E936 - Jessi & Mikayla, Mormon Wives, Sneaky Links w/ Chloe Veitch, Summer House & More Sonja Morgan News

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What's going on, everybody?

Welcome back to another wild and wacky episode of the Vile Files Reality Recap Edition.

Boy, do we have a banger of a week lined up for you guys?

What?

What's going on?

Wild and wacky.

I just like to make things up.

Boy, do we have a jam-packed episode for you?

The ladies of Mom Talk continue to make their presence felt on the Vile Files.

Today, we have Jesse and Michaela.

Boy, do they serve?

These bitches don't hold back.

Yeah.

I mean, they just cannot help but just like word vomit all tea constantly.

Even the show, watching the show, I'm like, okay, I'm going to do make my little batches.

I finished the whole thing.

Yeah.

Anyways, they are here.

They have a lot to say.

I'm honestly shocked about the claim that it was Michaela, Michaela.

Jesse confirmed it about how

an idea that Demi had for the end of season one that was

just

shocking.

Yeah.

Yeah.

She's producing.

She's, I mean,

there's producing and then there's craziness.

There's producing.

Yeah.

There's fully committed to the bit.

Yeah.

I'm always pro somebody who's fully committed to the bit.

So I know there's a lot to say going around, but in this single case scenario, I think the idea is definitely something worth pitching.

But there are unfortunately are layers to the committing to this bit.

There are.

I don't know if I approve of all the levels of pre-production that went into that bit that she committed to, but

I don't even know if we're allowed to laugh.

What is the internet saying over the weekend?

Are they starting to take sides?

A lot of people are ranking the wives.

I've seen that.

I see a lot of love for our girl Michaela.

Yes, Michaela's always one or two.

A star is born.

For sure.

True.

She really found her voice.

Did you see Marciano's video that he posted?

I did not.

There obviously is a lot of speculation about his involvement in this franchise.

I think what we all agree in, he seems to be kind of a loser.

A little bit of gross.

Yeah.

I mean, I think every wife has had a negative opinion of him, regardless of what Demi or Jesse or any of like the allegations or claims against him.

They're all just like, yeah, he kind of sucks.

Yeah.

But anyways, what was his video?

Well, he posted a video and he was at Swig and he was ranking the drinks that the girls made.

And he, he said, why not try some of these girls?

I mean, some of these girls' drinks.

Like he was, he was basically like saying how he feels about them through their drinks.

So when he tried Jesse's drink, he said, definitely something that I'm used to and that I like.

If I had another chance or opportunity to continue drinking this.

And then he says, I could see myself drinking this in the future.

He's talking about Jesse's swig drink.

Yeah, he's gross.

But kind of talking about her.

And then when he was drinking Demi's drink, he bleeps her name, first of all, in the video.

And then he says, no, instantly regretting it.

Wish I never took a sip of this one.

And then he spits it out and does like a ugh.

He sucks.

He does suck.

Yeah, he's like, he's just cringy.

I was like, ugh, what is this?

I mean, he clearly is trying to get clout and look at us giving it to him.

So it is working in his favor, whether people like him or not.

And he's cringy on Vanderpump Villa.

And I was kind of like, this guy.

And then to have the season two storyline, I'm like, this guy?

We're talking about this guy.

We only talked about Vanderpump Villa as it relates to Mormon housewives.

Did anything else go on?

I mean, that season has come out.

It's been out.

It's come and gone, I believe.

Do they?

Other than Mormon Wives?

I mean, I did, but that's just because my Queen Stossy was back on reality television.

So I very much like to remember.

How did you, but I mean, it's been two seasons.

It's been two seasons.

No one gives a shit.

I didn't finish it.

I didn't like it.

I haven't seen the season finale.

I don't know who got the $30,000.

Sarah can watch and finish just about anything.

I don't know what that says about Home Villa.

She can't get through it.

Yeah, I'm on like episode eight.

Nine.

What if there were human remains that were found close to Vanderpum Villa?

Would we

watch more?

Poor Taylor Swift.

Poor Taylor Swift.

She wakes up on a sunny Tuesday morning.

When she just come out, she constantly catches grenades and shrapnel from

nothing to do.

They just love to throw her name.

They just add it in the mix.

It's like there was...

What's the story?

Human remains were found just like near her house.

Less than a mile away from where she lives.

Like, we didn't need to include her name.

But a lot of people

live there.

Yeah.

Right.

Less than a mile.

It's crazy, but you know.

I bet there was someone else who lived closer than Taylor's Cliff.

It was actually in their backyard.

Probably somebody who lives there in that.

Katie Perry.

I'm just kidding.

I feel like she's going to write a banger song about it, though.

Taylor?

Yeah.

Like a missile.

Over my dead body.

They found the bodies near my house, but all I was thinking about was your body against my body.

No, someone mute her.

Cut her mic off.

I don't know.

I think it'd be a banger.

Taylor's constantly catching scrapnail, even from Justin Beldoni's lawyer, who last week tried to make some claim that, according to a trusted source, he heard a rumor that allegedly Blake threatened Taylor with releasing all of these public text messages.

A judge has stricken that down

and basically said, stop your shenanigans and tomfoolery when it comes to this case.

And I think even threatened sanctions against

the judge.

And then all the Justin sycophants and super fans are like, oh, well, the lawyer, he signed a sworn affidavit.

So he must be telling the truth.

Well, all he's telling, like the sworn affidavit that there is a trusted source, like that he has a source that he thinks he can trust and someone's willing to say this.

That's all he's saying.

So that could be literally anyone.

It could be his dog.

His dog could be the one being like, he's like, he's my best friend.

Yeah.

I heard that Taylor Swift and Blake Lively, like, gee, was going to like, that's all it is.

It's just like a, it's a source of a rumor.

I mean, didn't Blake's team also come out and be like, that's just like not true yeah yeah but then more importantly because like obviously blake's back and forth

team's gonna blake's team but like the judge is like stop this shit out he he's finally seems to be putting a stop to it but not after all the ridiculous headlines of that made it seem like it was a fact right yeah the damage is done now the damage you know listen they get what they want real quick that team they work hard and they work fast and i'll take the slap on the wrist i'm so sorry judge i mean they continue to try to bully and win this case in the court court of public opinion.

Anything new with Karen Reid going on?

Speaking of trying to win the case in public opinion?

Let me see.

I honestly have not had a moment to keep up, which is really hurtful for my soul.

But what I do know that happened is that Brian Higgins, who was like texting with Karen Reed, had a little something, something going on.

Well, he never texting Brian Higgins.

Well, they were texting each other.

He was responding.

So

she wasn't texting herself.

He was definitely responding to her.

He was texting her.

And

the night of the murder,

the night that John O'Keefe died, he didn't tell any police or anyone else that he went back to work at like two in the morning.

He went back to the police station with a duffel bag, did some things.

Uh-oh.

Didn't tell anyone he did those things.

When they asked when he, the next time he went to work, he was like, oh, like Monday morning, dude.

Like, just like, just like normal workday.

And like, he had like done some sketchy stuff in the police station.

Like, what?

And he didn't tell anyone.

That's just like

the last thing that's sticking in my mind from what I've seen on TikTok.

Yes, of course.

But that was like the last

stuff I paid attention to.

Still ongoing.

Yeah, listen, I think she will be acquitted.

I think every time I text Emily Baker, our unofficial legal correspondent, who, you know, I really respect, very much tries to be the legal.

correspondent that she is and stick to the facts and not not the opinions.

But I'm always like, first i when i was made aware of the case by my dear wife i was like oh my god karen rin is innocent i'm texting this to emily and emily always responds back with like a non-opinion but like also something about the case but then i text emily a couple days later and be like i think she's guilty now but i think she's gonna get off and her response was simply prosecution is a mess which i believe is kind of her agreeing with me that like she might get acquitted just because the prosecution doesn't seem to be doing their job appropriately.

The prosecution is definitely a mess for sure.

We also tried to watch Tangled this past weekend

with River and Nick the whole time was just like, God, her hair is probably so gross.

Like it just, it's on the ground.

It's probably really heavy.

It's just like, imagine how nasty it is.

The live action of Tangled is disgusting.

Can you imagine that just like

10 years of

is it though?

He's like, how you see the whole thing with Tangled.

Could you imagine just, it would be like a mop.

But it heals.

This is Nick.

While me and River are trying to enjoy a tangled, he's like, God, it's probably just really dirty.

Like, look how much it's dragging.

Well, first,

it's out the tower.

It's pulling up her mom.

It's wrapped around her shoes.

Yeah, her mom's shoes.

And God knows where her shoes have been.

I didn't really understand the plot of Tangle.

Well, Rapunzel?

It's a cartoon.

Sounds like you were a little distracted.

First of all, why aren't we calling it Rapunzel?

Because her hair is really tangly.

Yeah.

It's a tangled web of an adventure.

I don't know.

I feel like you're disrespecting Mandy more

by saying this.

You're watching the

swatts.

Exactly.

He was too focused on the hair being dirty that he didn't understand that the flower was like she was in the middle of the day.

She was like going to die, and then they gave her the flower.

But then, if she like cut her hair, then she wouldn't have the magic anymore, and no one knew what would happen to her.

Which is why Mother Gothel kidnapped her.

And keeps her in the tower.

She's going to grow old.

Yeah.

That lady is not going to be a good one.

That Mother Knows Best song.

Banger.

It's so good when it's like drama.

God.

I love Mandy more.

She's like closing all the curtains.

She's like, Mother Knows Best.

It's a funny show.

It's a funny show.

It's a funny show.

Did River like it?

You know, it's definitely more for the two of us.

She's like, not paying attention what to do.

There's still too much going on.

Try the hunchback in Notre Dame.

That really.

It's really soft.

I think if they're going to make any live-action remake, I would say, do the hunchback in Notre Dame.

Make it a better movie.

I also tried to show her Emperor's New Groove.

Not interested in that one either.

And then while I'm watching it back, I'm like, you know, it is kind of slow.

Like we do need, like, River needs the birds and the animals and the songs.

Like we have to narrate when we're watching with River.

If she's like, oh my God, the squirrels.

Wait, look at the birds.

Caw, ca.

Like, we have to, like, keep her interested, or she is in the other room.

Lama's not doing it for me.

No, llamas were not doing it for me.

Oh, my God.

Emperor's New Groove rocks so hard.

Speaking of moms and daughters.

Did you guys see that Sammy Sheen calls her sister Lola out for lying in a TikTok video and slamming her for not getting denise richards a mother's day gift this is the craziest tick to i've ever seen and i just like happened to scroll through i just wish she actually slammed her like body slam wwe style yeah it kind of honestly she could have it was verbal it was a verbal slam it was verbal and it was definitely unnecessary when she first started though i was like oh who's the tea what's the tea like and then she was just like yeah and i was in that photo too And I was like, oh, okay.

I am sad.

And then she's like, and just so you know, she's not that good of a person.

She actually didn't get our mom mom anything.

And I made the reservation.

I was like, I don't know what she invested in this.

What did Sammy get her?

She made the reservation.

That's not a gift.

I paid for everyone's food.

Lola said she was going to split the bill with me, and she didn't.

I got my mom two things of flowers and a bunch of shit from Barefoot Dreams and a very nice candle and a card.

And Lola couldn't even get her flowers.

Isn't that crazy?

But all the comments on that post were saying that she is so nice.

Okay.

But like,

Sammy's got that OnlyFans money.

Where's Lola?

Well, she was a host at that restaurant.

Or maybe she's at an ice cream shop.

I mean, I think it's great to have Jesus as your best friend, but he ain't like giving you cash.

He's definitely not paying your bills, baby.

That was really funny.

I will say, though, you know how there's always that one kid of the group that like is the one who is organizing the group gift for the parent?

Yeah.

And then there's the one.

But are any of you guys that person in your family?

It was always my oldest sister.

It was only my sister when she was trying to scam us, when she was like,

worked for like some kind of, you know, one of her many pyramid schemes or whatever.

And it was like trying to be like, mom needs makeup.

And then she would sell us the makeup and take the profits.

Yeah.

Working towards that.

Lexis.

How about my brother texted the family group chat?

Happy Mother's Day, mom.

Love you so much.

That was it.

What?

In the family group chat.

Nothing for me.

Didn't hear from him once.

And like, you could have texted her personally.

I didn't need to see that.

Also your sisters also literally what i love about that is i under i fully understood everything about his thought process which was simply like i just i need to text my mom this is the group chat she's in this group chat good great do it done done crazy

um yeah i do have to say in lola's defense though that she did post a photo of like the flowers and the card that she did get her mom so she said i did actually

i don't know why my sister decided to bring this to social media

you know lola was was like, what the heck is going on?

