#468 - Noble John, Sugar Me Twice and Good Old Gent

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Hello, and welcome to the Ellis James and John Robbins Show.

Politicians often have a strange relationship with apologies, but this isn't the cut and thrust of Westminster.

This is the more considered world of audio.

Listeners, I was wrong last week.

Mayor Culper, I apologise.

During the high tension of comely connection and during the upset and anger that can only come when a man called Kevin from Clinician in Cardiff doesn't know Mike Bubbins, I snapped at John.

I asked him to walk into the sea, drown, and not only did I promise never to look for his body, I said that I'd refused to write his obituary, claiming to think the Guardian were asking me to write an orbit for John the Baptist and I wasn't a Christian.

I snapped at John, and he is my number one.

Even though he's in rude health, I've decided to make amends for my unprofessional outburst by writing John's obituary.

The stunned-up comedian, broadcaster, and e-cigarette campaigner John Robbins

was born in Thornbury in 1982, and the small Gloucestershire town found it impossible to contain British comedy's most fertile creative mind.

After making his theatrical directorial debut as a precocious ex-pupil at Castle School, University beckoned.

An able and enthusiastic student who was keenly aware of his own abilities during his Oxford entrance exam, exam he was initially rejected for being too clever and confident a first in the institution's near thousand year existence after a chastening period working at Virgin Megastore now defunct he was accepted at the second time of asking to St Anne's College where he majored in darts

It was during his time at Oxford that the embryonic standard began to emerge, as every time he burst into tears at the college bar he was sure to do so with great humour.

British comedy wasn't to know that a star was being born.

After graduating, John tried his hand as a stand-up on Bristol's burgeoning open mic scene, and less than a month after his comedic debut, he made the most significant friendship of his career, meeting fellow open micer Ellis James at a gig in Cardiff.

According to his memoirs, first published in 2026, John initially didn't see Ellis as a threat, but grew to like him.

The perfect combination.

After a period of stasis, during which Robbins introduced James to pork pies and explained that James needed to declare himself self-employed, the pair were eventually given a chance on the commercial digital indie radio station XFM where the unique combination of John having never heard of any of the bands he was playing added to him being unable to hide his moods quickly found a legion of fans.

Able to translate his newfound success into ticker sales at the Edinburgh Festival, Robbins hit a sparkling run of form, culminating in him winning the 2017 Edinburgh Comedy Award, something that old schoolmate Joel Domet never did, but which ultimately doesn't seem to have held Domet back.

A unique and restless talent, John continued to create fantastic Edinburgh shows and podcasts until his eventual retirement in 2032.

Although in his darker moments, he'd often lament about his beloved vape, blaming the thing he was most in love with for ruining his voice and preventing him from getting a really big paying voice-over gig like Ed Gamble had managed with Kazoo.

He is survived by his millions of devoted listeners and his award shelf.

Oh, that's very good.

I'd settle for that.

Would you?

How long did I have in retirement before I walked into the sea?

Well,

that was a difficult one.

I didn't really want to put a date in it because I thought that was too bleak.

I'd take 20 years.

After 32.

Yeah.

2062.

So 1982 to 2062.

Yeah, walk into the sea.

What, 80?

No, 70 years.

Oh, 2012.

Walking into the sea at 70.

Maybe 70 is a bit young, actually.

That's quite young.

86.

Okay.

Walk into the sea at 86.

You can still walk.

You could push me in.

I'm not going to push you in, because then I'll go to prison for murder.

Well, no, what about if you push me out on a Lilo and then like...

Shoot the Lilo.

You can shoot the Lilo like a sniper and do adjust for wind

and the curvature of the Earth.

Yes.

You have to do that, Dave, if you're sniping from really far away.

Yeah,

unless you believe the Earth is flat and you're a sniper.

You'd miss

But also, I suppose, if you're retiring in 2032, the orbit won't really need updating, or just maybe a couple of sentences at the end.

Oh, in later life, he became a comfortable recluse.

Yes.

And he's actually on the Wikipedia page for Herbit.

Yes, that would be lovely.

So there you go.

Yeah, I felt bad about last week, John.

Dance V is very, very funny.

It was very funny.

It was awards folder funny, Alice.

Was it?

I dare I say.

You felt a bit bit bleak for the awards folder.

Yeah.

Well, how many other podcasts do you know where one of the hosts says the other one, I want you to drown, and I'm not going to look for your body or mention you ever again.

Exactly.

It's what sets us apart.

It genuinely is.

Yes.

You don't get that on Help.

I sexted my boss.

Agged married annoying.

Yeah, no, you don't.

Oh, good.

How are you, John?

I'm in a state of shock.

Still,

because I got shocked on Thursday.

I'm still shocked.

I was driving through, well, from Buckinghamshire to Berkshire towards Reading.

And I was following a car in the country lanes.

I thought, I don't know that design of car.

Get a little closer.

What is it?

It was not an Abbath, which was the difference between that and a Fiat.

I think it's a Fiat in a different country.

I think it's basically the same car, but I've often wondered that.

J-Cu.

Not a J.C.U., Dave.

Have I met?

I don't know.

Jacomo.

It wasn't a Gacomo.

Those shirts for bigger men.

I got up close, probably maybe a little bit too close to the rear of this car and saw five letters that put the fear of God into me.

Charlie, Alpha, Papa, Romeo, India.

Capri?

I know.

They've brought back the Capri.

Have they?

That's a bit

of Capri.

I did know this.

How did I not know this?

The aforementioned Mike Bubbins has a 70s Capri,

and I think he's actually against the modern design.

Oh, so it's a Ford?

Yes.

I saw it.

It's a Ford Capri day.

Yeah, yeah.

It's back.

I saw one the other day, a 70s one.

They're so small, hilariously small.

Well, they're a sports coupe.

Yeah.

Yeah.

God, they're massive.

