Murder, Mystery, And Mommies w/ Susan Hendricks | Your Mom's House Ep. 793

Speaker 1 What's everybody?

Speaker 2 It's me, Tom Segura.

Speaker 3 I will be in San Francisco January 24th at the Chase Center.

Speaker 7 January 30th, I'm in Athens, Georgia, January 31st, Savannah, Georgia, February 1st, North Charleston, South Carolina, and February 27th, Evansville, Indiana.

Speaker 7 All the dates and info are at tomsegura.com/slash tour.

Speaker 13 Welcome!

Speaker 14 Welcome to your mom's house.

Speaker 15 This isn't just a game, it's a once-in-a-generation event. The Harlem Globetrotters 100-year tour.

Speaker 15 Celebrate 100 years of high-flying dunks, 100 years of show-stopping moves, and 100 years of changing the game. Bring the whole family and be part of the legacy.
This game is once in a century.

Speaker 16 Be there at Chase Center on January 18th.

Speaker 15 Go to HarlemGlobetrotters.com for your tickets to the 100-year tour.

Speaker 17 What's everybody?

Speaker 18 We are back

Speaker 3 here, and it is time to get going.

Speaker 22 This is a huge episode.

Speaker 18 It's great to be doing this show for a year number 15, I think.

Speaker 27 No way, Jose.

Speaker 1 Are you serious? We started in 2010, so

Speaker 28 it's later in 2010, but still, it'll be 15 at some point this year.

Speaker 27 Still, my favorite thing to do in the whole wide world.

Speaker 28 It's so much fun.

Speaker 27 To look at my Jean, my Jean-Saint-Jean, and talk about farting and coming and all sorts of good stuff.

Speaker 30 All types of neat things.

Speaker 27 Rod Mutt.

Speaker 31 Yes, like a horse.

Speaker 33 This is stacked.

Speaker 29 We have to slow roll the announcement of all the things happening this year, but just know this is a super packed year for us.

Speaker 28 I'm still on tour.

Speaker 35 I will be shooting a special at some point this year.

Speaker 4 I have a show coming out.

Speaker 5 I got some other things that I'm shooting.

Speaker 38 We're going to be doing some stuff, YMH Studios.

Speaker 39 That's right.

Speaker 12 It's very exciting.

Speaker 29 There's a lot of stuff happening.

Speaker 27 There's a lot of stuff happening. I'm not touring yet because I'm still recovering from all my, oh, I know.

Speaker 27 I know. I'm sorry.
You had Invisalign, and that was really traumatic. And I had my own things going on.
It's not a joke. But I'm still selling lipstick.
You guys, get the perfect four.

Speaker 27 That is Berlin, Madison, Atomic Red, and the Perfect Red. You should get them all for.
And you know why? Because they cover all your bases.

Speaker 27 You got your daytime, your nighttime, your fancy, all of that shit. And, you know, in honor of what's happening in the art world right now,

Speaker 27 the the the banana that got taped to the wall and sold i'm throwing my hat in the ring as an artist as well you can buy my um pieces of art you can buy tom as a cat choking that was my homage to the

Speaker 3 debacle all that cool cool stuff don't forget i'm not afraid of it anymore i'm not afraid of that don't forget that the lipstick is gender neutral so this is not just for the ladies in your life this is for any human it can go with your color beard

Speaker 27 if you wish.

Speaker 43 If you want.

Speaker 44 Very cool. Very cool.

Speaker 8 All right, before we get into all the fun stuff, let's do an opening clip.

Speaker 47 What do you say there, bro?

Speaker 27 If I think it is what it is, I'm behind you.

Speaker 47 You don't know what it is yet.

Speaker 48 You don't know what it is yet.

Speaker 8 But this one's cool.

Speaker 44 Here we go.

Speaker 49 Happy Saturday.

Speaker 50 Rum chocolate.

Speaker 27 Always good and puke. No.
Yes, he is, you fucking liar. I hate you so much.

Speaker 20 He's not.

Speaker 49 Stop it.

Speaker 27 You're fucked. You know that? I hate you.
I hate you so much.

Speaker 27 Yes, he is, and I'm not looking.

Speaker 52 It really does just

Speaker 27 taste like cinnamon crutch.

Speaker 52 That's really good.

Speaker 54 time.

Speaker 55 Don't bring anyone up into this.

Speaker 56 Don't bother the fucking stand.

Speaker 13 Well, welcome.

Speaker 14 Welcome to your mom's house

Speaker 13 with Tom Sugura.

Speaker 14 Tom Suitsukura.

Speaker 49 And Christina Pajitsi.

Speaker 14 Welcome to your mom's house.

Speaker 14 I don't like you anymore.

Speaker 27 I don't like you.

Speaker 27 You know what? I just got inspired for new artwork. No!

Speaker 31 Yes, he doesn't throw up.

Speaker 31 You fucking ruined it.

Speaker 27 I don't want to listen to it. I love it.

Speaker 58 You ruined it.

Speaker 27 He doesn't throw up.

Speaker 49 Happy Saturday.

Speaker 31 What's wrong with his mouth?

Speaker 27 He's doing a gag.

Speaker 43 He is?

Speaker 27 How? Can you even curl your lip under?

Speaker 59 The whole time it doesn't pop out?

Speaker 43 You think that's really what it looks like?

Speaker 20 What do you think? He doesn't throw up.

Speaker 52 It really does taste.

Speaker 52 I hate you so so much. It really does taste.

Speaker 27 Tastes like citaben crutch.

Speaker 52 That's a really good.

Speaker 60 That is his lip, I guess.

Speaker 29 I think it's his lip.

Speaker 20 I hope your lip looks like it.

Speaker 48 I thought you said it doesn't bother you.

Speaker 8 You know what?

Speaker 19 You have food in your teeth.

Speaker 50 And I'm not going to tell you.

Speaker 11 But why'd you take it out?

Speaker 2 You said it doesn't bother you anymore.

Speaker 27 I don't like it. I don't like it.
I like either seeing it or not. I don't like the in-between.

Speaker 5 What?

Speaker 27 I don't like waiting, the anticipation of the sound and the thing.

Speaker 4 You literally were like, it doesn't bother me anymore.

Speaker 27 What do you want from me? It's not my fault. It's my reaction.
What do you want me to do?

Speaker 25 Your reaction is stupid.

Speaker 27 You're stupid. You're stupid.
You smell bad. I'm going to fucking draw another artwork for you.
Stupid. You're stupid.
Your mother.

Speaker 27 I'm so annoyed. Why would you open on that?

Speaker 31 Why would you open on that?

Speaker 27 But I don't like that. You know it doesn't make me laugh.
So that's just for you.

Speaker 46 Well, what? I don't get to laugh.

Speaker 61 I'm not allowed to laugh.

Speaker 27 Can't you please do a sort of a palate cleanse or something better?

Speaker 41 But you're ruining the vibe, just so you know.

Speaker 27 No, no, you've already ruined the vibe.

Speaker 8 No, the vibe was ruined.

Speaker 27 We were having fun. We were listening.

Speaker 26 Everyone was having a good time. Nobody liked it.

Speaker 61 Everybody was having fun.

Speaker 20 Nobody liked it in there.

Speaker 44 Really?

Speaker 29 Ask them.

Speaker 61 Ask them.

Speaker 27 I don't think it's funny.

Speaker 27 Jesus. Please play something different.

Speaker 10 God, stop talking.

Speaker 49 You stop talking.

Speaker 28 You're ruining everything.

Speaker 60 You're ruining everything.

Speaker 21 No, you are. You.

Speaker 42 You are. And you always do.

Speaker 9 Stop.

Speaker 27 I always.

Speaker 49 Yes.

Speaker 31 This is always. Always.

Speaker 4 Your big flaw is that you ruin everything.

Speaker 19 Oh, my God.

Speaker 44 Like, we were all having fun, and then you ruined it.

Speaker 62 You knew that I wouldn't like it.

Speaker 19 No, he just, no.

Speaker 20 You knew I wouldn't like it.

Speaker 1 He doesn't throw up, and you just got through saying it doesn't bother you.

Speaker 63 You planned that before.

Speaker 2 You just said it doesn't bother me. I know.

Speaker 27 I changed my mind. I changed my mind.
The lady changed her fucking mind.

Speaker 2 And you said it last week. You're like, it doesn't bother me anymore.

Speaker 33 You said this.

Speaker 27 I know. Well, then show me another barf clip and I'll watch it.
I didn't like the in-between. I don't like the anticipation.
Just show me someone puking or not.

Speaker 27 Fine. Show me someone else puking.
I'll watch it.

Speaker 64 Why are so many guys on here obsessed with saying, just be gay?

Speaker 65 Like, why do I have to just

Speaker 16 label myself?

Speaker 67 Yeah.

Speaker 16 When the more gay things I do,

Speaker 16 the more I want to eat clams.

Speaker 64 Young, nubile clams from the west coast of British Columbia.

Speaker 18 That is fucking vile.

Speaker 62 I love him.

Speaker 27 No, he's so free. Can you imagine being this free and this happy?

Speaker 27 I just love him. I love that he's so, he's just,

Speaker 27 he just is. He's everything.
Will Blunderfeld.

Speaker 19 Taking the shit, like the gnarled shit while he talks about it.

Speaker 70 I guess everyone's saying just be gay, but is he not just being gay?

Speaker 27 But you can't label him.

Speaker 3 But he is doing gay shit constantly.

Speaker 27 If you say he's not gay, he doesn't want to label it as gay shit. That's the whole problem.
It's just shit. It's what it's dude shit, is what he's trying to say.

Speaker 71 Okay.

Speaker 27 Maybe you should stop being so closed-minded and go on,

Speaker 27 go visit him and go on a retreat.

Speaker 43 Fine.

Speaker 5 Anyway would you come on a retreat with Will?

Speaker 61 Oh, no.

Speaker 19 I would not.

Speaker 72 Why? Big NO, I'm afraid.

Speaker 69 How come?

Speaker 57 How come?

Speaker 61 Yeah. How come?

Speaker 72 Well, yeah. Nigga, the video.

Speaker 57 That video. That's why.

Speaker 5 Well, which one?

Speaker 39 What do you mean, which one? Any of them?

Speaker 48 Well, you could pick any of his videos.

Speaker 24 Could you do it if you just went to this is what y'all talking about in the conference room before y'all?

Speaker 19 No, no, no, no.

Speaker 31 This is what y'all.

Speaker 71 Oh, how could we get any to do some gay shit?

Speaker 48 No, no, no, no. Not to do gay shit.

Speaker 46 Not to do gay shit.

Speaker 4 No, no. Would you just go on a retreat?

Speaker 61 Hold on, hold on.

Speaker 71 Yeah, I'm waiting. Okay.

Speaker 3 Where you listen and you are participating to the level that you are comfortable with.

Speaker 48 No, no, I'm saying just like

Speaker 51 learning, listening, growing, participating.

Speaker 76 Not doing

Speaker 37 gay shit.

Speaker 54 Uh-huh.

Speaker 48 I mean, so what shit are we doing?

Speaker 31 Well,

Speaker 19 you know, no, I don't.

Speaker 77 Well, you're just learning, man.

Speaker 78 Nah, learning about what, dog?

Speaker 19 Learning about what?

Speaker 48 Is this an electrician course?

Speaker 1 What's he teaching me? Fucking trade skills and shit.

Speaker 26 Just to be, you know.

Speaker 60 To be more masculine.

Speaker 31 Yeah, masculine.

Speaker 27 How to harness your masculine energy or cheat.

Speaker 30 And you don't have to do anything like nude unless you want to.

Speaker 20 You want to.

Speaker 43 Yeah.

Speaker 19 Yeah.

Speaker 71 I think I'm straight on this. I think I'm straight.
I don't know what I could learn.

Speaker 77 Okay, wear boxers.

Speaker 44 Hold on.

Speaker 9 You wear boxers. I'm wearing like 12 boxers.

Speaker 8 Okay, you wear multiple boxers.

Speaker 61 I'm wearing boxers, shorts, pants, and you just let

Speaker 9 the guru kind of guide you.

Speaker 61 This is crazy. Come on.

Speaker 60 Is this a real ask? You're actually asking me this?

Speaker 40 We kind of are.

Speaker 61 How did you think this was going to go?

Speaker 24 Well, I thought that you would not want to.

Speaker 19 All right.

Speaker 4 But I do think there's a path to growth, you know?

Speaker 1 How much money would you say would be at the end of this path?

Speaker 24 I mean, there would be a fee involved, obviously.

Speaker 61 There would be a fee?

Speaker 44 Yeah. How big is that fee?

Speaker 82 I mean, we could, you know.

Speaker 71 Let's say it on the show.

Speaker 83 Let's say it on the show. Everybody needs to know.

Speaker 29 Well, it's not going to be. Come on.
We can't talk about it.

Speaker 25 This is not lottery stuff.

Speaker 46 I mean, it would be a fee.

Speaker 61 What does that, what do you mean, lottery stuff?

Speaker 83 What does that mean?

Speaker 11 Like, you can't just throw out some crazy fucking number to go to a retreat.

Speaker 71 You know, like, I'm going to do it like your mom. I'm going to do it like a mom.
I ain't going to throw out a crazy number.

Speaker 2 We're going to do this. What's your fee for going to a retreat?

Speaker 9 I'm thinking like 50K.

Speaker 20 50K. Oh, my God.

Speaker 44 Yep.

Speaker 27 To better yourself. This is for you.
It's for your benefit.

Speaker 44 Okay.

Speaker 84 You got to come down here.

Speaker 27 He's acting like...

Speaker 61 49K. No.

Speaker 27 He's acting like this isn't in his benefit.

Speaker 51 I know.

Speaker 4 You're going to learn so much.

Speaker 5 You're going to come back a more masculine man.

Speaker 29 What?

Speaker 84 Come on, dude.

Speaker 71 You know what really made me look like a masculine man? What? If I had a nice little roly on

Speaker 61 this arm right here, or maybe two little rollie.

Speaker 31 Two.

Speaker 31 I don't know.

Speaker 71 That would make me feel real masculine.

Speaker 27 You know what, though?

Speaker 57 I got 50K in my hand.

Speaker 27 Any, by the way, you owe us, because I hear that you're so fat that you've been breaking our chairs.

Speaker 66 Huh?

Speaker 12 Yeah. You say you broke the chairs and they're coming.

Speaker 31 I've been breaking chairs.

Speaker 31 You owe us?

Speaker 85 What is that?

Speaker 27 Those chairs are ergonomic, $20,000 a piece.

Speaker 4 Yeah, maybe skip a few meals, man.

Speaker 20 Like, how much are you weighing now?

Speaker 31 I'm confused.

Speaker 19 I don't know what this is, but...

Speaker 27 You broke chairs.

Speaker 31 You owe us.

Speaker 65 I broke chairs.

Speaker 49 You owe us.

Speaker 31 I never broke a chair.

Speaker 60 Yes, you did in the conference room. They told us.

Speaker 3 They all said that you broke the chairs.

Speaker 27 You are leaning back because you're so fat and you broke them.

Speaker 73 You mean, no, no, no.

Speaker 71 See, what they mean to say is that they're stupid and they don't know how to fucking use chairs.

Speaker 73 And they go, I didn't break shit.

Speaker 71 Let me push a button.

Speaker 73 I'll fix it right back up.

Speaker 34 If I got you a really nice watch, would you go on the retreat?

Speaker 73 How expensive is this watch?

Speaker 54 If I were to take it to the nearest pawn shop, you're going to pawn it?

Speaker 31 Don't pawn it.

Speaker 27 Don't do that. It's an asset.

Speaker 63 It's an asset?

Speaker 27 It'll increase value over time.

Speaker 5 I'll get you a nice one.

Speaker 27 It'll appreciate in value.

Speaker 27 You don't want to sell it.

Speaker 71 But see, I'd rather just buy myself one. You know what I'm saying?

Speaker 20 Okay, okay.

Speaker 60 Let's say, okay, how about

Speaker 31 $40,000?

Speaker 10 I can't give you $40,000 to go on a retreat.

Speaker 51 Why not? It's insane.

Speaker 65 That's not insane.

Speaker 79 That is insane.

Speaker 73 This is an insane ass. To ask a black man to do some low-key gay shit.

Speaker 51 It ain't low-key gay.

Speaker 65 Okay, so you're right.

Speaker 1 Oh, so are the samurai all gay?

Speaker 60 Oh, my God.

Speaker 20 That's true, Tom.

Speaker 31 Good point.

Speaker 73 Samurai ain't niggas.

Speaker 65 I'll tell you that.

Speaker 56 Jesus.

Speaker 19 All right, good answer.

Speaker 43 Now,

Speaker 44 come on, man.

Speaker 27 You think there's no gay

Speaker 87 black people in the world?

Speaker 27 Is that what you're trying to assert?

Speaker 60 How did you get this?

Speaker 27 Well, the assertion is that black people can't be gay.

Speaker 25 That date just is nice.

Speaker 27 That is a nice one. Boy, I bet they'll look real nice on Annie's wrist.
Oh, my God. After his retreat, after he's built muscle and endurance and strength.

