#454 - Swiss Arrogance, All Cars are the Same and One of the UK’s SUVs

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Hello everyone.

Last week on the show we shared the heartbreaking news that Ellis' car, the Volkswagen Barrel of Eggs, had reached the end of its natural life.

Since then, people around the country have been paying tribute to one of the nation's most beloved vehicles.

Though many who saw the car parked badly in South London assumed it had been abandoned or declared sawn,

those lucky enough to see it in motion, be it arriving late to swimming clubs, arriving late to family engagements, or arriving late to home base, The image is one they will never forget.

We are a nation in mourning.

And none more so than owner operator Ellis James.

Ellis has been experiencing the five stages of grief.

Though widely discounted as a helpful modality in managing grief, Ellis thought he'd give it a go.

And the past week has been a challenging one.

On Friday, Ellis experienced denial, attempting to start the Volkswagen golf over 50 times before sitting in the back and playing Ornette Coleman from his phone when the car battery finally went flat.

On Saturday he sought solace in anger, hurling abuse at individual pigeons whose unchecked and uncleaned droppings had given the car its characteristic rough texture and contributed to the growth of vegetation on the exterior air vents through the process of seed dispersal.

On Sunday, it was bargaining.

with Ellis appealing for intercession from God, Mother Nature and the mechanic with the good vibe and hot brain who lives far away.

By Monday, a deep depression had brought darkness to Ellis' day.

He was left feeling empty and alone by things that usually give him joy, such as cycling topless to Kennington, reading about Charlton Athletic, and sharing screen grabs of his bank statements with Mike Bubbins and the other one.

And today...

Well...

Today it's time for acceptance.

Time to accept his current state of carlessness.

Time to accept that John was right.

And if he'd better prepared and replaced the VW months ago, or at least had it cleaned more than once a decade, he could have avoided joining the carless population.

One made up solely of old people who've finally bowed to pressure from their family and thickos who couldn't pass their test.

Ellis,

how's the acceptance process going?

I've started using that company who Dave doesn't like me to name that allow you to borrow a car for an hour.

The one I seem to keep borrowing because it's always in the area, it's always very near the house, is a Nissan Leaf.

Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

I could learn to love the Leaf, I think.

Ellis,

you have not

been

authorised.

to use the brand of car.

But I've learned to love the Leaf.

You've not been authorised by the BBC and its compliance team.

Okay.

I have been authorised after training, access to online learning materials and

being pointed towards new editorial guidelines

on the commission to the channel and the online course

because Dave is still not here.

Yes.

Because of the unique way the BBC is funded, we're not allowed to give undue prominence to certain, well, to any brand, do we?

And the unique way the BBC is funded, I don't know if you knew this, is it just rounds up all your card transactions.

So if you spend 56p, it's a quid.

The 44p goes to the BBC.

Exactly.

And that's why we're all drooling in it.

Yeah, you can opt out,

but you will have to contact your bank to opt.

You are automatically opted in.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

At birth.

At birth.

Yeah, yeah.

And that's the unique way the BBC is funded.

And also 25% on any savings interest.

Again, you're automatically opted into that when you open a savings account.

You can opt out.

It's quite fiddly.

So, Ellis,

in Dave's absence, you know, this could go one or two ways.

I could

stand by a lot of the points he raised on a half-hour phone call yesterday when advising you.

Why under new prominence?

When advising you on your new case.

What about the phrase, learn to love the leaf?

What do you think he'd love?

What do you think he'd like about the leaf?

That would be, I don't know whether the fact you haven't completed the course actually qualifies you to say learn to love the leaf.

But I would need to say the leaf is a bad idea,

but also a good idea and a

And a medium idea.

Because I have been doing my research all week on what car you should be.

You are good to me.

I am good to be.

You are good to me.

And I don't think NF people recognise it.

I don't think I recognise it enough, actually, but you're good to me.

I'm good to you.

Because I've just watched the Tour de France tonight TV.

Yes.

Thank you to Gary I'm like a netbolting.

The coverage has been fantastic.

Yes.

Well, I've been good to you in a way you didn't ask, nor particularly want.

Yeah.

I don't think NF people recognise that.

But it's still net good.

So let's begin.

Our BBC approved, editorially justified what car should Ellis buy?

Now.

Now, Ellis, you know, I know, and the BBC knows

that all cars are the same.

Yes.

That's my view.

Utility cars.

Utility cars.

It's the view of the BBC.

It's the view of the broad motor industry.

Yeah, yeah.

It's the kind of clothing people, utility clothing people wore after the war.

Yes, absolutely.

It's combat fatigues.

Now, obviously, this presents the consumer with a problem.

Because I can't go wrong or right.

Well, also, how do you choose when every car is exactly the same?

They seem just as good as each other.

All the same features, all the same size, all the same colour,

all the same quality,

all the same interior.

Yes.

Yes.

Well, that's where I come in.

Yeah.

Creating the first ever totally neutral recommendation of a car that's the same as all the other cars.

From Berlingo to BMW, they're all the same.

I can't see the difference, Ellis.

No, no, no, neither can I.

So let's start off.

with a car that's the same as every other car.

Yeah.

The BMW X5 3-litre 30D MHT M Sport Auto X-Drive Euro 65 Door.

Okay, wow.

It's the same as all other cars.

Yes.

It's 4,922 millimeters long.

That's just a cold, hard fact.

Okay.