Yeah, it doesn't look anything like a Capri, even though they say in the press release, which I've since researched, that they're sort of, it's harking back to the original, like, is it Heckers?

Like, you just couldn't think of any other names.

don't, I think I've got an odd relationship with that because it's not the same car.

Well, so

like, at least with the Mini, when that came back,

although

it is in spirit, it is sort of

it inhabits the same territory as the Mini with some like nice flourishes and little nods to it.

And it is still a small car, even though they're getting bigger, like all cars do.

But it was just mad.

I thought it'd gone mad.

Yeah.

But there it is, the Ford Capri back on our roads.

Well, good.

Is no one else freaked out by this?

I already knew about it.

I haven't got much.

I would be more freaked out if they brought it back and it was exactly the same.

That would be cool.

Yeah, it'd be a bit weird.

I mean, I'm just like the Ford range.

The Ford family.

The Ford family when I was a kid.

Escort Orion.

But it was such a part of my personality.

Yes, I agree.

I was big into Ford.

Yeah, like a Deo of Ford.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Sort of came after the Sierra.

I would actually say I was more interested in Fords than I was in like Lamborghinis.

Oh, yeah, big time.

When I was about 10.

Because I knew people with them, so I could sit in one.

But I'd never met anyone.

I've still never met anyone who owns a Lamborghini.

You know, Matthew Stevens does, but have you met him?

Yes, yeah, because I went to the same school as Matthew Stevens.

And doesn't a northern comic, but didn't a northern comic buy one?

A Lamborghini.

Didn't paul smith buy a lamborghini did he yeah

that's fantastic i didn't know that but they're expensive i know i think you made a lot of money

very well oh fair play what would your dream card be div if if i was able to wave a magic wand and give you a million quids probably an mgzr

back in the day okay really no i used to have an mgzr did you yeah you had a little little um

can you say scally these days i think you can yeah

you know it's a a bit of a scalli card, like a spoiler.

As long as you're self-identifying as a scally.

Exactly.

I can't imagine him in a scally car.

Yeah, well.

Do you have floating lights?

No,

it did have the JBR six by nines on the back shelf for me to blast out my music.

But the difference being.

Oh, the Cortinas and Blossoms.

Well, this is it.

You see, I was quite happy with the fact that, you know, everyone was blasting out Blooming Jar Rule and Scooter.

Imagine if they brought back the Sierra.

I'd be so excited, and I would definitely, definitely buy one.

Would you?

Yes.

Just to feel like I was part of Team Sierra.

Yeah, like an updated one or exactly the same.

Well, updated one, they're never going to be exactly the same.

But if they really, if they really.

Parking sensors and all that stuff.

Yeah, if they really harked back to what made the Sierra Cosworth such an incredible bit of kit.

Would you want a speedboat, Div?

Again, would you want a speedboat if I could offer you one?

Where where do I live?

Cheetah Hume.

No, you don't live in.

No, no, you live by the sea.

Villamora.

Yeah, yeah.

No.

Okay.

I don't think.

Big ferry.

No, no.

I'm trying to work out what you would do if

I could offer you unlimited riches.

I'm quite modest in that respect.

I wouldn't want a fancy car.

We wouldn't move house.

I'd have a dead good coat.

Yeah, I'd get a coat.

Oh, yeah.

Of course, I would.

Have you seen the different coats Liam's been wearing?

Have you googled each of them?

I have.

Yes.

Yeah, yeah.

I'd buy all of them.

All going into the spreadsheet.

Yeah, different Liam coat for every day of the week.

And people would finally respect me.

Right, this started out as a fascinating conversation about the Ford Capri, and it's turned into a bloody Liam's card.

All right, then.

All right, then.

Yeah, yeah.

Big time.

Ding, magic wand.

I've given you a million quid.

What's your dream card?

Nothing.

All right.

I've got my dream card.

He's got a card.

Okay.

I've got it.

All right.

And

I've given you 10 million quid.

Ding.

What are you doing?

Nothing.

I don't need 10 million quid.

We're all very happy, happy, Alice.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah,

I'd buy a coat.

I'd get another crash symbol for my electric drum kit because I'm missing one just above the ride symbol at the minute.

And they do do them.

Yeah.

But they're quite expensive.

And I'm there playing a certain romance by Arctic Monkeys.

Yeah.

And he's there with the crash symbol, and I can't play one because it's not there.

So that's what I do with my millions.

I'd buy a £150 crash symbol.

I'd get a doctor and I'd be administered a sort of a course of steroids and I'd become really ripped.

I don't think any of that.

Like a sort of tech bro.

None of us have thought this through.

Really?

No, no, no, no, no.

I went to visit my parents this week, and there was an incident in Didcock, me and my daughter.

Lovely little three-hour delay on the train.

But I didn't mind because I back public transport.

Yeah.

I like the communality of everyone being delayed by three hours.

Yeah.

It doesn't bother me.

Really?

Sat on the train?

No, no.

It had happened just before we arrived at Parlington.

So

we didn't leave until about an hour and a half after we were meant to.

But then it was a very, very extra

complicated route.

We just had to go to Bristol Temple Meads.

The announcement was actually, if you're going to South Wales,

go to Temple Meads and improvise.

So then we all went to Temple Meads, then we had to go to Cardiff, and then it was all delayed at Cardiff.

But we made friends.

I made friends with a guy called Richard.

I talked to him about how the shape of props has changed over the last 20 years.

Rugby props.

So, I've been a PAF.

A lovely listener to this show, gave my daughter some Korean biscuits.

It was actually quite a nice

me and my friend Robin used to have a phrase that encapsulated a certain form of melancholy,

which was trapped at Didcot.

Yes, yes, yes.

Because you had to change at Didcot on the way back from Oxford sometimes to Bristol.

Yes, yes.

And if you'd just been on a pub crawl or a reunion in your university town to then be trapped in Didcot.

