The One and Only, Kris Jenner

Speaker 1 So, five is your close-up. Hi.

Speaker 2 Hi, Five.

Speaker 2 Get it? Hi, Five.

Speaker 1 I just got it.

Speaker 2 I think when I was about 16 years old, all I wanted to do was have six kids. That was my destiny.
And I used to pray about it, and I claimed it.

Speaker 1 I don't think anyone questions your determination. I think everyone knows if you.

Speaker 2 I was laser-focused.

Speaker 1 They have this like anxiety and this build-up about the teenage stage. I know what a terrorist I was as a teenager.

Speaker 2 You were wild.

Speaker 1 I know.

Speaker 2 You were spicy and crazy.

Speaker 1 You're confirming that I should be terrified of the teenage phase.

Speaker 2 Absolutely.

Speaker 1 You and Kim, like, we're going to film a show and you guys have to be on it. Court and I were like, no, we're not.
We don't want to be on this show.

Speaker 1 Then when you were like our manager and telling us what to do, and we're like, what are you talking about? Like, you're not going to boss us around. We're like, what?

Speaker 1 You just don't want people thinking, oh, working with family is a breeze.

Speaker 2 No, no, there are challenges for sure.

Speaker 2 Just use me as a filler when you don't want to tape another episode.

Speaker 1 Oh, you'll be the host? No, oh, yeah,

Speaker 1 you have nurtured that Rolodax, you will have, I don't know,

Speaker 1 Jesus sitting right there.

Speaker 2 Oh my gosh, that would be great.

Speaker 1 Hi, Mommy. Hi.
Hi. I'm so happy that you are on my podcast.

Speaker 2 Thank you for inviting me. We've been talking about this for years.
Not me being here, but you having a podcast. Yes.
And I'm really proud of you.

Speaker 1 Thank you.

Speaker 2 Because I think it's very brave of you to actually go ahead and pull the trigger and do this when you were so reluctant to do it for so long for so many reasons. And here you are.
And look at you.

Speaker 1 here we are i know well you know having you on obviously you are what many people aspire to have on any podcast but you're my mom and i feel like we film together and like you have a documentary coming out one day and like there's books about you i

Speaker 1 there's no for me i felt like asking you the typical questions of where were you born where were you born you know how was san diego what's your mom like i feel like people that are real fans of yours know those things.

Speaker 1 And so,

Speaker 1 sure, we might glaze over those things, but I really thought an interesting topic that I feel is interesting and that people always ask me about. People are always praising us for our family dynamic.

Speaker 1 They always say, like, whether they come from a family with a lot of siblings, they always are like, oh my gosh, you remind me of my mom and my siblings. Or if they don't have siblings, they

Speaker 1 dream like that's their fantasy. If I had a bunch of siblings, like that's the sibling dynamic and parent dynamic that I would love to have with my family.

Speaker 2 So

Speaker 1 I felt like it would be a great episode to talk to you about, I think, our dynamic, the dynamic that you have with your children, and the many phases of that.

Speaker 2 But

Speaker 1 did you always dream about being a mother?

Speaker 2 Well, yeah. I mean, that was the dream.
The dream for me when I was growing up, all I wanted to do was have six kids. So much so that I would think about it day and night.

Speaker 2 I had things planned out in my head. I wanted to be, that was my goal in life, to get married and be able to raise a family, have six kids, and live happily ever after.
And in those days,

Speaker 2 You know, when I was growing up, I sound like a dinosaur, but there were no cell phones. There were no, you know, I barely had color TV.

Speaker 2 So there was no real form of communication or things to compare yourself to or things that inspired me.

Speaker 2 So I don't know where and when I got inspired, but I was watching Leave It to Beaver and I Love Lucy and all those shows and the Flintstones and everything in between the Jetsons.

Speaker 2 And, you know, you just saw the future and your life as more traditional in those days. It was a very, I was born in the 50s.

Speaker 2 I was a 50s baby, and I think I kind of grew up like a 50s child, even though I graduated from high school in the 70s, but all I ever wanted to do was have kids.

Speaker 2 So the year after I graduated from high school, I met daddy, and I just thought was the dream, was to have babies and, you know, sail off into the sunset. Do you know what's interesting?

Speaker 2 When I was getting divorced, from your dad, I thought, wow, how did that go so sideways? I was supposed to have six kids. I always thought that was my destiny.

Speaker 2 That was what was going to happen. And I used to pray about it and I claimed it, and it was going to happen.
So I really thought I messed up when there weren't six of you guys at the time.

Speaker 2 I think about that often. I thought, how interesting that that was one of the main takeaways from that whole experience.

Speaker 1 And I think also, maybe, and it's so crazy to think this, but you had Kendall and Kylie when you were 40 and 41,

Speaker 1 and

Speaker 1 28 years ago, or 27 years ago, it was really

Speaker 1 rare for someone in their 40s to have.

Speaker 1 It was almost like whispered about, like taboo, like she's 40 and she's going to have a baby.

Speaker 2 Is she nuts? And so, and then it was obviously safe to have babies at that age, but everybody thought there was also some danger to it. Like, what's going on? How could she have a baby in her 40s?

Speaker 2 Doesn't aren't all her eggs gone? And it was very controversial.

Speaker 1 So, I'm sure even you probably thought that ship has sailed.

Speaker 2 I didn't know what to think. I thought I got pregnant right away and then had a miscarriage, but I also had a miscarriage right before Robert was born.

Speaker 2 So, at a couple months, right before I got pregnant with Rob, I had a miscarriage. And then I had a miscarriage right

Speaker 2 before Kendall.

Speaker 2 So, when I got pregnant with Kendall,

Speaker 2 it was,

Speaker 2 we were really trying because I thought, you know, I'm not, this isn't taking me down. I will show my body.
You know, you almost, it's almost like a challenge to get pregnant.

Speaker 1 I don't think anyone questions your determination. I think everyone knows if you

Speaker 2 was laser focused.

Speaker 2 Laser focused.

Speaker 1 If you say you're going to do something, you're going to do something.

