Yeah.

Because you're clearly venting about your mother-in-law up until your wedding day.

You got to, though.

Like, you got to just like.

get after this.

And like someone gives her another idea.

Also, I would password protect anything and everything having to do with your wedding.

Let your vendors know your future mother-in-law sounds a bit unhinged.

And also, have a bridesmaid on standby with a glass of red wine ready to accidentally spill on mother-in-law's dress just in case she shows up in white or pisses you off the day of.

That girl's in a wedding party somewhere.

Uh-huh.

Yeah.

Uh-huh.

She knows it's you.

The passwords thing is genius.

That's so true.

Because I feel like I've had a story in the past where the mom or mother-in-law called the florist and tried to change everything,

tried to like cancel some stuff and change others.

Like, so they set up a password system.

Yeah.

So if you have anyone, that's a little

smart though.

Yeah, that's it's just awkward sometimes if the mother-in-law and the family's paying for it or something.

They feel like they have to have control.

It gets a little messy.

Yeah.

I think that's something, too, if you're getting married.

And this is something that like, I feel like Justin and I really did.

Like, we're basically paying for everything on our own, just the two of us, except his parents are going to help contribute to the rehearsal dinner and the train.

And my mom has like bought so much stuff for the farm and like

has put in

months worth of manual labor.

So, like, that helps me more than financial contributions, anyways.

Yeah.

So, like, everyone is helping, but that's something we made very clear: is like, if you're helping, we don't want any like strings attached.

Like, you can't hold it over our head and say, Well, you need to do this because of so-and-so.

Like, no, this is my wedding and I'm planning it.

Yeah.

Sorry.

It's hard though.

Like, I've had a little bit of drama here and there and I've had to like give invitations that I otherwise like wouldn't have wanted to.

Yeah.

Just to keep a little bit of peace.

But yeah.

Hey, I won't really interact with them anyways.

It's my day.

I'm walking around.

Oh, you're going to have a great time.

Drinking with friends.

I'll hold the glass of red wine to spill on literally anyone.

Sarah's got a job.

You heard it here, folks.

You heard it here.

Someone shows up in white.

Sarah's got her job.

Invite me to your wedding if you need something.

Especially if it's here in New York.

Yeah, I mean, I'll go anywhere with a glass of red.

Trust me.

Speaking of glass of red, we should go get one.

We are right now.

We're gonna have probably five because we needed this.

A bottle.

Yes, let's go.

Thank you guys for being here.

Another episode.

This was magical.

I hope you enjoyed getting to know Sarah.

I'm sure she will be back on one of my other New York trips, or actually, we're just gonna get her to LA.

Yeah, let's do it.

Come visit.

I got a guest room these days.

I got a guest room.

This is so grown up.

But that's all I got.

Head over to Patreon if you want more content.

There's three bonus episodes a month these days.

Some really good trio apps with Lauren Justin and I and Michaela Justin and I.

Really good.

So head over there.

But thank you guys for being here.

Until next time.

Bye.