Speaker 71 Zolo, can you go ahead and copy-paste that model into Google, put shopping in there?

Speaker 38 They got prices right there.

Speaker 20 What is that? $10,000?

Speaker 43 That's not low.

Speaker 88 That's too low for you.

Speaker 24 $10,000.

Speaker 27 That is ridiculous.

Speaker 20 Oh, my God.

Speaker 71 I got to buy my mama's house, dog. What? I got to buy my mama's house, don't you?

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Speaker 70 okay scroll down

Speaker 61 Plus, you already owe me 10 from the basketball game, so I owe you 10?

Speaker 44 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 2 I owe you $10,000 from the basketball game.

Speaker 29 What?

Speaker 27 When he won against Ryan?

Speaker 27 I thought we were doing something else from that.

Speaker 71 No, we canceled it.

Speaker 20 We canceled it? Oh, my God.

Speaker 27 That's on you.

Speaker 44 How do we cancel it?

Speaker 51 What do you mean? What do you mean? And he canceled it.

Speaker 27 He won hair plugs, and then he goes, changes his mind. We were going to fly you to Turkey to get your money.

Speaker 18 Oh, yeah, you were all in on hair plugs.

Speaker 63 Yeah, and then you change your mind.

Speaker 49 That's not our fault. I mean, we could do that too.

Speaker 27 Yeah, but you can't back out and then change what you want after.

Speaker 27 We have to sign a contract.

Speaker 27 See, I mean, but you can't change your mind and then go, oh, but we owe you money.

Speaker 73 But I didn't change my mind.

Speaker 73 We said,

Speaker 78 what did we say?

Speaker 71 We said 10K.

Speaker 73 We said 10 Gs.

Speaker 71 And, yeah, and then Ryan accepted.

Speaker 53 What do you mean?

Speaker 70 Ryan accepted.

Speaker 21 And what happened there?

Speaker 73 Y'all ended up saying, oh, this is unreasonable.

Speaker 71 We shouldn't do that because, you know. That's not,

Speaker 43 what was it?

Speaker 73 That was not fair to me because what if I lost?

Speaker 71 And it's too much.

Speaker 22 This and that. Oh, that was like a bet.

Speaker 50 I got you. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 49 That's what I'm saying.

Speaker 25 All right, I'm a little confused.

Speaker 27 I'm confused too. But then I thought we ended up saying that the prize for any would be a trip to Turkey to get hair.
Yes. That was the

Speaker 47 agreed on. And then afterwards.

Speaker 25 I came in and he was like, I don't want to do that.

Speaker 27 Then he changed his mind about what the prize is.

Speaker 31 I agree.

Speaker 61 It's very confusing.

Speaker 78 I'll tell you what, we'll settle all of it.

Speaker 40 $50,000.

Speaker 27 Sorry. It's just ridiculous.

Speaker 27 You know what? Forget it.

Speaker 24 We got to get you to go on this retreat, man.

Speaker 45 Please go on the retreat.

Speaker 27 Please.

Speaker 65 What do you mean?

Speaker 61 I can't believe this is a serious ask.

Speaker 45 This is a serious ask.

Speaker 44 I can't believe this is a serious ask. Please.

Speaker 71 I mean, I'm saying please, too.

Speaker 41 No, I know, but your please is unreasonable.

Speaker 45 You can't give you $50,000.

Speaker 27 Tom, which retreat are we doing? Is it Will's retreat? Yeah. Oh, you got to go do that.

Speaker 71 You see, you see,

Speaker 71 it's like, I don't even know.

Speaker 73 I don't even know if, like, I don't even know if 50K, like, if I'm really going to do that. And then I get there.

Speaker 1 And he's like, yeah, first thing you got to do, you just touch my dick a little bit.

Speaker 19 It's like, oh, I'm going to go.

Speaker 13 No, that's not his style.

Speaker 27 It's all voluntary. Whatever you do is voluntary.
He is not going to force you to do. Come on.
Come on, dude. That's not how he is.
I don't think he would just.

Speaker 79 Just take one for the team and go.

Speaker 71 Take one for the team.

Speaker 27 For the sake of fun and self-growth.

Speaker 27 I mean, I just don't understand why you would refuse this help. It's so good.

Speaker 79 Just do it.

Speaker 2 Can we say you'll do it?

Speaker 73 We cannot say it.

Speaker 74 This is crazy.

Speaker 47 Come on.

Speaker 19 Good job, pussy.

Speaker 11 Don't you like being part of the team?

Speaker 51 I love being a part of the team. Well, then come on.
Just do it.

Speaker 1 This is what it takes to be a part of the team.

Speaker 79 Well, this is how you're one of the leaders on the team, yeah.

Speaker 7 What? You're a leader.

Speaker 71 I'm a leader. Yes.

Speaker 44 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 24 All right, that's a yes. You're doing it.
I did not say that.

Speaker 60 Okay, great. It's done.
I did not say that.

Speaker 2 Let's say it's mostly settled.

Speaker 19 I did not say that.

Speaker 56 Yes.

Speaker 73 This is a conversation. I'm having a conversation.

Speaker 83 I didn't say say yes. It's crazy.

Speaker 8 Okay, we'll revisit.

Speaker 2 But basically,

Speaker 29 he's pretty much going.

Speaker 61 Okay, so

Speaker 2 I'm excited for you.

Speaker 18 Here's the thing.

Speaker 12 I already have your prize for you for going.

Speaker 87 Hey, Blackman. How are you?

Speaker 89 It's freaking snowing.

Speaker 20 And what kind of a

Speaker 89 person besides the snow bunny goes out in the snow in shorts.

Speaker 89 Anyways, I was just going to tell you that if you get you a snow bunny, we take care of your hair, we take care of your beard, we take care of getting reservations for food, we take care of stuff black eyes struggle with

Speaker 31 snow,

Speaker 89 we take care of making snowman stuff. Do you want to build a snowman?

Speaker 89 We take care of

Speaker 89 casserole dishes for the family parties. Nice.
We take care of

Speaker 44 everything.

Speaker 27 Hey, Black Men. There she is.
You know what time it is? It's almost tax season. Time to get you a snow bunny.

Speaker 68 Because, you know, we got that bread.

Speaker 61 Is this like an

Speaker 28 appealing thing to you?

Speaker 71 I mean, it's appealing to look at.

Speaker 71 I love watching this girl on Instagram, but I would never get with that, though.

Speaker 25 That bipolar, the crazy shit. She's crazy.
Yeah, that's wild.

Speaker 83 Hold on, I got that mania.

Speaker 73 That's crazy.

Speaker 27 I thought boys liked crazy chicks because they really put out.

Speaker 61 Yes, boys.

Speaker 78 You're right.

Speaker 31 Boys. Oh, men, men are over.

Speaker 71 Crazy? Men understand the consequences that come with those.

Speaker 19 Oh, right.

Speaker 27 Yeah, the fatal attraction.

Speaker 3 Seems like you already went to Will's fucking retreat.

Speaker 83 You were talking like a grown man.

Speaker 27 That's right. Yeah.
That's right. And you know what? It's time.
It's a new chapter in your life. It's time to expand your horizons and try new things.

Speaker 44 Yeah.

Speaker 4 It says here that she's married and has two kids.

Speaker 27 To a black man? Yeah. Oh, sweet.
But why is she?

Speaker 27 Blackman, black man, black man. listen?

Speaker 54 Yeah, that's me.

Speaker 66 What better

Speaker 66 way

Speaker 66 to start your new year south? She's slow.

Speaker 20 But they

Speaker 20 snow

Speaker 20 money.

Speaker 47 She really loves black.

Speaker 27 Am I having a stroke or was that?

Speaker 31 She put it in a slow-mo.

Speaker 19 You didn't

Speaker 27 like, I thought I did too many micro doses in the last week.

Speaker 90 Okay, okay, okay.

Speaker 27 She's slow. Hey, can I, I think the the new, remember what eyebrows were? Yeah, eyebrows used to be the tell for crazy chicks.
Yeah, the new eyebrows is eyelashes.

Speaker 31 Oh, eyelashes.

Speaker 18 The lash extensions that eyebrows are still a pretty good indicator, but yeah,

Speaker 18 yeah.

Speaker 27 If you've shaved your eyebrows and penciled them on, you're crazy. And if you do eyelashes like this chunky extensions, you're absolutely insane.

Speaker 25 By the way, and this has been something I've been hearing a long, long time because Ennie brought up the basketball game.

Speaker 6 Ryan has been wanting to rematch Ennie for a while.

Speaker 25 This is ridiculous.

Speaker 73 We're going to do this again.

Speaker 2 He wants to do it again.

Speaker 20 No way, Jose. Oh, my God.

Speaker 49 That's awesome.

Speaker 27 Well, Ryan's in much better shape.

Speaker 86 Yeah, that's the thing. He's lost a lot of weight.

Speaker 46 He's lost weight.

Speaker 27 He's been working out. He's been taking good care of himself.

Speaker 80 Yep.

Speaker 50 Damn.

Speaker 27 Could be.

Speaker 83 Yeah, that'd be cool, except no rematch.

Speaker 73 Sorry, buddy.

Speaker 71 One and done.

Speaker 19 Oh, he's afraid.

Speaker 27 How about if Ryan wins, you go to the retreat?

Speaker 44 What the f?

Speaker 31 No. One, no.
No.

Speaker 79 I'm already signing you up, dude.

Speaker 61 No. Yes.
No. Yes.

Speaker 72 This is not going to. This has to happen.

Speaker 71 Thomas.

Speaker 91 Come on, Ennie.

Speaker 51 Thomas. Are we not friends?

Speaker 71 This is not how.

Speaker 61 You see, this is how.

Speaker 73 Now I know how I sound when I do this to people.

Speaker 19 Okay, now I know how this feels.

Speaker 56 I see.

Speaker 20 Okay.

Speaker 44 Well, this is not going to happen. All right.

Speaker 9 We're getting there.

Speaker 84 We're getting there.

Speaker 25 I am sending a message to him.

Speaker 19 You are? What are you saying?

Speaker 27 Are you telling Ryan that?

Speaker 70 Annie wants to go. Yes.

Speaker 27 Annie, just do it.

Speaker 21 Come on.

Speaker 31 What happened?

Speaker 27 Have the people. You know what I mean? I think you need the retreat more than ever because you used to have this confidence.
Remember when anyone's confident?

Speaker 31 Used to.

Speaker 27 And now you're just kind of like, oh, I don't want to challenge Ryan. I can't.
I'm afraid. Like, I feel like your confidence is waning.
You need this retreat more than you know.

Speaker 31 Damn, now you're just going to try to hurt my feelings.

Speaker 27 Well, you need to build yourself your masculine energy back up.

Speaker 19 Yeah.

Speaker 19 Will can help you out. Will can help you out.

Speaker 44 I don't think I'll be out there.

Speaker 4 You want to be a real fucking man like this guy?

Speaker 30 I got the outputs mammoth on.

Speaker 66 Zox!

Speaker 31 Fuck, dude.

Speaker 43 Dude. Oh, yeah.

Speaker 54 Oh,

Speaker 54 fuck, dude.

Speaker 19 Oh, hell and hairy.

Speaker 9 Wow, it didn't come out. It didn't come out.
It didn't come out. Yeah.

Speaker 27 That's why he's not in royal pain.

Speaker 9 He was.

Speaker 87 You need alcohol to do that.

Speaker 44 He grips it.

Speaker 72 You could hear it clank against his teeth.

Speaker 27 Yeah, you need to be on drugs to do that to yourself. You need to be high on math opium.

Speaker 42 He needs falcon car wash.

Speaker 47 Yeah.

Speaker 38 Needs a little bit of Pepsi in a cup with some dog food on a knife.

Speaker 56 Dogs would like,

Speaker 60 yeah.

Speaker 27 You need, you need to be on drugs to do this. That's a problem.
He's he's sober.

Speaker 84 Yeah, man.

Speaker 84 Damn. Oh, man.

Speaker 26 This is America, right?

Speaker 51 You dumb motherfucker.

Speaker 57 You gotta get it going, bud.

Speaker 19 Yeah.

Speaker 43 It's insanity.

Speaker 2 That's how you do it.

Speaker 27 Insanity.

Speaker 2 Here's a guy who looks pretty cool. This is, I think, maybe a holiday video.

Speaker 54 Fuck you.

Speaker 54 It's from ATR.

Speaker 83 Yep. He's from ATR.

Speaker 13 Oh,

Speaker 13 fucking.

Speaker 44 He's choking.

Speaker 22 That guy's face is wrecked.

Speaker 53 Yeah.

Speaker 9 That fall from

Speaker 5 the choke to the floor, landing on your face.

Speaker 27 He just did it to himself. He totally did.

Speaker 86 Everything was to himself.

Speaker 27 That's the sad part in slow motion.

Speaker 61 He wasn't even.

Speaker 35 They're like, get the fuck out of here. Now they're like, God damn it.

Speaker 60 This guy.

Speaker 20 He just died on our bar.

Speaker 29 He's just unconscious now on our floor.

Speaker 31 God damn it.

Speaker 27 I tell you, the nightlife business is a hard one. I've worked in bars.

Speaker 47 We tell jokes in the night.

Speaker 21 Anything to to do with it.

Speaker 27 It's just, you're just dealing with chaos.

Speaker 29 All the time.

Speaker 27 The security you need.

Speaker 27 Drunk people are the worst to deal with.

Speaker 56 Ugh.

Speaker 22 Very, very sad.

Speaker 27 Very sad.

Speaker 1 What's up, fight fans?

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Speaker 4 Cuffing season led to a new boo.

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Speaker 21 And

Speaker 24 the great Iladia Baldwin.

Speaker 27 Oh my God, she's back.

Speaker 9 We've had some,

Speaker 6 if you don't know,

Speaker 12 some other stuff in the past, just to give you a refresher.

Speaker 37 Okay.

Speaker 27 Oh, she's so great.

Speaker 95 We have very few ingredients. We have tomatoes.
We have

Speaker 61 cucumbers.

Speaker 81 How do you say anything?

Speaker 67 How'd you say?

Speaker 27 Come on, se tice.

Speaker 96 There's been some questions about where I'm born.

Speaker 31 I'm born in Boston.

Speaker 27 So, can you say that?

Speaker 96 So I spent some of my childhood in Boston, some of my childhood in Spain.

Speaker 36 Got it.

Speaker 45 So that's why she was like, I don't know how to say.

Speaker 31 How'd you say?

Speaker 27 Do it, Tommy. Do her because you do that.

Speaker 32 How do you say?

Speaker 97 all these charges?

Speaker 98 No, I'm going to tell you what I'm going to say. You're not going to ask me questions.

Speaker 85 I'm going to ask you to ask questions.

Speaker 45 You're not going to ask it.

Speaker 66 Okay?

Speaker 98 Okay. I want you guys to realize that we have seven kids.
Jesus. And you being here

Speaker 98 to

Speaker 98 escort them to school

Speaker 31 and be there when they come home is not good.

Speaker 98 It's not good. So, on a human level, you guys know I'm not going to say anything to you.

Speaker 40 You know that.

Speaker 98 So please leave my family in peace and let this all play out.

Speaker 27 She talks like she was born in fucking Honduras or some shit.

Speaker 9 It's so funny. She's from Boston.

Speaker 18 Her name is Hilaria Lynn Hayward Thomas.

Speaker 31 Hilarious.

Speaker 56 From Boston.

Speaker 47 Not Hilaria. Sorry.

Speaker 27 Hilary Hills.

Speaker 36 From Boston.

Speaker 28 She is of English, French, Canadian, German, Irish, and Slovak descent.

Speaker 47 She says she was raised in a Spanish-speaking household and traveled to Spain annually.

Speaker 31 Okay.

Speaker 37 She also says she began to use the the name Iladia as she got older.

Speaker 6 So, anyway,

Speaker 27 it's not good for my children. Please.

Speaker 47 Here's the newest one.

Speaker 99 Oh, my God.

Speaker 16 Please explain what your photograph is.

Speaker 95 I mean, I don't know what that one is, but I can tell you that my torque

Speaker 95 is

Speaker 95 potatoes. You have to not cut them too tiny because they're not going to have the right texture.
And then,

Speaker 95 my husband hates

Speaker 43 it. Okay,

Speaker 95 so he hates seboya, and so I grind segoya and ajo.

Speaker 49 Oh my god, and ashol.

Speaker 60 What does she grind?

Speaker 93 My jospeis.

Speaker 46 What's the word for seboya?

Speaker 49 Anyone say how you say?

Speaker 75 She's like how my mom talks.

Speaker 21 Oh, I know.

Speaker 28 That's how my mom talks. Yes.

Speaker 6 Who learned English at 31.

Speaker 84 Yeah.

Speaker 27 She's claiming to forget her native tongue. It's just

Speaker 31 so fun. How you say.

Speaker 100 How do you say? say?

Speaker 100 And I make this a tortilla here for you.

Speaker 100 And then my husband like a house.

Speaker 26 I forget it.

Speaker 100 I forget it. How do you say?

Speaker 26 My first language.

Speaker 31 My first language.

Speaker 29 How do you say in English?