Okay.

All cars are that long.

And we deal in facts.

And we deal in facts on this show.

It's got a range of 54 miles because you did point out that you would like a hybrid vehicle.

All vehicles are hybrid vehicles.

Yeah.

Therefore, it doesn't matter which one you pick, if you wanted one with 54 miles range, on average, well, pick any of them, but also you could pick the BMW X5 3.0 for

HTML.

If I could be bothered for the 65 door.

Okay.

It's got one of the best driving experiences, according to reviews that also pointed out that all other cars have the best driving experience.

Yes.

Yeah.

Because what I like about reviews in general, I think the best reviews are completely neutral.

Yes.

Oh, the last thing I want from a review is an opinion.

When I go to the Edinburgh Festival, I look for all the most neutral reviews and I go to those shows.

All you want to to say is this is a comedy show.

It began on time as advertised.

It cost the same price as advertised.

It finished on time as advertised.

And the content broadly married up with what it said in the blurb.

Full stop.

Full stop.

Yes, please.

Two tickets for that.

Two tickets for that.

Like all cars, the BMW X5 has a high-spec interior.

Okay.

Okay.

And

because

something happened to all cars about five years ago, five to seven years ago,

where they were ahead of the game in terms of where fashions would go, of how cars would look.

So, all cars, like the BMW X5 3-litre 30D MHT M Sport Auto Extra V Euro 65 Door, still look modern now.

Yes, yes.

Okay.

So that's option one.

Okay.

But to be honest, you could be, you know, just putting a pin in a map because it doesn't matter.

Yeah, yeah, pin the tail on the hybrid.

Yeah, exactly.

We move because an older Ellis James, an Ellis James from the past, wanted to take a walk down Estate Alley.

Yes, I used to have a Ford Focus estate, which was the same as all of the cars.

Yeah, because all cars are estates.

And can I introduce you, ask you to shake hands with, but out of politeness, not out of pleasure, the Skoda Superb.

Oh, okay.

Yes.

The taxi driver's favourite?

The taxi driver's favourite, but the estate version.

Okay, and all taxi drivers love all cars the same.

They just happen to have a lot of superbs.

And like all cars, the SCODA's superb 1.5 TSI E-Tech MHEV SE Technology DSG Euro 65 door

has exceptional boot space.

But that's just true of all cars.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

My car's got exceptional boot space.

On the walk here, I saw circa

300 cars.

Yeah, yeah.

Every single one, exceptional boot space.

Ride comfort.

Okay.

As standard in all modern cars.

The same.

The same.

However,

compared to luxury brands in the same category, which are all the same,

it offers

a value for money.

Okay.

I'm not saying that's good value for money.

I'm not saying that's bad value for money.

I'm saying it offers a value of money.

To Skoda, money has a value.

And that's set by the international currency exchanges.

That's not up to Skoda.

And the dollar can fall as well as rise.

But all currencies are the same.

Yes.

When we went on top gear to promote our first tour, I now understand why the punters didn't like us.

Some drivers of the Skoda Superb Estate have highlighted that, as with all cars, it shares a slightly cheap feel to the interior when compared to an impossible ideal of cars that cars will never achieve.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

So they sat in the car going, this is where we're at.

Yeah.

Maybe in 10 years' time, the interior will feel a bit higher quality, but this is all you're getting at the minute.

I wanted a magic flying carpet.

Well, best of luck, mate.

Best of luck, mate.

Because this is what cars are.

Keep on dreaming and chugging on that dube, because it ain't coming anytime soon to a cinema near you.

The range is up to 37 miles, which is the same as the BMW I mentioned earlier.

Yes, the same.

It's the same, depending on how far a mile is in your locality.

But that's obviously 37 miles on the electric, and then you've got the fuel engine to, for example, take you to Carmarthen.

Yes, okay.

Finally, Ellis, it's an old friend or bitter foe, depending on your enemy, but usually more likely someone you don't have an opinion of.

The Kiesportage.

No opinion.

1.6 TGDI 13.8 kilowatt hour 4 Auto AWD Euro 65 door.

I miss when cars' names were shorter.

Yeah, the Ford Orion.

Yes, 1.4.

Yeah.

According to drivingelectric.com, over the past three decades, the Kiosportage has cemented its reputation as one of the UK's SUVs.

And despite being a rival of the Hyundai Tucson and Volkswagen Tiguan, Tiguan, none of them come out top or bottom.

No, they're all exactly the same.

Well, they are identical.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

You can only tell if you can't spell

when reading the name at the back.

Doesn't matter.

Yeah, no problem.

Doesn't matter what you buy.

Everyone's a winner.

Everyone's a winner.

Thank you, Car Industry.

The Kios Portage takes two hours to charge with a home wall box.

Okay.

and gets between 43 to 48 miles on a single charge, which is ideal for the school run and a trip to the supermarket if you have kids, or completely irrelevant for the school run if you don't have kids and consume energy by photosynthesis.

Okay.

It's 4,515 millimeters long, which is the same as the other two cars.

Yes, thank you.

If you were looking at them from the back.

Yeah.

So if you're looking them back on, they're all the same length.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I can't speak to what happens when you look at them side on in terms of the length.

Exactly.

I don't think anyone knows.

So there you go.

Three suggestions there: the BMW X5, the Skoda Superb, and the Kia Sportage.

That was a very, very neutral bit of advice that I can't lose from because all cars are the same.