And also a book of cricket

match reports by a famous cricket journalist from the 60s and 70s called Alan something was called Between Didcot and the Demon.

Because he would send them back on the phone at Didcot

station.

He would send them back to his editor.

Oh,

but yeah, so that was my week.

Just trapped on the train for ages and see my mum and dad, but then it was fine.

Now that everyone, when people in the commercial podcast realm want to push people towards their Patreon content, what they'll sometimes do is put a Patreon episode on the main feed

and say, look, you can get this for five quid a month.

We, of course, believe in Britain.

Yeah.

We back broadcasting.

Yeah.

We have a sense of public duty and public decency.

Yes.

And that's why Ellis and I eschew the world of sponsored reads, Dave, isn't that right?

It is.

No, thanks.

It's not for you.

You subscribe to us legally by paying your license for it.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

And that's better.

Yes.

That's a better system.

Yeah, yeah.

I'm not interested in Gap.

I don't want to talk about them on a podcast or

on example.

This is why we don't get any commercial stuff, Dave, because he's so out of touch with modern Britain.

Well, maybe.

All right, then it's easy.

So we have BBC Sounds exclusive content.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Sounds only.

Sounds only.

It's called the Bureau de Change of the Mind.

Yes.

It's where Ellis and I kick back, take off our trousers, stretch our legs, and talk about...

What do we talk about?

Well, we talk about whatever takes our fancy and then we massage ourselves.

Yes.

but not each other.

And last week on the Bureau de Change of the Mind, we set our young videographer Izzy the task of watching Mike Lee's Nuts in May because we were interested by what Gen Z makes of one of the greatest TV dramas of all time.

Yes.

Sandals and socks was

the byword for it was Keith from Nuts in May.

It was absolutely Keith from Nuts in May.

No Candice movie.

I want to just stay in the car and stay with the things.

Yes.

Oh, all the kings and queens, Keith in the middle of the day.

In their finally,

what on earth did you do?

Have you not seen Nuts in May?

I don't even know what that means.

Do you want me to watch it?

Yeah.

Yeah, I'd love you to watch Nuts in May and bring back your review.

So if you want to head over to BBC Sounds,

where all audio is available, all the audio on earth, because basically what the BBC do is they just put microphones in everyone's houses

and in the streets, in the woods and in the sea.

Yeah.

And they record all those sounds.

So there's a constant global soundscape being created.

As long as it's commissioned or acquired.

Commissioned or acquired.

Yeah.

They did a massive deal with the Mediterranean recently for the beachscape sounds and the underwater sounds.

But not the sky.

No.

That went to TNT.

The title of it was called Gag City.

Yeah, so the episode was...

Gag City, although apparently we don't say Gag City right, according to Izzy.

And I think it was on the 16th of August on BBC Sounds, so you can go and check that out, of course.

So Izzy, take up your seat to tell us and the listeners listeners what you made of one of the great um british plays it was actually uh

ranked 49th in the british film institute's 100 greatest british television programmes by old people probably because it was so boring okay right guys i'm not even just saying this to be annoying nothing happened not the case What happens?

They go camping.

They go camping.

Full stop.

Tempers flare.

Yeah, it's about atmospheres.

But when does the temper flare?

So I will say I watched it on two times speed.

What?

What?

I was so bored.

So bored.

You can't watch it on two times speed because that's the atmosphere exists in time.

And also comic timing is dependent on it being watched in the speed it was intended for.

But it was funny when the banjo was being played at two times speed, if I'm being a hundred dollars.

And there was like there was a bit where they like one of the backpacker guys was running and it was funny.

Yeah, when he chases him with a stick.

Yeah, so imagine that on two times speed.

I was Okay, I did lull at that bit.

I'd like to apologise to Mike Lee directly.

I don't know who that is.

The director.

Okay.

But they go to Korf Castle.

I didn't know what it was, so I had to Google.

Okay.

It doesn't really matter.

Firstly, on that, could not understand a word they were freaking saying.

Why?

What do you mean?

Because the man's accent I couldn't get.

That's what you put 0.01.

Can't understand what they're saying.

That's not true.

They're speaking English.

Well, again, two times speed probably won't have helped.

Oh my goodness.

What was the whole thing?

I was singing a two times speed.

Yeah.

British accent.

Yeah.

I didn't like the guy either.

Roger Slowman.

Well, he's a complex character.

He was so complex.

Like Zaddy Chill.

You meant what?

Zaddy Chill.

What does that mean?

Like, Zaddy needs to chill.

Who's Zaddy?

The guy.

Okay.

Yeah, he does need to chill.

I say that's a good text.

But like, he really reminded me of you.

So I get it.

Like,

so reminiscent of you.

I get it.

Well, I feel like.

Did I remind you of Alison Steadman?

Do you know what?

Glasses, yeah.

And she's a little bit, she's a bit sheepish.

I'm not sheepish.

I am a bit sheepish.

Oh, yeah, comparative thing.

That he's always telling you things and telling you to do things, and then you've just got to sort of do it.

Well, Keith wants everything to go to plan in a very specific way.

It's so annoying.

Well, you shouldn't be eating sausages.

That's what I mean.

It's misogyny.

Why are we laughing at that?

Chauvinism, not funny.

Yeah, it it is.

I mean,

she is definitely the sort of,

what's the word?

He is dominant in that relationship.

And were it made today, it would probably be more a comment on neurodivergence in relationships because he's definitely sort of on the spectrum.

Oh, Hyundi P.

Hyundai P.

Hundy P.

And also, my biggest issue with it, because anytime I watch a film, I need eye candy.

No one is hot.

No one is.

Are you the P teacher from Cardiff?

No, no, they're all gross.

But they're quite high-minded as a couple.

Yeah.

So, and I think

it was capturing something that was happening in the 70s around what we would now see as sort of healthy living or organic lifestyle and

eco-conscious.