I didn't see me.

Well, Sonia Morgan and restaurants just do not mix.

No.

She's struggling.

She's having some time.

Something is going on.

She's having some issues with the restaurateurs.

She's drinking before she's eating.

Well, I mean, Sonia Morgan is

notorious for having a great time when she goes out.

Or before she goes out.

I'm still kind of confused by the story because she allegedly is out to dinner and then an elderly patron at a restaurant was dining who appeared to be in distress.

Like, what was the elderly person

doing?

Oh, she fell.

I don't know.

There was distress.

So apparently Sonia

called the 911, but then ended up being on the stretcher.

Yeah.

What if she just like felt so connected to this old elderly woman and she was like, she has no one to go with her to the hospital?

I'll go with her.

Empathy.

On the stretcher.

Maybe Sonia Morgan just has empathy.

Like, maybe that was it.

She's an empath.

Yeah.

It appears that she made a call, a medical call, to the restaurant.

Officers responded.

They issued a written trespass warning to Sonia Morgan at the request of the Breakers Hotel, the owner of Echo, the restaurant that they were at.

So she must have been acting up or something.

Morgan refused to sign the warning, but police were unable to corroborate that report.

I didn't want to leave.

I insisted on making sure she was cared for.

Morgan tells people about the elderly woman.

Wait, so

elderly woman falls.

I'm hearing.

Elderly woman falls.

Sonia comes to help.

Restaurants mad at Sonia.

They file trespass, not allowed to come.

Wait, where?

No, no, no.

I'm trying to help.

No, that's a different restaurant.

This is in Florida.

Why is she being accused of trespassing at a restaurant?

That's open.

They issued a written trespass warning.

So I'm wondering if maybe like...

They wrote it down?

On like a barn at the police.

The police issued it.

This is

very Florida restaurant.

But what's confusing is that it says Morgan refused to sign that warning.

So I guess you have an option when a police officer gives you a trespass warning from the hotel restaurant.

She's trying to save a life.

She's in the middle of work right now.

She's a hero.

This is a public establishment that welcomes people when they're open.

Lots of people.

But they don't want her.

I can't.

But like, but why?

I need them to release a statement.

I, I saw the video of her being cared, like, on the gurney out, and she's clearly, like, actively speaking.

So, she's not in any type of

arm, yeah, but yelling at people.

It says, Where's the elderly lady?

Where's this video?

I don't know.

Florida has a really hard time with divas.

It was just Sonia.

Sonia made the call and somehow ended up on the gurney going into the ambulance.

Diva down.

That's why Justin is bringing up this video.

I have this vision in my head.

I hope.

This is the first one.

one i think this is the pressure is that sonia that's sonia on the gurney that guy in the background looks so over this

she crying no she was just like i heard i heard giggling in the middle this is the picture of her on the gurney yeah just chilling and this is after she called the 911 her medical assistants for someone else she said oh she's fine actually let me take a little red somewhere it said that she like sustained minor injuries and that the they wanted to check her out but i'm just like i feel like that's like uh that's a hefty bill so yeah just to get checked out i will say well

wishing her the best thoughts and prayers thoughts and prayers getting into some secret lives of mormon wives the women are continuing to beef online jesse called out to me on instagram and after they disrespected her in what I'm guessing was our interview because we did have Brett and Demi together.

And Jesse says a 47-year-old washed up loser who can't hold a job and asked my husband and I for 10 grand just a few months ago so he could pay his bills.

Is like.

What does Brett do for work?

I

don't know.

I know he was on Claire Crawley's.

He was also a bachelor and was

like,

That's not a job occupation.

It's not work.

You don't think he's trying to be on reality TV.

And that's awesome, but I am just curious what he's what he's been up to.

Should have asked, I guess.

Oh, we didn't know that.

He's a managing partner at Armstrong Consulting Group.

Oh.

As per his official LinkedIn page.

It sounds like a real job.

I mean, consulting.

That was in June of 2022.

2022.

He's freelance, maybe.

Well, managing partner means he has some kind of equity or

in this company.

I mean, it could be.

I don't imagine Demi with a scrub, you know?

Yeah, I mean, they don't look like they live poor.

Yeah.

Jesse is like not afraid to call him out and say, I mean, him, if that's true, which that's a strange thing to lie about because I feel like maybe there would be receipts of that, maybe not, but I don't know.

But like to be like, hey,

he needs money from us.

And then like now.

That's a bold thing to ask your alleged co-stars for money, the same people that allegedly.

And Jesse does get into, I know it's on episodes somewhere four five and six i don't know we get into it this episode but the whole conversation about like what went down before seasons one and season two in terms of their contract negotiation jesse breaks it down in great detail uh shortly when when michaela and jesse make their appearance in this episode but wouldn't it be kind of it's like that that's the same people he went to and asked for money i mean what i learned in this season of secret loves and warm-wise is that jesse's a millionaire and she's sitting on a hair empire

like they use the M word.

They did.

Yeah.

The M word, millionaire.

Oh, I thought you're going to say mogul.

I mean, millionaire is that, but that we could, we could throw that in there.

Okay.

For sure.

Well, they do have a new intro to the show.

It is very iconic.

I saw Taylor Frankie Paul's little BTS she posted.

Iconic.

So good.

Jesse and Layla don't get their hair wet, which I feel like if I'm production, I'm fighting them on that.

I'm saying, listen, I see the vision at the end.

You want to get your hair wet.

Don't be the only two that.

Jesse sent a video.

She had a video.

Jesse sent a video.

She's.

I do have it.

We have her response.

Well, because when we interviewed Jesse and Michaela, we were, there was so much.

Honestly, we went in with so many questions.

We didn't even get to most of them because they were just serving up.

And then, and this, and oh, by the way,

oh my God.

No, it's even on the docket.

Okay.

Okay.

So we've asked Jesse to respond to this question on why she did not get her hair wet in the intro, and she has sent us a response.

So should we play it now?

Yeah.

Okay, you guys, I was just as surprised to see that Layla and I had dry hair in the intro because we all got wet.

I was actually the very first one to film our intro, and I was like the guinea pig.

So I was like getting my hair in there, flipping it around.

I actually have so many videos of having wet hair.

And if you look at the poster, we all had wet hair.

So I don't know.

It's kind of funny because everyone's like, they're just divas and they didn't want to get their hair wet.

Trust me, if that was the case, they would have just been like, sorry, you're getting your hair wet.

We don't have that kind of stuff.

So, yeah, I did get my hair wet, but maybe I just looked so stunning gorgeous with dress

time to like leave it that way.

Literally, Jesse.

But no, we definitely had to do some work.

Layla, it was actually really funny because her hair is naturally curly and they were nervous that if she got her hair wet, her extensions would be just kind of wavy and wet and her own hair would curl up.

And so we had to get like lube and lube her hair down.

That's like a little hairstylist trick and put lube in it to make it look wet instead of getting it actually wet.

And then they got her extensions wet.

So a little BTS, but maybe it just didn't look as good as they were wanting.

And that's why they kept us both dry.

I'm not sure.

I'm going to have to ask and find out because I was curious about that too.

Okay.

Well,

it's funny that she says that because I thought about that on the poster.

I was like, wait, all of their hair is wet.

So I wonder if they were like, no, girls, it's fine.

We'll go and post and give you wet hair.

And I was like, but how did they do that?

They lubed her up.

Jesse, thank you for coming through this morning and uh picking up for what we failed to do when you first showed up and asked that question i'm glad we were able to get it me too because i also was like these bitches just didn't want to get their extensions wet because i've had extensions once or twice in my life before and i know how much of a bitch it is to like once you get them wet and like the whole drying process and i was like listen honestly i get it but i am shocked that production wasn't like girls trust get them wet and they did so that's so strange that they didn't use why would they make the two of them that is weird production choice

do you think someone accidentally like deleted the footage of like the wet shots they're like

it's kind of almost like there's just no real good explanation for why they wouldn't do that or like it wasn't in focus or scrolling that whole time yeah maybe they were like let's um let's create some discourse the person yeah the person in charge of the it'll be great intro is like kind of pissed at jesse and liila well we i told you we have a jammed pack episode for you today because coming up next chloe veach is with us who's hosting a new Netflix show, Sneaky Links, a show about maybe falling in love with the person you don't want anyone to know you're having sex with.

So I'm not sure how that all is going to work out.

It's a crazy concept.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Look, I see the vision.

You know what I'm saying?

But like, I don't see it executing.

They don't want people to know they're having sex with them.

I want to know how they got them there.

It's like, did you tell, did they go out to the person that's hiding them and be like, you're on a new dating show?

We're not going to tell you who, what, when, but when you get there, surprise.

Anyways,

I want to know: could you potentially sneaky link with someone else's sneaky link?

I don't know.

I'll have to ask Chloe Veach.

We'll have to ask Chloe who is up next.

And then, after Chloe, we'll break down a summer house breakup heard around the world between Lexi and Jesse.

Get into Mormon Wives, and then the interview.

Certainly, many of you have been tuning in for with Jesse and Michaela.

But coming up next, Chloe Veach.

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Chloe, welcome back to the show.

Thanks, Nick.

So great to have you.

Thanks for having me.

We're very excited about the new show on Netflix you're hosting.

Yeah, can you imagine?

Sneaky links.

We can.

Sneaky links.

Help us, for the people who may not know what a sneaky link is.

Yeah.

First, help us understand what that is.

Okay.

And then explain us.

The only concern we have is how are people who don't want people to know that they're hooking up with someone?

What are the possibilities they're going to want to do it on TV?

Okay, so I can't physically give any spoilers, but I'm going to spoil it right now.

Perfect.

They do.

They hook up, even if there's cameras.

They love sneaking.

So the definition of a sneaky link for me, the easiest way I can explain it was, and is,

you know, when you don't want anyone to know that you're in a relationship with someone or that you're hooking up with someone, it could be a six-month period of you've had sex with them a couple of times, or it could be a 10-year period of.

There's a couple on the show that was sneaky linking for 10 years

and like why why were they sneaky because of the lack of boundaries like he didn't want to be with her and she's very much like okay well i'm just gonna continue this because it's easy to do it and i think as women it's so easy to fall into something like that they would crawl from room because it's in a motel so they're in each other's room well they're in their own rooms and then they'd come out and they'd sneak away from their sneaky links and go meet up with other people in the motel and like crawl across like army crawl style crazy yeah and we're gonna see it you're gonna see all of it

and what and were you helping facilitate these hookups

i mean my job as the host was just to be there as the big sister okay like if if he if he hurts you or upsets you babe come here yeah i'm literally a veteran at dating shows at this point i understand your struggle i understand your pain come cry on my shoulder It wasn't my job to direct what they should do if that was to happen

because there's no way I would get sued.

It would be a HR issue because all the guys were really, really hot.

All the guys were hot.

All of the guys, yeah.

Wow.

Yeah.

Did you like find

yourself being like, Should I go into room AC really quick?

Funny you say that because Chloe's army crawling.

Me.

You're like, there's a lot of women army crawling.

I don't know what they're doing, but it was really crazy.

Yeah, Chloe.

Wow.

why is she wearing a bow blonde wig

i it was very hard for me to transition mentally like on set from talent to host because i've literally been talent for so long and now i'm like oh no they look to me now

and i need to tell them what to do

you're like babe and i will and i will suck them and i would that's what i would do

you know i love you we need to be friends.

Yeah.

That's what you tell her.

There was a couple of times I said to some of the executives, would it be like a violation if I was to like, obviously, if they ended up with no one at the end, if I was to get their number?

Yeah, it's like a power dynamic there.

And they were like, probably couldn't, you probably couldn't do that, Chloe.

And I'm like, just.

double check it.

How about if you have a DM if they slid into my DMs?

You don't think that, but could you just go ahead and actually ask the lawyers

and make sure I can't.

Yeah.

Because if I can, I'm going to.

If it's not in writing,

I can do what I want.

Where did Sneaky Links film?

So they filmed it in Scottsdale, Arizona.

Oh, correct.

Boiling.

I actually had heat exhaustion one of the days.

Oh, God bless.

Yeah,

it was a lot.

God bless Arizona.

And God bless.

Do we have a preview of this trailer?

Do we play a trailer?

When's it come out?

The 21st of May.

Oh, wow.

Comes out tomorrow, guys.

It comes out tomorrow.

Tomorrow.

Oh, my my gosh.

Alright, let's check out the trailer of sneaky links.

I am so ready to be in love.

I'm ready for something real.

I'm moving out of my whole phase.

I'm trying to find true love.

What is he doing here?

What's up, people?

It was a high school thing.

I thought I was going to see a whole new set of singles.