Yeah, and also, I should point out, superb, those are Skoda's words.

Yeah, yeah, yes, that's the name of the car.

It's not the BMW Brilliant.

And it's actually the Skoda Superb.

In South Korean, Superb translates as Sportage, and in German, Superb translates as X5.

Yes.

So they're all superb.

Yeah.

And there you have it.

Those are the options.

All secondhand, available for between sort of

25 grand.

Okay.

Like all cars.

Like all cars.

Because

my dad had a Toyota Corolla in the 90s.

Yep.

A few people have suggested that to me.

And I remember talking to dad and he said that that was the most

the it was a car he owned in the 90s and he was as pleased with that one as all of the other cars he owned in the 90s.

So, obviously, that's part of the conversation as well.

And people have suggested it to you so that you can feel a kinship with your father, not because it's any different to any other car, because, as we, Dave, the BBC know, all cars are the same.

Exactly.

And I really don't think that anyone's going to have a problem with the last 10 minutes because it's been so blimmy neutral.

And I can just text you links to all those on a car website.

Excuse me, I'd really, really appreciate that.

Thanks.

Not a problem.

So, Ellis, when are you going to get your new car that may or may not be from the list I've just given you?

Well, I mean, obviously, the list is a very kind thing for you to do, but all cars are the same.

So, I mean,

I'll probably just choose one at random and I'll be happy with that.

And that's the way it's going to work.

Has Izzy specified any kind of preference?

Absolutely not at all.

Really?

No, she would like a bigger car than the Battle of Eggs.

That's the only thing she said.

And an automatic?

That is a non-negotiable.

That's non-negotiable.

I actually miss driving a manual because I like driving

and I really like change gear.

On the rare occasions, I have to hire a car.

I will always hire a manual because I just miss it.

But that's fine.

Has it crossed your mind that this might be the car that your kids learn to drive in?

No, I'll tell you what has crossed my mind is the idea that we'll all be in driverless cars by the time they're learning to drive.

There are driverless Ubers in LA now.

Yes, I've seen a video of my friend in the back of one.

Yeah, it's weird.

Because it is a bit night rider.

It is.

It's going to be a further hammer

on the nail in the coffin of all

employment.

Yeah.

So there you go.

I hope they're putting as much money into researching what jobs everyone's going to have in 10 years' time.

Yeah.

I'm sure they are.

I mean, I listened to an AI podcast the other day that I actually thought was two normal people speaking.

So we're all in trouble.

We are all in trouble.

I'm not sure AI would would quite be able to predict my takes.

Because it will average your takes.

Yeah, you can't average my takes.

Meeting the Vajray Robbins take.

Yeah.

Because I heard myself described by someone as being emotionally repressed the other day.

And I was like, no, that's the opposite.

Yeah.

I need to be more emotionally repressed.

Yeah, God.

You'd be doing all of us a favor.

Maybe if someone set AI the task of coming up with an Ellis and John podcast, the whole system might collapse.

Because it can't be average.

See, I think I'm actually very predictable.

Yes.

I think AI could do an absolutely great job.

But AI will never know whether I'm in a good mood or a bad mood.

No, that is true.

Because you can't predict it.

I chopped wood yesterday and that's put me in a good mood.

Yeah, for 24 hours.

It's crazy.

And yet you can be told something very positive and that'll put you in a bad mood.

Yeah, very strange.

Though the AI eggshells,

that's what we need to introduce into the system.

Pay me a compliment.

I'll knock you out.

Who saw that coming?

Who saw that coming?

Anyway, we're going to be chatting to some heroes of yours,

we've got Mark and Lard on the show, and I cannot wait.

I have met Mark Riley, Lard, I've never met Mark Radcliffe, but the two of them are real radio heroes of mine.

So I'm greatly looking forward to this.

Well, let's get them on the line.

Okay, well, it gives me great pleasure to welcome our next two guests onto this show because they are radio heroes of mine.

We have Mark and Lard.

Cliff and Mark Riley.

Hello, fellas.

How are you doing?

Hello, guys.

Hello.

I'm

very excited to have you on.

But I will say, I've got a message for you from my parents in the mid-90s.

Your show on Radio One, because it was 10 to midnight, had a terribly adverse effect on my GCSEs.

Because I used to listen to the whole thing and then I'd be absolutely shattered at school then.

I wasn't really listening to that.

They say that, and you say that.

We don't know that you wouldn't have been a disaster in your GCSEs, whether we were on or not, do we?

I mean, you know, it seems like we're being unfairly scapegoated for something 20-odd years after the event.

So, I'm not having that.

Unfortunately, there wasn't a controller

who was also doing his GCSEs and not listening to Mark and Lard on Radio Way.

Exactly.

At the same time, so yeah, but it did feel like it was adversely affecting me then.

I can only surmise then that my GCSEs were improved by blue jam and the breeze block that was on lit yeah because i would stay up to listen to blue jam i'd set record on my c90 cassette yeah yeah i'd probably fall asleep about two-thirds of the way through in quite a disturbing state of mind yes god radio one i mean one thing i've got to ask you because you introduced me on that show to people like simon armitage and uh ian macmillan and it was on radio one did you ever think that you know there'd been some glitch in the matrix and that you were on the wrong station?

I think that what it's interesting when you talk about Blue Jam with Chris Morris, and we've talked about this, when you think of what Radio 1 was at that point and what it is now, it's not really, I mean, the only thing that they have in common is that they were both called Radio 1.