Speaker 27 What? And she also has that baby voice, like that highly

Speaker 27 voice. If you're, listen, if you've been sexually assaulted.

Speaker 27 No, it's true.

Speaker 40 That's why all the girls in porn, they they have a high register.

Speaker 27 It's a sign of assault. Just lower the register in your voice, and you'll sound way more intelligent.
No, listen, it's a true story.

Speaker 27 I believe it was Margaret Thatcher, when she started working in parliament, had a vocal coach to bring her voice down

Speaker 62 a few octaves because it's not.

Speaker 100 It's not pleasant to listen to it up here. Yeah.

Speaker 5 Well, you feel like you're listening to a kid.

Speaker 31 You're listening to a little girl.

Speaker 42 You want to listen to an authority?

Speaker 3 You want the authority to have

Speaker 19 a deeper register.

Speaker 27 You got that gravel.

Speaker 42 Well, yeah, just like, just talk like you mean business, right?

Speaker 49 I've been doing a lot of things out there.

Speaker 100 Guys, I've been thinking.

Speaker 31 Oi!

Speaker 39 Hey, you want to know something?

Speaker 1 Going to the UK soon.

Speaker 49 Oi, that's right, love.

Speaker 43 Yeah.

Speaker 100 Oi, I'm Margaret Thatcher. First fucking things first.

Speaker 8 There's the Prime Minister.

Speaker 49 Higher taxes.

Speaker 18 We are going to the UK.

Speaker 63 Oh, no.

Speaker 60 I can't fucking wait, mate.

Speaker 77 I have a tour.

Speaker 31 I'm so excited.

Speaker 38 Some of it is outside of the UK, but it's still in the region.

Speaker 46 I'll be going to Dublin,

Speaker 29 Glasgow, Glasgow,

Speaker 43 London, London, Manchester, Manchester, Birmingham,

Speaker 19 Cardiff,

Speaker 4 and am I forgetting one? I don't remember.

Speaker 27 Bam, Cardiff, where is Wales? No, that isn't Cardiff.

Speaker 22 Cardiff is Wales.

Speaker 29 Is it Birmingham?

Speaker 27 Bam is Birmingham. That's outside of London.

Speaker 81 It fell down in March.

Speaker 68 Let's see.

Speaker 27 I'm so excited. Belfast.

Speaker 61 Dublin. Oh, Belfast.

Speaker 29 Forgot Belfast, Glasgow.

Speaker 8 Oh, Nottingham.

Speaker 43 Nottingham.

Speaker 31 Nottingham.

Speaker 27 That's exciting, mate. Wembley.

Speaker 27 He's doing the Wimbley. Yep.

Speaker 37 It's all very exciting.

Speaker 27 This is so rad. I can't wait to come.
We're going to have the greatest family vacay. It'll be fun.

Speaker 44 Oi. Oi.
What?

Speaker 27 No, you got to practice your cool British accent.

Speaker 51 Nay.

Speaker 27 Nay. Nay is Australian.

Speaker 72 Nay. I know.

Speaker 18 They were.

Speaker 37 Do you know that that was a thing last night at bottom of the barrel?

Speaker 70 Well, one of the things was like, how how Australians say no?

Speaker 28 Yeah.

Speaker 37 And then there was an Australian guy in the audience that we made him speak.

Speaker 27 Did he say it? He went, nai.

Speaker 51 He was like, no.

Speaker 4 And everyone's like, you're not fucking doing it right.

Speaker 20 He was like, no.

Speaker 3 We're like, say water.

Speaker 19 He was like, water.

Speaker 8 And we were like, that's, I get it.

Speaker 5 We were kind of come up with things that...

Speaker 70 for him to say that we would be lost on.

Speaker 25 It was very fun.

Speaker 27 Well, I can't wait for you to do your Cockney accent in England and tell people you love them and happy birthday.

Speaker 61 Happy birthday. It's your birthday.

Speaker 27 Especially when you tip people.

Speaker 31 It's your birthday.

Speaker 63 It's your birthday. Happy birthday.

Speaker 27 Evening, governor. Hello.
It's your birthday.

Speaker 9 Oh, this is some serious.

Speaker 72 Sorry, we have to switch to something serious.

Speaker 27 Juniors?

Speaker 30 This is serious, if you don't mind.

Speaker 27 Oh, I'm sorry.

Speaker 80 Please.

Speaker 25 Could you get serious for a second? I'm sorry.

Speaker 29 But everything's a fucking joke.

Speaker 29 So,

Speaker 30 one of the great crimes of modern times, this has yet again happened.

Speaker 69 I have been misgendered three times in the past 24 hours at restaurants. Last night I was at Benny Hana with my girlfriend and the server said, What about you, sir?

Speaker 44 What would you like to eat?

Speaker 69 My girlfriend, God bless her heart, steps in, says, Actually, that's ma'am.

Speaker 69 And she looks at my girlfriend and didn't really understand what had happened and said, no, I'm talking to him, pointing at me.

Speaker 69 Our jaws were on the floor and we decided to leave because it was just a bad vibe afterwards.

Speaker 69 And just a few minutes ago, I was at another restaurant for lunch and they showed me my seat and said, here you go, sir. And I said, I am not a sir.
Yeah.

Speaker 34 So fucking crazy that this keeps happening.

Speaker 70 I'll tell you why it keeps happening.

Speaker 26 It's because you look like a guy.

Speaker 85 And you talk like a guy. Yeah.

Speaker 6 So if you want people to fucking start calling you ma'am, start looking like one.

Speaker 51 I know.

Speaker 76 You're not putting in enough effort, fuckface.

Speaker 31 No.

Speaker 48 You got to fucking try harder.

Speaker 4 There's a reason that everyone keeps doing this to you is because your level of effort sucks.

Speaker 1 Step it up.

Speaker 92 You have a masculine fucking face.

Speaker 32 No.

Speaker 5 Go get some surgery, wear a prettier dress, get better hair, and start talking in a higher voice.

Speaker 20 Like Hilaria. Yeah.

Speaker 27 Also, maybe not wear a bark collar out in the world.

Speaker 19 I thought that was a...

Speaker 3 a voice adapter changer on this.

Speaker 18 I wish.

Speaker 81 It's just a microphone.

Speaker 27 No, it's a microphone. It looks like that color you put on your dog so it doesn't bark when people ring the doorbell.

Speaker 8 I don't know how you can get mad at this.

Speaker 27 This fucking clown, he's been all

Speaker 27 so upset with people

Speaker 19 constantly misgendering me.

Speaker 27 And you know who he gets mad at? The busboys. Like people that have no, you don't care.

Speaker 90 Yeah. Don't do this.

Speaker 38 Sweet fucking El Salvadorian person pouring water.

Speaker 9 Yes, sir.

Speaker 61 He's like, for fuck's sake.

Speaker 34 It's just like a nice little immigrant guy.

Speaker 31 Yes.

Speaker 27 I'll tell you what, too.

Speaker 27 I really do wish in another life, if I could open up a shop to consult trans women, like help these dudes actually look like women.

Speaker 20 I would love to do that. And then I left because I wasn't comfortable anymore.

Speaker 69 And I went to a new restaurant and I asked, before I sit down, where's the bathroom, please? And they said, oh, it's right this way, sir.

Speaker 69 And I just left because I wasn't comfortable.

Speaker 32 So you're just going to keep it.

Speaker 69 If you're ever in the food industry, you don't need to use words like sir or ma'am. There are ways to be respectful without using those words.

Speaker 69 And if you get it wrong for someone like me, I will probably leave the restaurant. And it puts like a bad vibe on my day when it happens, especially when it happens three times in a row.

Speaker 38 Yeah, but this is fair to say also, this person is mentally ill.

Speaker 8 This is a complete lunatic.

Speaker 6 Yeah, of course.

Speaker 46 Like after seeing a series of these videos, you're like, okay.

Speaker 60 Well, I think this is all a charade.

Speaker 27 It's a charade. And it's all about picking fights.
It's like, this person's waiting to be called out and then get

Speaker 27 mad on TikTok. Like, just relax.

Speaker 35 And he's waiting to go in with his fucking dog collar. Yeah, well, his dog collar and his dock worker face, and going, like, hey, how come no one's like, excuse me, miss?

Speaker 4 Because no one sees it.

Speaker 4 And then you're just going to be like, I'm going to keep going into places.

Speaker 70 It's like the definition of insanity.

Speaker 27 It is. It is.
And I think, I imagine, I think this person lives in San Francisco, I want to say, which is a very open, open, lenient,

Speaker 27 trans-friendly town. So, I mean, there's nothing but trans.

Speaker 46 And it just goes all the way back to your level of effort.

Speaker 84 You're just not trying hard enough.

Speaker 31 No, you should try hard.

Speaker 27 You definitely need to get your face shit done, taken care of. Yeah, his face is still very masculine.
It's not passing.

Speaker 8 See my wild side.

Speaker 20 I show everything.

Speaker 27 Oh, that's why he's doing this.

Speaker 12 But including a cock, which also belongs to men.

Speaker 10 Watch me jack off with my feminine dick.

Speaker 68 Yeah.

Speaker 43 Yeah.

Speaker 27 I mean, come on. Now

Speaker 27 the gig is up. We know what you're doing.
Yeah. You're just

Speaker 27 directing traffic to the OnlyFans, huh? Got it.

Speaker 20 Got it.

Speaker 27 You know, this makes me mad.

Speaker 6 You're not the only one that's going to have a hot OnlyFans.

Speaker 44 Charo

Speaker 6 is getting closer to getting going, and the fans are still

Speaker 25 ready and asking for it.

Speaker 67 What's everybody?

Speaker 67 This is a message for for Charo.

Speaker 31 Getting on OnlyFans, girl.

Speaker 31 You know what we want to hear.

Speaker 27 I love this. I love this, dude.

Speaker 60 That shift was really fucking scary.

Speaker 83 Yeah.

Speaker 31 That was terrifying.

Speaker 27 Let's watch it again.

Speaker 39 Yeah, that was so scary.

Speaker 67 What's everybody?

Speaker 67 This is a message for Charo. You're like, okay.

Speaker 43 Uh-uh.

Speaker 31 Getting on OnlyFans, girl.

Speaker 31 You know what we want want to hear?

Speaker 56 Yeah.

Speaker 33 Oh, it was amazing. It was great.

Speaker 27 And by the way, he's got the cool guy angle. Yeah.
He's got the audio.

Speaker 87 I like it.

Speaker 9 He's got music playing.

Speaker 30 It looks like he's cooking or something or painting.

Speaker 6 He's got an apron on.

Speaker 97 Hey, Hitler's Brandon from Ohio. Just wanted to weigh in on the Charo OnlyFans debacle.

Speaker 97 Big time yes.

Speaker 54 Yes, yes, yes.

Speaker 78 The people want to see it.

Speaker 11 The people need to see it. It's riveting.
It's exciting.

Speaker 94 It's new.

Speaker 11 I'd pay 15 bucks a month.

Speaker 54 Wow. Let's get Charo on OnlyFans.

Speaker 23 Thank you, sir. Thank you very much for that.

Speaker 36 Wow. That was great.

Speaker 101 That was awesome. Hey, Charlie, this is Letidius from Scotland telling you to get your ass in gear and get that OnlyFans made.

Speaker 56 Let it rip.

Speaker 8 Yes.

Speaker 27 Thank you.

Speaker 6 There's excitement around this.

Speaker 76 Yep.

Speaker 25 And I think we're going to get her in here soon.

Speaker 35 We're going to show her these, and I hopefully think we can get a page going.

Speaker 37 She's getting ready.

Speaker 27 She's getting ready. She's getting her Botox today, she told me.
i yeah i'm taking her to get her face yeah i got a cool phone call what happened

Speaker 46 she was like i'm on my way to do this thing and i go okay i'm driving she's like how do i pay for this oh my god which is basically like how are you gonna pay for this and i was like i i

Speaker 29 don't know i'll reimburse you and she's like uh yeah i think i have a checkbook i go you're gonna bring a checkbook check God you really are old as shit.

Speaker 30 No.

Speaker 27 Anyway. She wants you to pay for it.
I got her a ride today.

Speaker 60 I gave her a ride.

Speaker 27 You took her? I didn't take her, but I got somebody to drive her.

Speaker 31 I got somebody to drive her.

Speaker 27 So she's shaking me down for the ride, and now she's shaking you down for the money.

Speaker 31 This is crazy.

Speaker 27 She's not destitute. She is not poor.

Speaker 13 At all.

Speaker 49 At all.

Speaker 27 I can't believe she just shakes us down for everything. Everything.

Speaker 22 Everything.

Speaker 27 I can't believe she just did it to me now. She's shaking me down.

Speaker 44 Yesterday it was, can I have a bag?

Speaker 21 Yeah. You have so many bags.

Speaker 27 Ask me for a bag.

Speaker 42 So this is like luggage, right?

Speaker 3 And I do have a lot of luggage. Yeah.

Speaker 30 Just years of so much travel.

Speaker 35 So I was like,

Speaker 29 okay, give me this backpack.

Speaker 47 I'm like, no, I just bought this backpack.

Speaker 29 Well, give it to me.

Speaker 20 I'm like, no.

Speaker 5 And so then she goes,

Speaker 28 don't you have something?

Speaker 29 Something I can have?

Speaker 12 So I fucking emptied a bag and I go, here.

Speaker 4 And I gave her a bag. And I go, I don't think you're going to want to take this.

Speaker 58 Why?

Speaker 2 I go, because it's empty right now.

Speaker 3 When it's full, it's a duffel.

Speaker 77 You're not going to want to throw it over your shoulder, you know?

Speaker 31 Of course, it's heavy.

Speaker 28 No, it's fine. And then in the car, I'm like, I really think you're not going to like that unless it's full of your stuff.

Speaker 37 You are right.

Speaker 46 I go, yeah.

Speaker 45 She goes, so you have another bag?

Speaker 23 I go, yeah, I have a roller bag.

Speaker 77 I'll give you a roller bag because you're not going to want to lug one over your shoulder.

Speaker 29 No, you are right.

Speaker 78 When can I have the roller bag?

Speaker 11 I'm like, the fucking next time you come over.

Speaker 27 It's unbelievable. She wants wants everything and she wants it right now.

Speaker 12 She should pair up with the fucking misgendered person.

Speaker 36 No.

Speaker 18 I feel like they would be a good match.

Speaker 27 You know what we should do? I was thinking, because every time she sees what I have, she wants it. She wants my handbag.

Speaker 27 She gets in my car yesterday and she's like, oh, what do I have to do to get this bag? And I go, nothing. You can't have this.

Speaker 27 Here's what we should do.

Speaker 27 Let's go to the 99 cent store. Yeah.
And just buy a bunch of shit.

Speaker 20 A bunch of bullshit.

Speaker 27 Wrap every single thing. So when she comes over, we're like, oh, we got you something.

Speaker 25 She's like a toddler.

Speaker 19 Yeah.

Speaker 27 So she can feel like

Speaker 27 she unwrapped a gift. Yeah.

Speaker 49 Are you retarded?

Speaker 19 Yeah. She's so retarded.

Speaker 29 Yeah, she is.

Speaker 49 Annie, you really need to take a shit.

Speaker 27 I know you're black and you guys do your own thing, but you still have to shit.

Speaker 80 Thank you, Charles. Yep.

Speaker 71 That's very true.

Speaker 45 All right, let's take a quick break.

Speaker 44 We'll be right back.

Speaker 6 And we are back.

Speaker 70 You know our guest perhaps from HLN, maybe CNN, and she's also the author of Down the Hill, My Descent into the Double Murder in Delphi.

Speaker 74 It's Susan Hendrickson.

Speaker 68 Yeah, good to see you guys.

Speaker 102 Thank you for coming.

Speaker 49 I'm so excited to be here.

Speaker 36 We're very excited.

Speaker 4 Me in particular.

Speaker 27 He's been erect all day just thinking about talking about murders with you.

Speaker 34 I mean, you know that most of our

Speaker 70 television consumption is basically her just

Speaker 4 literally every night when I get into bed She goes are you gonna watch a murder?

Speaker 27 And she's like I'm gonna go to bed as you watch a murder no no no I go what are you gonna watch genocide murder serial killers, kidnapping.

Speaker 62 What awful thing are you going to watch?

Speaker 88 And then she drifts off as I dive into a new story.

Speaker 68 Well, they're captivating.

Speaker 49 They bring you in.

Speaker 2 Thank you for doing this because one of the reasons I'm is that she also is like, you know, you're a sick person.

Speaker 70 Like, she'll say this to me, right? She's like, you're sick.

Speaker 72 Something's wrong with you.

Speaker 42 Why are you watching this?

Speaker 9 You're asleep.

Speaker 82 What are you filling your head with?

Speaker 97 And then I also would be like, hey, you realize this is the number one show trending right now?

Speaker 42 Like, she thinks, I'm like, you think they produce this for me?

Speaker 26 Like there's a lot of people watching, right?

Speaker 27 Let me tell you that. We watched that documentary the other night and I couldn't sleep for two, what was it called again?

Speaker 19 You're not a kid.

Speaker 88 Lover killer, mother, stalker, killer, lover, stalker, killer.

