E870 - Traitors w/ Wells, Baldoni Keeps Suing, Matt and Rachael Breakup, RHOSLC Finale + Michael Imperioli

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What's going on, everybody? Welcome back to another episode of the Vile Files Reality Recap Edition. I'm your host, Nick.
And Matt and Rachel broke up over the weekend. Sad.
Didn't see that one coming. Did not see that coming.
Did they break up or was he hacked? So true. I mean, that was the strangest breakup post I've ever seen in my life.
Like three hours after posting a cute reel of vacation. And then to use the photo from The Bachelor, which that was like the craziest fucked up season ending known to mankind.
Yeah, we'll get into that in a minute. But I will say, in Matt's defense, public breakups are hard.
Not a lot of playbooks for it, but like, I don't know who he was getting advice from. Definitely wasn't his buddy tyler but i feel like they've just created such a relationship outside of the bachelor and i feel like they've tried to like push themselves away from the franchise as much as possible and then they don't go to any events they don't talk about it at all i feel like neither of them hang out with anyone from the show and so it's so weird for him to use that photo of them meeting and then he like preyed on her kind of thing like Like he, from the internet, you know, it was like, you know, you know, when people like, you know, love all the, I love all my religious friends out there, but like sometimes people just like presume they want you to pray on them.
You know what I'm talking about? It's just like, you come up to him and like, let me just pray for you, on you, above you, all around you. Can you read it, Leah? Like he.
Yeah. So he posted this and the caption was, Father God, give Rachel and I strength to mend our broken hearts.
Give us a peace about this decision to end our relationship that transcends worldly understanding. Shower our friends and family with kindness and love to comfort us and remind us that our joy comes from you, Lord.
And then he put a broken heart emoji. Did we even know that he was this religious? Because I wasn't aware.
I mean. This photo is also like, it almost looks like a screenshot.
It didn't come from the archives. This is giving.
Plagiarized prayer. This is, yeah, this is giving like theology with Rachel's name put in.
Can you break this down for us, Leah? Like down the timeline for us. First, Matt posts a video of him eating pizza.
And Rachel's in this video of him eating pizza. And it appears to be from their trip to London.
I think it's important to note that Matt has made a career post-batcher out of being a food influencer. The last time I saw Matt was in New York, me and my cousin.
We were like, hey, we're going to go slice a pizza. And there was Matt just also getting a slice of pizza and giving his review.
And so yeah, he's full on doing his thing, committed to the bit. And so this gives like, hey, I have this content that we recorded.
Don't want to waste the content. So I'm still going to post it regardless of our relationships, that is.
So I actually don't think that that's what happened. Why? So he posts that video four days ago.
And then also four days ago, he posts their breakup. On the same day.
On the same day. And then Rachel's sister kind of gives us a little bit of clarity into what's happening.
She left a comment saying they were still together when he was posting all that, just to give some perspective on the timeline of things. So if I'm reading that correctly and understanding what her sister is saying, they were still, and this is just from my understanding of this comment left by Rachel's sister, they were still together when Matt posted the pizza video video and then they broke up between that post and the breakup post okay so how many hours was in between hours three i've been seeing the number three around well then her sister can't make a comment like three hours the comment that her sister left was that they were still together when he was posting all of that and And I believe there were three hours in between the two posts.
Gotcha. Okay.
I can't see anymore how many hours were between because it just says four days ago. We assume because Matt made the post that he was the one who ended the relationship, but we don't know if that's accurate.
So Rachel hasn't said anything. She has liked a few comments, one of which was the more I'm thinking about it, the more I think he completely blindsided her with this.
The breakup or the post? And then it said, give her some grace and let her respond in her own time. And Rachel liked that comment.
So it's either that Matt blindsided her with something that led Rachel to break up with him, or he blindsided her with the breakup. It could be anything.
She hasn't responded. Or just the prayer post.
Because usually, I mean, in my experience with these bachelor relationships or public breakups, usually the relationship ends long before people find out. There's usually like, hey, we should probably end this.
Or if it, you know, hey, we should break up. Even if it's not mutual, there's usually a like a normal like reaction to like a what is a real relationship.
And then and then eventually there's that awkward conversation of like, well, how do we tell people? There's a joint statement. And lots of times people are like, well, I'm not ready to deal with that right now.
I need to kind of have my own kind of moment to like process. It sounds like whoever made the decision, Matt just quickly went to like Instagram and said, well, you just got to let the people know.
I guess he just wants to keep it real. I don't know.
I was like, just let people like ruminate on it for a second. Like you don't, we didn't need to know, like talk to Rachel and figure out what y'all are doing.
I feel like it's kind of weird to like put something that's so definite where I'm like, y'all been together for so long. We, the public, didn't need to know that.
And now I just read your caption and prayed for Rachel. Usually, eventually, like, usually you want to tell people because it's like if you're broken up and you want to live your life, you don't want to start rumors about, well, why aren't they together? Or, you know, God forbid you get seen with someone from the opposite sex, you know, and people are speculating about cheating and things like that.
So, but, you know, the fact that Matt seemingly rushed to the internet. In a different country together? They were just in Japan.
And then London. So do we even know if they're back in the US? Who knows? They could be together around, traveling.
I mean. Broken up.
Messy, messy, messy, messy. None of us know the answer to that, but I do know that the London trip I think happened a while ago so that's why people were confused because they were spotted in Japan together within the last week or two well I think what's even more interesting is that the day before he posted the breakup he congratulated Lindsay Arnold on her boob job oh my god I forgot about that which is so interesting because i feel like we've never seen them have any sort of like we know they were partners when he was on dancing with the stars but we've never post about it or something well she's been kind of doing a like come with me as i get this boob job and it's been very like she's been very open with everyone and but i just feel like they haven't shared any sort of like relationship on social media or maybe i just haven't been following along but it's like i'll be honest even if they shared a relationship she's married you know like i think it was more so the comment the comment was lmao congrats with two balloons which the two balloons emoji choice was interesting.
Could have put, you know, I feel like equally as worse, watermelons, milk jugs. Milk jugs.
Baby bottles. Baby bottles.
LMAO is also like a no congrats. I think sometimes, you know, us men should just not.
Stay out of the comment. Yeah, you don't.
I feel like that wasn't a place for him. There's not like a...
Peeta was my dancing partner. We remain friends.
I try to wish her well. But if...
Especially now that I'm in a relationship. If I'm in a relationship and my women friends are in relationships, there's things I just opt out of.
If they post a thirst trap, opt out you know i don't like i'm not there i don't need to support everything they're doing right you know like and post your thirst trap but talk about your breast augmentation i'm just not i don't like seeing myself out of this conversation like i'm lindsey arnold's husband i'm like what the fuck rachel kirkconnell like well they're broken up so but they were together when he did this supposedly i mean it was before the thing i don't know i mean i feel like i definitely feel like that was unnecessary it's just maybe a text you could have texted her and been like hey mama at least is like why do it publicly you know i just feel like there's just some things where I'm like, you could keep it simple with the congrats.

If you're a part of the conversation, fine.

But I'm just saying, I don't know their relationship.

But for ultimate violence purposes, that if I ever saw my boyfriend commenting that on a girlfriend's breast augmentation post, the way he would be skinned alive.

It's the two O's and the LMAO and the balloons that like.