You have been bought here with the person that you love having casual sex with.

AKA, you're Sneaky Link.

This is gonna get messy for sure and quick.

I'm helping you explore your Sneaky Link relationship in a deeper way.

But it's okay for you to explore other connections if you're curious.

This is a disaster.

It's a disaster.

Would you like to come over?

Holy smokes.

They're all hot.

Smoking.

She's giving me zero attention.

If he won't, someone else will.

She's actually kind of cute.

Kelsey didn't only step on my toes.

She came for my neck.

I came in with some habits that I needed to break.

Some of you have made crazy progress, and I can see that there are romantic sparks flying.

I kind of want Cole.

I'm not here to make friends.

Oh, f.

We are in trouble.

Wait, I can already see like the people who

have been sneaky linking for a while.

They go here.

They imagine to like continue to sneaky link.

And then their guy is like off with another girl.

I'm pissed.

Yeah.

No, literally.

I have quite a couple questions after seeing that.

One, are any of the men

the ones who wish they could be in a relationship that are being hidden?

Is it, is it, yeah, they are.

There are some men.

There are some sad, sad boys.

And I think that's why I was so intrigued because I haven't seen it from that side.

I thought it was going to be the women that are like, I want you to marry me.

Like the ultimatum.

Love is blind.

Out there in the wild.

How many sexual partners did the person who have the most sex have on the show?

Like, I don't mean coming into the show.

I mean filming the show.

Like, how many?

Like, they bounced around.

Yeah.

How, what was the most sexual partners one person had?

I think three.

Wow.

Question.

For the casting process, like, how did you, how did they get their sneaky link?

Or like, how did they get the person that was hiding them to come on the show?

So I was worried about this.

Yeah.

And I feel like from an audience perspective, it's always like, well, how did they not know?

This is lies.

Like, what?

Like, too hot to handle after the first season.

You're going to know it's too hot to handle.

I went on X on the Beach MTV.

And before that, I kind of knew already what X's were coming on because I would call them and be like, oh, by the way, I'm going on the show.

What are you doing in a month?

Yeah, literally.

So I was worried about that because I thought I want it to be natural, whatever.

But the casting process took a year.

Really?

So they were constantly like, because I even spoke to them just to understand how it worked, but they, they picked.

five or six sneaky links from each person they wanted to be an original on the show and then they would vet them for months and months and then it would be like so carefully curated that none of them actually knew it was like genuine shock and surprise some of them didn't even want to continue filming when it was like i do not want this i did not come here for this when their sneaky link showed up yeah oh that's

because they've been like

you can know that because they've been terrible to that person but it's not an edge i did not send him to get exposed did any of them have like relationships and they were like cheating cheating on that relationship with this sneaky link and maybe that relationship ended or something?

Like, was there any of that kind of canoodling going on?

I don't think necessarily that exact scenario.

Scenario, but the morals, the values, the boundaries, and everything in between, everything's bled.

From your perspective,

how many of the people who didn't want to date their sneaky link didn't want to date them because they didn't perceive them to be their physical match or equal?

Quite a few of them.

Yeah.

That's maybe the number one reason, do you think, from your perspective?

That was very hard to watch because no one wants, listen, exes and sneaky links completely different.

An ex is someone that you've introduced to your family, you've gone out into the wild with them, you've posted them on social media, and then all of a sudden it's like sneaky links.

You don't want anyone to see them.

It's like there's a reason you don't want the world to know that you're together.

Right.

So, yeah, it does get messy.

I cried multiple times.

Crying.

Yeah, because it's just, it's hard.

Because as a woman, it's like, and especially as a guy as well, but I've got a vagina.

So as a woman, I've been through, it's so relatable because I've been through every single fucking scenario that's on the show.

You want to be like, come here, it's okay.

Please, just leave him.

Did you really learn anything from watching the show, or is it just a fun, hot, messy mess?

I wouldn't have gone on the show as a host if it wasn't.

adding some value to like relationships as a whole because otherwise I would literally just break boundaries and do whatever I wanted to.

You would have joined the cast.

Yeah, I literally would have joined the cast.

Spicy Murray is the relationship expert.

So she is someone who has a method that she brings people on the show with me and she sits down and we have this like link lowdown at the end of the episodes.

And she like rips them a new butthole.

She's like, this is what you're doing wrong.

You're breaking boundaries.

You're pressing her buttons.

This is toxic.

This is what you need to change.

This is what you need to do.

So yeah, you do, you do learn.

That was some growth.

Okay.

Yeah.

Okay.

Oh, I'm so growth in all areas.

Did you watch Temptation Island?

Yes.

And I watched the whole of your reunion episode.

Oh, did you?

Yeah.

Yeah.

What did you think?

How do you think this compares to that?

Because that was a massive smash hit.

Particularly around the messiness.

Yeah.

I think

two completely separate shows.

Two completely different shows.

The same kind of blueprint in dating, but Temptation Island.

Oh my God.

I loved it.

I binge-watched it in, I think, less than two days.

I didn't sleep.

Oh my god, yeah,

I loved it, but I was angry.

Yeah, whilst watching it, I'm like,

we'll wait to the angriest.

Rhythmic water slapping, literally.

That'll get you.

That'll get you every time.

Yeah.

Him in the shower with the, and they didn't have the camera for the threesome, and all it said was rhythmic water slapping.

Oh, really?

All I heard was the birds chirping.

Oh, no, no, no.

The sun's come out.

Yeah.

and then they're all like all right bye yeah

yeah no literally but i think with that show the the pain point was oh if this was my boyfriend i would be fuming whereas with sneaky links the pain point is oh my god this is what i do in the outside world and this is why i haven't found love yet right so like this

may be of a mirror for people watching yeah there's different pain points in different shows where what did you think about yourself after hosting the show have you ever been a sneaky link or sneaky linked Yeah.

I mean, I've been a sneaky link.

No, I have, I've never been the sneaky link, I don't think.

You'd be surprised.

There's no way.

You'd be surprised.

They're all like, we're dating.

She's like, God, no, please, please.

No, I'm not.

Please.

No, you can hide behind the plant.

So you've hidden a boy before?

Yeah.

Why?

And a woman.

When I first was like, I think I'm by,

it was a sneaky linky relationship.

It lasted a year well that makes sense yeah but I learned a lot from that because now I understand that I shouldn't have done that but yeah sneaky linking it's it's not the way forward was it hard this to to host this kind of show like did you find yourself kind of picking and choosing your favorites yeah I mean a few people did grow on me on the show only from like a storyline perspective though because when you're

Like I respect someone's craft.

And by craft, you mean how they're able to manipulate?

I think the way that they're able to direct themselves in a narrative of, okay, I know that the show is about sneaky links and growth.

And I feel like some of the men did have a lot of growth.

A couple didn't, you know?

Yeah.

Which one did you want to have sex with?

Again.

Again, I feel like HR.

HR possession, you know.

In your head, not in reality.

I think everyone would want to have sex with the same person.

So you watch it.

You would probably want to have sex with the same person that I do.

Was he the toxic one or the one who learned?

Oh,

he's the toxic one, yeah.

Okay.

Okay.

But I'm in therapy.

Thank God.

Okay, I'm in therapy.

And because of this show, I want to go to college.

Really?

I want to study psychopaths.

No more.

No more TV.

I'll be in your doctor's office.

I'll see you in July.

So, what do you want to go to school for?

I want to study psychology.

Oh, cool.

Yeah.

I want to learn the brain of the toxicity.

The difference between sociopaths, psychopaths, narcissism, gaslighting.

I know that the last time we had a conversation about that when I was on the podcast.

Oh, did I?

Gaslighting is such an overly used term.

Buzzword.

It frustrates him.

I love it.

Every time I bring it up.

It's going to sound like when people water down the meaning of meaningful words.

Yeah.

You know, because

they do exist.

Not everyone who made you mad is a narcissist.

Yeah.

And I think I'm starting to learn that.

I'm like, oh, he didn't.

Okay.

He's probably not textbook.

Selfish?

Possibly.

Yeah.

For sure.

Just a terrible person.

For you.

But not for everyone else.

Who knows?

Because I'm biased.

His mom might think he's great.

Yes.

What else have you been up to?

What have I been up to?

I literally moved to America.

Oh my God.

I live here now.

Welcome.

Yeah.

Thank you.

Have my 0-1 visa.

You can't get rid of me for three years now.

Well, thank God.

I have been learning the ropes of America and dating and finding my feet.

Have you found yourself at a raisin, Keynes?

Oh, yeah, every Wednesday.

Perfect.

What is the biggest difference dating in America versus dating in the UK?

I feel like men in America are very

straightforward in the beginning.

They're like, oh, I love you.

Like, you're so good looking.

Like, oh, I'm going to treat you like a queen.

I'm a gentleman that you've always needed.

And then a month down the line, you're like,

he's not called me in two days.

What's going on?

So I think the men in the UK are very hard to get, but the men in America are very easily,

they approach you quicker.

It's like called love bombing.

Nick's like, stop.

You're saying, sorry about your buzzwords, but

they're like, everything, I want to put you on a pedestal.

I love you so much.

And then go.

If you're saying I love you with the intent to get laid

and you don't, you know, yeah, kind of.

Can you fall in love and fall out of love that quickly?

Well, I think there are people who just get excited and are emotionally immature and they actually maybe think they're in love.

Yeah.

And then like a week later, like, oh.

I guess I just want to have sex with you.

What is the most American thing you've been doing since you've been here?

The most American thing, driving on the opposite side of the road.

Bloody hell.

The first six months, I was petrified.

We're going into ongoing traffic.

Getting all y'all wrong.

Getting in the wrong side of the car every time.

My friends are like, what are you doing?

You guys in, what, Libya?

There's like two countries.

Libya or Libya.

There's an African country, I believe, that drives on the wrong side of the Libya.

Major or menorah?

What's menorah?

But you guys are the odd man, huh?

The inner, I believe.

Labia menorah, I believe, is the inner.

The country.

Oh, well.

Or your vagina.

I thought we were talking about countries.

We thought you said we needed vaginas.

Nick said Libya and you said Labia?

Because there's a okay, right, I get the connect now.

Is it really only Australia in I don't even think it's Australia?

I don't think Australia drives on

the left side of the road, correct?

There's got to be more places than that.

It says United Kingdom, Australia, New Zealand, Zealand, India, Japan, and many Caribbean islands.

And I think Meiji, yeah, New Zealand does.

I've been there.

What am I talking about?

But other than that, I don't know.

I mean, are you having

chicken, a lot of sauce, a lot of all of it?

Yeah.

Yeah.

I feel like you just have to drive everywhere.

There's not really much to do.

So wait, wait, back to the British boys.

Like they just, they're, are they mean at first?

Are they hard to read?

Hard to read, mean.

And it stays pretty consistent.

So, so what I'm hearing is the UK men are just up front sucky.

Yes.

And the American men pretend not to be sucky at first, but then you eventually find out they're also sucky.

Yes.

Okay.

Yes.

So all of them just suck at the end of the day.

Only the ones that I've met.

Okay.

How many do you feel like you've met personally in your go-round?

Do you know what?

I think

I don't.

Okay.

In the in general, as a whole, or just in America?

Because this is a very, very broad question.

I think as a whole okay all of them um i've met a few yeah yeah quite a few i think yeah it's almost like homework for me well back to school

exactly i need to understand the the minds of men um one thing if i had children i would definitely say travel the world date men have sex with a condom obviously but with you don't have to wait months to have sex with some i don't think you know you're you're like do you feel like that messes with the chances of maybe having something?

Because I know a lot of women are always like, oh, you can't have sex the first day.

They'll think I'm easy.

They won't want to date me.

Like, do you think that's valid?

Or do you think that's all in our women's heads?

No, I think

50-50.

I think it all depends on the vibes of the date.

I mean, if you're emotionally mature enough to understand that you're an adult, he's an adult, you're vibing, he's sexy, you're sexy, and it's like, okay, this is, I just want to have sex with you.

I think you're allowed to do that.

You're an adult as long as as it's consensual.

But then on the flip hand, if it's like you, just me, I'm going to talk on my perspective, me going out there and just being like, I just want to have sex with everyone.

I'm allowed to do that.

But is it going to be perceived as,

okay, she probably doesn't

want something serious?

Yeah.

I don't know.

It's valid.

Yeah.

Yeah, that's valid.

Nick, what's your take on that?

I think timelines are useless.

I think a guy will wait.

Guys love a goal.

Give him six months.

He'll wait six months.

Give him two days.

He'll wait two days.

I think if you're six to eight.

I think if you, like you said it perfectly, if you want to have sex, you should have sex because that's how you're going to get a sex.