Yeah.

Well,

it's not the same at all.

It's a very, very...

different beast.

Some might prefer one, some might prefer the other.

But I think there was a lot of

there were a lot of quite ambitious ideas around in our era, and not all of them worked.

And not just on our show, but it was a very different set of aspirations, I feel.

We would come up with an idea, not entirely sure that it would work, but we would give it a go.

And if it didn't work, you would never hear from it again.

And if it did work, then you might.

So it does, yeah, it seems like the micromanagement now has kind of taken that element of danger and mischief out of everything.

Do you think that, and this is not just specifically Radio One, but a lot of broadcast media, that the fear of making mistakes and the attempt to remove error actually stops things

having their finer moments?

I think there's a lot of people.

I think there's a lot of people determined to be offended, waking up every day and thinking, what can I find that's offending me today?

Almost looking for things to be offended by.

And of course, if you wanted to complain about Mark and Lard,

you had to look for the address of the BBC on page 129 of the radio times then you had to go to the post office and buy some basiled and bond paper and then you had to write it in and post it and then eventually it would go through about 14 bbc departments before it came to us who would ignore it whereas now you just immediately react and uh you know everybody's got a voice now which which you'd think would be a positive thing but we know from the likes of most people that it definitely isn't well out of curiosity, I was going to ask you this because when we were live on Five Live,

we would often come in with half an idea.

And if it didn't work, people let us know very, very quickly on the text and tweets.

So when you were broadcasting, say when you were broadcasting on the breakfast show in the late 90s, how did you know how things were going down?

Or with the general public?

Well, we didn't, did we really?

I mean, we found out after nine months when you sacked us.

Can I correct you that, Mark?

We were sacked after six, but we stayed on for nine.

And Mark, Mark, I don't, I also, I don't want to, I don't want to correct Mark rightly, um, uh, particularly, but he is he is wrong.

You know, sometimes we had an idea that patently didn't work, but it carried on for nine months.

There's an interesting point made on and um, by Richard Osman on an episode of The Wrestlers Entertainment, where he's talking about Noel Edmonds, and it's a superb defense and prosecution of Edmonds.

Because he says, part of the thing about that landscape of TV in the 70s and 80s and 90s, especially, is that no one ever heard criticism.

So it could create people who were very confident in their own abilities.

Whereas now, Ellis and I,

having been on like essentially three different stations,

there's no chance that our self-belief would get out of control because we've had so much criticism come directly into your hands.

Yeah, often from the same bloke.

And

that's two straight white guys.

Yeah.

So it's comparatively not that much criticism.

So that ability for people to hear when

the audience are getting offended does mean you're perhaps slightly more down to earth about your own talents.

I'm not saying that's the case with you guys, but in the culture of the 70s, 80s, and 90s, there were people who just thought they were amazing at everything.

Yeah, thinking about it, it's a little bit like, you know, people say punk rock had to happen.

And to a certain extent, that kind of element of mischief in Radio 1 had to happen because, and that was Matthew Bannister came in.

And Matthew Bannister recognised the fact that, you know, it really was the smashy and nice.

It was being parodied and it wasn't going anywhere.

And so Matthew came in and turned it all on its head with the likes of, you know, he went to Mark first and Mark working with myself on Radio 5 wanted to continue that on Radio 1.

But as you say, Chris Morris, I mean, the man's an absolute genius and you can't imagine them letting him anywhere near anything these days, you know, on mainstream radio, just because it's so out there and so risky.

And smashy and smashy and nicey, you could say it may, it may be the only piece of satire in the history of comedy that's ever worked because it actually

put an end to what it was satirizing.

Yes.

It actually hit the target, like more or less nothing else.

Overnight, those people became kind of instead of being these sort of you know potentates, became figures of fun and derision.

And so, I think that you know, they can die happy with that.

Certainly, my goodness, they got rid of some monsters, didn't they?

One

thing I vividly remember about your evening show was that you gave a real space to my favorite band of all time, Gawky's I got it monkey, and my second favorite band of all time, the superior animals.

And I think, correct me if I'm wrong, this is how I remember it.

The Gawkies Patio song, I think might have been your first single of the week when you were on Breakfast Radio.

It was certainly very early on.

The first breakfast show record of the week was Suede and Trash.

I do remember that.

Can I just say that there seems to be quite a bias towards Welsh acts in

bands, doesn't there?

Actually, I'd be disappointed we didn't play more Deke Leonard's iceberg.

But because you were playing those kinds of records and you had poets on the show, and people like Mark Hermod as well, then when you were, it was a certain, you know, it attracted a certain kind of audience.

So then when you went when you replaced chris emons on the breakfast show

you were famous

it was a big news story the whoever was taking over edge one breakfast was a big news story at the time what was it like going from a tent till midnight sort of graveyard slot show to being to having the biggest show in this you know in in britain i think one thing to say about one thing to remember about the evening show you say about the poetry and readings and all the kinds of things that were on there there was no internet you know so if you were like, you were there doing your O-levels and you wanted to know maybe what new films were out or some classic cult books or some kind of, you know, interesting poetry, where would, where would you find that?

Where would you find that?

Like when me and Mark were growing up and we were both music nuts, we could read about music in Sounds, Melody Maker and NME every week.

We couldn't hear it anywhere.

You certainly couldn't see it on the telly.