It's giving fuck boy. Yeah, there's boundaries.
Natalie, you solved it. He was hacked.
He was hacked. It's the only explanation for all of this.
This is crazy behavior for someone who's like seemingly just been like pretty chill. Unproblematic and chill.
But it's been four days and he hasn't said anything. Exactly.
He's still hacked. He got access.
The hacker is like, I need to relax. That was a lot.
He's still not in doubt. could you imagine though if that is the case and it's like in a couple of days it's like all of that wasn't real but wasn't no but rachel was commenting she was like yeah he wasn't his sister her sister also puts well assuming that they remain broken up a bow on i think people forget you know matt and rachel got together their relationship matt season of the bachelor being the first black bachelor we all know what happened with chris harrison no longer being the host but like you know rachel kind of obviously made the mistake that she made and we're not gonna like get into it but i thought that afr as a response to you know what was going on with george floyd tensions being what they were like was the most disgusting display of performative like social justice that i think i've ever seen and like the way that rachel was like crucified on live tv so that the franchise and the people dealing with what was going on could feel better about themselves and And then fans of bachelor nation at a time where everyone was like posting their black squares and things like that and you know being performative allies like i thought it was really sad how rachel was treated and again that's not to say that she didn't make the mistake that she made but the response to what happened and i've had conversations with matt since then, I'll never forget that night.
I thought it was really gross behavior on the part of a lot of people during that time. But anyways, I wish Rachel and Matt the best.
I hope that they move on, you know, and maybe Matt needs a crash course on internet efficacy. But, you know, weird.
Anyways, speaking of weird, Justin Bodoni's continuing to sue everybody. He filed a lawsuit I think over the weekend, another one, after he filed a lawsuit against the New York Times.
I mean, man, this guy, I'm more just kind of surprised by the internet in general and the amount of people who are just trying so hard not to believe Blake Lively in this situation. Maybe it shouldn't be surprising to me, but it is.
The amount of people I have commenting on my posts being like hashtag team Justin, A, I'm like, I know these are those bots. Bot behavior.
Well, yeah, let's not forget that. I do think a lot of people are forgetting, you know, just to kind of recap this whole drama.
In late December, Blake came out with her complaint against Justin, right? And I think a lot of people are forgetting that the focus of that complaint wasn't the sexual harassment, but it was the retaliation of the sexual harassment and the kind of the complaints that were laid out that Blake and Ryan or whatever, that meeting that they had that said, here are all the things we'd like you to stop doing for us to feel safe and comfortable to continue filming this movie and finish our work. So we could all just kind of go home and never talk to each other again, which included like the request that like Justin and his team would not retaliate.
And again, the focus of that complaint was the retaliation part, which included tons of text messages and emails of what is hard evidence of Justin's and his team's intentions to destroy the credibility of Blake. All those messages about, hey, this is the thing we need to do, a la the same way they would try to take down Haley Bieber.
The statement of work that was an email that clearly laid out from Justin's crisis PR team, once again, the crisis PR team that Johnny Depp's team hired to eviscerate Amber Heard's credibility. And point by point, that statement of work to kind of laid out like everything they plan on doing in terms of retaliating against Blake that also include the, I think the $25,000 a month fee, which again is, is an outrageous fee for any type of PR, right? So it's, it exceeds the normal amount that anyone would hire for a normal publicist.
And I think a lot of people are just forgetting that. Another thing people seem to be overlooking is the lawsuit from Stephanie Jones against Justin Baldoni, Stephanie Jones being Justin Baldoni's former publicist.
And in that complaint included messages of Justin's new PR team, his crisis PR team between Melissa Nathan and Jennifer Abel, those two women talking to each other, acknowledging Justin's behavior and acknowledging his creepy behavior. And in their words, it's just all so much.
Those emails to me are very concrete. I don't know how they're taken out of context is what I'm saying.
I read Justin's lawsuit over the weekend. And what is shocking to me is how many things in that lawsuit that they admit to.
They're not even denying many of the claims. It's basically Justin Lawyer basically wrote this long story that to summarize is basically saying, yeah, we did this and we did that.
But basically, Blake is hysterical and crazy and high maintenance and they're not even denying it. It's like Justin's saying, you know, Ryan Reynolds called me a sexual predator.
Like, what the heck? And it's like, well, why is he calling you a sexual predator? Like, maybe we should focus on that instead of like feeling bad that he said that about you. It's like the whole complaint is Justin's lawyer painting Justin as a victim to Blake's alleged behavior.
Like for example, he admits to reaching out to Blake's trainer to ask about her weight. Now he claims that had something to do with his back problems.
There's a debate whether there was a scene that did or didn't exist. And I'm like, who gives a shit about him? To me, I don't care about whether he had back problems or not, or with whether this scene existed.
Like if you actually think that it's appropriate for your coworker to reach out to your personal trainer and ask about your weight, then I can't help you. And if you want to convince yourself that that's normal behavior, but, and then like the, the birthing video, they admit to that again, they admit to like all these random behaviors and they're just trying to spin it.
I mean, it's gaslighting for all the people over the years who wrongly use the word gaslighting, just because when two people are in a fight and you disagree with them, this is literal gaslighting. Again, Justin's whole persona.
We actually bring up the TED Talk. I've talked about this TED Talk multiple times over the past couple episodes.
I think some of you need to hear some of these outtakes from Justin's TED Talk. I've been pretending to be a man that I'm not my entire life.
See that? I believe. I've been pretending to be strong when I felt weak, confident when I felt insecure and tough when really I was hurting.
I think for the most part, I've just been kind of putting on a show. I also believe that because I don't just want to be a good man.
I want to be a good human. And I believe the only way that can happen is if men learn to not only embrace the qualities that we were told are feminine and ourselves, but to be willing to stand up, to champion and learn from the women who embody them.
Again, this is a guy who talks about standing up and championing the women around them. The same guy who had the opportunity to hire the director of this movie.
Again, keep in mind, Justin is the co-founder of Wayfarer that bought the rights to this movie. And so as the production company that ran this movie, they hired the director.
And then when Justin had the opportunity to hire the director, he hired himself. And then he's given interviews since then talking about some of the more sensitive scenes in this movie that speak to the domestic violence.
And in those interviews, he talks about he relied on the women of this movie to make sure that they were getting the proper feedback. Well, again, this is not a guy who's championing women.
This is a guy who's using women. Instead of just hiring a woman and giving her the director credit that she could deserve or the paycheck that she could deserve and bring to life the many talented women in Hollywood who aren't getting opportunities, he could have done that and he chose not to.
But again, so if this person was real, this person who's giving this TED Talk meant what they said, that person would have hired a woman to direct this movie. Now, I've learned over time that if I want to practice vulnerability, then I need to build myself a system of accountability.
So I've been really blessed as an actor. I've built a really wonderful fan base, really, really sweet and engaged.
And so I decided to use my social platform as kind of this Trojan horse, wherein I could create a daily practice of authenticity and vulnerability. It's so interesting he uses the word Trojan horse because a Trojan horse is like your snake out.
Yeah, it's a fake. It's a fake.
You're implying that it's disingenuous and it's a way to kind of insert yourself into a community where people should otherwise think that you're the enemy, which I thought was an interesting choice of words. Maybe a Freudian slip.
I don't know. This next part is wild.
Are you brave enough to be vulnerable, to reach out to another man when you need help, to dive headfirst into your shame? Are you strong enough to be sensitive, to cry whether you are hurting or you're happy, even if it makes you look weak? Are you confident enough to listen to the women in your life, to hear their ideas and their solutions, to hold their anguish and actually believe them, even if what they're saying is against you? Oh my God. And will you be man enough to stand up to other men when you hear locker room talk, when you hear stories of sexual harassment, when you hear your boys talking about grabbing ass or getting her drunk, will you actually stand up and do something so that one day we don't have to live in a world where a woman has to risk everything and come forward to say the words, me too.
I mean, the self-own and the way this guy, man, is telling it himself. Again, people, if you're listening to this, ask yourself, if this man really bought into this, would he be handling this the way he is? Again, the evidence about his retaliation is pretty laid out pretty clearly.
And what's crazy about Justin's lawsuit, again, it's just tons of text messages of just trying to paint Blake in a bad light. It's just debating whether there's messages about bringing Taylor Swift in, talking about as if he were bullied into using parts of their song, whatever.
Blake always had a producer credit in this movie. It's incredibly common for people with a producer credit or big name actors to have input, to share their ideas.
And Justin's whole narrative is centered around that Blake shouldn't have been sharing ideas or she was too high maintenance. He also said in a text that we have read in one of these complaints where she tried to, he was like, always give, always feel free to let me know on stuff.
And she was like, I just wasn't sure if like, that's what you wanted me to do. He's like, no, you have, you are always welcome to share your ideas.
Yeah. So like, which one is it? Like, is she allowed to share ideas or not share ideas? Again, like one thing that people aren't talking about that I'm actually shocked about, again, Justin Wayfair bought the rights to this movie.
That's my understanding that they also financed a lot of this movie. I'm not familiar with the details of the contract, like point by point, but I am pretty sure because they financed it, Justin and Wayfarer, given the success of the movie, made a ton of money from the success of this movie.
They got a lot of back end profits. So assuming that's true, again, Justin's whole narrative is that Blake and Ryan hijacked this movie.
And then my question is to what end? What was, what was their motive? You know what I'm saying? Like, so you're telling me that they decided to make up a story about Justin's behavior, get her entire cast to buy into this alleged lie. Her entire team, her personal trainer, all had to join in on this conspiracy theory so that what what, Blake could have input? And then regardless of what her input that she had, Justin would still maintain his director credit.
Justin and Wayfair would still get all the profits. Blake didn't make any more money from the success of this movie.
I'm assuming she got her paycheck. So you mean to tell me that Blake and Ryan came up with this master plan? And regardless of what version they used, whether it was Blake or Justin's, if it was going to be successful, Justin and Wayfair were going to benefit.
So instead of leaving that story, I think people need to acknowledge that Blake decided to fight this fight. It would have gone away.
I'm assuming that if it weren't for their retaliation that blake would have just again those list of things that they wanted to fight just to get back into filming to feel safe and comfortable probably would have let it go but it was the whole retaliation part of justin investing a ton of money to try to destroy her credibility and brand by hiring these people who are known to take down people

online was why she is in fact fighting back. And she had the most to lose and nothing to gain

other than trying to get back her credibility from a guy who spent money trying to destroy it.

And I mean, shit, Natalie and I have been on flights the past couple of weeks. Now with all

this drama going on, everyone's watching this movie. It's gotten more popular and it's going

I don't think so i think they did that despite knowing that that would be a sad fallout to them fighting this fight and giving it more attention than it already had it's like again like you just got to ask yourself these very basic questions and instead of like deciding that you don't like blake lively because again she reminds you of something you went to high school with You actually just read the complaints. And like Justin, again, has a ton of text messages and you could read Justin's complaint and you could decide that Blake Lively is someone that you don't fuck with or someone that you don't like.
It does not answer the questions about Justin's behavior and specifically the retaliation, which is still going on. It's so obvious about the the bots like it's still obvious that the people he was paying back in august sure seemed like he's still paying them and they're still doing definitely hasn't fired them that's for sure yeah why fire them now you still need them because so much of what so much of what they talked about was about not flying under the radar not getting caught being covert about.
And, you know, honestly, I don't even think they use bots. I think they're far more sophisticated.
That's why it costs $25,000 a month to keep these people on their payroll. What's also crazy is that he went to leave L.A.
and... Pulled a Tom Sandoval? Called the paparazzi to make sure they shot him.
I mean, like. Play that.
Do we have that? He reminds me of Frank Booth from the David Lynch movie, Blue Velvet. And the girls that'll get it will get it.
You ever seen Blue Velvet, the David Lynch movie? No. No.
You wouldn't like it. But he reminds me of Frank Booth.
I mean, it's so obvious he called the paparazzi because it's this place in lax after you walk up the gates and as soon as justin comes up to escalator the tmz reporter immediately goes to him there's no like pause there's no like oh my god it's justin baldoni it was like they were doing a scene you know wait listen how are you doing grateful to be with the family. All right.
I know it's a tough time for you. How do you get through this? Oh, man.
We have amazing friends and family. I'll set you a screen if you need one.
And Faith. Faith? Thank you so much, man.
Have a great day. You got it.
What's also crazy about that is, like, LAX is huge. It's massive.
And the amount of celebrities that we've seen there, I've never once seen a paparazzi. We're still using TMZ? Literally.
Also, the fact that he's talking to TMZ, the amount of celebrities who just like, don't, they're like, I'm not like, come on. I'm with my family.
I'm dealing with this big thing. I'm just trying to get on an airplane.
Like, I'm not about to talk. And the fact that he's like, hey, man, how are you? Yeah, with my family he's not he doesn't look caught off guard yes it's like when you get when tmz approaches you it's very intrusive and you're kind of like look around you feel kind of uncomfortable i mean they come up with a huge camera and they're like hey hey what's going on talk about this talk about that and it's like oh my god i just gotta get out of he is.
He loves it. It's so obvious that he and his team called TMZ.

And again, his lawsuit doesn't even seem to be.

I'm not a lawyer for the courts, but it seems to be for us, the audience, and try to win people in the court of public opinion.

I actually do have a comment on that because I did want to just like read an opening statement

from his new lawsuit versus her lawsuit, where me, I read the 179 pages, and it was hard because it's like, I feel like I'm reading a novel. Like, your lawyer is an author because it's really hard to discern what's fact and what's not.
So, like, an opening statement on her lawsuit. On January 4th, 2024, prior to resuming filming of It Ends With Us following guild strikes and all-hands meeting, was convened to address the hostile work environment that has nearly derailed the production of the film.
His first opening statement, the following is not a story plaintiffs ever wish to tell. Unfortunately, defendant Blake Lively has unequivocally left them with no choice, not only to set the record straight in response to Lively's accusations, but to also put the spotlight on the parts of Hollywood that they have dedicated their careers to being the antithesis of.
That task was always going to be an uphill battle. Jesus.
They never imagined they would have to encounter it to this degree. And I was like, this is for Colleen Hoover readers.
That is a creative writing piece. That is not jargon.
The figurative language in this lawsuit where I'm like, though very eloquent. Yeah.
That is like an AP lit test. Thank you.
That's why I was like, show me the facts. Go back to the TED talk.
There's a part that Justin keeps telling on himself. I love how there's like two men in this.
But they made sure to get them in the shot. Serious stuff.
Serious stuff. I've had to take a real honest look at the ways that I've unconsciously been hurting the women in my life.
What a Freudian slip. And it's ugly.
My wife told me that I had been acting in a certain way that hurt her and not correcting it. Basically, sometimes when she would go to speak at home or in public, I would just cut her off mid-sentence and finish her thought for her.
It's awful. The worst part was that I was completely unaware when I was doing it.
It was unconscious. What else is he unconsciously doing? This is a man seemingly admitting to this behavior that he acts in ways towards women that he doesn't even realize he's doing it and it's unconscious.
But now he's allegedly done the work that he's seemingly incapable of being this guy who has, in his own words, hurt women in his life. But we also know that he admitted to in a text that we read from Justin Baldoni of having this plan to like like go see, go to the class or go to the session where he could like blame all of this on his ADD or ADHD or neurodivergency.
It's a very calculated person. And back to the allegation that Ryan allegedly called Justin a sexual predator.
If your partner was working with someone who made their whole platform about making an environment safe for women and being an ally to women and understanding women's plight and started calling their trainer to ask about her weight postpartum, by the way. And again, as someone who knows what it's like to be married to someone who just had a child, the vulnerability that all women feel about a lot of things, especially their body postpartum, and then here's Justin acting this way and then trying to paint himself as the victim is wild behavior.
And the amount of people who are just trying so hard to not believe Blake because they decided- But he has back problems. Because they don't like her.
His back hurts. And his chiropractor said he has to make sure if you're if you have back problems that like make it at risk then write out the scene such a loser like take the scene out like what like if you shouldn't be picking up people then don't pick up pick up anyone and regardless of how much blakeively weighs or doesn't weigh, you don't have

the right to go behind her back and ask about her weight. I also do think that there is something to be concerned about in the sense to where you could admit that you've made mistakes in the past, but you're claiming as if being a healed person means that you're incapable of making mistakes further.
Yeah. And that's the whole gaslight part about it.
It's like, imagine what it'd be like to work in this environment with this person who says, no, I'm the good guy. I'm the good guy.
I'm safe. I understand.
And then constantly does things like hire his friend. I know there's debate whether this friend that Justin hired was an actor or not actor Justin claims he was.
I know Blake didn't. But once again, if you're a man who understands the plight of women and wants to make them feel comfortable, wouldn't you hire a woman to play that doctor? You know, like, why is he hiring his male buddy? And again, there's this example after example how Justin is not the ally he claims to be.
He's not the feminist he claims to be, even though he made his whole plan. And also, if you all really are an ally, you don't have to yell it.
You don't have to scream it. You don't have to talk about it all the time.
You just do it. You just do.
You just do it when it comes up, when the opportunity presents itself. You support the people you love.
I mean, it's the classic saying, actions speak louder than words. And clearly, like, his actions are not speaking louder.
Well, and also, you can just do without having to broadcast it. Like, if you are an ally, if you are a good person, if you are somebody that's dedicated to helping other people, you don't have to talk about it every single time.
And again, the amount of people online talking about this alleged Deadpool scene and acting as if like Ryan Reynolds was inappropriate for cracking some jokes. I mean, I don't know what it would be like to be in Blake and Ryan's position, right? Like what they tried to do is try to finish the job.
They tried to, again, it wasn't like, oh, Justin started making all these people feel uncomfortable and she threw a big fit about it. No, she tried to squash it, tried to get things back on track so everyone can go back to work and just hope that they wouldn't retaliate.
That was their ultimate goal. And then, so they tried to, I guess, I don't know, deal with it.
I mean, for all the people who are claiming that Ryan allegedly was mocking Justin Baldoni, if that's true, again, how does that make Blake's accusations less credible? I would do that and more if I were in Ryan's position,

I would absolutely mock the guy.