Speaker 27 And I couldn't sleep for hours. I was so upset.
I felt traumatized. I felt sick to my stomach.
Now, how is it that

Speaker 27 how do you live with this stuff?

Speaker 49 I was watching an episode, you guys, I'm so excited to be here again. I'm a huge fan.
You guys got me through COVID. Thank you.

Speaker 49 I would come back and from the numbers ticking up at CNN and it's like fight or flight constantly.

Speaker 49 And then I come home and I listen to Sebastian and Picorielli, you guys, and now my algorithm is, that's all I listened to is you guys.

Speaker 60 Good.

Speaker 49 But, right, my sister would say, oh, I fall asleep to forensic files. Oh, my God.
And when covering the story out of Delphi, it was two young girls murdered in the middle of the day.

Speaker 49 And I was sent there by CNN. I didn't know about the story, much about it, just that the 14-year-old Libby was able to hit record on her cell phone.

Speaker 49 And they got this kind of, the guy on this abandoned bridge in the woods. I used to play outside.
It was Gen X. That's what you did.
Come home when the lights go on. It was a day off from school.

Speaker 49 They were down there and it was secluded. And she was able to,

Speaker 49 he was a blurry version because he was far away, but they got his voice saying, guys down the hill. So I was sent here.
I met the families.

Speaker 49 Normally with the news cycle, when I'm in studio, teleprompter, story, you know, the A block, the B block, it's very formulaic. So you care, but you're on to the next, the next, the next.

Speaker 49 Well, this one, I was in their kitchen. I had spaghetti with the families.
I saw their rooms, and I went, oh my, I saw the bridge, and they were looking for the guy.

Speaker 49 Fast forward, I really got to know them well, especially Libby's family, and every family deals with it differently. And Libby's family was very open.

Speaker 49 They were speaking at CrimeCon, holding up a sketch, like, we need help finding this guy. And I think that was their focus to get them through.

Speaker 49 And Mike, Libby's grandfather, was there, and he would say, come to the meet and greet. And I'd say, it's inappropriate.

Speaker 60 I shouldn't be here. I'm not part of it.

Speaker 49 He's like, come. And he kicked me under the table because in a nice way, but say, you have to be here.
These women would show up and cry. They're waiting in line.
They care.

Speaker 49 So I think what I found out through this whole community is the connection. So at Crime Con, it's either people who have literally gone through it.

Speaker 49 I interviewed BTK's daughter, Carrie Rawson, on stage because I met her through Kelsey's sister, this girl. Well, she said, I trust you, Susan.
I gave Carrie your name.

Speaker 49 I said, Okay, she just wrote a book. I said, That's fine.
And I met her, and she's amazing, and she's shaking backstage. And she said, I'm nervous.
People don't like me.

Speaker 49 They say that I look like my father. And I'm so glad that this family is nice to me because I'm on the other side.
And I said, What other side?

Speaker 40 There's no, you didn't do this.

Speaker 49 It was your father. She said, I had no clue, Susan.
He'd make me scrambled eggs. He'd say, fill up your tires before driving back to college.
Walked her down the aisle. And that, to me, I got that.

Speaker 49 It's part of the fascination. Like,

Speaker 49 what? Wait a minute. What? Because the Mansons look like man.
Yeah.

Speaker 60 Crazy.

Speaker 49 The father, and with this, it ended up being a guy, CVS, father.

Speaker 49 He walked his daughter down the aisle at CVS. When the aunt of one of the girls walked in crying for the funeral and said, develop a picture for her, he said, it's on me.
It was him. He looks normal.

Speaker 49 We think that they're not going to look normal.

Speaker 25 Well, that's part of the fascination, right?

Speaker 4 Is that, first of all, I think you just, these are behaviors that all extreme violence is accessible to everyone.

Speaker 30 In other words, everyone has thought, God, I want to kill this person.

Speaker 70 I'm so mad. I want to hit this person.

Speaker 3 But you always, you stop yourself, right?

Speaker 4 Like you want to, you're so angry.

Speaker 42 And so the fact that somebody is capable of doing that, I think is part of the fascination, that somebody crosses the line, right?

Speaker 97 Yes.

Speaker 49 And then there's the story aspects to this because they're fascinating like how did the person go about doing this horrible thing got away with it for five years and to get away with it and then how did we piece together the the investigation to catch the person so that whole arc i think is why these stories are never get old yeah it's just always you're like how did this happen how can somebody do this and then how do you catch them and i have an eight-year-old son and i interviewed ann burgress i'm like is it nature or nurture like what is it can you raise a murder like what is it She's a, well, that's the question that everyone asks, but it usually is, not always, but there's abuse there.

Speaker 49 We all want to like compartmentalize to be like, why? And the why is never like a, oh, okay, I get it. I get it.

Speaker 49 So he was 44 years old when he went down there and he said, when I first walked into this trial, because I had seen him when they finally made an arrest, and he looked back at me.

Speaker 49 And he didn't take his eyes off me first. And I went, like, because you know how you normally do that.
And I go, what's going on? Yeah. This was a hearing before the trial.
And

Speaker 49 Tara, Libby's aunt, said to me, oh, he always does this. He glares at us and he would look at me like this.
The guy's like 5'4.

Speaker 43 And I'm like, what?

Speaker 49 44 years old. Wakes up one day and decides to murder someone.
But I've gotten to know Paul Holes, who solved the Golden State killer case.

Speaker 49 And he's like, Susan, you can have sick fantasies about this for years and never had done.

Speaker 18 That Golden State cases.

Speaker 27 What is that? Just tell me to remind you

Speaker 62 what else.

Speaker 49 It was originally

Speaker 49 the person because it happened from the 70s, and it was an ex-cop, but it was called the.

Speaker 2 Yeah,

Speaker 4 he started with break-ins. Yep.

Speaker 104 So what he would do is just break into homes, ransack them.

Speaker 4 He was like, robberies, you know?

Speaker 6 And then it escalated to assaults and then to murders.

Speaker 91 And he did it.

Speaker 6 I mean, his numbers were actually.

Speaker 36 off the charts.

Speaker 49 Sadistic.

Speaker 6 It was off the charts with how many people.

Speaker 70 The murders are obviously like the highlight, highlight, but if you know how many people he actually broke into homes and and assaulted even before that, it was like triple digits.

Speaker 49 And this is before, of course, cell phones like with this guy who got caught, Richard Allen.

Speaker 49 It was, he didn't bring a cell phone down there, but it's kind of like you're able to see his car pass a certain building, even though the town was less than 3,000 people, which I think it heard of.

Speaker 31 120 burglaries. Jesus.

Speaker 31 51.

Speaker 49 Years. And no one suspected he was an ex-cop.
But what he would do, he'd tie up the husband, have him watch, and put

Speaker 49 a crystal cup on his back and say, if I hear this, smash, you're all dead. And he killed, I mean, countless people, of course.
And finally, Paul Holes said to me, Susan, I had to look out for this.

Speaker 49 I put everything that aligned with what I thought. I would say, okay, I think I got the guy.
And he said, and everything that didn't, I'd kind of push away.

Speaker 49 And he said, I had to be very careful about that.

Speaker 49 because it turned out that because the DNA came back, it wasn't the guy I thought it was.

Speaker 49 He pulled in in front of his house and Paul Holes has the most amazing book and he thought, I'm going to go in. This is him.
I know it's him. And he goes, thank God I didn't.

Speaker 49 Like what he fantasized about going in. And the first page of Paul Holes' book, he said he was so devoted.
And he said, he was at this strip club.

Speaker 49 And he thought to himself, he would see the young girl. He was with a bunch of guys.
And he'd say, I'd see her in like an autopsy devil. And he's like, I'm going crazy.

Speaker 49 He's like, what the fuck am I doing? I'm going crazy. And he said he felt more comfortable, though, at an autopsy than a cocktail cocktail party.
It ruined marriages, but he's good at it. I know.

Speaker 49 But he'd look at a scene and say, swab the foot, like he has a way of solving it. Yeah,

Speaker 70 no, the story was just, it was unbelievable.

Speaker 2 I mean, the HBO series, they had a series on it about

Speaker 60 Michelle McNamara.

Speaker 47 That's right. That's Pat Namara.

Speaker 63 Married to the actress.

Speaker 80 Yes.

Speaker 70 And she was obsessed with

Speaker 25 the case and died during.

Speaker 56 Yeah.

Speaker 70 And it was, yeah, it is one of the most incredible stories.

Speaker 49 If it wasn't for Michelle McNamara, and Paul Holst points this out all the time, it wouldn't have been solved. Yeah.
She became

Speaker 77 the driving force of this thing.

Speaker 49 She was like an armchair detective, so to speak,

Speaker 49 and really kind of dug into it and was taking things to sleep at night. And then

Speaker 49 it ended up accidentally killing her, the prescription mixed with something. And sometimes I have my sister called, don't get too much into crimes.
Michelle McNamara died.

Speaker 49 Like, you can't, you have to separate this. And my mom would say, can't you tell them you have kids now? No more murders.
I'm like, Mom, I can't go into CNN.

Speaker 47 Like, excuse me.

Speaker 30 Excuse me, no more murders.

Speaker 27 Well, that's what I was going to ask.

Speaker 104 But this also was, yeah, this guy also, just by the way, was married, kids, grandkids.

Speaker 27 Of course.

Speaker 68 They all have their profile of human beings.

Speaker 60 Don't trust normal humans.

Speaker 19 You don't know.

Speaker 27 Do you ever get afraid of retaliation?

Speaker 49 I do, but I think that I'm very skilled at compartmentalization. I don't know if that's a good thing.
I'm able to

Speaker 49 tell other people's stories and focus on that. I don't get afraid, but

Speaker 49 my son the other day is in second grade. He goes, mom.

Speaker 49 He's just so sweet. He goes, so there was a mom today at reading and she writes poetry with my friend's mom.
And I said to him, I'm like, my mom writes books.

Speaker 60 She goes, what kind of books?

Speaker 49 He goes, don't tell anybody.

Speaker 57 Murder.

Speaker 49 And my mom goes, well, at least he said, don't tell anybody. I'm like, the Catholic way.

Speaker 49 But I told that to Nancy Grace. I'm like, I swear he's a therapy.

Speaker 56 He's going to see therapy.

Speaker 40 Murder.

Speaker 49 And then I, when, when I decided to write this, and it's, it's different because no one was caught at the time.

Speaker 49 I just got to know the families and I thought there's something there about their perspective. And growing up, I digress back to New Jersey.
I think I was like 10 or 11.

Speaker 49 Our cousin, the Keith family, is like four very pretty girls. And the dad worked in local politics.
So did my dad and the brother.

Speaker 40 And she was murdered.

Speaker 49 And I heard my parents talk about it, like on the landline. And we heard rumors like, was it a drug dealer in New Brunswick, New Jersey? No one ever talked about it.
And we didn't.

Speaker 49 And our friend, whose sisters were friends with Kathy Keith,

Speaker 49 said it was a drug dealer and it was this house. So finally, when I was writing this, I mentioned it and I said to my dad, Dad, what happened? And he goes, oh, it was our boyfriend.

Speaker 108 I went, what do you mean, boyfriend?

Speaker 49 I thought it was a drug dealer. He goes, well, they were doing drugs, but it wasn't a drug dealer.
I'm like, why don't you tell us? He's like, what am I going to tell my teenage girls about that?

Speaker 49 So I did call the sister and say, can I mention this? And it was, there was a newspaper article that I found.

Speaker 49 And it's funny because it says like the headline of this. And when I, the editor, Hachette, said more of this.
But if the sister said, I don't want to talk about it, I wouldn't have.

Speaker 49 And it was more like the headline was like, Dead woman is daughter of official.

Speaker 31 Did they get preferential treatment?

Speaker 49 Which was like the headline. But anyway, so I thought, is that why? I don't know why.
But anyway,

Speaker 49 I think it's about the draw to it is

Speaker 49 people want to understand why. And I feel like they can, they think that they could help maybe.
I'm not sure.

Speaker 34 Did you find that?

Speaker 47 I mean, obviously this title is very telling, my descent into this, that you became obsessed with this then?

Speaker 60 Did you become obsessed with this? No, I didn't. Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 49 Because I was used to being on set and there's a teleprompter in their stories. And you just move on.
I did Anderson's show at night and I you move on you and you're good at moving on.

Speaker 49 And then I got to know them too well and I would just start crying for no reason. And then the pandemic hit and my sister's like, I think you're too involved.
I'm like, I'm not too involved. I just,

Speaker 49 and I get criticized like we all do online, I guess, but it's like, she's not a journalist. Who does she think she is? She's too nice to the local cops.

Speaker 49 They were, I really liked the local authorities, but I found out my cousin, Kevin Hendricks, he's 10 years younger than me. I still look at him as a kid.

Speaker 49 He's in the FBI and I said, what do you, can you look into this? Like, what's going on? There's tips. It's a town of less than 3,000 people.
It's like, but I think that was a deterrent.

Speaker 49 You would think, oh, it's Jim. No, you don't think it's the guy who you like,

Speaker 49 who you see in town. So

Speaker 49 he's like, okay, I'm going to. Write you back like this and don't look at this and open this as this.
And I thought, I'm going to see stuff. This is two years before an arrow.

Speaker 90 And he goes, oh, forget it.

Speaker 49 I go what he goes.

Speaker 90 They shut the FBI out.

Speaker 105 They kicked him out.

Speaker 49 Because when someone's missing, the FBI is automatically invited in. The girls were missing.
When their bodies were found, they have to be invited in. And guess what they gave them?

Speaker 49 The tip line, nothing.

Speaker 49 The ego. So you think you see it in the movies?

Speaker 19 It happens.

Speaker 24 Wait, now, why do you think, because you have, I'm sure,

Speaker 36 a very clear perspective on this.

Speaker 12 Why do you think these stories and this genre in particular appeals to women so much?

Speaker 49 That's such a good point or a good question. And I've wondered that too.
And Kevin Balfu puts on CrimeCon, I've asked him that. And it's a funny story.
Him and his brother owned Red Seed Ventures.

Speaker 49 And Nancy Grace came to them after HLN and said it was kind of a podcast umbrella. And he said, oh, let's go to the crime conventions.
And there were none. And he said, so we started one.

Speaker 49 He's like, it could have been a colossal failure. He goes, I didn't know.
I wasn't really. He said, but what I have found is that women either want to know

Speaker 49 And I've heard this said in kind of a joking manner. Like women, when they go on a date, if they don't know that, they're worried they're going to get killed.

Speaker 49 Like women want to be armed with the information. So I don't know if it's that, but the Scott Peterson.

Speaker 49 I think it's the person who doesn't look like a killer. And so you're like, wait a minute, that guy could, and Chris Watts, the most horrific.
It's like, he looks normal. Who's Chris Watts?

Speaker 108 The one horrible.

Speaker 54 He looks totally normal.

Speaker 102 He killed his two little girls and the wife.

Speaker 27 Yeah. And the wife.

Speaker 49 It got so bad, and I'm good at staying at this level on the air. Well, that day it was the hearing where the prosecutor, I think he did this on purpose, explained everything he did to those girls.

Speaker 49 And I was with guys I'm usually with contributors. This was Joey Jackson, an attorney, and my eyes were watering.
And I looked at him and he goes, I got it. So he kept talking.
And it was horrific.

Speaker 27 Usually it is the husband, correct, that kills children.

Speaker 49 I want to tell future husbands if you're thinking about doing this or like you get caught.

Speaker 10 It's the guy. They always get caught.

Speaker 27 But what about those anomaly cases like the John Benet Ramsey's or Madeline McConnell where they're like, well, it's not the parents. Like, I mean.

Speaker 63 Usually,

Speaker 49 and even in the Delphi case,

Speaker 49 these internet, the thing I love about YouTube, and I was able to find you guys and podcasts, everyone has a voice, but the bad news is everyone has a voice.

Speaker 49 So some people could go on there and blame the families that have nothing to do with it.

Speaker 49 I think with murder and abuse of kids,

Speaker 49 it usually happens inside the house of its family. outside the house, when they're on a bridge, it's not going to be, you're going to be like, Dad,

Speaker 49 if they're walking towards you,

Speaker 49 with it, depends who you ask. With Maddie McCann, I never

Speaker 49 ever thought, because I covered that, but not as extensive as others. I never met the parents, but I always thought like something happened.
And it's funny, I stayed at a hotel with my husband.

Speaker 49 I'm like, nobody leave this room. I'm a little nuts now.
A lot nuts because I'm like, didn't you see the Maddie McCann thing? You think of everything that could happen. And he's like,

Speaker 49 We have a sitter. There's a sitter there.
I'm like, should we, should we not bring the kids? So you always think of the worst case scenario.

Speaker 49 But there are people out there who said maybe it was an accidental death and the parents covered up. But you can find anything that you believe.

Speaker 70 That whole cover-up and maybe, you know, you can't help but think about the Jean-Bonnet case because it's, you know, the other thing is, I mentioned this in some of the other stories, like even the Menendez story, is that, you know, you're alive during it,

Speaker 70 but you kind of, you're like, oh, yeah, the guys that killed their parents.