If you're having sex because you think he'll like you more, he won't.

No.

He never will.

Definitely not.

He'll like you more by not having sex.

Once he has sex with you, he's like, oh, I guess I just wanted to have sex with you.

Yeah.

Men don't know that until after they have sex with you, but they think they're interested until they're in to it.

Kind of.

You know, they just

know that thing I was

future

won't be a second date, like just chick-checking the oil.

They're like, nah, no, no, not gonna happen.

That's so, and that can happen even if you make them wait six weeks or six dates.

Yeah,

honestly, I think what we've learned is men are disgusting.

Yeah,

honestly,

and we are just so lovely.

You know what I'm saying?

Women are so

attractive

and sexy.

Yes.

And

we smell good.

We do.

We have soft, supple skin.

Only if we moisturize.

Mine's pretty scaly right now.

I'm not going to lie.

But you smell amazing.

Do you know what expectation I hate?

And I want to know about you girls, right?

I shave every two days.

Sorry, Nick.

Women conversation.

No, because like he's used to it.

CMI shaving.

That seems like a lot.

Sometimes I guess no, because I get

hairy.

Oh, yeah.

Like my legs, my hair's like black.

I've only got highlights.

You're preaching to the choir.

Yeah.

Breach into the choir.

So I have to shave all the time.

I'm like, ah, no.

Nick will make like,

if I do this, will you shave your legs yet?

Or no?

Oh.

Not that it's a negotiation compromise.

It's like, if I go and get you a coffee this morning, will you maybe shave your legs when you take a shower?

Or no?

I'm like, I don't think today is the day for that.

I'll try again tomorrow.

But okay, make sure it's iced.

Yeah, you shave every two days.

I have to.

And that's the expectation that you hate?

Is that like to be like, yeah, the dolphin?

If my armpits get a little bit hairy, I'm like,

if I want to go to a club and I put my hands up, people are going to look at me and be like, oh, shavana, shabana.

But then should I care?

No.

Why do I care?

I don't know.

Because we're conditioned.

We're all conditioned that way.

I saw a TikTok of a man.

He said, I'm sick.

He said something about like

women always being like, oh, I haven't shaved.

I haven't shaved.

And he was like, I eat the sticker on an apple.

You do.

It's so true, though.

Y'all don't care.

So, like, you know?

Yeah.

Why do I care?

I don't.

Nick made me get a massage once.

They hate you.

He told me.

No, he did.

Also, get that massage.

I was like, that's a great, that's a great thing to do

to do.

But he didn't tell me that it wasn't a massage.

It was a lymphatic stretch.

So

me and my bush walked into that room and she had my leg all the way up here and my bush was in her face.

So that's something that we as a couple did have to work through.

I actually walked in on my mom giving my neighbor a full-on Brazilian wax.

Neighbor?

When I was younger.

Oh my God.

And I thought, oh, my mom's, she's lesbian.

She's cheating on my dad.

She's gone to her.

She's got her face because my neighbor was like laying on the couch, legs up.

My mum was like

down there.

I walked in.

I must have been six years old or something.

And I've walked out and gone, oh no.

I'm like, planning the divorce.

My dad's going to leave and this is going to happen.

You know, when you're a kid and you're sat in your bedroom and you're like, oh no, I've got the weight of the world on my shoulders.

Dad's house.

What am I?

Am I going to tell him?

Yeah.

Who's going to take the dogs?

The neighbor's like,

oh, no, they're having so much fun in this.

They were literally crying.

The funny thing is, I only brought it up to her a little while ago.

I was like, mum, because I'm in therapy.

I said, that was a very traumatizing moment for me.

And she said, obviously, I kind of knew that she was just waxing her vagina, but she went, oh, I didn't actually realise that you'd walked in.

Otherwise, I would have like said something.

I said, yeah, that was a bit weird that you didn't say anything, but she didn't know that I'd walked in.

She was so just knee-deep

in the cooch.

She didn't realize you had entered the room.

You're like, and neither did the neighbor.

You're not making eye contact with your mom at dinner.

You're like,

maybe that's why I shave.

Because I'm scared.

You don't want anyone to think you're cheating.

No, they've cracked the goat.

Just get laser.

It looks like a very fun show, and we're excited that you are a part of it.

It's Sneaky Links.

It's out tomorrow on Netflix.

Check it out.

If you are in the mood for some scandalous dating hookups, some secrets some sneaky links this is the show for you and congratulations on hosting the show very cool experience oh i appreciate you guys what's that call like i cried like first of all i didn't even think i was going to get it like one of the execs from netflix called me and he's like chlo

because over the years they've pitched loads of shows they're like we want you to do this we want you to do that and it gets to a point where you become disheartened you're like it's just never going to happen okay whatever i'm just going to start waxing vaginas i got a call and they said chloe we've got a show it's like in development right now we want you to be the host and i'm like okay but then i didn't get too excited a couple weeks later they were like okay the date's locked in then the negotiations started happening like i haven't been paid as much as i've been paid from any show even combined to host so now i'm like

okay

I think I could do this forever.

You know, I'm a Netflix employee.

Yeah.

I'm part of the bus.

Exactly.

Yeah.

And then it must be cool because obviously Netflix has a plethora of

talent that I'm sure many of them were, you know, I mean, come on, you got it.

Like you're competing a little bit with your peers is what I'm saying.

And like you, you know, you're not.

It's always like a, it's always like a motivation.

Many of them wish they would have gotten, you know, right?

I mean, I did get that envious feeling when Melinda done

her dating are related and I was like, oh, I would love to do that.

No, envy isn't the right word.

It's almost like,

oh, wow.

Like, because motivation.

Yeah, it was motivating because no one had ever done it before.

No one's ever really been talent tent host on Netflix.

Now there's a couple people, and now I am.

I'm like, oh, okay.

I just hope it gets the second season.

So please watch it, guys.

Please watch it.

Stream, stream, stream, stream, stream.

All right.

Well, watch it.

Check it out.

Sounds like you guys are going to love it.

We're excited to watch it.

It's out tomorrow.

Chloe,

other than on Netflix, where can people find you?

You can find me on Instagram, TikTok, Chloe Veach.

I don't know.

V-E-I-T-C-H.

Well, thanks for coming, Chloe.

Thank you.

Okay.

Well, questions asked and answered.

If nothing else, I think it's going to be hot people hooking up.

So I'll be watching this.

This is always beautiful.

You know,

let's do Summer House.

Did Lexi carry this season?

Yeah.

Loki.

She gave us the drama.

Honestly.

Yeah.

If it wasn't for Lexi, we wouldn't have the drama with Sierra and Jesse.

I mean, Sierra, Jesse, West, Jesse.

Like, I'm like, I'm just like, there's just like, it's not even like that, there's like atomic bombs being blown up, it's just like little fires everywhere.

Yeah, do we care about anything else?

Not really.

No, why?

There hasn't been really any other interesting storylines.

Well, we had the like Paige and Craig breakup kind of in the beginning, but then it's like that storyline's completely dropped off.

Did you catch what she said in this episode?

And she's like, I'm in a happy, healthy relationship.

I didn't hear that.

I was like, oh, great.

I just never see him.

Yeah.

Well, we did have Lynn.

I feel like the moment where Lindsay brought up her anniversary of her breakup post.

She activated.

Either it was the producers going to Lindsay or Lindsay going to the producers and being like,

I just give me this.

I just, I've been living in a room, not being a part of the season, doing absolutely nothing.

Or maybe the producers are like, hey, you know, like...

Can we get a little something from you?

I know you're like, you know, all about happy, healthy, Lindsay, keeping your peace.

Can you just be petty for no reason for a second?

I mean, completely, we agree this is like an absurd video for her to post.

The caption was absolutely absurd, but it kind of like feels like she,

I think she's completely over Carl, but I don't think she's over like just taking the jobs at Carl because I'm like, what other reason are we doing?

Maybe, maybe gender reveal.

Maybe so.

Also, scavenger haunt.

West has never been more afraid for his life when he was like, I read your post.

And she was like, okay.

And he was like, I didn't see it, but I.

I read it.

And she was like, so you didn't see it, but you read it.

And he's like, well, I didn't.

And she's like, is there something you want to say?

He's like, well, no.

Literally, literally, like, he was a panic.

Well, let me ask you this.

What's the line of

fucking move on versus, you know, you get to keep talking at some point?

And as someone, I'm just saying, I know what it's like to be Carl.

Yeah, like, I felt bad for Carl at the dinner where I'm just like, first off, you brought the sandwiches.

And she's like, I brought better sandwiches.

But like, Lindsay is pregnant with someone else's child.

And Carl did do her a favor.

And Carl, despite her hating it in the moment and her graciously coming on this show to talk mad shit about Carl post-breakup, which we all appreciated, she should be thanking Carl in a genuine way, not in a petty sort of like, I move on despite.

I don't think she's in a genuine place quite yet.

Whatever.

She doesn't have to really think she does.

The reality is that she is having someone else's baby.

That wouldn't have happened if it weren't for Carl, like maybe seeing the light.

All that being said, like, I'm just saying I know what it's like to be Carl and having people just like not get over the fact that someday in this lifetime, you two had some kind of connection and that connection's fucking over.

And maybe we can just move on and maybe you can find a different way to get engagement or clicks.

I'm just saying I know what it's like and it's pretty fucking annoying.

But also, you do have to put in context that this is

a year, less than a year after the breakup.

It was a year.

A year.

I mean, but they, but they've been filming before this episode for a while.

So it was less than a year that she's been like back living with her ex-fiancé.

I'm sure she's re-triggered by a lot of things.

It's only been less than a year.

But she hasn't given birth yet.

She hasn't like had that connection of like, oh my God, this is like what I was carrying.

I can't even think about my life before now having held this baby.

She's kind of like back living with her ex, back getting re-triggered by like everything he did.

It was only like

10, 11 months ago.

If I'm the new boyfriend, hate it.

I'm, I'm gonna.

Well, Turner seems to be very chill.

Yeah,

so maybe you know i kind of agree with nick here in the sense that i'm like we made choices i don't think that anybody should have to not be on this show based off of an ex or based off of a relationship or it's anybody's responsibility but you did make a choice to come on and spend your pregnant summer with the ex-fiancé who you claim to have humiliated you so i'm like it just seems like these are just like a dig after dig, week after week of like, how do I make Carl uncomfortable in this house?

I love it.

And I'm just like, I don't, I just, it's, it's kind of me.

It's funny.

It is.

Well, it's also like Lindsay's when the reveal of Lindsay like coming back pregnant with another guy's baby to her ex-boyfriend Carl and living with him.

All I want to see in that as a viewer is mess.

I mean, listen, again, in the terms of this show, it was a funny moment.

I'm just saying, practically speaking, it's like Carl throwing jabs too.

Carl's like, she's not over it.

Well, she's not.

But he's not throwing jabs.

That's just like his reaction.

He's tried to apologize.

He tried to be like, hey, like, like, let's be cool this summer.

No, I just want to see them throw more jabs at each other.

That's right.

Like, she's, that's where I'm like, she's pregnant with somebody else's baby.

Like, doing this, it'd be one thing if, like, if not, or she wasn't in a new relationship, then, like, fine.

But I'm just like, enjoy being pregnant.

Enjoy your new relationship.

The conversation that this episode opened up with with Sierra and Jesse having like some kind of serious friend heart to heart.

Like, if you're doing that with someone of the opposite sex that's not your girlfriend and you are supposedly a in a new dating situation and you're pursuing a relationship couldn't be me i'm just saying that conversation that sierra and jesse had like someone wants to have sex with someone in that scenario i don't there's just no point to have that serious of a conversation about each other's feelings and how one person might feel disrespected or or needs you to prioritize them some i've that is i will say they they clearly had a friendship for a while i mean they met last year they've had a friendship I mean, I think like the whole time, if Jesse, I would take it a little bit more serious if we hadn't watched Jesse so overly flirt with her for the past two years, two summers.

Like, I feel like maybe I would have taken that conversation a little bit more to the heart where it's like, oh, no, he just genuinely like misses his friend Sierra and he doesn't like that they're in this like weird limbo friendship where she's kind of being mean to him and he like doesn't understand why.

But it does, it does raise some flags when like you definitely want to fuck her.

And like you have been non-stop flirting with her.

You've crossed very many boundaries when you're supposed to be in a relationship with Lexi.

So if I'm Lexi, I'm also like, this is a weird conversation to be having.

And I also have to say, I'm like, it doesn't feel like Jesse was like so much upset about like where his friendship is with Sierra as much as he was upset about the names that he was being called.

He was like, it hurt my feelings.

You called me two-faced.

You called me a liar.