They were ahead of their time, I can't lie.

They were that annoying about it.

Well, yes, they are.

Yes, but they are.

It was also judgmental.

And it was a very common trope in 70s.

British sitcoms was to make fun of people like that.

I suppose the good lights.

That's a really good example.

What did you think of the Brummies honky and finger?

Is that the one who was beaten by a stick?

I loved her boots.

Yes.

The fits were slaying.

I think they did sort of like my attention was wearing when they got involved.

Yeah.

Even though you were watching it at two times speed.

Yeah, the whole thing would have been off in like less than an hour.

Oh my gosh, it took.

Yeah, it was quick.

It was quick.

Did you make the conscious decision to watch it at two times speed from the beginning?

No, so that was sort of 10 minutes in, I thought.

You gave it 10 minutes.

10 minutes of, again, nothing happening.

I love it when

Candice Marie says, can I come out with you?

And he goes, no, Candice Marie, I want you to stay and look after the things.

And that's such a good observation because the amount of times I've been in a car with a girlfriend.

That's what I mean.

This is why you like the technical station.

And they said, oh, can I come out?

And I

kind of like you to watch the phone.

Otherwise, I've got to unplug all my devices for safety.

That's what I mean.

I can understand why you literally lap it up because you see myself.

It's like putting a mirror in front of yourself.

I get it.

Well, thank you for making Ellis and I feel sad about a piece of culture we absolutely love.

Thank you for making us feel sad about young people, in a way.

Well, thanks for ruining an hour and a half.

Well, no, we're not.

Well, it was an hour, wasn't it?

It was actually 45 minutes.

It was 50 minutes of my life, so I'm not going back.

Well, thank you very much for your take, and we'll have no more of those next week.

I will watch, for example, 24 Hours in Police Custody,

Forensic's the Real CSI, at 1.2 times speed.

Will you?

Yeah, because it's still exactly the same.

I tried.

But I don't think I would do that with a dramatic piece that someone had sort of scripted and acted on.

I was looking for something

on the podcast,

and I knew roughly when it had been, and I listened to the podcast at 1.5, and I just could not concentrate on it.

Listen to all podcasts at 1.5?

No.

Apart from Three Bean Salad is the only podcast I don't listen to at 1.5.

You should get through more of it.

I know, but I'm a purist, John.

I'm a purist.

But people do talk quite slowly.

But that's natural.

That's how they're talking.

Yeah, but it still sounds normal out, say, 1.25.

Does it?

Yeah.

It just sounds like you've thought about what you're going to see.

I remember I watched, I think I might have said this this before, but I watched genuinely 40 minutes of the film 300 in half speed, thinking it was a dramatic war scene.

Because it's the type of film that, you know,

it could do that, and you could think this is fancy.

And it just got to the point where I thought...

And it just suddenly clicked.

I thought, something's not right here.

This is too long.

This is too long.

He's dying slowly.

Let's connect with someone from Wales.

Can one of South London's more beloved Welsh expats connect with fellow country person in 60 seconds by randomly listing names after finding out where they did their GCSEs?

It's the Cymru connection.

Where did you go to school?

Do you know Daffy daffons no

come on mate you must do no we've never met

at all

now last week saw some pretty controversial scenes as ellis failed to connect with guffer's neighbor

and

when i questioned his approach to welsh club yeah ellis said he wanted me to walk into the sea and drown and that he wouldn't look for the body or write my obituary.

I'm dreading seeing Guffer next.

So Ellis, how is your mood today?

Because you're in a poor run of form.

I am.

I'm.

Our tour is going to get in the way of me watching the Swans.

So I don't know when I'm going to see Guffer next because I see Guffer at Swansea games.

But I'm dreading it.

Because he's...

You know, he's someone who crops up relatively often on this feature.

And usually it's a bit of a free hit for me.

But I just didn't.

I just didn't add the two of them together.

I was staggered that he didn't know Mike Bubbins.

Well, that had thrown me.

We have a caller on the line from Wales.

Hello.

Hello.

The next voice you hear will be that of Ellis James.

There are 60 seconds on the clock.

Let's come reconnect.

Agent School.

39, and I went to Urbana High School in Frederick, Maryland.

Right.

so, um,

where do you live?

Bangor.

What do you do for a living?

I'm a full-time student.

Oh, okay.

What are you studying?

Uh, Kamrai.

Right, okay.

Um,

uh, do you know oh, Banger University 39.

Uh, do you know Dylan Foster Evans?

No.

Okay.

Uh, do you know Afiona Lina Dwyn?

No.

Okay, that's fine.

Um,

do you know Ivan Pritchard, the musician?

No.

Ozgunev.

no, the okay, Tidorawin,

no,

all right.

That's fine, that is good.

Um,

Anger University,

okay, you don't know Fiona, she's a big player, that's fine.

Uh, do you know, um, Flier Sanford Reuter?

No,

okay, I'm an undergrad.

Good.

I've got to say that was poor.

That was poor.

You're from Maryland in the US.

Yeah.

You're presumably a Welsh learner.

Or you've learnt Welsh and now you're doing it.

So you're doing a degree in Welsh?

I'm doing a degree in Welsh.

Well, Diane?

I always love it when people learn Welsh.

So why are you learning Welsh, Corla?

And why do you live in Bangor?

Well, I moved to Wales to study

for unrelated reasons.

And then after moving here and starting to learn...

well, I started learning Welsh because it's obvious if you move to Gwynedd, you should learn Welsh.

Thank you.

And then

I got so into it that I decided to switch degree courses to Camerag.

I love that.

What were you initially studying?

Education.

How long did it take you to learn Welsh, out of curiosity?

I'm still learning.

To

a degree that I could have conversations in Welsh, I would say

about five or six months, maybe.

Goodness me.

That's important.

Let's say something in Welsh program.

Oh, it's fantastic.

It's fantastic.