Speaker 6 And then you watch the documentary again and you're like, oh, shit, I don't remember any of this, or I didn't know any of this.

Speaker 4 And the Jean Bonnet documentary was a real,

Speaker 6 really informative and also a big-time refresher because I was like, you know, I remember the story.

Speaker 19 When you were young and you're younger.

Speaker 34 When you were young, and you're like, I remember that when it started, I was like, oh, yeah, so who ended up being arrested for that again?

Speaker 8 That's how I, and I was like, oh, right, they never really got anybody.

Speaker 49 I go back and forth on Jean-Bonnet at first. I never,

Speaker 49 I've met the dad at Crime Con and a nice man. And I was in the green room with him and he said, you know, Susan, I think

Speaker 49 I'm fighting for that. Like in Delphi, I want the FBI to be, to stay in certain jurisdictions.
And I said, I understand.

Speaker 49 And at first I wasn't clear about what happened or I didn't have a thought. And then I read a book on it and I thought, ooh, could it have been the son?

Speaker 49 And, parents would, because you're not, I thought about it. I wouldn't stick up for my husband if he did this ever.
But if my daughter accidentally, would I stick up for the kids?

Speaker 49 So that's where my head went. But I don't know if we'll ever know.

Speaker 49 The note was odd.

Speaker 85 The note's so odd.

Speaker 63 So what do you think of the note?

Speaker 70 The placement.

Speaker 5 Well, first of all, her being in the home, you know, the access to that home through that window.

Speaker 75 The note is beyond peculiar

Speaker 38 but also

Speaker 4 seeing okay take the father aside seeing how I believed how distraught this mother was me too and it was it just didn't register to me like that she was just being like I got you to him on this I know it's very peculiar I don't think we'll ever know but I think something happened inside of that house

Speaker 49 and I don't think we'll ever know what it is I really don't and it's horrible that Patsy passed away and that,

Speaker 49 you know, he

Speaker 49 wouldn't you though, if there were suspicion on you, just kind of go away? He's still at CrimeCon. He's still out there.
He wants it tested.

Speaker 49 He even came out and said recently, look, I think that, I know what you're going to say. What?

Speaker 27 That

Speaker 27 I think, here's what I, I think, okay, you know, when the mind is very powerful, and I'm not accusing anybody of anything, you know what I mean?

Speaker 27 But let's just say I did something terrible, and I could convince myself that I'm innocent. And I might believe that lies so much.

Speaker 27 I might go to church every day just to show other people how innocent I am.

Speaker 27 I might try to absolve myself of the sin by overcompensating.

Speaker 31 Someone find my daughter. Someone find my husband.

Speaker 74 I love Tom Sigura so much.

Speaker 49 Before I came on here, I said I was going to talk about this. She's CSI, and I said, what do you think? Tell me, I won't quote you.
She just quote me. Lena said that.

Speaker 70 Well, there's people, a lot of people are doing what she said, which is, you know, when they go, all right, well, submit for this.

Speaker 6 And they go, sure, I'll give you my DNA.

Speaker 49 And then the DNA DNA is a match you know that there is DNA some DNA in this case as well that isn't a match for the father right and I think it depends on what documentary you watch because my sister just watched one that John was leading right and so she said there's no way she said Burke reminds me of Jack my son's Jack he's eight there's no way he's gonna kill I said well what if it was accidental and then they covered up and she's like I just think it's not true and I'm not saying I feel bad if John

Speaker 49 if he is innocent and think of the life and the hell he went through, but

Speaker 49 it's just bizarre to know that there's too many things. I don't know.
It's so bizarre. So bizarre.
But you're right about that. So Cheryl McCollum is her name.
She works for Nancy Gray.

Speaker 49 She's the most amazing person. I love her.
And she's like, Susan,

Speaker 49 this is Cheryl, she said.

Speaker 49 If I was looking for Caroline, her daughter, would I say,

Speaker 49 I found her? Or would I say, like, just that she picks up on things that I don't.

Speaker 27 Like, and then there she was.

Speaker 105 Wouldn't you say, oh my God, there's my son.

Speaker 60 Like,

Speaker 49 but then I think back to like, do we, do we put ourselves in that situation and think, how would we react? But the truth is, the Chris Watts, the Scott Peterson, they don't act right.

Speaker 27 They don't act right. They don't act right.
They don't act right. And the dad, when he carried John Bennett's body, which I found.

Speaker 49 And invited all the friends over.

Speaker 27 And invited the friends over. And then not only that, carries John Bennett's body out like this.
Now, if you find your dead child, I would cradle. I don't give a fuck what evidence.

Speaker 27 This is not the way you carry the child you just found murdered on the floor. I would be to my body looking for life and holding it.
Yeah.

Speaker 27 I don't even hold my fucking dog, my cat like that.

Speaker 49 Right. And you put yourself in the shoes.
And yes, there have been situations where people have been accused and they didn't do it because we always think, oh, it's the closest to.

Speaker 49 But in the Delphi case, the grandfather, Mike, I say grandfather, he's like in the 60s. He's like, check me out, test me.

Speaker 60 You know, it's like, do what you're doing.

Speaker 49 I know they go to to family first yeah um but with john bonet i think the fascination was and i remember same thing as you mentioned tom with with the menendez brothers even i knew them one of them lyle went to high school with my sister princed day school i i went to east brunswick tennis club with them and we knew the tennis pro Merrick and it's funny because my dad remembers this they stopped by it was him and Lyle the the older one and we weren't home i was 14 i probably should have been hanging out with a 19 year old tennis guy right

Speaker 49 But so they stopped by, we weren't there. And Merrick used to say to me, you know, Susan, you got to meet this lile.
He's crazy. He'd pull up to Newark airport in a Porsche and just leave it.

Speaker 49 And that's where he parked. And

Speaker 49 he'd pay for the towing.

Speaker 49 So when it came out on People Magazine and going to high school in Princeton, Chuck's was right near us. We ate there all the time, the restaurant they bought.

Speaker 49 Just like you said, you don't think about it. Thank God murder wasn't my business at 17.
I'm like, oh, really? They killed for money? And then you move on.

Speaker 49 But they had, now that I think about it, they had access to all the money anyway. You don't kill your parents for an extra couple million.

Speaker 43 No.

Speaker 49 Was the shopping spree? I asked Ann Burgess. She testified in the first trial.
And she said, they had access. That was like a way of saying, you're gone.

Speaker 49 You know, and I, and oh, I also interviewed one of the jurors, Hazel Thornton from the first trial. And she said to me, Susan, I'm like, tell me what it's like when you go back and you're talking.

Speaker 49 It's divide. And remember, 90s,

Speaker 49 men against women. Men were like, no way would a father abuse their kids.
Sexual. No, it just doesn't happen.
Boys. And are they gay?

Speaker 12 That's what the men were saying. Yes.

Speaker 49 And the women are like, not to say, let them walk. It's a horrific crime, you saw.
Yeah. But they were saying manslaughter.
They'd be out by now. So that's the argument.

Speaker 49 Hazel has said to me, I've been on with her. And she's like, Susan, I'm not saying they should have walked.
No one's saying that. But 35 years is enough.
And

Speaker 49 considering the horrific abuse. And the DA, Gil Garcetti at the time, just lost OJ.
So he's like, we can't, a lot of this is political. We can't lose this.
No abuse is allowed in the second trial.

Speaker 36 One of the most telling things was that in the documentary that came out recently about them, that the prosecutor, and prosecutors are always like, fucking lock this piece of shit.

Speaker 49 She's a Spitfire.

Speaker 12 She's a real Spitfire. And she goes,

Speaker 35 the day, that's the woman right there.

Speaker 60 Where is she? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 35 She goes, the day that that guy died, the father, she goes, the world became a better place.

Speaker 6 So for the prosecutor to say that, you know, she was like, this guy, she goes, I couldn't find one character witness for the father.

Speaker 29 Not one.

Speaker 49 Not even one he paid. None.
Think about how much money he had. No one.

Speaker 9 He must have been just a real fucking horrible guy.

Speaker 56 Well,

Speaker 49 they have 20 family members, even on his side, who say, let these guys out. Like, that's why I believe.

Speaker 49 But when I was watching that, I remember being young and watching that and being like, ooh, I don't know about the sweaters.

Speaker 49 and and i don't think as a society we could wrap our brains around that that would happen

Speaker 27 no because i remember growing up and thinking like oh those two douchebags killed their me too parents you know because you don't think about that context for sure about it but but you should you shouldn't kill your mommy and daddy and there's a lot of people are abused but geez louise no absolutely i totally but they paid their debt to society i see what you're saying 100 because my mom says that

Speaker 49 um why do you have to talk about the bananas all the time and she goes and i and they shot their parents and And I said, I know, mom, but I said, I don't want to get into details.

Speaker 49 But if you watch the documentary about Menudo

Speaker 49 and

Speaker 49 nothing against that industry back then, but now that we know what we know, what did he have access to and how evil was it?

Speaker 49 But I think, obviously, when they went to reload and shoot the mom.

Speaker 19 There's a lot of hatred in there.

Speaker 31 Rage. Rage.

Speaker 49 Rage.

Speaker 49 But I do think that they paid their debt to society. I truly believe that.

Speaker 40 And all of their family members.

Speaker 49 If they were even, you know, the father's family members. That's interesting that nobody liked the guy.

Speaker 5 Not one.

Speaker 42 She goes, that's the reason, she goes, we couldn't even have a character witness brought to the trial because we couldn't find one.

Speaker 49 I think people think money equals problem solved.

Speaker 108 And therefore, why would anyone with money do that?

Speaker 49 It hides a lot of things, I think. And I even think with the Ramseys, like, people are like, oh, no, that wouldn't happen.
Look at the facade. Like, look at the way they look and their house.

Speaker 27 And the, you know,

Speaker 49 I think that, and I do that, I fall into that of like, well, they don't look like they should look. They don't look like Manson.

Speaker 49 What could possibly be wrong? But I think secrets are held tight inside of houses and you never know. And that's part of the crime obsession.

Speaker 108 You're watching like 20, why would I?

Speaker 12 It's all the questions. You're the unanswered questions, of course.

Speaker 49 And I don't know if we ever hear a why and go, oh, that makes sense.

Speaker 79 But that's like the, you know, this is like the, it's the, the reason why Hitchcock became a phenomenon.

Speaker 91 It's like you go, this thing happened, and then you're, you want to piece it together.

Speaker 4 Everyone wants to piece things together.

Speaker 6 You want an explanation.

Speaker 30 You want the answer at the end.

Speaker 4 And every time a crime occurs, it's a new question, right?

Speaker 46 And you go like, what?

Speaker 57 Like, it's just this.

Speaker 49 What I found, so the

Speaker 90 trial.

Speaker 49 of Richard Allen in Delphi, there are, it's a business. And so I saw ABC, NBC they're swarming

Speaker 3 and like who's getting exclusives and do you know the family and can you get the the the and it's it's and you guys all end up competing too because Netflix puts out the doc and then all of a sudden there's a dateline special and then there's a CNN special like everybody has to do their story on it.

Speaker 49 I think you guys who paved the way, it's true. Last night I didn't realize how long you guys have been doing this, but you really did pave the way of different media.
And

Speaker 49 what I love about you guys is people kind of talk about their feelings and talk about who they are. And at CNN, it's like teleprompter and anchor hair.
And it's funny, Mr.

Speaker 49 Ballin, I met with him about his charity. And I said, Can I even say this, fuck? And he goes, I love that you said, fuck.
He goes, you have anchor hair, but we love you. So it made me laugh.

Speaker 49 I'm like, that's because of you guys. At CNN, I'd be like, pulled up.
But my point is, I think that you allow conversations to happen. And that's why I really love you guys because it's authentic.

Speaker 49 And at CNN, I remember producers in my head is like, Susan, I said,

Speaker 49 you're kind of funny. We like the commercial break, Susan.

Speaker 60 Oh, I'm like, I'm like, but I can't do the commercial break, Susan.

Speaker 49 I'd like,

Speaker 49 you know, it's like three, two, one.

Speaker 60 Sure, yeah.

Speaker 49 Pretend you're coming up tomorrow with the Yanker voice. So I digress, but you guys allow for this conversations to happen.

Speaker 49 And I forget your question.

Speaker 32 No, that's.

Speaker 70 I want to ask you this.

Speaker 6 The gays are going nuts for Luigi Mangion.

Speaker 49 And so is the rest of society but gays i think me too i think me too if you saw my screenshots so i was getting my haircut the other day and i i was looking at like a haircut i liked and the guy got some hair goes why is luigian

Speaker 49 i go i know it was a screenshot of him i'm sorry stunning

Speaker 30 handsome young man smart smart uh young young he's very young um the gays really are going crazy if you go on twitter it's like gay twitter um and also like there's a a lot of debate over whether that penis pic is real.

Speaker 27 Wait, wait, really?

Speaker 49 Debate now.

Speaker 49 You guys, I'm behind on the

Speaker 27 story.

Speaker 85 What? The dick picks?

Speaker 85 I broke it.

Speaker 49 You didn't see the penis pic. Mom, it's time to mute this.
What?

Speaker 63 Susan? What?

Speaker 85 You got to see his dumb.

Speaker 49 No.

Speaker 12 Well, people were saying whether or not it's a Photoshop, but where?

Speaker 40 Well, there's a.

Speaker 49 Was it the perp walk? Did you guys see the perp walk with the mayor who's in trouble with Diddy at his own perp walk?

Speaker 3 The perp walk was kind of crazy.

Speaker 49 Well, Oh, that pic.

Speaker 8 Nope, that's not the one, but that is one.

Speaker 49 That's not the one.

Speaker 6 That's not the one.

Speaker 18 That's a good one.

Speaker 38 But that's an example of.

Speaker 49 I think he's closer to my son's age than my age. All right, let's see.

Speaker 49 I know what the draw is, though.

Speaker 25 What is the draw?

Speaker 49 The Robin Hood type of guy. Like my husband's father passed away last week.
He was 70 at COPD for a while. He had got COVID.
They put him in the hospital, nicest guy. We all went to Disney last year.

Speaker 49 Anyway, his insurance,

Speaker 49 they sent him home early.

Speaker 49 And he died. He was, I mean, and my husband was talking to him on the phone watching a Broncos game.
And my husband said, do you think he got too excited? He couldn't breathe.

Speaker 108 I'm like, he should have been in the hospital still.

Speaker 49 Or they said with rehab to build up the lungs. And he died.
He was mentally fine. He was only 70.
So I, and he said, it's the insurance thing. I said, that's why that guy.

Speaker 48 It really did like open our eyes.

Speaker 49 We're all talking about it.

Speaker 6 It sparked, which actually kind of defines how terrorism works, right?

Speaker 36 Because like a terrorist attack

Speaker 12 isn't about the act of violence. It's usually done to point your eyes towards a cause, right?

Speaker 6 And then, and then that's when that's when they consider it a success.

Speaker 2 It's like if you do the horrific act of violence and they go, why did this happen? We did it because of this.

Speaker 24 And then if you're discussing this and you're changing the way you view something, that's like a successful terrorist attack.

Speaker 42 This was killing one person, but it's.

Speaker 27 Oh, there it is.

Speaker 90 Yeah, that's not it.

Speaker 31 That's it.

Speaker 34 Oh, that's the one that people are.

Speaker 9 You're saying that's a fake.

Speaker 70 People are saying that might be a fake.

Speaker 29 Susan, please look. This is very important.

Speaker 60 Do you think

Speaker 27 that's his real piece?

Speaker 49 Now we're going to go to a commercial break. Well, the lighting seems to be.
Oh, my God, he's eyes.

Speaker 103 I mean, isn't that crazy?

Speaker 27 Now you can see why. Do you do this at CNN?

Speaker 5 Now you can see why gay Twitter is going nuts.

Speaker 49 A producer read my air and go, B-roll. We got B-roll.

Speaker 40 Roll it.

Speaker 27 You think it's authentic?

Speaker 62 Here's our B-roll.

Speaker 60 Is that authentic?

Speaker 49 Oh my gosh, you guys, he's too young for me even to be thinking.

Speaker 63 He's scuttering.

Speaker 47 Look at it like you're a pediatrician.

Speaker 44 Do you think?

Speaker 49 I think it's real.

Speaker 61 You think it's real?

Speaker 27 I don't know, because now looking at that, we did see that picture last time we discussed it. The shadowing, the light, it seems a little blurry at the head.
It's a hog.

Speaker 27 Do you see the head as a little blurry? Yeah. It's in the foreground, and therefore it should be clearer image, correct?

Speaker 49 Look, then as a society, we came together over this guy. Wait, did that sound right? Okay, we all got together

Speaker 49 over this guy.

Speaker 49 But, but, but, but, there's clearly something wrong. The mom was called and she said,

Speaker 49 is this your son? Like, he is a huge family. Like, is if that was my son, Jack, oh my God.
But if that was like, I'd be like, that's my.

Speaker 3 Just don't close it. Just move it off frame for a moment.

Speaker 6 I don't want her to lose her frame.

Speaker 60 I'm Catholic.