I would want to fight back any way I could,

you know,

they're probably limited in ways they can fight back.

I would imagine they'd probably been talking to the lawyers and things like

that,

you know,

but the,

the,

the amount of focus the internet is giving this as opposed to,

again,

Stephanie Jones's complaint and all the shocking text messages that are in that and the shocking text messages that like very clearly lay out that Justin hired this team and very much had the intention of trying to make Blake Lively look bad online. It's just like crazy.
I saw this TikToker, Saatchi, who said, it feels like he's acting. It's a dangerous game that a lot of men will go into where they're kind of telling on themselves for overdoing it in regards to him.
I don't know. For all that Team Justin people out there, I don't know.
You're kind of telling on yourself. It's not that hard.
And again, go look at his engagement video. This is a man who spent 30 minutes acting and performing skits that had nothing to do with his relationship and made the woman that he was about to propose to sit there and just watch him act.
It was a Justin Baldoni performance about Justin Baldoni, featuring Justin Baldoni, starring Justin Baldoni, directed by Justin Baldoni. And honestly, I don't even know his wife's name.
For a man who wants to elevate women and hold up women and showcase women, boy, his wife sure lives in the shadows. Also that photo of them, like supposedly in the basement during the, like it ends with us.
They sure looked fucking happy to be in the basement. They're all like, well, they could have left so happy.
They could have like, if you're like shunned and sent to the basement, wouldn't you be like, but again, were shunned because you made blake and her entire team feel you feel really uncomfortable her entire team like jenny slate and landon skenar who all and her hairdresser colleen hoover herself assistant colleen hoover all come and like back up blake's story but people want to still like find reasons not to believe her it's shocking to me and, Brandon, I didn't realize he was the same actor in 1923. He's an absolute badass in that.
He's in a lot of stuff. Yeah, he's really great.
I didn't realize that was him. Also, I know a lot of people have been in my stuff being like, I hope you give the same amount of attention to Justin's lawsuit.
And it's like, we read it, and then we're like, this is bullshit, and we give our opinion on this show. And our opinion is we're team Blake.
So. But yeah, it's a lot of text messages between Justin and Blake.
And it's just painting Justin as a victim. It's text messages between Justin and his team being annoyed with Blake, being frustrated with Blake.
And again, they're trying to paint Blake as the high maintenance, overbearing, demanding mean girl that they're claiming her to be. A lot of the lawsuit is centered around this Blake making the wardrobe come to her.
Again, this is someone who just gave birth to her fourth child. God forbid that she wanted the wardrobe to come to her to make her life a little bit easier so that maybe she could spend more time with her kids.
And again, I would think that the guy giving that TED talk would be more than happy to accommodate that request as opposed to painting her in the light that he's so badly trying to paint her. It's like you can, Blake could be everything people say about her.
And that still does not mean that she should be harassed. Like you can be, you can.
Don't like blake yeah you can hate blake and think she's a shitty person and think she sucks and think she's like all of these things and whatever and that still does not mean that it didn't negate that yeah it does not negate like you can be a shitty person and still like not deserve to have things happen to you yeah and the amount of people out there deciding that blake Blake is a mean girl. Yeah, she's not a perfect victim.
Or she's not a girl's girl. They decided that, well, they're almost like, well, she kind of deserved it.
Yeah, nobody deserves it. It's fucking crazy.
Misogyny. It's misogyny, yeah.
It's just stupid. Anyways, I don't know.
As always, as I said since August, ask yourself smart questions, the right questions, and just take Blake out of it. Take the person out of it and just read the claims.
And I don't know how you can take some of that stuff out of context. Watch Justin's videos and ask yourself, is this guy sincere? Is he real? Or is he just telling it himself? Or is it just an act to cover up a guy who just obviously has been problematic how did tmz know that he was taking that 5 30 delta flight to wherever the fuck he's going also that looks like i could be wrong but judging by how lax looks that looks like post security no it's it's right up the escalator it's right before you go into tsa he was flying delta oh yeah he was flying delta yeah okay but it's like how how did that how did that tmz guy know that no why didn't why wouldn't he think he's flying american watch the video again there's no pause there's no reaction the guy the camera was ready because again when tmz finds you they like the guy's just like standing there these tmz people just hang around these areas and when they find find you, then they'll roll the camera.
This camera was rolling before Justin came up the escalator. Does this guy have, is he a psychic? All right.
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TikTok is back. TikTok.
Well, it was gone for eight hours. I mean, the crying that I saw on social media.
No, the confessions on TikTok. Yes.
All of these creators started outing themselves like within 24 hours of the app closing down yeah so there was this uh trending sound that they were using and some like you've got fitness creators saying that they never did the workouts that they posted you've got food creators food creators being like like there's one guy that like bakes things in his car or something because he lives in arizona and it's like he's like not all of the uh baking like the success of the baking videos turned out so it's like all of these people are starting to come forward outing themselves thinking that the app is going to be completely gone forgetting the fact meredith doxford is that her last name doxford who like went viral for doing so much makeup and she was like rapping and it was so cool she was like i wiped off half of those layers like everything until i'm like i thought about trying it i didn't do it because i was like what a waste of makeup but like things that people actually went home after watching these people's videos and did come to find out i'll fake all for for why were they admitting it because they're like it's going away let me just like give my last confession of that's awesome is what. But there's other platforms out there.
Well, that's the problem. And that's the like kind of the best part of it all is it kind of like outed a lot of content creators for being fake.
But it's like they forgot the fact that it's like if TikTok is gone, you're going to have to go to a different platform. And now nobody trusts you.
I mean, after talking to Emily Baker, I'm. Darwinism.
I'm a little I'm a little sad. I mean, I don't again, I don't use it as a consumer.
We use it, obviously. We post our videos on it.
Thankfully, I have a team who posts that for me. But I don't remember the last time I was scrolling because I just want to protect my mental health.
I mean, it is also very sad because I do know it was one of the most women-dominated industries. I know a lot of women who- Oh, TikTok? Oh, yeah.
I i mean providing for their family like the the amount of money that these women were able to make off of this app i mean it yeah oh my god mom talk like will mom talk survive no it did i guess yeah i mean so like that's back now i don't know i don't know i mean i i think it's very sad that like all of these people who were making money and providing for their families lost that in seconds. Obviously now it is back.
So it's a little like, but I just wish that people would put this amount of energy into like child trafficking.

You know, like, come on.

High speed railway systems.

Like world hunger. It's like we could do something if we all just cared about this equally as much as we cared about TikTok.
I would like a high speed rail system. Right? Something.
Right? Yeah. But anyway, so it's back.
It's back. And you know who's back on? It's Spencer Pratt.
It continues to promote his wife, Heidi Montauk, who is now a pop superstar. And following in their footsteps, Leighton Meester's fans are trying to get her song somebody to love, and they're buying her song.
The big question is, is Adam Brody going to step up in the way that Spencer Pratt has? Because I don't think this has the longevity that it's had with Heidi, if not for Spencer. He's been his wife's best PR manager, agent, fan, and it's absolutely worked in the best possible way.
So I would love to see Adam Brody step up for his wife. I think this is more of like a fans thing and less of Leighton and Adam want her to be the number one super pop star.
Okay. So she doesn't want to be? I haven't talked to her.
Okay. Yeah.
So I don't know. But I just think this is more of like, you know, clearly this was Heidi and Spencer.
It was led by Spencer. It was Spencer, you know, and I think this is more so fans being like, well, hey, Leighton Meester also has a couple songs out.
We should also try to get her up there as well. Spencer and Heidi keep saying they're coming on.
So hopefully they're coming on on Wednesday. We'll see.
You know, she's very busy being a new pop superstar. So we will hopefully have them on Wednesday.
An update on Leighton. I guess her song is in the pop charts again.
And big supporter Flavor Flav posted to Hype up his- Was also a supporter of Heidi's song. So maybe Flavor Flav is really the musical curator.
He also saved Red Lobster. You want to talk about an ally? Talk about selfless.
Flavor Flav, right? He really is like taking care of the common. Yeah.
I'm also so hip to what's going on on the internet. He is.
Oh my god. When he met Paul Simon, that was a very beautiful day for me.
It was really cute. Anyway.
I'm not familiar with that day. A recent study reveals that people who walk faster may be less happy in life.
Yeah. I walk real fast.
I walk so slow. I'm so happy.
Nick calls me pokey all the time. When I was little, my family used to call me Sid the Sloth because I would...
You look pokey. What? I don't even know what that's referring to.
Saying you look slow, like you walk slow. You just look like you're not in a rush.
I'm not. Never in my life have I been in a rush.
Pokey, is that a Midwest thing? Yeah, 100% because I've never heard that.

I've never heard that my entire life.

I think it's in the South too.

The hokey pokey?

Pokey.

You're being pokey?

No, I'm pokey.

That's in the South too.

Yeah, just like slow.

Just slow.

Yeah.

Like if we're in an airport and our thing,

like we're going to like,

they're going to shut the doors on us.

Nick is there and I'm coming.

Just go.

Make him wait for me.

And what pisses me off even more is like the constant look back to see just like How far I'm like don't Look at me I'm coming Wait Nick Do you ever do like The backwards tour guide walk Because you're walking so fast That you have to like Talk to like someone But also walk your normal speed He did that to me While we were roller skating I was trying to help you Roller skate I know And it was not I was just like Oh you're going backwards And I'm literally grasping the wall for my life Sorry He's going backwards on one foot I was mansplaining roller skating Y'all know that Nick has not I'm holding hands Y'all know that Nick has not had sugar coffee or weed at all in two weeks I had one coffee Oh yeah I had one no sugar. I'm not even...
Natalie ordered an Honor Palmer, my favorite drink ever, and I just watched her drink it. You ordered an unsweetened tea, though.
Yeah. Emphasis on unsweetened.
Accountability. It's good to have.
No, but I am so proud of him because for someone who dabbled in extracurricular activities for so long and then to just cut cold turkey and honestly hasn't... He hasn't been like, oh i wish like i haven't heard a peep out of him it's like he hasn't even thought about it i did see him yesterday open up what used to be a drawer of extracurricular activities it just kind of was like looking no you missed the part where i saw some residue and the bottom of the tray on two trays and i collected the residue to see if it could work and i then i was like this no and i threw it away i threw it away you must have done that and you're i could have used it and it was like it was mostly extracurricular activities and then maybe like you know a paper clip paper clip some dust you know pencil fibers who knows It was a smorgasbord of a junk drawer.
It would make you feel something. It would, yeah.