Speaker 2 And if somebody said, if I read something that said, drink iced tea or take, you know, peptobismol or have three coffees or whatever somebody's recommendation was I would do whatever it took you know to try and get pregnant like all these little old wives tales and everything under the bed one time you and your ex-husband were trying and that was

Speaker 1 I'm still

Speaker 2 yeah but you snuck into my bedroom I was playing hide and go seek and nobody Found me and I fell asleep. You were with Francesca.

Speaker 2 So you apparently, who were you looking for, each other?

Speaker 2 You You were hiding under my bed. It was gross.
And you didn't get caught. You decided to stay there because it sounded exciting.
And you got an earful.

Speaker 2 And you being tortured for the rest of your life is exactly what you deserve. Great.
Well, those sounds will never leave your.

Speaker 1 No, they won't.

Speaker 2 Wait, how did you get out of there? Did we catch you under the bed or did you wait?

Speaker 1 I ran out and you guys were like, what was that?

Speaker 2 Oh, so we didn't at the time know it was you?

Speaker 1 Yeah, well, you like,

Speaker 1 I ran out and because at first we were like, huh, like, I think we were like, oh my God, and like a little giggling. And then you guys were like, I think I hear something.

Speaker 1 And then when you guys said that, we ran. And then you're like, wow, what was that? Who was that? No one came to find us for a while because I think you guys were probably so mortified as I was.

Speaker 2 Probably trying to figure out the game plan. Like, what do we say? Like, what do we say we were doing? Yeah.
Let's say we were wrestling.

Speaker 1 Yeah, no. And I knew what was happening.

Speaker 2 It was an Olympic competition.

Speaker 1 Gross. I can't even think about this anymore.
Okay.

Speaker 2 This is like a therapy session.

Speaker 2 Are you going to make me go through every childhood trauma? No, that's not.

Speaker 1 And help you

Speaker 1 work it out until you're satisfied. If Courtney was here, then that would probably happen, but I'm good.
All right, good. I don't feel like I have a lot of childhood traumas.

Speaker 2 Thank God. I don't.
That makes one.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 1 I think, well, me and Kim, I think, are in the same boat. And what I find interesting, because I don't remember, like even, I absolutely despise when people call Kendall and Kylie our half-sisters.

Speaker 1 Yeah. Because I'm like, no, those are my real sisters.
I was born and raised with them, spent every minute with them. And so I really find that insulting when people say that about us.

Speaker 1 So I don't like that term. None of us like that term.

Speaker 2 I don't even think about that term. We don't use that term.

Speaker 1 We never do. But like just other people, I just hate when they

Speaker 2 recognize the divide.

Speaker 1 I really, really really hate that. And I don't hate a lot of things.
But

Speaker 1 I think something that you did so well, because I hear from so many

Speaker 1 blended families, like it's so hard to integrate my first set of kids with the other set of kids, but I don't remember there ever being with any one of us.

Speaker 1 I think Kendall and Kylie were born when I was

Speaker 1 maybe like 11 and 12, something like that. I thought, okay.
Maybe younger. I don't know.

Speaker 2 95.

Speaker 1 So you were... I was 11.
You were 11.

Speaker 1 So, but I don't remember ever there needing to be even a discussion or just even with my dad, I felt like everything, I don't know, we've always had this really strong family dynamic.

Speaker 1 We never felt like

Speaker 2 you were, you were, you were at the hospital

Speaker 2 when I gave birth. All of us.
So you guys all came and it was like, here's your baby sister. Like this is, we're all going home together.
We're all in this together.

Speaker 1 He's sleeping on the floor. And

Speaker 1 do you have any, I don't even know if you do, because for us it was not, I don't think it was methodical or talked about.

Speaker 1 But do you have any tips for people that are trying to blend families or nervous about that?

Speaker 2 You know, I think that it's a little bit different if you have parents with two sets of, you know, two families and each parent has a different set of children with somebody else.

Speaker 2 That's a little bit different. It's a little bit harder to really integrate the kids.
And if the kids get along, then

Speaker 2 that's obviously a lot easier. But with Kendall and Kylie, I felt like I had two litters of kids.
And it was just so natural that one just came a little bit later than the other.

Speaker 2 And it was, you guys, I think from the day I got pregnant. with Kendall and the day I got pregnant with Kylie, you guys were so involved in every discussion, every

Speaker 2 doctor's appointment, decorating the nursery, you know, where we were going to live because we were looking for now, we had to get a bigger house.

Speaker 2 And that was the year in 1996, right after Kendall was born and before Kylie was born, we moved to Hidden Hills.

Speaker 2 And it was all about finding this big, you know, massive house that everybody could have their own bedroom. And, you know, I think the minute that we came home from the hospital with number five,

Speaker 2 I think you were in love with your sister, and so was everybody else.

Speaker 2 And, you know it there was never a thought of

Speaker 2 she doesn't belong to me right she's not mine this is my sister and everybody was so protective and loving and you know it was just you know we did everything together yeah and nobody was ever left out right not even your dad Your dad came over way before we, you know, obviously when Kendall was born, and he just wanted us to know and you guys to know, I'm Uncle Robert.

Speaker 1 I really think what it has to do with, and I always say this, is the parents. Yeah.
I think

Speaker 2 a hundred thousand people.

Speaker 1 Yeah, if children see that this is normal and okay by all parents, everybody involved, then the kids are like, okay, this is okay.

Speaker 1 Because I think hatred and all of that stuff is learned that's not innate in anybody.

Speaker 2 You know, I think it causes so much

Speaker 2 trauma to the children and unhappiness and

Speaker 2 just being very anxious, a lot of anxiety, and people really trying to tiptoe around parents' feelings. And that's really not the child's responsibility.

Speaker 2 It's really for us as parents to make you guys feel loved and comfortable.