So I think that we were a kind of pre-internet service for people with inquiring minds.

But yeah, the glare of publicity of the breakfast show, it came as a real shock, didn't it, Mark?

Because I think up until Chris Evans did it, they just swapped it sort of almost on the quiet between whoever was at Radio 1 that day and no one paid any attention.

But because the row between Chris Evans and Matthew Bannister about wanting Fridays off, which I know they do now, is that it was such a big thing.

It elevated it to a huge tabloid thing.

And I don't think we were in any way prepared for that.

So you presented your last show in March 2004

and you began touring your show Carry On an Audience with Mark and Lard last year.

What are you giving the audience that they don't get from the radio?

Well, I think we're really almost

discussing almost two historical characters, Mark and Lard.

We're looking at them with 20 years perspective.

We're not trying to be Mark and Lard.

We're talking about the thought processes such as they were that went on behind those.

And we've got a load of clips and things and so we were we went through a lot of stuff and um it took a while for us to find out with audiences which was the bits that people really still found funny um and there were some surprises in that so it's really it's really and and kind of setting it in some kind of perspective because people who love the show who still love the show who come to see these shows um sort of want to know the stories behind how things came about and the wranglings that were going on with management and things and the sort of some of the unfortunate um interlockings with major league celebrities and some not so unfortunate ones as well and so you know it it's easier for us i think to look back on those two characters with a certain kind of with an older man's perspective really we're not trying to be the same guys but mark's right in as much as the rhythm between us of of being able to talk and not kind of talk across each other and make each other laugh still and bounce off each other that seems to be unchanged after a 20-year break.

Well, thank you so much for joining us, Mark Riley, Mark Radcliffe.

And tickets are available from markandlard.com.

We've also got some dates next year.

Oh, great, okay.

2026.

Yeah, we've got the dog.

It's like Bob Dylan.

It's the never-ending talk.

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Sucks!

The new musical has made Tony award-winning history on Broadway.

We the man to be home!

Winner, best score!

We the man to be seen!

Winner, best book!

We the man to be quality!

It's a theatrical masterpiece that's thrilling, inspiring, dazzlingly entertaining, and unquestionably the most emotionally stirring musical this season.

Suffs, playing the Orpheum Theater, October 22nd through November 9th.

Tickets at BroadwaySF.com.

Well, from two great lads to a collection of mad dads, it's now time for mad dads.

My dad, when he brought his first non-stick frying pan, kept the instructions and stuck them on the wall next to it.

Actual real wooden clods

and set about eating what must have been north of 24 egg canopies.

He then proceeded to empty 40 litres or so of punch onto the timber and strike a match.

Dance a mad!

Dance a mad.

Dads are mad.

Let us know about your mad dads, ellisandjohn at bbc.co.uk.

This first email is great but quite gross.

I have a mad dad, but I must warn you, it's a bit disgusting.

My dad is very strange and often does a lot of stuff under his self-proclaimed title, the family's head of morale.

One of his quirks recently came to a head.

In his room, my dad keeps a small cactus that he's been trying to grow for a few years.

I went into his room to find the cactus totally dead and suffocating under a pile of something.

On closer inspection, it was a pile of toenails.

On questioning, my dad reported that he'd been adding his toenails to the cactus's pot each time he cut them.

His hope was that as the cactus grew, it would grow over the toenails, absorb them, and, quote, take on his DNA.

He'd been piling his toenails into this pot for five years.

My mum always says, he wasn't this mad when she met him and blames me and my sister for turning him odd.

I think he was born this way, but is now letting his weird flag fly.

Best of luck with Project 32, John, but do take this cautionary tale about what lack of direction can do to a man in retirement.

Goodness me.

I think

taking on your DNA

is one of those four scientific things that people think makes sense, but actually doesn't make sense.

If you know what I mean.

I think it comes from sci-fi films like The Fly, where it's where Jeff Goldblum ends up being part fly and part man.

I get a lot of solace from the fact that my natural body will return to the earth and become part of an ecosystem.

Because you're a good laugh.

Because I'm a good laugh.

But it struck me that actually it's already been happening because you've shared lots of skin cells every day.

So I'm constantly sort of becoming part of the living world.

And your waist.

And my waist.

But yeah, and also the laughter I create.

Yes.

Because what is not the wind?

The wind is

not the wind, it's the gales.

That's what you say.

What is not the wind?

What is not the wind?

Yeah, but what is not the wind if not the laughter of people listening to podcasts in many ways?

Yes, and I think that's your gift.

That's your gift, isn't it?

This is a Glastonbury-based mad dad.

Hello, my precious little bunnies.

Emma Balda from Camberwell here.

Has Glastonbury just been and gone?

Thought it was the perfect time for a mad dad anecdote based at the festival itself.

I'm a big music fan and first started going to Reading in 2002 when I was 15.

My dad, Steve, is also a big music fan, and once he got wind of this magical culture of camping, music, and drinking, well, he wanted in.

So he and a few mates also started going to Reading, enjoying bands like Red Orch Chili Peppers, Foo Fighters, and Full English Breakfasts.

I can't imagine anything less likely than my mum deciding to come to Reading Festival in 2001.

Yeah, it's like I think my dad would have fancied it, but I would have shrivelled and died.

I didn't want my parents at a music festival.

Anyway, fast forward a few years, and we'd both graduated to attending the best festival in the world TM, Glastonbury.