Yeah. paperclip some dust you know pencil fibers who knows it was a smorgasbord of yeah of a junk drawer it would make you feel something it would yeah yeah i i opted to throw it away and and uh i i'm uh i was gonna say are all these like fast and choices so that you can post thirst traps like dillenefron the body's coming back i haven't really been able to work out much lately because like air quality not good and uh and uh i haven't been able to do that but yeah i'm uh i look in the mirror and i see me you know i see you yeah no i'm uh i don't know i don't eventually i might throw i might i might sneak in a thirst trap when when i if i if i really get the body back and just be like oh my God, oops Dad bod I mean Nick's page is all podcast stuff So then to just have like Just a thirst trap in there I wonder if Matt James would comment Yeah would he give me two balloons LMAO Way to do all those pushups Congratulations peaches.
Father God just told me you look hot as fuck. I was in Target this weekend, Nick, and I saw Sour Candies, and I thought of you, and I was like, should I? I was like, I have to fast with it.
You bought me? A different kind, but I was like, it said Sour, and I was like, he would like that. If you find those again, then you should buy them.
You'll break the fast for that. Well, I mean, eventually, I don't know.
Yeah, eventually I'll know I really There is no trying honey You eat the whole thing Yeah that's true We have just you know Later in this episode The great Wells Adams Joins us to talk about His very mini short stint On Traders But he is in Times Square So like He is in Times Square Next to Alan Cummings Pretty cool flex And the dog And Michael Imperioli You know him from Sopranos You know him from Season 2 White Lotus He is with us in Times Square. Next to Alan Cummings.
Pretty cool flex. And the dog.
And Michael Imperioli. You know him from Sopranos.
You know him from season two White Lotus. He is with us and he's promoting the restoration of the iconic film Girlstown.
So excited to talk with him. I'm excited to ask him about some White Lotus stuff.
We got season three coming up. I'm curious about his time on White Lotus.
So that should be fun. Also, tomorrow we have a very special Going Deeper for you all, so get ready for that.
Just a little reminder before we get into Southern Charm, Vile Files Plus is out there, available, and many of you are missing out, let me tell you. Our Pop Extra episodes, all your favorite pop culture topics we didn't get to talk about in Reality Recap.
We have our update for all you ask nick fans out there all your juicy updates as well as our vanderpump recaps if you are missing vanderpump well as many of us are we'll bring you back to all the juicy and salacious stuff where uh you know people like ike kennedy really you know show their true colors and things like that you can sign up on vilefiles.com or if you listen to it on Apple, just sign up right there. It's free to sign up.
Give it a seven-day free trial. So check it out.
Should we do some reality TV? Yeah. Did you see Shep Rose is no longer with his girlfriend, Sienna? No? What happened? Well, after that conversation he had with Molly, I would hope that his girlfriend would be like, um...
Yeah, After that scene with Molly, because I said to Molly, they make sense.

Yeah.

There's something there.

Yeah.

Why are Shep and Sienna rumored to be broken up?

Well, it's not rumored because he confirmed it.

Well, he said it.

So basically he was saying how there is this incident where she didn't buy a plane ticket

for a trip they were taking.

So she was waiting for him to buy it.

So then he was like, OK, I'll buy it. And then basically this is what he said, she said.
Where I come from, the man takes care of everything. That's a bad thing to think and to practice, frankly.
So anyhow, I was like, maybe we should take a step back. And she was like, yeah, okay.
I couldn't agree more. So she said, I expect you to do everything, pay for everything.
And he was like, yikes, I don't know how I feel about that. And she was like, well then maybe we should break up.
Yeah. I mean, when Natalie and I were dating and she was flying to LA to see me, I paid for the flights, but I offered.
And I was like, to me. He invited me out.
So like, if you're inviting me somewhere, you better fucking pay. But like, at a time where like, yeah, I wanted her to come to me.
I felt like I was in a position to do that financially. But what Natalie never said to me is i expect you to do this you have to do this a man pays for everything no but it is like hey um i want you to come to australia with me and it's like okay you want me to buy that ticket to australia like yeah you want me to come with you and you want me to also pay how many dollars for a flight like i'm just saying like if you would have ever early in our dating situation this point blank made a statement that like it's your job to pay for me point blank period yes i do not agree with that i would have been like yuck ew ick yeah i don't i don't agree with that uh mindset i know that is a lot of people in the south especially's mindset it's a's a very like old way of thinking of like, man takes care of the family.
And like, for sure. I love taking care of my family, but like, there's this, you, you remove the, I guess it's like you remove the love language from it.
But also they're not a family yet. Like they've been dating for just dating.
Yeah. Like if you, if you are like an active service person and you like doing things for the person you love, as soon as that person says, this is an expectation and this is your job to do it, it removes that ability to feel like you're doing something for that person you love that I want to go out of my way and take care of you.
I want to go out of my way and do something nice. It doesn't feel nice when it feels like your job.
Required. And it's required.
And so I would absolutely be like, you know what, we're just not meant to be. Wanted to clarify, so they took a break because of it.
So they might be back together. Yeah.
It's not going to last. Probably not.
It was never going to last, but you know. I mean, again, in this episode of Southern Charm, he was like all up on Somali calling her, I mean honking at her from the side

and he's like, you look good.

I'm going to pull over and

talk to you and also like

you need to give yourself so much more credit.

I mean, look at you. Wow.
It's just

you're and then he's like, yeah, so me and Sienna, we're

actually doing really good.

He's like, I'm going to listen to classical music

for you. Yeah, that's give it.

It's giving crush coming to her concert.

Was that a

fake drowning incident? Like classical music for you. Yeah, it's giving crush.
He's coming to her concert. Was that a fake drowning incident? Like, what's going on? I don't know.
Vinita's not the type to fake, but that scene looked so fake. I was so confused.
I thought I missed something. We need a little spice up this party.
And she was like, hold my drink. And then Craig came to quote unquote save the day.
It was hot. It did look wonderful.
It did look wonderful. Him like lifting her out of the pool.
Yeah. Still diving into the pool and then being like, I got this.
Or all the guys who just like stood there and watched. Actually, did you see the cameraman? It looked like the cameraman close to the pool, like tried to put down the camera and then saw Craig.
And then also realized he's got like packs and all of these things. But yeah, Craig had his phone in his pocket, too.

I don't know if y'all noticed that when he was like pulling out.

And I was like, oh, my God, what a gentleman.

Yeah.

Then all the other guys really look bad who are just like standing there.

Whitney really made me laugh in this episode, though.

Just him, like just his personality of just not wanting to be there.

And then just being snarky the whole time did make me giggle.

And the fact that I was kind of bored the whole episode.

He is the executive producer.

Yeah. He's bored of his own show.
Yeah. He well i'm so happy i'm here tonight who is the other girl that taylor was fighting with sally are we team sally are team taylor for sure taylor i feel like you know but even back to last season with olivia i just we've met taylor we've had her on i just she doesn't seem to be this lying manipulative backstabbing not a girl's girl that it seems like so many of her castmates are trying to paint her in maybe she just has us fooled but like I don't know I just feel like maybe they don't like her because she's you know

they see her

as competition

well also she didn't say

who in the group

said not to trust her

we never saw that

on camera

I fucking hate that

if you're gonna say people

tell me who it is

name them

name them

not just random accusation

oh you know

everyone says this about you

I fuck you

fuck off

just so you know

there's a group of people

that talk about you

we all feel the same way

but I can't out them

because I'm loyal

no

No, that's... You know everyone says this about you I fuck you Just so you know there's a group of people that talk about you We all feel the same way but I can't out them because I'm loyal Immediately you're wrong If you're the person who says that you're so wrong Also Sally's boyfriend Is giving Justin Baldoni Gaston T No no no Andrew Sally's boyfriend I understood the situation.
And then as I kept watching it, I was like, I think I have all these people backwards. I'm so confused.
They're all blonde. The immediate he's come on to set.
We've never seen him before. And the throat grab that he did on Sally for a kiss.
The Hawaiian shirt. Connor wanted to turn off the TV.
The throat grab. And he did it twice.
And like aggressive for no reason. In the bedroom, do your thing.
We all love a little, you know, tension. But like that, a greeting on camera is your introduction.
Grabbing her throat and pulling her in for a kiss. I kind of like Sally.
I don't because I don't respect the way that she's going about this whole Taylor Gaston thing for her to sit there and be like, he's part of my past. I deserve a right to talk about him.
Sure. Yeah, you do.
But you're also you're in a relationship and now he's in a relationship and you're only doing this to like have some sort of storyline to like have something to share with the other women to like talk about. That's the only reason you're doing doing this like if if this like relationship was something that like you really felt i don't know it just seems like it's very performative to me and like you're in this new relationship so why are you like talking about him and then to be like he fucking called me and told me to keep his name out of my mouth well yeah i would too having the right to do something doesn't make you not a douchebag for doing it Like I don't think I fully realized who Sally was Because she is Blonde hair show, brown hair interview It is very confusing Really confusing for me That's all If I have to watch one more scene of Austin Crying over Craig I'm gonna lose it.
Yeah. And I don't, why, why is Madison, like, is it, is this, this all seems fake? I mean, Craig didn't even meet up with JT.
They did a scene. They did a scene.
And it wasn't even like them getting along. It was them like hashing out their differences.
It was them having a fake conversation. Cause you've got JT in his interviews being like, oh, I'm holding back.
And I just, there's so much I want to say. And he's just like, hey, buddy, are we going to be friends? Are we can we be cool? Because he's a puss.
Exactly. But I'm just like, there was no point of us even watching that.
Craig was like, all right, guess we're cool, man. And JT's like, we're not cool, but we are cool.
I don't know. The whole thing just makes zero sense.
I think Molly added context on our episode last week where she said everybody's acting like his accident was nothing when it was more than like it was dangerous. So that gives context of like I think clearly JT looks like he feels invalidated.
Like people are looking at him like he's weird saying he's doing stuff he's not doing when it's like. But again, I mean, maybe he had a very serious accident, but like he can still be doing weird things.
But Craig saying there's an audio or that he said something where we don't even have audio existing of it is kind of like now you're gaslighting him.

Why would Craig make that up?

Well, I think I think it was proven to like Craig embellishes and he like likes to add on to a story here and there.

And like on Watch What Happens Live, they're like, you're a bit of a liar.

And he was like, me, what?

And then they played like several instances where he lied.

And it's like, OK, he's kind of messy like that. And they all said it.
Even then I will say JT is not my favorite person on reality television at all. But I'm like, I will give him.
I'm like, he's not the type of person. He's very clean cut in the way that he speaks that I'm like, it's giving like Southern gentlemen.
I don't think he would use a term like that to call an older woman out of her name. I just really don't.
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Coverage information is subject to change by the relevant payer. Anyways, that does it for Southern Charm.
I hope they figure it out. I can't do any more Austin and Craig.
Anyways, now it's time for our friend and the first elimination from traders, Wills Adams.

Glad you threw that in there. You were so pissed.

You were so mad.

I was so angry.

We were so angry too.

We were angry for you.

Yeah.

It was so fucked the way it happened.

It's like.

Yeah, I did not see it coming.

I bet you didn't.

Yeah.

I bet you didn't.

I was like, what are you guys talking about right now?

It made zero sense.