Speaker 1 Well, I know from my personal experience with Tristan and how we're such good co-parenters because of the example that I've had my whole life from you and my dad's dynamic to Bruce and my dad's dynamic, and

Speaker 1 it's all I saw. So, for me, it was a no-brainer.
And I do really think that, yes, you don't need that example. You can do it on your own, but when you have that example, it's

Speaker 1 all you know, and it's just embedded in you, and it's so easy. And for that, obviously, like, it's, I think, one of the best lessons because it's so peaceful for my children.
And

Speaker 1 they deserve that.

Speaker 2 It's such a great, important, powerful word because it really does, you know, you don't let

Speaker 2 the divide and the trauma and the nastiness come in at all. It's almost like you've built a wall where none of that can get in because you're showing your kids how to live this amazing

Speaker 2 life together. And this has, exactly.
And they want to feel loved. Children want to feel, you guys, all my, my job as a mom was to make sure you were safe and you felt loved and secure.

Speaker 2 in a really special place. And that was the most important thing to me.
And if we could get there, and you know what? It wasn't even something

Speaker 2 that we sat down and talked about, although I feel like we would have if it got nasty or anything at some point. But I think that

Speaker 2 when people get divorced, I feel like there's always a cooling off period where people have to find their way and come to terms with what's just happened and maybe the fact that you're not going to be with this person forever.

Speaker 2 But when you have kids with somebody, you are with that person. You're You're connected forever for the rest of your life, in my mind.
Yes, of course. And that's how I've always lived my life.

Speaker 2 And I, you know, would share everything with your dad. And then after we had our cooling off period, is what I like to call it, we became best friends.

Speaker 2 And he would come, once we moved to Hidden Hills and Kendall was born and then Kylie followed. And you guys were, you know, young 11-year-olds or teenagers and all that.

Speaker 2 He'd come walking in the back door at any time. What's for dinner? You know, he'd be there Christmas morning.
He'd be there on your birthdays. We'd give our parties.

Speaker 2 We would, you know, co-host everything that you guys did. And he just wanted to be a part of every special moment and want to be a part of the planning of it, too.

Speaker 2 I would call him up and go, hey, Rob's graduating from, you know, this or that. Where are we going to go? You know, or, you know, from kindergarten.

Speaker 2 He would be a part of the recital when you were four years old in nursery school. You know, but I mean, we were still married then.

Speaker 2 But, I mean, he was a part of all of those moments and what i mean is he still wanted to be a part of every single moment he came to kendall and kylie's birthday parties i know you know as uncle robert yeah so it was a pretty special time and i think that the best thing that happened because of all of that it takes you guys it takes a village but it takes all like-minded adults and

Speaker 1 people would put their own ego and issues aside for the betterment of children because it makes such a a difference in the long run.

Speaker 2 I don't think people realize that them winning, everybody wants to win, whatever the argument was, whatever the, you know, the reason for the divorce, whatever.

Speaker 2 You just have to decide that you want to kind of hang on to the love that you once had, but in just a different way. And that's what we did.

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Speaker 1 So you and my dad and Bruce were, I would say, partners in raising all of us.

Speaker 1 And I think think all three of you guys did an incredible job. And then my dad

Speaker 1 died in 2003.

Speaker 1 And so I think you always had that person to lean on. My dad died.
My brother was 16. I was 19.
And I forget Courtney and Kim in their young 20s. And,

Speaker 1 you know, having that person, I think, just really abruptly taken away.

Speaker 1 How did your role change of being

Speaker 1 a parent that had, yes, we still had Bruce, but it is different when our real

Speaker 1 dad is now gone. And he was also he

Speaker 2 was so present in your lives and such a big part of our day-to-day. So it wasn't just like, oh, your dad lives in Iowa and, you know, he's not around very much or he's not, you know, an available.

Speaker 2 He was emotionally available to you guys in such a big way. And he was emotionally available to me.

Speaker 2 And that really meant the world to me because he was,

Speaker 2 he was always there.

Speaker 1 And when

Speaker 2 I got remarried, Bruce didn't have a lot of money and I didn't have a lot of money. And we were trying to put it together and we were all collectively paying for

Speaker 2 private school and all these different things. But one of the funniest things and one of the nicest, most lovely things that your dad did did was when I was going through this, your dad used to

Speaker 2 kind of jokingly harp on me for my Neiman Marcus bill. Oh, yeah.
So every month it was the Nieman's bill. Oh, her and the Nieman's bill.
She's still using my Niemann's card.

Speaker 1 Right, I was going to say it was his card. Yeah, yes.
Yeah. Let's talk about this relatable story.
Okay.

Speaker 2 But anyway, it was a charge card. I was spending too much money.
And so later, when I was remarried, I remember one time he goes, do you need anything? I know, you know, it's crazy over there.

Speaker 2 And I said, said, Well, if you want to help me pay my

Speaker 2 now, I had my own Nieman's card. And I asked him, Would you pay the bill this month? And he goes, Sure.
And he paid my Neiman's card bill that month. And I'll never forget it.

Speaker 2 And we laughed about that. He goes, If you would have told me years ago that I would still be paying your Neiman Marcus bill, you know, or your clothing bill all these years later.

Speaker 2 And so we got a good laugh out of that. But I just think that

Speaker 2 when you're supportive and

Speaker 2 you can

Speaker 2 raise kids together and be there for one another, and do it as

Speaker 2 a team. It was definitely something where we were all aware of that.
That's a lot of people. I mean, six kids is a lot of kids.
And he was really well aware of the fact that I was juggling.

Speaker 2 And by the way, my relationship with you changed the minute I had Kendall. Because you really grew up and came to bat for me because you were like my little helper.

Speaker 2 You were mama's helper because I was working from home.

Speaker 2 And whenever you came home from school or on the weekends, you always helped me with Kendall and then Kylie, which changed my world because we didn't have a nanny.

Speaker 2 I had somebody to help me with housework and stuff, and somebody to help, which then turned into somebody helping with the kids while I was working in my home office. But

Speaker 2 I just remember you were

Speaker 2 this amazing bond with them, the little ones, because you were so in love with them. And you knew I could use the help.
And you found a gazillion ways to entertain them. You really did.

Speaker 2 You'd feed them, you'd bathe them, you'd help put on their pajamas, you'd take them for walks, you'd play with them in their playhouse outside, or you'd swim with them, or whatever it was.