And it's like, but you are two-faced and you are a liar.

So, where did she stutter?

What does she apologize for?

Yeah, I mean, just he doesn't want to be like the type of liar that women call a narcissist or a monster.

Exactly.

That's what I'm saying.

It's like it's about like, you're, you're cock blocking me for the future, but I know I'm supposed to be in this committed relationship with Lexi, and I know that we're really good friends, but like, you guys were really cockblocking me for when the season ends.

That's how that felt.

Yeah.

Jesse's never going to change.

No.

He's never going to have to.

Also, Kyle was that was dirty.

What What part?

Where Kyle goes to Lexi and he's like, Were you talking about Sierra?

Because that whole thing up there was about Sierra.

And like, it really was the one comment.

I liked it.

He did the right thing.

I kind of liked it too.

It felt very like Kyle's stir in the pot.

See, and that's the thing.

In the past, he usually does, but he's like messy with it.

But I'm just like, I don't know.

For me, I'm like, I would appreciate knowing that the man that I'm sitting here, like debating whether or not I'm going to stay with, literally just ran right behind me and goes, this is why she broke up with me.

And that Sierra comment came out of nowhere.

Like, he must probably

edited it out there.

Like Lexi said, she said, I didn't mention Sierra's name once outside.

I wonder if she said it like in person after, you know, like maybe not in that conversation, but had said it to him in person when they were hanging out in between the U.S.

Open and coming to film for Summerhouse.

And he's like using that.

But this is the problem I have with Jesse: it's like the question that was asked was, What was that conversation outside about?

And he was like, She's mad that I had a nice time with Sierra.

Not what she she said, not the conversation that was had.

You couldn't wait to throw her under the bus and have everybody on your side and fuck that girl.

And like, that's what I don't like about him.

He is two-faced.

He'll never change, though.

You know what?

Did you him talking

everything that he says is the most like eye-roll

comment?

I mean, he him talking about Paige.

I don't know where I saw, I saw a clip of it.

He was talking about Paige about how she's the funniest girl ever and she's so relatable.

She'll go out and she'll order a Coke, not a Diet Coke, but a Coke, a regular Coke.

And it's like, okay.

Him talking about his exes.

He's like, yeah.

And none of them were just like excited about their careers.

Like none of them were, what do you do, Jesse?

First of all, I mean, we talked to Lexi for like 90 minutes.

She's

very excited about her career.

We learned a lot about Lexi.

There's a lot going on.

Sounds like we had a conversation that Jesse never had with her.

Right.

About herself.

About herself.

Yeah.

Literally.

I guess he'll never change because

Professor Scott Galloway, I'm a fan of his work.

He talks a lot about like the digitization.

Digitization?

Yeah.

Of internet dating and how it's made dating for women, for all women, just a little bit worse.

Oh, yeah.

And then made for a small percentage of men, Jesse.

A little bit better.

Amazing.

Amazing.

Because like everyone online thinks they have access to the 1% available to them, the 6'4 people who make a little bit of money.

And then it's just trash for all the, like, I guess the average, an average-looking man, so average is whatever you think it is, has to like, has to swipe right a thousand times to get one coffee date.

And then four out of five of those women will ghost him.

While Jesse Saliban is out there just being like,

and he can just, he'll get unlimited chances to.

I feel like maybe not after this.

I don't know.

He still will.

Maybe he'll get more.

He still will.

Yeah.

They'll probably eat him.

He's getting eaten alive for this.

On the internet, but when he walks out in New York, they'll always be plenty of people who think they're eating.

It's the one who's talked the most shit about him, too.

That's going to be like, hey.

Oh my God, you cannot believe that I hooked up with that disgusting slime ball.

Yeah.

You went for him.

Anyways, congratulations, Lexi.

You really handled yourself quite well

throughout the season.

And that's how you break up.

The finale's next week.

So I'm excited to see how this ends.

All right, Secret Lives and Mormon Wives time before we get to the interview of Jesse and Michaela.

You know, Miranda, maybe it's just like rookie, rookie season.

You know, we enjoyed our conversation of going deeper with her.

She gave a lot there, but she seemed to be kind of afraid of all the women this season.

Understanding.

Well, they were girls welcoming.

Yeah.

That intro.

That's like, dance.

Let's see what you got.

That does seem like one of the most terrifying environments to have to enter into as an newbie.

Like the one person you know is the person you had a falling out with

because you are in each other's husbands kind of had a thing or not?

Huge public fallout, information exposed about you against your will.

Your one ally is Whitney.

Maybe.

That must be a little frustrating on Miranda's part of just kind of like, bitch, I was a fucking OG.

I started this shit.

Literally, like, y'all about to tell me I can't be in mom talk when I like helped create this.

Well, that's why it was so funny to me at the beginning of the first episode where it was just like, oh my God, wait, is that Miranda?

Oh, my God.

Like, she was in mom talk.

and it was just like, girls, don't act like you haven't seen her.

Like we remember the contracts.

Yeah, but I don't think we realize when like this group of women who make up this show are a small percentage of all the moms of Utah and Salt Lake City.

And the aspiring mom talkers are, we've learned talking to these women, like there's a lot of them.

There's thousands of them.

So even though like Taylor knew Miranda, I honestly don't think a lot of these women like they weren't like friends with her.

Like they didn't fuck with her.

So, I think for a lot of them, like, it was their first time meeting her?

Maybe not their first time meeting.

I don't know about that, but I don't think it was like this person they've been hanging out with on the regular on the side, and then they pretended to not know her coming in.

I'm just saying, like, I didn't know anything about mom talk.

I mean, I knew mom talk before Secret Lives, but like, I knew Taylor, Miranda, and Camille were like the originators.

Because, like, this all started through the scandal, which I think a lot of these women, like the Demis and the Jens, weren't a part of that scandal and weren't friends.

I I don't, you know what I'm saying?

Like

this group came together after the fact.

So was Camille not involved in the swinging?

She was just

a trio kind of.

Yeah, it was Miranda, Camille, and Taylor.

And then she, yeah.

Because people speculated it was Camille when Taylor did that original like.

TikTok live, but then it was like Miranda that came out being like, those are lies.

Well, it was like there was like the whole like negotiations for casting or something.

And remember, it was like they were talking about Miranda and Camille like saying like, I would never do that or whatever.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Cause I don't want don't want to be on a show with Taylor.

Yeah.

But like I'm glad she's on it.

Yeah.

Also the dinner at Taylor's parents' house when Dakota comes.

It's a tough watch.

I was so mad.

That was hard to turn off the TV.

That was hard.

What did you do like to allow him to come over and sleep when I was there?

Her dad like calling her easy was

watching trauma wounds being opened.

It was also tough to like, and I don't obviously know their dynamic, but to like not see her sisters or her mom be like oh that was a little far honey maybe maybe let's not go there i mean and it was also like the comparison of like yeah he may have cheated on you but you let him come over to your house after the fact and she's like i didn't know this is why i want you to be on my side what he did to me was

Yeah, it's it's tough.

I know.

I, you know, we, we now see Taylor, though, obviously defending her family in the comments.

I don't want to like, I mean, inappropriate for sure.

Tough, tough watch.

Definitely would have loved Dakota to have stood up for his lady in that moment anyone to stand up but especially dakota i mean like i mean when you know like well dakota we watch dakota time after time halloween party he doesn't stand up for i mean he's like him and chase are going at taylor like he does not stand up for her i know it is a weird moment though i mean the we've talked about this but when you were pregnant uh on thanksgiving um and that was the first time i had experienced like men in your family making like remarks about like her body your body which wasn't meant maliciously but was the first and it wasn't like i had to like confront them, but I made some like remarks about their comments in a like a passive, aggressive way, which was weird to do, but like still necessary.

Right.

That's not nice.

Yeah.

I just remember, I just, I think it's like, what's with all the guys in this family, like, commenting on pregnant women's bodies?

And I kind of said that aloud, and they all kind of awkwardly.

Her brother was very kind and handled appropriately after the fact.

But yeah, he just doesn't, yeah, Dakota doesn't.

It's almost like he like, not like he enjoys it happening to Taylor, but it's like he enjoys the support for himself that it's just like we're being on the same side as somebody else, that it's just like he just does not have her back no matter what.

Which I listen, I think what we know about Dakota and Taylor is they are antagonistic with each other.

I mean, we've all been in those types of relationships where you just, you know, it's the hurt people hurt people and they're constantly hurting each other.

And I think they both feel like a victim of the other person.

So, you know, they can't get out of how they feel victimized in this relationship.

You know, they can't see the forest through the trees.

Right.

You know, I mean, and Taylor, that whole scene where she's going through the text message, like it's like, it's, it's going to be, Taylor's always so in control when she's activated.

It's, I think that's why we love Taylor so much.

You can tell she's triggered, but like she, she has this level of calmness that makes her seem so very in control.

Like when she's going through the text messages or, you know, when she's confronting one of the ladies, she's just, she is, she never loses it completely.

Until it's that time.

That was insane.

But even then, she's articulate.

you know, she's she doesn't lose her composure.

So many people do.

And then we cry, but it's like she's not doing anything a step before.

I can't remember what episode it was.

Maybe it was Halloween, but it was like somebody was like narrating her confrontation, being like, she's, she's cocking her head to the side.

You know what that means?

Taylor's, Taylor's getting activated.

And it's like these tells where it's like, she's processing, she's taking in everything.

And then when she strikes, it's so beautiful.

It is.

Well, she does like a head nod.

She's like, oh, yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Her eyes get all like

she's incredible.

I am reading.

I am processing.

And I'm about to eviscerate you.

Yeah.

So the best part is watching these women attempt to go after Taylor and then she does the whole, yeah, yeah.

And they're like,

yeah.

I love you.

I wish I could.

God, to be able to eviscerate someone like that is the

skill.

It's a skill.

I do not have it, and I kind of wish I did.

I would only use it for good.

Is Demi trying too hard so far?

Yeah.

From like, did she come into the season feeling like a little confident about her position in mom talk?

As a fan favorite.

Yeah.

Is it possible?

And it's like this, the competing with Taylor, where I'm like, Taylor's just on her own tip.

Like, she's really not focused on what's going on in the other girls in the other girls' lives outside of herself.

And then it's like, Demi is just so focused on what everyone else is doing.

Fuck Jen.

Jen doesn't tell the truth.

Taylor's behavior.

Like, it's just like, why don't you just take a beat?

Yeah, but even, I don't mind the shit talking because even like Michaela is talking more shit this season.

Jesse is louder this season, but they seem to be doing in a way that doesn't come across as trying to reclaim a position.

That's what it's gonna say.

You know what I'm saying?

Demi's doing that thing where she's trying to have like secret cahoots with other people so everyone's on the same page when I confront this person.

You're you have my back.

Where Michaela's just like, I'm not, I don't need to sit around.

I could talk shit behind your back, but I also will say it straight to your face in the moment, no hesitation.

I'm like, Demi is kind of like sneaky about it and then tries to act like it's like, oh, well, everybody feels this way, but like I didn't originate this thought where she did and she's not owning that.

Well, we'll hear Jesse's version of the whole contract negotiations, but when they talk about it in the next batch of episodes, the way to me is just like, no, it's just like there was just like a misunderstanding and like everything's fine now.

And then when we hear Jesse's version, she's like, she did what?

She said what?

You know, it's two different versions.

She's giving sheep in a wolf in sheep's clothing is what Demi is giving for me this season.

It's good to watch.

As I said, I'm entertained.

I am hooked.

I have not been able to stop watching it.

I'm already ready to re-watch it.

I was like, I'm going to wait for the finale.

I had to get through the whole thing.

There was no way that I was stopping at episode nine.

It was so good.

I don't know what they all, like Jesse and Demi's big problem with Jen is.

Why are they trying so hard to take out Jen?

I don't know unless it's this whole like Demi

Vanderpump Villa stuff because there's like

Jen hasn't done anything.

I mean the whole like her talking to Zach and her being like, Well, you told me that we were related to Ben Affleck.

And he's like, I never said that.

You made that up.

And she's like, No, you told me.

And he's like, I literally never said that.

So that's like literally Jen's biggest crime, which is like leaning into a silly rubber.

Which you know, I'm sure his family has been like, the afflex, oh yeah, like they're our cousin.

Like, I'm sure that when they first met, it was like a joke that maybe she wasn't under the impression it was a joke.

And sweet little Mormon Jen was this like real little Mormon Jen.

Yes.

We're getting an athlete.

Yeah, we're famous.

They didn't anticipate Jen being famous and telling the world.

And they're like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

Actually, we were just kidding.

Right.

She ruined that whole family's reputation back in Provo.

It's kind of more charming than it is evil, though.