While we'd been at festivals at the same time before, not many of my new Cardiff University pals had gotten a chance to meet my dad.

They were absolutely gagging to meet this legendary festival-going father.

They'd heard me refer to as Stevie B,

a man who had apparently achieved mythical status simply by knowing how to cook bacon in a tent.

Wow.

So one morning, nursing some horrendous hangovers, I arranged for me and about eight pals to meet him at the park stage for breakfast.

It's quite a big festival, as you know, so it took me a minute to spot him as our shambling crowd of walking disasters trudged up the hill.

Suddenly, I crocked a figure waving madly at me and pointed triumphantly.

Oh, there he is.

Cheers went up among my posse of slightly still pissed chums.

If only he'd taken a beat to properly assess his situation.

What's that?

asked a concerned friend.

On my dad's head was a straw hat, nothing too strange there, perfectly sensible protection from the Somerset rays.

But on the hat, glinting ominously in the sunlight, was something I'd never seen before.

Solar panels.

And cables.

Lots of cables.

All stuck to the hat with what appeared to be a half roll of black and yellow electrical tape, like some sort of DIY cyberpunk fever dream.

I stopped dead in my tracks as this strange apparition approached looking like he'd mugged a scarecrow and raided Curry's PC world.

Way to the festival.

Clocking our collective expression of bewildered terror, he tapped the brim of his creation with obvious pride.

Phone charger, he announced, as nonchalantly as if he just commented on the weather.

He launched into an enthusiastic explanation of how he'd cobbled the contraption together, gesturing wildly at various bits of tape and wire, while my university friend slowly backed away like he might be contagious.

Does it work then?

one of my braver mates finally asked, clearly fascinated despite himself.

Dad's face fell slightly.

Well, not exactly.

Turns out you need a bit more than Somerset Sunshine and electrical tape to generate actual power.

But, he brightened immediately, tapping the contraption again, it's the principle of the thing, isn't it?

And that's what Stevie B became the first man in Castlebury history to look like he was receiving transmissions from space while sporting a completely useless phone charger that would probably cost more in tape than a portable battery pack.

There you go.

That's great.

And the true element of the mad daddy there is keeping it on your head regardless of the fact it hasn't worked.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Because it's the principle.

It's the principle of the thing.

It's the principle of the thing.

Because I can imagine myself attempting to fashion a solar-powered phone charger.

Not fashion one, but to put one on my body.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Like wearing a rucksack.

If I could buy you one, I'd wear it.

yeah i just wouldn't make one yeah and i wouldn't wear it if it didn't work no oh no no once you ditch it once it becomes redundant absolutely so thank you very much uh for sending that in yeah if you've got a mad dad for us send it to ellisandjohn bbc.co.uk and we're about to come reconnect so ellis has got to do his squats his press-ups his lunges his active spider-men his rope climbs and a little bit if possible ellis of mental preparation Yes, keep talking, keep asking questions.

Stay in the zone.

Fail to prepare is preparing to fail.

Visualize positive visualization.

Imagine yourself crossing the Cymru connection line.

I'm a good person.

Okay, he's got his head in his hands.

Get your head out of your hands.

I'm focusing.

I'm focusing.

I'm focusing.

I always do this to focus.

But that's not a positive way to focus.

Right?

Back up straight.

Chest puffed out.

Here we go.

Very good.

A hat-trick of connections.

A joie de vivre in his connecting style.

Has the OG connector Ellis James found his form?

Are we finally in the golden age of connecting?

It's time to find out in the Cymru connection.

Ellis thinks his tactics are sheer perfection.

But his questions have one direction.

Where did you go to school?

Do you know Daffhaven's?

No.

Come on, mate, you must do no, we've never

met

at all.

That's right, in the last few weeks, Ellis has had the schooling of a sports psychologist.

He's also had the input of a listener who provided him with a cheat sheet.

He's doing nothing that either of them suggested, not using the free material.

So I wonder if arrogance has begun to set in.

Well, I'll tell you what made me arrogant.

The fan zone in Lucerne Lucerne was a cavalcade of Cumberry Connector.

Yeah, but it's not in matched circumstances, is it?

No, the Adwaith gig.

Oh, my God.

Doesn't matter.

A Cumbry thing.

Irrelevant.

Cumbri Connecting.

Irrelevant.

I must admit, Lucerne made me arrogant.

Yeah.

Because I was walking around.

You've got Swiss arrogance.

Someone came up to me and said, I went to school in Bangor.

I was born in 1993.

Go.

Wallop.

Done.

Got done 30 seconds.

I did it in front of my daughter.

She was very impressed.

We can all make 147s in the snooker hall.

Last week, Ellis sealed an exemplary hat-trick.

With seconds to go, Caller Tom was connected via Auriel from the Aberyswith Art Center.

Yes, it was the hat-trick he needed, the hat-trick we all knew he was capable of achieving.

But we, the nation, want Ellis to go one step further.

We want him to join the likes of Aguero, Messi, Ronaldo, Cole Palmer.

Listen to the crowd, Ellis, and you'll hear them baying for more.

We want four.

We want four.

The quad connect.

But can Ellis do what's never been done before in Cymru Connecting history?

Have I never done Fall on the Trot?

His rate, you're rubbish at this.

I was, but not.

He started well.

His rate is back to 48%.

If he connects today, that would move closer to the coveted 50%.