Speaker 2 And that made, I think that not only made your bond with them so strong, but our bond so strong because you were doing something that Kendall and Kylie were out the house by then.

Speaker 2 I mean, Courtney and Kimberly were, Courtney went to college and

Speaker 1 Kim ran off and

Speaker 2 got married. And I didn't find out for a minute until Courtney found it on the internet.
So that was wild. I mean, we've been through some wild stuff together.

Speaker 2 And I think that does make a family close.

Speaker 1 Did you feel a shift of your role as a parent when my dad passed away? And if you didn't, that's not.

Speaker 2 I felt a huge shift and a huge responsibility. And now it was

Speaker 2 you have to say, okay,

Speaker 2 I'm the mom and the dad.

Speaker 2 I have to make the decisions that him and I used to make together because no matter what happened, him and I would always discuss whatever was going on with you guys and make decisions together.

Speaker 2 School decisions.

Speaker 2 I remember before he passed, he was, Rob was living with him, and we had this really crazy plan that he was going to make sure that Rob was prepared and prepped for college and for the college exams and filling out all the paperwork to get into USC and different colleges that he wanted to apply to.

Speaker 2 And I thought, oh, great, this is your lane. This is, I'm so happy this is happening.
You know, were

Speaker 2 this was early like 2003,

Speaker 2 and it was such a relief to me that he was so, you know, wanted to be there for Rob. And when he passed, I was lost.
I am not scholastic like that. I wasn't the one who was doing homework with Rob.

Speaker 2 I wouldn't know how to do high school homework. I mean, that was like so out of my, you know, realm of things that I would be good at or help somebody else.

Speaker 1 I was doing first grade homework, and I'm like, what is Singapore math? I know. Hello.
Singapore math?

Speaker 2 I don't know what that is.

Speaker 1 Exactly. Okay.
Try it. No.
I'm going to make you do it one day. No.
Like, excuse me? What happened to just regular edition?

Speaker 2 One plus one. I know.
Well,

Speaker 2 he was really instrumental in just helping your brother mature and go through those teenage years of his life.

Speaker 2 And I knew the girl thing inside and out, but the boy thing was a bit, you know, I just thought, oh, Rob's got this.

Speaker 1 Do you think that's

Speaker 1 you're more of a girl mom or a boy mom? Or can you adapt to both?

Speaker 2 I learned how to adapt to both. Yeah, I think I was more of a girl mom, right? But then Rob was the most adorable, perfect, like

Speaker 2 funny, loving,

Speaker 2 athletic. I mean, he was just everything that he was a boy, but all boy.

Speaker 1 What is your favorite stage of a kid? Like, I'm not a huge infant type of person.

Speaker 1 Like, I like infants, but I'm like, all right, can we do something? Like, I love more infants.

Speaker 2 I love the infant stage. I love the way they smell.
I love the cuddling. You guys were such angels, except Courtney.

Speaker 1 Oh, God.

Speaker 2 They were more. She just

Speaker 2 threw up on everybody. Everybody.

Speaker 2 We couldn't get that formula right. So that was challenging.
But after I got through that, I think I love the baby, baby stage.

Speaker 2 Then when they first learned to walk, that always used to be an adjustment for me because we always had stairs and, you know, a lot going on.

Speaker 2 And it was running around trying to chase four little kids around. It was nuts.

Speaker 1 I think for me, my biggest... Right now, I don't know.
I'm just, I got to get this out of my head. Okay.

Speaker 2 Is that I have this like anxiety and this buildup about the teenage stage I know what a terrorist I was as Chloe you were you were wild I know you were spicy and crazy okay this is you used to Chloe Chloe so each one of you probably had a good 18 months of hell week I called it hell week but it was really 18 months and one of the things you used to do regularly I might add was we don't have to get a we had a bedroom you had a bedroom that had a patio off of the

Speaker 1 bedroom downstairs

Speaker 1 because the other kids took my room, so I moved downstairs.

Speaker 2 Well, the babies needed to be up by us.

Speaker 2 So you're downstairs, and I think you're a pretty mature young lady,

Speaker 2 but you're also very creative and resourceful. And you used to stuff your bed as if it was a person sleeping, under the covers, lock your door, leave the room,

Speaker 2 but lock that door.

Speaker 2 and then you would leave and I don't know when you came back or how you got back in but this went on for a minute and I fell for it until one night I just thought there's no way she's this good of a kid and puts herself to bed every night at eight o'clock and doesn't come out of that room until you know seven o'clock the next morning And we had to break into your room.

Speaker 2 And that's when we found out that you had been stuffing your bed and leaving. And then another time that I still can't get out of my head, and I'm sort of like

Speaker 2 a little angry about it, is you

Speaker 1 were

Speaker 2 friends. Let's call it you were friends

Speaker 2 with somebody.

Speaker 2 And you used to cook for them.

Speaker 1 Are you going to talk about the fucking pots and pans? You took the pots and pans. I can't let it go.

Speaker 2 I cannot let it go.

Speaker 1 I will buy you new pots.

Speaker 2 I have pots and pans, but you took my favorite pots and pans from Tower Lane that I used to make. That was my pilo pan.

Speaker 2 And you took my pilo pan.

Speaker 1 What can we do? I want to make this up to you because you bring this up on a weekly basis. I know.
I can't do that. I can't do.

Speaker 2 There's nothing.

Speaker 1 Okay, so we're just going to talk about it forever.

Speaker 2 Well, we're in the right, you know, forum.

Speaker 1 This is something that. It happens once a week.
The fucking pilove pan.

Speaker 2 Okay, well, the pilo pan. So that was my favorite pan.

Speaker 1 I got to do something else.

Speaker 2 I said to you, where's my pila pan? I went to go make pilove. I made pilav twice a week.

Speaker 2 And you did not know where the pilaf magically disappears. And you were.

Speaker 1 The blue, right? Blue. Yeah.

Speaker 2 The blue pilav pan with the clear top, the clear glass lid.