Speaker 49 I would, you know, she said I could see him doing that. So I'm wondering, was this the beginning of schizophrenia? I'm just making that up.
Like, was something

Speaker 49 to think that he's the normal

Speaker 49 University of Pennsylvania.

Speaker 34 I think he was this normal, obviously very bright guy.

Speaker 23 He's valedictorian. You penny.

Speaker 75 He's in the 20s, you penny. And really sharp guy.

Speaker 42 But he started to retreat from his normal connections.

Speaker 70 Nobody was in touch with him.

Speaker 25 that's not normal behavior, especially for somebody in their early 20s.

Speaker 70 Started to post and write, you know, things that were not of the norm, like his going on, I think, some Reddit rants and maybe on Twitter about his, the, you know, his feelings about the healthcare industry.

Speaker 70 And, and, so, you have these kind of behaviors that indicate something is changing, right?

Speaker 9 Then the actual act of pulling off this assassination.

Speaker 76 And now you have,

Speaker 70 you know, they had the very short manifesto written that he was like, this was my work alone and didn't want to, I didn't include anybody else on this, but now pleading not guilty to it, which is matching the lawyer sweater, isn't that weird?

Speaker 49 And the husband of that woman is P. Diddy's lawyer.
They're a dream team, though. I mean, if anyone could get him off.

Speaker 22 I don't see how you can get off on this. I really don't.

Speaker 49 Well, there's something called, um, is it jury nullification, which basically means they could go back. Same thing with OJ, in my opinion.

Speaker 23 Oh, that a jury might let him off.

Speaker 49 Yeah, a jury might be, hey, you know,

Speaker 60 maybe Nicole did,

Speaker 49 but there's a bigger issue. It was Rodney King, it just happened, and I understand.
And they were,

Speaker 49 I remember, I think I was interning at a Fox affiliate in Phoenix. I went to Arizona State.

Speaker 50 So I was, but I remember

Speaker 49 watching that. And I, Theater, he was a superstar, right? But I'm wondering, is this guy a superstar?

Speaker 77 Kind of.

Speaker 77 For a certain portion of the population, he is.

Speaker 49 But mentally, did i think oj would kill again no no

Speaker 11 would i don't know i don't know the mental stability of luigi i don't know luigi might be like i mean there's there's it's reasonable to believe that he might have a new agenda or or see somebody else that is reasonable to go after you know not that i think he's a

Speaker 60 career

Speaker 49 so much more than we know for sure you know because what a heartbreak for them this kid i watched this high school speech val victorian i still don't know how to spell it much less be it For him to do that speech, it's like, what happens?

Speaker 49 But there is schizophrenia with boys, and I think girls, I think, more boys at that particular time.

Speaker 49 That's when he could show so.

Speaker 37 So the fact that he had this

Speaker 36 surgery that,

Speaker 25 you know, to have spinal surgery.

Speaker 49 But did he? Someone I saw on a show was saying, how do we know that's his x-ray?

Speaker 11 Well, yeah, but I think he's...

Speaker 49 He did, though, right?

Speaker 60 He wasn't here.

Speaker 1 He's been...

Speaker 6 You can find him talking about him him going through this.

Speaker 19 I wonder if that pain shifted something.

Speaker 77 Oh, that pain can shift something in you for sure.

Speaker 77 And pills and whatever else he was taking

Speaker 34 can mess with your mind.

Speaker 21 And

Speaker 25 you can kind of fall into schizophrenia at an early age because of that.

Speaker 91 But, you know,

Speaker 6 he was in real pain, I think, with his back problems.

Speaker 49 I remember after September 11th, I think I was in Palm Springs at the time, everyone coming together.

Speaker 49 And of course, I feel like, and not to compare this to that, but but in terms of how, like, doesn't matter what party, everyone agrees that our health care system

Speaker 31 is a disaster.

Speaker 49 Yeah. Is a disaster, whoever you ask.
And maybe, like, if you can afford, it shouldn't be that you could afford it. I was thinking, like, so

Speaker 49 I was thinking this about my, I should have stepped in. We should have gotten him a private nurse.
And why can't we step? I didn't know how bad he was. It was sudden, though.

Speaker 49 I didn't know that they sent him home.

Speaker 108 And we didn't know.

Speaker 49 But it shouldn't even be that. If you pay, he's paying health insurance.

Speaker 57 He doesn't.

Speaker 44 People get so egregious.

Speaker 102 And so I think

Speaker 25 that's the coverage. And you'll see that.

Speaker 49 He's the symbolic.

Speaker 29 Yes, he's the symbol of it.

Speaker 49 Face of it. And he happens to be good-looking.

Speaker 27 I know. Thank God we chose a handsome fella.

Speaker 10 Well, it would be, I've thought about this: that if he were

Speaker 3 not a good-looking guy, there would still be people who'd be like, Yeah, I get why you did this.

Speaker 49 And like, supporting the fact that, like, I think Chris Rocks said that, he's like, come on. But this changed this guy looked like someone else.
We'd be over it. He's good-looking, right?

Speaker 49 And smart and came from that like succession family. Yeah.
I'm dying a deep dive there. Like what,

Speaker 51 or.

Speaker 4 It's interesting, too, that the grandmother.

Speaker 90 What?

Speaker 37 The grandmother had a $30 million

Speaker 42 fortune that she left to

Speaker 77 her children and grandchildren, right?

Speaker 36 Of which he is one.

Speaker 75 And in the will,

Speaker 4 it notes like if anybody's convicted of a felony,

Speaker 61 that you don't get a piece of this.

Speaker 76 But I'm like, this is such an interesting thing to think you have to put in there.

Speaker 34 You know what I mean?

Speaker 88 Like, I just, but who does that?

Speaker 34 Yeah, like, who goes, well, no felonies, though.

Speaker 49 That sounds like succession. Yeah.
Like, that there would, she predicted that something like that would happen.

Speaker 49 I remember my Aunt Jeannie, who didn't die with much, you'd go, I love my Aunt Jeannie and Uncle Peter. You'd go in their house, and it felt like at a madman.

Speaker 49 And they, I think they grew up in the Depression, so they had Campbell's soup.

Speaker 49 But they, he, my dad, who's an attorney, was the executor, and he said, Uncle Peter, a $200,000, like, stuff was hidden in mattresses.

Speaker 49 But they left it to like my mom and certain people, but not the cousin that was divorced. That was the end of that.

Speaker 60 That was their line.

Speaker 49 Yeah, like divorce, but felonies apparently with this family. But I wonder if it does go to trial, he's charged federally.
But it's funny, I had questions about terrorism, and you answered it.

Speaker 70 Well, because they, and it was a big deal because when he was originally arrested, they were saying that they were going to charge him with second-degree murder.

Speaker 42 Because in New York is a more likely conviction.

Speaker 70 And the sentencing guidelines for that, they felt like they could for sure do that.

Speaker 41 And

Speaker 77 then there was the shift to make it first-degree terrorism, which is a much, but there's a much higher burden of proof for that. So there's a lower threshold to convict on second degree.

Speaker 12 But I think with the fact that,

Speaker 25 well, the video, obviously they confiscated the backpack, the, you know, they had the gun there.

Speaker 51 That's interesting.

Speaker 49 With Casey Anthony, there was a criticism of overcharge. So she walked.

Speaker 49 That could be interesting.

Speaker 2 Could be the, yeah.

Speaker 49 I heard this morning that P. Diddy is jealous of how much attention he's getting.

Speaker 49 Because they're in the same prison. And they have husband and wife lawyers.
The wife is his lawyer. The husband's P.
Diddy. So P.
Diddy is furious.

Speaker 5 He's like, why is everybody talking about Luigi, man?

Speaker 27 That is so ridiculous.

Speaker 31 But he's furious.

Speaker 49 It's interesting about murder and what we think. And looking at, I remember seeing that video and thinking, who has a silencer? This was a hit.
And then the bike.

Speaker 49 But then, is it true that like a female flirting brought him down? Like, I mean, that's.

Speaker 88 Well, that's how that photo got circulated.

Speaker 10 Yeah.

Speaker 4 The photo was circulated because, like, if it's not for this photo, we don't have a face.

Speaker 34 So, if you don't have a face, how would people know who to look for?

Speaker 49 We didn't have it. If you're a savvy and you planned it, like, you don't flirt with the

Speaker 27 gorgeous. You're right.
You know what's interesting, though, is that I feel more afraid of a P. Diddy than I do this.

Speaker 49 So do I. I was just going to say that.
We have different lines. Like with BTK, who was absolutely nuts and would kill again, and he said that out loud in court.

Speaker 49 Would certain people kill again? Like that's, it's almost like the Menendez. Like when is a murder we ass? And I guess that's why, obviously, they have the legal system and parole.

Speaker 49 It's like, would they do it again? How have they acted in prison? And I guess that matters to the new generation.

Speaker 47 Diddy was in a

Speaker 31 torturing people.

Speaker 63 And he's been torturing people.

Speaker 49 Diddy, I think he tried to kill Jamie Foxx or somebody. I don't know.
The more I go down it, I don't know what to believe with him, but it's like, again, I ask why you have everything.

Speaker 31 What are you doing?

Speaker 34 Well, I mean, that was callitic. That's the big thing.

Speaker 12 He was just like unchecked resources and power that just kept growing and growing.

Speaker 79 And then that...

Speaker 24 For him, it feels like it was just like to get that dopamine drip, you just had to keep raising the bar until it got into this really sick, dark world.

Speaker 18 I don't know.

Speaker 6 I mean, who knows what would have been next for him

Speaker 3 if you follow the story.

Speaker 49 It's almost what happens to you, though. I feel like I'm not saying that everyone's abused who commits murder, but kind of, I think so.
It's like, what happened to you?

Speaker 49 Oh, yeah. But there are people that are abused that never do this.
I'm not saying that that excuses it.

Speaker 70 But usually, when it's like

Speaker 28 serial killers, people that have patterns of repeated violence, you almost always, always find neglect and abuse, almost 100%.

Speaker 49 I asked Gabby Petito's dad that he was wonderful. Joe Petito, I said to him, I went to his house in Florida.
He's from Long Island, though, him and his wife. And

Speaker 49 they were setting up lights and it took forever. And I said, I got to know him.

Speaker 43 Wait, where did I?

Speaker 49 Oh, oh my gosh, this is embarrassing. So I was doing a Gabby Petito special at CNN and I was doing this and I was exhausted.

Speaker 49 And I'm walking to the parking lot and they're like, keep trying to call Joe. Here's his number.
I'm like, hello. He answered, Susan? I said, yeah, it's Susan Hendricks.
How you doing? He goes, good.

Speaker 49 And I start hysterically crying i'm overtired i'm like i'm so sorry and he's like don't worry about it it's gonna be all right i'm like this guy's making me feel i'm mortified it's a father and i just said i'm so sorry i just because the video came out of her that body cam video of her

Speaker 49 and i i think that was my peak of like okay i need a break here i'm crying to this dad um

Speaker 49 But so I got to know him and I and I said, what do you think happened? This is off the camera. And And he goes, I'm going to show you something on my phone.
And it's not out yet.

Speaker 49 I'm going to show you something. I said, all right.
He goes, Gabby texts me this that day and it's her with a huge black eye.

Speaker 56 And I'm like, oh, my.

Speaker 49 And I said, do you think it's his father? Like, is that, I was trying to,

Speaker 49 I had gotten to know him.

Speaker 44 And he goes, the mom, the mom.

Speaker 49 And I said, what? And he goes, did you see the note that came out? It said, burn after reading. Like, it was, so body cam footage came out where he was seen smacking across the face.

Speaker 49 I think she was, so an assessment had been done that was in Utah. And I interviewed the assessor of this, who

Speaker 49 was the police chief, who said, based on what he saw and investigated, she was the victim of long-term abuse.

Speaker 18 The girl was. Yeah.

Speaker 49 And I think watching that, I think I saw myself

Speaker 28 from him.

Speaker 97 No. Oh, from him.
Him.

Speaker 49 Yeah, yeah. But long-term, meaning at that age, it could be a couple years.
And I saw a little bit of myself in like who you dated at that age.

Speaker 49 And so when I saw that in the newsroom it was very different than my friend Sammy who is 25 a pretty he's like she seems a little off too I'm like oh god only certain people see what I see yeah because he had

Speaker 49 kind of conned the cops who were there and said is everything all right and he's like

Speaker 49 you saw him suck them in it was something that I'll never forget seeing and

Speaker 49 The father said, I can't watch that. That's not really Gabby.
I'll watch part of it, he said, but it gets very depressing. And he said, what keeps their family going?

Speaker 49 So Gabby's mom and dad were divorced when she was three. They're good friends with the now step parents.
They're all good friends. They were at CrimeCon one year and they're funny and nice.

Speaker 49 They went golfing with my husband. They're nice.
They came together. Now they're trying to help others, like people who don't get as much attention as Gabby.

Speaker 49 Because I was asked that at CrimeCon, like, why? Because she's blonde and pretty. And is that why? And I said, I'm not sure.
I don't make the decisions at Sienna.

Speaker 49 I don't know if that comes first, then the attention comes, or is it we put it out first? But they're right. Everyone should get equal attention.
And now Joe and his family fight for that.

Speaker 49 But he said watching that, her mom said watching that, her mom's uncle,

Speaker 49 that she knew.

Speaker 56 She knew right after that.

Speaker 49 And seeing that is horrible.

Speaker 27 Can I ask you this? When you've met people. that have committed crime, violent crimes, do you feel

Speaker 27 an energy from them? For instance, in that John Bonet documentary on Netflix, the first policewoman that shows up, she says, I locked eyes with the father with John, and I knew, and I knew.

Speaker 27 Like, did you, do you feel a cold breeze?

Speaker 49 I will say that that's a great question. I felt it in Delphi when I first walked into the hearing.
This was at the end of July.

Speaker 49 And when he turned around, and I know, It's easy to say because he's an orange, you know,

Speaker 49 but that look was like, oh my God. And it's not about me.
So I'm with the family. They said to me, Susan, come over here.

Speaker 31 I go, it's inappropriate.

Speaker 49 I always said, now I hear my son say, that's inappropriate.

Speaker 49 And so I said, I was like, they're like, no, come here. So I sat with him and he just glared.
And that's, I never got a feeling like that.

Speaker 49 But it's not often that I meet the guy, like the alleged perpetrator, whoever. I usually meet the families, the Joe Petitos, not the Brian, the guy who's accused.

Speaker 49 But with John Ramsey, I didn't feel it. But,

Speaker 49 and I wonder if I would have with BTK. It's interesting because I felt it with him, but he was in, and he was looking at me, and he was also at the ceiling doing this.

Speaker 19 BT?

Speaker 49 No, this is

Speaker 105 Richard Allen.

Speaker 49 And then when the trial came along, I think he was faking it. Then I saw a interview that he did.
And he acted normal.

Speaker 40 Because I was watching him and I go, how did the wife not know he was nuts?

Speaker 49 Because the wife's sitting over there. Then I see an interview interrogation that he did.
And I'm like, because he's faking it. He is

Speaker 49 normal.

Speaker 49 I think that the people who are able to do that, if I met him and he wasn't arrested, I don't think I'd be able to do it.

Speaker 63 I think you would.

Speaker 49 I think they're good at it.

Speaker 27 Well, what about these eyes? Look into these eyes. What do you see? What do you feel? Feel the coldness.

Speaker 49 He's too much of an intellect.

Speaker 40 The coldness.

Speaker 66 The coldness.

Speaker 27 The dead, the dead.

Speaker 12 My first gig was I worked for America's Most Wanted.

Speaker 49 What?

Speaker 19 I didn't know that.

Speaker 38 Yeah, I was an associate producer on Final Justice.

Speaker 25 You love it. And then I switched over to America's Most Wanted.

Speaker 49 You know, I can't wait to call my husband because he's like,

Speaker 49 I'm a huge fan. He's like, it's definitely going to be the wife who knows all about the murder stuff.

Speaker 49 He's not even going to know what you're talking about.

Speaker 57 Yeah.

Speaker 27 I don't like it. I don't like it, Susan.
Let me tell you, I don't like it. And

Speaker 27 I get more terrified because this could be your neighbor. This could be the school teacher.

Speaker 49 This is called

Speaker 49 they're called news moms on Seidgo.

Speaker 2 I got to ask you this, this, though, because you said you interviewed BTK's daughter.

Speaker 36 That story is obviously one of the most famous, horrific stories.

Speaker 25 But when you realize that this guy had the family and the, like, what

Speaker 3 was she like?

Speaker 46 What did you gather from her?

Speaker 49 She was really amazing. She's very, you could tell that her nervous system is shot.
And she said that she,

Speaker 49 her dad would say to her, be careful, be careful that BTK, you know, lock the doors or do no, yes. And so

Speaker 49 she, I felt her get her mojo back, so to speak. Like at CrimeCon, I think it's a good thing it gave her strength.
She was a, and oh my gosh, so there's a Q ⁇ A session at the end

Speaker 49 and she wrote about it,

Speaker 49 two kids with her husband, but it caused a divorce. And of course, she says she has PTSD and all of that.
But when the FBI first showed up at her door, they said she thought her grandmother died.