You had a teacher, Mr.

Luelin.

Well, I went to Llewellyn.

Yeah.

Do you know his sister, Nia?

I've met Nia.

Yeah, I'm good friends with her.

Sugar my body and eat me like a pudding.

How would you know Nia?

Both taught by that person.

I know Nia because she runs a program for Welsh learners and Lamperto.

Yes, she does.

When her brother taught me history at school, and then we remained friends because he's an absolutely top man.

But I've only met Nia once or twice.

Oh.

Is Lamperton near Bangor?

No, it's down south.

Yeah, it's down south.

I think you'd be

unfair on yourself if you thought you'd get that connection.

Because why would you.

Well, we've got to question whether someone not born in Wales,

as much as our caller is doing a great deal to

integrate into the Welsh culture, Welsh language and Welsh society, does that truly count as a Cymru connection?

It would do if the connection was there.

I don't think we've ever said they have to be born in Wales, have we?

The problem is, what's your name, sorry, Caller?

Joshua.

The problem is, I'm so impressed with Joshua's

linguistic abilities.

I'm so pleased that he's learned Welsh.

I want to Cymru reconnect with him, but I have to admit it is harder because he went to school in Maryland in the US.

And so how long have you lived in Wales?

Three years.

I think that's asking a lot.

But it's nice to have a curveball every so often.

It is a curveball.

I mean, Ellis didn't interrogate any of these circumstances with his questions.

Well, I knew he was American.

But you didn't say, well, how long have you lived there?

Why did you move there?

What did you do there?

What, to Wales?

Yeah.

Well, I knew he was studying, and Bangor University is obviously going to be the route I'm going down.

Okay.

You know.

He gives himself one route.

I've got 60 seconds, you complete piece of meat.

I think he might ask you to drown in the sea again, John.

If you knock out.

Can I ask Alice, do you know Anghara Price?

Which one?

I know about eight Anghara Price's.

Well,

she's a writer and

a teacher at Bangor University.

No, I occasionally, I think if it's the same one we're talking about, I think I often get suggested her on my Facebook, but I don't think we have met.

Okay, do you know Jerry Hunter?

No, who's that?

He's another American, but he's been in the Welsh department at Bangor for like 20, 30 years.

I think I once played Five Aside with him when we were both very drunk at about two in the morning, and

it was starlight, or starlit Five Aside, which is impossible.

That's a nice Cumory connection, though.

Yeah, if I think he went to the Stedvod like in the late 90s.

Has he got ginger hair?

No, it's dark.

Okay,

I think we actually are thinking about the same person, but I never would have.

I don't actually...

I've forgotten his name.

Because it was only lit by starlight, so you wouldn't know what colour it was.

Yes,

oh, Joshua.

I am feeling a mix of emotions right now.

There's confusion.

It's confusing.

Because I'm...

You admire Joshua and hate yourself.

It's exactly that.

So it's actually not confusing.

You've nailed it.

I admire Joshua and I hate myself.

It's 50-50.

Well, thank you very much for trying to come reconnect, Joshua.

We wish you all the best with your studies and your future adventures.

Yes, publish, Joshua.

Thank you very much, Diochovar.

Thank you.

There we go.

What a day.

I mean, the stats are through the floor, but it was interesting.

A lot of interest there.

Oh, yeah.

We're meeting interesting people.

And I think, given what he's doing in Wales, there was a chance that it wasn't like we just had a random American on.

I think

that would be impossible.

I certainly have to be Welsh-born.

Do you?

Yeah.

I think it helps.

Yeah, I mean, it doesn't.

I think it does help, but I'm sure.

Because he's not Welsh.

He's not.

Is he?

And that's the

sort of the premise.

Well, is the premise not connecting to a Welsh person?

Yeah, he's not a Welsh person, Dave.

But is the premise not connecting to a Welsh person?

I'll say it again.

He's not a Welsh person.

He's an American who lives in Bangalore.

But it's the person person that you find in the middle.

No.

No, I think it's finding a connection.

Because if Ellis had connected with him, but it was someone who lived in Bristol, you'd still allow it.

It's still a connection.

It's connecting to a Cymru person.

I'm not having a go at Joshua.

Oh, God, no.

I'm not having a go at Joshua at all.

I value Joshua.

I believe in Joshua.

And Wales values Joshua.

Wales certainly values Joshua, but that was, I would say,

sticky wicket.

Should we scrub it?

Yes.

Because it would help your stats.

Yeah, yeah.

Don't mention my stats, but yes, it would help.

This could be the difference between 44 and 45%.

Yes.

Be quiet for a minute and broadcast silence.

Should we just sit on the carpet?

Should's go and sit on the thinking spot.

He sounds good a little bit as well.

There's an artist that I love called BC Camp Light.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

He did some at BC Camplight.

But what was funny was when I said aged school and he went, whatever his school was in Maryland, my brain began to fizz.

And I thought, this is, I thought, is this, is it April the 1st?

It's after midday.

We shall return to Wales next week, but it was nice to, nice to hear in Maryland.

It was very nice.

I was going to, I thought he must have been born in Wales, moved to Maryland as like a sort of three-year-old.

That's what I was thinking as well.

Right, there we go.

Well, now it's time for a game, and Nate's put his head in his hands, Dave.

I feel like I've been punching the solar plexus, Dave.

And I'm looking over at my corner, man, and I'm like, don't end the fight, man.

But

I'm going to take an eight count, and then we'll hope for the best.

Yeah.

What do you mean?

I've been beaten up, Dave.

Got it.

But you still want to continue.

Absolutely.

It's a tight let's take for God's sake.

Great.

Should we do a made-up game?

Yeah, I think that's best.

I'm suffering.

Yes, yes.

I'm going to use a phrase that John introduced me to on his excellent episode of What Did You Do Yesterday.

I'm in my pain cave.

And do you know what you have to do?