Speaker 2 And I used to make my pilav, and I was so happy with that pan. Yeah.
I wore it in. It was the perfect like cookware.

Speaker 2 And you just really

Speaker 2 took my pan and I asked you, bring the pan. Just go to the guy's house and get the pan pan back.

Speaker 1 Yeah.

Speaker 2 And you just wouldn't.

Speaker 1 You just wouldn't do it.

Speaker 2 No, you wouldn't. And then, but then

Speaker 2 my phone disappeared.

Speaker 1 I feel like at the end of this episode, we should be like in loving memory to the Pilov pan.

Speaker 2 R.I.P. Yeah.
And my phone with the $6,000 bill that somebody, you loaned my phone to somebody when cell phones first became a thing.

Speaker 1 And I said, where's my phone? I just loaned somebody.

Speaker 2 You did. And I said, where's my phone?

Speaker 2 And I think so.

Speaker 1 Or somebody took it from you.

Speaker 2 that you had had a cell phone missing it was lost so now I'm looking for it I had to get a new phone and when I got the bill who has a six thousand dollar cell phone bill I'm not sure about this it was from Europe

Speaker 1 wow I'm so she somebody took

Speaker 2 I knew people from Europe somebody took 15

Speaker 2 to Europe and charged all this money on my phone and I'm like these are her friends I have so your grandmother used to say show me your friends

Speaker 2 and

Speaker 2 I'll show you who you're going to be. And I was like, these friends, they're taking the pilo pan and the phone to Europe.

Speaker 1 They sound pretty chic and cultured.

Speaker 2 They know what to take. They probably were.
Yeah, they know what to take. They probably were.
But anyway, you gave me a run for my money.

Speaker 1 I was

Speaker 1 confirming that I should be terrified of the teenage phase.

Speaker 2 Absolutely.

Speaker 1 I feel like it was always what it seemed so seamless for you. And I would love, even for myself, for the listeners out there, what are some tips? Like, how do you handle your children?

Speaker 1 Like, cause we drink together. I mean, now I'm 40, but like

Speaker 1 there is that, I would think there's that transitional period that you have to, okay, this is normal. My daughter's ordering wine at dinner, but she's of age.
Like, I don't know. Does that

Speaker 1 is, was that ever strange for you?

Speaker 2 You know what? I remember when you guys were getting a little bit older and my girlfriend used to say, she used to get so mad at me because she felt like I wasn't tough enough.

Speaker 2 I wasn't the disciplinarian that she was or that she thought was appropriate. And I would say to her, but I want to do this my way.
You know, well, these aren't your friends, though.

Speaker 2 You know, you're too much of a friend. You're not the parent.

Speaker 1 And I said, oh, no, I'm the parent.

Speaker 2 But I didn't, you know, carry these kids around for nine months in my body and then give birth to them and raise them and come this far.

Speaker 2 And now they're young adults or they're, you know, going to be a teenager soon to just let it all go and just be their parent. And then

Speaker 2 that's the end. These are going to be my soulmates for the rest of my life.
I want to be able to

Speaker 2 find

Speaker 2 our own love language with each one of my kids because you guys are all so different, but yet we have a thread. We're all so alike.

Speaker 2 And I think that that's what makes us so close: we love each other so much, but that was always the lesson. You know, I always said God first, family second, and everything else comes after that.

Speaker 2 And I taught you and raised you like that.

Speaker 2 We went to church, and we, you know, I took you to Bible study when you were a toddler and when you got a little bit older and tried to instill those types of belief and spirituality, because I think it's a huge part of growing up, and it's how we live our lives now.

Speaker 2 We believe in God, and we say our prayers, and you have Bible study at your house on Thursday nights with your kids, and all the cousins.

Speaker 2 And I think prayer is so important in our family, and we all pray a lot about everything.

Speaker 2 And I really think that's an important part of who we all are.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 2 then I think that just our love language, my love language with each one of you is just a little bit different.

Speaker 2 And I find that seeing each one of you and letting you be who you are while at the same time you know that I'm your safety net.

Speaker 1 Well, you do an excellent job at that.

Speaker 2 It's hard.

Speaker 1 It is hard, but I think the hardest part would be when your kids start dating.

Speaker 1 I

Speaker 2 think by nature, I was a very welcoming person to whoever you guys brought home. Yes.
Whether it was a stray cat or a guy from fourth grade or as you guys got older, you know, it was the dating.

Speaker 2 Suddenly you were dating. And the challenges that come with that definitely

Speaker 2 tested my,

Speaker 2 you know, ability to control my temper sometimes.

Speaker 2 I'd be so mad that you guys would try to pull the stuff that you would pull or the dating that you tried to do until I think you realized we're all good. Bring everybody here.

Speaker 2 And we became the house that everybody liked to hang out at. When you guys would become very close to somebody, we welcome them into our family with open arms.
We have the time of our lives.

Speaker 2 We're close. We have very intimate, you know, relationships with all of the people in our family and the people that you guys are dating, and it's really fun.

Speaker 2 But when you guys break up with somebody, I feel like I break up with somebody.

Speaker 1 Totally.

Speaker 2 It's so

Speaker 1 sad for me.

Speaker 2 You know, I feel like, wow, this was such a crazy time in our lives.

Speaker 2 I can't believe they're not here anymore because sometimes I get caught up in your joy or your desire to want to build yourself, your life, your family.

Speaker 2 And then when it doesn't work out, I'm heartbroken too.

Speaker 2 You know, when something breaks your heart, it breaks my heart.

Speaker 1 But it's also very forgiving because we can be like, so-and-so is a piece of shit and and did X, Y, and Z. And then we're like, we're never talking to them again.

Speaker 1 And then next week we're like, okay, we're back with this person. And you're like,

Speaker 1 okay. And here we go.
Yeah. And you're very forgiving where I would be like, I'm not

Speaker 1 going to be.

Speaker 2 You know what? It's the, what do they say?

Speaker 2 The only person when you get really angry with somebody or you get, you know, you build up all this hatred towards somebody, the only person it's really hurting is yourself.