Yeah, I just, I feel like from what I can gather, that's kind of her biggest crime.

And then maybe, you know, with the whole like, you know, Halloween party, she didn't relay the message to Zach the best possible way.

But I'm like, to be fair, where I'm just like, whatever issues they may have, like, I'm like, whatever goes on in her relationship, like, they need to work that out.

But it's like weird that the other women are so like, well, Zach, like, they didn't tell, well, she didn't tell, well, I communicated.

And it's just like, oh, okay.

Like, I don't know.

It's like, it's like, you guys are trying to ruin her relationship.

It's also like, yeah, they're trying to like be the middleman of their relationship and be like, well, did she tell you this?

And Zach's like, well, I mean, not in that.

And it's like, well, but about this, did she tell you that?

And it's like, just let them be a married couple.

Thank you.

And figure it out on their own.

Natalie, you nailed it because even I was kind of awestruck when Demi and Brett had said that Jen scapegoated him for the money in Vegas when it was his money, but said it was him gambling her money.

Yeah.

So it's very interesting that I think they're so quick to try to expose the fact that they think she's like scapegoating him for like being a bad person when does it really matter?

You know, we'll see, but we left season one hating Zach, everyone.

You know, if it wasn't Whitney, Zach was maybe the biggest villain of the season.

But like, I don't like...

And maybe some people will never forgive him for his haircut season one, or just like, some people just like hate his face.

You know, some people hate my face.

You know, they'll never get over it.

But I think there's a world where Zach might redeem himself a little bit.

He seems like he's just said, I'm going to go ahead and be a husband.

Better, yeah.

You know?

He got a haircut.

Got a haircut.

quit medical school.

I mean, if you say, oh, well, no, because she's making money.

Either way, you're talking about a man who grew up in a very patriarchal society.

And this is a man who's choosing his, who's quitting his dreams to support his wife's.

I'm just saying, like, we should acknowledge that a little bit.

You know, we'll see if it's real.

We'll see how long it lasts, but steps in the right direction.

And

preach.

Well, anyways, let's hear from Jesse and Michaela first.

And listen, people, you know, there's a lot in this season to break down.

We're going to be talking about this show for a few weeks now.

We're not the ones who chose for them to like drop it all at once.

So like we will be breaking down things.

If we didn't get to your favorite scene today, chances are it's in this interview with Jesse and Michaela.

Don't worry.

We have Macy and Layla on Thursday.

Reality recap going deeper.

I will say we were supposed to have Taylor, but some drama happened between Dakota and Taylor that morning, which seems to be an ongoing thing.

So they're still making each other's lives miserable.

Yeah, something happened late at night.

You know, they were filming season three.

I don't know.

I'm just going to say, hopefully it'd be in season three.

Lots of detail.

I'm pretty sure Macy gives us some insight on that on Thursday.

So anyways, Jesse and Michaela.

We're just trying to live up to the version of us that Jeff and Steve think that we are.

Obviously, those are our pets.

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Jesse Michaela, welcome back.

Yeah,

I'm not back in the corner this time.

I know I can actually see you and hear you.

It's crazy.

I'm like, oh, I get, you know, first chair.

I'm like, I can literally hear you.

Was that trauma of being in back?

Yes.

You know, I brought up all my wounds from therapy about not being good enough.

Well, I got to say,

you really showed up this season.

Oh, really?

Well, you are front and center of the drama.

You are

stirring the pot.

I mean, I haven't watched it, but in all the press, they're like, Jesse really is so funny.

Oh, I'm not.

Someone texted me a podcast where I was like, you're messy.

I was like, you are messy.

Both of you.

Oh.

I say this with love and a compliment to someone who, again, more than anything, just a fan.

Okay, good.

Thanks.

Simply just a fan of

both of you of the show.

You both found your voice through both your voice and your actions.

Specifically, you, Jesse.

Oh, yay.

Yeah, you you definitely

front and center yeah

but anyways so yeah was that trauma putting you in back there what really competitive catapult yeah that's why i stepped it up season two

um i find it fascinating that you ladies um we're recording this before the season has dropped you ladies haven't seen it yet no

nervous how do you you're nervous yeah did you have you fought with the producers no i'm the favorite so like i basically

i'm like i never fight them i feel like we've asked a little bit though Yeah, we get irritated, but also I feel like our producers are very sarcastic like me.

So if I, if I'm saying things, it's like I'm annoying, but I'm still going to do it.

And they know that.

I just like to give them shit.

What is also, I'm sure, because everyone you're talking to has seen it.

And they're all like, oh, this and, oh, that.

And so we're going to have to do it.

And we lived it, but we have no idea, obviously, how it's put together, what was cut and stuff.

And so it's hard to like, no, you guys have seen it.

And we have no idea what the edit is.

What's funny when they ask me about it, because they do call you Messy Jesse.

Oh, when they say about all the um events they're like and chase was invited oh jesse invited him and this person invited oh jesse invited him and i'm like interesting

too nice no you're not everyone involved jesse is the yes girl she's too nice i am so is that really is that what it is you're just i have a hard time yeah saying no to people and so i feel like i'm a people pleaser which can be

not it's not necessarily machiavellian in the sense where you're like who's not here i feel like yeah

what can i do to make this dramatic it's it's not but hey it made good tv right no no Again, thank you.

I'm just like,

but I'm just curious, like the human, Jesse.

Like, what is what is

people pleasing for sure?

It's people pleasing.

Yes.

Okay.

I think even after the Halloween party, she's like, I had no idea this was going to happen.

Like crying.

I'm like, what do you mean?

I told you that I told you not to.

I didn't get Joe Chase that well at all.

I think I had met him one time.

Yeah.

But he had friends with his girlfriend.

Yes.

You know what?

Honestly, that's a great place to start because I think.

I think a lot of fans, me included.

Obviously, we know that mom talk started with like Miranda and Taylor and the whole swinging scandal.

And obviously, we talk about that a lot and that gets brought up a lot.

But like, I don't feel like everyone fully knows like who was friends with who, who really knew each other.

Like, how close were all of you women before this all like really got together mom talk-wise?

Like, you know what I'm saying?

Like, how did you all, like, how did you get brought into the group?

So, Macy actually brought me in.

Okay.

And it's funny because in Utah, like, there's a big group of influencers and we all go to events together.

And, like, it's like a little community.

So, we were all intertwined in that community.

Like, like how many it's like if we haven't met you know 50 to 100 people

yeah really so like you would go to an event and see people so like macy and i knew each other because of that i had actually done whitney's hair for two years before the show jesse's mom did my hair once yeah mikaela's been to my salon so we all knew of each other like i am responsible for whitney's ever-changing hair in season one you know so like i knew whitney that was you yeah

yeah yeah so i knew whitney really well and then macy referred me because she just i guess thought i would be good because she knew of me but yeah there was that mom talk group that was really close for a while but it was like more business right what year was that because we started pilot 2022 end of 2022 and that was me macy whitney taylor and then taylor got arrested we got her we held off on the on all the filming for like a year yeah and then demi oh demi came on the last day of filming the pilot in 2022.

oh so she filmed like one or two days just to like scope her out and then we did recasting after taylor got arrested and that's when Jen, Jesse, Layla came out.

And Layla was around for the original mom talk.

Yeah.

Layla was at the original mom talk before the swinging stuff.

I think there was like an original mom talk for like a year before the swinging stuff, if I'm right.

And so I had met up with like Miranda and Taylor, knew them for like a short period of time.

And then the swinging stuff came out, hung out with Miranda like once or twice after.

Yeah.

And she kind of gave me like her side of the swinging stuff.

And then two years go by and that's when the show.

We always say though, but back then mom talk was like transactional from what I've heard like yeah business get your video done see yeah now it's like a real friendship yeah do you feel like there's a group of women in Utah who maybe were involved in the original mom talk who are very bitter yes yeah oh gosh I'm sure but I'm like I want I want I want that story I want that to be a show of its own no I want the story about all the women who are jealous and like it's like I don't know put it on like a less popular platform or something.

That would be hilarious.

It got too big though.

Like, do you remember there was like the videos that would blow up?

There were like literally like 20 girls and they're like all filled the front.

They got way too big.

Some of them would come from like out of town.

So they weren't all from Utah.

So it was just, it was too much.

Yeah.

There were like five people that would like come in and from out of town and then they'd leave again.

Yeah.

But like they lived in Utah originally.

So going into the show, Jesse, you're closest with Macy.

Yeah.

Michaela, you're closest with.

like Macy.

Yeah.

Macy and Jesse.

Well, at the beginning.

Oh, going into the show, definitely Macy.

Yeah.

Cause I was like best friends with Macy for two years before mom talk and filming.

Wow.

Okay.

I actually think I got closest with Jen and Layla before the show started filming, though, because we all went on like trips together and like we would hang out before filming started.

And me, Jen, and Layla were like the newbies to the group.

So we kind of like stuck together because of that.

But then as filming went on, I obviously got really close with Demi.

And now I'm closest with Mikhail and Macy.

So, and Taylor.

It changes all the time.

It does.

You never know.

Do you ever run into

the housewives?

Yes.

Brittany comes to my salon.

Okay.

Uh-huh.

And then I have met whitney she's singing when she walks in yes all the time i love her she's so funny and she always grabs me to do like fun tick tocks and stuff um

i whitney i've met a bunch of times um there was one time when jensha was in my break room eating pizza and i was looking at my security cameras and i was like what the hell so i like ran over to meet her um but yeah like it through that yeah it's random yeah um michaela yeah again you were amazing this season and a little messier which because you're so like like for the first season you were just like demure

quiet

Kayla, unless Whitney

did in my life.

Unless Whitney walked in the room.

One thing I just love to just push back on you just a little bit.

Just a little bit.

Watch it.

Okay.

Watch.

Listen.

I'm like, watch a man.

I'm usually not in the business of agreeing with Whitney.

Okay.

Uh-oh.

But like, let's keep that going

today.

Don't stop now.

Yeah.

I honestly respect how much you hate her.

But like the trolling TikToks.

like you really, like this season, you really did not back down being like, I can do whatever the fuck I want.

Which obviously you can, but like you can't appreciate why, like, that maybe that, like, maybe looks like you're, you're going past the point of, like, standing up for yourself when it comes to like, I wouldn't say that.

I didn't say that.

But,

but,

emphasis on the but.

It's just there wasn't like the dynamic of like Whitney is so innocent and everyone's ganging up on her.

It was like she was feeding into this role of like, oh, make me your villain.

I'm this.

Like it was all editing.

I didn't know I was like this.

And so it was just, it almost made it harder to be quiet because it was like, oh, I don't remember it going that way.

But yet she was still feeding into this and doing like the same patterns.

And I think

I didn't really have that drive to say as much.

until she brought like Macy into it.

She was posting Macy's text messages where Macy was like backing her hard, hard, blindly almost.

And I feel like that's when I got almost more defensive because I was like, she was always a shitty friend to Macy.

And I always told Macy that.

But it wasn't until after the show and she was like throwing Macy under the bus and defending that she wasn't going to her launch by exposing their messages.

And that's when I was like, all right.

See, that's helpful context because like in the show.

Yeah, the context matters.

It just looks like you're just out there waking up

being like, I'm going to troll Whitney today.

Oh, are you saying in season two?

It didn't show like how you guys stopped being.

Oh, yeah.

It didn't show like the falling out at all with Whitney.

And Whitney has like that very victim mindset all the time.

Like I said, every time she goes into something, tell me your issues.

We tell her her issues.

She runs away crying and saying she's the victim.

We're attacking her.

And it's that.

And it was continued through season two.

I had probably seven conversations that was.

that ended the exact same way of her like, I really want to work on this, but you're not telling me what I'm doing wrong.

And I was like, what about the last six conversations that I like, do I need to spell it out or like write a list and give it to you?

Yeah.

it was just so many conversations that ended the same way, and literally everyone agrees.

And with Miranda coming into the group, it was like what she would do to everyone.

The new person in the group, when she's on the outs, she'd get really close.

And then, when it didn't serve her, she doesn't talk to Miranda anymore because she left again.

So,

interesting.

Yeah, there was a scene with Macy where Macy wanted some accountability from Whitney and asked her to like reflect, like, do you now regret you know not coming?

And Whitney did this whole thing.

And so, like, well, how could I be sorry if that's how I felt in that moment?

And it's like, wait, that doesn't,

that's literally the, the definition of like reflecting back on your actions and like knowing that you felt one way in one moment.

And like now that like that moment has passed, like thinking.

Like she can't admit she was wrong in her feelings.

Yeah.

I just, oh my gosh.

And it just, I could go all day just because I think it just triggers me so much.