Speaker 49 They mentioned some, someone, she, it didn't click until they said, your father's BTK. And she said, my life changed from then on out.
I had no idea. None.
Zero.

Speaker 49 And the mom and, of course, the brother, everybody was shocked.

Speaker 49 I think she said, I have to own it. I can't hide from this.
But I hope that people know that I,

Speaker 49 of course, they know you had nothing to do with it. So someone stood up at the end, and this gave her strength.
I never thought I would hear this. And I said, okay, you're next.

Speaker 49 And she said, hi, Carrie. I wasn't going to come, but I heard you were here.
My dad's also a serial killer.

Speaker 27 No.

Speaker 57 And I went, only a crime con, a place called crime, that you would find that.

Speaker 3 Somebody else saying that.

Speaker 61 Yeah, that's cool.

Speaker 49 And

Speaker 49 so they walk up to her and say, hey, you know, and I asked Kevin that who puts it on with his brother, how do you keep out the crazies? Because you would think they'd be there. Yeah.

Speaker 49 And he said, well, it's two things. If anyone does anything bad, they're out.
Escorted out. But I price them out.
It's expensive.

Speaker 49 These people have like backstage for $1,000 meet and greet and it's weird he was able to do this upstairs and it's different cities each time it's like they have sweatshirts that say i'm basically a detective and like a payphone i'm like i remember pay and like cutouts of the dateline people um but then on a different floor it's with delphi like flyers we want you to help out but everybody's kind they really are they're they they're spending a lot of money to be there they want to be there and a good friend of mine he used to play for the falcons koi wire I worked with them for years at CNN.

Speaker 49 And he's like, oh my gosh, my wife is so jealous. She was at the first Crime Con in New Orleans.

Speaker 40 I'm like, really?

Speaker 40 Why?

Speaker 49 But I, but because people love 2020 dateline, they, and I think, I don't have the exact answer, but I think it's because people feel more in control maybe.

Speaker 49 It comes down to like a mystery, who would do it and why. It's not so much a crime, like a drive-by shooting.

Speaker 49 It's more like who did it.

Speaker 80 Yeah.

Speaker 49 And why. And we never know why.
We're always like, why?

Speaker 27 Well, and I was watching Gladiator 2 this morning as I was walking in my treadmill. And I do think, you know, that is a primitive yearning that humans need violence.
We need that sublimation.

Speaker 27 The bad guy. We need to see bloody, awful stuff because it is a part of the human experience, unfortunately.
I don't know. Maybe it's a cruel thing.

Speaker 56 Maybe we like it.

Speaker 49 I think I was able to watch Friday the 13th at age like 12. I tell my mom that she's like, I didn't know you were watching that.

Speaker 49 I'm like, we were screaming the VCR tape of like Jason slaughtering people.

Speaker 49 If my son's like, now I'm, I'm, I overcompensate, but clearly he knows what's going on because I did order books and the first person to see, oh my gosh, now I have to write this.

Speaker 49 How am I going to write it? And tracking this was the hardest thing I've ever done in my life. So I ordered these books and he goes, Mom, murder.

Speaker 102 And I said, oh, no, that's an actress.

Speaker 40 He goes, oh, shh.

Speaker 49 I'm like, my daughter is older. She would never do that.
He's definitely definitely in tune to different things. He's like, murder.

Speaker 46 You want to see some wild shit?

Speaker 35 I don't know if you've seen this. This is

Speaker 49 Brian. I'm like, I'm in.

Speaker 36 Yeah, of course. This is

Speaker 12 Brian Cohey Jr. You saw this? No.

Speaker 49 I thought you were going to say Coberger.

Speaker 99 Parents have some concerns of some stuff they may have found in your room?

Speaker 43 Yeah, I believe so.

Speaker 59 And what would it be?

Speaker 64 A human head and hands.

Speaker 62 Like, for real, human head and hands?

Speaker 43 Yes. From

Speaker 64 that fellow who went missing recently.

Speaker 99 Which fellow was that?

Speaker 84 Warren Brown.

Speaker 59 Warren Brown? When did he go missing?

Speaker 64 The night of the 27th.

Speaker 59 The night of the 27th? Okay, then how did you end up with him?

Speaker 64 I murdered him.

Speaker 15 With what?

Speaker 7 A knife.

Speaker 90 Why would you have done that?

Speaker 64 I've always wondered what murder felt like.

Speaker 99 How do you know this guy?

Speaker 64 They told me that that was what was in the wallet.

Speaker 43 What do you mean that was?

Speaker 99 How'd you come across the gentleman?

Speaker 64 I was driving

Speaker 64 and I saw a strange shape near the railway. Uh-huh.
So

Speaker 64 I parked my car and investigated it, and I found it to be a man sleeping.

Speaker 43 Okay.

Speaker 59 Where's the knife at?

Speaker 64 It is in my sunken car. Well, it's in my car.
I had that. Previously sunken.

Speaker 90 Well,

Speaker 59 when I killed him,

Speaker 64 I tried disposing disposing of his body back so much.

Speaker 43 I just

Speaker 60 I don't know how you guys are in it.

Speaker 99 Where's the rest of his body at?

Speaker 59 Where's the rest of the body at?

Speaker 109 What parts?

Speaker 27 The rest of it, homie.

Speaker 109 Down the river.

Speaker 43 Down the river.

Speaker 50 I'm gonna have you walk over here.

Speaker 43 You're gonna sit in the back of

Speaker 99 my partner's control patrol car for a minute, okay?

Speaker 99 Just sit back there and hang out for me, okay?

Speaker 27 Why do you just keep the head and hands, I wonder? And the rest is down the river.

Speaker 105 I'm good, sir. How are you?

Speaker 54 You said your name is Brian?

Speaker 64 I'm not feeling too well.

Speaker 54 No, no feeling too well?

Speaker 83 No, these constant days, I've been very, very anxious.

Speaker 56 Yeah, that's understandable.

Speaker 49 So, what we're going to have you do here is I'm just going to have you sit in the back here, okay?

Speaker 27 I'm going to turn on the air for you in a second.

Speaker 27 That way, you're not too hot. Are you a hot button?

Speaker 49 We knew about Jeffrey Dahlmer, and then the whole new generation learned about it.

Speaker 20 Well, no, that documentary screen.

Speaker 43 So, you prefer the cold?

Speaker 31 Okay, fantastic.

Speaker 66 I'm going to hear about that.

Speaker 27 So, hop in here.

Speaker 98 I know you're tall, so it's a little bit of a tight squeeze, but like I said, I'll get that air up.

Speaker 31 We go back to British shows.

Speaker 27 Oh, we got more, right, Sean?

Speaker 50 My mom's like, why don't you go to Hallmark? Christmas.

Speaker 43 I'm like, okay.

Speaker 29 And she called me and said, get over here right now.

Speaker 18 Oh, they have to blur it out again.

Speaker 49 Oh, wait. Was it one dog? Can you see it?

Speaker 50 She didn't want to hang it on. I don't want to look at it.

Speaker 50 Yep.

Speaker 29 Yeah.

Speaker 29 So.

Speaker 3 But you see how he was like.

Speaker 49 Is this a serial killer? No, no. What state?

Speaker 60 I got to go throw up. Excuse me.

Speaker 19 I have to

Speaker 18 go to Colorado.

Speaker 6 Grand Junction, Colorado.

Speaker 27 Grand Junction. Okay.
I'm going to pitch.

Speaker 61 You're going to leave right now?

Speaker 27 I have to pee so bad. I'm so anxious and nervous.
Watching murders.

Speaker 43 I'm sorry. I have to piss.

Speaker 29 She's such a bummer about this shit.

Speaker 49 Wait, how old is that kid?

Speaker 5 He was 19 when he murdered a 69-year-old guy.

Speaker 49 I know. It is weird.
I think when Nancy Grace came into HLN CNN, it was and the Casey Anthony, it's all about ratings and numbers. So that's when it kind of shifted.

Speaker 49 That's when I kind of got into the all-crime

Speaker 49 genre. So it is my job.
It's weird.

Speaker 6 I think there's also something about just how many,

Speaker 70 you know, when you say like, it would be great if everybody could get the same coverage,

Speaker 4 just how many.

Speaker 28 horrific crimes occur, particularly in this country like this, violent crimes.

Speaker 49 And what I realized with Gabby Petito's dad told me that in the national parks, like there are dead bodies that are there, and no one talks about it.

Speaker 49 Because I did say to him, Look, I'm going to be a crime con with you, and that's going to be a question. I even asked my bosses at CNN, I'm like, How do you think I should answer?

Speaker 49 Because they're like, Well, don't bring that up.

Speaker 19 I'm like, I'm not going to bring it up.

Speaker 49 They're going to bring it up. Why do we cover blonde, pretty girls, or like the Casey Anthony's? I hope this isn't airing because I'm scared.
But okay.

Speaker 49 I don't know what the answer is. I think it's about what catches on.
I know it sounds callous.

Speaker 6 Part of it, though, is the fact that when you show

Speaker 6 a blonde 20-year-old who's gone missing or whatever, people's attention also just sparks for that.

Speaker 12 It's not just the fact that you showed her.

Speaker 17 It's that people go, oh, what?

Speaker 49 And to me, I guess if I were to answer, it'd be like, oh, we saw Gabby because she has, you know, videos now and kids have younger have things.

Speaker 49 With Scott Peterson's wife, it was just that one still shot. shot.
Do you remember with Lacey Peterson? Now, kids have videos and you're able to kind of get a peek into their lives.

Speaker 3 Did you watch that doc?

Speaker 49 Which one? The Scott Peterson? Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 35 I forgot so much about that case.

Speaker 49 With his ponytail, but I'm like, someone said to me at CNN, and you kind of joke, you get used to what you do.

Speaker 63 Not joke about anyone dying, but you get used to what you do.

Speaker 49 And if you don't laugh, you lose your mind. But someone's like, how about that aging on Scott Peterson? What's going on with the skincare?

Speaker 60 Meaning he looks good.

Speaker 57 I'm like,

Speaker 49 you know, he kind of sleeps like a baby.

Speaker 60 Yeah, you know, yeah.

Speaker 49 The sister being like, still that sister-in-law.

Speaker 105 I'm sorry, she's in love with her.

Speaker 31 She's in love with her.

Speaker 24 But the

Speaker 35 crazy, one of the things that stands out so much is his behavior in the initial interrogation.

Speaker 30 Oh my God.

Speaker 47 Like the Christmas interview.

Speaker 49 Guys who do this, who don't cry, they have this raspy voice.

Speaker 60 They're like, we're looking for Liz, eh?

Speaker 49 Like, they have like this raspy, like, I don't know where she is, trying to sound sad. Practice it, Tom.
It's a raspy, like, fried voice with no tears.

Speaker 19 Christina's gone.

Speaker 102 Is that good?

Speaker 49 A new whisper. Yep, perfect.

Speaker 31 Christina's

Speaker 31 going to go.

Speaker 60 And that's it.

Speaker 49 No tears.

Speaker 3 He was like,

Speaker 3 he's like, yeah, I got back.

Speaker 28 I went fishing.

Speaker 38 And then I saw the dog that was out.

Speaker 80 And then, I don't know, yeah, I hope that's right.

Speaker 49 I'm fishing on Christmas Day. And Nancy Gray is like fishing on Christmas Day.

Speaker 27 I love Nancy Grace. Didn't he like order a pizza before he called and called her in missing or something?

Speaker 24 He was so chill.

Speaker 49 Oh, he got. No, remember, the cops arrested him.
He had an orange beard.

Speaker 49 He took classes at Arizona State, my alum.

Speaker 49 But he, and they're like, are you hungry?

Speaker 108 And they went through a drive there when he got like in and out.

Speaker 49 They're like, are you hungry? And he's like, I'm starving.

Speaker 14 Yeah.

Speaker 49 That just killed me. No qualms.

Speaker 9 But I mean, he like he did the worst performance, like, as far as putting on a performance, he was just like, yeah, and the dog was out, so I knew something was wrong.

Speaker 46 Yeah, the dog was like, So, yeah, she's just, I don't know where she is.

Speaker 6 Like, but I hope you find her. It's like, this is your pregnant wife on Christmas Eve, and you're like, I hope you find her.

Speaker 8 I don't know what to tell you, man.

Speaker 49 How about his mistress? I really liked her.

Speaker 19 She was really nice. She was forward.

Speaker 60 And like,

Speaker 40 he's like, oh, hey, I'm in Paris.

Speaker 13 I see the AFL Tower.

Speaker 49 There's the AFL Tower.

Speaker 35 And she knows at that point that

Speaker 91 what's going on.

Speaker 31 So she has to be like, oh, cool.

Speaker 27 Yeah.

Speaker 49 Do you see now this is my job? So I would listen to you guys and was on the algorithm and was like,

Speaker 49 all I wanted to do was laugh. Yeah.
Because it's like,

Speaker 49 and I am, I will say, I'm a little nuts. Like, I'm so aware of my surroundings that I was at the gym and I hit this

Speaker 49 the elevator and I noticed like a guy was supposed to get off on the button. He clicked, but he didn't.
He got off on where I did. And I'm like,

Speaker 49 and I take a right and I'm like, I'm nuts.

Speaker 108 I'm nuts.

Speaker 28 I remember one time.

Speaker 27 Stranger danger, baby.

Speaker 70 I was a foreign exchange student.

Speaker 25 I was in Madrid.

Speaker 25 And the bus that would go to my stop,

Speaker 106 it was taking it in the evening.

Speaker 29 And I got up from the back of the bus.

Speaker 6 And a woman in the front of the bus was getting off.

Speaker 5 And she turned around and saw me.

Speaker 35 And when I got off with her, she ran.

Speaker 9 Like, she ran.

Speaker 6 And like, and I, like, like, screaming, ran.

Speaker 5 So I chased chased her.

Speaker 34 What?

Speaker 6 I did because I was like, this is so fun to see somebody this scared.

Speaker 3 So it was fun.

Speaker 27 Let the record show that he was joking about it. If I go missing, guys,

Speaker 49 my favorite clip of you guys is Bill Burr being like, no, you're.

Speaker 36 Oh, who's the bigger psycho?

Speaker 47 Oh, yeah.

Speaker 53 Total.

Speaker 49 Please. I didn't know you worked for America's Most Wanted.

Speaker 27 Yeah, he loves it.

Speaker 49 Remember the Mill Cartons? Was anyone ever found from that?

Speaker 27 Jesus Christ, I'd hope so. I think so.

Speaker 31 But that showed

Speaker 31 a lot of people.

Speaker 8 Oh, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 6 America's Must Wanted caught so many people.

Speaker 49 Oh, with what's his name? John Walsh? Yes. Yeah.

Speaker 35 That when Fox went to cancel the show after it had been on for years, there was a backlash that was so big that they brought it back.

Speaker 11 Good. Because they were showing.

Speaker 93 They're like, look, his show's already caught like 800 people.

Speaker 27 Yeah.

Speaker 31 It was public service.

Speaker 29 It was like public service, yeah.

Speaker 105 Always.

Speaker 49 I don't know if you guys are aware of this subculture.

Speaker 49 So outside of trials, I covered this, but with like Karen Reed, there's these people on YouTube who want clicks, and there was Turtle Boy, who's like the conspiracy theorist, and like, she's innocent.

Speaker 49 She was accused of killing her Boston

Speaker 49 cop husband. But, you know,

Speaker 49 so there are people who now go to these trials. So the Brian Koberger trial is coming up at the end of August.
Yeah.

Speaker 44 And that Idaho.

Speaker 93 Yeah.

Speaker 49 And I got to know Stacey.

Speaker 27 Who's this psycho? Sorry.

Speaker 49 Ethan Chapin is,

Speaker 49 you know, the college kids who were murdered in the

Speaker 49 off-campus home, the three girls and the boy.

Speaker 49 I got to know Ethan Chapin's mom, and I said to her, would you do

Speaker 49 be on a panel with me? I'm interviewing like Yardley Love, who was killed in a lacrosse. She played lacrosse at University of Virginia.
And so I was doing a panel on kind of how do you recover?

Speaker 49 What is the strength? And there's a lot of gag orders. And I said, we won't talk about the specifics.
And she said, I will. And she's so nice.
She called me like two weeks before.

Speaker 105 She goes, you didn't tell me the name of it.

Speaker 49 I go, I know.

Speaker 31 i'm sorry crime con i left that to the end oh yeah yeah

Speaker 49 i was like i know and she goes i'll do it and then uh i really love her she's like i don't think i'm going to the trial nothing can bring my son back she's like he was at his girlfriend's house and the one thing i will say i know this sounds very depressing and we keep bringing up different murders The families that I've met and the strength that I got from them, and that's the focus of my book,

Speaker 49 it's unprecedented. If you think you're going through something, it really is.

Speaker 60 And you guys do that too.

Speaker 49 Like, I feel like your genre and what you guys do, when you guys were one of the first, it's like men don't talk about things back then that you guys talk about.

Speaker 49 Like, oh, um, like with Theo Vaughn, maybe I'm depressed, or maybe emotions.

Speaker 60 Yeah, yeah, yes.

Speaker 49 For my husband to watch it, that wasn't talked about. They watched like football games.
You guys are doing something wonderful and I'm doing good work here. I kind of thought through it.