And I bet at that round table,

because obviously that came out of nowhere. So were you just kind of like, what do I even say? How do I defend myself right now? I had a little bit of heads up.
Dylan came to me like 10 minutes before we went to the round table and was like, yo, I'm hearing your name. And I'm like, what? And he's like, yeah, I don't understand it either.
It doesn't make any sense. And he's like, you should go do some politicking around the house.
And I'm like, yeah, saying it you know like what do i gotta do and i like walk away from dylan and then it's like producers like stop talking we're going into the round table and i'm like what i need one second which it makes sense like i would want all of my like politicking to happen at the round table like i get it from their standpoint but uh i was like, what? And especially when I watched the show back, I was watching, I guess, last night, Nikki finds out that her name's being called, so she has time to walk around and be like, what are you guys talking about? I wasn't given that opportunity. It's tough, though, because when you get accused of something, everyone thinks they're good people readers and things like that, but if someone was like, you're a traitor, like it's hard not to be like.
Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Like to not find the words and stumble over your words and then have people think that maybe that means you're lying and things like that.
Yeah. I mean, like, so what happened to me was I'm stupid.
That's why. Like, I'm an idiot.
Like, you know, hindsight 2020. Right.
So. Are you talking about the Because I do want to ask you about the boat.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. We can go through the whole thing.
But my downfall was saying I thought what the traders did was stupid. Which I stand by what I said.
Definitely. I stand by you, too.
It was stupid. That's not really the point.
No, it's not. But as I watch it, I'm like, these are dumb moves.
Like, I will die on this hill. I did die on the hill, actually.
You did, yeah. You're murdered.
But yeah. You're usually Mr.
Affable Wells. Oh, I know.
Does the, keeps his opinions to himself. Hey, guys, stop arguing.
Let's just crack open a beer and have a good time. I'm the guy who ruffles feathers early.
Like, I was just like, what is he doing? Well, here's the thing. The thing that I said was not considered controversial by anyone except for two people.
Yeah. First of all, I wasn't the only one who said that.
Everyone said what I said, because what happened was the night before everyone, I would say 90% of the cast was like, Dorin's a traitor, right? And we're like, yeah, 100%. And so we were like, all right, so we're going to banish her tomorrow, right? And that's how we went to bed thinking, right? And then we wake up and she's gone.
She's been murdered. And we're like, everyone was like, but we were going to do that.
Like, why would you kill someone that we were already going to banish? Get a threat out. So everyone said it.
And then where I went wrong was, is I was sitting in the billiards room and Robin and Sam walk in and we're all talking about it. And everyone is also saying like, yeah, what are we going to do now? That was so dumb.
And so she's like, what do you guys think? And I say the thing that I say, and she got really defensive. And right then I was like like oh no like I thought what I was saying was a universal truth like she would be like oh yeah I feel the same way yeah uh but then you know like looking back it makes sense like she's a housewife she I think she was kind of defending a housewife in some way looking back I shouldn't have said what I said but I wasn't the That's what's really frustrating.
Yeah. You know? Reality TV edit.
Yeah, I know. Can we talk about the boat? Let's talk about the boat.
What were you thinking on the boat? Because, again, maybe it was edited, but what we saw as you guys get in the boat, everyone's rowing, you and Sierra are like manning the ship. I didn't even know why that job required two people in the first place and then as the boat ride continues all the women get kicked off the boat all the guys are like we need to be strong enough to row the boat meanwhile you're still being like row row and i'm like wells row row the boat like if i'm one of the people in the boat i'm pissed at you for just yelling at me for two hours while not rowing the boat.
Yeah, that's because I guess you've never been on a dragon boat probably before. So someone has to steer.
Like, so I was in charge of the rudder. Is that a physically demanding job? Well, if no one's doing that, then the boat doesn't go in the direction you want it to so that's why it's a two-person job well so this is this is how it was explained to us it was we need someone to steer the boat and then we need someone to like yell out row but okay that explains it too and i knew i knew i was in trouble at that exact moment because like my plan going into the show was don't say anything basically what dylan actually dylan's become very boisterous he's talking but in the beginning he was just like i'm staying under the radar and i was like i'm gonna do that too and we were kind of like an ally uh alliance in the beginning and the second we get down to the dock they're like all right even productions like this is what you have to do you have someone needs to be the one yelling out someone needs to be steering and then also i think it was like a seat thing like there wasn't enough seats for like sierra to go sit in row i guess maybe that could have changed when she got out but anyways that's how it was explained and immediately it everyone was like wells you're the loudest you're the most opinionated you're the leader you get up there and you steer and, oh, damn it.
Like I'm five minutes into doing this show and I've already fucked up my plan of like going under the radar. Like you're allowed.
You're like, who said? Yeah. I was like, oh, no.
So that explains. Yeah.
So I and also like they did cut this, but there was a little bit of like toxic masculinity thing going on of like the weak women need to get off the boat and the strong men need to stay in row. And there was a little bit of like, that's gross.
And also like Nikki can like bench press me. She's much stronger than I am.
So I was like, this is dumb. So there was a point where as much as I wanted a shield, I felt bad.
And I was like, Hey guys, if I'm not doing a good job of steering the boat, I will get off like I feel bad for all the women that are like kind of getting thrown to the wolves and everyone was like shut up we need you to steer you're doing a great job just don't worry about it we got it figured out down here and I'm like oh they threw it into the bus there okay okay so I'm glad thank you for offering that context yes did you watch Ion sob at leaving? Like, were you, like, did you watch that with the rest of us? Yeah. Or did you know that she was that upset? Well, I know we were really, like, she was my favorite.
She might be my favorite person. No offense, Nick.
She might be my favorite person I've ever met on a reality TV show. I've never had the illusion that I was your favorite person.
Well, you're in the top 10. 10.
But she was so like in a world full of just like vapid, just, you know, egocentric people. She was like the most lovely person I've ever met.
In 2017, she DM'd me and told me I was full of myself. Oh, I saw the video.
And that makes me love her even more. That is the and then i saw that she like liked something like later or whatever yeah i messaged her and i gave her a heads up that like we talked about it because i didn't want to like throw her under the bus and then she finally unsent them i'm like we've already seen it no she was such like this amazing like light of like beauty like and out too.
She had no idea what game she was playing. My favorite thing was, is that we were riding like to the castle or whatever.
You're in cars a lot when you're not filming, you know? And so a producer is reading her the rules so that she can sign like the rule, right? This needs to be done before we start filming. So if I'm Ayan, you're me, and then you're the producer.
Producer's reading and she's just looking at me being like, okay, so tell me about your wife. Look at that on your wife.
Oh my God. Mother and family.
I love mother and family. And so the producer's like, Ayan, you need to focus.
You need to focus. And she's like, I can do two things at once.
She cannot do two things at once she the whole time she was like wells what is happening what is happening and i'm like explaining her the rules and her whole thing was she was like my son thinks i'm going to be the first one killed and so she was so pumped that she wasn't the first one killed which was like so cute but then she was like the third one and i'm like no dude why what were the traders thinking again Again I think that that was I think that what Bob the drag queen his whole thing was he wanted chaos which I do think that's a fun and a good strategy but chaos also doesn't breed accusing people of murdering people chaos also? Chaos also implies no strategy.

Yeah, it's very true.

In a way.

With the chaos of Dorinda being killed,

it made no sense because we think we all thought

we were going to banish her the next day.

So then it became this mad dash of who do we all

kind of glob onto, which was unfortunately yours truly.

But the Ayan one made no sense to me

because you can't pin it on somebody. This is why iron would be killed you know and then also there are a lot of really really strong players in the game and no offense to i am like she's not like a strategical genius you know like i i would have taken out you know like like a wes long before now i don't think actually he could have been up for murder, but do you know what I'm saying? That's why it made no sense to me.
And it also wasn't leading people down a path to blame someone else that wasn't a traitor. Yeah.
To your point, traitors or faithful, whoever they were, there's some clearly people in the cast that self-identidentify as like game players, strategic players.

And you would think that you would just take them out first,

just to be like,

well,

at least we got the game players out.

Now we have to deal with this housewives and bachelors.

Yeah.

Like if I'm,

if I'm a,

yeah.

If I'm a,

if as a faithful,

like you're just like,

cause at the end of the day,

you're all competing against each other.

Yeah.

Right.

So like,

you know,

just take out,

I mean, I guess unless, unless you think Rob's a faithful, I don't know. I think you should take him out because eventually Rob's going to Rob for Rob.
Yep. You know? As we saw.
I think you should just take out Rob. Well, I think that's what they realized, obviously, with this last episode.
I called that shit so hard. Yeah.
Them being like, how does he 100% know? Yeah. I said...
I didn't't think it was gonna happen literally the next episode but I said boss or Rob's going to backstab Bob the drag queen and uh yeah I think that um like I don't know I know him but I don't know it's in his mind but I I think that he was getting frustrated with Bob was not only kind of like running the round table as he's also running the turret and and I think that he thought that the decisions that uh Bob the dragon was making was bad and I think that Caroline kind of agreed with him in that respect and I think for Rob's game um he was like I need to get rid of this guy because I want to have control over the turret and I think that like strategically I'm a better game player he is. And I would agree with that.
I just think that he showed his hand a little too early because Dylan was already wanting to go down that route. And then he like really like globbed on.
How do you think Boston Rob gets out of the target he's put on himself? I don't know how he gets out of it, but I don't know if enough people, like they're all sitting in bar and they're and Wes makes the genius point of like, how do you 100% know, you know? And so then everyone's like, it takes everyone a while. And the person who figures it out, like answers the question is Tom Standoval, which I love.
And he's like, he's a traitor. He's like, yeah, you know, broken clocks right twice.
Tom accused everyone of being a traitor, which was wonderful. And that was one of the things that frustrated me the most about the round table of which i was banished was that tom went on like a you know a 20 minute diatribe about chrischelle and like he know he's like i could tell from the way that she took off her thing and i remember being like dude shut up man they up, man.
They're going to kill me. No one cares about Chris Shell.
No one thinks this is... I was like, dude, stop talking.
Let me defend myself or defend me, I guess. But yeah, he was throwing a lot of spaghetti at the wall.
You know Tom's going to go decently far because he's not a threat to anyone. But that's what I thought about Ian too.
That's a good point. It doesn't make sense why she got voted out it's weird though i do think maybe it's a criticism of bachelor nation but the other franchises like the housewives survivor big brother they protect their own and i feel like bachelor nation we're all in it for ourselves i don't think there's any i don't remember you and gabby like did she vote for you at the round she didn't no i was friends with the girls i was for the bambis because i was like abby's in the group yeah yeah because from on the way back from the dragon boat race we were all in the same car the bambis the band yeah what a name to give yourself i know chef's kiss uh so six-pack bros yeah they were like because because i had said like if you guys want me to get out i will i don't want to but like i'll get out just to make it fair that like also like i'm not doing anything and i remember gaby being like you're an ally and i'm like yes yes i am do you think that comment of like i'll get out but i don't want to is seen as like you trying to like, no, no.
Because I was very much like, I do not want to do this, please. But and so what do you think ultimately caused you to have the target on your back? Other than like people saying, oh, you're the most outspoken, blah, blah, blah.
Oh, no, I doesn't make you a traitor. I think it's two things.
Well, I think it's a bunch of things. But I think that me saying to Robin and Sam, I thought it was a dumb move to kill Dorinda and then her getting defensive and then me feeling very weirded out by that.
I was like, because in my mind, I'm like, OK, you're getting really defensive of me saying it was a dumb move. Surely you're not a traitor and dumb enough

to show that me saying a traitor's move is stupid

would affect you like this.

Yeah.

Did you say that at the round table?

Yeah, I did.

That's a good argument.

Can I ask you, how long is the round table session?

And then also, what did you say to defend yourself

that we didn't get to see on television?

Okay.