What?

You have to, when you're in your pain cave, this is from

an American ultra runner.

Oh, yeah.

Whose name escapes?

Scott Sturek.

No, what is her name?

I'm going to find it because it's important to credit people with wisdom.

She's famous for not just being amazing at ultra-running, but also

she can eat lots of crisps.

Well, she does.

She doesn't do special diets, so she like eats pizza all the time and stuff.

Do I mean Courtney DeWalter?

Yeah, it's Courtney DeWalter.

Dowalta.

Okay.

She

has this concept that when she goes into the cave, the pain cave,

she visualizes herself holding a chisel to make the pain cave bigger so there is more space for her the next time she goes into it.

Wow.

What an incredible powerful piece of visualization.

Get me a chisel, Dave.

I'm in my pain cave.

Because

I couldn't connect with an American who's learned Welsh and now lives in Bangor.

I'm in my pain cave.

Get me a chisel, Dave.

Wouldn't be so hard on yourself.

This week was a tricky one.

We're scrubbing it from the record.

What makes me such a top elite level player?

It would have been amazing.

I mean, it would have been limbs if you'd got it.

It would have been limbs.

It would have been limbs.

I'd have have given you 10% more on your stats.

It would have been your wealth.

Out 10 now.

You wouldn't have done that.

It would have been limbs and a pitching version.

I mean the good news is I'm going to go on the BC camp light.

A final

criminal record pitch invasions these days aren't there?

Oh, yeah.

It's much harder on that.

That's why you don't get streakers anymore.

You ain't really getting much if you run onto Pitcher City after they've won the league.

Really?

But 20,000 people are doing it.

Yeah.

It's uncontrollable.

And Britain's prisons are overcrowded.

Yeah.

Imagine what Rory Stewart would say if you put 20,000 city fans in prison.

He would be spitting feathers in his drawing room with his little gilet on.

I think if they put 20,000 Swansea fans in prison for a pitched pitch, I think we'd have a laugh.

Oh, yeah.

If you're all in the same prison, there'd be some good chants in the prison.

Yeah, yeah.

All right, made-up games then.

L, come on, mate.

Come on, mate.

We're going to use the Robert Miles jingle, which is an old one, but a cracking one from Jake.

Here we go.

Considering he's got auto-tune at his disposal, it's remarkable that he didn't choose to use it, but fantastic tune.

Well, maybe that's why Robert Miles was mainly instrumental.

Yes.

Because it's tricky to actually put vocals over it.

Maybe that's the problem.

Each week we play a made-up game that is made up by a listener at home.

Scores on the doors.

John

is two games to love up, leading 40-15 in the third game of the second set.

Okay.

And you are one setup as well.

Yeah, of course.

This week's game is from David in Wiltshire.

Greetings, my little biscuits of brilliance.

In an episode I heard recently, Ellis commented, I'm always right about the continents when referring to Lou Sanders discovering that she was imminently due to go on a hendu in South Africa.

To help test that knowledge, here's a map-based game for you.

Love it.

It's called...

I'll take a run-up at this.

It's called...

International Place Guestimation,

which I'm going to take upon is a little play on words of international space station okay now dave there is a map to my right does that need to be turned round oh you're very honest john i'm very noble thank you call me noble john let's have a look at the map i'm going to turn it around just in case okay okay yeah do you know what it could actually be a problem oh this is from around the world in 1880 daves around the world in 80 daves yes god rest its soul on uh three bean salad they they're doing that feature though they had a quiz they do bonjo's house of Pain as a patron only.

And one of the questions was: what are the only two

countries that begin with A that don't end with A?

And I immediately pressed pause and pulled over in my car.

And I was not allowed to set off or press play until I got them.

Beginning with A that don't, because you immediately think Andorra.

You do.

Angola.

America.

And here we are.

Wow.

There's loads.

Alaska.

That's not a country.

Argent.

Damn it.

Did it again?

I know.

It creeps up.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So, but let's carry on with Argentina.

Can we move on?

Yeah.

Can we?

Are there any?

Yeah, there's two.

There's two.

What are they before I go out?

Let's carry on.

Oh, thanks.

I'm just going to run up then.

International Place Guestimation.

Armenia, isn't it?

Azerbaijan!

Yes!

Well done, he's back.

He needed that.

And one more.

You You then just, so Dave will have all the letters of the alphabet in a bowl.

You'll each draw out FA Cup draw style.

All right.

You then just have to name two places which are the furthest apart as possible that begin with those two letters.

Okay, yeah, we've done a similar thing.

We've done similar, but.

Which I think Ellis won.

I think it wasn't in West.

No, do you know what happened?

It was that Pharaoh Falkland, mate.

Oh, it was Pharaoh's Falklands.

No, it wasn't that one.

There was one where we had to do as the crow flies

distances, and I was really showboating.

And I missed, I was too far by about 10 miles in the new one.

But we've played lots of games like this in the past, but I don't mind.

I'm excited.

I don't think we've played it with letters to try and make you get free because it's forcing your hand a bit.

Because I think there was a problem.

Afghanistan.

Thank you.

Locations, not countries.

Distances,

locations on Earth.

Yes.

Not Pluto or heaven.

Because you could win quite easily then.

Yeah.

How far away is heaven?

Yeah, Germany to heaven.

So far away, Dave.

Or is it right here?

Yeah, exactly.

This is it.

It's this show.

I watched an interview with a guy yesterday who's claiming there's no such thing as time.

It's just infinite present.

I've joined a Facebook page about time slips.

Have you?

What's that?

So someone will live opposite a primary school and then they'll open their curtains at 3am when they need a wee.

But the primary school playground is full of children from 1910.

Right.

That's not real, though, is it?

No, but enough people think it's real for it to be a burgeoning Facebook page.

So why have you joined it?

Because once you popped up, I found it such an engaging idea.

I thought, yeah, I've got to see more of this.