Speaker 4 Hey, it's Gemma Speck. And if you loved hearing Chloe and Chris open up about family, life lessons, and everything in between, then you'll love my podcast, Mantra.

Speaker 4 Just like Chloe and Chris reflect on their relationship, personal growth, and building something bigger than themselves, Mantra is all about embracing change and evolving with intention.

Speaker 4 Every Monday, I break down a new mantra, something simple but powerful to help you navigate your own life transitions, whether it's in love, career, or personal growth.

Speaker 4 It's like your weekly check-in to stay grounded and reset.

Speaker 4 So if today's episode has you thinking about the lessons that shape us, tune into Mantra for fresh insights, reflections and practical takeaways to help you move forward with purpose.

Speaker 4 Mantra is an open-mind original powered by Pavit Studios and new episodes drop every Monday. Just search Mantra wherever you listen to podcasts.

Speaker 1 I remember when I was, I want to say 15, I didn't have a license yet, and I stole Bruce's expedition and I was driving on the 101 by the 405, like right where it crosses over.

Speaker 1 And it's like a little turn anyway, so I guess I swerved a little and I got pulled over. And

Speaker 1 I was wearing a really cute skirt from Forever 21. For sure.

Speaker 1 And

Speaker 1 I'll mention why I remember that skirt. And

Speaker 1 I I remember the police officer was like, what's, can I have your license and, you know, registration?

Speaker 1 And I said, oh, I don't have my license, but my name is, I think I said Courtney Kardashian, but my birthday is, and I gave Kim's birthday. So, of course, they were like, you're lying.

Speaker 1 Get out of the car. I got taken to jail.
I remember that. So I went to jail and they called you.

Speaker 1 And it was, I don't know, like nine or ten at night.

Speaker 1 And I was just, they took me there. I didn't go to jail.
Like, they took me to a precinct or whatever just until you came to pick me up. And they

Speaker 1 impounded the car. And you were like, what's wrong with you? You're dressed.
Look at this short skirt you're wearing. You look like you could have been a hooker.

Speaker 1 But this is all private. Like in front of everyone, you were like, oh, she's a great girl.
Like, you were so sweet. Like, ah.

Speaker 1 Teenagers, I don't know why she did that. Or sisters, whatever you said, they let us go like with a warning.

Speaker 1 You didn't tell Bruce that we impounded his car for 30 days and somehow we made up some story because you were like, I remember that.

Speaker 2 I remember he couldn't get the car the next day and he's like, where's my escalate? Oh, it had a scratch.

Speaker 2 I took it right to the shop.

Speaker 1 But to me, you were like, you, I can't believe you did in the car. Yeah, you were like cussing me out.
I was on punishment, but you kept it from Bruce. And I was always like, that was really...

Speaker 1 nice of you. That was really cool of you that you did that.

Speaker 2 You guys showed me a lot of respect.

Speaker 2 So even though you were probably shaking because that was a horrible thing to go through and scared of what I might do or how I would react, you know

Speaker 2 my

Speaker 2 temperature. You know, you know that when I get really mad and get in the car, you know, you're dead, get in the car, I'm going to get it.

Speaker 2 You know that I don't mean any of that. You just know that because you know me, your mom.
And I'm going to get in the car and we're going to laugh about it one day.

Speaker 1 Did you ever think you would be working with all of your children and not only working with them, but because it started out the clothing stores and us working together, but then

Speaker 1 managing like their careers and everything and basically guiding their futures?

Speaker 2 I think the way that our lives unfolded

Speaker 2 is one of the best things that

Speaker 2 I've ever, I could have ever dreamt of. And it was like the perfect storm.
And did I see it coming? No.

Speaker 2 I think the way it all unfolded was

Speaker 2 the perfect storm, and I think that it was started out because I needed to pay the bills and it ended up because we're working with our favorite people and having the time of our lives.

Speaker 2 To this day, I get excited about getting up in the morning and what we're going to do today because I feel like every day we have a different job or we're working for a different company.

Speaker 2 You know, we're always filming our show, and

Speaker 2 they're right over there, those Kardashian people, the filmers.

Speaker 2 But I can't, I guess I could never also have imagined it to even include another generation, which is so amazing.

Speaker 2 Like now my grandchildren get to shoot with us or film with us, or even just if they don't want to film, be in the room. Like it's the kind of thing where we can all work together.

Speaker 1 I also think our dynamic at the beginning, like it was challenging.

Speaker 1 I know more so for Court and I to

Speaker 1 for you to be our manager at first because we were like, What are you talking about? Like, you're not going to boss us around. Like, we were like, What? We don't even want to do this.

Speaker 1 Like, at first, when you guys were like, When you and Kim were like, We're going to film a show, and you guys have to be on it. Court and I were like, No, we're not.
We don't want to be on this show.

Speaker 1 You know, you guys were like, No, you're going to be on the show.

Speaker 2 Yeah, we're on the show.

Speaker 1 And we're doing a show, and it just sort of happened. And you were like, It's only going to be one season, it's not a big deal, just do the show.
And we just did it.

Speaker 1 But then, when you were like our manager and telling us what to do and where to go, and it was hard for us to differentiate mom

Speaker 1 and then a manager.

Speaker 2 It was hard for, I would say, the first few years

Speaker 1 to be like, okay, she's ordering me around or telling me to do this, but not as my mom. Cause we would be defensive or like,

Speaker 2 what are you doing?

Speaker 1 Like it was, I think, Kim, and you always had a very easy rapport and respect in this. And I had respect for you as my mom, but I was like, you are not my boss.
Like, that was my, yeah,

Speaker 1 just my attitude towards you until I had to realize, okay, she's, she knows what she is. This is manager, Chris.

Speaker 1 Well, I had to put you in two different categories until I think our relationship really became very seamless once I had kids.

Speaker 1 And it was always a great relationship, but the management mom role was always very hard for me to

Speaker 2 just

Speaker 1 sometimes if I wanted to talk to you about manager stuff, where's my mom?

Speaker 2 Yeah, which one is my mom today?