And with the first four in a row, his name would surely be written in Cymric Connecting History.

But can he do it?

Does he have the metal?

Let's find out.

We have a caller on the line from Wales hello

hello the next voice you hear will be that of Ellis James 60 seconds are on the clock go Agent where did you go to school

not in Wales where

Watford

what how old are you

39

I I think I know this person I think I actually have a direct connection with this person.

Watford?

Is that Helen Watt?

It It is indeed.

Oh,

whoa, it's a one-to-one.

It's this is one-touch football.

Direct connect.

We have a direct connect, and that's for...

Now, this puts us in interesting

territory, novelli protocol-wise, because I know Helen, but I know her because she was on my podcast lots.

Well, you grew up in Watford.

Yes.

So was it your grandmother who was Welsh?

My grandmother and my grandfather on my maternal side.

Where were they from, out of curiosity?

Penarth.

Penarth.

Grandparents' age.

I mean, I could go through the football club, because obviously you know people like Iman Roberts and Danny Gambadon, etc.

Very true.

Out of curiosity, going down the Watford route.

Do you know Kenny Jackett?

I've met him, if that counts.

I've met him.

I once asked him so many questions at a football fans forum I got asked to stop.

Did you ask him where he went to school?

No, I didn't.

No, but people said, come on, mate, you've got to let other people speak.

Well, it's a delight to see a one-to-one connection because, Helen, thank you for joining us.

Helen is Wales' second all-time top scorer, scoring a total of 44 goals in 105 matches.

Yes, until Jess Fishlock obviously broke your record.

Helen, I've got to ask, because people probably won't ask you this on the media you're doing.

We could really do with with a striker like you at this tournament.

Have there been any chances where you thought I'd have scored that?

Not in my current physical state, no.

I mean, my legs have gone a long time ago, but

I think the art of the number nine is something that's dying in football in general for me.

I think it's a very different game.

Yes, yes, I would agree with that.

But obviously, you're out there covering with you only retired a few years ago, so is it quite bittersweet watching

ex-teammates of yours performing on the big stage?

To be honest, no.

I can see why people ask me that, but I think I retired at the right time for me.

I knew that

I wasn't going to continue to get picked, so basically, I jumped before I was pushed.

And I think that allows me to be very grateful for the opportunity to be here in a different way.

There's no bitterness.

Obviously, there's moments where you think, oh, it would have been nice to have been involved in that.

You know, you focus on the plane and all the freebies you get mostly is what i'm jealous of but the actual football side of it i watch it and it's so quick now like even in two years i mean there were kids coming through that were young enough to be my kids when i retired so i knew that was the time to get out so no it's there's no no bitterness i'm just i'm enjoying being here as a a fan and a pundit yeah because i'm roughly the same age as um stephen gerrard

And that's just one of many similarities.

No, but what would happen the last few seasons, whenever anyone would refer to Stephen Gerrard, even though he was about six months older than me, they would always say, can Gerrard's creaking limbs cope with one more campaign?

And it made me feel very old, even though I actually still felt quite young.

Well, I had the same with Jimi Anderson.

When he retired from English cricket, I knew my chances were

at opening the bowling for England.

Bringing my own football into this, I was playing on Tuesday and it was 22, 21 with a minute to go and I was put through.

And I think I snatched at it, Helen.

And I blasted it straight at the keeper as someone who scored 44 goals for a country.

How do you remain calm in these situations?

Because I had people shouting at me.

There was a guy watching through their fence who had called me a rude word minutes before, and I think I crumbled under the pressure.

So, Helen, how can you stop me snatching at these chances?

Another pass.

Don't have to be blasting it.

It's just one more pass into the goal.

Pick your spot.

Oh, the ball.

Arrange the noise.

Yeah.

Seeing the shot as a pass.

Yeah.

I like that.

Also, I think just exposing yourself to that environment multiple times.

Did you find that, Helen, like, I don't know, like handling spiders of an increasing size

made you less afraid of the spider of the ultimate tarantula of a goal?

Am I answering with regard to spiders or is that?

A bit of both.

Of course.

I don't deal with spiders.

My husband does that.

But in terms of football, yes, I mean, obviously, my career, we didn't have any fans really to begin with.

There's no footage or proof that I even made my debut for Wales.

So as the game grew, obviously I grew in maturity anyway, just about.

So you kind of had to go along with it.

But now, obviously, these crowds and

the sort of critique of the game now is very different to what it used to be, particularly for the older players in the team.

It is quite new, and I think

that's something that the younger players will have in their back pocket now if they go on to hopefully make many more tournaments, as we expect them to do now.

They'll have that experience that I think

they openly admitted they were quite overwhelmed by that Dutch game and the fans and the crowd and the occasion.

And I think it takes a lot to admit that.

But it's all experience now.

Like you said, you've done one tarantula, You can move on to the next one with that in your

past, and you can take it with you and use it to learn.

And I think we saw in the performances from game one to game two: okay, the scoreline wasn't what we wanted, but the improvement in performance was unbelievable.

Helen Ward, thank you so much for joining us and allowing and giving Ellis, you know, you're teeing him up for his quad connect.

I am going to pass the ball into the ghoul the next time I'm given that opportunity at 21-22, and I could be equalising.

Thank you, Helen.

Yeah, you're welcome.

Well, I think we might have to talk to Pierre Novelli about it, but it feels to me like I've got a quad connect, which

going into, you know, next week's connection has put a real spring at my step.