A, maybe an hour and a half. Really? Yeah, it's really long.
Okay. I was not expecting that.
Yeah. Yeah.
They cut out a lot. Like I fought- It's like five minutes.
Yeah. I know.
I fought a lot of people. I fought Tony a good bit.
My thing was, is that he had come and said something to the effect of right after the touching of the shoulders, who does everyone

think is a traitor? And I was like, well, I want to go backwards. I want to go and exit out people who I do not think are traitors and then hone it down and then figure it out from there.
Because I was like, Ian, definitely not a traitor. Tom Sandoval, worst casting decision in the world to make the biggest villain in America a villain again.
Yeah, of course. I was like, not a traitor.
You know, like me, not a traitor. Dylan Efron, no.
You know, like I was like doing that. And he was like, that's a real traitorous way of thinking.
And I was like, Tony, you're a cop. Isn't the number one thing to X out like who has alibis in a murder case? Like, what are you talking about? Also, you should have probably been like,

well, if you vote me off,

like you're going to look really like not a good cop.

Yeah.

Okay, so the first question was how long does it go?

And then-

What did you say to defend yourself

that we didn't get to see?

Okay, so the truth of the matter is,

is that the next mission that we had

was the three guys in the bird cages

and we were all running around

trying to get coins to bring them down.

I thought that I had a target on my back from the trader

and mission that we had was the three guys in the bird cages and we were all running around trying to get coins to bring them down i thought that i had a target on my back from the traders because i said that that their move was stupid and so i really wanted to get a shield but then i had like a whole plan and we can go into the plan in a second but everyone was getting down boss and rob and then people were getting down derrick and no one was getting down And I was like, I'm a huge fan of the challenge. And I also like just know if you kind of like attach your wagon to either Wes or CT or Johnny Bananas in the challenge, you kind of get, you can kind of ride that to the end.
So I was like, Wes, you're my boy. I'm getting you down.
And what they didn't really show was I would say like 90% of the coins that were got for Wes was from me. And so it was Dylan and I who were just like doing wind sprints up and down this thing.
People kind of like quit on it and were like not trying to get coins as much. Once we got two guys down.
You're good at untying knots. Yeah.
The knots one was annoying, but the one that was the hardest, you know, kind of sprint up a hill and then like throw, they didn't show all of them, had to throw rocks at these bags then knock them down and then run back down and so no one wanted to do that because you had to run up this hill so it ended up being dylan and i were the only ones running up and down the hill anyway so i get him down and i'm like keeled over like cannot catch my breath at the end of it we had to like stop and like wait for me to catch breath before we like continued filming. So one of my arguments was like, I think I'm going to be killed by a traitor.
I worked so hard to get Wes down. Why would I be running like this if I didn't care? And then they didn't show this part, but Wes chimes in.
He's like, it's true. Wells got me down.
Like he was running really, really hard. I think if he was a traitor, he probably wouldn't have been like going that balls to the wall.
So that was one of my arguments. I don't know.
Do you feel like they just didn't have anyone else? Yeah, for sure. Because it was supposed to be Dorinda.
Yeah. Because what happened with Dorinda was she was the first one off the boat.
Right. And so the implication is, is that if you get off the boat on the pontoon, you don't care about immunity because you're a traitor.
Right. Like you don't have to worry about sleeping tonight.
I don't know if they thought about that. We were really early in the game, but she was the first one off.
And then like the way that they did the show, which was brilliant, you know, make them stay them stay out there they make them cold they make all of us go back get in our nice you know clothes feed us really well then they bring them we all thought they were going to go home you know be done with the day of filming and then they come in and so they're so angry which i totally get and i remember dorinda was like you couldn't wait to eat the food. I remember straight up, I was like, dude, just tell Crafty to get more.
What are we talking about here? They told us to eat. We're just doing what we're told.
I remember yelling out to production. I was like, can we get her a hot plate? What are we doing? Because it was cold by that time, but it was good good producing but so then she goes in and she starts going crazy like at um at iver because iver was the one was like the weak women need to get off the boats yeah uh the old brit yeah yeah the old lord and so we all were like whoa this is a lot i remember being like so is this what Housewives is? Because I've never gone on that show.
Because she was just going nuts. And afterwards, we were like, seemed like a little much, right? Like a little over the top.
And everyone's like, yeah, she was the first one out of the boat. She went like nuts on us for like, you know, what are we going to do? We got back here.
They told us to put the clothes on. They told us to eat the food.
And so everyone's like, yeah, yeah like yeah yeah yeah she's definitely a traitor so then by the time that the round table happened i think no one had any concrete evidence and what ended up happening was is that robin because i said i think it was a dumb thing and then she got defensive of it and then i was like like i walked out of the room she was like that's you're acting weird i think bob grabbed onto that and was like this would be a good opportunity to get wells out and i i don't know if this is true it'll be fun to go do like the after show and like figure out what their thoughts were because the person that knocks me out is the that's the deciding vote is carolyn who is a traitor so i wonder if they were like, if we have an opportunity to knock Wells out, let's do that over Robin, who that's my campaign was against her effectively. Well, that makes sense.
I mean, like even like this episode, I thought like Bob wasted his own vote. It ended up not mattering.
But early on, Bob voted against who was it? Bob, the drag queen. Rob.
He went back to rob when everyone was doing sierra it's like yeah like vote for sierra even if you don't think it's sierra because like she's your biggest competition for sure and like he wasted his own vote on just being petty yeah i made a mistake because they yeah who did you vote for i voted for robin but i mean the mistake that i made was they said, you said that it was a dumb move.

Who got upset?

And I was like, Robin, because she's the one who says it out loud, like at the round table.

And they're like, who else?

And I was like, Sam, because that was the truth.

I should never have said Sam because the second I said, Sam, Sam was like, well, I'm voting for Wells now.

And so that was the I think the thing that's that's me.

I think that's a part you realize I'm just watching it. It's like, you, you know, it's just like, you have to be mindful of that because especially around the round table, people will like vote out of pettiness or just to get back at you.
And you have to like kind of count votes because that seems to, it's also an easy way to, to argue it. Cause when you, when you make your vote, they don't always show it.
But when you make your vote and you have to show it, you have to kind of say why. And so it's such an easy way out of being like, dude, you said my name.
I don't like that. That's on you instead of like, I think it's Sierra because she was cussing in the coffin or whatever.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So yeah, I made a lot of bad decisions.
There's a lot of talk about Tom Sandoval detoxing. Yeah, I don't know about that.
He was sweating a lot. He was so sweaty wearing that great t-shirt.
I think he just runs hot, dude. I think that he just...
He's like a little glitchy. He just doesn't stop.
He's always talking he's always i mean you know that he definitely has a high motor yeah he's like it's kind of impressive oh the other thing that i think so uh i talked about this somewhere else but what uh robin says uh was is something the effect of like after alan went around and touched everyone, I noticed that you were different. And I was like, I don't think I was different.
But we had only ever been around each other on camera during that time. And then after that, then there becomes a lot of like the hurry up and wait of making a television show, which is like you're filming film and then you're not shut up.
Right. And, you know, I am someone who like when I'm filming a television show, if like the cameras aren't on, I'm not doing anything.
Like I'm hanging out. I'm trying to like keep my energy level at like a baseline.
Uh, one, because I don't want to waste like good jokes or like funny sound bites when nothing's happening. And two, like they are really, really long days.
And it's funny because like, you know, she's a housewife. And that's one thing I noticed with the housewives.
I was like, oh my God, you guys never stop. This is all, this is, this is who you are, which is amazing.
That's why those TV shows are so great. But I was like, I wouldn't have the bandwidth to be able to do this all day long and so my theory i haven't talked to her to robin but my theory is is that she saw i was much different when the cameras were on than when the cameras are off and she was like that's traitor traitor mentality or whatever well you campaign to try to go back either next season or you're done?

No desire to go back on the show.

Why?

Well, I just, I don't, I'm not good at competition shows.

I got eighth on the bachelorette.

I got 22nd on this one.

The Bachelor's About Love.

That's true.

No, I don't know.

I think that.

You've gotten first on Bartender.

Yeah.

You won Worst Cooks. I did win Worst Cooks.
But also, is that a win? That's a competition. You're the best worst cook in America.
Or I beat Johnny Bananas. How is the food there? Terrible.
That's my big concern. Well, you should do the show.
Yeah, they've asked, but it's been tough with this show. Yeah, I get it.
It would be fun to try. It'd be interesting to see how you do, because you are super cerebral.
I could see myself being first out. I could see myself, because that's the thing.
It depends who else they cast. We've talked some shit about some people on reality TV.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Great television then, right there.
Listen, yeah. Everyone just being like, you called me this.
You said this about me this i would not be worried about my ability to make television but it really depends how yeah it it could go either way and i think yeah to your point it's there's gamesmanship but there's a lot of things outside of your control you know like johnny bananas was the first one out last season like i think he probably would have been an excellent player had he just you know and i think think that made sense when I remember watching it because he comes from the challenge. He's been very successful.
Like a Dorinda, that didn't make sense. Johnny Bananas, let's just get a strong player out immediately, no matter what.
That made total sense. Did you talk to anyone before you went and filmed from last season? No.
It's funny, though, because I thought for sure it was going to be Johnny Bananas, who was the person that they like de-robe in the first episode. And like, I love Johnny.
I've known him now for years. And if it was him, I would have been like, I'll get you.
You can come in the game. I'll kill somebody here.
I love Johnny Bananas. But then when it was Rob, I was like, everyone was like, and I turned to Dylan.
I'm like, who is's like that's from Survivor and I was like oh yeah I don't watch that show but yeah if it would have been Johnny I would have gotten him in the game would that have given you a shield or like immediate yeah but then it puts a target on your back because you kill somebody right then and there which I think that if they had done it it would have been moot because that person would have come back in that birdhouse the next day and then they would have been angry at whoever did it I could see it was all planned out great that's crazy I thought you would have been a good traitor if I'm a producer I'm picking you as a traitor of course then you would have been identified anyways yeah they would have been right about that but then i wouldn't have had like bob the drag queen and uh you know carolyn two traitors vote for me that's true they would have like rallied with you yeah that is interesting yeah but maybe that's why you got voted out because like you you know the nice guy and it's like yeah i don't know i mean i had this whole plan i had this i was gonna set this trap all uh like uh pilot pete so after the second uh mission i go talk to wes and i'm like i got your ass down and he's like you're getting my shield and i was like hell yeah and then i pull this is like this i should have been politicking for myself before the round table, right? For the round table, I pull I had a side and I was like, I'm getting the shield, but I want you to say you got the shield and I'll back that up. And I think I can get West to say that as well.
So that means that you'll be safe tonight from banishment because they think that you have a shield. And that means that I'll be safe from banishment because I actually have the shield.
And then if no one gets murdered tonight,

then we'll know that they were trying to kill me.

And then we got to figure out who would want me out.

And then at the time I thought it was Robin

and I was like, yeah, she'd want me out of there

because I went so hard at her early that day.

So that was my plan, but I never got there.

So I mean, Robin has the worst read on everyone. She it's like what really okay exactly yeah no dylan dylan uh it's so funny because ian actually called bob the drag queen and i was like really it's a little too on the nose uh because it's hard to say it's obvious as a viewer yeah because you know but yeah.
Like I remember thinking he was a little bit on the nose of like the biggest, loudest person in the house is going to be a traitor. But Ian was very much like, I think he's a traitor.
I don't trust him. And it was funny too, because he says something like, he says something that really hurt my feelings.
He said that i've been really standoffish to him and that wasn't true at all it's like i've been here for a day well and the reason why it was he was the person i tried the the hardest with for these reasons he does a podcast with monet exchange of whom went to high school with my wife uh he's on RuPaul's Drag Race, of which my wife was a judge. And then Sarah was taking over on Little Shop of Horrors from Jinx Monsoon, who was on RuPaul's Drag Race, of whom I had just hung out with multiple nights in New York and was like, this is the coolest person I've ever met.
So every opportunity I went every opportunity i went up to bob being like okay i got we can connect i got another thing to talk to you about like i know i'm a cis white like straight male but like i have i know we have the same friend like i know and when he said that i was like he's just projecting on you well when he said that i was like i know that's not true yeah did you call him out yeah so they cut that out too but i was like What you talk? I said those exact things. I was like, X, Y, Z.
I have tried to talk to you and you've like shut me down. And at the time I was like, I will concede I'm not everyone's cup of tea.
Like, that's fine. But to say that like I haven't been trying with you, that's not true true and then I remember right after I get banished you know

I'm pissed off but

I'm like Robin's a traitor

and I was like and Bob's

a liar so he

he made that up

and ipso facto

he's a traitor and I think that

Dylan saw that

because all the things that I said about

that you know everyone heard Dylan was like you let it well said that you were lying about that. And then there are people who were like, yeah, I was in the car when you were talking, when he was talking to you about this.
So anyways, I wish I had like used my intuition more. What was that phone call like with Sarah when you left? Like you got fired from a job.
Yeah. She's like, what?