Speaker 1 But it would be hard, or you would want to talk about work when we're at dinner, and I'm like, no, like, that's not what I want to do right now. So, it was always.

Speaker 2 No, we had, we definitely had to figure it out. Yeah, the transition of that was definitely and when to turn it off.

Speaker 1 That was always hard for me.

Speaker 2 But I don't think I've ever learned how to turn when I get on a roll. That's always been one of my, you know, nuts.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 Well, I, it's, it's hard for me to turn things off because I get so excited about stuff and that to me is like the the you know if we're at dinner that's my dessert let's talk about that

Speaker 1 for everything in life you're a very passionate person but I just don't want people thinking oh working with family is a breeze and this it's it's not it does no no there are challenges for sure yeah all the time it takes a minute to yeah

Speaker 2 be comfortable in those roles and know people's positions and learn to to not take things so seriously and put them in that work role as you would if you had a legit boss yeah and it's hard when when i get angry at somebody if somebody doesn't show up or cancels or can't do it or doesn't want to do it or you know really fucks up i i inside i'm going crazy and then you know i'm singing stormy song patience

Speaker 2 like i'm losing my mind but on the inside and on the outside i'm trying to be you know professional, if it's a professional setting and go, okay, this is what needs to be done.

Speaker 2 Because like I said, I'm solution-based,

Speaker 2 but whether it's teaching you how to tie your shoes or teaching you how to create a new business, you know, that's, we've had so many different, I feel like I've had nine lives. You have.

Speaker 2 And all these different decades and different chapters.

Speaker 1 But I think the best thing about every one of your lives is one of your biggest strengths, I would say, and you have many, many, would be your ability to nurture and curate these relationships from every different life that you've had.

Speaker 1 And you've never let them go. And you have this Rolodex of people that you can

Speaker 1 call, rely on, ask for something, and they ask you the same. Like you've, you've really, I'm not great at nurturing relationships.
I'm like, I'm, I'm busy. I got kids.

Speaker 1 Like, I don't have time to chit chat and go to dinners and do that.

Speaker 1 And I don't know how on earth you have time, but you do.

Speaker 1 And even if you don't, you make people feel so loved and seen and that they're so important to you. And I think that's why I think that's something that people can all take away.

Speaker 1 It doesn't matter what world you're in, but whatever that world is, make sure that you do nurture those relationships and that you never burn a bridge and that every bridge you can walk back over at some point in life because we're all going to need to.

Speaker 1 And I know that when I'm like, I want to do this or let's start this business or do that, you're like, I know someone that is an expert in that field.

Speaker 1 Let me call them and let's get an advice from that. Every single person,

Speaker 2 if I

Speaker 1 could name 50 people and I know you know every single one of them or there's someone that knows that person and you can always reach out to those people. You've never burned a bridge.

Speaker 1 And I think that,

Speaker 1 and if you have burned a bridge, it wasn't worth going back over anyways. Like it's very intentional.

Speaker 1 And that is something that I really admire.

Speaker 1 And I feel, I hope that when my kids get older and I have a little more energy at the end of the day, that I will be able to do the same because it's such an amazing gift to do that because it is.

Speaker 1 It takes energy.

Speaker 2 Well, your friends are possessing your girlfriends are super important in your life. They play such a huge, important role.
And I think you don't realize that until you do get older.

Speaker 2 But I think that I think I've taught you that because you've said to me numerous times how you and your friends sit and say, I want to be like my mom and her friends because, you know, she's got these great girlfriends.

Speaker 2 And I think that's a really rich,

Speaker 2 rewarding, important part of life as you get older because you do share ups and downs.

Speaker 2 And as you get older, you lose a lot of people and you know, life gets sad at times that you didn't have those experiences when you were younger. So

Speaker 2 if you

Speaker 2 and the fact that you guys all have each other is amazing. You and your siblings are so close.
And you might be closer to one than the other through the years.

Speaker 2 You might be, you know, this year you're closer to Kim. And next year it'll be Courtney and then it'll be Rob.
And then, you know, always a different,

Speaker 2 beautiful, delicious, loving relationship. But it's always a little bit different.
And relationships

Speaker 2 change just like, you know, from time to time. They just, they, they change.
But nothing changes about the love language. You know, you find that, that

Speaker 2 really great

Speaker 2 way to be and have that relationship, at least for me, with each one of you, because you're all so different. And we have different, like, people say to me, who's your favorite?

Speaker 2 Well, today, my favorite's Chloe.

Speaker 2 Because I'm on the podcast. And we, I do have, of course, I have a favorite every, a different favorite every day.
You might be my favorite. That's weird.

Speaker 2 You might be my favorite for 30 days in a row. That's weird.
But it's not weird. It's like, oh, I'm so in love with Rob this month.

Speaker 2 Like, I'm spending all my time with Rob, and Rob and I are working on this.

Speaker 2 What are you going to do?

Speaker 1 Your favorite because you're vibing so much with Rob this month.

Speaker 2 Well, I'm just saying, favorite is a silly word. Okay.
But I mean it lightly. I mean, who am I hanging out with right now? Who am I connecting with?

Speaker 2 Who am I exchanging ideas with and creating with and being passionate with?

Speaker 2 Who wants like Kendall and I will sit and talk about design ideas because she's working on something for days, you know, or Courtney, who can't even pick a paint color, you know, will drive me up a wall because she can't get into the process of it.

Speaker 2 So I'll talk to her about something else. And I think it's really when your kids are teenagers learning how to pay attention to what their interests are and what how to help them find their passion.

Speaker 1 I have a random question

Speaker 2 For you,

Speaker 1 because

Speaker 1 you were married twice, very long-term marriages, and then you start dating. Like, how weird was that for you? Because we're adults, yes, but like, was that weird?

Speaker 1 Like, I can't seem to date because of my young kids. Like, I'm like, I don't want to expose them to that.
Right. Is it different when, because you dated after my dad to meet Bruce, obviously?

Speaker 1 What is weirder? I would think when they're adults, because they're just...