Like Quantum Leap.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So...

It's another way of saying time slips.

You'll draw the letters.

You'll then just have to say in two places which are furthest apart as possible to begin with those two letters.

Locations, not countries.

Cities, towns, whatever.

Distance is measured as the crow flies.

When a letter is drawn, it is out of future draws, obviously.

Of course.

Because I'm not going to put it back in the bowl.

Yeah.

I'm not mad.

And if we do say a country,

or do we not say a country?

You can't say a country.

No, you can't say countries.

A few little rules.

Just to spice things up a bit.

UK and Ireland are off limits.

Interesting.

So you can't just keep going for that.

So we're naming cities then.

Hey?

So we're naming cities.

I I think it's mainly cities.

Cities.

Hamlets.

But it couldn't be a river.

Can't be a river.

No.

Could it be a mountain?

Is there a village on the mountain?

Okay, okay.

So it's habited areas.

Yeah.

Okay, okay.

And as the crow flies, the quickest way to that?

Which is a straight line.

Straight line.

Like if you did London and Redding, if you went all the way around the world, it'd be sort of thousands of miles.

Oh, yeah, no, no, no.

Or it could be 40 miles.

Good point.

Good point.

Because that's the kind of thing that John would have actually stress-tested with the rules.

Five rounds in total, unless it drags on, and we'll do three.

Okay.

Let's see how we get on.

Are we ready?

Yeah.

I'm going to let each of you pick one each time.

Very good.

So, John, take a letter from our big bowl of letters.

Okay.

Ellis, you take the second.

You can go in either direction.

Are you kidding me?

So, two letters have been picked.

John, what have you got?

Z.

Zed.

That's unfortunate.

Ellis?

P.

P.

I'm not going to put a time limit on it.

I think we'll just do it when you're both ready.

So you need to be picking two locations that you think are as far apart as possible.

With the same letter.

Well, either go.

You're going to have to let me go, UK, because I don't think I can think of two places that begin with Z.

Well, you need one that begins with P and one that begins with Z.

Oh, I see.

Oh, okay.

All right.

Okay.

So I don't pick two Zeds.

I need to pick.

Oh, okay.

So it's P to Z or Z to P.

Absolutely.

Yes.

So nothing that matters.

Yeah.

Rooting for Alice, I can't lie.

Just to give him a little pick-me-up, John.

Just to get him

back in the zone of life.

Hmm.

Turn Robert Miles off.

Well, we'll bring Chris Tarrant back again to tell you off, if you're not careful.

Ellis has pointedly taken his headphones headphones out and put his fingers in his ears.

Like a footballer not wanting to hear fans chant at them.

Okay, I'm ready.

John's ready.

Al, can you hear me with your fingers in your ears?

Yes, yes, yes.

I'm not thrilled.

I can't, I know.

But never mind, we'll give it a good go.

Do your billy best.

Okay.

Ellis, please.

Zurich.

Sure.

To Perth in Australia.

Perth's not my favoured side of Australia.

I'd like to go further.

John, what you got?

I've gone Zagreb to Perth.

Two Perth's in play.

It's the double pillars further.

The results are...

Oh, I knew I should have done true.

I knew I should have done.

I knew I should have done.

Too late.

Never mind.

Too late.

Oh!

Not much in it.

No.

Of course.

John.

8,204 miles.

Yeah.

Ellis, 8,573.

Well done.

Well done, Zell.

Does Ellis get a point or is it come cumulative miles?

No, he gets a point, I think.

Okay, that's right.

Round two.

Oh, it's me again.

Well, we know Zed's gone.

Yeah.

Gone, John.

Pick as a letter.

Ellis, pick as a letter.

You've used quite a lot of paper to write down a letter, Dave.

Yeah, it's quite a lot of paper.

I have.

Some sort of tax dodge.

V.

Interesting, isn't it?

K.

Whoa.

Okay.

1-0 to Ellis.

It's V to K or K K to V.

Alex is taking his headphones back out again.

What have you got against Robert Miles?

Shut up, D.

It's actually quite hard to think of places that aren't countries, especially with quite obscure letters when you're not allowed to use the UK and Ireland.

Yeah.

That's the point.

There could be some here that are very short distances, but you still might win because if both of you are struggling to find the really long ones,

so it's a level playing field.

Okay, I'm ready.

Okay, good.

Good, good, good.

It's got your brains going, hasn't it?

John, please.

Kansas City.

Kansas.

To Verona.

Oh, it's good.

Versailles.

To Karachi.

Oh, nice.

I was also considering Kyiv to Vermont.

Yeah.

Oh, yeah, yeah.

I think

Results, you're trickling in from our uh okay trickling in

a name like it's election night

here they come

Sunderland South Distance Sunderland have come in too early and they've got it wrong uh Ellis 3817 miles great it ain't bad though is it John 5094

Kansas to Verona oh that's really good it's good stuff

but But both good.

I was initially gone Kuala Lumpur, and remember that was a country popped into my body.

Kuala Lumpur's not a country.

Is it not?

It's the capital of Malaysia.

Oh, no, it can be.

Sugar.

Sugar.

We've sugared you already today.

You've sugared me twice.

Should we just see what would have matters?

Kuala Lumpa.

Yeah.

Go on then.

Hot.

How far is that?

I would have won, I think.

Because Versailles.

We haven't got time to play what you could have won.

We've got five rounds of this.

I think the listeners are desperate to know whether Alice would have nicked the round.

Ellis would have nicked the round.

All right, never mind.

Let's pick our places.

Rip it up and start again.

Round three.

Ellis, I'm gonna let you pick first.

This should be called Pick a Place, Traverse the Space.

Love that.

F

T

T F and T.

Okay, so start scribbling.

Hmm.

Okay.

Oh, no.

It's not.

Okay.

No.

I think we stick to cities.

You can have a city and a state.