What?

Yeah, I don't.

That's possible on that show, though.

Yeah.

It's crazy.

Yeah.

You know, it's weird because you get to call your family.

During?

Yeah, but someone's like in the room to like make sure that you don't say anything.

Sarah's like trying to do like sign language.

Like you're FaceTiming? Yeah. That's funny.
It was good to see you. What else is going on in your life? I don't know.
Nothing. I'll promote my wife.
She's going to be Daisy Buchanan on Broadway in The Great Gatsby. I saw the show beforehand when she was doing Little Shop.
Her run starts February 10th and she goes through the summer. I'm going to need some time off.
Yeah. We might go out there the 7th, 8th or 9th or something.
Is that a Monday? yeah Monday's a Tuesday I think it's pretty positive her schedule starts on Monday no she's off on Monday who knows her better it is? 10th is a Monday who knows her better her best friend or her husband what is today? Monday yeah so she's off today okay whatever it's February 10th hold on let me look at my calendar maybe it's 11 it's 11. I was going to say, if she's off on Mondays, then it's the 11th.
Early Feb, guys. Early Feb, for sure.
Early Feb. Yeah, you're right.
I don't know what I'm talking about. Maybe Tuesday.
It doesn't really matter. She's still in rehearsals right now, so maybe she's just off for rehearsals.
Maybe rehearsal off. What the fuck do I know about? No, because you've got to be off the same day as in rehearsals because they have to have the actors come and do it with them and they wouldn't make them have to work on their day off what what does a what does a husband do when his wife's living abroad make it out with a different guy on stage every night that damn jay gatsby um what do i do i don't do anything i oh your, your wife.
I thought you were like, oh, you were making out.

No, he's making out with a different guy every day. I'm making out with a weird way to pass the time,

but okay. Yeah, I'm hanging with Boo.

There's a bunch

of things that I have

coming up that I can't talk about, but

are really exciting.

I'm supposed to go to Orlando

to go hang out with Benjamin Higgins

and Joey Graziani. Graiani Italian last name Golfing Yeah we're doing this LPGA event so I've got that coming up and that's about it It's good to see you man You too I miss you guys Miss you We're here every week Yeah I know You know where we live Yeah Yeah I see her all the time so this is not that exciting it's okay it's okay uh thanks for having me i'm sorry i didn't do better i'm like embarrassed we're okay with it that's okay good we were rooting for you and we were all pissed when you got voted off i was too we were like what the fuck i was so angry so mad well because everyone's like we're gonna be the first season to get a traitor out first.
Like, that's what everyone said.

And I'm like, yeah, that's a good idea.

Let's do that.

And then they get me and I'm like, what?

Fuck, guys.

I need to be close.

Oh, my gosh.

I should have, to your point earlier, I should have said to Alan, I want to be a traitor.

Because then at least you're like control of your own destiny. Yeah.
But I do that because i didn't care yeah i was like indifferent i was like i'd be a good traitor but i think i'd be a better faithful i'm good at reading people so i don't know hindsight is 2020 i did i every move that was bad i made calamity of errors it's only a game my memoir which is something that fans sometimes seem to forget about with this with this show yeah they get real tense yeah because it's weird because it's questioning people's like integrity which is something that people take very very seriously true you know especially if it's like lying and bachelor nation is worse than murder no i know i'm like yeah the whole the whole thing is like being there for the wrong reasons right if you If you're a traitor and so that's a hard thing. That was the thing that annoyed me the most.
I didn't care about the money. I didn't care about getting kicked off.
The embarrassment of like being out early. What hurt my feelings was someone said something about me that I didn't think was true.
Yeah. But anyways, priorities.
You're still number one in our hearts. Thanks.
33 in the field, number one in our hearts. Good talking to you.
See you guys. Bye.
Bye, Wells. All right.
Up next, you know Miss Christopher from Sopranos. He's also in season two of White Lotus.
He played the sex-addicted dad. Michael Imperioli is with us next.
Michael. Hi.
How's it going? Okay. How are you? We're doing great, man.
We're so excited to have you. We're such big fans.
Thank you very much. So what's new in your world, man? Well, I just played a couple of concerts with my band last week in Washington, D.C., Philadelphia, and New York.
And then we have another one next week that's a benefit for the relief, you know, for the victims of the fires in Los Angeles here in New York City. Yeah, it's terrible do you uh we certainly know a lot of people thankfully we were okay we know a lot of people who sadly were affected did uh or do you have any friends that uh yeah yeah yeah several you know it's it's unimaginable tragedy uh we really big fans of white lotus here on this show we really really, really enjoyed you in season two.
What was that experience like? It was just incredible experience on every level, both in terms of the production and being there just as a visitor to Sicily and being in those amazing cities in Sicily. And as an actor, the material and the cast and Mike White, who directed everything and wrote everything, it was pretty much a dream gig for me because I love being in Italy and working there is really, really fun and exciting.
How long is filming? How much time do you get to filming? Four months. Four months.
Okay. I wish it was longer.
Yeah. Obviously, with such a large ensemble cast, did you get to interact with all of your castmates or get to know some more than others? Because, you know, with different scenes, people are, you know, sometimes you're not working with people or it's more like a family atmosphere with the entire cast.
I definitely got to know the actors that I worked most closely with best. But we spent a lot of time together as a group because we were all living in the hotel where we were shooting most of the show and the hotel was closed.
So it was just the cast and crew and the hotel staff in this, you know, beautiful hotel. So when we had dinners together and, you know, some parties and, you know, got to spend a lot of time wandering around the streets there.
And it was a really lovely vibe among the cast and crew. That's great.
So much about White Lotus is like, you know, who's the one who got murdered? Did you guys, when you get the script, is that part kept private from you guys? I don't know if that was the same with Sopranos at the end. Did you guys know about the ending prior to it happening or how did that all play out? Yeah, we knew, but we were definitely sworn to secrecy.
And that's how it was on The Sopranos as well. Like we all knew what was going on, but it was really important to everybody.
It's just more fun that the audience can get surprised. We kept it a secret as much as we could.
Did Tony Soprano die at the end? I think so. You think so? Okay.
I've always thought that, yeah. Are you the type of actor that likes to watch your work back, or are you like, I don't care, I don't need to see it, I don't want to watch myself? I usually watch it once, which is enough.
Okay. Maybe more than enough.
Less and less over the years do I enjoy it. It just gets me in my head a little bit too much.
It's a little better if it's been done for a while and I can see it. I don't like watching playback on the set, which some people do and they find it very helpful for their performance.
I don't find it helpful, so I avoid it. I just get in my head and start focusing on the wrong things.
I kind of pretend that nobody's going to see it except the crew and the other actors. I kind of live in a little bit of a fantasy world that millions of people aren't going to be watching this in a couple of months.
That's probably smart. I bet it would be easy to be a bit of a perfectionist in that, you know, if you keep watching playback, being like, I can do it better than that.
I can do it better. Yeah, something like that.
Or like, it's also really hard to be objective. Like, are my choices working or not? It's really hard for me to know what's being communicated.
So you have to really leave that up to the director yeah is it it's just easier for you to just kind of trust the director and let them lead and just kind of you you do your thing and yeah much much much easier for me to turn that over to the director and then i just focus on trying to do the best in the within the takes rather than judging the last take and stuff take and stuff and let them adjust to make adjustments. Did you ever see Mike on Survivor? No, I never watched Survivor.
No. But he brought some of the people he did Survivor with.
They did some background work in Sicily. He keeps, I guess, in contact with them and he's friends with a lot of them and they visited the set in Italy.
That that's really cool who do you keep uh in close contact with from that calf well murray abraham um has become one of my closest friends to be honest i mean he lives in new york as do i so we see each other quite often and uh our families have kind of become friends as well and uh adam uh demarco played my son i keep in touch with i just saw him couple of months ago when he visited New York. Sabrina Impaciatore, I keep in touch with and Simona Tabasco.
A good bit. But once in a while I hear from, you know, quite a bunch of them.
So I have really fond memories of it all and have formed some good friendships. Do you feel like White Lotus has changed the way that you look or view traveling? Do you have any sort of like, what if? You know, I mean, to be honest, shooting in a place like that really can spoil you because having this suite overlooking the Mediterranean Sea, you know, because we were living there.
So you're kind of experiencing a bit of that as well. And it was very exclusive because the place was closed, yet there was this whole staff in the hotel working there.
Also, the town itself is a seasonal, mostly a summer resort town. And we got there at the end of February.
So for the first couple of months, the town itself was very quiet. So the restaurants and bars and little shops that we went to,

they all knew who we were and what we were doing there.

So there was a bit of exclusivity to that too.

And that was really kind of fun, you know,

to have that connection to the people in the town as well.

Yeah, that is cool.

Talk to us about the restoration of Girlstown.

Well, this was a, you know, a movie that we did in the 90s,

you know, kind of the height of American independent cinema American independent cinema, and really the beginning of the Sundance generation of films. Jim McKay is the director, and Lily Taylor, who was one of the stars.
We were a part of a theater company and had done some independent off-off-Broadway theater that our friend Tom Gilroy was writing, and we were producing stuff together. And this kind of came out of that vibe and that community.
You know, the important thing about this restoration and re-release of the movie and a place like IFC showing it is that a lot of these movies, because nobody really makes or has DVDs anymore, I mean, very few people do. And if they're not on the streamers, you can't find these movies.
If they're not making new dvds and if you're not a collector who has them you know the streamers have a limited amount of movies that they keep a lot of these movies that were made back then you can't get them you can't see them you can't find them and i i think this one is a pretty important one because it's really a precursor to the whole me too movement way before that actually happened you know yeah that Yeah, that's awesome. And you make such a great point about so many great films and movies aren't available.
One of the greater movies that you were in, Goodfellas, I watch it all the time. It's one of my rewatchables.
Do you still fall into the category of you don't watch your work, or is that a film? Because that's one of things that's like constantly on TV. Every once in a while during the holidays, you'll find it playing.
Does that bring you back or do you still avoid that one as well? That's a little easier because it's so long ago. It's like another lifetime ago.
But I do tend to avoid it. I kind of have this game with myself nobody really sees what i do kind of silly but i guess it makes it a little bit easier to go in front of the camera all the time i don't you've worked with some legendary actors uh has anyone been like a role model for you or who's had the the biggest impression on your career from having the opportunity to work with them from actually working um you know de niro was a big influence i was such a big fan and then when i got an opportunity to work with him so early in my career i obviously was watching him very closely and uh you know what i learned from him was how to economize, not dissipate your energy with distraction because shooting a movie are long hours, you know, and you're on set for a long time.
There's a lot of distractions. And then we're rolling.
Everything has to be concentrated and, you know, intensified into this little moment that you're creating. And you may have some important close up in some really important scene in hour 13 of the day.
So you better have something in the tank. And I watched him, you know, make sure that and I kept that definitely kept that with me.
But just a fan or as you know a wannabe actor when i was young al pacino definitely was a big inspiration with just what he brought to the screen what he brought to his characters and you know the the honesty that he brought to his roles and the depth that really touched me made me want to be an actor that's very cool

um it's super cool to talk with you man and uh very excited to uh see girlstown restored and uh anything else you want to plug before we let you go um just the benefit which is next uh tuesday january 28th at bowery electric in new york city which you know there's a bunch of new york bands playing uh and the money is all going to you know to help the victims of the la fires so you can go to barry electric's website and get tickets if you want awesome really quickly do you think nick looks like theo james yeah right i see that i know i see that a lot you could play his brother you could white lotus season four yeah i got i went when when it was airing i uh i got a lot of those uh you got a lot of that right a lot of that so i didn't quite see it but i'll take it you know he's a handsome fellow you got to work on your british accent yeah i'll uh i'll do that yeah all right michael uh really appreciate your time uh appreciate you and uh talk soon thanks Thanks for having me. Take care.
Thank you. Bye.
So cool. Can you do a British accent? Hello, Mike.
What's so rich, then? I'm British. Oh, my God.
I take it back. All right.
Time to get into some Salt Lake finale. Best franchise.