Speaker 2 Well, it's weird when they're adults, because if your adult children don't get along with your significant other or the person you're dating, it's never going to work.

Speaker 1 Was Corey not like, I'm going to, obviously, I'm sure when he met you, he knew, obviously, that you have six kids.

Speaker 2 I think three of them were with me when I, the night I met him in Spain. But yeah, I think it was pretty well known that I have six kids.

Speaker 1 And that doesn't, I mean, doesn't throw anyone off.

Speaker 2 Not throw Corey off. I think he,

Speaker 1 you know, loves

Speaker 1 hope for me yet.

Speaker 2 No, I think when you're, listen,

Speaker 2 if one of us is with a partner, we're kind of all with that partner. I mean, it's like all for one and one for all.
We all have to kind of decide, like,

Speaker 2 it would be in our family. I'm talking about our situation.

Speaker 2 I'm not saying this is the way everybody should be, but we're pretty connected and we're pretty intuitive of one another's feelings and our energies.

Speaker 2 And I think if somebody, if we feel like one of us, you know, is in the wrong relationship, we're pretty vocal about it. And I think that

Speaker 2 we know that we just want each other to be happy. And

Speaker 2 we all spend all of our time together. So for us, it would never work if, you know, there was friction with the kids.

Speaker 1 I don't remember the first time I met Corey, I just remember the first time I knew you were talking to someone, and because you were smiling and texting and being weird. And I'm like, What the fuck?

Speaker 1 I know that face. And I'm like, Who are you texting? And you're like, This guy I met.
And

Speaker 1 it was just to see you that giddy and smiley and happy. It was really cute.
But I don't remember the first time I physically met him. Um,

Speaker 1 but Corey's been around for over 10 years or 10 years, almost 11 years,

Speaker 1 And he hasn't left yet with all of our craziness.

Speaker 2 Corey was somebody also that had been in his career, had worked with a high-profile person. And

Speaker 2 he was very well aware of how a life like this goes and

Speaker 2 all the things that came with it. And we would walk into a restaurant in another country.

Speaker 2 and walk into the, you know, the George Sonk in Paris and they would go, Corey, you know, and whisk us right back into the table that, you know, blah, blah, blah, and through the kitchen so we could get out of there.

Speaker 2 And, you know, he, you know, he knew all about security and all about all the drivers and seemed to know everybody in LA and everybody in my life. And it was a very

Speaker 2 safe feeling to be able to date someone who you didn't have to explain how our life worked. I know that's a weird thing to say, but and a very probably unrelatable

Speaker 1 thing. It was your reality.

Speaker 2 It was my reality, and I felt really comfortable with the fact that I didn't have to make excuses for our lifestyle or for the way we lived and explain it to him.

Speaker 2 He was explaining it to me, and he was making my life easier and saying, oh my God, let's do that. And then we travel really well together, and all we did was travel.

Speaker 2 We still, that's all we do is we're going here, going there.

Speaker 1 You guys do, it's amazing.

Speaker 2 And working, and

Speaker 2 he knows that if I'm going to be in another country and, you know, if we're trying to do something fun, fun, I'm still going to be working at 2 a.m. And I have to set an alarm and do this and do that.

Speaker 2 And he helps, you know, facilitate.

Speaker 1 He doesn't try to control you.

Speaker 2 He lets you be you. And he makes it easier to be me.

Speaker 1 But it is interesting that he has no kids and he's with someone that has the most kids and grandkids and we're always together. Does he ever get annoyed that we're

Speaker 1 always because... we're neighbors.
So I just walk on in and I'm like, hey, Corey, sitting on the couch eating, like watching TV. And I'm like, sorry, just walk.
I'm going to go see my mom.

Speaker 1 Like, I'm sure he's like, what the fuck? Can someone? He doesn't care. He never says he does.
He's never, he would never.

Speaker 1 Deep down, he's like, Yeah.

Speaker 1 The fuck?

Speaker 2 No, he's he's proud of you guys. I mean, he's been around long enough to see, you know, a lot of the things that you guys do and how passionate you are and how hard you work.

Speaker 2 And, you know, nothing's handed to you. Nothing.
And he sees and respects that and talks about that and just admires how much everybody has so much just focus and vision and creativity.

Speaker 2 And I think that anybody who's watching from the inside, which is very few people, get to really see how we are day to day.

Speaker 2 And I think it is amazing for somebody like him to sit back and say, wow,

Speaker 2 this is incredible.

Speaker 1 I have a very serious question. What? Oh, God, what?

Speaker 2 Who's my favorite?

Speaker 1 No. Okay.
I wouldn't ask such a thing. Uh-huh.

Speaker 1 What makes a great martini?

Speaker 2 Oh, now we're talking. Yeah.
Now you've got my number. Yeah.
A great martini is shaken, not stirred.

Speaker 1 Okay.

Speaker 2 It's putting

Speaker 2 a generous amount of vodka in a metal martini shaker with about six ice cubes.

Speaker 1 Six.

Speaker 2 Shake, shake, shake until it's freezing cold.

Speaker 2 Straining it into the glass. You don't always need to strain.
If I'm in a hurry, you pour it directly into the glass, two olives,

Speaker 4 and enjoy.

Speaker 1 It's just a glass of vodka, that's

Speaker 1 what it is.

Speaker 2 Well, it's typically with vermouth.

Speaker 1 Right, but yours is straight up.

Speaker 2 Mine, it's straight up. But if you go to a restaurant and say, I want a martini, they're going to say, Do you want blue cheese or regular?

Speaker 1 Gross. And you just.
I don't like blue cheese.

Speaker 2 You want regular.

Speaker 2 At least that's the way I drink them.

Speaker 1 Yours is just vodka. Just say, can I have a shot of vodka? That's what I would say.
No,

Speaker 2 it's about the experience.

Speaker 2 You have to like hold the martini glass, think Frank Sinatra music.

Speaker 1 Oh, love.

Speaker 2 You know what I mean?

Speaker 2 Get into the, everything's an experience.

Speaker 1 This was an experience, just like the martini experience. Oh my God.
Thank you. Thank you.