Speaker 49 You are, but I thought through it. Like, that's what that does.

Speaker 49 It's like they can get through it, then I can get through through it and i think hurt people are drawn i think you're right to crime con they really are

Speaker 27 it's good for them to meet other people too that have been victims of something

Speaker 49 of any and even not maybe of a murder but just yeah something something viable there's always something in the eyes though oh i know this guy's out of his

Speaker 27 eyes are really open wouldn't talk to that kid Wouldn't talk to him.

Speaker 49 And I remember talking to Paul Holz about it. He said, remember he saw snow or there's something snow.

Speaker 49 Like that is, I don't know if it's a sign of schizophrenia, obviously, but something was up clearly. And remember the dad driving him across the country.

Speaker 49 But in that picture, like, if he's a teacher at your college, you're not thinking mass murderer.

Speaker 35 He wants Jake Jill and Hall to play him.

Speaker 106 Is that what he said?

Speaker 49 If this tells you anything, don't trust anyone. I mean, you could turn paranoid, so that's why I have to balance it out.
And my mom's like, watch Hallmark Christmas movies

Speaker 49 with the same plot.

Speaker 49 So it is a little,

Speaker 49 um, but it is, again, the strength from the families. It is a little,

Speaker 49 oh, yeah, Jake Jill and all. I could see that.

Speaker 27 I think also I have an aversion to this type of stuff because I grew up in Los Angeles during the Night Stalker as a child.

Speaker 49 Yeah, so did my good, my college roommate.

Speaker 27 And it was so scary. We were all terrified this guy was going to climb in our windows at night.
And it's a very, there he is, childhood fear.

Speaker 49 I think that may have saved my life, and here's why. But as Ditzy as ditzy can be, my parents said, You can go to any college you want.
My dad, and my mom's like, I can't believe you said that.

Speaker 49 They took me to ASU. I live in New Jersey.
My mom cried the whole flight home. My sister went to Boston College.
She's like, You should go to Boston with your sister. I'm like, Mom, I'm old.

Speaker 49 Now I look at pictures. I'm like,

Speaker 49 So, my friend Terry had a Jeep and she ran out of gas all the time to ditzes.

Speaker 31 And the guy pulls up like muffler-dragging

Speaker 49 and said, Hop in, girls, and has a badge. And I go, Let's go.
She goes, No.

Speaker 49 And I'm shocked she said no, because I was like, why?

Speaker 49 Like, she's like, there's growing up, there was a night stalker worried about you never know who's who. And I'm like, let's get in.
He has a badge. No.
Thank God.

Speaker 6 I lived in Milwaukee during Dahmer, and I got just a taste for chocolate.

Speaker 12 I was really like, this is what I want to be doing, man.

Speaker 31 It was exciting.

Speaker 49 I think we got the Dahmer glasses.

Speaker 20 Oh, man.

Speaker 49 But the Nightstalk. I mean, we talk about people not looking like that.
He looks like a killer. That is the cool thing.
How did they finally get him? I don't even know about that.

Speaker 27 So the best part of that story is that it was the citizens of Los Angeles. They beat this guy in the streets.

Speaker 60 They found him.

Speaker 27 Somebody,

Speaker 27 no, he was all over the news in L.A. You couldn't not hear about the Night Stalker.
And his picture was up everywhere.

Speaker 27 And somebody saw him coming out of a Greyhound bus station, I think, in the neighborhood.

Speaker 47 He's trying to steal a car.

Speaker 27 And they fucking spotted him.

Speaker 27 And these group of dudes beat him down.

Speaker 49 Think about before social media, everyone's like, I'm sick of this guy.

Speaker 49 And L.A. was.

Speaker 27 And it was the greatest thing ever that he got street.

Speaker 105 Where did you grow up in LA?

Speaker 27 The San Fernando Valley.

Speaker 49 So it's on.

Speaker 49 Last night I turned on Anderson Cooper.

Speaker 60 I'm like, it's burning.

Speaker 27 It's devastating.

Speaker 27 It is devastating.

Speaker 84 Devastating. Yeah.

Speaker 27 This is the worst one ever. I don't think I've ever seen it.

Speaker 40 And getting you lived.

Speaker 49 I lived in LA a couple of years after college, Manhattan Beach first. And then my dad calls me.

Speaker 60 He's like, Do you have a job?

Speaker 49 No, I'm just moving with my friends at Manhattan Beach.

Speaker 49 But I loved living there. And I turned it on.

Speaker 22 I'm like, what the hell? It's so sad.

Speaker 27 It's very cool. Very sad.

Speaker 62 Not cool.

Speaker 31 Oh, my God. But

Speaker 36 there's a great doc about that, too.

Speaker 102 The Night Stalker.

Speaker 19 Yeah, that's great. God, are you taking it?

Speaker 49 Oh, maybe Jake Gyllenholm played him, right? I think I made it. Or I'm thinking of what was it where they would leave signs that they...

Speaker 60 Zodiac? Yeah, did they ever catch that?

Speaker 88 Zodiac was...

Speaker 61 Well,

Speaker 8 the theory is that the one guy who they presumed was him

Speaker 106 that it was him because there's no other...

Speaker 49 There's nobody else that fits the profile like he did he died um that guy who was the Long Island one who used to shoot people in their cars like they were kissing oh you talked about

Speaker 49 the son of Sam you're talking about yeah yeah yeah this is the new one this is the Long Island guy yeah a friend of mine Charles a fucking CSI guy that woman that I'm friends with she said Susan I was at his house no Nancy Gray show like after the fact

Speaker 49 I'm sorry but he's an architect and that house it stands out like Billy Baldwin went to high school with the guy, like, because he lives in upstate and said, like, I don't know.

Speaker 49 I mean, do you ever know? Everyone knows kind of someone in high school where you're like, hmm, I could see that. So there's the house.
And

Speaker 49 I guess he had a room in the basement, like Silence of the Lambs.

Speaker 27 No.

Speaker 49 Yeah, like a soundproof.

Speaker 34 That's quite a mug he's got on him, though, too.

Speaker 33 That is a, that's a, that is a face, man.

Speaker 49 And it is sad going back to like the Gabby Petitos.

Speaker 49 If these women, because they didn't have, some of them didn't have families who were going to be the dad that's standing in front of the microphone, you got away with it for longer.

Speaker 31 This makes sense. He was killing prostitutes.

Speaker 61 So it's like people with,

Speaker 49 but this one woman who was on Nancy Grace was a prostitute and met him and said, no, got the vibe and was like, uh-uh.

Speaker 49 Met her restaurant. He was furious, but like the overpowering.
And you know, I just miss the online dating, thank God. But who do you, you never know who's who, right?

Speaker 27 Well, we just, that stalk Mary kill. What was that?

Speaker 47 Stalker lover dancer, stalker kill.

Speaker 60 Yeah,

Speaker 27 immediately when he talks about going on a date with the first girl, and there's she's like, We had a party, we went to a bar, and she's like flipping the bird and like,

Speaker 27 and I'm like, that chick's so fucking crazy.

Speaker 25 Did you see that one?

Speaker 57 No, that one

Speaker 60 is really good, but I think you got to see it.

Speaker 63 I think that one I that one kept myself.

Speaker 12 I would put the end of the fire one above that.

Speaker 31 That one is incredible. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 49 That's what's the premise of it?

Speaker 88 Into the fire? Yeah.

Speaker 6 So this woman

Speaker 70 had given up her,

Speaker 77 this woman right here had given up her daughter for adoption.

Speaker 70 And she decides,

Speaker 86 as an older woman now, to look up her adult daughter, who has she gave up.

Speaker 3 Well, she finds that the daughter she gave up for adoption had gone missing years prior. And that's the catalyst for this whole thing.

Speaker 6 And she ends up really being, like we were discussing earlier, she ends up being the driving force

Speaker 70 for getting answers to like how like what do you mean my my daughter just went missing and it's i don't want to give it away because it's such a good story

Speaker 17 it's such a good story that uh

Speaker 49 i mean it it really is it's unbelievable christina did you watch chillianne this one yeah no no but she was hearing stuff

Speaker 18 what happens is she's she's like do you watch tv in different rooms no i fall asleep to him

Speaker 4 and i hear murder she'll just hear she'll be like and then assaulted and put a cigarette out on her eyes.

Speaker 6 And she's like, thank you. I'm trying to sleep now.

Speaker 27 Or if it's having to do with children, I can't do it.

Speaker 49 I can't do it. I can't.
And that, when I sent her weekends on C, I would say, okay, this rundown, it's a Saturday. It's literally, I said, no dead kids.
Like, this is horrific.

Speaker 49 And I know that we shouldn't like, I'm sorry, but I can say that. Like, with kids, I can't.

Speaker 44 Yeah, I know.

Speaker 29 I don't want to watch any kids' stories. I don't.

Speaker 27 I'm telling you, you just did the adoption.

Speaker 38 No, this is different.

Speaker 27 John Benet is where I drew the line, and I got obsessed with John Benet and Maddie McConne, and I was like, I can't. Can't you?

Speaker 102 What do you guys think happened to Maddie?

Speaker 40 What do you think happened to?

Speaker 27 I think what you said to the extent of some maybe neglect, because they were, so if people don't know, it was a group of tourists, English tourists, and they were what, in Portugal.

Speaker 27 And they decide to not. get babysitters instead they let all their children

Speaker 27 sleep alone right and instead they have tapas

Speaker 27 how many feet away around a bush, down the hotel. And they figure we can check on these kids every so often.
They should be fine. Well, one of the kids disappears.

Speaker 27 I think, oh, I think they drugged her because they're doctors. They probably drugged the children to go to sleep.
And I think it was a death. Because here's what gets me: oh, you think that?

Speaker 27 I think it was an accidental death, and then they got rid of the body. Because the blood-sniffing dogs, remember that? There's the dogs that are like experts.

Speaker 49 It's stopping corpse sniffing.

Speaker 27 The dog's alarmed on that. I do.
I always think it's the parents.

Speaker 49 Do you think Casey did the same thing, Anthony would say?

Speaker 31 Do you think Anthony?

Speaker 49 Allegedly, people guess that it's like chloroform to go out and party.

Speaker 63 Yeah. Hello.

Speaker 27 Sometimes that's what they do because that's what those parents did. I think they drugged the kids to go to sleep so that they could have fun at the top of his place down the street.

Speaker 49 And it's funny, my mom would watch me during this, and my daughter was that age at the time. I think she's like, I think of Emery too much.

Speaker 49 And I'll call her about Delphi, and I'll say, mom, this is what I saw today in court. She'll start crying.
And she's like, it's just so sad.

Speaker 49 And not that I'm not sad, but I'm like, realize how hardened because I have to like talk about it on the air. And so I'm almost able to compartmentalize, but who knows? Long-term damage.

Speaker 49 Like you're able to talk about it because it's my job. So,

Speaker 49 but it is horribly sad. And the one day, so we're, we're, we get lottery tickets for pool reporters.
So I'm in the front row.

Speaker 49 And that day that I got the pool, I took myself out of the lottery after that. I said to Nancy's producer, I'm like, get me out.
Because it's front row. And and it was the crime scene photo day.

Speaker 102 Oh.

Speaker 49 And it was zooming in and I went,

Speaker 49 like, oh, no. And I had to, I got in trouble too.
You laugh. So I had to take notes and I knew that it was going out to a pool because there's no cameras.
And my notes weren't that good.

Speaker 49 And we're in a lunch break. And the Carroll County Comet newspaper lady who was like, Susan, I need your notes.
I said, they're not done. I'm just writing.
I'm Googling the blood term.

Speaker 49 It was DNA day and I'm so stressed. And then I send it at four o'clock.
I had to take pictures so everyone could get it.

Speaker 56 Well,

Speaker 60 Nancy's producer calls me.

Speaker 49 I've been friends with him at CNN. He goes, Cheerbite, you got fired.

Speaker 108 I go, what do you mean?

Speaker 105 He goes, you got let go.

Speaker 49 You didn't hand your notes in at noon. I'm like, I'm fired for the pool.

Speaker 31 They're like, yeah.

Speaker 49 I'm like, good. I'd rather wait in line with the cool people anyway.
It was just so funny. I'm like, they're like, we won't be needing your services for the notes.

Speaker 49 But I'm like, I don't want to sit in the front row and be worried about the notes. And that's the fine line.
Because I got close to the family. I was like, you know what?

Speaker 49 Because I did go to the hearing and Mike, the grandfather's like, who are you with now? I'm like, myself, I wanted to be there. I didn't want.

Speaker 49 So it's kind of like, I don't know, I think I'm too in it almost with this case, like that I don't,

Speaker 49 it's a little nuts. Yeah.

Speaker 3 Well, for people who want to do a deep dive because you did,

Speaker 70 get down the hill, the descent in my descent into the double murder in Delphi, which I'm excited to read.

Speaker 27 I am. Maybe you can read out loud to me as I fall asleep.

Speaker 49 I can read it to the kids. Well, it's funny.
I asked the families because it mattered to me. I didn't want them to not want me to do this.
So I sent them a couple of chapters.

Speaker 49 I said, if you don't want me to do it, I won't do it. And Becky said, no, it's okay.
And she read it. And this was a very big compliment to me.

Speaker 49 Tara, Libby's aunt, said, can you send me four for Christmas? Because it's not, at this point, we didn't know much, but it's really about them going through beginning to end and their perspective.

Speaker 49 So it wasn't like,

Speaker 49 you know, not that I'm on on my high horse saying I'm better, because people are really fascinated by the actual killer. You know, we can name them.
We rarely can name the victims.

Speaker 49 So I just wanted it to be a different perspective. Yeah.
I'm not saying I'm amazing by doing it. It's just what I knew.
Sure. What I could write about.

Speaker 27 And we don't get to hear those stories.

Speaker 27 I don't think, you know, I've ever heard of a book like that where you hear from their perspective and how absolutely traumatizing that has to be to have someone else.

Speaker 49 And to be able to keep going on.

Speaker 49 And that's what it is. It's the connection at Crime Con.
Like, if they can get through that, how do they get through that?

Speaker 49 Then I can get through anything I'm going through.

Speaker 60 So true. That's a good point.

Speaker 10 So true.

Speaker 49 So that's what I've gained.

Speaker 49 I've learned so much from them. And Kelsey, Libby's sister, wrote the foreword.
I asked her.

Speaker 108 And I'm like, if she can get through this, she was only 18 at the time.

Speaker 49 She dropped them off at the bridge. She blamed herself.
She didn't know what to do. I went to her baby shower.
She has a little girl. She's pregnant again.
So, yes, I am too close. But I love that.

Speaker 49 I really like them as people. And I think I felt for the first time I was in the inside looking out.
It's at the outside looking in and getting the sound bite.

Speaker 49 And I know it might be nuts, but it's my perspective.

Speaker 27 Tell you what, I think you're nuts. I think you're nuts, but I'm going to read this.

Speaker 4 Susan, thank you so much for coming.

Speaker 13 Thank you guys for having me.

Speaker 19 It's been so fun chatting with you.

Speaker 77 Hopefully, you can come back and we can do another dive into crime. Would love to and horrible things that people

Speaker 102 and home our Christmas challenge.

Speaker 19 Yes.

Speaker 3 All right, that's it. We'll see you guys next week.

Speaker 63 Bye.

Speaker 110 Welcome to Macabe's Medical Monday.

Speaker 110 It's all about this, the cucumber, or as they call it in Jamaica, cucumba.

Speaker 110 Cucumba, cucumber.

Speaker 109 Vitamins, minerals, very high number. Silicon, here, and near the end longer.
Other vitamins make your poor and stronger. Anti-link could make you look younger.

Speaker 109 95% water. Kidney cleans are creative.

Speaker 109 Eat up swipe back with regulator. Hear about the good things, don't be a triat.
Empty cucumbers, cut it in a slice. Put it in a jug of water overnight.

Speaker 109 You know what you get for a fraction of the price? Energy drink full of electrolyte. Roaring salad is one of the user.
As a benefit, we have vegetable juice.

Speaker 110 Another surprise when I flies on your eyes.

Speaker 109 Take away the light is to revitalize.

Speaker 110 Oh, yes.

Speaker 109 One thing I have left. Kokumba can answer help with my breath.

Speaker 110 My friend.

Speaker 110 Kokumba.

Speaker 13 You're very handsome.

Speaker 13 You're my fresh latte.

Speaker 13 Whoa, thanks team.

Speaker 13 What's going on?

Speaker 13 What's going on? I've been having a

Speaker 13 cucumber.

Speaker 13 Where?

Speaker 13 Eat cucumbers.

Speaker 79 Yeah, I eat cucumbers and then it makes me look better.

Speaker 15 This isn't just a game, it's a once-in-a-generation event. The Harlem Globetrotters 100-year tour.

Speaker 15 Celebrate 100 years of high-flying dunks, 100 years of show-stopping moves, and 100 years of changing the game. Bring the whole family and be part of the legacy.
This game is once in a century.

Speaker 16 Be there at Chase Center on January 18th.

Speaker 15 Go to HarlemGlobetrotters.com for your tickets tickets to the 100-year tour.