Sorry.

It's good.

It is.

Lisa's such a hypocrite.

Tell us how you really feel.

Words. Get into it.

This is not even an opinion.

This is a fact.

First of all, I mean, vicious, vicious game.

I feel like Heather never has good ideas with games at these.

It's giving Sawtrap.

Why not good? It was brilliant. It was awesome.
I mean, clearly it seemed like Heather went to the producers. Yes.
And said, I have a great dirty idea. Or maybe they had an idea.
Heather has made it very clear that she is a producer pet. She does her job.
She does her job. She's clocked in.
We're thankful for that. Nope.
That's not a criticism. It's just an observation.
No. When she said, we're going to read the worst text message about another person at this table,

I'm just audibly out loud being like, you're doing what?

I was talking to the TV.

What I loved about this game, it revealed who the real housewives are and who the fake real housewives are.

And Mary played, Browen played, Heather played, Angie played, and on it. Whitney.
Whitney played. Whitney played.
Whitney played. Whitney won.
Whitney went the distance. That was, you could argue that was a little dirty.
A little? It definitely was dirty. It was unnecessary.
She's good. It was scrappy.
But my question is, do you think that Whitney knew that Lisa was going to have to open up and zoom in for every word that she wasn't going to see what the actual text message said before she read it out loud? I had to do that, too. She was just like, and my, and then she made out, and my husband did what? It was just like every word for word that I was like, oh, my God, have zoomed out and just read it you would have known what was in there so I was at a party with Justin and then what so Lisa and Meredith literally didn't even play you knew she didn't want to and then basically performed her anger and stormed off chasing Lisa just so she didn't have just so she didn't have to read her nasty comments which we'll never know what was said.
I'm sure it would have been just a la Lisa where it was like a nothing burger. Like really that's the worst thing you've ever said about anyone Lisa? I mean Brittany's being like I want to invite Bronwyn instead of Mary.
And she's like, I did a search. Yeah.
You searched meanest thing about like, this is the meanest thing I've said about you. I don't totally believe that's a meanest thing.
No. But I'm willing to believe it's possible.
No. Mary going, I agree.
Yeah. But Lisa spreads rumors.
That's Lisa's thing to spread rumors she spreads rumors about people their husbands their partners i mean i think that's why that's why it was so easy for her to like so easily flip the script onto angie and be like see angie what if i would have said this about your husband and it's like you're doing the exact same thing that whitney just did to you I heard that Sean does circle jerks. How does that feel? Like, that's a crazy sentence.
Yeah. And it wasn't like an example.
She was like, this is a rumor I've heard. Now, how do you feel? Yeah.
It wasn't like a what if like someone was like, I saw Sean at the grocery store. She's okay.
Whitney's just trying. Like, I mean, also Whitney is playing very dirty, but she is trying to confess that like the terrible things that she said about you is about your marriage and spreading rumors exactly that's the game it was Heather's game she played by the rules and yes it is very mean Angie's to Bronwyn was also about her marriage and was also super mean the one foot in the grave one, one foot on a banana peel.
Oh, she's already crying. No, yeah, that was really, really bad.
I felt so bad. But the way that Bronwyn was able to be like, okay, like if this, she's like, you don't have to explain yourself if that's how you felt in that moment.
That's how you felt. Like this is what this game is.
We're squashing it. We're burning it.
We're good. She doesn't listen because her ears are stitched down to her face so tight she can't hear anything.
She wears a hot dog outfit to remind us she sucked her weight at the top. Awful.
Honestly, I would have been crying too if I read that about myself. Justin.
I wouldn't have cried. What do you have to say? She's a sniper with her words.
She is. That's all I gotta say.
I don't support it, but love her. She is typing.
She's like the club Chalamet of the housewives.

It was the fact that Angie said, oh, no, she's crying.

What was said about Mary?

About Mary was, I would like to invite Bronwyn over to tea instead of Mary tomorrow.

I am curious how Mary would have reacted to some real criticism.

Same.

Maybe.

Especially coming from Brittany.

Yeah. Or just anyone.
Maybe it was intentional intentional to i mean because this is obviously produced maybe they kind of told the girls who to read about who you know and well clearly like how do you how do you even know how do you even know the meanest thing you said or how do you search that you know what i'm saying like how do you you can search a name in your text and then every text that has that person's name comes up in every conversation so I wonder if they like gave if producers gave the the women like here's your person search that in your phone and that's why Britney honestly is like this is the meanest thing I've said about you yeah and she's like because the rest of it is on record in my videos if they would have given me Bronwyn yeah guarantee there's some text messages in Britney's phone about Bronwyn. I just, one thing I can't get out of my head, the earworm of Bronwyn's text to Britney reading, Britney is emotional manipulative.
It is so funny. She's emotional manipulative.
That brought me back to Southern Charm, some of the misuse of words. Intentionality.
Taylor was like, innuendo, or a hidden innuendo. It's like a hidden agenda.
Also, we're glossing over, Whitney reached out to Monica. Which? Oh, by the way, to be clear, I'm not the podcaster that they were referring to.
I'm pretty sure the podcaster they're referring to is the same person that Whitney was fighting with and Angie was fighting with at Kathy Hilton's Christmas party. Yeah, I think it's from that original call where Whitney called in the car with Justin and he said she owns a tequila company.
That's confirmed in the uncensored version on Pe correct it's not us yes it is not it's confirmed we watched the peacock uncensored so it's a live version that was like confusing people because it was a shortened version of like the blog conversation at the dinner and they kept calling him a podcaster and he's a blogger he's a blogger he's a bravo So not Nick. Yeah.
I don't, I don't, I do not conspire with these ladies. But Whitney then called out Meredith for also talking to this blogger.
Which makes sense. I mean, it's like, how are you going to get mad at me for talking to him? But you did the same thing.
It's like you reach out for confirmation. You got it.
And now you're saying that his word is more than mine. And Heather, thank God.
is like you i can't believe you're talking to this person like you have to stop talking to this person block this person whitney block this person like them just being like allowing these people to have access to you clearly their agenda is to like get clout and and and have their own storyline on their own platforms and so it's like the more i this show, the more I feel like Monica really got thrown under the bus. Oh, she absolutely did.
I've been saying that. Yeah.
I don't see any difference between Lisa, Barlow, and Monica. When she said everybody was reaching out to Reality Voluntes.
Yeah. So it's like they all had a part of it.
Also, Whitney did tell us at Kathy Hilton's party the reason that she reached out to Monica was because she heard Monica on this podcast say she had proof that all of these women had reached out to reality volunteers so she wanted the proof she wanted the proof she wanted the time which does make sense because she was like you and even Mary like I'm glad Mary kind of chimed in and stuck out for her being like you women are mean and when y'all are mean like mean, like y'all are vicious. And you do put people in a corner to where they are like, holy fuck, what do I have to do to like prove myself? Right.
That's so true. I mean, like how, I mean, Brittany shouldn't have been recording, but the way they, if they're lions, they would have just destroyed her.
It's like mob mentality. Oh my God.
It's vicious. Don't show one ounce of weakness in this group or we attack.
One thing that also in all the drama did get looked over is Angie likes to call tits chicharrones or chichis. Testicles? Well, it's Mexican fried pork.
Yeah. Yeah.
And I can't stop thinking about that. What is the best word for boobs? I like titties.
If you're asking me. Tatas.
Tatas. Bazongas.
I'm just going to reference earlier in the episode. I'm just going to.
Nick's like balloons. Balloon emojis.
Baby bottles. I don't have an opinion.
Mommy mocha. Also Meredith at the top of the episode with the Louis Vuitton eye mask on.

She has such a mood.

She's like, I woke up at 4 a.m. with a scratched cornea.

Like, what were you doing at 4 a.m.?

Also, the conversation with her and Heather of Heather being like, I don't understand why you're mad at me.

And then Meredith being like, yeah, well, I was.

And then Heather being like, well, okay. And then Meredith being like, I accept your apology.
Weirdos. Who was the best Lisa? The ate Lisa lunch.
Phenomenal. Angie was the best Lisa for sure, in my opinion.
I think Whitney was the best Lisa. Whitney just did that to piss her off and like you know that's I mean and clearly it worked because she stood up she walked away she was like I have to let her see these tags hanging off my clothes and I didn't get it I'm sorry that was if I think I feel like I'm always on it and I just did not get it I was like oh my god Whitney left her tag on I clocked the tags I was like is a tag there? Well, it's because Whitney was going to be the fakest, phoniest, cattiest, materialistic bitch she could be.
I love Whitney's willingness to stand up to Lisa. I did love Lisa's line of, your gut is off.
It's leaking. Take a probiotic.
It's a mess. You will never be as ethical as me.
Lisa has some great lines. She does have bars.
She does. That's why they call her Lisa Barlow.
Do you think she practices them? No. I think they're off the cuff.
That's her. Yeah.
I think she's just that talented. Lisa and Angie both do have bars.
In the preview for the reunion, they bring the husbands. They always do.'t last they didn't last season for Salt Lake City they always do did they not last season was the only season they didn't but Salt Lake City every season they brought the husbands out yeah usually because they're part of the storyline too yeah like Justin and Whitney but because even like Mary like that was the reason Mary's husband didn't come back because it was like he didn't like the way they treated him.
Say what you want about Todd and Brawins. The fact that that guy shows up for the reunions, he must love her.
He does. Because like, I don't know, he doesn't need this shit.
And it hasn't been great for him. No.
So he's still showing up. The moment between Angie and Mary we need to talk about.
Because I was so upset that Mary just like immediately immediately switched up on her and was like lisa i'm done with angie like didn't even want to have a conversation with her was just like fuck this i'm done and then to like hear her open up at the table like both of them crying and it was like you realized in that moment that when she like wasn't answering angie angie was like oh my god like wait this means more like our friendship means so much to me and like what this isn't just like a show this is real life and it was really it was a really beautiful i didn't agree with mary in that moment but i you know i appreciate her explanation and her vulnerability around you know her band her abandonment issues because like i'm glad that angie went there whether you like britney or not again those women were vicious and it's like bullying behavior that they like showed britney and it was just fucking mean and like i think any decent person would go and just make sure that person is okay mary obviously has her issues with britney but like i'm glad that mary at least explained where it came from and it obviously was less about britney and more about just like she really wants to be able mary needs to know who her ride and dies are she needs so she wants to she wants that absolute trust and loyalty and it was it was an overall sweet moment yeah said you changed my life for the better and i was like okay i see you differently than everybody else i i cried i'm not gonna lie i shed a tear It made me emotional They said I love you Yeah

Mary's made me cry

But she didn't make me cry this one

Well maybe at the reunion

Who knows

Yeah

Well that will wrap up this episode

A special thank you to our guests

Wells Adams and Michael Imperioli

We are back tomorrow

With a very special

Going deeper episode

Excited to be bringing it to you

And then we are back on Thursday

For another reality recap

We'll see you then. Bye.
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