I don't want to trigger it.

No, it's fine.

It's just like filming with, it's because we're filming too.

And I know with filming,

yeah, it's the same thing.

Like, everyone's like, Why are you so passionate?

Because I'm like, She hasn't changed.

Like, even just a week ago, couldn't say she regretted going to Macy's baby shower.

She told Macy she had to look up the definition of regret to say if she regretted it.

I'm like, you know what regret means.

And I'm like, you're an actress.

Come in and act like you're sorry for season two.

I don't know.

Yeah, I mean, and Whitney's literally the only one who's never been on the show.

There have been several conversations with her team and us about coming on.

As a character, I'm a fan.

I'm just obsessed with

the hospital TikTok.

I can't watch it without it.

It brings joy to my life.

It truly does.

Because she's so blissfully unaware of how it comes across.

It's really funny.

It's funny and it's frustrating.

And in this season, she want, you know, she didn't want to, she wanted to do an interview by herself.

Our response was, you're not really in it this season.

Ooh, good to know.

Yeah, you know, like, she definitely is much less of the villain this season from my perspective.

Is there a different villain in your perspective?

No, it's just

more men.

Uh-oh.

I mean, like, it's really going to be, I think, fan perspective.

Obviously, and we'll get into it, but like, the season ends with a lot of accusations heading your way.

Yeah.

And I'd love to, you know, and then you, you, and, you and Demi, obviously,

very critical of Jen.

Well, y'all came into season one being very close.

Yeah.

And then obviously we have now seen what's going on on social media.

Y'all are not close anymore.

What was the initial fallout of you and Demi's relationship?

Did season two touch on like the contracts stuff?

Yeah.

Okay.

So that was the first thing.

Yeah, which round?

That was the first thing.

It happened during the summer.

Actually, before season one even aired, we started negotiating some different contracts as a group.

And she basically threw me under the bus because I.

didn't care to fight for more money and she wanted an absurd amount of money.

What did that conversation sound like?

Like, how did it happen?

It had all of us on.

So we were all on a call.

And keep in mind, this is a call with our lawyer and managers who represent us.

So we should be able to say how we feel.

And some of you share managers and lawyers.

Totally.

I'm like, so they all have our couple husbands in our mind.

And we should be able to say, like, I want this, I want this, and it can differ.

Some husbands were on.

I was doing a podcast virtually.

So I joined the call late.

When I joined the call, the first thing I heard is Brett saying, if we don't get this amount, everyone's walking.

And I was like, you can't speak for me.

So I said that because that's initially what I heard.

So I was like, wait, wait, wait.

I just want you to know, like, I'm not willing to walk.

And he was pissed.

And they just were so mad at me.

That is the catalyst for everyone.

Well, because then there was another call after, because what happened before to give it context, we were all like, no one's going to walk, obviously.

This is what we were saying before she went on, like, no one's going to walk, but there's power numbers.

Yeah.

And so.

we're all going to walk.

And so then Jesse, yeah, Jesse comes on, hears that.

She's like, I'm not going to walk.

And if I had that context, of course, I would have not said that.

But again, it didn't warrant their reaction.

No, so then she's calling people behind the scenes, being like, Well, Jesse has no morals and no values.

And Brett John after you is like, Oh, he's like, Oh, and then Brett's response to me was like,

Jesse, you're willing to walk for pennies, and none of us are, and that was gross, and

just kind of like came at me.

And then she's calling everyone behind my back, being like, Well, if Jesse doesn't, like, maybe Jesse doesn't need to be on the show, then let's get her off and we can all get more money.

Yeah, she was saying that she had no morals, no values.

I'm not going to be a pawn in her hair scheme.

Well, also, like, after we just clearly talked about there seems to be a line of women in Utah.

Yes, willing to do this.

All of the earth places.

And I think, obviously, the show.

I think, to be honest, Demi was a fan favorite, and it went to her head.

And she's like, well, I can make more money then.

She'd only say she said it a million times.

And I think it's really important, obviously, like as reality TV becomes more and more prominent, it gets more and more credibility.

I think you guys deserve, you are stars.

You guys deserve to get yours.

But like, when I would have done The Bachelor for free, keep in mind, this is before season one aired.

So I didn't know what the reaction was going to be.

And they wouldn't show us

the background numbers of airing or like anything.

We don't even know if it's a hit yet.

Exactly.

Like we knew that it was good because they were wanting to go in so quickly into filming season two.

And like we knew after the numbers came out too, that it was doing really well.

But also there was just the line of like, okay, this is absurd and this is way too much money.

Like, yes, we deserve more, but this is like, it's not.

It's not realistic.

Like they were trying to get rich in that moment.

Yes.

Without having to work.

Like she doesn't want to work like a dog.

That's her words.

And so she doesn't want to hustle.

No.

But she wants to be rich.

I think that that was where it started.

And then I think for me, what was hard was after that happened, I didn't know everything she said about me, but then the text messages she sent me during that were like, you need to earn my friendship back.

Like, I'm very disappointed in you.

Like kind of put herself on a pedestal above me where I had to like beg for her love is how I felt.

And then the hair drama happened.

So it was just like one thing after another.

And I just kept forgiving her.

Like I was like, I don't want to have another friendship fallout.

Like I just, it's fine.

And the friendship fallout inevitably happened because I finally hit a point where after the finale where she like says she's going to walk, it was like that argument in my house.

She was mad that I didn't defend her towards Taylor and that I didn't gang up on Taylor.

And it was again, I'm disappointed in you.

She sent me this big like breakup text and I was just like, I'm not doing this.

I'm not doing this pattern where I have to beg for your love if I'm not doing exactly what you want.

So well, even in like the conversation we had where we were like had our little mom talk meeting

and there was the bullet between Taylor and Demi, they were talking about because Demi was like wanting to have a huge finale for season one.

And so she was wanting to make up, she's like, We can make up this whole thing that, like, I have an affair with Dakota and like this.

And so we were like, everyone was like, oh, that, that's a weird thing to say.

No one wants to be able to say that.

No, I know.

Taylor brought it up in the conversation and Demi's like, did everyone think that was weird?

And everyone's like, you know, yeah, kind of, that was a little bit weird.

And she was like, really, Jesse?

Unbelievable.

I was like, and so it was like this, the friendship.

I'm not to take it.

I was like, you know, I'm a fan of all you women.

Yes.

And we've gotten to know Demi.

And I've really quite, we've enjoyed her company.

I've been doing her.

She's charming.

You like Demi, too.

Like, when our friend, because I got really close to Demi and Jesse and Macy, which I was already, but like, we were getting closer to Demi.

And then all this started unraveling.

And we still gave not her the benefit of the doubt, but it was just kind of sad to see like, oh, she would do that.

And then it kind of just kept progressing.

And so we weren't like immediately like, okay, closed off.

It just happened gradually.

So it was sad for sure to see that she was willing to do all the things that she did.

Yeah.

So she was willing to

have the world think that she had an affair with Dakota for television.

Yeah.

Or at least she threw it out there.

It was her.

She had a whole plan.

Yeah, apparently she had a whole plan.

It wasn't something she just had.

It could be funny.

Yeah.

She's like, oh, we could meet in a car and then like they could catch us.

We were like, it was like a plan.

But also, I think it says a lot that there are seven women who feel the exact same way about her.

It's not just me that had issues.

And I want to ask you, and I'm not sure how much you women can share.

We've obviously interviewed Miranda.

Yeah.

We interviewed her the morning that a lot of you were online in the comments between

Marciano and Demi.

Demi was here with Brett and she made some claims, some very serious claims.

What I'll say is victims should always be believed.

I'll say that.

And yeah, I think it's really hard for, again, you have like, I was the victim of sexual abuse and Demi kind of takes advantage of that in the situations of like guilting us of like, well, you were going through this.

Like you out of anyone should believe me.

Yeah.

But also I was there right after the villa and I heard from her own mouth, I'm not a victim.

I was playing into this.

Like I was being flirty.

I was having a fun time.

And that was the story from the beginning.

And I was also there to kind of like watch everything too.

And you were there too.

This is such a serious subject.

Very none of us would ever do this if we didn't know for sure.

Or we didn't have gut feelings and witnessed things, you know?

So no, yeah.

I'm like, especially in my situation where again, I went to my mom and that wasn't believed.

So it's not coming lightly that I'm like choosing to be hesitant.

When we talked with Demi and Brett, it's they certainly gave the impression that they were done with this show.

Specifically, Brett.

Yeah.

Demi seemed pretty in line.

With Brett, I'm sure you can't tell us.

I don't even know if you know for sure what's going on contractually, but like, I just want to know your opinions.

Do you think Demi and Brett

are done with the show and mom talk and secret lives?

No, because the minute she gets a taste of like fame and the fun stuff we're doing now, it's like, oh, wait, I want to come back.

So I think it's just like waiting for her.

So whether she

does or doesn't come back, you think whether she leaves, whether she comes back, she'll always be back.

Yeah.

I mean, we met Lana Del Rey the other day, and that was an opportunity we got.

And as soon as she saw that, she's like tagging Lana on her story, like, let's do a redo.

It's like, then why are you leaving these experiences?

Yeah.

I think her go-to every time was, who's walking?

who's walking with me.

I'm done with the show.

So I'm like, right now,

I don't know.

I don't think it would surprise me with her coming back because she is so back and forth in that sense too.

I just think, like Whitney, they can't stay away.

If she does decide to come back and is allowed back, how will you women approach her given her alleged behavior and how you women perceive her?

Because it's one thing.

to be Whitney

and not understand how to apologize or think you are as accountable as the rest of the group when maybe you might not be.

And then there's everything that's going on with Demi.

How will you women approach that?

I think it is different for me because again, I go back and forth with Whitney where I'm like, do you truly just not know?

Are you like this calculated?

Like, are you as manipulative as you seem or do you truly just not know better?

With the Demi stuff, it is very, very calculated and very, again, the serious allegations and everything that she's doing with like the contracts i'm like this is i think everyone has seen the character flaws with it and no one want i don't want a friend that's willing to do that to me so and i think everyone kind of agrees and has that same opinion with her i think guards are definitely going to be up 100

and i don't think i mean i don't see myself personally getting close again no and i had ended my friendship with her before all of these allegations so I already knew that was done for me.

And now this has added a bigger, heavier layer.

But for me, if she needs to be my coworker, that's fine.

I'm not going to go out of my way to mend a friendship do anything like that like I'm for sure done but if I have to be around her I will yeah which yeah that's can we talk about how hard that is yeah because I think people don't get that that I'm like there is like the real friendships and then there's like the show aspect and we are being forced against our will to hang out with these people

and it's so hard

if someone like puts y'all in a photo and you're standing next to Whitney are you like excuse me

from the get-rill event where we're like me and Demi are crouched down

and there's like a big gap.

And everyone's like, that's so telling.

No, it's like the interviews where it's like, who's most likely to?

And we're all like,

like having a point and we're all in a group.

And it's like, that's so awful.

It's hard for sure.

Well, switching gears a little bit, Jesse, you have not been wearing your wedding ring.

Is there anything that you can share about your marriage?

I will say that reality TV is hard on any relationship, whether it's a friendship or a marriage.

And we've been through a lot and now it's going to be public.

And we're working through things and we're trying our best, but things are a little tricky right now.

And, you know, I'm excited to hopefully someday share more about that.

But right now, it's a little bit, it's just real life and it's hard.

So yeah, I don't really know.

I have to ask, and I'm assuming because

I think you guys are filming season three.

And I know obviously we want to be conscious of spoilers, but you know, season two ended with quite the accusation towards you.

And Miranda made it seem like you, you and Jordan Jordan have some real tough conversations ahead.

Do you want to clear the air about like

you and Marciano and him saying you guys had an affair?

Or can you like what can you, if anything, clear up right now?

I can't say much.

Unfortunately, I wish I could, but there is just so much more to the story.

And again, relationships are hard and they're nuanced.

And there's so much more that I'm...

I'm excited to share because I think people will be able to relate to my story.

And I think it may help people.

Do you think that Jordan is a good role model for the men that your daughter should look for in AI?

Oh my gosh, that is a loaded question.

No, I think that there's been a lot that's happened.

And I think that he and I are both willing to work on things and change, but maybe he should be asked that question because that might wake him up.

But no, I think there's a lot of things that have needed to change.

I've heard some things about him and I was really disappointed to hear.

I hope they're not true.

Clearly, you can't tell me, but your answer to Nally, I think, think, is revealing.

And I'd love the opportunity to talk with him about some of the things I have heard if they end up being true, because it's really quite sad and disappointing.

But I am

looking forward to getting to the bottom of that.

I will say one thing about me is I...