Don't use your microphone, though, at the same time.

Can I have a st- But I yeah, but if the city doesn't start with the letter, the fact that it's in the state that does start with the letter.

No, you can't do that.

I can't do that, can I?

I need to put my glasses back on.

I'm going to have to push because I think there are...

There are options, aren't there?

You're just trying to get as far away as possible, which is the challenge.

Yeah, I'm ready to rock.

Alice, how are you feeling about the whole shebang?

Angry.

If I was able to use a state, I'd be thrilled to bits.

Would you?

Yeah, not

happy, actually.

What comes to you first, John?

Fort Worth

to Tehran.

Oh, that's good.

Out of curiosity, could you sw

I don't know what I mean by that.

What could I have gone Tehran to Fort Worth?

How do you spell Tehran, John?

T-E-H-R-A-N.

Ay, of course.

Okay, Alice, what's yours, please?

Frankfurt.

Yes.

Tallahassee.

I think John's nicked it.

I wanted to go Tasmania,

but I could only think of Hobart, which is in Tasmania, which obviously starts with an H.

It's 4,759 miles between Frankfurt and Tallahassee.

Fort Worth to Tehran, 7,294.

That's good gameplay.

That's big.

I've got to hand it to John.

That's great gameplay.

I've got to hand it to him.

I don't mind losing to that.

I nearly went Fort Worth to Tokyo, but then I thought, actually, the other way around.

The other way around,

that could be pretty close.

You might be able to see Tokyo from there.

Should we leave it at three?

No.

You want five?

I love it.

And he's ahead, and

he's asking for more.

Right then.

It's 2-1, isn't it?

Get me a big bucket out.

Yes, we should do a quick fire round.

Yeah, well.

Okay.

All right.

What do we we got?

John?

M.

M is a solid letter.

Why?

It's trickier.

Oh, okay.

I've got one already.

Have you?

Got one.

You got one?

Yeah.

He's confident, John.

Done, done, done.

Well, John ruined that he asked for five rounds over three.

Well, I haven't got one yet.

Exactly.

I'm quite pleased-ish with mine, but you know, let's not get hoopristic about it.

Okay.

John, please.

Yucatan.

Don't know how to spell that.

Go on, yeah.

Melbourne.

Okay, will we allow Yucatan as a Mexican state?

Oh, is it a state?

Well, we didn't allow Ellis' state because we were quite firm with okay.

Do you want me to guess again?

For why, yeah.

I was only asking you.

Yellowstone.

Surely that's not allowed.

Otherwise, I would have said Tasmania and got myself more thinking time.

I think it's okay.

Yellowstone.

Great.

I need to start watching watching that.

I've stopped watching it.

It's a good prog.

Ellis.

Yp.

In Belgium.

How do you spell that?

Y-E-P-R-E-S.

Wow, okay.

The Battle of Yp.

Y-P-R-E, of course, yes.

To Melbourne in Australia.

Melbourne.

Not to Derbyshire.

Oh, Ellis.

I hope you've got it.

We're rooting for you.

I mean...

Steward's inquiry.

He's got it.

Who has?

He's got it.

Ellis has got it.

10,386 miles to John's 8,608.

That's got to be almost as far as you can go.

Yeah.

It's got to be, hasn't it?

It's got to be.

It's definitely the best.

I couldn't think of an M in New Zealand, which obviously would remember.

And it takes us to the fifth and final deciding round.

Two oh!

Two oh.

What have I done, Dave?

Well, you've made for a tense and fun game, which is lovely stuff.

What do you got, John?

G.

G.

Two.

G to H.

G to H.

I'm quite quick again.

He's quite quick again.

Are you?

Are you happy?

I'm doubting I'll improve on that.

Well, when you come in hot, you are very impressive.

I don't think I'll beat that.

Incredibly impressive.

John, please.

Green Point.

Where's that?

New York.

Sorry, it's to Alice first.

Okay.

Ellis first, please.

Ghent.

Ghent.

To Hobart.

To Hobart.

John.

Greenpoint to Hobart.

Greenpoint.

You both went to Hobart.

I knew.

And I brought Hobart into the mix.

Just waiting for the results to pop in.

Right, the results are in.

John was 2-1 up.

And decided to play on.

Narrative.

Confident that he could still take the win.

In the fifth and final round, the deciding round, Greenpoint to Hobart is 9,879 miles.

It's strong.

It's not strong enough.

Ghent to Hobart is 10,651 miles.

Ellis Nixon, 3,2.

Absolutely massive.

That's gameplay.

That is gameplay.

Good old Ghent.

Good old Ghent.

I need to learn more towns and cities.

I was really struggling.

But you walled way better than me there.

I'd have been horrendous at that game.

None of them were embarrassing answers.

They were all decent.

Where's Distance B?

Canada, North.

Well done, lads.

Well done, everyone.

That was a good game.

Enjoyed that.

The problem is, you are essentially thinking of places in Australia.

You should outlaw Australia and New Zealand would be better than

outlawing the UK.

Okay.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I'll pass that back to you.

Because

although I should...

Frankfurt to Tokyo would have been another win, I can't believe I didn't think of Tokyo.

You won the game, but I was going too far.

So I tried to get it in.

Missed.

He was throwing his paper at me.

Good.

Thank you, everyone.

Thanks, David, for a fun game.

Thanks, David, for a long time.

That's probably it.

It is.

I mean, it's just a Cumric Connection and a made-up game.

And an Izzy review.

And an Izzy review.

I cannot believe you should watch Nuts and Me at two times speed.

Well, join us next week and do send in your Shane Wells.

Yes.

And your mad dads.

We love your mad dads as well.

And you can send those, of course, to alisonjohnbbc.co.uk.

Or if you fancy, you could send us a WhatsApp on 07974293022.

We'll be back with you on Friday.

Thank you very much for listening.

Goodbye.

Bye.