I just feel like the manager's put his arm around my shoulder and said, Elle, I believe in you.

You're going to be my starting striker.

And I think that we go from a great feeling of positivity to another very positive thing.

We are going to absolve the nation of shame in John's Shamewell.

What was I thinking?

Why did I say he had nice ankles?

She was stood behind me the whole time.

I didn't know he's only got one hand.

I was signed in on her Gmail.

John Shamewell.

Yes, hello everyone.

You're still ashamed, and I'm still here.

And that's why I keep going.

Yeah.

And my goal is to have all shame eradicated from the UK by 2032, and then I retire.

Yeah.

I simply leave the building, I leave my key on the hook, I kiss the concierge on the lips if it's a man, or I shake their hand if it's a lady.

Don't know why I said that.

And I just go and then I go home.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So somehow it's less threatening if I say I kiss the man on the lips.

That's still threatening.

So I ask both for consent before doing either of those things.

Apart from the handshakes, you can offer a hand.

Yeah.

Or you can offer a kiss.

I can just stand where I am, puck her up, not move forward in any way.

And if they say no, that's fine.

You could gesture forward with your hands like Liam Gallagher does.

Yeah, but making, but miming a question mark with the other hand.

Yes.

Well, that's quite hard.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

I look like a gif.

Or

or you could maybe wear a t-shirt last day at school, uh, last day of job, of your job, saying, you know, I've eradicated, then then it should be shamefun to your kiss.

Kiss question mark.

Yeah, then you just walk around with puckered lips.

Yeah, okay.

I've got that sorted.

Good.

Yeah, good.

This week's email.

I toss my shame deep into the well.

A few years back, I met up with an old university friend, we'll call him Bill, for a long overdue catch-up over several pints.

As these things go, the chat turned to mutual friends, including an old housemate who'd recently got married.

Now, this particular wedding was a sore point for me because I'd been deliberately snubbed, the only one out of our friendship group.

No invite, not even a whisper of an explanation.

Naturally, I told Bill that I didn't care in the slightest.

Of course, as the evening wore on and the pints flowed, it became abundantly clear that I did care rather a lot.

Upon my interrogation, Bill proceeded to give me a play-by-play of the wedding, every little detail.

Fuelled by pints and

wounded pride, I began to tear it apart.

No DJ, puh.

Buffet Buffet dinner, rubbish.

But the real kicker, the thing I really went to town on, was the accommodation.

Camping.

They'd had all the guests camping.

I laid into it for the better part of an hour, saying it was tight-fisted and, quote, the most ridiculous wedding idea I'd ever heard, and compared their wedding to a DOV expedition.

I felt like I hadn't missed much opportunity to lay into it.

We had a lovely evening otherwise, more drinks, more laughs, before I bid him farewell and headed home.

The next morning, chatting to my partner about the night, she pointed to an envelope I'd left on the kitchen table and asked, What's this?

Oh, I said, that's

an invite to Bill's wedding he gave me last night.

I opened it.

Still slightly foggy from the night before.

Date?

Fine, we can make that.

Location?

Fine, we can get there.

Accommodation?

Camping.

Oh, God.

Dear reader, my soul left my body.

I'd spent an hour last night ripping apart the exact wedding accommodation Bill had planned and invited me to with an invite that had been sat snugly in my pocket the entire time.

We've never spoken of it since.

I went to his wedding, enthusiastically camped with a constant smile and loudly declared camping to be the only way to celebrate love.

Into the well it goes.

Yours in shame, anonymous.

It's a ruddy nightmare.

That would

yeah, I've got a couple of examples of those from my own life, so do I, which I can't say without all of the liquid leaving my body, then I would turn to dust.

That can't happen until 2032.

That is extremely relatable.

Very relatable shame.

And I think

I would take Bill to one side and say, you know what I said for an hour the other day?

I lied for an hour.

I actually like camping.

I wanted to hurt him.

Yeah.

And camping was my strongest weapon.

I was angry at myself.

Yes.

For not being as invitable as you.

And then, as a mark of respect, camp in your own garden for six months.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Throughout either a heavy winter or a heat wave.

But that is a chillingly relatable

shame well.

I've got two right now, and I can see myself in

like each eye of my mind is in a different living room.

Something I said at the 2009 Edinburgh Festival.

Here it comes, here it comes, and

it's overwhelming again.

Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

To an ex-girlfriend's mum.

Something I said to an ex-putner sister.

Oh, here they are.

They're knocking around in mind.

When will I be freed?

When will this end?

But we just have.

Oh, let me sleep at night and forget what I said.

Let me sleep at night and enjoy going to bed.

Oh, it's so true, but we can enjoy going to bed, Ellis, because we chop wood, carry water.

Yeah.

I'm going to go home.

I'm going to chop some wood, metaphorical wood, because I've already chopped all my wood.

I'm going to carry some water.

Don't need to, because it comes out of my taps.

But I'll find something similar.

I might move some toilet rolls.

Yeah.

Take care everyone.

We will see you very soon.

Lots of love to you.

And Dave will be back.

But then he goes away again.

Because he hates us.

Because he hates us.

And he hates you, the listener.

And he hates Britain.

And he wants wants to see GDP sink for a third consecutive month.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

He wants a recession.

Yeah.

He's making money at this recession.

Oh, somehow.

Yeah.

Bye-bye.

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