I feel like, unlike Whitney, I'm really good at taking accountability.

And I own my shit.

And I am excited to someday tell the full story and, you know, fall on my sword and take accountability for certain things, but also open up a bigger conversation that I think needs to happen.

I wanted to ask you guys about Jen.

A lot this season, when you and Demi were still close, a lot of your focus and attention and criticism was towards Jen.

Obviously, we know that Jen left the show and took a mental health absence and is pregnant.

So I want to be respectful of that.

It's my opinion watching the show that while Jen may embellish, maybe it's like, and there's like the people who just like, want to fit in, want to people please get caught up in the moment.

And I'm not saying it's okay.

Clearly, there needs to be correcting, but that's that's my, my, that's my, Jen's harmless.

That's my opinion.

That's my opinion of Jen is that she's more or less harmless.

Yeah.

Do you, looking back, regret any of your behavior towards Jen?

Because it was pretty harsh.

Yeah.

And I'm not blaming you for anything because there's a lot going on in Jen's life, specifically her relationship with Zach and the pregnancy and just, you know, probably a lot we don't know.

Yeah.

But how do you feel about your behavior with Jen?

And do you think it was ever influenced by Demi?

Great question.

So again, I can take accountability and I was harsh for sure.

I think I was hearing a lot of things that I was just shocked by.

And then Jen was so MIA from the group that it was a lot of jumping to conclusions because she wasn't giving us answers.

So I think that's where a lot of it began.

And then also Demi was on a mission at the time to make Jen seem like a liar because Jen knew more about the situation in Italy.

So Jen was starting to expose that and say things.

And so I think Demi was 10 steps ahead and was like, oh, I need to discredit her now.

And if if I can discredit her through this avenue and this avenue, it will make her look like a liar all around.

So I do think there was a little bit of that.

But again, I take accountability that I went hard on Jen on my own accord.

And I was very frustrated by all of the lies building up.

And then Zach himself telling us, like, that's a lie.

Like, she didn't say that.

I was like, what?

So I think I was honestly getting caught up in the drama of it all.

And looking back now, I'm like, okay, I was probably a little hard on her.

Thoughts agree, disagree.

I don't know what's going to be shown.

I mean, I lived it and I'm like, I don't know what I should say.

I'm trying to tread very lightly.

Say your truth, and we'll make sure you're protected in the back end.

What are your thoughts and feelings on Jen and yeah?

I mean,

the little white lies.

I had friends in school like that.

No, like the friend who had a dad who worked in China and like had a mansion.

I had a sleepover once with a guy who had all the baseball cards.

No, I like Jennifer.

That's amazing.

And I was like, when can I see him?

He's like, no, they're like, they're, oh, they're not this house.

They're our house in Hawaii.

I'm like,

I don't get it.

that happens that was jen probably um i yeah like i said like it is so hard it's so much filming like we do so much filming it's so many hours and so again it's hard not to be frustrated when people aren't showing up and then on the back end they're like trying to ruin your life or make up lies to ruin your life i feel like it's so frustrating and then just like those little weird lies about like ben affleck and like things like that i'm like oh i think

we can never get a straight answer this season that's i think what's frustrating is we can never get a clear answer it's very fresh.

I just did more press and it's like not doubling down, tripling down, quadrupling down.

And I'm like, I just, I'm trying to keep my mouth shut because I don't know what to do.

It's like I want to give her a pass, but even when she owns up to it, she's like, talking in circles.

She just, she kind of leans into how unserious she is.

Yes, yes.

But so it's like, if you know, you're, you know, it's like, how, how innocent are you?

I have not, I haven't seen it.

That's the opposite where he's like.

Very serious.

Yeah, very serious.

So it's really funny.

Speaking of Zach, I, you know, he was, if, if, if Whitney was villain number one, he was villain number two season one.

And at least from what I saw season two,

I'm not saying he completely redeemed himself, and I'm not saying he's like a completely changed man, but I saw a lot of growth.

And I saw a lot of at least intention to like we didn't see him strive

to be a better person.

At least, at least from

my media training, Colin.

Like, what was he supposed to say again?

And I'm just wondering

if what I saw is what you all witnessed.

So, the weird, I don't know.

Okay, so the weird thing is, we didn't see Zach a ton.

I think I saw him at my talk with him and then the Halloween party.

So, a lot of their stuff was like probably alone.

And so, I can't speak to that, but I will say I know he was trying and he was working on things, and I'm proud for that.

I would say his one-on-one stuff with Jen, if season one looked like Zach was a deadbeat husband who never really gave a shit about his wife's emotional well-being, health anything all of the above he really seemed like a present husband who more than anything wanted to be there for his wife that was and i was i was i was really impressed and i was i appreciated that again i'm sure he has a long way to go um everyone deserves a second chance to like undo their wrongs yeah michaela who is your favorite husband you cannot say jacob oh oh damn she knows how many who's even i'm like who's left all the how many husbands are there in others

God, who, that's kind of funny.

I think I know who you're going to say, and it's kind of funny.

Who is it?

Oh, Connor.

I love Connor.

Connor's the everyone loves Connor.

Like, he's so, he is so great and so logical.

Yeah.

I think he's like Whitney's right side of her brain, truly.

Like, he is so

keeps her grounded.

He does.

He's very, and he's just so, he's not very, he's emotional, but not in his, he doesn't like act out of emotions.

He's just very caring and he's logical and just, yeah, he's great.

Do you think he, he, he sees what you see in Whitney?

Probably.

I think everyone sees it.

I just think he handles it with more grace and compassion

because he's married to her.

I wouldn't want to piss her off if I had to live with her.

Michaela, how is your health these days?

It's doing great.

You look beautiful.

You look human.

Yeah, it's been a lot better.

I think.

The less I've done, the better it's gotten, which is really ironic because I really put my heart and soul into it for like years and years and years with no progress.

So yeah, I'm like, hopefully.

I don't know if you've like the pregnancy in some ways.

I mean, my mom had 11 kids and my mom also had some, a variety of different health struggles.

And there seemed to be time, maybe it was just, you know, the belief in something.

Yeah.

But it really seemed like sometimes her pregnancies was almost a

something that healed her.

Yeah, it totally is a thing.

Like I've looked up a lot of that with like autoimmune stuff.

I don't know what was going on with my health issues, I still never got answers of what was going on, but I've heard like people with eczema and all this stuff they get pregnant and it goes away.

So, I was like very strong.

I'm like, hopefully, this baby heals me, which people had an issue with that for some reason.

Yeah, did you see?

I don't have so much shit for that.

Yeah, they're like, that's so much

heat to put on a baby.

I was like, okay, what is it shocking?

It's like,

you would think that when it comes to pregnancy and women, there would be a lot of

grace and unity.

And but it really seems that people are,

whatever they you know yes do not give an opinion that it doesn't align with someone else online you'll hear about it yes but no I do think pregnancy has helped a lot and then again like I said working through trauma I've been learning a lot through like how trauma stored in your body and like unraveling all that and I think yeah I've seen the most healing in the last nine months to a year just going to therapy yeah and honestly not not on medication yeah healing the in the inside out yeah that's what I've been telling Jesse too I'm like you need to she's like that's work on yourself

That's why I'm going to do that stuff.

Exactly.

I'm like, okay, I'll take it.

Let's get to her book.

We do have a fun little game we want to play.

It's

some superlatives.

Some Mormon wives superlatives.

Mormon wives superlatives.

Obviously, you haven't seen the show, but also

the show.

This is about your

life.

Just your

genuine opinion of these people.

Okay.

And it's now time for Mormon Wives Superlatives.

Oh, my God.

Okay.

Don't text your actors.

Happy birthday.

Yeah, there you go.

Sponsored by.

Okay.

Most toxic couple

in the group.

One at a time.

Taylor and Dakota.

Take it away, Jesse.

Take it away, Jesse.

Yeah.

Oh, I do have a question for you about them.

Yes, sir.

Do you hope they get back together?

No, not as of right now.

Never.

I just think, I think ever.

Never, ever.

Yeah.

I love them both as people.

Like, I think they're both amazing people.

I think together they just can't, they're in a toxic cycle that will just never end.

And we see too much.

Yeah, we know.

I've seen too much, heard too much.

Okay, who is most likely?

Wait, you didn't answer.

Oh, yeah.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah, Taylor Nicole.

Okay, sure.

I don't even think that.

Okay.

Who is most likely to beauty filter their photos?

Oh.

Demi.

Yeah.

Demi always has a filter.

Who's most likely to sneak in a fart and blame someone else?

Whitney.

Yes.

Yeah.

She would never have to be able to do that.

Or actually, she would never take accountability for it for me.

So true.

Most likely to have lied this season.

Most likely to win an Oscar.

Not winning.

No, say what you said about her.

Remember when

you, Taylor said, and for the second time in a row, her award for

her leading role is the victim.

Second season in a row.

But let's not hype her going on through that much.

Best dressed.

Ooh.

Probably Jesse or Layla.

Or Miranda.

I was going to say Miranda or Layla.

Worst dress.

Whitney.

Probably me or Taylor.

Not you.

Well, are we talking season two?

I'm talking in real life.

Yeah, like when you see him at the grocery store, you see him at a coffee shop.

When you guys are together, I'm pretty grungy.

What?

Yeah.

What do you mean?

You're just a bra with a blazer over.

I was like,

Clay.

I love that person.

It's the nicest thing you've ever

person who thinks they're a good cook, but isn't.

Probably Jesse.

Just kidding.

No, I think you know.

Oh, you were at my house and I hadn't even turned it on.

She's like in our house for like six months.

I was like, how do you turn your oven on?

She's like, I've never used it.

I was like, okay.

It's giving Carrie Branch on.

No, actually.

It's giving Jordan Ashley.

What do you mean?

No, I'm going to say Taylor.

TB and J.

I'm me, probably.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Who is most likely to get canceled?

Ooh.

Ooh.

Taylor.

Yeah, Taylor, just because she's so like, I don't give a fuck.

Like, she's so controversial at times.

But also, people love her.

Her audience loves her.

Because she doesn't give a fuck.

Yeah, exactly.

They can see through it.

So, or like, they see the like genuine.

Do you think Taylor is the one who really doesn't doesn't give the fuck in the most authentic way of the group?

Yeah, I think everyone doesn't, but I think

I just keep going back to the CMA post when she was like, It was just Penny.

I don't care.

I don't care.

We're like, But honestly, she owned it.

So it's like, How do you stay mad at her?

Yeah.

But I was talking to her, her the other day about hate and how she deals with it.

And she's like, I go like this.

I'm like, oh, okay.

Like, she is herself.

Most likely to steal a baby name.

Ooh.

Especially with this going on.

Imagine you guys like

a baby name?

I don't know why I want to say Jen.

I want to say, oh, no, I can't.

Yeah, I see that.

I don't know why.

Have y'all shared names you're thinking of?

I have that.

You're zero names.

And same with Mason.

Send me all your ideas.

Zero names.

No, we were joking with Jen.

We're like, you should name your baby Ben.

Yeah.

I was like, Ben.

Literally.

What are your other two names?

For my kids?

I have three.

You have three.

Beckham, Haven, and Tommy.

So I have my little girl Tommy and Haven.

And then Beckham's my one boy.

Most likely to pick their nose nose in public.

Whitney.

Yeah.

I think that's it on superlatives.

We kind of, yeah.

That was quick.

Real quick.

Oh, my gosh.

That is funny.

Well, ladies, thank you for coming by.

Good luck.

Hopefully, season three.

Hopefully, I'll see you soon.

Everyone watching, if you haven't already, Secret Lives of Mormon Wives is now streaming on Hulu all 10 episodes.

Yeah, yeah.

I think it's an absolute doozy.

Jesse, good luck.

I know there's a lot of

that.

I'm going into hiding, but imagine.

And yeah, I want to be respectful to you, but I feel like I'm not doing my job pulling it out of you, but I feel like

there's more to

come.

We'll circle back.

Michaela, it's so great to see you.

So great to see you doing so well.

Congratulations with the baby, everything that's going on in your life.

Really so happy for you and Jace.

And

yeah, thanks for stopping by.

And I can't wait to see you guys more in the future.

Yay!

Perfect.

Thanks for listening.

Thank you to our guests, Chloe, Veach, Michaela, and Jesse from Secret Lives of Mormon Wives.

Don't forget it is streaming now, all episodes on Hulu.

Check it out.

We'll see you back tomorrow for a,

boy, a just a dark, crazy episode of Going Deeper from Michelle, formerly Michelle Lolly of the Valley, talking about her ex-husband, Jesse Lolly.

That is tomorrow, and

it's a very lifetime movie.

See you then.

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